Dominion Strategy Forum
Dominion => Dominion Online at Shuffle iT => Dominion General Discussion => Dominion Isotropic => Topic started by: Schneau on March 15, 2013, 06:51:15 am
-
I probably won't have time to play today, so yesterday I probably played my last game on Isotropic. Feel free to post about your last game on Iso here too!
My last game went out with a bang (http://councilroom.com/game?game_id=game-20130314-110920-bc075aa8.html). It was a board with many of my favorite cards - Fishing Village, Goons, Throne Room, and Grand Market, to name a few. There wasn't enough trashing for a ultra-quick game, but the piles were getting pretty empty when on turn 16, my opponent had a 3 Goons turn to boost into a 25 point lead. Starting with only 3 cards, I managed to draw my whole deck for the first time in the game by Throning Council Rooms, and was able to finish a third pile and buy a bunch of Provinces and Coppers for a 62 point turn. It was a great way to end my playing on Isotropic!
-
http://dominion.isotropic.org/gamelog/201303/15/game-20130315-041757-1f6d67e7.html
I think this may be it. Down by one going into my last turn, slip the final curse past her Lighthouses and buy an Estate to win. Gardens and Witch on the board--two memorable cards from when I first played, IRL.
Thanks for the great times, DougZ.
-
This was the highlight (http://councilroom.com/game?game_id=game-20130314-144416-7144a48e.html) of my final series of games. One turn and an Estate off a 4 way tie!
#1 qmech: 29 points (3 Provinces, 3 Duchies, 3 Estates, and a Curse); 17 turns
opening: Fishing Village / Trader
[37 cards] 2 Traders, 6 Coppers, 16 Silvers, 3 Golds, 3 Estates, 3 Duchies, 3 Provinces, 1 Curse
#1 Aether: 29 points (3 Provinces, 3 Duchies, 4 Estates, and 2 Curses); 17 turns
opening: Silver / Trader
[34 cards] 2 Treasuries, 1 Fishing Village, 1 Trader, 5 Coppers, 12 Silvers, 1 Gold, 4 Estates, 3 Duchies, 3 Provinces, 2 Curses
#1 Volandum: 29 points (4 Provinces, a Duchy, 3 Estates, and a Curse); 17 turns
opening: Treasury / nothing
[27 cards] 2 Treasuries, 1 Mandarin, 1 Trader, 5 Coppers, 5 Silvers, 4 Golds, 3 Estates, 1 Duchy, 4 Provinces, 1 Curse
#4 Achilles: 28 points (2 Provinces, 4 Duchies, and 4 Estates); 16 turns
opening: Silver / Sea Hag
[25 cards] 1 Bazaar, 1 Sea Hag, 7 Coppers, 5 Silvers, 1 Gold, 4 Estates, 4 Duchies, 2 Provinces
-
Well, I'm not sure if I want to play to mess up my current last game which was a lot of fun.
I didn't grab the log, but it was a game between myself (lvl 40) and Cruton (lvl 45) which featured the following cards:
Forge, Adventurer, Border Village, Fairgrounds, Horn of Plenty, Inn, Horse Traders, Island, Trade Route, Woodcutter
We both thought HoP would synergize well with Fairgrounds, but that didn't work so well.
The most amazing thing was when I played Something, Island away a Copper and then HoP.
Because Island was no longer "in play" I had to grab something costing up to $2 instead of $3 I had mistakenly expected. So in all the confusion I grabbed an Estate, trashing my HoP in the process instead of a Copper. Funnily enough a couple of turns later Cruton made the same mistake, but he took a Copper. I was amazed that DougZ even managed to get this right.
The end game was very tense, he had a lot of Trade Routes, all worth $5, but eventually ran out of fuel. I had an extra Gold and an Adventurer which proved actually pretty decent with all the green we were swallowing. Piles were low but neither of us could swoop the last 2 cards (Island and TR) while ahead. In the end I was fortunate enough to keep the lead for an extra turn and get the needed $7+ with 2 buys.
