Dominion Strategy Forum

Miscellaneous => Forum Games => Mafia Game Threads => Topic started by: jotheonah on December 28, 2021, 06:03:29 pm

Title: BM 34: Groundhog's Day Mafia -- GAME OVER, mafia wins flawlessly
Post by: jotheonah on December 28, 2021, 06:03:29 pm
Up for a bastard game where everything starts to feel very familiar? Sign up here.

This will be a regular game with a big twist. It will be a closed set-up.

I will fire it with however many people show up.

This will also be our first test of using Discord for team chat and possibly PMs.

Players:

1. MiX
2. mathdude
3. WestCoastDidds
4. Galzria
5. scolapasta
6. Awaclus
7. EFHW
8. gkrieg
9. Swowl
Title: Re: BM 34: Groundhog's Day Mafia
Post by: jotheonah on December 28, 2021, 06:03:51 pm
This is a bastard game. You can trust what the mod tells you to a point. But some things I say may not be entirely true. Or not true in the way you think they are.

The town win condition is as follows:

You are aligned with town. You win when all members of the mafia are eliminated or nothing can prevent the same.

The Rules:

The Golden Rule:
This is a game. Everyone who signs up to play must be considerate of each other, never get personal, and focus on having fun. Once the game starts, having signed up is a commitment: inactivity is just as inconsiderate as rude comments.

The Standard Rules:
1. No communication between players outside of the game thread or shared discord channels at any time. This includes passing references, jokes, or cases in other games or threads, whether in context or not.
2. If the game thread is locked, do not post. If you are unsure if something is locked, ask the mod by PM or on Discord.
3. Direct or verbatim quoting of mod-provided information (including QT opening and closing times) is strictly forbidden. Paraphrasing is okay.
4. Actions with instructions that do not specify a game state will be resolved in the order they are received.
5. All night actions must be submitted within 36 hours of day ending.
6. Players must post once every 24 hours.
7. Do not edit or delete posts, ever. If you need to clarify or correct something, post again.
8. Invisible text, font size less than 10, and spoiler tags are not allowed.
9. Cryptography is not allowed.
10. The time between an exile being reached and a flip being provided is called twilight. All players may continue posting during this time, including the exiled player.
11. Dead players may not post in thread or QT, except their Role QT. An exiled player is not "dead" until a flip has been provided. However in this game, death may not always be permanent. The start of day post will always list the players currently active in the game.
12. Personal multimedia, such as video or audio recordings, are not allowed in the game thread.

The Voting Rules:
1. Votes should be in this format: Vote: Playername. Unambigiuous nicknames are acceptable, or any string that uniquely identifies a user. Note that the point of voting is, in fact, unambiguity, and attempting to make it unclear to other players (or, of course, mods) which user you are voting for is very ill-advised.
2. Unvotes should be in this format: unvote or Unvote: Playername.
3. Unvotes are not required if changing your vote from one player to another.
4. You may vote: no exile.
5. Exiles occur when a simple majority (rounded up) of living players is reached. Once reached, an exile cannot be undone.
6. If a majority lynch is not reached by the Day's deadline, no exile occurs.

The Rest:
1. Bold, Blue text is reserved for the MODs. Players may not use it.
2. If you have an issue or problem with the game, please PM the Mod. Do not post complaints in the game thread.
3. Mods make mistakes - please point them out gently. If they can be corrected, they will. If irreversible, they will stand as final to be commiserated over after the game.
4. If a mod error disadvantages one faction greatly, the game may be called off.
5. Ask all questions and make all requests directly to the Mod via PM. Questions deemed as "universal" (defined as questions for which the answers should be available to all players) will be requested to be re-posted in the Game Thread and answered there.
6. Players may request prods on other players if they have not posted in 24 hours. Players are subject to replacement or modkill after one prod.
7. All rule violations will be dealt with according to their severity, as determined by the mod.
8. Each player will receive their own private discord channel, regardless of role. Don't quote from it.
9. If the game goes on for 3 days and 3 nights without an exile or nightkill, town wins.

Deadlines:
1. Days will last five IRL days.
2. Nights will last 48 hours, with actions due after 36 hours.
Title: Re: BM 34: Groundhog's Day Mafia
Post by: MiX on December 28, 2021, 06:20:25 pm
/in
Title: Re: BM 34: Groundhog's Day Mafia
Post by: mathdude on December 28, 2021, 06:48:10 pm
Sounds like fun.
*w /in k
Title: Re: BM 34: Groundhog's Day Mafia
Post by: WestCoastDidds on December 28, 2021, 07:01:02 pm
Hi hi hi hi hi hi! *tw/inkle stars* ⭐️ ⭐️

Title: Re: BM 34: Groundhog's Day Mafia
Post by: Galzria on December 28, 2021, 07:16:32 pm
Just gonna make a post here. Please Don't m/ind me.
Title: Re: BM 34: Groundhog's Day Mafia
Post by: scolapasta on December 28, 2021, 11:14:36 pm
OK, campers, rise and sh/ine, and don't forget your booties cause it's cold out there. It's cold out there every day.
Title: Re: BM 34: Groundhog's Day Mafia
Post by: WestCoastDidds on December 29, 2021, 08:52:16 am
OK, campers, rise and sh/ine, and don't forget your booties cause it's cold out there. It's cold out there every day.

It’s been almost 80 here for the last few weeks. It’s weird and disconcerting. Especially since we had frozen power stations and rolling blackouts back in February.
Title: Re: BM 34: Groundhog's Day Mafia
Post by: Awaclus on December 29, 2021, 01:24:59 pm
/in
Title: Re: BM 34: Groundhog's Day Mafia
Post by: EFHW on December 29, 2021, 02:19:22 pm
/in
/in
/in ...
Title: Re: BM 34: Groundhog's Day Mafia
Post by: Galzria on December 29, 2021, 05:14:45 pm
Just gonna make a post here. Please Don't m/ind me.
Title: Re: BM 34: Groundhog's Day Mafia
Post by: Dylan32 on December 31, 2021, 09:36:19 am
Just gonna make a post here. Please Don't m/ind me.

Read this and thought to myself,"Wait, didn't Galz already say this earlier.....oh"
Title: Re: BM 34: Groundhog's Day Mafia
Post by: WestCoastDidds on December 31, 2021, 09:49:48 am
Same, Dylan, same
Title: Re: BM 34: Groundhog's Day Mafia
Post by: jotheonah on December 31, 2021, 09:55:41 am
I can probably find a way to run this with 7, but I’d love to get a few more.
Title: Re: BM 34: Groundhog's Day Mafia
Post by: Dylan32 on December 31, 2021, 10:11:55 am
I will probably have to be out for at least this discord trial game, because I'll be able to see all the "private" channels, hence the need longterm for someone who doesn't actively play to be the server owner.

Joth, I sent you the invite link, so if you could join asap I could give you the permissions and start walking through the process of setting everything up with you before you are having to immediately send out PMs.
Title: Re: BM 34: Groundhog's Day Mafia
Post by: EFHW on December 31, 2021, 10:32:11 am
I will probably have to be out for at least this discord trial game, because I'll be able to see all the "private" channels, hence the need longterm for someone who doesn't actively play to be the server owner.

Joth, I sent you the invite link, so if you could join asap I could give you the permissions and start walking through the process of setting everything up with you before you are having to immediately send out PMs.
I assumed the mod would create a server.
Title: Re: BM 34: Groundhog's Day Mafia
Post by: Dylan32 on December 31, 2021, 11:30:07 am
I will probably have to be out for at least this discord trial game, because I'll be able to see all the "private" channels, hence the need longterm for someone who doesn't actively play to be the server owner.

Joth, I sent you the invite link, so if you could join asap I could give you the permissions and start walking through the process of setting everything up with you before you are having to immediately send out PMs.
I assumed the mod would create a server.

You don't really want to have a new server for every game. It's a lot easier to use one server and archive old games for a number of reasons. And in another thread Joth and I had talked about me making the trial server for his game.
Title: Re: BM 34: Groundhog's Day Mafia
Post by: gkrieg13 on December 31, 2021, 02:33:17 pm
/in
Title: Re: BM 34: Groundhog's Day Mafia
Post by: Swowl on December 31, 2021, 07:07:04 pm
i will /in if there is still rooms.
Title: Re: BM 34: Groundhog's Day Mafia
Post by: jotheonah on January 01, 2022, 12:32:42 am
Alright I will join the server tomorrow and work on rolling up roles. Signups still open until then.
Title: Re: BM 34: Groundhog's Day Mafia
Post by: Dylan32 on January 01, 2022, 01:54:43 am
https://discord.gg/amNUQYxT

Join and change your server nickname to match your name here if you are in or wanting the speccy.
Title: Re: BM 34: Groundhog's Day Mafia
Post by: jotheonah on January 01, 2022, 07:07:45 pm
Ok, gonna lock it in there while I figure out exactly what the setup looks like with 9.

Dylan, I know you can restrict access to certain channels, but can you also make them invisible to people who don't have access to them? Otherwise we might have an issue with things like masonries, where the very existence of them needs to be secret. Although we could just make a practice of making a few extra dummy channels.
Title: Re: BM 34: Groundhog's Day Mafia
Post by: Dylan32 on January 01, 2022, 08:36:00 pm
Ok, gonna lock it in there while I figure out exactly what the setup looks like with 9.

Dylan, I know you can restrict access to certain channels, but can you also make them invisible to people who don't have access to them? Otherwise we might have an issue with things like masonries, where the very existence of them needs to be secret. Although we could just make a practice of making a few extra dummy channels.

Answered in the mod channel. But since everyone will need to know that it works, the short answer is yes.
Title: Re: BM 34: Groundhog's Day Mafia
Post by: jotheonah on January 01, 2022, 09:27:48 pm
Thread Locked

Please join the discord if you haven't already. You will not get a PM this game, just an invite to your private discord channel. Your role will be waiting for you in the discord shortly if it's not there already.
Title: Re: BM 34: Groundhog's Day Mafia
Post by: jotheonah on January 01, 2022, 10:06:47 pm
Please note that post 2 has been update with notes and rules.
Title: Re: BM 34: Groundhog's Day Mafia
Post by: jotheonah on January 02, 2022, 12:13:34 pm
We are waiting on one more confirmation, then we will enter Night Zero which will last 12-24 hours, depending on time of day.
Title: Re: BM 34: Groundhog's Day Mafia
Post by: jotheonah on January 02, 2022, 01:27:29 pm
Last confirmation is in! Day 1 begins in 24 hours.
Title: Re: BM 34: Groundhog's Day Mafia
Post by: jotheonah on January 03, 2022, 01:15:50 pm
Okay, campers, rise and shine, and don't forget your booties 'cause it's cooooold out there today.

It's coooold out there every day. What is this, Miami Beach?

Not hardly. And you know, you can expect hazardous travel later today with that, you know, that, uh, that blizzard thing.

That blizzard - thing. That blizzard - thing. Oh, well, here's the report! The National Weather Service is calling for a "big blizzard thing!"

Yessss, they are. But you know, there's another reason why today is especially exciting.

Especially cold!

Especially cold, okay, but the big question on everybody's lips...

 - On their chapped lips...

 - On their chapped lips, right: Do ya think Phil is gonna come out and see his shadow?

Punxsutawney Phil!

Thats right, woodchuck-chuckers - it's

GROUNDHOG DAY!


Day 1 Begins Now

Vote Count 1.0

Not voting:  MiX, mathdude, WestCoastDidds, Galzria, scolapasta, Awaclus, EFHW, gkrieg, Swowl

With 9 alive, it takes 5 to exile.
Title: Re: BM 34: Groundhog's Day Mafia
Post by: jotheonah on January 03, 2022, 01:20:43 pm
THREAD UNLOCKED
Title: Re: BM 34: Groundhog's Day Mafia
Post by: Galzria on January 03, 2022, 01:24:43 pm
First!
Title: Re: BM 34: Groundhog's Day Mafia
Post by: Galzria on January 03, 2022, 01:25:57 pm
MiX, it’s been awhile. Why should I believe that you are not scum this game?
Title: Re: BM 34: Groundhog's Day Mafia
Post by: Galzria on January 03, 2022, 01:26:27 pm
Vote: WCD. D1 meme’s.
Title: Re: BM 34: Groundhog's Day Mafia
Post by: Galzria on January 03, 2022, 01:29:29 pm
Happy New Year!

Hope everyone was well for the Holidays. Swowl & I both had COVID, but neither had bad symptoms. In fact, we both tested positive *after* anything that might’ve been considered “symptoms” has passed. We both had a day of just feeling tired … and not to the point where we were like, “oh, maybe we’re sick”. But cautionary testing on Christmas Eve before family gatherings sent us both home to do a second year of Zoom Christmas.

We’re both in the clear now though, so hurray!
Title: Re: BM 34: Groundhog's Day Mafia
Post by: Galzria on January 03, 2022, 01:32:00 pm
Alright - I’m off to continue looking for treasure until my eyes bleed. There’s a one week deadline for that all to come together…
Title: Re: BM 34: Groundhog's Day Mafia
Post by: WestCoastDidds on January 03, 2022, 01:41:20 pm
Hi hi hi hi hi hi!

Galzy! Hi! I am always ALWAYS holding myself back from posting new and exciting gifs and memes. So much tasty flava!  I hope you and Swowl are both feeling better.

Happy new year, friends! My birthday is next week so you can all start readying your celebratory energy now.
Title: Re: BM 34: Groundhog's Day Mafia
Post by: mathdude on January 03, 2022, 02:43:08 pm
MiX and Awaclus are scum.
Discuss.

Also, memes are always welcome, Didds
Title: Re: BM 34: Groundhog's Day Mafia
Post by: Awaclus on January 03, 2022, 02:47:17 pm
MiX and Awaclus are scum.
Discuss.

no u
Title: Re: BM 34: Groundhog's Day Mafia
Post by: mathdude on January 03, 2022, 02:52:22 pm
MiX and Awaclus are scum.
Discuss.

no u

Wow, awesome comeback. And great discussion.
Title: Re: BM 34: Groundhog's Day Mafia
Post by: Awaclus on January 03, 2022, 03:02:46 pm
MiX and Awaclus are scum.
Discuss.

no u

Wow, awesome comeback. And great discussion.

Thanks. Why aren't you voting for me and MiX? Are you our scumbuddy?
Title: Re: BM 34: Groundhog's Day Mafia
Post by: scolapasta on January 03, 2022, 03:09:17 pm
So if we can get past the pointless accusation stage... any one want to speculate on setup?

i.e. Groundhog's day - here's my attempt:

One of us is the Bill Murray character and if they get exiled of NKed then everyone who was killed before is "regenerated".

Not saying that would work as a game, maybe, but it would be thematic.
Title: Re: BM 34: Groundhog's Day Mafia
Post by: MiX on January 03, 2022, 03:47:36 pm
Hey everyone!

MiX, it’s been awhile. Why should I believe that you are not scum this game?

I don't think joth would make this multiball.

MiX and Awaclus are scum.
Discuss.

Also, memes are always welcome, Didds

I wish, kinda, although I liked rolling town this game.

So if we can get past the pointless accusation stage... any one want to speculate on setup?

i.e. Groundhog's day - here's my attempt:

One of us is the Bill Murray character and if they get exiled of NKed then everyone who was killed before is "regenerated".

Not saying that would work as a game, maybe, but it would be thematic.

Pointless accusation stage is the best!

Vote: scola, let's see if you can escape a single RVS vote without making the scummiest post of the game.
Title: Re: BM 34: Groundhog's Day Mafia
Post by: mathdude on January 03, 2022, 03:56:23 pm
MiX and Awaclus are scum.
Discuss.

no u

Wow, awesome comeback. And great discussion.

Thanks. Why aren't you voting for me and MiX? Are you our scumbuddy?

Nope.  And I didn't feel like voting yet.
Title: Re: BM 34: Groundhog's Day Mafia
Post by: Galzria on January 03, 2022, 03:56:46 pm
So if we can get past the pointless accusation stage... any one want to speculate on setup?

i.e. Groundhog's day - here's my attempt:

One of us is the Bill Murray character and if they get exiled of NKed then everyone who was killed before is "regenerated".

Not saying that would work as a game, maybe, but it would be thematic.

Vote: Scola

Why is random accusation stage worse than pointless setup speculation stage?

In fact, I would argue it quite the opposite - "Random Accusation" is never, in fact, random - and is far less so for scum than for town. And further, "Pointless Setup Speculation", when there is no public setup info to begin with, only encourages potential slips of knowledge - something scum would love to pick up on.
Title: Re: BM 34: Groundhog's Day Mafia
Post by: mathdude on January 03, 2022, 04:05:51 pm
So if we can get past the pointless accusation stage... any one want to speculate on setup?

i.e. Groundhog's day - here's my attempt:

One of us is the Bill Murray character and if they get exiled of NKed then everyone who was killed before is "regenerated".

Not saying that would work as a game, maybe, but it would be thematic.

