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1

Innovation General Discussion / Tournament! (results thread)

« on: November 28, 2014, 03:05:58 pm »

Hi all,
The bracket has been posted at http://challonge.com/isotropicinnovation2014
Please get in touch with your opponents of the first two rounds and schedule games with them before the end of next week (December 7th).
Play 4 games (base, echoes, e/f, e/f/c), defaulting to standard achievement target (but you can play extra achievement if you both agree).  Try to keep links to the games and post the results here.

Participants with their time zones (UTC+/-)
antony -8
ipofanes +1
qdread -5
markusin -5
popsofctown -6
Lekkit +1
moomoo -5 (but claims -9 is closer to his sleep patterns :-))
JimKam +8
AJD -5
MTom -5

Antony

2

Innovation General Discussion / Tournament?

« on: November 24, 2014, 12:34:53 am »

Anyone interested in an innovation tournament?
Suggested format: round robin of 4-game matches (base, echoes, echoes+figures, echoes+figures+cities), to keep everybody happy :-)

3

Innovation General Discussion / Moar bugs

« on: June 04, 2014, 04:19:37 am »

Radio-telescope doesn't like seeing the cards it drew go anywhere else than in hand (yes, I'm looking at you Rhazes).

4

Innovation General Discussion / Yet another bug report

« on: April 11, 2014, 09:17:26 pm »

I don't have the link, but in case Doug is reading this: Susan Blackmore crashes the game if the card she is supposed to score (by virtue of being activated) scores itself first (e.g., in our case, loom, which was the lowest card on my opponent's deck).

5

Innovation Game Reports / 9 special achievements / decrees

« on: August 27, 2013, 02:02:39 am »

Including 4 in the last round, with an up->left unsplay.
http://innovation.isotropic.org/gamelog/201308/26/game-20130826-225905-5cb00c32.html

6

Innovation General Discussion / FiS: subtler bugs

« on: July 22, 2013, 10:34:42 pm »

http://innovation.isotropic.org/gamelog/201307/22/game-20130722-193035-bee863c7.html
On my turn 9, I try to meld Printing Press from my forecast, triggering the karma of Sejong the Great (if you would meld a blue card of value above 3, instead return it and meld a card of value one higher), so I meld Coal instead (and not Printing Press).  I am still asked whether I want to apply Printing Press' dogma, but when I say yes it applies Sejong the Great's (the top blue card at that point) dogma instead (afaict).  I don't know what the official rules say but it is well established that a card's dogma can apply even after the card isn't at the top of its pile anymore (e.g. if a first part of the dogma scored the card itself), so I would guess that instead I should still have gotten Printing Press' dogma?

7

Innovation General Discussion / FiS bug report

« on: July 18, 2013, 04:15:34 am »

Bicycle (activated through the forecast) doesn't like exchanging Figures, apparently
See attached.

8

Innovation Game Reports / Industrialization when behind in factories

« on: March 21, 2013, 09:50:56 pm »

http://innovation.isotropic.org/gamelog/201303/21/game-20130321-184900-15049a30.html
I just needed to draw a 7 as quickly as possible for my 6th achievement before my opponent starts melding overpowered stuff through Atomic Theory.
Also note Monumental Currency, for 27 points...

9

Innovation Articles / Article draft: Chopsticks

« on: March 20, 2013, 05:35:40 pm »

After winning another game with Chopsticks, I just realized how strong this card is, so here we go...

Chopsticks (yellow, age 1) - void, leaf, leaf, echo
echo: Draw a 1
dogma: If the 1 deck has at least a card, you may transfer its bottom card to the available achievements.

So let's say both you and your opponent (assuming 2p, I have no experience with 3 or 4p games) have managed some early scoring for 20-30 points each, grabbed a few achievements, and are ploughing your way through ages 3-5.  Somehow, you manage to draw Chopsticks, perhaps through some random dogma - or perhaps you saved it carefully since the beginning.  If the 1 deck is not empty, then you can suddenly grab an achievement per turn: apply the dogma of Chopsticks, and achieve the 1 you just transfered.

