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Messages - Elanchana

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3
Empires Previews / Re: Empires Rulebook
« on: June 10, 2016, 02:53:32 am »
I came up with a killer combo the other day (that everyone probably saw already but eh). Advance+Fortress with extra buys? Borked?

4
Empires Previews / Re: Empires Rulebook
« on: June 07, 2016, 01:33:53 am »
Seems to me that the right use of Donate is to first buy cards which give some economy without any regard for thinning and then buy donate, trash all 10 starting cards, and transition into an engine.

I feel like its main purpose was to make junking attacks utterly irrelevant, but... that too.

Junking attacks aren't irrelevant though.  If you junk them after they've Donated the first time, you'll slow them down again.  If you do it enough, you may get them to buy Donate again, which isn't trivial.

It does neuter the -VP of Curses though, if they can Donate right before the end of the game.

Don't forget that it's essentially free when you buy it, and if they already have enough good cards (that are just getting blocked by the junk) they can pay off the debt really easily in the next turn or two. I was thinking more along the lines of "Donate is on the board, do I really want to get this Mountebank instead of building my engine?"

5
Empires Previews / Re: Empires Rulebook
« on: June 07, 2016, 01:23:29 am »
Seems to me that the right use of Donate is to first buy cards which give some economy without any regard for thinning and then buy donate, trash all 10 starting cards, and transition into an engine.

I feel like its main purpose was to make junking attacks utterly irrelevant, but... that too.

6
Empires Previews / Re: Empires Rulebook
« on: June 06, 2016, 11:04:39 pm »
fhhh.

I think DXV has lost it. I was reading through the card descriptions and I had to stop partway through the Landmarks because my brain couldn't handle everything. Adventures was complicated enough, but this is insanity.

I'll get used to it........ sometime............

Couple of random comments. Archive is awesome - it won me my first Empires playtest game, no joke. I've made good use of Encampment as well. Wild Hunt was the Gathering card I got really petty with. Wondering how something as OP as insta-thin Donate made it into the game. Delve, did you just make the Silver test irrelevant? And finally, twelve points go to... are we gonna call it "buying a Salt the Earth" or just "Salting the Earth"?

7
General Discussion / Re: Dominion Cards that put songs in your mind
« on: May 21, 2016, 10:57:49 pm »
Eurovision this year gave us the glorious Lighthouse song

8
Puzzles and Challenges / Re: Villa: To Infinity and Beyond
« on: May 18, 2016, 12:07:00 am »
Wow, mind = blown. I didn't realize that Mandarin's effect was on-gain (I thought it was on-buy, guess it was easy to confuse since it used to be impossible to gain it with treasures in play without buying it). I'm still trying to wrap my head around all the things BoM can do. Forget Villa, THAT's a borked card right there.

Here's my attempt at a Villa loop with Crown:

Kingdom includes: Crown, Villa, Council Room, Rogue, Mandarin, Peasant, Lighthouse/Page, Ferry, Bonfire
Setup: +1 buy token on Council Room, +$1 token on Rogue, -$2 token on Mandarin, all opponents defended
Starting deck: 8xCrown, 2xCouncil Room, 3xRogue
Trash includes: 2xCouncil Room, 3xRogue, Ambassador

Quote from: First iteration
Hand includes 2xCrown, Council Room

Action Phase:
Play Crown
-> Play Crown
->> Play Council Room, draw half of deck (+2 buys)
->> Replay Council Room, draw rest of deck (hand is now 6xCrown, Council Room, 3xRogue) (+2 buys)
-> Replay Crown
->> Play Crown
->>> Play Rogue, gain Council Room (+$3)
->>> Replay Rogue, gain Council Room (+$3)
->> Replay Crown
->>> Play Crown
->>>> Play Rogue, gain Rogue (+$3)
->>>> Replay Rogue, gain Rogue (+$3)
->>> Replay Crown
->>>> Play Crown
->>>>> Play Rogue, gain Rogue (+$3)
->>>>> Replay Rogue, gain Ambassador (+$3)
->>>> Replay Crown
->>>>> Play Crown
->>>>>> Play Council Room, draw 4 cards (+2 buys)
->>>>>> Replay Council Room, draw 2 cards (hand is now 2xCrown, 2xCouncil Room, 3xRogue, Ambassador) (+2 buys)
->>>>> Replay Crown
->>>>>> Play Ambassador, reveal any card without returning
->>>>>> Replay Ambassador, reveal any card without returning