-
http://dominion.isotropic.org/gamelog/201303/15/game-20130315-051143-5381d126.html (http://dominion.isotropic.org/gamelog/201303/15/game-20130315-051143-5381d126.html)
had a nice last duke game. i grabbed all 8 Duchies and 6 Dukes =) easy if you arent contested with goveneur hoard Nomad Camp support
-
http://dominion.isotropic.org/gamelog/201303/15/game-20130315-062719-412d1a4a.html (http://dominion.isotropic.org/gamelog/201303/15/game-20130315-062719-412d1a4a.html)
Not my last game ever, but probably one of the first where I put Mandarin to any competent use. And just the other day I had my very first win with a Bureaucrat-based strategy.
Also where are you people? There's a few hours left and the lobby is practically empty!
-
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=FFShaocBaug
This was my last game. Would have played more, but at 5:28 with the Gold and Estate on top and without the second FG in my hand I felt that it was time to stop playing.
-
http://dominion.isotropic.org/gamelog/201303/15/game-20130315-071306-2effdd0e.html (http://dominion.isotropic.org/gamelog/201303/15/game-20130315-071306-2effdd0e.html)
Might have to call this my actual last game.... Won with 3 of my favorite cards, a Develop thrown in for kicks, and got the "Who Needs Green Cards?"
Not a bad way to go out.
-
http://dominion.isotropic.org/gamelog/201303/15/game-20130315-073444-9b5b92f7.html
I'm gonna stick with this. Apprentice and Mountebank are a little bit interesting appearing side by side. Thanks for the game Morgrim!
-
DEpending on when Doug closes it down, this is likely my last one:
http://dominion.isotropic.org/gamelog/201303/15/game-20130315-083656-00677b2d.html
PapaSnork (level 40 - great player) and I on an IGG board with some Bishop complexity.
Here's the reason to stop playing now:
Estates, Duchies, and Curses are all gone.
ednever and PapaSnork rejoice in their shared victory!
Didn't even finish the last IGG because both of us drew $4 for 2 turns in a row.
May she rest in peace! And live again through Innovation!
Ed
-
If I don't have time to get any more games in tonight, I still think I did an ok job. Gained probably 12ish levels in the last 3 days (well, 10 in the last 2 so far, dunno about today), and finished off with a win against the strongest player (and also 3-2 against the other lvl52).
That said, I'm probably playing more later anyway, so there's still plenty of time to crash and burn.
-
This is really pedestrian compared to other accomplishments, but still.
http://dominion.isotropic.org/gamelog/201303/15/game-20130315-103802-51b8fb34.html
A game against a player of a similar level, non-mirror strategies (BM-Envoy against a Caravan stack). Brute force wins.
Thank you, Isotropic, for letting me play lots of Dominion... and it looks like I should learn Innovation :).
-
I stayed up too late and eventually came back to win a board with Tournament (maybe my favorite card).
Figured it was a good last iso game to have.
-
DEpending on when Doug closes it down, this is likely my last one:
http://dominion.isotropic.org/gamelog/201303/15/game-20130315-083656-00677b2d.html
PapaSnork (level 40 - great player) and I on an IGG board with some Bishop complexity.
Here's the reason to stop playing now:
Estates, Duchies, and Curses are all gone.
ednever and PapaSnork rejoice in their shared victory!
Didn't even finish the last IGG because both of us drew $4 for 2 turns in a row.
May she rest in peace! And live again through Innovation!
Ed
It was an honor for me as well.
Couldn't resist to keep playing after the previous one.
I don't think I've ever actually bought the last Curse for a tie so this was a great farewell salute.
Cheers all, time to learn Innovation.
-
Didn't save the log, so hopefully it will show up on Council Room tomorrow, but most likely I've played my last game now.
It was a fun Tournament-Colony-King's Court-City game. We both opened 2/5, which sucked for that board. He went City, and I went Tournament. I started to buy Cities with my $5s; otherwise Tournaments and King's Courts. Got Followers, then Princess, then Trusty Steed, then Diadem... the first 3 being played with a King's Court at least once each. Never got a second Province; got 5/3 Colony split plus 6 extra Estates to his 6 Curses.
-
Ah crap, I totally forgot about this...
-
http://dominion.isotropic.org/gamelog/201303/15/game-20130315-135606-1fa3a670.html
Used a last turn forge on a caravan to deplete the caravan pile, activating my cities so I could get enough buys to 3-pile the native villages.