I'm going to guess basically the opposite.  I'm going to guess that if such character is not killed (exile during day or killed at night), the day restarts exactly the same as D1.  Effectively, he's the scum?  There may be extra mechanics of some sort (maybe a Traitor?) or maybe we're just on a wild goose chase for one scum?  His wincon might be surviving D1 a certain number of times?
Title: Re: BM 34: Groundhog's Day Mafia
Post by: Awaclus on January 03, 2022, 04:06:02 pm
Vote: scola
Title: Re: BM 34: Groundhog's Day Mafia
Post by: MiX on January 03, 2022, 04:07:23 pm
This is as good of a time as any to say that 4 votes is X-1.
Title: Re: BM 34: Groundhog's Day Mafia
Post by: mathdude on January 03, 2022, 04:08:53 pm
This is as good of a time as any to say that 4 votes is X-1.

Are you saying you want someone to put the pasta at X-1?
Title: Re: BM 34: Groundhog's Day Mafia
Post by: MiX on January 03, 2022, 04:09:12 pm
This is as good of a time as any to say that 4 votes is X-1.

Are you saying you want someone to put the pasta at X-1?

No, the opposite.
Title: Re: BM 34: Groundhog's Day Mafia
Post by: EFHW on January 03, 2022, 04:26:01 pm
This is a bastard game. You can trust what the mod tells you to a point. But some things I say may not be entirely true. Or not true in the way you think they are.

Does this include role pms? What about win conditions?
Title: Re: BM 34: Groundhog's Day Mafia
Post by: EFHW on January 03, 2022, 04:29:38 pm
Hi everyone!
Title: Re: BM 34: Groundhog's Day Mafia
Post by: mathdude on January 03, 2022, 04:32:32 pm
This is as good of a time as any to say that 4 votes is X-1.

Are you saying you want someone to put the pasta at X-1?

No, the opposite.

If I voted for pasta, would you unvote?
Title: Re: BM 34: Groundhog's Day Mafia
Post by: MiX on January 03, 2022, 04:37:20 pm
This is as good of a time as any to say that 4 votes is X-1.

Are you saying you want someone to put the pasta at X-1?

No, the opposite.

If I voted for pasta, would you unvote?

Yes.
Title: Re: BM 34: Groundhog's Day Mafia
Post by: EFHW on January 03, 2022, 07:34:56 pm

This is a bastard game. You can trust what the mod tells you to a point. But some things I say may not be entirely true. Or not true in the way you think they are.

Does this include role pms? What about win conditions?
Title: Re: BM 34: Groundhog's Day Mafia
Post by: jotheonah on January 03, 2022, 07:42:39 pm

This is a bastard game. You can trust what the mod tells you to a point. But some things I say may not be entirely true. Or not true in the way you think they are.

Does this include role pms? What about win conditions?

You can trust win conditions.
Title: Re: BM 34: Groundhog's Day Mafia
Post by: Swowl on January 04, 2022, 12:31:25 am
yoyo - Happy New Year!

set up talk in a game where you are explicitly told the mod "may not be able to be trusted" seems pointless. and I fucking love set up talk.

Vote: Awaclus
Title: Re: BM 34: Groundhog's Day Mafia
Post by: mathdude on January 04, 2022, 07:49:25 am
yoyo - Happy New Year!

set up talk in a game where you are explicitly told the mod "may not be able to be trusted" seems pointless. and I fucking love set up talk.

Vote: Awaclus

Why not just vote for joth then?
Title: Re: BM 34: Groundhog's Day Mafia
Post by: MiX on January 04, 2022, 08:51:14 am
Slow starting game. Then again, we're just 9, but gkrieg hasn't showed up yet.


This is a bastard game. You can trust what the mod tells you to a point. But some things I say may not be entirely true. Or not true in the way you think they are.

Does this include role pms? What about win conditions?


Just thought about something: why didn't you just ask this in your QT?
Title: Re: BM 34: Groundhog's Day Mafia
Post by: gkrieg13 on January 04, 2022, 09:36:45 am
Slow starting game. Then again, we're just 9, but gkrieg hasn't showed up yet.


This is a bastard game. You can trust what the mod tells you to a point. But some things I say may not be entirely true. Or not true in the way you think they are.

Does this include role pms? What about win conditions?


Just thought about something: why didn't you just ask this in your QT?

I’m here I’m here. Vote: MiX
Title: Re: BM 34: Groundhog's Day Mafia
Post by: EFHW on January 04, 2022, 09:44:32 am
Slow starting game. Then again, we're just 9, but gkrieg hasn't showed up yet.


This is a bastard game. You can trust what the mod tells you to a point. But some things I say may not be entirely true. Or not true in the way you think they are.

Does this include role pms? What about win conditions?


Just thought about something: why didn't you just ask this in your QT?
I wanted to be able to quote and it seemed like good information for town to have. Would the qt have been preferable somehow?
Title: Re: BM 34: Groundhog's Day Mafia
Post by: jotheonah on January 04, 2022, 01:58:05 pm
Phil Connors wakes up in his bed and breakfast in Punxsutawney, ready to deliver an unenthusiastic news report about the groundhog looking for his shadow. Entirely focused on himself, he fails to notice that something is amiss in the town of Punxsutawney. The Punxsutawney mafia are lurking, looking for their chance to make trouble.

Vote Count 1.1

scolapasta (3): MiX, Galzria, Awaclus
Awaclus (1): Swowl
MiX (1): gkrieg13

Not voting (4): mathdude, WestCoastDidds, scolapasta, EFHW

With 9 alive, it takes 5 to exile.

Day 1 ends at 1:30 pm ET on January 8th.
Title: Re: BM 34: Groundhog's Day Mafia
Post by: MiX on January 04, 2022, 02:02:27 pm
scolapasta (2): MiX, Galzria, Awaclus

Is that VC completely correct?
Title: Re: BM 34: Groundhog's Day Mafia
Post by: scolapasta on January 04, 2022, 02:29:26 pm
Hey everyone!

MiX, it’s been awhile. Why should I believe that you are not scum this game?

I don't think joth would make this multiball.

MiX and Awaclus are scum.
Discuss.

Also, memes are always welcome, Didds

I wish, kinda, although I liked rolling town this game.

So if we can get past the pointless accusation stage... any one want to speculate on setup?

i.e. Groundhog's day - here's my attempt:

One of us is the Bill Murray character and if they get exiled of NKed then everyone who was killed before is "regenerated".

Not saying that would work as a game, maybe, but it would be thematic.

Pointless accusation stage is the best!

Vote: scola, let's see if you can escape a single RVS vote without making the scummiest post of the game.

Messi?
Title: Re: BM 34: Groundhog's Day Mafia
Post by: scolapasta on January 04, 2022, 02:33:23 pm
So if we can get past the pointless accusation stage... any one want to speculate on setup?

i.e. Groundhog's day - here's my attempt:

One of us is the Bill Murray character and if they get exiled of NKed then everyone who was killed before is "regenerated".

Not saying that would work as a game, maybe, but it would be thematic.

Vote: Scola

Why is random accusation stage worse than pointless setup speculation stage?

In fact, I would argue it quite the opposite - "Random Accusation" is never, in fact, random - and is far less so for scum than for town. And further, "Pointless Setup Speculation", when there is no public setup info to begin with, only encourages potential slips of knowledge - something scum would love to pick up on.

I didn't call it random, just pointless. And yes, I get the point is to see how people react. But I'd argue, that's not actually effective. It would be interesting to see some analysis on how well anyone's D1 reads actually are...

I do hear you on potential slips of knowledge and had not completely thought of that - but those slips some times come from scum, too, no?

i.e I think the point of either is just to encourage more chatter - and this is true for both town and scum. town trying to weed out scum, scum trying to learn town's roles. I'm not sure why one is actually better than the other. I'm just not of fun of picking someone and voting for them without at least a piece of reasoning.
Title: Re: BM 34: Groundhog's Day Mafia
Post by: Swowl on January 04, 2022, 02:57:24 pm
yoyo - Happy New Year!

set up talk in a game where you are explicitly told the mod "may not be able to be trusted" seems pointless. and I fucking love set up talk.

Vote: Awaclus

Why not just vote for joth then?

... what?
Title: Re: BM 34: Groundhog's Day Mafia
Post by: mathdude on January 04, 2022, 03:55:11 pm
yoyo - Happy New Year!

set up talk in a game where you are explicitly told the mod "may not be able to be trusted" seems pointless. and I fucking love set up talk.

Vote: Awaclus

Why not just vote for joth then?

... what?

If you love setup talk, and joth made this game such that setup talk is practically pointless (as is typically the case in BM games, I'd say)... why not just vote for joth?  Let's vote out the mod!  It's a BM game after all - maybe it's possible here?

Also...

Vote: MiX
Title: Re: BM 34: Groundhog's Day Mafia
Post by: WestCoastDidds on January 04, 2022, 04:15:13 pm
Scola, what does the Messi question mean?
Title: Re: BM 34: Groundhog's Day Mafia
Post by: Galzria on January 04, 2022, 04:21:22 pm
I was going to vote MiX here, but I’m going to leave my vote on Scola for right now. I would also consider Datswan or Gkrieg at this point in time.
Title: Re: BM 34: Groundhog's Day Mafia
Post by: Galzria on January 04, 2022, 04:23:05 pm
Actually:

Gkrieg, what was the reasoning for your MiX vote?
Title: Re: BM 34: Groundhog's Day Mafia
Post by: Galzria on January 04, 2022, 04:26:56 pm
Scola, what does the Messi question mean?

Didds - Are you just curious, or do you hope to glean some alignment indicative information from this question?

What’s your read on Scola? What’s your read on the Scola wagon?

Do you think EFHW asking her MOD question in thread is alignment indicative? It seemed to ping MiX.
Title: Re: BM 34: Groundhog's Day Mafia
Post by: scolapasta on January 04, 2022, 04:33:57 pm
Scola, what does the Messi question mean?

Oh, I just like to give MiX a hard time about Messi (the GOAT) vs Ronaldo. And somehow last game my Messi post was seen as scummy for some reason.
Title: Re: BM 34: Groundhog's Day Mafia
Post by: WestCoastDidds on January 04, 2022, 05:18:05 pm
Scola, what does the Messi question mean?

Didds - Are you just curious, or do you hope to glean some alignment indicative information from this question?

What’s your read on Scola? What’s your read on the Scola wagon?

Do you think EFHW asking her MOD question in thread is alignment indicative? It seemed to ping MiX.

I wanted to know what it meant because it was a one-word response to a long exchange. I think it’s distracting because it looks like a response, but isn’t.

So, yeah, I think it’s indicative of something.

The Scola wagon seemed to be rather RVS to me so I hadn’t considered it much. I don’t like the random voting. I don’t really understand it so I don’t do it. It’s interesting that he is and has been at E-2 for a while now.

EFHW question seemed innocuous enough, but I don’t know how mix’s mind works. He’s really good at finding scum, at least when the sum is me, so there’s that. I don’t know why EFHW would have asked in her qt when it was easy to forget this was a bastard game or what Joth means by that term. So… meh. I don’t think it’s much in regard to either of them.
Title: Re: BM 34: Groundhog's Day Mafia
Post by: Swowl on January 04, 2022, 05:21:39 pm
Slow starting game. Then again, we're just 9, but gkrieg hasn't showed up yet.


This is a bastard game. You can trust what the mod tells you to a point. But some things I say may not be entirely true. Or not true in the way you think they are.

Does this include role pms? What about win conditions?


Just thought about something: why didn't you just ask this in your QT?

its a BM with no set up info. no one that is town should be asking public info questions in their QT and not in the public thread.
Title: Re: BM 34: Groundhog's Day Mafia
Post by: MiX on January 04, 2022, 05:34:14 pm
Slow starting game. Then again, we're just 9, but gkrieg hasn't showed up yet.


This is a bastard game. You can trust what the mod tells you to a point. But some things I say may not be entirely true. Or not true in the way you think they are.

Does this include role pms? What about win conditions?


Just thought about something: why didn't you just ask this in your QT?
I wanted to be able to quote and it seemed like good information for town to have. Would the qt have been preferable somehow?

Just feel like a question that is most natural to ask when you read it, not when the game starts, so it felt weird.

Messi?

Yes.

I didn't call it random, just pointless. And yes, I get the point is to see how people react. But I'd argue, that's not actually effective. It would be interesting to see some analysis on how well anyone's D1 reads actually are...

Last game, you were tied to Didds because of Didds' early wagon and infang buried himself when he called me scum due to an assumption that people will say things like that when pushing people they think are scum. Reacting is a very big part of mafia.

Now, do I think your reaction here is scummy? Kinda, honestly. Enough to keep my vote on you.


I like Galzria this game. I guess he kinda reminds me of when we were scumbuddies? But I like what I'm seeing overall.
Title: Re: BM 34: Groundhog's Day Mafia
Post by: EFHW on January 04, 2022, 08:29:36 pm
So if we can get past the pointless accusation stage... any one want to speculate on setup?

i.e. Groundhog's day - here's my attempt:

One of us is the Bill Murray character and if they get exiled of NKed then everyone who was killed before is "regenerated".

Not saying that would work as a game, maybe, but it would be thematic.

Vote: Scola

Why is random accusation stage worse than pointless setup speculation stage?

In fact, I would argue it quite the opposite - "Random Accusation" is never, in fact, random - and is far less so for scum than for town. And further, "Pointless Setup Speculation", when there is no public setup info to begin with, only encourages potential slips of knowledge - something scum would love to pick up on.

I didn't call it random, just pointless. And yes, I get the point is to see how people react. But I'd argue, that's not actually effective. It would be interesting to see some analysis on how well anyone's D1 reads actually are...

I do hear you on potential slips of knowledge and had not completely thought of that - but those slips some times come from scum, too, no?

i.e I think the point of either is just to encourage more chatter - and this is true for both town and scum. town trying to weed out scum, scum trying to learn town's roles. I'm not sure why one is actually better than the other. I'm just not of fun of picking someone and voting for them without at least a piece of reasoning.

I think scola might have drawn scum AGAIN.
Title: Re: BM 34: Groundhog's Day Mafia
Post by: Swowl on January 04, 2022, 09:33:47 pm
EFHW - what you find skummy about that?
Like also mix what do you find skummy about the response he had?

Could they of responded in a way that was not going to be skummy? Or was it just the fact that they responded?
Title: Re: BM 34: Groundhog's Day Mafia
Post by: Swowl on January 04, 2022, 09:36:59 pm
I was going to vote MiX here, but I’m going to leave my vote on Scola for right now. I would also consider Datswan or Gkrieg at this point in time.

I’m like… 99% sure DatSwan is not in this game
Title: Re: BM 34: Groundhog's Day Mafia
Post by: EFHW on January 04, 2022, 10:23:39 pm
EFHW - what you find skummy about that?
Like also mix what do you find skummy about the response he had?

Could they of responded in a way that was not going to be skummy? Or was it just the fact that they responded?

It has the ring of a classic scum post - making generalizations about how they play and how town and scum play. Safe stuff, no commitments.

I'd vote him, but I don't want to put him at E-1 so early in the day.
Title: Re: BM 34: Groundhog's Day Mafia
Post by: WestCoastDidds on January 04, 2022, 11:57:49 pm
I was going to vote MiX here, but I’m going to leave my vote on Scola for right now. I would also consider Datswan or Gkrieg at this point in time.

I’m like… 99% sure DatSwan is not in this game

Ha!
Title: Re: BM 34: Groundhog's Day Mafia
Post by: WestCoastDidds on January 04, 2022, 11:58:56 pm
EFHW - what you find skummy about that?
Like also mix what do you find skummy about the response he had?

Could they of responded in a way that was not going to be skummy? Or was it just the fact that they responded?

It has the ring of a classic scum post - making generalizations about how they play and how town and scum play. Safe stuff, no commitments.

I'd vote him, but I don't want to put him at E-1 so early in the day.

I think this is a really accurate assessment. +1
Title: Re: BM 34: Groundhog's Day Mafia
Post by: Swowl on January 05, 2022, 12:55:24 am
EFHW - what you find skummy about that?
Like also mix what do you find skummy about the response he had?

Could they of responded in a way that was not going to be skummy? Or was it just the fact that they responded?

It has the ring of a classic scum post - making generalizations about how they play and how town and scum play. Safe stuff, no commitments.

I'd vote him, but I don't want to put him at E-1 so early in the day.

do you disagree with anything he said?
he was answering a question right? all of it seems to check out to me.
There is no definitive answer, it is open ended, so I don't see not having commitments here skummy. Nor towny.
Title: Re: BM 34: Groundhog's Day Mafia
Post by: EFHW on January 05, 2022, 08:18:54 am
EFHW - what you find skummy about that?
Like also mix what do you find skummy about the response he had?

Could they of responded in a way that was not going to be skummy? Or was it just the fact that they responded?

It has the ring of a classic scum post - making generalizations about how they play and how town and scum play. Safe stuff, no commitments.

I'd vote him, but I don't want to put him at E-1 so early in the day.

do you disagree with anything he said?
he was answering a question right? all of it seems to check out to me.
There is no definitive answer, it is open ended, so I don't see not having commitments here skummy. Nor towny.
It's the generalizations. And the topic is so not interesting.  Why did he say that about RVS anyway? If you don't like it then don't do it. Personally,  I rarely do it, but I think it's a valuable community building phase, before we all feel suspicious of each other, and a place to work out feelings from past games. Maybe I'll start doing it more!

