3051
Variants and Fan Cards / Re: Really bad card ideas
« on: September 12, 2012, 02:18:24 pm »
That one took me a while.
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3052
Variants and Fan Cards / Re: Sarcophagus: A treasure which curses
« on: September 11, 2012, 10:47:26 pm »
If you go first and open Sea Hag, and then I open Sarcophagus, and we each curse once per shuffle, I'm going lose the Curse split 4-6. You could argue, of course, that the Sea Hag practically becomes a curse when spent, so it's comparable to a 5-6 split. Each shuffle I encounter two curses more than you, but in exchange my curse giver is a silver, which allows more flexibility and growth. In comparison to other curse givers, it would generally be unwise to purchase many Sarcophagi since you'll take on too many curses.
Rather than raising the price to $5, one could lower its value to $1 so that it is a cursing copper rather than a cursing silver.
Rather than raising the price to $5, one could lower its value to $1 so that it is a cursing copper rather than a cursing silver.
3053
Variants and Fan Cards / Sarcophagus: A treasure which curses
« on: September 11, 2012, 10:02:30 pm »
Sarcophagus
Treasure - $4
+$2
When gain this, gain a Curse.
When you discard this from play, each other player gains a curse.
Thematically, you're cursed as soon as you open the sarcophagus, but then you curse others when they are exposed to it. As a comparison to Sea Hag, it's slower (you even curse yourself!), but it's essentially never dead since it's a silver at worst.
The "When you discard this from play" clause prevents shenanigans with Herbalist and Mandarin, and also means cursing if you use a Counterfeit or purchase a Mint.
Watchtower or Trader allows you bypass the on gain effect making Sarcophagus more appealing, but then cursing is usually a bit weaker with either of these cards on the table anyhow.
Treasure - $4
+$2
When gain this, gain a Curse.
When you discard this from play, each other player gains a curse.
Thematically, you're cursed as soon as you open the sarcophagus, but then you curse others when they are exposed to it. As a comparison to Sea Hag, it's slower (you even curse yourself!), but it's essentially never dead since it's a silver at worst.
The "When you discard this from play" clause prevents shenanigans with Herbalist and Mandarin, and also means cursing if you use a Counterfeit or purchase a Mint.
Watchtower or Trader allows you bypass the on gain effect making Sarcophagus more appealing, but then cursing is usually a bit weaker with either of these cards on the table anyhow.
3054
Variants and Fan Cards / Re: Clasic_Cards - (Copper Week) - #38, 39, 40: Scam Artist
« on: September 09, 2012, 07:40:07 am »I'm thinking that my initial concerns about the card being overpowered were overstated. With that in mind, I could just go the simplest route--reverse Grand Market:
Reserve (3)
Victory
3VP
-----
You can't buy this unless you have at least 3 Copper in play.
The wording I initially chose was always an attempt to lessen this card's power, but I think it can easily be fair at this cost and value.
I like the idea of some restriction on acquiring this card based on copper. $3 is a pretty low price in dominion, and for cards this cheap one needs to consider the impact of +Buy. Once an engine is built that draws your whole deck, oozing with + buys, it can be pretty trivial to add 3 coppers back into your deck. Then you have a situation where you can pick up VP at a rate of one per coin. You would only need $6 to purchase a province worth of VP. Now, I know that similar rates arise with other alt VP. Fairgrounds often becomes 6 VP for $6, and doesn't even require plus buy. Gardens can certainly exceed 1 VP per $1, as can Silk Roads and Dukes. But in all of these other cases, one really needs to plan for them. They alter the entire feel of the game.
One interesting side effect of Jack's suggestion is that you wouldn't be able to purchase the card while possessing another player. If Alice possesses Bob, and then compels Bob to buy a Reserve, then Alice will gain it. But having no coppers in play to discard -- indeed, no cards in play at all, aside from duration cards and those modifying them -- Alice would immediately return it to the supply and gain a Silver.
3055
Variants and Fan Cards / Re: Excavation: A Choice Treasure Gainer
« on: September 08, 2012, 10:57:03 pm »
And of course there's the obvious synergy with pearl diver.
3056
Rules Questions / Re: Overgrown Estate & Market Sqare
« on: September 04, 2012, 11:34:51 am »
If you were allowed to draw a card before revealing a market square, but weren't allowed to reveal the freshly drawn market square, there would be an awkward accountability issue. Who's to say that you didn't just draw that market square that you're revealing?