-
I don't know if this will be my last game, but my last for now was definitely fun. A long, long Ambassador war.
http://dominion.isotropic.org/gamelog/201303/15/game-20130315-140847-09823783.html
-
This one might be my last: http://www.councilroom.com/game?game_id=game-20130314-130648-b41d3257.html
He choice of opening masquerade on a possession board REALLY does not work out well for him. (Especially since I just salvaged the masquerade he tried to pass me)
-
Remaking Estates into Villages, Militias into Council Rooms (but keeping some Militias for post-CR use), buying Grand Markets with Silvers and Militias, while my opponent is going for some simple BM on a Colony board. He has around 5 Platinums and 5 Golds when I start buying money, but at that point I consistently generate ~$20 per turn so that's more than enough to catch up.
-
http://dominion.isotropic.org/gamelog/201303/15/game-20130315-153347-d09114ed.html
Nothing like some good double tactician to end things. I wish I had time for a marathon tonight but unfortunately that is not the case. It's been real guys.
-
Didn't see this thread earlier:
Axxle's last game on dominion.iso. Might not be a great moment in a vaccum but it is my last one which makes it memorable. http://dominion.isotropic.org/gamelog/201303/15/game-20130315-084821-7b6afbe7.html
-
So it was still up this afternoon and I got in a few more last games.
Decided this was a good one to end with:
http://dominion.isotropic.org/gamelog/201303/15/game-20130315-161452-529874e2.html
Winning 93 to -1 on a King's Court Bridge/Torturer mega-turn without any +actions. It was a challenge to set up as the only trashing was Mint and Loan - and without the +actions I had to balance the terminals I needed later (for this mega turn) with their uselessness until I got the multiple King's Court's to line up. But it happened on turn 20:
(ednever draws: a Silver, 2 King's Courts, a Torturer, and a Curse.)
ednever plays a King's Court.
... and plays a King's Court.
... ... and plays a Torturer.
... ... ... drawing 3 cards.
... ... ... jar discards 2 cards.
... ... and plays the Torturer again.
... ... ... drawing 3 cards.
... ... ... jar gains a Curse in hand.
... ... and plays the Torturer a third time.
... ... ... drawing 3 cards.
... ... ... jar gains a Curse in hand.
... and plays the King's Court again.
... ... and plays a Torturer.
... ... ... drawing 3 cards.
... ... ... jar gains a Curse in hand.
... ... and plays the Torturer again.
... ... ... drawing 3 cards.
... ... ... jar gains a Curse in hand.
... ... and plays the Torturer a third time.
... ... ... drawing 3 cards.
... ... ... jar discards 2 cards.
... and plays the King's Court a third time.
... ... and plays a King's Court.
... ... ... and plays a Bridge.
... ... ... ... getting +1 buy, +$1, and reducing all costs by $1.
... ... ... and plays the Bridge again.
... ... ... ... getting +1 buy, +$1, and reducing all costs by $1.
... ... ... and plays the Bridge a third time.
... ... ... ... getting +1 buy, +$1, and reducing all costs by $1.
... ... and plays the King's Court again.
... ... ... and plays a Bridge.
... ... ... ... getting +1 buy, +$1, and reducing all costs by $1.
... ... ... and plays the Bridge again.
... ... ... ... getting +1 buy, +$1, and reducing all costs by $1.
... ... ... and plays the Bridge a third time.
... ... ... ... getting +1 buy, +$1, and reducing all costs by $1.
... ... and plays the King's Court a third time.
... ... ... and plays a Bridge.
... ... ... ... getting +1 buy, +$1, and reducing all costs by $1.
... ... ... and plays the Bridge again.
... ... ... ... getting +1 buy, +$1, and reducing all costs by $1.
... ... ... and plays the Bridge a third time.
... ... ... ... getting +1 buy, +$1, and reducing all costs by $1.
ednever plays a Gold, 2 Silvers, and a Copper.
ednever buys a Colony.
ednever buys a Colony.
ednever buys a Colony.
ednever buys a Colony.
ednever buys a Colony.
ednever buys a Colony.
ednever buys a Colony.
ednever buys a Colony.
ednever buys a Province.
ednever buys a Province.
It's been a pleasure. Too bad it wasn't a Horn of Plenty mega-turn to end it...
(Honorable mention is not one, but TWO games this afternoon I made work with Develop! Nice way to end it. Now if only I had found a way to open Mint / something other than Fool's Gold and make that work...)