But I'll grant you that it reads somewhat less scummy if you take into account that he was answering a question.
Title: Re: BM 34: Groundhog's Day Mafia
Post by: WestCoastDidds on January 05, 2022, 11:16:37 am
My school just went remote for the first two weeks.  It really does feel like groundhog day!

Swowl defending scola is super interesting.  But also, where's gkrieg??
Title: Re: BM 34: Groundhog's Day Mafia
Post by: mathdude on January 05, 2022, 12:52:31 pm
But also, where's gkrieg??

Waiting until there's a wagon on him?
Title: Re: BM 34: Groundhog's Day Mafia
Post by: EFHW on January 05, 2022, 07:35:37 pm
ok then, vote: gkrieg. Mostly just drowning out the crickets. 9 players means we all have to be more active than usual.
Title: Re: BM 34: Groundhog's Day Mafia
Post by: Galzria on January 05, 2022, 08:04:18 pm
I didn't call it random, just pointless. And yes, I get the point is to see how people react. But I'd argue, that's not actually effective. It would be interesting to see some analysis on how well anyone's D1 reads actually are...

A very 1-dimensional outlook. You're only considering "how people react" as a direct influence on reads. But there's a lot more to the purpose of voting than that. It creates connections. Is scum!MiX more likely, or less likely, to put a vote down on a partner in early RVS phases? What about Awaclus, or anybody else? An RVS vote may not have any weight or reason, and the "reaction" it generates may not be all that valuable (especially D1) - but every vote says something about the person making it - They choose who for reasons that are very rarely random (or pointless).

I do hear you on potential slips of knowledge and had not completely thought of that - but those slips some times come from scum, too, no?

Possibly, maybe. But town has much less use for such information than scum does, as scum is actively looking for information to inform a pretty major decision during the night - therefore pursuing discourse that may positively influence that decision for scum is fairly bad for town.

i.e I think the point of either is just to encourage more chatter - and this is true for both town and scum. town trying to weed out scum, scum trying to learn town's roles. I'm not sure why one is actually better than the other. I'm just not of fun of picking someone and voting for them without at least a piece of reasoning.

Not all chatter is equal. Chatter that potentially makes alignment connections is more valuable than chatter that potentially reveals information. You even acknowledge as much in the bolded above: One IS clearly better than the other - so why pursue a line of conversation that is beneficial to scum?

Also, vote: swowl.
Title: Re: BM 34: Groundhog's Day Mafia
Post by: Galzria on January 05, 2022, 08:06:10 pm
ok then, vote: gkrieg. Mostly just drowning out the crickets. 9 players means we all have to be more active than usual.

I agree with this.
Title: Re: BM 34: Groundhog's Day Mafia
Post by: Galzria on January 05, 2022, 08:14:51 pm
ok then, vote: gkrieg. Mostly just drowning out the crickets. 9 players means we all have to be more active than usual.

I agree with this.

To clarify: I agree with EFHW's point - the vote I'm not yet sure on. Waiting for Gkrieg to come back and answer my question.
Title: Re: BM 34: Groundhog's Day Mafia
Post by: gkrieg13 on January 06, 2022, 12:19:32 am
Actually:

Gkrieg, what was the reasoning for your MiX vote?

Mostly RVS. Partially him talking about nothing.
Title: Re: BM 34: Groundhog's Day Mafia
Post by: gkrieg13 on January 06, 2022, 12:21:06 am
People that tend to single out my low involvement early in the game are either scum or Faust generally.
Title: Re: BM 34: Groundhog's Day Mafia
Post by: Swowl on January 06, 2022, 12:30:43 am
I didn't call it random, just pointless. And yes, I get the point is to see how people react. But I'd argue, that's not actually effective. It would be interesting to see some analysis on how well anyone's D1 reads actually are...

A very 1-dimensional outlook. You're only considering "how people react" as a direct influence on reads. But there's a lot more to the purpose of voting than that. It creates connections. Is scum!MiX more likely, or less likely, to put a vote down on a partner in early RVS phases? What about Awaclus, or anybody else? An RVS vote may not have any weight or reason, and the "reaction" it generates may not be all that valuable (especially D1) - but every vote says something about the person making it - They choose who for reasons that are very rarely random (or pointless).

- Are you saying this as NAI? I don't think I can think of single RVS vote I have ever made as town that was not completely arbitrary.


i.e I think the point of either is just to encourage more chatter - and this is true for both town and scum. town trying to weed out scum, scum trying to learn town's roles. I'm not sure why one is actually better than the other. I'm just not of fun of picking someone and voting for them without at least a piece of reasoning.

- Galz wants to know "why pursue a line of convo that is beneficial to skum"... I just wanna know how you think "skum trying to learn town's roles" is not clearly worse than "town trying to weed out skum"?
Title: Re: BM 34: Groundhog's Day Mafia
Post by: WestCoastDidds on January 06, 2022, 08:25:27 am
My head is spinning! I see myself agreeing with both Galzy and EFHW way more than I usually do. It’s a refreshing change.

I’ve been thinking about the low level of interaction and content generally. I’m guessing it’s attributed to the closed set up, so we don’t actually have much to talk about right now? Thus the conversation about the utility of random votes to start the game. It feels tough to get started, or to form any sort of concrete opinions.
Title: Re: BM 34: Groundhog's Day Mafia
Post by: EFHW on January 06, 2022, 09:00:56 am
My head is spinning! I see myself agreeing with both Galzy and EFHW way more than I usually do. It’s a refreshing change.

Oh no, maybe I misread my pm and am scum after all!
Title: Re: BM 34: Groundhog's Day Mafia
Post by: EFHW on January 06, 2022, 09:02:30 am
I didn't call it random, just pointless. And yes, I get the point is to see how people react. But I'd argue, that's not actually effective. It would be interesting to see some analysis on how well anyone's D1 reads actually are...

A very 1-dimensional outlook. You're only considering "how people react" as a direct influence on reads. But there's a lot more to the purpose of voting than that. It creates connections. Is scum!MiX more likely, or less likely, to put a vote down on a partner in early RVS phases? What about Awaclus, or anybody else? An RVS vote may not have any weight or reason, and the "reaction" it generates may not be all that valuable (especially D1) - but every vote says something about the person making it - They choose who for reasons that are very rarely random (or pointless).

- Are you saying this as NAI? I don't think I can think of single RVS vote I have ever made as town that was not completely arbitrary.


i.e I think the point of either is just to encourage more chatter - and this is true for both town and scum. town trying to weed out scum, scum trying to learn town's roles. I'm not sure why one is actually better than the other. I'm just not of fun of picking someone and voting for them without at least a piece of reasoning.

- Galz wants to know "why pursue a line of convo that is beneficial to skum"... I just wanna know how you think "skum trying to learn town's roles" is not clearly worse than "town trying to weed out skum"?

Swowl, I am curious, as are others, I think, about your stalwart defense of scola. Can you tell us what's behind it?
Title: Re: BM 34: Groundhog's Day Mafia
Post by: jotheonah on January 06, 2022, 09:21:41 am
On me in three, two, one.

Once a year, the eyes of the nation turn to this tiny Pennsylvania hamlet... to watch a master at work.

The master?

Punxsutawney Phil, the world's most famous weatherman, the groundhog who, as legend has it, can predict the coming of an early spring.

The question we have to ask ourselves

today is, "Does Phil feel lucky?"


This February 2nd at 8:02 am and 42 seconds...

Punxsutawney Phil, the seer of seers... prognosticator of prognosticators... emerged reluctantly, but alertly in Punxsutawney, Pennsylvania and stated in Groundhogese...

'I definitely see a shadow.'     

Sorry, folks.

Six more weeks of winter.


Television really fails to capture the true excitement of a large squirrel predicting the weather. I, for one, am very grateful to have been here. From Punxsutawney, this is Phil Connors.



Vote Count 1.2

scolapasta (2): MiX, Awaclus
Awaclus (1): Swowl
MiX (2): gkrieg13, mathdude
gkrieg13 (1): EFHW
Swowl (1): Galzria

Not voting (2): WestCoastDidds, scolapasta,

With 9 alive, it takes 5 to exile.

Day 1 ends at 1:30 pm ET on January 8th.
Title: Re: BM 34: Groundhog's Day Mafia
Post by: mathdude on January 06, 2022, 12:04:23 pm
ok then, vote: gkrieg. Mostly just drowning out the crickets. 9 players means we all have to be more active than usual.

I agree with this.

To clarify: I agree with EFHW's point - the vote I'm not yet sure on. Waiting for Gkrieg to come back and answer my question.

I agree with Galz agreeing with EFHW. And I think others should agree too.
Title: Re: BM 34: Groundhog's Day Mafia
Post by: mathdude on January 06, 2022, 12:11:34 pm
My head is spinning! I see myself agreeing with both Galzy and EFHW way more than I usually do. It’s a refreshing change.

I’ve been thinking about the low level of interaction and content generally. I’m guessing it’s attributed to the closed set up, so we don’t actually have much to talk about right now? Thus the conversation about the utility of random votes to start the game. It feels tough to get started, or to form any sort of concrete opinions.

Sorry, my mistake. I guess I still had an old window open from early this morning before work and didn't refresh it before replying.

I guess I agree with Didds, agreeing with Galz, agreeing with EFHW. Anyone else?

In all seriousness... i haven't played enough games here to know who votes whom and when on D1.

But still, seeing people's votes D1 can sometimes be helpful D3 and onwards for those who are able to look back and say "last time I was scum with X, they were very careful to vote each partner D1 but not put any pressure" or "I have never seen Y vote for partners D1 before. He voted Z D1 today and we know Z is scum now, so I'm pretty sure Y isn't scum".
Title: Re: BM 34: Groundhog's Day Mafia
Post by: WestCoastDidds on January 06, 2022, 12:14:34 pm
My head is spinning! I see myself agreeing with both Galzy and EFHW way more than I usually do. It’s a refreshing change.

Oh no, maybe I misread my pm and am scum after all!

:)
Title: Re: BM 34: Groundhog's Day Mafia
Post by: scolapasta on January 06, 2022, 12:33:03 pm
EFHW - what you find skummy about that?
Like also mix what do you find skummy about the response he had?

Could they of responded in a way that was not going to be skummy? Or was it just the fact that they responded?

It has the ring of a classic scum post - making generalizations about how they play and how town and scum play. Safe stuff, no commitments.

I'd vote him, but I don't want to put him at E-1 so early in the day.

do you disagree with anything he said?
he was answering a question right? all of it seems to check out to me.
There is no definitive answer, it is open ended, so I don't see not having commitments here skummy. Nor towny.
It's the generalizations. And the topic is so not interesting.  Why did he say that about RVS anyway? If you don't like it then don't do it. Personally,  I rarely do it, but I think it's a valuable community building phase, before we all feel suspicious of each other, and a place to work out feelings from past games. Maybe I'll start doing it more!

But I'll grant you that it reads somewhat less scummy if you take into account that he was answering a question.

I mean generalizations is really all we have D1, I think. Or at least early in the day. And I'd argue that even though we're nearing deadline, it's still early in that there haven't been many posts.

And only 1 wagon (me) which was very early.

So it's a weird D1 in my mind. But that's fine, I guess. I just don't see anywhere right now to put my vote.
Title: Re: BM 34: Groundhog's Day Mafia
Post by: scolapasta on January 06, 2022, 12:35:33 pm
I didn't call it random, just pointless. And yes, I get the point is to see how people react. But I'd argue, that's not actually effective. It would be interesting to see some analysis on how well anyone's D1 reads actually are...

A very 1-dimensional outlook. You're only considering "how people react" as a direct influence on reads. But there's a lot more to the purpose of voting than that. It creates connections. Is scum!MiX more likely, or less likely, to put a vote down on a partner in early RVS phases? What about Awaclus, or anybody else? An RVS vote may not have any weight or reason, and the "reaction" it generates may not be all that valuable (especially D1) - but every vote says something about the person making it - They choose who for reasons that are very rarely random (or pointless).

- Are you saying this as NAI? I don't think I can think of single RVS vote I have ever made as town that was not completely arbitrary.


i.e I think the point of either is just to encourage more chatter - and this is true for both town and scum. town trying to weed out scum, scum trying to learn town's roles. I'm not sure why one is actually better than the other. I'm just not of fun of picking someone and voting for them without at least a piece of reasoning.

- Galz wants to know "why pursue a line of convo that is beneficial to skum"... I just wanna know how you think "skum trying to learn town's roles" is not clearly worse than "town trying to weed out skum"?

Of course, scum trying to learn town's role is worse. I just don't think it's that risky on slipping on roles by discussing set up. and more possible scum could mess up, since, at least from experience as scum in other games, usually know more (and it's shared info, so each member of scum knows all that).
Title: Re: BM 34: Groundhog's Day Mafia
Post by: scolapasta on January 06, 2022, 12:36:18 pm
That said, I don't actually think slips of either kind are that likely. Was just saying that you if you're discussing slips, it goes both ways.
Title: Re: BM 34: Groundhog's Day Mafia
Post by: MiX on January 06, 2022, 12:43:53 pm
It's near deadline already?

Sorry everyone, I'm just really busy until the 11th, so I probably won't give much time to this D1. Even now I don't feel like going back and reread the, what, 5 pages of this game?

I have a feeling Galzria is scum this game. But I don't want to act on it.
Title: Re: BM 34: Groundhog's Day Mafia
Post by: mathdude on January 06, 2022, 01:29:36 pm
I have a feeling Galzria is scum this game. But I don't want to act on it.

What a scummy thing to say. Trying to create partner interaction? Or interpreted interaction?

I'll leave my vote on MiX. I think it's good there
Title: Re: BM 34: Groundhog's Day Mafia
Post by: EFHW on January 06, 2022, 09:33:18 pm
@scola, do you have anything to say about your wagon?
Title: Re: BM 34: Groundhog's Day Mafia
Post by: Awaclus on January 06, 2022, 09:54:57 pm
Vote: MiX
Title: Re: BM 34: Groundhog's Day Mafia
Post by: Swowl on January 07, 2022, 04:01:54 am
It's near deadline already?

Sorry everyone, I'm just really busy until the 11th, so I probably won't give much time to this D1. Even now I don't feel like going back and reread the, what, 5 pages of this game?

I have a feeling Galzria is scum this game. But I don't want to act on it.

where does that feeling come from?
Title: Re: BM 34: Groundhog's Day Mafia
Post by: WestCoastDidds on January 07, 2022, 08:19:33 am
Vote: MiX

Awaclus, why do you find him scummy? What do you think about Scola?
Title: Re: BM 34: Groundhog's Day Mafia
Post by: WestCoastDidds on January 07, 2022, 08:20:47 am
Galz, why the Swowl vote?
Title: Re: BM 34: Groundhog's Day Mafia
Post by: mathdude on January 07, 2022, 11:16:22 am
Didds and pasta... why the lack of voting still?  We're just over 26 hours to deadline.
Title: Re: BM 34: Groundhog's Day Mafia
Post by: Awaclus on January 07, 2022, 01:27:09 pm
Vote: MiX

Awaclus, why do you find him scummy? What do you think about Scola?

For reasons. I could also go back to voting Scola.
Title: Re: BM 34: Groundhog's Day Mafia
Post by: mathdude on January 07, 2022, 02:01:15 pm
Vote: MiX

Awaclus, why do you find him scummy? What do you think about Scola?

For reasons. I could also go back to voting Scola.

Ah yes, those "reasons".  Elusive "reasons".  Sounds very familiar... like we seem to have this discussion every other game why some people don't give their "reasons".
Title: Re: BM 34: Groundhog's Day Mafia
Post by: EFHW on January 07, 2022, 02:03:31 pm
I'm confused why scola isn't interacting with us more around his wagon. I think we have the votes to exile him. No one else is being suggested. In a larger game, that would suggest he was town. I'm not sure how that plays out in a small game like this. Someone did mention Galz but didn't elaborate.
Title: Re: BM 34: Groundhog's Day Mafia
Post by: MiX on January 07, 2022, 02:11:43 pm
Vote: MiX

Awaclus, why do you find him scummy? What do you think about Scola?

For reasons. I could also go back to voting Scola.

Ah yes, those "reasons".  Elusive "reasons".  Sounds very familiar... like we seem to have this discussion every other game why some people don't give their "reasons".

Yeah, you'd assume eventually people would remember not to ask.
Title: Re: BM 34: Groundhog's Day Mafia
Post by: Galzria on January 07, 2022, 02:28:55 pm
Galz, why the Swowl vote?

Unexplained vote on Awaclus, which you will see as I list all of his points he's never brought back up again (or changed):

yoyo - Happy New Year!

set up talk in a game where you are explicitly told the mod "may not be able to be trusted" seems pointless. and I fucking love set up talk.

Vote: Awaclus

Nothing Post, not scum hunting in any meaningful way:
yoyo - Happy New Year!

set up talk in a game where you are explicitly told the mod "may not be able to be trusted" seems pointless. and I fucking love set up talk.

Vote: Awaclus

Why not just vote for joth then?

... what?