There are a few reasons why Chopsticks is so strong.  First, it does not care about sharing: because you play the dogma after your opponent in case of a share, you can make sure only one new 1 is achievable (and in case of a share, your opponent gets to draw a 1 while you draw a 1 and a card of your current level, which is a good trade...).  Second, it is very hard for your opponent to stop you: he has either to steal Chopsticks of your board (I actually don't think this is possible in the early ages), cover it by sharing some meld action (fairly random and unefficient), or attack your score pile (Medecine and Mapmaking are probably too slow, and even at age 4 there is only Anatomy and Toilet which hurt just a little bit more).  Note that score-pile attacks that transfer points to your opponent's score hurt less than normally, because as long as you have enough points, you can keep the rhythm of one achievement per turn, while your opponent needs normally at least three actions per dogma (score, tech up, achieve).
Another thing that hurts Chopsticks is depletion of the 1 deck.  If this is a concern, there are cards that can return 1s, or you can try to draw (or have you opponent) draw Echo 1s instead of base 1s.

10

Innovation Game Reports / five special achievements by fulfilling their non-dogma conditions

« on: March 19, 2013, 11:46:59 pm »

http://innovation.isotropic.org/gamelog/201303/19/game-20130319-204101-edec3089.html
One turn from the end, if I just drew (A.I.) and melded it I would have won by achievements: #1 and the five special achievements.  Moreover I would have managed to get each of these achievements by fulfilling their "non-dogma" conditions (i.e. not by activating a dogma).
Oh well, I thought I had more chance to get there by Empiricism (a green draw-upsplay, or possibly another lucky draw, would have given me my 12th clock).

11

Game Reports / Standard Possession madness

« on: March 08, 2013, 06:22:07 am »

http://dominion.isotropic.org/gamelog/201303/08/game-20130308-031359-ef6a2cea.html
With Masquerade, Apothecary and Goons (and Festival for the actions, and Highway for the finish, and Oracle thrown in the mix, and Gardens for the VPs) (no one decided to ask the Fortune Teller why a Ghost Ship was on the board too).
Apothecary+Masquerade allows HiveMindEmulator to get a Possession by turn 5(!) and I start realizing that tactical discarding on Goons will be useful, just as using the opponent's Goons when possessing him to destroy the hand he's going to possess at the expense of a few VPs... a bit later Oracle also shows up as a way to mess up the opponent's deck once you're about to be done possessing it.
HiveMindEmulator starts building a decent engine with Festival and Highway, but I luckily possess him at the right time and grab Gardens to bloat my deck.  He manages to Masquerade a Province from my hand to his while I steal one of his Possessions but my VP lead is just too big for him to overcome.

12

Innovation General Discussion / Tournament stats

« on: January 31, 2013, 01:19:48 am »

I'll try to keep this up to date.

After both marco2012/bittorrent games (5 games)

Winning conditions:
Achievements x3
Empiricism x2

Initial melds of game winners:
Pottery x2 Sailing x2 Writing
Initial melds of game losers:
Writing x2 Tools x2 Clothing

Game lengths (x+1/2 = 1st player won in the (x+1)th turn):
15.5 17 17.5 18.5 22.5

13

Innovation General Discussion / Some requests for dougz

« on: January 29, 2013, 06:23:28 am »

Dougz, as you may have picked up from the other thread, I am trying to write a parser for Innovation games to extract whatever statistics may be interesting.  Right now there are two things (among others) that make this slightly harder:
1/ There is no (afaict) all.tar.bz2 file that allows me to grab a large number of logs at a time -- right now I can just test my parser on whatever logs I remember to save directly after the game.
2/ The "transfer" action doesn't always say from where the card come -- right now I can see at least Archery (transfer from hand) and Navigation (transfer from score pile) that produce identical logs ("<player> transfers <card> to <player>'s <location>").  Can you make this log "<player> transfers <card> from <location> to <player>'s <location>" instead?
Of course there is no hurry, but that would be very helpful.
Thanks in advance.

14

Innovation General Discussion / Tournament round 1

« on: January 28, 2013, 04:55:52 pm »

So let's start!

antony-Qvist: 1-1
Game 1: antony (Sailing) wins by 6 achievements to 2 (Qvist: Writing) in 19 turns
http://innovation.isotropic.org/gamelog/201301/28/game-20130128-125400-a6c46c39.html
I use Road Building to steal Banking from Qvist, then Banking to steal Steam Engine and then just keep scoring until the end.
Game 2: interrupted by Qvist (Sailing) losing connection while he was leading 5 achievements to 0 (antony: Clothing) after 20 turns
http://innovation.isotropic.org/gamelog/201301/28/game-20130128-132350-24bcbe87.html
Qvist's Steam Engine / Combustion basically replicates my previous game but I manage to stop him using Rocketry just before it is too late.  Unfortunately his connection drops immediately after (he was probably an overwhelming favourite to win the game at that point).  We decide to replay the game.
Game 2b: Qvist (Writing) wins by 6 achievements to 0 (antony: Clothing) in 17 turns
http://innovation.isotropic.org/gamelog/201301/28/game-20130128-134510-3f0b8a7c.html
Where Philosophy reveals itself to be a decent scorer too when the opponent doesn't manage to share its benefits.