3057
Dominion: Dark Ages Previews / Re: The New Golden Deck
« on: August 15, 2012, 09:53:54 pm »
I feel like Bishop/Fortress may actually be relatively dominant, particularly since it provides so much of its own trashing and never needs to go above $4 a turn. It can even function as a weaker golden deck with fewer components. If both players go for it, you could just smack your own fortresses on your turn while trashing junk on your opponent's turn. Someone will have to figure out the proper balance in a Bishop/Fortress mirror match to strike a balance on reaching the 12 VP/turn quickly [bishoping your own junk] while gathering as much VP as possible on your way to that deck [bishoping your fortress and relying on your opponents bishops for thinning].
3058
Dominion: Dark Ages Previews / Re: The New Golden Deck
« on: August 15, 2012, 06:34:54 pm »
Oh right, I forgot to take into account that the fortresses themselves take actions to play. Make that four bishops and four fortresses to get 12 per turn.
3059
Dominion: Dark Ages Previews / Re: The New Golden Deck
« on: August 15, 2012, 06:05:48 pm »
Three fortresses and four bishops. Twelve points each turn.
3060
Dominion: Dark Ages Previews / Re: Horn of Plenty/Watchtower/Mandarin/Cultist
« on: August 15, 2012, 09:38:17 am »Yes of course you need to use HOP for the gain, but as far as getting the HOP up to 5 unique cards, why can't you just play a copper or silver before playing the HOP? Mandarin lets you top deck the treasures in any order; just put the HOPs on top.
Because if you're using treasure to get up to the 5-unique threshold, then as soon as Mandarin top-decks, Horn won't be able to gain Cultists and the whole thing falls apart.
Well, if Squire were on the board (I know, now it needs five specific cards...), then you could gain Squire, trash it to gain Cultist, trash that to draw 3 cards. The problem is that you'll run out of Squires/Cultists more quickly since you need to keep drawing back both your horns and your other treasures. Really, it's the limited number of Cultists and Mandarins in the supply that prevents you from just going to town and picking up everything.
Come to think of it, you could probably get away with using a venture, since playing it would itself draw the next horn of plenty. Then you would only need 3 action cards in play.
3061
Dominion: Dark Ages Previews / Re: Horn of Plenty/Watchtower/Mandarin/Cultist
« on: August 14, 2012, 10:45:18 pm »Well, time to throw all the cards in the trash. The game is officially broken.
I wouldn't say that this breaks the game. It's just another way of reaching a megaturn, and not a particularly easy way either. What I find most interesting is that this is an "engine" which operates during the buy phase rather than the action phase.
As long as we're looking at four card combos, something like King's Court/Bridge/Inn/Chancellor is much easier to execute. Buy 2 KC and 3 Bridge. Play a chancellor to put your whole deck in the discard and buy an Inn to let you pick out the KC-KC-Bridge-Bridge-Bridge as your next hand, and buy all the provinces. Doesn't get much easier to execute a game ending hand than that.
3062
Dominion: Dark Ages Previews / Re: Horn of Plenty/Watchtower/Mandarin/Cultist
« on: August 14, 2012, 05:45:41 pm »
Hey, maybe your opponent will get a Cultist and send you one of those supposedly useless +1 action "ruined villages", which would be precisely what you need to get down four action cards quickly. :p
3063
Dominion: Dark Ages Previews / Re: Puzzle: If the Shelters were in the supply, when would you buy them?
« on: August 14, 2012, 05:36:46 pm »Dark Ages aside, if you have a bunch of coppers in play (say, for use with Banks) and some +buys, you could in theory get a Mandarin to remove them from play and then buy Grand Markets?
I... did not even think of that before. Is that allowed?
Gaining the Mandarin would immediately remove all of the treasure from play, but my understanding is that playing a copper gives you +$1, so the money would remain even if the copper is no longer in play.
On the other hand, if you are relying on a quarry, then when you gain a mandarin you'll remove the quarry from play, so its +$1 remains but the price reduction on actions goes away.
3064
Dominion: Dark Ages Previews / Horn of Plenty/Watchtower/Mandarin/Cultist
« on: August 14, 2012, 05:31:21 pm »
This incorporates blueblimp's idea of adding in Mandarin.
