# Dominion Strategy Forum

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1
##### Rules Questions / Re: Potions and Talisman
« on: April 19, 2013, 05:36:12 am »
I had a question about the talisman and cards using potion for cost. The talisman says when you buy a cards costing up to \$4, gain a copy of it, does this apply to cards that cost a potion as well?
Does a card costing \$4+P look like the Potion >\$0 so you do not gain a copy of it because it then costs >\$4? also is there a difference for cards that cost \$4+P vs \$2+P or \$3+P? Such that \$0<potion<\$1 so that any card below \$4+P would gain a copy or is it such that the potion is a foreign currency that the talisman cannot duplicate and then would never allow for gaining a copy of a potion required card?

"Costing up to \$4" means the same thing as "could be bought if you had at least one Buy and exactly \$4". If you have exactly \$4, you cannot buy a Potion-cost card, no matter how many or few coins are in its cost, because you do not have a Potion. Similarly if you have exactly \$1337.

2
##### Dominion General Discussion / Re: Homage to the Best Card
« on: April 12, 2013, 09:52:28 pm »
This thread is just too a-mu-sing now.

3
##### Goko Dominion Online / Re: An unfamiliar bane
« on: April 11, 2013, 05:16:45 am »
From ACM practice, general strategy for implementing lexicographic comparison with fields ordered by f1, f2, f3, ...

Code: [Select]
`if (a.f1 != b.f1) return a.f1 < b.f1;if (a.f2 != b.f2) return a.f2 < b.f2;if (a.f3 != b.f3) return a.f3 < b.f3;...`
It always works, it's obviously correct (okay, to be fair, maybe this takes getting familiar with the pattern), etc. you waste no time thinking about edge cases or demorgan's law.

Two problems:

1. As pointed out by others, cost comparison isn't lexicographic. That would be the model we want if one potion were "worth more" than any number of coins, or vice-versa; e.g. if a card costing \$9 could be purchased with \$p. What we generally want to do, to get a "costing less than \$X" condition, is compare each component (coins and potions) and make sure each is satisfied.

2. But YW doesn't even involve a "costing less than \$X" condition. The card says that the bane is a card "costing \$2 or \$3". It can't be Poor House, for example.

4
##### Goko Dominion Online / Re: Something doesn't add up...
« on: April 11, 2013, 05:06:37 am »
No !
But you said "when I play the Golem it doesn't reveal this ghostly potion" and you have this potion in your hand ! So my question was "What is wrong ?"

There are 15 Potions shown in the supply, 1 in hand and 1 in the discard pile, for a total of (at least) 17. There should be 16.

Let me attempt to translate the rest for you:

"when I play the Golem it doesn't reveal this ghostly potion" -> "After playing Golem, the unexpected 17th potion in my discard pile disappeared."

"Do you work for Goko?" -> "You should be able to see what is wrong with the total number of Potions in the screenshot; I am making a joke about the quality of the work Goko has been doing."

5
##### Game Reports / Re: More than one way to skin a Rats
« on: April 09, 2013, 10:17:39 pm »
Rats also combos with Vineyard.

Sort of? It gives you extra Actions quickly, but it also quickly becomes dangerous to play those Actions (you especially don't want to be forced to trash Vineyards). And then if you don't play them, they become dead cards - it's even worse than if you'd loaded upon terminals, since you can't fix it with villages.

6
##### Game Reports / Re: I Opened Duchess-Cache!
« on: April 09, 2013, 12:33:36 am »
Mountebank perhaps?

7
##### Variants and Fan Cards / Chameleon
« on: April 03, 2013, 09:27:30 pm »
Chameleon - Action/Reaction - \$4?

Choose one: +1 Card, +1 Action; or play this as if it were any Action other than Chameleon that you already have in play.
-
When any player (including you) gains a card costing up to \$6, you may reveal and discard this from your hand. If you do, gain a copy of the gained card, putting it in your hand.

8
##### Variants and Fan Cards / Re: Really bad card ideas
« on: April 03, 2013, 06:35:24 am »
Casino
Treasure
When you play this, roll a die. This produces 1\$ per dot at the upside of the die.