Ed
-
A real nail biter between me and the current no. 1 (level 52 - didn't that stuff used to be outlawed? ;) ).
http://dominion.isotropic.org/gamelog/201303/15/game-20130315-161638-cbf181d3.html
I don't usually win against any of the top 10 players, so this was a great time for me to quit. Yesterday I played like 40 games. Today just this one.
-
My last game went out with a bang (http://councilroom.com/game?game_id=game-20130314-110920-bc075aa8.html)
http://dominion.isotropic.org/gamelog/201303/15/game-20130315-153347-d09114ed.html
Poor tomato on a mission was the victim to both my and shark_bait's last games.
-
Didn't get to finish my 50th game of the day:
(http://img833.imageshack.us/img833/729/lastday.png)
At least I ended with a win (would have been another one with a few more minutes). Thanks to eigensheep for being my last <3
-
My last game finished just seconds before the server was shut down, so I might have won the last iso game ever!
1:10 »»» I'm writing python and I've some free time
1:10 »»» I feel FANTASTIC and I've some free time
1:10 »»» While you're losing I'll have some free time
1:10 RebelLemming: gg
1:10 »»» And when we're down I will have some free time
1:10 SheCantSayNo: gg
1:10 »»» Some free time
1:10 »»» Some free time
http://dominion.isotropic.org/gamelog/201303/15/game-20130315-171023-f53e558a.html
-
Also, doug, let's see an updated/final leaderboard!
-
My last game finished just seconds before the server was shut down, so I might have won the last iso game ever!
1:10 »»» I'm writing python and I've some free time
1:10 »»» I feel FANTASTIC and I've some free time
1:10 »»» While you're losing I'll have some free time
1:10 RebelLemming: gg
1:10 »»» And when we're down I will have some free time
1:10 SheCantSayNo: gg
1:10 »»» Some free time
1:10 »»» Some free time
http://dominion.isotropic.org/gamelog/201303/15/game-20130315-171023-f53e558a.html
Cool, I was just about to come here wondering what was The Last game on Isotropic.
-
Also, doug, let's see an updated/final leaderboard!
It'd be interesting to see one with all the players who haven't played for N days, as well.
-
I forgot to grab the URLs :( But my last two games were both wins: a doubletac-Monument engine (just managed to grab 6 Monuments for a Colony each turn, though I had to Apprentice one of them to keep going) built with vanilla Villages (that always feels good) vs. someone playing a mostly money-oriented single-Tac strategy; and another win in a NV-Bridge mirror (a squeaker; the other player sniped a Province early after emptying the mat a couple of times, taking a Gold, and aggressively going for Pearl Divers as the third pile; I barely managed to build up enough on my mat to have a double-Province turn and buy the last three Pearl Divers simultaneously. I think he also got a Duchy somewhere).
-
While I'm posting images,
Since this file is never getting updated again, here are all (think there's like one or two exceptions in there, maybe) of my 2p games from Feb 1 2012 and on:
(http://img708.imageshack.us/img708/893/dominionresults.png)
I wish I was just a little bit better at this game, but of course I realize a ~60% winrate against pretty skilled opposition is still pretty strong. I'd be interested in seeing other players' records, if you kept anything similar to this.
The second set of results/avg rating/winrate, below the first one, is counting games only against people at level X or higher. Apparently I had a positive winrate against "level 42 and up" (avg rating 45.18), at 165-163-9; above that and I fall below 50% (except against level 53's, where my lifetime record is 0-0-1!). Damn you Obi Wan and Stef!
-
Final ranking: 1386-2247-58
I consider this to be my last game:
http://www.councilroom.com/game?game_id=game-20120815-200308-4ef4c224.html
with my now-wife =); silk roads beating provinces was pretty cool. Was on 2012-08-15 though.
I played two more games recently in memory of old times on iso, but I got torture-piled and won the other 45-33 against an unrated, so those don't really super-count.
-
Meh, I should have just picked a good win and stopped there. As it was I was trailing in a game where I was trying to set up a double Tactician to someone who went Tactician/Outpost and hit the Tactician in the Outpost turn three times in a row, then got distracted for a moment and *poof* server gone.
-
My final game was against jonts26, where I nearly picked up 12 points and emptied 13 cards from 3 piles with a Border Village / Develop / HoP / KC strategy, but screwed it up and ended up a card short. After which he bricked and I won anyway.