Have four non-treasure cards (or fewer if one is a bridge, highway, or princess) in play while having a hand with three horns of plenty and a watchtower. Necropolis may help set this up more quickly. Suppose the Cultists, Duchies, and remaining HoPs are untouched and at least four Mandarins are available.
HoP -- gain a HoP, top deck it [2 HoP in hand, 1 on deck]
HoP -- gain a HoP, top deck it [1 HoP in hand, 2 on deck]
HoP -- gain a Cultist, trash it, draw 3 cards (2 HoP + something) [2 HoP in hand, 0 on deck]
HoP -- gain a Mandarin, top deck all four HoPs [1 HoP in hand, 4 on deck]
HoP -- gain a Cultist, trash it, draw 3 cards (all HoP) [3 HoP in hand, 1 on deck]
HoP -- gain a HoP, top deck it [2 HoP in hand, 2 on deck]
HoP -- gain a HoP, top deck it [1 HoP in hand, 3 on deck]
HoP -- gain a Cultist, trash it, draw 3 cards (all HoP) [3 HoP in hand, 0 on deck]
HoP -- gain a HoP, top deck it [2 HoP in hand, 1 on deck]
HoP -- gain a HoP, top deck it [1 HoP in hand, 2 on deck]
HoP -- gain a Cultist, trash it, draw 3 cards (2 HoP + something) [2 HoP in hand, 0 deck]
HoP -- gain a Mandarin, top deck all eight HoPs [1 HoP in hand, 8 on deck]
HoP -- gain a Cultist, trash it, draw 3 cards (all 3 HoP) [3 HoP in hand, 5 on deck]
HoP -- gain a Duchy, trash HoP [2 HoP in hand, 5 on deck]
HoP -- gain a Duchy, trash HoP [1 HoP in hand, 5 on deck]
HoP -- gain a Cultist, trash it, draw 3 cards (all 3 HoP) [3 HoP in hand, 2 on deck]
HoP -- gain a Duchy, trash HoP [2 HoP in hand, 2 on deck]
HoP -- gain a Duchy, trash HoP [1 HoP in hand, 2 on deck]
HoP -- gain a Cultist, trash it, draw 3 cards (2 HoP + something) [2 HoP in hand, 0 on deck]
HoP -- gain a Mandarin, top deck all four HoPs [1 HoP in hand, 4 on deck]
HoP -- gain a Cultist, trash it, draw 3 cards (all 3 HoP) [3 HoP in hand, 1 on deck]
HoP -- gain a HoP, top deck it [2 HoP in hand, 2 on deck] *HoP pile is empty
HoP -- gain a Mandarin, top deck all three HoPs[1 HoP in hand, 5 on deck]
HoP -- gain a Cultist, trash it, draw 3 cards (all 3 HoP) [3 HoP in hand, 2 on deck]
HoP -- gain a Duchy, trash HoP [2 HoP in hand, 2 on deck]
HoP -- gain a Duchy, trash HoP [1 HoP in hand, 2 on deck]
HoP -- gain a Cultist, trash it, draw 3 cards (2 HoP + something) [2 HoP in hand, 0 on deck] *Cultist pile is empty
HoP -- gain a Duchy, trash HoP [1 HoP in hand, 0 on deck]
HoP -- gain a Duchy, trash HoP [0 HoP in hand, 0 on deck] *Duchy pile is empty
This empties the HoP, Cultist, and Duchy piles in one go.
If one HoP has been purchased by your opponent you should still be able to modify this to empty these piles in one go.
If two HoPs have been purchased, you should be able to get 7 Duchies from HoPs, and then given the spare draws from the Cultists when only 2 HoPs were on top of your deck, you could probably just buy the eighth Duchy.
Missing Cultists is a bigger problem, but you could still snatch many of the Duchies, and hopefully your Mandarins would help you reach the remaining Duchies.
OK, yeah, this would be hard to set up. Any ideas on making this easier? Maybe opening Mandarin/Mint, then using the Mandarin with the remaining coppers to buy a Horn of Plenty which is then minted. Your four non treasure cards could be Necropolis, Mandarin, Mint and some cantrip.