Actually, doing this with a d4 and making it cost \$5 doesn't sound horrible...
Yes, it sounds like Harvest.

Well, Harvest is easier to activate, but is a terminal action.

9
##### Variants and Fan Cards / Re: Really bad card ideas
« on: April 02, 2013, 11:10:14 pm »
Casino
Treasure
When you play this, roll a die. This produces 1\$ per dot at the upside of the die.

Actually, doing this with a d4 and making it cost \$5 doesn't sound horrible...

10
##### Variants and Fan Cards / Re: Fan Expansion: Proletariat v2.3a
« on: April 01, 2013, 04:16:27 am »
Environmental Degradation - Neutral
If there is 1 empty supply pile, Cards with the same name can only be played 3 times per turn.
If there are 2 empty supply piles, Cards with the same name can only be played 2 times per turn.

City just became terrible. I guess that's thematic?

11
##### Variants and Fan Cards / Re: Contest! Innovation card
« on: April 01, 2013, 04:10:49 am »
Innovation - Action

Look through your discard pile, deck, and any mats, and determine the score you would have if the game were to end now. If this value is at least five times the top value on the Age pile, gain an Age card from the Age pile and set it aside; return it to your deck at the end of the game. If you could not gain an Age card, the game ends. Reshuffle your deck after looking through it.

The Age pile contains 10 Victory cards, with a cost of 0* and VP values numbered from 1 up to 10. It is not shuffled, but instead set up in ascending order of point value.

12
##### Variants and Fan Cards / Re: "Goko only" Promo Idea: Spanish Inquisition
« on: April 01, 2013, 03:17:36 am »
But NOBODY has ten-sided dice. Seriously. With five kids, I barely have any six-sided dice.

Presumably you'd include one in the box set that provides this card, or bundle it for purchase with a promo card...

13
##### Variants and Fan Cards / Re: Capitalism -- My 19 card set.
« on: April 01, 2013, 03:14:31 am »
Quote
Convention -- the wording is off.  For this kind of effect, it is "while this is in play", not "in games using this".

I think his wording is usable, and has the result that the effect doesn't stack (i.e. you can only gain one Convention per \$5+ Action gained, even if you have multiple Conventions in play).

Also, is it just me or are there two Casinos in the list? (I think the old version was left in after adding the fixed one?)

14
##### Variants and Fan Cards / Re: Break all the rules
« on: April 01, 2013, 03:10:16 am »
Gain a Treasure card with a cost equal to the number of letters in its name.

So... Cache?

15
##### Dominion Articles / Re: Don't Play Everything!
« on: April 01, 2013, 03:06:31 am »
\$3 and a Watchtower in hand? Top-deck a WT for next turn! Knowing if your opponent has seen their curser this shuffle yet, or how many WTs are left in your draw/discard, or where you are in your shuffle are also factors that weigh into this.

This may be a trap, though, as topdecking Watchtowers consecutively also means that you are passing up on cards that could provide \$.

As well as overloading on terminals. (And if you intend to always use them to topdeck, and aren't playing any other engine pieces, then suddenly you're playing 4-card hands.)

16
##### Rules Questions / Re: Native village: can you look at the top card?
« on: March 31, 2013, 06:24:56 am »
Well, I don't fully understand whether there is a disagreement among you people, or whether you are joking (I'm not an English speaker).
The fact that it says "Choose one" does not exclude looking at the top card, it has nothing to do. Neither has nothing to do the word "or".

Yes, it does.

The structure of the card text is as follows:

Choose one: x, or y.

Thus, you have two options. You can do all of x, beginning to end; or you can do all of y, beginning to end.

'x' is:

Set aside the top card of your deck face down on your Native Village mat

That does not say you can look at the card before setting it aside, therefore choosing this option does not give you the right to look at the card at the start. In much the same way that you cannot gain a Province before setting the card aside.

'y' is:

put all the cards from the mat into your hand.

That also does not say you can look at the card, therefore you can't.

In neither case are you given the right, therefore you don't have the right.

Now, there is a part that says you can look at cards that are already on the mat. But that means, in order to look at the card, you must first have already placed it on the mat. That means you have already done x. It is now too late to change your mind and do y, because you have finished playing the card.