Answering for EFHW, not scum hunting in any meaningful way:
Slow starting game. Then again, we're just 9, but gkrieg hasn't showed up yet.


This is a bastard game. You can trust what the mod tells you to a point. But some things I say may not be entirely true. Or not true in the way you think they are.

Does this include role pms? What about win conditions?


Just thought about something: why didn't you just ask this in your QT?

its a BM with no set up info. no one that is town should be asking public info questions in their QT and not in the public thread.

The first (and only) post that might be considered scum hunting, but really it's just the start of his series of deflections from Scola - with no seeming goal of actually deciphering the alignment of either EFHW or MiX.
EFHW - what you find skummy about that?
Like also mix what do you find skummy about the response he had?

Could they of responded in a way that was not going to be skummy? Or was it just the fact that they responded?

Nothing Post - No scum hunting in any meaningful way:
I was going to vote MiX here, but I’m going to leave my vote on Scola for right now. I would also consider Datswan or Gkrieg at this point in time.

I’m like… 99% sure DatSwan is not in this game

And this is why I say his post asking EFHW & MiX about Scola wasn't actually scum hunting - because EFHW's response was met with the below, where there's no train of thought about how EFHW's response might say something about her alignment - instead, he's simply debating why he thinks she shouldn't find Scola scummy:
EFHW - what you find skummy about that?
Like also mix what do you find skummy about the response he had?

Could they of responded in a way that was not going to be skummy? Or was it just the fact that they responded?

It has the ring of a classic scum post - making generalizations about how they play and how town and scum play. Safe stuff, no commitments.

I'd vote him, but I don't want to put him at E-1 so early in the day.

do you disagree with anything he said?
he was answering a question right? all of it seems to check out to me.
There is no definitive answer, it is open ended, so I don't see not having commitments here skummy. Nor towny.


These were the 6 posts he's made, in total, prior to my vote. I feel like Swowl is actively posting, so that he cannot be called a lurker, but I don't feel like Swowl is actively engaged in finding scum.

His deflection from Scola makes Scola a slightly worse exile between the two - because scum!Swowl is more likely to do that to town!Scola than scum!Scola. And in the consideration of town!Swowl - Why would town!Swowl spend his time deflecting from unknown!Scola, while also spending no time at all scum hunting? Again... his vote is still currently on Awaclus from his first post of the day.

Ultimately, I feel like Swowl is posting to stay active, but is actively NOT scum hunting, which doesn't feel like town!Swowl.

Title: Re: BM 34: Groundhog's Day Mafia
Post by: Galzria on January 07, 2022, 02:32:09 pm
Actually:

Gkrieg, what was the reasoning for your MiX vote?

Mostly RVS. Partially him talking about nothing.

Can you specify the "nothing" that he was talking about?
Title: Re: BM 34: Groundhog's Day Mafia
Post by: Galzria on January 07, 2022, 02:34:41 pm
People that tend to single out my low involvement early in the game are either scum or Faust generally.

Oy vey the problems with this post.
Title: Re: BM 34: Groundhog's Day Mafia
Post by: WestCoastDidds on January 07, 2022, 03:31:09 pm
Didds and pasta... why the lack of voting still?  We're just over 26 hours to deadline.
I know!  I am working on it.
Title: Re: BM 34: Groundhog's Day Mafia
Post by: WestCoastDidds on January 07, 2022, 03:37:40 pm
I am more persuaded by Galz than the Scola folks, although he is my second choice.  The MiX reasons are... uh...hard to evaluate.  I'm not sure his lack of activity is any worse than gkriegs. I do not understand at all why gkrieg can just check out of D1 with no repercussions, though.

So, my scummy to not list is
Swowl
Scola
gkrieg
MiX
math
Awaclus
Galz
EFHW
Title: Re: BM 34: Groundhog's Day Mafia
Post by: WestCoastDidds on January 07, 2022, 03:38:41 pm
Vote: Swowl
Title: Re: BM 34: Groundhog's Day Mafia
Post by: WestCoastDidds on January 07, 2022, 03:38:56 pm
People that tend to single out my low involvement early in the game are either scum or Faust generally.

Oy vey the problems with this post.

Right?!?!
Title: Re: BM 34: Groundhog's Day Mafia
Post by: MiX on January 07, 2022, 04:05:49 pm
I am more persuaded by Galz than the Scola folks, although he is my second choice.  The MiX reasons are... uh...hard to evaluate.  I'm not sure his lack of activity is any worse than gkriegs. I do not understand at all why gkrieg can just check out of D1 with no repercussions, though.

So, my scummy to not list is
Swowl
Scola
gkrieg
MiX
math
Awaclus
Galz
EFHW

EFHW town? Why?

I have Galz and Awaclus on top of my town list too, but mostly because that's who I remember being townie. Of course, Galzria's recent wall post skyrocketed him to townhood. Just reached that threshold of pro-town.
Title: Re: BM 34: Groundhog's Day Mafia
Post by: WestCoastDidds on January 07, 2022, 04:18:02 pm
EFHW town? Why?

I have Galz and Awaclus on top of my town list too, but mostly because that's who I remember being townie. Of course, Galzria's recent wall post skyrocketed him to townhood. Just reached that threshold of pro-town.

Why not? She has made some good observations about Scola and I am in 100% agreement on the gkrieg vote
Title: Re: BM 34: Groundhog's Day Mafia
Post by: Awaclus on January 07, 2022, 04:59:08 pm
Vote: MiX

Awaclus, why do you find him scummy? What do you think about Scola?

For reasons. I could also go back to voting Scola.

Ah yes, those "reasons".  Elusive "reasons".  Sounds very familiar... like we seem to have this discussion every other game why some people don't give their "reasons".

Yeah, you'd assume eventually people would remember not to ask.

I think it's fine to ask, I might respond some other way and that would be suspicious.
Title: Re: BM 34: Groundhog's Day Mafia
Post by: scolapasta on January 07, 2022, 07:17:05 pm
@scola, do you have anything to say about your wagon?

All 3 votes came after one one post of mine (the one where I tried to discuss the game setup - which I still don't think is a bad thing). So I don't make too much of the original votes, NAI.

I'm confused why scola isn't interacting with us more around his wagon. I think we have the votes to exile him. No one else is being suggested. In a larger game, that would suggest he was town. I'm not sure how that plays out in a small game like this. Someone did mention Galz but didn't elaborate.

I mean there wasn't much to say on the wagon other than it seemed based on the fact that I'm not a big fan of RVS and wanted to discuss setup. I get your point that my posts have been somewhat generic, but I do think that's typical for me on D1 (when town, because I'm still just trying to get my bearings; and also when scum. because I'm trying to emulate scolatowna).



Didds and pasta... why the lack of voting still?  We're just over 26 hours to deadline.

Mostly because no one has really jumped out as scum so far. I think a lot of posts (including my own) have been fairly generic; I guess except for the ones discussing me.

I do think WCD's case for Swowl sounded plausible. So maybe I'll lean there? I'll reread some later tonight and try to at least throw an initial vote. I expect to be around tonight and for deadline too, so am not too worried about not having voted yet.




Title: Re: BM 34: Groundhog's Day Mafia
Post by: Swowl on January 07, 2022, 08:38:38 pm
Mobile and semi vla for like 2 days but to summarize.

1. Galz focusing on my “lack of skum hunting” is both fishy and incorrect. Just because you say it is not skum hunting based on how the situation pans out and your opinion does not make it true. B) literally no one is skum hunting by your logic - why single me out.

2. Awaclus obviously was rvs it was jn my first post and i am not a fan of any of the other wagons and still really am not.

3. WCD is also off, but that is just bc she is normally better at reading me i think.

I am not huge fan of a mix vote. I know we are close but i need to finish driving, back in a bit.



Title: Re: BM 34: Groundhog's Day Mafia
Post by: WestCoastDidds on January 08, 2022, 07:07:06 am
Mobile and semi vla for like 2 days but to summarize.

3. WCD is also off, but that is just bc she is normally better at reading me i think.


Two things… there hasn’t been much content to assess and normally town!Swowl hangs out with me more. So my read is largely based on Galzy, but also this lack of interaction.
Title: Re: BM 34: Groundhog's Day Mafia
Post by: mathdude on January 08, 2022, 09:51:16 am
It's my wife's birthday and we have family over so I likely won't be on for deadline. I will try to check in once or twice more though.

I have no idea where we should vote. Nothing obvious stands out. So it feels typical D1, where we need to maximize usefulness of the vote. Who do we have the most opinions on? Scola? MiX? Swowl? Someone else?

I do think we should exile today though, to maintain odd parity... until or unless we learn anything else about roles that can affect that. So I'm willing to jump votes if needed and if able.
Title: Re: BM 34: Groundhog's Day Mafia
Post by: jotheonah on January 08, 2022, 10:20:33 am
Vote count incoming when I have a chance to be on not mobile but y’all have about three hours left in Day 1. And once Day 1 is gone, you can’t get it back!
Title: Re: BM 34: Groundhog's Day Mafia
Post by: Awaclus on January 08, 2022, 10:23:45 am
And once Day 1 is gone, you can’t get it back!

I'm going to press X to doubt here.
Title: Re: BM 34: Groundhog's Day Mafia
Post by: gkrieg13 on January 08, 2022, 10:33:49 am
I’ll be in and out around the deadline. Will try to be here just before at least
Title: Re: BM 34: Groundhog's Day Mafia
Post by: gkrieg13 on January 08, 2022, 10:36:31 am
Actually:

Gkrieg, what was the reasoning for your MiX vote?

Mostly RVS. Partially him talking about nothing.

Can you specify the "nothing" that he was talking about?

He was posting things about how I hadn’t posted, etc.  He was making posts that don’t really help town
Title: Re: BM 34: Groundhog's Day Mafia
Post by: gkrieg13 on January 08, 2022, 10:36:58 am
Slow starting game. Then again, we're just 9, but gkrieg hasn't showed up yet.


This is a bastard game. You can trust what the mod tells you to a point. But some things I say may not be entirely true. Or not true in the way you think they are.

Does this include role pms? What about win conditions?


Just thought about something: why didn't you just ask this in your QT?
Title: Re: BM 34: Groundhog's Day Mafia
Post by: gkrieg13 on January 08, 2022, 10:39:39 am
Hey everyone!

MiX, it’s been awhile. Why should I believe that you are not scum this game?

I don't think joth would make this multiball.

MiX and Awaclus are scum.
Discuss.

Also, memes are always welcome, Didds

I wish, kinda, although I liked rolling town this game.

So if we can get past the pointless accusation stage... any one want to speculate on setup?

i.e. Groundhog's day - here's my attempt:

One of us is the Bill Murray character and if they get exiled of NKed then everyone who was killed before is "regenerated".

Not saying that would work as a game, maybe, but it would be thematic.

Pointless accusation stage is the best!

Vote: scola, let's see if you can escape a single RVS vote without making the scummiest post of the game.

Why did you like rolling town this game?
Title: Re: BM 34: Groundhog's Day Mafia
Post by: gkrieg13 on January 08, 2022, 10:41:03 am
This is as good of a time as any to say that 4 votes is X-1.

This is another post of nothing
Title: Re: BM 34: Groundhog's Day Mafia
Post by: gkrieg13 on January 08, 2022, 10:41:50 am
This is as good of a time as any to say that 4 votes is X-1.

Are you saying you want someone to put the pasta at X-1?

No, the opposite.

If I voted for pasta, would you unvote?

Yes.

Why not have a wagon go to dangerous levels?
Title: Re: BM 34: Groundhog's Day Mafia
Post by: gkrieg13 on January 08, 2022, 10:44:23 am
So if we can get past the pointless accusation stage... any one want to speculate on setup?

i.e. Groundhog's day - here's my attempt:

One of us is the Bill Murray character and if they get exiled of NKed then everyone who was killed before is "regenerated".

Not saying that would work as a game, maybe, but it would be thematic.

Vote: Scola

Why is random accusation stage worse than pointless setup speculation stage?

In fact, I would argue it quite the opposite - "Random Accusation" is never, in fact, random - and is far less so for scum than for town. And further, "Pointless Setup Speculation", when there is no public setup info to begin with, only encourages potential slips of knowledge - something scum would love to pick up on.

I didn't call it random, just pointless. And yes, I get the point is to see how people react. But I'd argue, that's not actually effective. It would be interesting to see some analysis on how well anyone's D1 reads actually are...

I do hear you on potential slips of knowledge and had not completely thought of that - but those slips some times come from scum, too, no?

i.e I think the point of either is just to encourage more chatter - and this is true for both town and scum. town trying to weed out scum, scum trying to learn town's roles. I'm not sure why one is actually better than the other. I'm just not of fun of picking someone and voting for them without at least a piece of reasoning.

I think it is likely better for scum to know the setup than town, and the chatter you get with voting and making wagons is probably better than what you get from closed setup discussion.
Title: Re: BM 34: Groundhog's Day Mafia
Post by: gkrieg13 on January 08, 2022, 10:48:19 am
Slow starting game. Then again, we're just 9, but gkrieg hasn't showed up yet.


This is a bastard game. You can trust what the mod tells you to a point. But some things I say may not be entirely true. Or not true in the way you think they are.

Does this include role pms? What about win conditions?


Just thought about something: why didn't you just ask this in your QT?
I wanted to be able to quote and it seemed like good information for town to have. Would the qt have been preferable somehow?

Just feel like a question that is most natural to ask when you read it, not when the game starts, so it felt weird.

Messi?

Yes.

I didn't call it random, just pointless. And yes, I get the point is to see how people react. But I'd argue, that's not actually effective. It would be interesting to see some analysis on how well anyone's D1 reads actually are...

Last game, you were tied to Didds because of Didds' early wagon and infang buried himself when he called me scum due to an assumption that people will say things like that when pushing people they think are scum. Reacting is a very big part of mafia.

Now, do I think your reaction here is scummy? Kinda, honestly. Enough to keep my vote on you.


I like Galzria this game. I guess he kinda reminds me of when we were scumbuddies? But I like what I'm seeing overall.

What made scola’s reaction scummier than when you were going to unvote then if mathdude jumped on the wagon?
Title: Re: BM 34: Groundhog's Day Mafia
Post by: gkrieg13 on January 08, 2022, 10:49:40 am
EFHW - what you find skummy about that?
Like also mix what do you find skummy about the response he had?

Could they of responded in a way that was not going to be skummy? Or was it just the fact that they responded?

It has the ring of a classic scum post - making generalizations about how they play and how town and scum play. Safe stuff, no commitments.

I'd vote him, but I don't want to put him at E-1 so early in the day.

I think this kind of tentativeness is a town tell for EFHW
Title: Re: BM 34: Groundhog's Day Mafia
Post by: gkrieg13 on January 08, 2022, 10:50:42 am
EFHW - what you find skummy about that?
Like also mix what do you find skummy about the response he had?

Could they of responded in a way that was not going to be skummy? Or was it just the fact that they responded?

It has the ring of a classic scum post - making generalizations about how they play and how town and scum play. Safe stuff, no commitments.

I'd vote him, but I don't want to put him at E-1 so early in the day.

I think this is a really accurate assessment. +1

So if so many people want to exile scola, why aren’t more people voting for them?
Title: Re: BM 34: Groundhog's Day Mafia
Post by: gkrieg13 on January 08, 2022, 10:54:27 am
My head is spinning! I see myself agreeing with both Galzy and EFHW way more than I usually do. It’s a refreshing change.

I’ve been thinking about the low level of interaction and content generally. I’m guessing it’s attributed to the closed set up, so we don’t actually have much to talk about right now? Thus the conversation about the utility of random votes to start the game. It feels tough to get started, or to form any sort of concrete opinions.

Are you more likely to agree with them if they are town or if they are scum?

Also I feel like your buddy meter is turned a little down this game. I think that probably makes you town, but because it is you I’m not sure.
Title: Re: BM 34: Groundhog's Day Mafia
Post by: gkrieg13 on January 08, 2022, 10:56:37 am
My head is spinning! I see myself agreeing with both Galzy and EFHW way more than I usually do. It’s a refreshing change.

I’ve been thinking about the low level of interaction and content generally. I’m guessing it’s attributed to the closed set up, so we don’t actually have much to talk about right now? Thus the conversation about the utility of random votes to start the game. It feels tough to get started, or to form any sort of concrete opinions.

Do you have anyone that you would like to give a town pass to D1?  That can help start conversation and narrow down the exile pool.
Sorry, my mistake. I guess I still had an old window open from early this morning before work and didn't refresh it before replying.

I guess I agree with Didds, agreeing with Galz, agreeing with EFHW. Anyone else?

In all seriousness... i haven't played enough games here to know who votes whom and when on D1.

But still, seeing people's votes D1 can sometimes be helpful D3 and onwards for those who are able to look back and say "last time I was scum with X, they were very careful to vote each partner D1 but not put any pressure" or "I have never seen Y vote for partners D1 before. He voted Z D1 today and we know Z is scum now, so I'm pretty sure Y isn't scum".
Title: Re: BM 34: Groundhog's Day Mafia
Post by: gkrieg13 on January 08, 2022, 10:57:12 am
Oops, quote fail and I don’t really want to fix it on my phone.
Title: Re: BM 34: Groundhog's Day Mafia
Post by: gkrieg13 on January 08, 2022, 10:57:41 am
My head is spinning! I see myself agreeing with both Galzy and EFHW way more than I usually do. It’s a refreshing change.