Have four non-treasure cards (or fewer if one is a bridge, highway, or princess) in play while having a hand with three horns of plenty and a watchtower. Necropolis may help set this up more quickly. Suppose the Cultists, Duchies, and remaining HoPs are untouched and at least four Mandarins are available.
HoP -- gain a HoP, top deck it [2 HoP in hand, 1 on deck]
HoP -- gain a HoP, top deck it [1 HoP in hand, 2 on deck]
HoP -- gain a Cultist, trash it, draw 3 cards (2 HoP + something) [2 HoP in hand, 0 on deck]
HoP -- gain a Mandarin, top deck all four HoPs [1 HoP in hand, 4 on deck]
HoP -- gain a Cultist, trash it, draw 3 cards (all HoP) [3 HoP in hand, 1 on deck]
HoP -- gain a HoP, top deck it [2 HoP in hand, 2 on deck]
HoP -- gain a HoP, top deck it [1 HoP in hand, 3 on deck]
HoP -- gain a Cultist, trash it, draw 3 cards (all HoP) [3 HoP in hand, 0 on deck]
HoP -- gain a HoP, top deck it [2 HoP in hand, 1 on deck]
HoP -- gain a HoP, top deck it [1 HoP in hand, 2 on deck]
HoP -- gain a Cultist, trash it, draw 3 cards (2 HoP + something) [2 HoP in hand, 0 deck]
HoP -- gain a Mandarin, top deck all eight HoPs [1 HoP in hand, 8 on deck]
HoP -- gain a Cultist, trash it, draw 3 cards (all 3 HoP) [3 HoP in hand, 5 on deck]
HoP -- gain a Duchy, trash HoP [2 HoP in hand, 5 on deck]
HoP -- gain a Duchy, trash HoP [1 HoP in hand, 5 on deck]
HoP -- gain a Cultist, trash it, draw 3 cards (all 3 HoP) [3 HoP in hand, 2 on deck]
HoP -- gain a Duchy, trash HoP [2 HoP in hand, 2 on deck]
HoP -- gain a Duchy, trash HoP [1 HoP in hand, 2 on deck]
HoP -- gain a Cultist, trash it, draw 3 cards (2 HoP + something) [2 HoP in hand, 0 on deck]
HoP -- gain a Mandarin, top deck all four HoPs [1 HoP in hand, 4 on deck]
HoP -- gain a Cultist, trash it, draw 3 cards (all 3 HoP) [3 HoP in hand, 1 on deck]
HoP -- gain a HoP, top deck it [2 HoP in hand, 2 on deck] *HoP pile is empty
HoP -- gain a Mandarin, top deck all three HoPs[1 HoP in hand, 5 on deck]
HoP -- gain a Cultist, trash it, draw 3 cards (all 3 HoP) [3 HoP in hand, 2 on deck]
HoP -- gain a Duchy, trash HoP [2 HoP in hand, 2 on deck]
HoP -- gain a Duchy, trash HoP [1 HoP in hand, 2 on deck]
HoP -- gain a Cultist, trash it, draw 3 cards (2 HoP + something) [2 HoP in hand, 0 on deck] *Cultist pile is empty
HoP -- gain a Duchy, trash HoP [1 HoP in hand, 0 on deck]
HoP -- gain a Duchy, trash HoP [0 HoP in hand, 0 on deck] *Duchy pile is empty
This empties the HoP, Cultist, and Duchy piles in one go.
If one HoP has been purchased by your opponent you should still be able to modify this to empty these piles in one go.
If two HoPs have been purchased, you should be able to get 7 Duchies from HoPs, and then given the spare draws from the Cultists when only 2 HoPs were on top of your deck, you could probably just buy the eighth Duchy.
Missing Cultists is a bigger problem, but you could still snatch many of the Duchies, and hopefully your Mandarins would help you reach the remaining Duchies.
OK, yeah, this would be hard to set up. Any ideas on making this easier? Maybe opening Mandarin/Mint, then using the Mandarin with the remaining coppers to buy a Horn of Plenty which is then minted. Your four non treasure cards could be Necropolis, Mandarin, Mint and some cantrip.
3065
Dominion: Dark Ages Previews / Re: Puzzle: If the Shelters were in the supply, when would you buy them?
« on: August 14, 2012, 04:15:53 pm »
You can't play treasures after buying, but that's why we're using the horn of plenty. You gain immediately when you play it, and you do play treasure cards one at a time.