There is absolutely nothing about Dominion rules that is "deliberately left open to interpretation". Dominion is a game that expects you to be able to follow card instructions to the letter, very precisely. If it's not mentioned in the rules FAQ, it's because DXV never imagined that somebody could really imagine things to work the way you think they do.

17
##### Game Reports / Re: Haggler/BM vs Haggler/Vineyards
« on: March 19, 2013, 03:11:08 am »
The problem of Haggler/Vineyards is that anytime you buy a Vineyard with Haggler in play, you must gain a Copper, so there is a bit of antisynergy going on.

It works well if there's another Alchemy card besides Transmute, though

no - I've fallen for this trap too. You can't gain Vineyard with a Haggler (not because of potion cost trickery, but because vineyard is a victory card)

See, I know this, but I keep messing it up >_<

18
##### Dominion Isotropic / Re: Last Game on Isotropic
« on: March 15, 2013, 08:48:53 pm »
I forgot to grab the URLs But my last two games were both wins: a doubletac-Monument engine (just managed to grab 6 Monuments for a Colony each turn, though I had to Apprentice one of them to keep going) built with vanilla Villages (that always feels good) vs. someone playing a mostly money-oriented single-Tac strategy; and another win in a NV-Bridge mirror (a squeaker; the other player sniped a Province early after emptying the mat a couple of times, taking a Gold, and aggressively going for Pearl Divers as the third pile; I barely managed to build up enough on my mat to have a double-Province turn and buy the last three Pearl Divers simultaneously. I think he also got a Duchy somewhere).

19
##### Variants and Fan Cards / Re: Auction cards
« on: March 13, 2013, 06:56:32 pm »
Sorry to say it, but I think there's a fundamental flaw with this mechanic: if the card isn't very powerful, then there's no real reason to pay attention to it; if it's powerful enough to make the auction "interesting", then suddenly it becomes an overwhelming advantage to open 5/2, i.e. the opening becomes far too luck-based. I can't take the card away from you until I hit \$6, and I might not have a better opening than Silver/Silver for attempting to do so.

Also, how do you decide how many Auction cards to put out, and which?

CHAMBERLAIN, Auction-Victory (v2)
While you own this, at the start of your turn, +\$1.
~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~
Worth Victory Points equal to the number of players.

(the original +\$2 effect was too good to pass throughout the game. whoever had it, had a massive advantage, so we were all fighting to get it. even more so during endgame when it became 4 points plus the money we needed for Provinces. the new version doesn't look all that, but if you manage to get, you'll not want to part with it.)

The original version of this was obviously incredibly strong; in a 2-player game, it'd already be like a Harem that you get to play every turn.

Quote
HANDMAIDEN, Auction (v2)
While you own this, at the start of your turn, choose one: +1 Card; or trash a card from your hand.

(the original draw until you have 6 cards made Attack cards that make you discard, largely redundant or even help your hand. the new effect should be more versatile without being too beneficial.)

The original version was ludicrous (consider the interaction with Outpost, for example). With this change, it's basically better than Alchemist (since you don't need to find a Potion to topdeck it, nor buy the Potion, nor let the Potion be a dead card) even without the trashing option.

Quote
SELLSWORD, Auction (v2)
When you buy Sellsword, place its token on a Kingdom card pile.
While you own this: if you buy a card from a pile with Sellsword, gain 1 Victory Token; if another player buys a card from a pile with Sellsword, he draws only 3 cards for his next hand.
~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~
When a card is bought from a pile with Sellsword, you place its token on a different Kingdom card pile immediately.

(altered the Curse gain to draw only 3 cards, which makes for a more blocking effect. other players could still get around this by 'gaining' but not 'buying' from that card pile. the VT gain is also toned down but can still get really powerful if you are able to build an engine that let's you buy more than one card on your turn, and there are cheap Kingdom cards available. however, too many of these can hurt your later hands.)

You probably want that to say "he draws only 3 cards during his cleanup phase". I don't really know how to rate this; it seems like you ought to be able to switch it between two cheap piles frequently and rack up bonus points on megaturns... but then you were probably going to win anyway.