I’ve been thinking about the low level of interaction and content generally. I’m guessing it’s attributed to the closed set up, so we don’t actually have much to talk about right now? Thus the conversation about the utility of random votes to start the game. It feels tough to get started, or to form any sort of concrete opinions.

Sorry, my mistake. I guess I still had an old window open from early this morning before work and didn't refresh it before replying.

I guess I agree with Didds, agreeing with Galz, agreeing with EFHW. Anyone else?

In all seriousness... i haven't played enough games here to know who votes whom and when on D1.

But still, seeing people's votes D1 can sometimes be helpful D3 and onwards for those who are able to look back and say "last time I was scum with X, they were very careful to vote each partner D1 but not put any pressure" or "I have never seen Y vote for partners D1 before. He voted Z D1 today and we know Z is scum now, so I'm pretty sure Y isn't scum".
Do you have anyone that you would like to give a town pass to D1?  That can help start conversation and narrow down the exile pool.
Title: Re: BM 34: Groundhog's Day Mafia
Post by: gkrieg13 on January 08, 2022, 10:58:49 am
EFHW - what you find skummy about that?
Like also mix what do you find skummy about the response he had?

Could they of responded in a way that was not going to be skummy? Or was it just the fact that they responded?

It has the ring of a classic scum post - making generalizations about how they play and how town and scum play. Safe stuff, no commitments.

I'd vote him, but I don't want to put him at E-1 so early in the day.

do you disagree with anything he said?
he was answering a question right? all of it seems to check out to me.
There is no definitive answer, it is open ended, so I don't see not having commitments here skummy. Nor towny.
It's the generalizations. And the topic is so not interesting.  Why did he say that about RVS anyway? If you don't like it then don't do it. Personally,  I rarely do it, but I think it's a valuable community building phase, before we all feel suspicious of each other, and a place to work out feelings from past games. Maybe I'll start doing it more!

But I'll grant you that it reads somewhat less scummy if you take into account that he was answering a question.

I mean generalizations is really all we have D1, I think. Or at least early in the day. And I'd argue that even though we're nearing deadline, it's still early in that there haven't been many posts.

And only 1 wagon (me) which was very early.

So it's a weird D1 in my mind. But that's fine, I guess. I just don't see anywhere right now to put my vote.

Pretty much same question. Where do you not want to put your vote.
Title: Re: BM 34: Groundhog's Day Mafia
Post by: gkrieg13 on January 08, 2022, 11:00:17 am
Vote: MiX

Awaclus, why do you find him scummy? What do you think about Scola?

For reasons. I could also go back to voting Scola.

Ah yes, those "reasons".  Elusive "reasons".  Sounds very familiar... like we seem to have this discussion every other game why some people don't give their "reasons".

You’ll have an easier time talking to Faust about reasons than Awaclus
Title: Re: BM 34: Groundhog's Day Mafia
Post by: gkrieg13 on January 08, 2022, 11:01:06 am
I'm confused why scola isn't interacting with us more around his wagon. I think we have the votes to exile him. No one else is being suggested. In a larger game, that would suggest he was town. I'm not sure how that plays out in a small game like this. Someone did mention Galz but didn't elaborate.

I feel the exact same way
Title: Re: BM 34: Groundhog's Day Mafia
Post by: gkrieg13 on January 08, 2022, 11:03:04 am
People that tend to single out my low involvement early in the game are either scum or Faust generally.

Oy vey the problems with this post.

It’s mainly when that is all they do. Like if Swowl were to do it, it would be very scummy. Much less scummy when you do it.
Title: Re: BM 34: Groundhog's Day Mafia
Post by: gkrieg13 on January 08, 2022, 11:04:26 am
I am more persuaded by Galz than the Scola folks, although he is my second choice.  The MiX reasons are... uh...hard to evaluate.  I'm not sure his lack of activity is any worse than gkriegs. I do not understand at all why gkrieg can just check out of D1 with no repercussions, though.

So, my scummy to not list is
Swowl
Scola
gkrieg
MiX
math
Awaclus
Galz
EFHW

EFHW town? Why?

I have Galz and Awaclus on top of my town list too, but mostly because that's who I remember being townie. Of course, Galzria's recent wall post skyrocketed him to townhood. Just reached that threshold of pro-town.

Why did that long post make him town?
Title: Re: BM 34: Groundhog's Day Mafia
Post by: EFHW on January 08, 2022, 11:12:14 am
This is cool. I like Galz's Swowl case and gkrieg has some good points on MiX. And scola is defensive and not participating much.

vote: Swowl. Would also vote scola. Would vote MiX in a pinch.
Title: Re: BM 34: Groundhog's Day Mafia
Post by: gkrieg13 on January 08, 2022, 11:14:01 am
Reads are:

MiX - definitely scummy. Reasons are above.
scola - I definitely get why people are saying they are scummy. I agree with them, just don’t think they are as strong as others suggest. Still wouldn’t mind this exile.
Swowl - I don’t completely agree with their defense of themselves, but didn’t feel as strong about the case either. Would also be fine with this exile.

Awaclus - don’t want to exile here
Galz - I don’t think he is as townie as other people think, but don’t want to exile D1.
EFHW - I don’t like that she is one of the people who is just talking about voting for scola but not actually doing it. If scola is scum, she is likely their partner.
WCD - she seems like she is trying to find her footing, but just seems townie in the way she is doing it. Don’t really want to exile.
Mathdude - this is the first game I’m in with them where they don’t scream scum to me. So don’t want to exile them.
Title: Re: BM 34: Groundhog's Day Mafia
Post by: scolapasta on January 08, 2022, 11:25:43 am
I'm going to go ahead and:

Vote: mathdude

I'm guessing this will likely get an OMGUS vote, from past experience, we'll see...

Reasoning: MiX is a typical easy D1 vote and if it turns out to be a mixexile, is easily defensible. And mathdude's last post felt to me as scummy, trying to see where a town created wagon might exist that he could jump on and then plead innocence that he just we just one of many misvotes.

gkrieg - you say  "this is the first game I’m in with them where they don’t scream scum to me" - can you recall in other games where they did scream scummy, where they actually scum or town? i.e. in Memento for a long bit he screamed scummy (imo) but turned out to be town. In other words, I think town mathdude is usually more aggressive, and this more passive mathdude reads to be as trying to hid among the town.


Title: Re: BM 34: Groundhog's Day Mafia
Post by: jotheonah on January 08, 2022, 11:33:42 am

The blizzard wasn't supposed to hit Punxsutawney. But it did. And Phil, his producer Rita, and their cameraman Larry are stuck in Punxatawney for another night. After a quick drink at the hotel bar they decide to hit the hay and hope things clear up tomorrow.

Little do they know that nefarious forces are at work, and the Punxsutawney mafia has big plans for this snowbound night...




Vote Count 1.3

MiX (3): gkrieg13, mathdude, Awaclus
Swowl (3): Galzria, WestCoastDidds, EFHW
scolapasta (1): MiX
Awaclus (1): Swowl
mathdude (1): scolapasta

Not voting (0)

With 9 alive, it takes 5 to exile.

Day 1 ends at 1:30 pm ET on January 8th. That's in 2 hours
Title: Re: BM 34: Groundhog's Day Mafia
Post by: scolapasta on January 08, 2022, 11:38:55 am
If no one else decides to switch to mathdude, and it's between the two current wagons, I lean towards Swowl.
Title: Re: BM 34: Groundhog's Day Mafia
Post by: MiX on January 08, 2022, 11:40:19 am
Two hours? But I'm still busy!

I don't wanna sacrifice myself again, but I should've saved that for this game I guess.

gkrieg, I think Galzris is town because of the sheer amount of effort and pro-town posting he's done. Before it was just low enough to be done by scum!Galzria, but now I can't see that anymore.

I'm not considering Awaclus today, but otherwise I'm okay with Swowl scola and math as options. Swowl I'm basically sheeping Galzria though, I didn't check Swowl's posts myself.

I'm around to check on the game but I'm not rereading anything today.
Title: Re: BM 34: Groundhog's Day Mafia
Post by: Swowl on January 08, 2022, 11:46:21 am
Well I’m about to start skiing and ain’t looking good for old Swowl here.

I won’t be around at DL

Vote: Mix

Was expecting Galz to dial back on his lane weird tunnel, the fact that didn’t happen should be looked at later. Not just him, well yes him it’s the most off, but Didds also. Galz kind of purposefully wrong interpretation of my ply style day 1 and WCD weak sheep is very out of char for them (especially regarding me).

Maybe check in at the top in like an hour.

Title: Re: BM 34: Groundhog's Day Mafia
Post by: WestCoastDidds on January 08, 2022, 12:16:55 pm
Except I answered you…

Title: Re: BM 34: Groundhog's Day Mafia
Post by: WestCoastDidds on January 08, 2022, 12:18:14 pm
I would move to Scola, but probably not MiX.
Title: Re: BM 34: Groundhog's Day Mafia
Post by: WestCoastDidds on January 08, 2022, 12:20:14 pm
Well I’m about to start skiing and ain’t looking good for old Swowl here.

I won’t be around at DL

Vote: Mix

Was expecting Galz to dial back on his lane weird tunnel, the fact that didn’t happen should be looked at later. Not just him, well yes him it’s the most off, but Didds also. Galz kind of purposefully wrong interpretation of my ply style day 1 and WCD weak sheep is very out of char for them (especially regarding me).

Maybe check in at the top in like an hour.

That’s E-1
Title: Re: BM 34: Groundhog's Day Mafia
Post by: WestCoastDidds on January 08, 2022, 12:21:47 pm
Assuming MiX moves to Swowl, that leaves Scola with the decision between Swowl and MiX.

That feel super icky to me, but I’m not quite able to articulate why. Just off.
Title: Re: BM 34: Groundhog's Day Mafia
Post by: scolapasta on January 08, 2022, 12:33:14 pm
I'll try not to be super offended by that. :)

Title: Re: BM 34: Groundhog's Day Mafia
Post by: scolapasta on January 08, 2022, 12:37:55 pm
OK, as I don't see any real chance of movement towards mathdude, I'm announcing my Intent to vote swowl by 1pm (24 minutes from now).

I'm not voting now because since Mix is the other wagon, he'll likely just hammer. So I feel my vote is effectively a prehammer, and prefer to do it as an intent and give chance for others to chime in.
Title: Re: BM 34: Groundhog's Day Mafia
Post by: gkrieg13 on January 08, 2022, 12:47:22 pm
OK, as I don't see any real chance of movement towards mathdude, I'm announcing my Intent to vote swowl by 1pm (24 minutes from now).

I'm not voting now because since Mix is the other wagon, he'll likely just hammer. So I feel my vote is effectively a prehammer, and prefer to do it as an intent and give chance for others to chime in.

Why Swowl over MiX?
Title: Re: BM 34: Groundhog's Day Mafia
Post by: scolapasta on January 08, 2022, 12:51:32 pm
OK, as I don't see any real chance of movement towards mathdude, I'm announcing my Intent to vote swowl by 1pm (24 minutes from now).

I'm not voting now because since Mix is the other wagon, he'll likely just hammer. So I feel my vote is effectively a prehammer, and prefer to do it as an intent and give chance for others to chime in.

Why Swowl over MiX?

I'm not sure I have a super great reason - mostly just that Galz and WCD who seem to know him best are on him. I think if he turns out town, then we have good reason to look at those two.

For MiX, he seems fairly not MiX like this game and I'm not sure how to read that. He did say he was busy, so it could just be that, though.
Title: Re: BM 34: Groundhog's Day Mafia
Post by: scolapasta on January 08, 2022, 01:00:22 pm
Vote: Swowl
Title: Re: BM 34: Groundhog's Day Mafia
Post by: mathdude on January 08, 2022, 01:05:48 pm
Vote: Swowl

That's X-1 on Swowl now too. MiX is left.
I'm willing to switch my vote if MiX doesn't show up soon.
Title: Re: BM 34: Groundhog's Day Mafia
Post by: jotheonah on January 08, 2022, 01:31:49 pm
THREAD LOCKED
Title: Re: BM 34: Groundhog's Day Mafia
Post by: jotheonah on January 08, 2022, 01:34:17 pm

As Phil Connors drifts off to sleep, all he can think about is getting out of this sleepy little town tomorrow.



Deadline has been reached. No one has been exiled. Night 1 begins now and will end in 48 hours, with night actions due in 36 hours in your Discord threads.

Vote Count 1.4

MiX (4): gkrieg13, mathdude, Awaclus, Swowl
Swowl (4): Galzria, WestCoastDidds, EFHW, scolapasta
scolapasta (1): MiX

Not voting (0)

With 9 alive, it takes 5 to exile.
Title: Re: BM 34: Groundhog's Day Mafia
Post by: jotheonah on January 10, 2022, 02:34:10 pm
Okay, campers, rise and shine, and don't forget your booties 'cause it's cooooold out there today.

It's coooold out there every day. What is this, Miami Beach?

Not hardly. And you know, you can expect hazardous travel later today with that, you know, that, uh, that blizzard thing.

That blizzard - thing. That blizzard - thing. Oh, well, here's the report! The National Weather Service is calling for a "big blizzard thing!"

Yessss, they are. But you know, there's another reason why today is especially exciting.

Especially cold!

Especially cold, okay, but the big question on everybody's lips...

 - On their chapped lips...

 - On their chapped lips, right: Do ya think Phil is gonna come out and see his shadow?

Punxsutawney Phil!

Thats right, woodchuck-chuckers - it's

GROUNDHOG DAY!


Day 1 Begins Now

Vote Count 1.0

Not voting:  MiX, mathdude, WestCoastDidds, Galzria, scolapasta, Awaclus, EFHW, gkrieg, Swowl

With 9 alive, it takes 5 to exile.
Title: Re: BM 34: Groundhog's Day Mafia
Post by: jotheonah on January 10, 2022, 02:35:48 pm
THREAD UNLOCKED

Day 1 begins now and will end at 2:30 pm ET on January 15th
Title: Re: BM 34: Groundhog's Day Mafia
Post by: MiX on January 10, 2022, 02:42:25 pm
Well, there you go.

This would've been more helpful if one of us had flipped. Sorry about that.

I think something we can conclude from that EoD is that if Swowl's scum, Swowl's buddies were either voting on me or not around. There's just no way they would risk me showing up and hammering. I didn't reread though, and I'm still kinda busy until tomorrow, so that's all I really have for today.
Title: Re: BM 34: Groundhog's Day Mafia
Post by: Awaclus on January 10, 2022, 02:45:13 pm
No kill is interesting.

Vote: MiX
Title: Re: BM 34: Groundhog's Day Mafia
Post by: WestCoastDidds on January 10, 2022, 02:46:57 pm
Hmm…. So that was not much ado about nothing.

Vote: Scola
Title: Re: BM 34: Groundhog's Day Mafia
Post by: WestCoastDidds on January 10, 2022, 02:47:46 pm
I'll try not to be super offended by that. :)

Please don’t! No offense was intended. Just a comment on the game state.
Title: Re: BM 34: Groundhog's Day Mafia
Post by: scolapasta on January 10, 2022, 02:48:30 pm
Well, there you go.

This would've been more helpful if one of us had flipped. Sorry about that.

I think something we can conclude from that EoD is that if Swowl's scum, Swowl's buddies were either voting on me or not around. There's just no way they would risk me showing up and hammering. I didn't reread though, and I'm still kinda busy until tomorrow, so that's all I really have for today.

What makes you say we can conclude swowl's scum?
Title: Re: BM 34: Groundhog's Day Mafia
Post by: scolapasta on January 10, 2022, 02:50:06 pm
I'll try not to be super offended by that. :)

Please don’t! No offense was intended. Just a comment on the game state.

OK. I find it super icky that you're voting for me today, though.

Do you think Swowl is scum?
Title: Re: BM 34: Groundhog's Day Mafia
Post by: scolapasta on January 10, 2022, 02:50:33 pm
MiX why did you not hammer Swowl?

mathdude, why did you not come back and switch your vote to MiX?
Title: Re: BM 34: Groundhog's Day Mafia
Post by: mathdude on January 10, 2022, 03:04:17 pm
MiX why did you not hammer Swowl?

mathdude, why did you not come back and switch your vote to MiX?

I intended to come back and check. And then I would have hammered. But I got busy with family and didn't get back in time.
(Also, you mean switch my vote from MiX to Swowl).

Useless D1. Useless N1 so far. Anyone have useful results from night? Otherwise, anyone opposed to a quick day, and we just put those votes back and actually hammer?
Title: Re: BM 34: Groundhog's Day Mafia
Post by: WestCoastDidds on January 10, 2022, 03:23:24 pm
I'll try not to be super offended by that. :)

Please don’t! No offense was intended. Just a comment on the game state.

OK. I find it super icky that you're voting for me today, though.

Do you think Swowl is scum?