Hand is now 2xCrown, 2xCouncil Room, 3xRogue

Buy Phase:
$18, 8 buys
Buy Bonfire, trash 2xCouncil Room (-$3, -1 buy)
Buy Bonfire, trash 2xRogue (-$3, -1 buy)
Buy Bonfire, trash Rogue, Ambassador (-$3, -1 buy)
Buy Mandarin, put 6xCrown on deck (-$3, -1 buy)
Buy Villa, put in hand, restart (-$4, -1 buy)

Quote from: All subsequent iterations
Hand: 2xCrown, 2xCouncil Room, 3xRogue, Villa
Deck: 6xCrown
Discard pile: Mandarin

Action Phase:
Play Crown
-> Play Crown
->> Play Council Room, draw 4xCrown (+2 buys)
->> Replay Council Room, draw 2xCrown, Mandarin (hand is now 6xCrown, Council Room, 3xRogue, Villa, Mandarin) (+2 buys)
-> Replay Crown
->> Play Crown
->>> Play Rogue, gain Council Room (+$3)
->>> Replay Rogue, gain Council Room (+$3)
->> Replay Crown
->>> Play Crown
->>>> Play Rogue, gain Rogue (+$3)
->>>> Replay Rogue, gain Rogue (+$3)
->>> Replay Crown
->>>> Play Crown
->>>>> Play Rogue, gain Rogue (+$3)
->>>>> Replay Rogue, gain Ambassador (+$3)
->>>> Replay Crown
->>>>> Play Crown
->>>>>> Play Council Room, draw 4 cards (+2 buys)
->>>>>> Replay Council Room, draw 2 cards (hand is now 2xCrown, 2xCouncil Room, 3xRogue, Villa, Mandarin, Ambassador) (+2 buys)
->>>>> Replay Crown
->>>>>> Play Ambassador, return Villa
->>>>>> Replay Ambassador, return Mandarin

Hand is now 2xCrown, 2xCouncil Room, 3xRogue

Buy Phase:
$18, 8 buys
Buy Bonfire, trash 2xCouncil Room (-$3, -1 buy)
Buy Bonfire, trash 2xRogue (-$3, -1 buy)
Buy Bonfire, trash Rogue, Ambassador (-$3, -1 buy)
Buy Mandarin, put 6xCrown on deck (-$3, -1 buy)
Buy Villa, put in hand, restart (-$4, -1 buy)

Accumulation: $2, 3 buys

Not as satisfying without the level 3 Cities but I'm still glad I managed to find something. I thought this worked without Ferry (and it probably might with 10 Crowns???) but I math'd wrong. And it's still messy as all hell but my mind doesn't really do concise solutions like this.

9
Dominion General Discussion / Re: Best Dominion moments 2016
« on: May 17, 2016, 11:41:56 pm »
Some time ago I had a game where I did more trolling than possibly any other time in my entire life.

But I can't remember if it was this one, this one, or this one. I know it involved me using Artificer and needlessly prolonging the game by midturn gaining cards instead of buying them like a normal person.

10
Empires Previews / Re: Empires Bonus Preview #5: Castles
« on: May 15, 2016, 03:09:27 am »
Really random thought - I wonder if I've visited a chateau in France that fits every castle description. My parents and I did some touristing in the Loire valley and the Acquitaine, so I got to go to the crumbling castle of Chinon, the sprawling castle of Chambord, a humble castle owned by a private family with records showing the owners for the last thousand years...

11
Empires Previews / Re: Empires Bonus Preview #5: Castles
« on: May 14, 2016, 04:34:50 am »
I walked past a Castles game when I was taking a break from a game day with a couple of playtesters and I only got to see that it was a "variation pile" before they were all like "NO YOU ARE NOT ALLOWED TO KNOW WHAT THESE DO IF YOU ARE NOT PLAYING." So it's nice to finally know what I missed.

I mean, as a concept, I love it. In practice, probably not so much? Castles seem to have the disadvantage of forcing you to decide on a very specific strategy before you make your first buy of the game (and I know there are a lot of cards like that, but Empires seems to be throwing more in than usual). As someone who's lost way too many games either not reacting to their opponent's strategy enough or not compensating for far-from-ideal shuffle luck, I can't help but get nervous when I go into a strategy blind. This should be my cue to suck it up, but that isn't as easy as it sounds. It doesn't help either that Castle-friendly boards will probably be much harder to spot than, say, Gardens- or Vineyard-friendly ones. Leaving this up to you guys.

12
Empires Previews / Re: Empires Previews #5: Events
« on: May 13, 2016, 01:05:27 pm »
Windfall seems weak. If you're drawing your deck, you usually don't want Golds. But I could be wrong there.