-
My final game was against jonts26, where I nearly picked up 12 points and emptied 13 cards from 3 piles with a Border Village / Develop / HoP / KC strategy, but screwed it up and ended up a card short. After which he bricked and I won anyway.
That was your last game? Bah. It wasn't that I bricked. I had just played a tactician and would have surely won on my turn. It's that after your misplay, you got insanely lucky with that KC/KC/moat. Anyway, glad I could send you out on a high note.
I ended up winning my last game (and likely would have won the game I was playing when the server went down). It involved alchemists and governors. I forget who I was playing. Somewhat interesting. I'll find the link tomorrow.
-
My final game was against jonts26, where I nearly picked up 12 points and emptied 13 cards from 3 piles with a Border Village / Develop / HoP / KC strategy, but screwed it up and ended up a card short. After which he bricked and I won anyway.
That was your last game? Bah. It wasn't that I bricked. I had just played a tactician and would have surely won on my turn. It's that after your misplay, you got insanely lucky with that KC/KC/moat. Anyway, glad I could send you out on a high note.
I ended up winning my last game (and likely would have won the game I was playing when the server went down). It involved alchemists and governors. I forget who I was playing. Somewhat interesting. I'll find the link tomorrow.
I think it would have been just as fun a game to go out on if I'd instead lost because of that mistake. It was so fun to attempt I wasn't particularly worried about the outcome.
-
My final game was against jonts26, where I nearly picked up 12 points and emptied 13 cards from 3 piles with a Border Village / Develop / HoP / KC strategy, but screwed it up and ended up a card short. After which he bricked and I won anyway.
That was your last game? Bah. It wasn't that I bricked. I had just played a tactician and would have surely won on my turn. It's that after your misplay, you got insanely lucky with that KC/KC/moat. Anyway, glad I could send you out on a high note.
I ended up winning my last game (and likely would have won the game I was playing when the server went down). It involved alchemists and governors. I forget who I was playing. Somewhat interesting. I'll find the link tomorrow.
Oh hey that was me. I felt that although I got a bit unlucky with not getting $3P, I also didn't play that well so my loss was entirely justified.
That was my last full game. Server ended right after I got a double Province turn in my next game, and I was in a good position to win. Oh well.
-
Remaking Estates into Villages, Militias into Council Rooms (but keeping some Militias for post-CR use), buying Grand Markets with Silvers and Militias, while my opponent is going for some simple BM on a Colony board. He has around 5 Platinums and 5 Golds when I start buying money, but at that point I consistently generate ~$20 per turn so that's more than enough to catch up.
Remake, or Remodel?
-
This, actually:
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=0HFGtqefiN0 (http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=0HFGtqefiN0)
I was going to play a series of games with my buddy as a sendoff, but life got in the way. Pretty bummed about that, but kinda cool that I recorded my last game I guess.
-
Remaking Estates into Villages, Militias into Council Rooms (but keeping some Militias for post-CR use), buying Grand Markets with Silvers and Militias, while my opponent is going for some simple BM on a Colony board. He has around 5 Platinums and 5 Golds when I start buying money, but at that point I consistently generate ~$20 per turn so that's more than enough to catch up.
Remake, or Remodel?
uhhh..Remake. CR costs $5.
-
I won my last game, but I was too busy watching Doug's Still Alive parody to really pay attention, wouldn't have cared if I lost :P
-
My last game was a Scout game ::)
With King's Court and Quarry on the board, you might hope to see some crazy engine. Well, kind of: I ended up playing the Scout/Moat combo. The reason for this: Duke.
http://councilroom.com/game?game_id=game-20130315-105547-61e6ef20.html
(besides Duke, Scout was arguably the second best kingdom card here ...)
Actually I had time to play one more game, but didn't in order to post a cool game here !
-
When the server went down, everyone auto-resigned, so there are many logs of partially completed games. If I did things right, this is the last full game ever played on Iso.
http://dominion.isotropic.org/gamelog/201303/15/game-20130315-171037-8878552b.html
-
I had intended to stop playing after a game (http://dominion.isotropic.org/gamelog/201303/14/game-20130314-183233-8b13b0ff.html) in which I was able to get all 8 Colonies without a Bridge mega-turn, but addiction is what it is.