You and Swowl are my best guess for the team. Or you and MiX.
Title: Re: BM 34: Groundhog's Day Mafia
Post by: scolapasta on January 10, 2022, 03:31:58 pm
I am willing to go back to the vote I ended up having late D1 (the first one).

Vote: mathdude
Title: Re: BM 34: Groundhog's Day Mafia
Post by: EFHW on January 10, 2022, 04:09:49 pm
I'm sorry about missing deadline. I got distracted.

The irony of no kill is that we do D1 all over again, just like the movie!
Title: Re: BM 34: Groundhog's Day Mafia
Post by: Galzria on January 10, 2022, 05:05:53 pm
Barring a given reason otherwise (and I'll re-read everybody's first posts here today in a bit), nothing has changed for me other than being frustrated with the no-exile.

Vote: Swowl
Title: Re: BM 34: Groundhog's Day Mafia
Post by: EFHW on January 10, 2022, 06:04:34 pm
THREAD UNLOCKED

Day 1 begins now and will end at 2:30 pm ET on January 15th

It's literally Day 1 again.
Title: Re: BM 34: Groundhog's Day Mafia
Post by: scolapasta on January 10, 2022, 06:10:23 pm
I was going to point this out to you - it's not just no exile, and no NK, but literal. So I'm guessing every day will be like this? Though, ostensibly people may have learned things at night.
Title: Re: BM 34: Groundhog's Day Mafia
Post by: Galzria on January 10, 2022, 06:12:41 pm
THREAD UNLOCKED

Day 1 begins now and will end at 2:30 pm ET on January 15th

It's literally Day 1 again.

It is. Which is definitely worth noticing.
Title: Re: BM 34: Groundhog's Day Mafia
Post by: WestCoastDidds on January 10, 2022, 06:33:24 pm
THREAD UNLOCKED

Day 1 begins now and will end at 2:30 pm ET on January 15th

It's literally Day 1 again.

Oh!!
Title: Re: BM 34: Groundhog's Day Mafia
Post by: WestCoastDidds on January 10, 2022, 06:34:00 pm
Could it be that there is no scum??
Title: Re: BM 34: Groundhog's Day Mafia
Post by: WestCoastDidds on January 10, 2022, 06:44:48 pm
And we just keep going until we exile Joth?
Title: Re: BM 34: Groundhog's Day Mafia
Post by: mathdude on January 10, 2022, 08:58:56 pm
Vote: Swowl

Willing to switch to MiX or scola at this point too to get a serious wagon going.
Title: Re: BM 34: Groundhog's Day Mafia
Post by: mathdude on January 10, 2022, 08:59:23 pm
Also willing to try and exile joth.
Title: Re: BM 34: Groundhog's Day Mafia
Post by: EFHW on January 10, 2022, 09:51:55 pm
I didn't call it random, just pointless. And yes, I get the point is to see how people react. But I'd argue, that's not actually effective. It would be interesting to see some analysis on how well anyone's D1 reads actually are...

A very 1-dimensional outlook. You're only considering "how people react" as a direct influence on reads. But there's a lot more to the purpose of voting than that. It creates connections. Is scum!MiX more likely, or less likely, to put a vote down on a partner in early RVS phases? What about Awaclus, or anybody else? An RVS vote may not have any weight or reason, and the "reaction" it generates may not be all that valuable (especially D1) - but every vote says something about the person making it - They choose who for reasons that are very rarely random (or pointless).

- Are you saying this as NAI? I don't think I can think of single RVS vote I have ever made as town that was not completely arbitrary.


i.e I think the point of either is just to encourage more chatter - and this is true for both town and scum. town trying to weed out scum, scum trying to learn town's roles. I'm not sure why one is actually better than the other. I'm just not of fun of picking someone and voting for them without at least a piece of reasoning.

- Galz wants to know "why pursue a line of convo that is beneficial to skum"... I just wanna know how you think "skum trying to learn town's roles" is not clearly worse than "town trying to weed out skum"?

Swowl, I am curious, as are others, I think, about your stalwart defense of scola. Can you tell us what's behind it?

I don't think I ever got an answer to this.
Title: Re: BM 34: Groundhog's Day Mafia
Post by: gkrieg13 on January 10, 2022, 10:16:17 pm
Sorry, swamped until Friday.
Title: Re: BM 34: Groundhog's Day Mafia
Post by: mathdude on January 10, 2022, 11:02:03 pm
Sorry, swamped until Friday.

Then I'm also willing to switch votes to gkrieg to get a D1 exile off. Not a policy exile. I'm just seeing that he's not helping town. So that could mean scum.
Title: Re: BM 34: Groundhog's Day Mafia
Post by: gkrieg13 on January 11, 2022, 12:29:54 am
Sorry, swamped until Friday.

Then I'm also willing to switch votes to gkrieg to get a D1 exile off. Not a policy exile. I'm just seeing that he's not helping town. So that could mean scum.

Am I helping town less than Swowl?
Title: Re: BM 34: Groundhog's Day Mafia
Post by: mathdude on January 11, 2022, 01:28:43 am
gkrieg,

I just look back through D1 posts, and you have a lot more than I remember.  I guess you are good at contributing without standing out.  So overall, no, you're not helping town less than Swowl overall.  Today - so far, pretty much the same.  No contribution.

I was mainly reiterating that I don't think it's helpful to let us end this day the same we did for D1.  As I said at EoD1, and still feel - we should exile today.  Also, unless someone reveals something useful from night... I don't see any reason this day needs to drag on until Saturday.
Title: Re: BM 34: Groundhog's Day Mafia
Post by: MiX on January 11, 2022, 05:28:17 am
I was mainly reiterating that I don't think it's helpful to let us end this day the same we did for D1.  As I said at EoD1, and still feel - we should exile today.  Also, unless someone reveals something useful from night... I don't see any reason this day needs to drag on until Saturday.

Sorry, swamped until Friday.

There's a pretty good reason to drag this game until Friday though.
Title: Re: BM 34: Groundhog's Day Mafia
Post by: gkrieg13 on January 11, 2022, 09:43:27 am
I was mainly reiterating that I don't think it's helpful to let us end this day the same we did for D1.  As I said at EoD1, and still feel - we should exile today.  Also, unless someone reveals something useful from night... I don't see any reason this day needs to drag on until Saturday.

Sorry, swamped until Friday.

There's a pretty good reason to drag this game until Friday though.

I’m 1 out of 9 people. I’m not trying to stall the game, just have a big paper deadline on Thursday.
Title: Re: BM 34: Groundhog's Day Mafia
Post by: gkrieg13 on January 11, 2022, 09:44:38 am
People could say why they didn’t hammer the other wagon. That would be useful.
Title: Re: BM 34: Groundhog's Day Mafia
Post by: MiX on January 11, 2022, 10:00:10 am
People could say why they didn’t hammer the other wagon. That would be useful.

I was busy and completely forgot about this game.
Title: Re: BM 34: Groundhog's Day Mafia
Post by: Awaclus on January 11, 2022, 11:15:06 am
People could say why they didn’t hammer the other wagon. That would be useful.

My memory from these past few days is a bit hazy but the deadline was in the evening on 01-08, and I think I woke up pretty late after going to bed at around 11 am, and there was a power outage when I woke up which took a while and the day had already ended by the time the outage was over. Which I remember because I barely made it in time to watch the Sora no Woto anniversary rewatch and that started a couple of hours later. I guess I could have checked the thread on mobile during the outage, but that didn't cross my mind and I'm not sure if I had even woken up before the day ended.
Title: Re: BM 34: Groundhog's Day Mafia
Post by: scolapasta on January 11, 2022, 11:17:52 am
I fully expected MiX would come in and hammer. Then I expected, based on his post, that mathdude would hammer. I didn't see any reason to switch away from swowl at the time.
Title: Re: BM 34: Groundhog's Day Mafia
Post by: scolapasta on January 11, 2022, 11:26:18 am
I still don't understand the anti setup talk sentiment from the first D1, but now that we have some more (limited) info, I think it's worth visiting again. If that makes some of y'all think I'm more likely to be scum, so be it.

It's D1 again. Do we think every day will be D1? (I do; it fits the theme). If so, then I wonder if that's the reason for no NK? i.e. what if there was actually was one?

From the 2nd post:
This is a bastard game. You can trust what the mod tells you to a point. But some things I say may not be entirely true. Or not true in the way you think they are.

So my hypothesis is someone was NKed and joth not telling us about a NK is the "not true in the way you think they are" because it's D1 again.

But what would that mean? Is that person back alive? Can they post? Can they vote? I'm still trying to figure out how I think that could work.

I think only swowl hasn't posted so far. But I'd also be surprised for that to have been the NK, anyway.
Title: Re: BM 34: Groundhog's Day Mafia
Post by: jotheonah on January 11, 2022, 01:07:09 pm
Phil Connors wakes up in his bed and breakfast in Punxsutawney, ready to deliver an unenthusiastic news report about the groundhog looking for his shadow. Entirely focused on himself, he fails to notice that something is amiss in the town of Punxsutawney. The Punxsutawney mafia are lurking, looking for their chance to make trouble.

Wait a minute, that all sounds extremely familiar. He already delivered that news report! The mafia already made trouble! He's lived this day before!

Vote Count 1.1

MiX (1): Awaclus
scolapasta (1): WestCoastDidds
mathdude (1): scolapasta
Swowl (2): Galzria, mathdude


Not voting (4): EFHW, MiX, Swowl, gkrieg13

With 9 alive, it takes 5 to exile.

Day 1 ends at 2:30 pm ET on January 15th.

Title: Re: BM 34: Groundhog's Day Mafia
Post by: WestCoastDidds on January 11, 2022, 01:10:14 pm
I think we need to exile someone to see if the day just keeps happening. I don’t think waiting until Friday when gkrieg is unswamped is a good idea since deadline is Saturday.
Title: Re: BM 34: Groundhog's Day Mafia
Post by: mathdude on January 11, 2022, 01:18:59 pm
I think we need to exile someone to see if the day just keeps happening. I don’t think waiting until Friday when gkrieg is unswamped is a good idea since deadline is Saturday.

+1
Title: Re: BM 34: Groundhog's Day Mafia
Post by: Awaclus on January 11, 2022, 03:55:16 pm
I think we need to exile someone to see if the day just keeps happening. I don’t think waiting until Friday when gkrieg is unswamped is a good idea since deadline is Saturday.

Good idea. Vote: WCD
Title: Re: BM 34: Groundhog's Day Mafia
Post by: Swowl on January 11, 2022, 04:27:58 pm
Well, there you go.

This would've been more helpful if one of us had flipped. Sorry about that.

I think something we can conclude from that EoD is that if Swowl's scum, Swowl's buddies were either voting on me or not around. There's just no way they would risk me showing up and hammering. I didn't reread though, and I'm still kinda busy until tomorrow, so that's all I really have for today.

Pretty much because of this logic (bold) and another thought, that MiX is solid town lock.
1. MiX as skum had the absolute perfect self D set up to hammer me with no shade to be cast on them.
2. MiX, or like anyone really, as skum... when they are the other wagon... is going to "forget about the game" at DL to the extent they don't even come in to vote.

As it happens, I am Town. so that makes me I guess suspicious of players that put themselves in a situation where they could not last minute switch to either MiX or myself without it being skummy. Will look into who that is...
Title: Re: BM 34: Groundhog's Day Mafia
Post by: Awaclus on January 11, 2022, 04:46:09 pm
2. MiX, or like anyone really, as skum... when they are the other wagon... is going to "forget about the game" at DL to the extent they don't even come in to vote.

Why is it more conceivable that this would happen as town?
Title: Re: BM 34: Groundhog's Day Mafia
Post by: Awaclus on January 11, 2022, 04:46:23 pm
Also,

The Punxsutawney mafia are lurking

time to exile all lurkers, it's mod confirmed they're scum.
Title: Re: BM 34: Groundhog's Day Mafia
Post by: Swowl on January 11, 2022, 05:27:34 pm
I didn't call it random, just pointless. And yes, I get the point is to see how people react. But I'd argue, that's not actually effective. It would be interesting to see some analysis on how well anyone's D1 reads actually are...

A very 1-dimensional outlook. You're only considering "how people react" as a direct influence on reads. But there's a lot more to the purpose of voting than that. It creates connections. Is scum!MiX more likely, or less likely, to put a vote down on a partner in early RVS phases? What about Awaclus, or anybody else? An RVS vote may not have any weight or reason, and the "reaction" it generates may not be all that valuable (especially D1) - but every vote says something about the person making it - They choose who for reasons that are very rarely random (or pointless).

- Are you saying this as NAI? I don't think I can think of single RVS vote I have ever made as town that was not completely arbitrary.


i.e I think the point of either is just to encourage more chatter - and this is true for both town and scum. town trying to weed out scum, scum trying to learn town's roles. I'm not sure why one is actually better than the other. I'm just not of fun of picking someone and voting for them without at least a piece of reasoning.

- Galz wants to know "why pursue a line of convo that is beneficial to skum"... I just wanna know how you think "skum trying to learn town's roles" is not clearly worse than "town trying to weed out skum"?

Swowl, I am curious, as are others, I think, about your stalwart defense of scola. Can you tell us what's behind it?

I don't think I ever got an answer to this.

I totally missed that you asked this. Answer is pretty much what we talked about here:
EFHW - what you find skummy about that?
Like also mix what do you find skummy about the response he had?

Could they of responded in a way that was not going to be skummy? Or was it just the fact that they responded?

It has the ring of a classic scum post - making generalizations about how they play and how town and scum play. Safe stuff, no commitments.

I'd vote him, but I don't want to put him at E-1 so early in the day.

do you disagree with anything he said?
he was answering a question right? all of it seems to check out to me.
There is no definitive answer, it is open ended, so I don't see not having commitments here skummy. Nor towny.

I felt like he was the first engagement in the game in just a crazy weak way that people jumped on it. All he did was say RVS is worse than set up talk (or the other way around, I don't remember, because IT DOESN'T MATTER) and then 2-3 just piled on him. Then someone asked him for justification and he gave it and people said it was skummy that he answered the question the way he did. I just didn't agree with any of it. The one thing I didn't understand (how skum learning town PRs vs Town finding Skum) I called them out on, and I feel as if they answered it well enough.

Honestly, thinking about it now more... my suspicion list should be the people that continuously pushed pasta
Title: Re: BM 34: Groundhog's Day Mafia
Post by: Swowl on January 11, 2022, 05:31:43 pm
2. MiX, or like anyone really, as skum... when they are the other wagon... is going to "forget about the game" at DL to the extent they don't even come in to vote.

Why is it more conceivable that this would happen as town?

Technically, I suppose you are correct. I still feel like skum is less likely to "forget about the game", but your point is valid.
Title: Re: BM 34: Groundhog's Day Mafia
Post by: mathdude on January 11, 2022, 07:01:38 pm
Also,

The Punxsutawney mafia are lurking

time to exile all lurkers, it's mod confirmed they're scum.

And who would you define as the lurkers?
Title: Re: BM 34: Groundhog's Day Mafia
Post by: Awaclus on January 11, 2022, 09:16:41 pm
Also,

The Punxsutawney mafia are lurking

time to exile all lurkers, it's mod confirmed they're scum.

And who would you define as the lurkers?

The Punxsutawney mafia.
Title: Re: BM 34: Groundhog's Day Mafia
Post by: mathdude on January 12, 2022, 12:15:13 am
Does anyone else feel like we're going in circles here?  Like things will keep repeating over and over again?
Title: Re: BM 34: Groundhog's Day Mafia
Post by: Galzria on January 12, 2022, 12:24:49 am
Cool.

People I won’t Exile today: Mix, Scola, Awaclus
People we should Exile today: Swowl
People I could consider, but don’t think are the best options: mathdude, Gkrieg
People that I would need to see a REALLY good case for: EFHW, WCD
Title: Re: BM 34: Groundhog's Day Mafia
Post by: Galzria on January 12, 2022, 12:28:32 am
Math:

Why did you vote Swowl today? You said you were willing to make the switch before deadline, but never did. Obviously your preferred exile of choice at the time was MiX, otherwise you wouldn’t have been there. Why have you switched to Swowl now, instead of trying to convince someone from his wagon to vote for MiX today?
Title: Re: BM 34: Groundhog's Day Mafia
Post by: Galzria on January 12, 2022, 12:33:36 am
Scola:

You moved to Swowl late in the day, I’m assuming to consolidate votes for an Exile? Today, you’ve opened back up by returning to where your vote was before the switch (on Math). Barring any relevant new information, why do you think that exile has more of a chance of going through today than it did yesterday? I don’t really see you making any new arguments for it - or trying to bring up old arguments either.
Title: Re: BM 34: Groundhog's Day Mafia
Post by: Galzria on January 12, 2022, 12:34:55 am
Scola:

You moved to Swowl late in the day, I’m assuming to consolidate votes for an Exile? Today, you’ve opened back up by returning to where your vote was before the switch (on Math). Barring any relevant new information, why do you think that exile has more of a chance of going through today than it did yesterday? I don’t really see you making any new arguments for it - or trying to bring up old arguments either.