I think you're wrong there... quite often you'll build up a great engine that can draw your deck and generate multiple buys; but still only end up with $15 or so money to spend. I remember many games where I've bought a Province and a Silver, then later a Province and a Gold, then finally could move on to 2 Provinces. This gives you a whole new way to build up an engine and then quickly add payload.

Yeah, you've never had an "oops, I've got too many Laboratories" moment?

This would have been a life saver on my default Base board back in the day. I always had to take a few turns to buy Golds before finishing my engine and then my opponent would get ahead. No need anymore! Except I've retired that board. And that strategy.

13
Empires Previews / Re: Empires Bonus Preview #2: Crown
« on: May 13, 2016, 01:01:28 pm »
Clarification question. When you play Crown in your action phase, does it still count as a treasure that can be topdecked with Mandarin?

14
Empires Previews / Re: Empires Previews #5: Events
« on: May 13, 2016, 12:33:46 pm »
New piledriving achievement: Buy out the Provinces in one turn by ONLY using Dominate.

I seem to remember one poorly-thought-out game I played where I hit way above $8 a bunch of turns in a row but there was no +Buy on the board. If only...

Windfall looks really good for Golden Deck variants, or possibly engines that get a bit delayed in buying payload. Triumph sounds like it could be a key part of a ton of forced wins.

15
Puzzles and Challenges / Re: Villa: To Infinity and Beyond
« on: May 12, 2016, 12:28:48 pm »
Here's an open-ended challenge for anyone who wants to try: Can you make this work without KC? I got REALLY close but there were roadblocks I couldn't get past without tripling. No need to satisfy any hard modes - just the main goal of (theoretically) infinite buying power.

The limiting factor is getting cards from play back into your hand.  You can do that by trashing the card and retrieving it from the trash with Rogue or Graverobber.  But every time you play Rogue or Graverobber, you've just put another card into play.  And if you throne a Rogue, you get two cards out of play, but you also put two into play.  Any combination of Rogues, Throne Rooms, Processions, Crowns, and Royal Carriages will never get more cards out of play than you put in.  Only King's Court.

But! Maybe Crown does provide an exception after all.  If you buy a Mandarin, that puts all treasures in play on top of your deck.
Hmmmm... Crown does sound like a possible workaround to the actions-in-play problem. And in that case you'd double Ambassador as well to put Villa AND Mandarin back (buying the Mandarin first later). Lemme pull out my unfinished Procession solution and try to get back to you on this...

16
Empires Previews / Re: Empires Previews #3: VP Tokens
« on: May 12, 2016, 12:22:56 am »
I don't think Temple is petty. Its still a trasher. You just have to figure out the best time to purchase it for the tokens or risk your opponent buying it. I like the card. I remember playing this card and enjoying it a lot.

I didn't mean that the card itself was petty, just that it's probably going to encourage pettiness. Like "I'm going to buy Temple here JUST so you keep not getting the tokens."

17
Empires Previews / Re: Empires Previews #3: VP Tokens
« on: May 11, 2016, 10:36:26 pm »
Temple is one of those cards that I was referring to with the "pettiness" thing. I'm just seeing a ton of games where either no one gets Temple because they don't want to risk the other players getting the VP gathering tokens, or everyone buys it out as fast as possible because of the same reason. It's not a mechanic I can see myself enjoying... even if it's just because I'm terrible at timing this kinda thing.

Chariot Race got odd when I played with it, but I had a power-mad golden deck so I didn't give a crap. I don't remember if I did anything with Groundskeeper but it looks fun.

18
Puzzles and Challenges / Re: Villa: To Infinity and Beyond
« on: May 11, 2016, 10:25:19 pm »
So, I guess people want me to post my expert mode solution - I'm sorry I didn't do this sooner, but f.ds was down for like a whole day. Anyway...

Kingdom includes: Lighthouse (if non-solo), Ambassador, Villa, City, Rogue, King's Court
Events: Bonfire, Ferry
Setup: -$2 token on King's Court, all opponents defended, 2 piles empty

Hand: 2xKing's Court, 2xRogue, City, Villa*
Deck/discard: empty
Trash includes: 4xKing's Court, 4xRogue, 3xCity, Ambassador
*(The Villa is not in your hand at the very start of the turn, but it is there at the start of each subsequent cycle.)