3066
Dominion: Dark Ages Previews / Re: Puzzle: If the Shelters were in the supply, when would you buy them?
« on: August 14, 2012, 04:08:19 pm »
well, combine it with blueblimp's idea then. HoP/Cultist/Mandarin/Watchtower could lead to a pretty cool megaturn where you replay your HoPs pretty much as often as you'd like until either the Mandarin or Cultist piles run out. It would take a watchtower and two HoPs, with four non treasure cards in play to get started. Then you could buy up all the remaining HoPs and convert them to Duchys while three piling using the Mandarins and Cultists. I haven't worked out the math to see how far you could get before running out of Cultists/Mandarins.
3067
Dominion: Dark Ages Previews / Re: Puzzle: If the Shelters were in the supply, when would you buy them?
« on: August 14, 2012, 03:45:39 pm »
I hadn't noticed that until eHalcyon's post, but now you could arrange to draw and play new treasure cards during the buy phase. If you have a watchtower in hand you could play a horn of plenty to gain a cultist which you then immediately trash for +3 cards, and play any treasure cards drawn.
I could even envision a chain in which 4 HoPs are played to gain 3 HoPs and a cultist which are top decked and trashed respectively using your watchtower, allowing you to immediately play the remaining 3 newly acquired HoPs. You could then play these 3 HoPs to gain 2 HoPs and a Cultist, draw back those 2 HoPs, and use then to gain the last HoP and a Cultist, and then play this HoP together with what additional treasures are in the 3 extra cards drawn from Cultists.
Watchtower is going to be pretty awesome, converting "on trash" benefits into "on gain" benefits.
I could even envision a chain in which 4 HoPs are played to gain 3 HoPs and a cultist which are top decked and trashed respectively using your watchtower, allowing you to immediately play the remaining 3 newly acquired HoPs. You could then play these 3 HoPs to gain 2 HoPs and a Cultist, draw back those 2 HoPs, and use then to gain the last HoP and a Cultist, and then play this HoP together with what additional treasures are in the 3 extra cards drawn from Cultists.
Watchtower is going to be pretty awesome, converting "on trash" benefits into "on gain" benefits.
3068
Dominion: Dark Ages Previews / Re: What card design rules are left?
« on: August 10, 2012, 09:47:20 pm »
The simplest way I can think of to make a new card which is strictly better than an existing card, using established game mechanics and even routing the Possession rebuttal, is to add a "+1 victory token" clause. Can anyone think of a scenario in which adding "+1 victory token" would not yield a strictly better card?
One potential benefit of the "weaker" card could be if an opponent plays a Jester. For this reason we may want to begin with an Action-Victory such as Great Hall or Nobles. That way the Jester deals out a Curse regardless.
The only other instance I can imagine is when an effect references "differently named card", in which case it may be better to have a "weaker" and a "stronger" rather than two "stronger" (or preferable have two "weaker" than a "weaker" and a "stronger"). One way to circumvent this would be two introduce a new card which has the same name as an existing card, but I would consider this to be outside the realm of established game mechanics.
Of course, there's also the fact that even Dominion has some politics in it, at least in the sense that one can adjust their strategy towards the detriment of a chosen player (generally the one perceived as winning or the greatest potential threat), and so one may imagine as a marginal circumstance in which a "weaker" card would be preferable to lull your opponents towards butting heads. If we stick to two player games though, this concern is mostly gone.
One potential benefit of the "weaker" card could be if an opponent plays a Jester. For this reason we may want to begin with an Action-Victory such as Great Hall or Nobles. That way the Jester deals out a Curse regardless.
The only other instance I can imagine is when an effect references "differently named card", in which case it may be better to have a "weaker" and a "stronger" rather than two "stronger" (or preferable have two "weaker" than a "weaker" and a "stronger"). One way to circumvent this would be two introduce a new card which has the same name as an existing card, but I would consider this to be outside the realm of established game mechanics.
Of course, there's also the fact that even Dominion has some politics in it, at least in the sense that one can adjust their strategy towards the detriment of a chosen player (generally the one perceived as winning or the greatest potential threat), and so one may imagine as a marginal circumstance in which a "weaker" card would be preferable to lull your opponents towards butting heads. If we stick to two player games though, this concern is mostly gone.