Didds, same question to you RE: Scola.
Title: Re: BM 34: Groundhog's Day Mafia
Post by: Galzria on January 12, 2022, 12:37:42 am
EFHW, MiX, Swowl & gkrieg - You were all voting by the end of day yesterday. You’re not voting now. What’s changed? Who do you think is scum?
Title: Re: BM 34: Groundhog's Day Mafia
Post by: Awaclus on January 12, 2022, 01:21:05 am
Does anyone else feel like we're going in circles here?  Like things will keep repeating over and over again?
(https://dl.dropbox.com/s/dth02o2b43mr2b1/problems%20on%20your%20end.png?dl=0)
I think the problem's on your end, buddy.
Title: Re: BM 34: Groundhog's Day Mafia
Post by: mathdude on January 12, 2022, 01:25:08 am
Cool.

People I won’t Exile today: Mix, Scola, Awaclus
People we should Exile today: Swowl
People I could consider, but don’t think are the best options: mathdude, Gkrieg
People that I would need to see a REALLY good case for: EFHW, WCD

Just curious - why won't you exile MiX or scola today?  They were both very viable at certain points yesterday.  Their potential exile today could give valuable intel on others in the days to come - who was willing to or not willing to vote for whichever we choose.
Title: Re: BM 34: Groundhog's Day Mafia
Post by: mathdude on January 12, 2022, 01:27:20 am
Math:

Why did you vote Swowl today? You said you were willing to make the switch before deadline, but never did. Obviously your preferred exile of choice at the time was MiX, otherwise you wouldn’t have been there. Why have you switched to Swowl now, instead of trying to convince someone from his wagon to vote for MiX today?

"Preferred" on D1 is a very flexible term.  I think either would be a good choice today.  I think when I voted, it was mostly showing I was willing to vote Swowl and try to get the wagon going again (and that EoD1 wasn't a "convenient" forgetting to switch the vote like I said).
Title: Re: BM 34: Groundhog's Day Mafia
Post by: mathdude on January 12, 2022, 01:30:38 am
Does anyone else feel like we're going in circles here?  Like things will keep repeating over and over again?
I think the problem's on your end, buddy.

So you think you can just "buddy" me, and then I'll follow along with whatever you say?  Should I start sheeping your votes now too?  Sorry, but that's not the way I play.
Title: Re: BM 34: Groundhog's Day Mafia
Post by: Swowl on January 12, 2022, 02:18:17 am
EFHW, MiX, Swowl & gkrieg - You were all voting by the end of day yesterday. You’re not voting now. What’s changed? Who do you think is scum?

personally, I voted mix for self prez and iirc I already said why I am not on that anymore.
Title: Re: BM 34: Groundhog's Day Mafia
Post by: MiX on January 12, 2022, 07:59:03 am
EFHW, MiX, Swowl & gkrieg - You were all voting by the end of day yesterday. You’re not voting now. What’s changed? Who do you think is scum?

I'm not voting because I'm busy. It turned out I would only have time for this game today (instead of yesterday), so I should be rereading tonight. I was voting scola for some of his early posts, but I don't really remember why because I didn't write anything down.

Does anyone else feel like we're going in circles here?  Like things will keep repeating over and over again?
I think the problem's on your end, buddy.

So you think you can just "buddy" me, and then I'll follow along with whatever you say?  Should I start sheeping your votes now too?  Sorry, but that's not the way I play.

That is not what Awaclus meant by the word "buddy".
Title: Re: BM 34: Groundhog's Day Mafia
Post by: WestCoastDidds on January 12, 2022, 08:02:22 am
Scola:

You moved to Swowl late in the day, I’m assuming to consolidate votes for an Exile? Today, you’ve opened back up by returning to where your vote was before the switch (on Math). Barring any relevant new information, why do you think that exile has more of a chance of going through today than it did yesterday? I don’t really see you making any new arguments for it - or trying to bring up old arguments either.

Didds, same question to you RE: Scola.

When the day started again, and I looked at the VC from the end of the day, Scola stuck out to me as the person who was not on one of the wagons, which I find a scummy non-committal place to be. That, combined with his posts from the first day made me think k it was worth seeing where that might go.

Yesterday after I posted that I thought we should get on with the exiling (as opposed to dragging out until Friday) I was going to switch my vote to Swowl (who continues not to engage with me which is SUPER weird) but it would have been e-1 so I held off.
Title: Re: BM 34: Groundhog's Day Mafia
Post by: WestCoastDidds on January 12, 2022, 08:05:11 am
But maybe movement is better than no movement.

Vote: Swowl . That is e-1

Also, it’s my birthday! Have some cake for me today, y’all! 
Title: Re: BM 34: Groundhog's Day Mafia
Post by: gkrieg13 on January 12, 2022, 10:18:16 am
But maybe movement is better than no movement.

Vote: Swowl . That is e-1

Also, it’s my birthday! Have some cake for me today, y’all!

Happy birthday!
Title: Re: BM 34: Groundhog's Day Mafia
Post by: scolapasta on January 12, 2022, 01:42:43 pm
Scola:

You moved to Swowl late in the day, I’m assuming to consolidate votes for an Exile? Today, you’ve opened back up by returning to where your vote was before the switch (on Math). Barring any relevant new information, why do you think that exile has more of a chance of going through today than it did yesterday? I don’t really see you making any new arguments for it - or trying to bring up old arguments either.

Correct I fully expected Mix to vote Swowl and had to choose between the two of them. I still liked mathdude as an option better, but realized I suggested it too late on (first) D1. Since (second) D1 had just started thought it made sense to start with my strongest scum read. If no ones joins me and no wagon gets created here, I'll probably go back to swowl. (still preferred to Mix, though now that Mix is less busy, I expect more posts from him)

My read on mathdude is the same as when I first made the vote.
Title: Re: BM 34: Groundhog's Day Mafia
Post by: scolapasta on January 12, 2022, 01:45:41 pm
Scola:

You moved to Swowl late in the day, I’m assuming to consolidate votes for an Exile? Today, you’ve opened back up by returning to where your vote was before the switch (on Math). Barring any relevant new information, why do you think that exile has more of a chance of going through today than it did yesterday? I don’t really see you making any new arguments for it - or trying to bring up old arguments either.

Didds, same question to you RE: Scola.

When the day started again, and I looked at the VC from the end of the day, Scola stuck out to me as the person who was not on one of the wagons, which I find a scummy non-committal place to be. That, combined with his posts from the first day made me think k it was worth seeing where that might go.

Yesterday after I posted that I thought we should get on with the exiling (as opposed to dragging out until Friday) I was going to switch my vote to Swowl (who continues not to engage with me which is SUPER weird) but it would have been e-1 so I held off.

Um, I switched to Swowl (having announced my intent even before) about 30 minutes before deadline. That said, the VCA did have me listed as twice, with both my old mathdude vote and my swowl vote. It has since been corrected.

But had you been paying attention at the end of (first) d1, you would definitely have known I was on one of the wagons. (only Mix wasn't).
Title: Re: BM 34: Groundhog's Day Mafia
Post by: EFHW on January 12, 2022, 02:00:14 pm
EFHW, MiX, Swowl & gkrieg - You were all voting by the end of day yesterday. You’re not voting now. What’s changed? Who do you think is scum?

personally, I voted mix for self prez and iirc I already said why I am not on that anymore.

It does feel like a new day for me because of EOD1. I recognize that I am also responsible for the no exile, but scola, math and gkrieg were all on at that time, so I'm curious why none of them voted to ensure an exile.

scola's explanation doesn't really work for me:
I fully expected MiX would come in and hammer. Then I expected, based on his post, that mathdude would hammer. I didn't see any reason to switch away from swowl at the time.

Usually getting an exile is enough of a reason to switch on Day 1.
Title: Re: BM 34: Groundhog's Day Mafia
Post by: scolapasta on January 12, 2022, 02:50:58 pm
EFHW, MiX, Swowl & gkrieg - You were all voting by the end of day yesterday. You’re not voting now. What’s changed? Who do you think is scum?

personally, I voted mix for self prez and iirc I already said why I am not on that anymore.

It does feel like a new day for me because of EOD1. I recognize that I am also responsible for the no exile, but scola, math and gkrieg were all on at that time, so I'm curious why none of them voted to ensure an exile.

scola's explanation doesn't really work for me:
I fully expected MiX would come in and hammer. Then I expected, based on his post, that mathdude would hammer. I didn't see any reason to switch away from swowl at the time.

Usually getting an exile is enough of a reason to switch on Day 1.

Why doesn't work for you? I posted intent to vote swowl at 12:37 and followed through at 13:00.

MiX posted at 11:40 that he was around. I did think he'd vote for swowl after my vote, but sure it wasn't guaranteed. If that was the only reason I had I probably would've switched.

BUT, mathdude's response to me, 5 minutes later:

Vote: Swowl

That's X-1 on Swowl now too. MiX is left.
I'm willing to switch my vote if MiX doesn't show up soon.

This seemed definite enough to me that it would happen, especially considering his earlier sentiment that we should definitely exile. So it didn't even occur to me that I should switch as I assumed mathdude would post within those 25 minutes. I guess at 1:25 or later I could've tried to be around in case that didn't happen.
Title: Re: BM 34: Groundhog's Day Mafia
Post by: mathdude on January 12, 2022, 04:34:00 pm
EFHW, MiX, Swowl & gkrieg - You were all voting by the end of day yesterday. You’re not voting now. What’s changed? Who do you think is scum?

personally, I voted mix for self prez and iirc I already said why I am not on that anymore.

It does feel like a new day for me because of EOD1. I recognize that I am also responsible for the no exile, but scola, math and gkrieg were all on at that time, so I'm curious why none of them voted to ensure an exile.

scola's explanation doesn't really work for me:
I fully expected MiX would come in and hammer. Then I expected, based on his post, that mathdude would hammer. I didn't see any reason to switch away from swowl at the time.

Usually getting an exile is enough of a reason to switch on Day 1.

In hindsight, knowing I was busy with family, I should have just hammered. I did want to give MiX or others a chance to provide final comments. Shouldn't have done that.
Title: Re: BM 34: Groundhog's Day Mafia
Post by: mathdude on January 12, 2022, 04:36:46 pm
Actually, I'd like to see MiX hammer Swowl. That could give a little more validation to his claim that he forgot about the game, rather than the feeling I'm getting that he just didn't want ro hammer.

I'd hammer Swowl myself right now (for similar reason), but I'm already on wagon.
Title: Re: BM 34: Groundhog's Day Mafia
Post by: Swowl on January 12, 2022, 05:14:44 pm
Happy BDay Thelma!

I see no value in claiming in a bastard game, so probably not going to do that.

Everyone that is on me should, prior to hammer, have to publicly state why they are on me. My case is a lazy attempt and I honestly can’t believe some people are so hard set on it - but all in good fun and it’s a BM so i don’t mind being the exile for the day.

Vote: Galz

If i had to baller guess a pairing rn it would be Galz and Awaclus/GK.

I do really think people should have to state why they like my wagon before hammer though, just because most are hiding behind a weak initial case that is not actually accurate 100% - I know that sounds omgusy but i think pretty much my wagon is skum and lazy - so if you are being lazy take a moment to think about why i am your choice, and if you’re skum, we’ll then whatever town should force you to do it.
Title: Re: BM 34: Groundhog's Day Mafia
Post by: Awaclus on January 12, 2022, 05:19:32 pm
That is not what Awaclus meant by the word "buddy".

What did I mean by it?
Title: Re: BM 34: Groundhog's Day Mafia
Post by: Awaclus on January 12, 2022, 05:21:08 pm
Everyone that is on me should, prior to hammer, have to publicly state why they are on me.

That doesn't sound like a good idea and fortunately I have the power to prevent it from taking place. Vote: Swowl
Title: Re: BM 34: Groundhog's Day Mafia
Post by: MiX on January 12, 2022, 05:38:05 pm
That is not what Awaclus meant by the word "buddy".

What did I mean by it?

Not anything related to buddying, which is how math took it.

Was Swowl just hammered? Guess I'll take the night to get real reads then.
Title: Re: BM 34: Groundhog's Day Mafia
Post by: Awaclus on January 12, 2022, 05:49:44 pm
Was Swowl just hammered?

Yes.
Title: Re: BM 34: Groundhog's Day Mafia
Post by: Swowl on January 12, 2022, 05:57:09 pm
Everyone that is on me should, prior to hammer, have to publicly state why they are on me.

That doesn't sound like a good idea and fortunately I have the power to prevent it from taking place. Vote: Swowl

Surprise :P
Title: Re: BM 34: Groundhog's Day Mafia
Post by: jotheonah on January 12, 2022, 09:12:40 pm
Phil finds it hard to even give his usual level of effort in his Groundhog's Day broadcast. He gathers Rita and Larry at the diner. What could be happening? Why is it today again? Of course, no one believes him.

Vote Count 1.2

mathdude (1): scolapasta
Swowl (4): Galzria, mathdude, WestCoastDidds, Awaclus
Galzria (1): Swowl

Not voting (3): EFHW, MiX, gkrieg13

With 9 alive, it takes 5 to exile.

Day 1 ends at 2:30 pm ET on January 15th.

Title: Re: BM 34: Groundhog's Day Mafia
Post by: MiX on January 12, 2022, 09:17:11 pm
But maybe movement is better than no movement.

Vote: Swowl . That is e-1

Also, it’s my birthday! Have some cake for me today, y’all!

This was not e-1, this was e-2.

Guess that means time for a reread! Or a read, rather. I have not paid attention at all.
Title: Re: BM 34: Groundhog's Day Mafia
Post by: Awaclus on January 12, 2022, 09:18:09 pm
That is e-1

How could you do this? I trusted you!

Also happy birthday.
Title: Re: BM 34: Groundhog's Day Mafia
Post by: MiX on January 12, 2022, 09:21:19 pm
I was going to do this in my big reread post but I might forget so

Happy birthday Didds!!!!!!
Title: Re: BM 34: Groundhog's Day Mafia
Post by: WestCoastDidds on January 12, 2022, 09:47:02 pm
That is e-1

How could you do this? I trusted you!

Also happy birthday.

Apologies! I was distracted. Simple arithmetic, apparently, is not my jam.
Title: Re: BM 34: Groundhog's Day Mafia
Post by: scolapasta on January 12, 2022, 11:16:24 pm
That is e-1

How could you do this? I trusted you!

Also happy birthday.

Apologies! I was distracted. Simple arithmetic, apparently, is not my jam.

We'll excuse it only because it's your birthday! Hope you've had a fun day.
Title: Re: BM 34: Groundhog's Day Mafia
Post by: Swowl on January 13, 2022, 01:48:59 am
I do really think people should have to state why they like my wagon before hammer though
Title: Re: BM 34: Groundhog's Day Mafia
Post by: EFHW on January 13, 2022, 08:23:21 am
Phil finds it hard to even give his usual level of effort in his Groundhog's Day broadcast. He gathers Rita and Larry at the diner. What could be happening? Why is it today again? Of course, no one believes him.

Wait a minute, the main character and the groundhog have the same name? I never noticed that!
Title: Re: BM 34: Groundhog's Day Mafia
Post by: EFHW on January 13, 2022, 08:28:52 am
scola's answer works better now that he spelled it out.
Title: Re: BM 34: Groundhog's Day Mafia
Post by: EFHW on January 13, 2022, 08:33:53 am
vote: Galzria.  I'll have to blame his silver tongue for my being persuaded by his case on Swowl. Or I was being lazy.
Title: Re: BM 34: Groundhog's Day Mafia
Post by: mathdude on January 13, 2022, 02:42:14 pm
Why are people not interested in exiling Swowl?

Can someone explain the case on Galz?

Let's get an exile going.
Title: Re: BM 34: Groundhog's Day Mafia
Post by: EFHW on January 13, 2022, 04:24:47 pm
Galz's case is no longer relevant. Swowl has done a lot more since then. How do you feel he has been scummy since Galz made his case?
Title: Re: BM 34: Groundhog's Day Mafia
Post by: scolapasta on January 13, 2022, 05:06:24 pm
vote: Galzria.  I'll have to blame his silver tongue for my being persuaded by his case on Swowl. Or I was being lazy.

Why Galz? Is he trying too hard?
Title: Re: BM 34: Groundhog's Day Mafia
Post by: MiX on January 13, 2022, 05:13:06 pm
If people are seriously considering Galz I will just say I started by rereading him and I found him incredibly townie. I didn't post my reasons why because it's not very relevant (and then I fell asleep before rereading anyone else), but I can post it if people want.

And, uh, why is everyone dodging Swowl's question?
Title: Re: BM 34: Groundhog's Day Mafia
Post by: mathdude on January 13, 2022, 09:22:09 pm
Galz's case is no longer relevant. Swowl has done a lot more since then. How do you feel he has been scummy since Galz made his case?

I do agree Swowl has done a lot more since Galz' case on him.  How do I feel Swowl is scummy?  It has mostly been a D1 vote, even through our second D1 now.  I think he's one of the best results where we can truly learn more about other people after Swowl's flips because of the various opinions people have expressed on him throughout the game, and some opinions that have varied a little as time went on.  Does that mean I think he's scummy?  Not necessarily.  But I also don't see much from him that would indicate he's Town.

This one post did raise my attention though:
Well, there you go.