15

Innovation General Discussion / Tournament

« on: January 25, 2013, 07:39:23 pm »

Anyone interested?  Given that I don't expect that many people signing up perhaps we can do a double round robin or something like that.
I have less than one week's worth of experience with the game but it looks fun.

16

Innovation Game Reports / Two achievements by turn 1

« on: January 25, 2013, 07:02:14 pm »

http://innovation.isotropic.org/gamelog/201301/25/game-20130125-160125-a0488ab7.html
I was half a turn away from winning by Bioengineering, too.

17

Dominion General Discussion / Rigoletto

« on: September 26, 2012, 10:36:22 pm »

I went to see Rigoletto, the opera, yesterday.  Well, it is the story of a jester, in a duke's court full of conspirators, who is cursed by a nobleman.
That's it.

18

Game Reports / Coppersmith-driven megaturn

« on: August 12, 2012, 04:25:51 pm »

http://dominion.isotropic.org/gamelog/201208/12/game-20120812-131945-14ec4e9a.html

And managed to get both the mega-turn and charge achievements in before iso goes down

19

Game Reports / Minion/Masquerade vs. Torturer/Shanty Town (province game)

« on: March 30, 2012, 07:40:05 am »

Turns out I managed to get rid of the curses with two masquerades and mitigated the discarding effect with all the minions for a close win (all curses, minions and provinces gone, though I could have tried to three-pile with the shanty towns as well)... but what's your choice?

20

Council Room Feedback / No one-trick-pony?

« on: February 23, 2012, 04:05:33 am »

Bought a single Council Room.
http://councilroom.com/game?game_id=game-20120222-032848-7571b363.html

21

Game Reports / Tactical embargoing

« on: February 06, 2012, 05:27:29 am »

http://dominion.isotropic.org/gamelog/201202/06/game-20120206-021951-7154220e.html
1/ What is your opening choice on 4/3 with: Caravan, Chancellor, Chapel, Coppersmith, Duchess, Embargo, Fool's Gold, Lookout, Minion, and Noble Brigand.
2/ panda goes for NB, then Minions, aren't these two slightly contradictory?
3/ Anyways, I decide to avoid having to mirror the minion rush by embargoing them... then take a 3-1 lead in Provinces, at the cost of horribly slowing down my deck.  Now my opp embargoes NB () so I have an easy endgame by embargoing Provinces.

22

Council Room Feedback / achievement idea?

« on: January 25, 2012, 01:39:12 pm »

Perhaps that is too close to PileDriver but still...
http://dominion.isotropic.org/gamelog/201201/25/game-20120125-103039-f60cdbb2.html
"Won with all curses in hand at the end of the game"?
(PS: NOT done on purpose, in case you wonder...)

23

Simulation / (Reasonably easy) way to bias the simulation?

« on: January 05, 2012, 08:40:13 am »

Hi,
Today I played a (no-Colony) kingdom with no $3, where the $4 were Feast and Quarry, and the interesting $5 were afaict Tactician / Treasure / Torturer.  I guess we were both going to go for BM/Tactician, but I was lucky and got a 5/2 opening so opened Torturer to slow down my opponent.  My opponent got lucky himself a few turns later and got $10 on a Tactician turn, so got two treasuries and started a Tactician/Treasure combo.  Anyways, I ended up pulling a close win, he wasn't able to stack Treasures fast enough.
I tried to simulate this on Dominiate, and indeed stacking Treasures seems too slow (the VP graph shows that it takes the lead only around turn 25 or so), but then I thought that merely giving a list of priorities is not going to be enough, instead I should also force me to get a 5/2 opener and my opponent to get $10 before say the 4th reshuffle (otherwise it's clear that Treasure-stacking is not going to be viable).
So is there a way, either to force that, or perhaps more simply, to throw away any run that doesn't satisfy this property?  (of course I could also try to come up with a gain priority list that adapts itself, but then quite often both bots would end up playing single Tactician, watering down the difference in strengths.)