Quote
AUCTION HOUSE, Auction
When you buy Auction House, place its token on a Supply pile.
While you own this, cards from a pile with Auction House cost \$1 less to you (but not less than \$0), and \$1 more to other players.
~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~
When a card is gained from a pile with Auction House, you place its token on a different Supply pile immediately.

(much like Sellsword but the effect applies to ALL cards, not just Kingdom cards, and repositions the token on 'gain'. not playtested yet.)

I think this cost-altering mechanic is more interesting, honestly.

Quote
CITY GUARD, Auction-Reaction
While you own this, if you do not have 4 cards at the start of your turn, draw or discard until you have a hand of 4 cards. At any time on your turn, choose one: +1 Card; or +1 Action.
~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~
When another player plays an Attack card, you may discard a card. If you do, you are unaffected by that Attack.

(not sure if this needs to be listed as Reaction since it does not need to be revealed or played or trashed. not playtested yet.)

You really need that to say "at any time during your turn, once per turn," or something to that effect. Also it should presumably say "if you do not have exactly 4 cards at the start of your turn". Halving the damage from a Torturer is interesting (actually it is not that good against chains in general), anyway.

20
##### Help! / Expand-Tactician, wtf?
« on: March 13, 2013, 02:29:39 pm »
http://dominion.isotropic.org/gamelog/201303/13/game-20130313-112829-e0c100a2.html

How does this beat me? What else can I sensibly do on such a weak board?

21
##### Help! / Islands, or something.
« on: March 12, 2013, 03:00:59 pm »
http://dominion.isotropic.org/gamelog/201303/12/game-20130312-115905-9cb5a1da.html

Every time I buy Islands mindlessly like that, it doesn't work, and every time my opponent does, it seems to. What gives?

How come I'm not able to set up the engine effectively later, even though my economy should be much stronger?

Why isn't my trashing faster than his with the Steward? And why does it take forever to line up TMs despite that trashing?

22
##### Dominion General Discussion / Re: Greatest Dominion moments 2013
« on: March 12, 2013, 02:53:10 pm »
It was a massive engine board, where I once spent \$15 for a Council Room after realizing it was the only +Buy... then I found that I never got around to picking up a Ghost Ship, so I was helping him with that; and he won the City split; and earlier had been having better luck lining up KC-Mountebank (even though I had more KCs). Just so many power cards that it's hard to know where to begin.

But then with two piles gone and his Cities powered up, he piled the Peddlers, bought a Province... and lost to the 8 Monument points (minus a Curse) that I'd built up.

http://dominion.isotropic.org/gamelog/201303/12/game-20130312-114929-6a9d3fd6.html

23
##### Dominion General Discussion / Re: Stupid Pet Tricks
« on: March 12, 2013, 01:36:02 pm »
Just lost a game because I tried to Ambassador the last Province while ahead... only to realise he had a Lighthouse out. Sad times.

... So all that happened was you wasted your Action, and he was far enough behind that just getting the last Province wouldn't win, and yet he won on his turn anyway? Had he been slowly building up a megaturn deck in spite of your Ambassadoring or something?

24
##### Innovation General Discussion / Re: Online Innovation
« on: March 12, 2013, 01:31:55 pm »
I am finding that the client is completely unusable for me

Firefox 13.0, I observe the following:

- My hand never shows up. When I toggle 'show text' for my hand, I get "'hand' is not defined" in the console.

- Sometimes the text area for chat does not show up; I have a text box where I can type messages to send, but I do not get them echoed, nor do I see any responses from my opponent. This is accompanied by similar 'not-defined' Javascript exceptions in the console.

- Both in the lobby and in game, a 'syntax error' is reported on every AJAX response (I think this is just a matter of the MIME type setting, since the responses look like valid JSON and seem to be getting parsed fine).

25
##### Help! / Re: I apparently don't understand Governors at all.
« on: March 12, 2013, 02:48:14 am »
I wanted Feast to get a Governor right away from it. Is that somehow wrong? Again, am I not actually trying to win a split?

I picked up Tactician and Forge out of frustration because my Governors weren't lining up on their own. Am I supposed to be using them for draw anyway? My question is really really about the mechanics of the card rather than the buying.

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