So my last online Dominion game (http://councilroom.com/game?game_id=game-20130315-135217-40237957.html) was an anti-climactic three pile ending with a 6-0 score. I was hoping to go out with a bang rather than a fizzle.
Thanks for all the games! I'm surprised how sad it is to say goodbye to Iso :'(
The Dude abides. I don't know about you but I take comfort in that. It's good knowin' he's out there. The Dude. Takin' 'er easy for all us sinners.
-
Remaking Estates into Villages, Militias into Council Rooms (but keeping some Militias for post-CR use), buying Grand Markets with Silvers and Militias, while my opponent is going for some simple BM on a Colony board. He has around 5 Platinums and 5 Golds when I start buying money, but at that point I consistently generate ~$20 per turn so that's more than enough to catch up.
Remake, or Remodel?
uhhh..Remake. CR costs $5.
Oh man, oops! Brain fart. My bad!
-
http://councilroom.com/game?game_id=game-20130315-164432-ae096e29.html
my last game. Got insanely lucky with Black market. I got 11 cards from the black market, which included:
ambassador, mountebank, bridge, KC, TR, sea hag, highway, and three cards that gave +2 actions on a board with no +2 actions. ended up giving my opponent all 10curses on a board with no cursing, decreased the price of cards by four in one turn on a board without bridge or highway, and played 5+ terminal actions in one turn on a board with no +2actions. there was no trashing, but with a combination of scrying pool, cartographer, and cellar I managed to draw my deck a couple times. oh, and there was goons too.
-
Log from my last game: http://councilroom.com/game?game_id=game-20130315-045805-40029587.html (http://councilroom.com/game?game_id=game-20130315-045805-40029587.html)
I think my second-to-last game was better, though: http://councilroom.com/game?game_id=game-20130314-210326-452dd24a.html (http://councilroom.com/game?game_id=game-20130314-210326-452dd24a.html)
-
OK here is the log from my last full game - http://councilroom.com/game?game_id=game-20130315-170636-80fc044c.html
I'll give it a nice breakdown.
Supply: Alchemist, Governor, Great Hall, Haggler, Herbalist, Oracle, Philosopher's Stone, Potion, Saboteur, Woodcutter, and Worker's Village
We both open 4/3.
There are a number of different possibilities but I think at the heart of any of them, you have to be aiming for a Governor fueled engine. There is herbalist/P.Stone, but it's going to be way too slow here I think. Governor/BM is of course strong, but there's just so much support to improve upon it.
The big thing with governors is you want to use them for +cards as little as possible. So getting card draw from elsewhere is ideal. We have 2 options here, alchemist and oracle. Alchemist is non-terminal and very consistent, but slow setting up. Oracle is more inconsistent, but also attacks, but needs villages.
We both opt for opening potion, going into the alchemist route. I decided that if I went alchemist and the other guy didn't, I'd probably lose the governor split 6-4, or we might split them due to my first turn. But the huge card draw would let me much more effectively gain and remodel gold to provinces that it wouldn't matter. However, that theory wasn't tested as we both got potions. I opened Potion/Woodcutter, thinking the plus buy would be useful early on. However, thinking back, I would have preferred potion/oracle. Titandrake opened potion/herbalist, and while herbalist is garbage later on, it can act as an early accelerant with good luck, so it's the sort of high variance move I might make as 2P. Of course, he gets terrible early luck which most likely decides much of the game.
The basic game plan for me was then, get alchemists, get a haggler and then buy as many governors and worker's villages, gaining more villages and oracles. Use the governor's to trash extra 3's into more governors and then once I'm drawing my deck start gaining and remodeling gold as much as possible. I have the opportunity to drain three piles prematurely thanks to haggler and I take it for the win.
An interesting game, and would have been more so if luck was more equal. Thanks Titandrake for closing out my Isotropic Dominion career. It's been a blast.
-
My last game on iso was this one (http://councilroom.com/game?game_id=game-20121211-181415-dac8ab48.html) against greatexpectations back in December during the tournament.
-
My last one (http://www.councilroom.com/game?game_id=game-20130313-202728-13c66112.html) was Wednesday, KC/Scheme game.
Then I ended up playing eight games this weekend offline. So weird, playing with actual physical cards.
-
Do you attend scummeets? I'm curious, I imagine Dominion might seem some play at them.