ACTION PHASE
Play King's Court
-> Play King's Court
->> Play Rogue, gain King's Court (+$2)
->> Replay Rogue, gain Rogue (+$2)
->> Replay Rogue, gain City (+$2)
-> Replay King's Court
->> Play City, draw King's Court, Rogue (+1 buy, +$1)
->> Replay City, draw City (+1 buy, +$1)
->> Replay City, draw nothing (+1 buy, +$1)
-> Replay King's Court
->> Play King's Court
->>> Play Rogue, gain King's Court (+$2)
->>> Replay Rogue, gain Rogue (+$2)
->>> Replay Rogue, gain City (+$2)
->> Replay King's Court
->>> Play City, draw King's Court, Rogue (+1 buy, +$1)
->>> Replay City, draw City (+1 buy, +$1)
->>> Replay City, draw nothing (+1 buy, +$1)
->> Replay King's Court
->>> Play King's Court
->>>> Play Rogue, gain King's Court (+$2)
->>>> Replay Rogue, gain King's Court (+$2)
->>>> Replay Rogue, gain Rogue (+$2)
->>> Replay King's Court
->>>> Play Rogue, gain Rogue (+$2)
->>>> Replay Rogue, gain City (+$2)
->>>> Replay Rogue, gain Ambassador (+$2)
->>> Replay King's Court
->>>> Play City, draw 2xKing's Court (+1 buy, +$1)
->>>> Replay City, draw 2xRogue (+1 buy, +$1)
->>>> Replay City, draw City, Ambassador (+1 buy, +$1)
Play Ambassador, return Villa*
BUY PHASE
$33, 10 buys
Buy Bonfire, trash 2xKing's Court (-1 buy, -$3)
Buy Bonfire, trash 2xKing's Court (-1 buy, -$3)
Buy Bonfire, trash 2xRogue (-1 buy, -$3)
Buy Bonfire, trash 2xRogue (-1 buy, -$3)
Buy Bonfire, trash 2xCity (-1 buy, -$3)
Buy Bonfire, trash City, Ambassador (-1 buy, -$3)
Buy Villa, put into hand, return to action phase, restart cycle (-1 buy, -$4)

TOTAL ACCUMULATION PER CYCLE: $12, 3 buys

I do realize this is messy as all hell. There was a version with only 2 King's Courts that was MUCH cleaner but it didn't accumulate buys (this was when I wanted to do an infinite turn challenge rather than an infinite coins/buys one). L3 Cities are perfect for this - you rack up coins and buys, draw everything you need, and the nonterminality means you don't need to use a KC slot on Ambassador. Do you guys think that's cheating though?


Here's an open-ended challenge for anyone who wants to try: Can you make this work without KC? I got REALLY close but there were roadblocks I couldn't get past without tripling. No need to satisfy any hard modes - just the main goal of (theoretically) infinite buying power.

19
Empires Previews / Re: Empires Bonus Preview #1: Villa
« on: May 10, 2016, 10:02:25 am »
I might have played with guys who are playtesters.
So that makes me a playtester-tester.

Yeah same here. I was one of the... secondary playtesters I guess? I was in the right place at the right time to learn about some of the cards and mechanics (thanks Elestan) but I wasn't singled out by DXV and I definitely haven't gotten to familiarize myself with all of them. This was one of the ones I did get to see.

I'm gonna go ahead and agree with everyone saying the only thing stopping Villa from being way OP is the lack of draw. If it were, for example, a level 3 City with that on-gain effect, then we'd have something to worry about. But as it is, there's not THAT much you can do with the on-gain without a way to get more cards - it's kinda like Coin in that aspect. The reason I thought it was so broken in my game is that I DID have a way to draw more cards because of the +1 card token, but that's kinda what the token is there for.

20
Puzzles and Challenges / Re: Villa: To Infinity and Beyond
« on: May 10, 2016, 09:49:16 am »
Here's a solution using a five-card deck.  It has no durations, no princes, and the only token is Ferry.

Setup: Ferry on KC
In trash: KC, KC, Rogue, Rogue, BoM, Villa, Villa, Villa
In Hand: KC, KC, Rogue, Rogue, BoM.  These are the only cards in your deck.

Part A:
Play KC-KC-R-R-BoM
Rogues: gain KC, KC, R, R, BoM, Villa
BoM: Mining Village (trashing itself), Salvager (trashing Villa), Watchtower (drawing KC, KC, R, R, BoM)
1 Travelling fairs
2 Bonfires: trash KC, KC, R, R
Buy Villa

Part B:
Play KC-KC-R-R-BoM
Rogues: gain KC, KC, R, R, BoM, Villa
BoM: Mining Village (trashing itself), Ambassador (returning two Villas to supply), Watchtower (drawing KC, KC, R, R, BoM)
3 Travelling Fairs
2 Bonfires: trash KC, KC, R, R
Buy Villa, play it.

Part C:
Play KC-KC-R-R-BoM
Rogues: gain KC, KC, R, R, BoM, Villa
BoM: Mining Village (trashing itself), Salvager (trashing Villa), Watchtower (drawing KC, KC, R, R, BoM)
2 Travelling Fairs
3 Bonfires: trash KC, KC, R, R, Villa, Villa
Buy Villa

It starts out with AB, then loops ABCB,ABCB...
Payoff from A: 6
Payoff from B: -1
Payoff from C: 1
Unique cards: 8 + 3 events


Nice one!!

When should I post my solution, by the way? There are obviously a lot of ways to do this, but only one (that I've found anyway) that satisfies all hard mode conditions (which I'll admit were somewhat arbitrary).

21
Puzzles and Challenges / Re: Villa: To Infinity and Beyond
« on: May 10, 2016, 12:23:52 am »
That still is a bit reliant on shuffle luck though, on a very technical level. My own solution is completely luckless to get started.
Eventually you'll hit every starting hand (with probability 1).

If that's not okay you can solve it by using Black Market and putting Scrying Pool, Council Room and Hunting Ground in the BM deck. You can then initially draw your deck with SP, and use CR and HG for draw (the disadvantage is that the on-trash ability of HG caused me headaches, you need a bit extra draw to draw those annoying Duchies (but that can be easily solved by putting some extra cards in the BM deck)).

I'm not saying that your solution isn't good. It is. It's pretty damn awesome.

I'm just saying there's a way you can start with only 5 cards in your deck.

22
Puzzles and Challenges / Re: Villa: To Infinity and Beyond
« on: May 10, 2016, 12:14:31 am »
I can do it with 5 kingdom cards and 2 events, without durations or teacher-tokens and even without Black Market. This is in a solo game; with opponents I need every opponent to have a Moat in hand, which adds 1 kingdom pile.

Kingdom: Ambassador, Villa, Rogue, King's Court, Council Room
Events: Ferry, Bonfire
shelter game

Preparation: Put Ferry token on KC. Get a deck consisting of KC*6, Amb, Rogue*4, Villa*4, CR*3, Overgrown Estate, Hovel. Trash all starting copper and Necropolis and make sure at least the following is in the trash: KC*4, Amb*1, Rogue*4, Villa*2, CR (trash with Bonfire).

Start your infinite turn when you have KC*2, CR*2 (this will eventually always happen). Play KC-KC-CR-CR-Villa to draw your deck.

-- START LOOP -- (hand consist of KC*4, Amb*1, Rogue*4, Villa*3, CR (and OE), trash consists of KC*4, Amb*1, Rogue*4, Villa*2, CR)
Now play your 4 KCs in a chain to play 7 actions three times:
play 4 Rogues three times, to gain KC*4, Amb, Rogue*4, Villa*2, CR
play CR three times to draw your deck.
play 2 Villas three times.

Play Ambassador, returning a Villa.

You gained 30 coins and 9 buys by this KC-chain. Go to the buy phase and buy Bonfire 6 times to trash 4*KC, 4*Rogue, CR, Villa*2, Amb. Buy a Villa to return to your action phase, and repeat the loop.
-- END LOOP --

Every iteration of the loop gives 8 coins and 2 buys, so you can get arbitrarily much coins and buys by doing this as often as you like (however, not infinitely many, since that takes infinite time)


EDIT: simplify a little bit.
EDIT 2: Had to make some minor changes because you cannot trash hovel without having a victory card in your deck in this kingdom.

I think I might have been bested.



That still is a bit reliant on shuffle luck though, on a very technical level. My own solution is completely luckless to get started.

23
Puzzles and Challenges / Re: Easy Puzzles
« on: May 09, 2016, 11:40:38 pm »
Here's a very easy puzzle:
You play a card with no tokens on it. Champion is not in play. There are no durations or villages in play.

You play card X and draw four cards. You then play a Scout.

What is card X?

City Quarter ja?

24
Puzzles and Challenges / Re: Villa: To Infinity and Beyond
« on: May 09, 2016, 11:28:39 pm »
Bonfire (and Mandarin) say hi.

I have a solution with 7 kingdom piles. I'm trying to reduce it to 5.

I've gotten it down to 6. I tried reducing it to 5 and failed (under all the hard mode conditions). But if you succeed, congrats!

25
Empires Previews / Re: Empires Bonus Preview #1: Villa
« on: May 09, 2016, 11:19:20 pm »
AND THEN EVERYONE GETS AN ACTION PHASE AT THE SAME TIME RAAAAAAH MASS INSANITY

Ahem. I think that's what happens (besides my addition). So that's a pretty bad idea. <.<

It's already established from Caravan Guard that Actions gained out of turn do nothing.  And since it's not the other players' Buy phases, the "Return to Action phase" clause does not trigger.

"besides my addition"

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