This would've been more helpful if one of us had flipped. Sorry about that.

I think something we can conclude from that EoD is that if Swowl's scum, Swowl's buddies were either voting on me or not around. There's just no way they would risk me showing up and hammering. I didn't reread though, and I'm still kinda busy until tomorrow, so that's all I really have for today.

Pretty much because of this logic (bold) and another thought, that MiX is solid town lock.
1. MiX as skum had the absolute perfect self D set up to hammer me with no shade to be cast on them.
2. MiX, or like anyone really, as skum... when they are the other wagon... is going to "forget about the game" at DL to the extent they don't even come in to vote.

As it happens, I am Town. so that makes me I guess suspicious of players that put themselves in a situation where they could not last minute switch to either MiX or myself without it being skummy. Will look into who that is...

In the quoted quote, I expect that sort of confidence from MiX (in fact, I'm actually somewhat surprised it's not more confidently stated as fact - he actually says "I think").

Swowl's initial conclusion ("proved" by 2 points) is much more bold than I'm used to seeing from him though.  Did we actually get viable wagons on D1 on 2 scum members - MiX and Swowl?  The probability is very heavily against that, but it's not impossible.  And statements like these from MiX and Swowl I could see as them trying to play off the wagons, and try and slowly work away from both of them as we went into today.
Title: Re: BM 34: Groundhog's Day Mafia
Post by: Swowl on January 13, 2022, 09:57:57 pm
vote: Galzria.  I'll have to blame his silver tongue for my being persuaded by his case on Swowl. Or I was being lazy.

Why Galz? Is he trying too hard?

yes
Title: Re: BM 34: Groundhog's Day Mafia
Post by: Swowl on January 13, 2022, 09:59:56 pm
vote: Galzria.  I'll have to blame his silver tongue for my being persuaded by his case on Swowl. Or I was being lazy.

Why Galz? Is he trying too hard?

yes

Not saying trying hard is bad... just specifically, he is trying too hard to accomplish something that is out of the ordinary for him.
Title: Re: BM 34: Groundhog's Day Mafia
Post by: EFHW on January 13, 2022, 10:54:41 pm
vote: Galzria.  I'll have to blame his silver tongue for my being persuaded by his case on Swowl. Or I was being lazy.

Why Galz? Is he trying too hard?
Kind of. I'm reacting mostly to the Swowl case. His towniness is NAI.
 
In other news, I don't think gkrieg has said what happened with him at EOD1.
Title: Re: BM 34: Groundhog's Day Mafia
Post by: Swowl on January 14, 2022, 12:59:31 am
Everyone that is on me should, prior to hammer, have to publicly state why they are on me.

That doesn't sound like a good idea and fortunately I have the power to prevent it from taking place. Vote: Swowl

How is this not a good idea?
Title: Re: BM 34: Groundhog's Day Mafia
Post by: Awaclus on January 14, 2022, 01:03:03 am
Everyone that is on me should, prior to hammer, have to publicly state why they are on me.

That doesn't sound like a good idea and fortunately I have the power to prevent it from taking place. Vote: Swowl

How is this not a good idea?

Gives scum info.
Title: Re: BM 34: Groundhog's Day Mafia
Post by: Swowl on January 14, 2022, 01:17:43 am
Everyone that is on me should, prior to hammer, have to publicly state why they are on me.

That doesn't sound like a good idea and fortunately I have the power to prevent it from taking place. Vote: Swowl

How is this not a good idea?

Gives scum info.

But you think I am skum.
Either I flip town and the info of a town flip with that info is for sure better for town then skum.... or I am skum and it doesn't matter.
Title: Re: BM 34: Groundhog's Day Mafia
Post by: WestCoastDidds on January 14, 2022, 10:49:50 am
Hhmmm…. EFHW, what’s the thought on Galz besides a silver tongue? Up until recently I had the two of you in my towncore
Title: Re: BM 34: Groundhog's Day Mafia
Post by: scolapasta on January 14, 2022, 12:13:47 pm
It's Friday - where's gkrieg?
Title: Re: BM 34: Groundhog's Day Mafia
Post by: gkrieg13 on January 14, 2022, 01:55:16 pm
vote: Galzria.  I'll have to blame his silver tongue for my being persuaded by his case on Swowl. Or I was being lazy.

Why Galz? Is he trying too hard?
Kind of. I'm reacting mostly to the Swowl case. His towniness is NAI.
 
In other news, I don't think gkrieg has said what happened with him at EOD1.

Saw that two people had plans to hammer Swowl, so I left the thread, assuming they would do it.
Title: Re: BM 34: Groundhog's Day Mafia
Post by: gkrieg13 on January 14, 2022, 01:57:28 pm
Cool.

People I won’t Exile today: Mix, Scola, Awaclus
People we should Exile today: Swowl
People I could consider, but don’t think are the best options: mathdude, Gkrieg
People that I would need to see a REALLY good case for: EFHW, WCD

That’s an interesting list of people you won’t exile. Why them?
Title: Re: BM 34: Groundhog's Day Mafia
Post by: gkrieg13 on January 14, 2022, 01:58:28 pm
EFHW, MiX, Swowl & gkrieg - You were all voting by the end of day yesterday. You’re not voting now. What’s changed? Who do you think is scum?

I mean really nothing has changed, was just busy.

Vote: MiX
Title: Re: BM 34: Groundhog's Day Mafia
Post by: gkrieg13 on January 14, 2022, 01:59:26 pm
vote: Galzria.  I'll have to blame his silver tongue for my being persuaded by his case on Swowl. Or I was being lazy.

Why Galz? Is he trying too hard?
Kind of. I'm reacting mostly to the Swowl case. His towniness is NAI.
 
In other news, I don't think gkrieg has said what happened with him at EOD1.

Also why do you think the Swowl case from galz is scummy?
Title: Re: BM 34: Groundhog's Day Mafia
Post by: gkrieg13 on January 14, 2022, 02:01:23 pm
Reads are:

MiX - definitely scummy. Reasons are above.
scola - I definitely get why people are saying they are scummy. I agree with them, just don’t think they are as strong as others suggest. Still wouldn’t mind this exile.
Swowl - I don’t completely agree with their defense of themselves, but didn’t feel as strong about the case either. Would also be fine with this exile.

Awaclus - don’t want to exile here
Galz - I don’t think he is as townie as other people think, but don’t want to exile D1.
EFHW - I don’t like that she is one of the people who is just talking about voting for scola but not actually doing it. If scola is scum, she is likely their partner.
WCD - she seems like she is trying to find her footing, but just seems townie in the way she is doing it. Don’t really want to exile.
Mathdude - this is the first game I’m in with them where they don’t scream scum to me. So don’t want to exile them.

Reposting my reads only because I don’t think people responded to them.
Title: Re: BM 34: Groundhog's Day Mafia
Post by: EFHW on January 14, 2022, 02:07:10 pm
vote: Galzria.  I'll have to blame his silver tongue for my being persuaded by his case on Swowl. Or I was being lazy.

Why Galz? Is he trying too hard?
Kind of. I'm reacting mostly to the Swowl case. His towniness is NAI.
 
In other news, I don't think gkrieg has said what happened with him at EOD1.

Also why do you think the Swowl case from galz is scummy?
Because it feels very compelling, as evidenced by my joining him. But on reread there's nothing there. That combination suggests scum!Galz.

I also think Swowl has done some towny stuff. But Galz isn't continuing to try to figure out if he is really scum, he just stays on the wagon.
Title: Re: BM 34: Groundhog's Day Mafia
Post by: EFHW on January 14, 2022, 02:08:30 pm
Everyone that is on me should, prior to hammer, have to publicly state why they are on me.

That doesn't sound like a good idea and fortunately I have the power to prevent it from taking place. Vote: Swowl

How is this not a good idea?

Gives scum info.

But you think I am skum.
Either I flip town and the info of a town flip with that info is for sure better for town then skum.... or I am skum and it doesn't matter.

This is an interesting point. How do you respond, Awaclus?
Title: Re: BM 34: Groundhog's Day Mafia
Post by: EFHW on January 14, 2022, 02:11:10 pm
If people are seriously considering Galz I will just say I started by rereading him and I found him incredibly townie. I didn't post my reasons why because it's not very relevant (and then I fell asleep before rereading anyone else), but I can post it if people want.

And, uh, why is everyone dodging Swowl's question?
I'd be interested to see your notes on Galzria.
Title: Re: BM 34: Groundhog's Day Mafia
Post by: MiX on January 14, 2022, 03:14:43 pm
Oh my god I forgot about this game.

Here's my Galzria post:

-----------------------------

Let's go player by player.

Galzria is town. Galzria is playing for the town condition. I'll grab a few posts that make me say this:

I was going to vote MiX here, but I’m going to leave my vote on Scola for right now. I would also consider Datswan or Gkrieg at this point in time.

Okay, this is null, throwing a bunch of names around is fine for either alignment.

I didn't call it random, just pointless. And yes, I get the point is to see how people react. But I'd argue, that's not actually effective. It would be interesting to see some analysis on how well anyone's D1 reads actually are...

A very 1-dimensional outlook. You're only considering "how people react" as a direct influence on reads. But there's a lot more to the purpose of voting than that. It creates connections. Is scum!MiX more likely, or less likely, to put a vote down on a partner in early RVS phases? What about Awaclus, or anybody else? An RVS vote may not have any weight or reason, and the "reaction" it generates may not be all that valuable (especially D1) - but every vote says something about the person making it - They choose who for reasons that are very rarely random (or pointless).

I do hear you on potential slips of knowledge and had not completely thought of that - but those slips some times come from scum, too, no?

Possibly, maybe. But town has much less use for such information than scum does, as scum is actively looking for information to inform a pretty major decision during the night - therefore pursuing discourse that may positively influence that decision for scum is fairly bad for town.

i.e I think the point of either is just to encourage more chatter - and this is true for both town and scum. town trying to weed out scum, scum trying to learn town's roles. I'm not sure why one is actually better than the other. I'm just not of fun of picking someone and voting for them without at least a piece of reasoning.

Not all chatter is equal. Chatter that potentially makes alignment connections is more valuable than chatter that potentially reveals information. You even acknowledge as much in the bolded above: One IS clearly better than the other - so why pursue a line of conversation that is beneficial to scum?

Also, vote: swowl.

As scum, this post serves to fill Galzria's ISO with words that make sense, to make him look townie. So what's the last thing scum's thinking when they're doing that? To setup a vote. This vote right here at the end of all that is townie, it shows that Galzria really wants the game to keep moving, and more importantly that he wants to push specific people.

Swowl case

This is a pretty significant chunk of effort that scum!Galzria doesn't need to do, doesn't need to feel like he needs to do it, and probably doesn't feel like he needs to do it. Now, I don't particularly agree with his case, I think saying he's not scumhunting as the primary reason to scumread is a bit off: yes, Swowl always scumhunts D1 and it feels like he's doing less of that here, but this game is not really like a normal one, especially with less players and thus less content. But the case itself comes from a townie perspective, and it's good enough to sheep.

Now, to D2: he's basically been hell-bent on exiling Swowl. Is this the position scum is taking? They might not even know if Swowl dies permanently, and if he does he would flip (right, joth? right? please?), so then Galz would get a bunch of heat on him, which happens regardless of how he pushes Swowl. I can see scum say "let's just setup this exile which by all rights should've happened yesterday", but not just do that.

For all of these reasons, and for not really seeing scummy posts, I would say Galz is always town here.

Now, Didds: the first thing I notice is this subtle buddying:

EFHW question seemed innocuous enough, but I don’t know how mix’s mind works. He’s really good at finding scum, at least when the sum is me, so there’s that.

The rest of the post doesn't matter, and maybe I'm being a bit self-centered, but that's a hidden buddying right there. Town!Didds is open about buddying, does this mean scum!Didds is more reserved about it? I don't remember checking for that in any previous scum!Didds games, but this is a point against Didds being town.

There's a few posts in between that aren't very alignment indicative. Then there's this:

I am more persuaded by Galz than the Scola folks, although he is my second choice.  The MiX reasons are... uh...hard to evaluate.  I'm not sure his lack of activity is any worse than gkriegs. I do not understand at all why gkrieg can just check out of D1 with no repercussions, though.

So, my scummy to not list is
Swowl
Scola
gkrieg
MiX
math
Awaclus
Galz
EFHW

Outside of Swowl, and maybe EFHW's a bit up, this was basically my readslist (yes, I remembered), roughly swapping me with Didds.

---------------------

Oh it has a bit of my Didds reread before I stopped being able to think about mafia.
Title: Re: BM 34: Groundhog's Day Mafia
Post by: scolapasta on January 14, 2022, 03:19:30 pm
Oh my god I forgot about this game.

This doesn't seem very credible from MiX, does it?
Title: Re: BM 34: Groundhog's Day Mafia
Post by: MiX on January 14, 2022, 03:23:03 pm
Oh my god I forgot about this game.

This doesn't seem very credible from MiX, does it?

I don't care how credible it seems, I'm now finally not busy, which comes with having fun doing things other than mafia. I've been "busy" all day since I woke up having fun elsewhere that I didn't even think of this game until...well, now.

Maybe there's something about the low player count that makes me not want to wake up and read every post, because I know I can catch up eventually.
Title: Re: BM 34: Groundhog's Day Mafia
Post by: scolapasta on January 14, 2022, 03:54:46 pm
So deadline is in a little more than 22.5 hours.

And no one really seems to want to join me on mathdude. So let's:

Vote: MiX

D1 (the first) I did prefer swowl to MiX, but D1 (the second) I've changed my mind. I would switch though in order to get an exile today.



scolacounta:

mathdude (10): scolapasta
Swowl (4): Galzria, mathdude, WestCoastDidds, Awaclus
Galzria (12): Swowl, EFHW
Mix (2): gkrieg13, scolapasta

Not voting (31): EFHW, MiX, gkrieg13

With 9 alive, it takes 5 to exile.

Day 1 ends at 2:30 pm ET on January 15th.



Surprised to see MiX not voting here.
Title: Re: BM 34: Groundhog's Day Mafia
Post by: Swowl on January 14, 2022, 05:30:42 pm
It isn't really all that surprising MiX is not voting given he just posted like their first real post which said they thought Galz was town and I was "not as skummy" as that reads list mentioned and those are the only two options.

I am kind of standing by my mentality that I would be dead right now already if MiX was skum, now that spans not just from Day 1 but to current... So if someone has a slot outside of Galz - speak on up.
Title: Re: BM 34: Groundhog's Day Mafia
Post by: mathdude on January 14, 2022, 10:44:35 pm
It isn't really all that surprising MiX is not voting given he just posted like their first real post which said they thought Galz was town and I was "not as skummy" as that reads list mentioned and those are the only two options.

I am kind of standing by my mentality that I would be dead right now already if MiX was skum, now that spans not just from Day 1 but to current... So if someone has a slot outside of Galz - speak on up.

Is your statement about MiX not hammering specific to MiX? Or is it related to general strategy? Because if it's a general statement, that's no reason to give MiX town-cred. We're nearing end of D2, and had no exile D1. I think most Town should be interested in getting an exile at this point. If anything, I would expect Scum to hold off and not hammer... I'd say Town will likely hammer.

However, if you're just saying MiX doesn't hammer D1 when he's Town. He only does it when he's Scum... then ignore this post entirely.

Let's not wait until the final 30 minutes this new D1, and miss again. Is someone hammering Swowl? Or should I jump back to MiX to make his wagon more viable?
Title: Re: BM 34: Groundhog's Day Mafia
Post by: Swowl on January 15, 2022, 02:21:26 am
I just pretty much 100% with everything in your last post Math.
Also, why is mix the only option for you to divert To rather than mix or Galz?
Title: Re: BM 34: Groundhog's Day Mafia
Post by: Swowl on January 15, 2022, 02:24:36 am
Mix is there anyone that is not you me or Galz that we can agree upon?
Title: Re: BM 34: Groundhog's Day Mafia
Post by: EFHW on January 15, 2022, 09:11:38 am
I reread D1 and discovered that it was Galz who got scola talking about RVS and that he spent even more time on generalizations than scola.

MiX,  effort is NAI for Galzria. Did you find his actual points about Swowl to have substance? On reread, it seemed to me like just a lot of shade.
Title: Re: BM 34: Groundhog's Day Mafia
Post by: EFHW on January 15, 2022, 09:33:00 am
I just pretty much 100% with everything in your last post Math.
Also, why is mix the only option for you to divert To rather than mix or Galz?

100% agree or disagree?
Title: Re: BM 34: Groundhog's Day Mafia
Post by: EFHW on January 15, 2022, 09:34:37 am
I would like to point out that wanting today to be a repeat of yesterday in terms of votes is scummy. That's Galzria and math.
Title: Re: BM 34: Groundhog's Day Mafia
Post by: EFHW on January 15, 2022, 09:39:11 am
Well, there you go.

This would've been more helpful if one of us had flipped. Sorry about that.

I think something we can conclude from that EoD is that if Swowl's scum, Swowl's buddies were either voting on me or not around. There's just no way they would risk me showing up and hammering. I didn't reread though, and I'm still kinda busy until tomorrow, so that's all I really have for today.

This makes sense.
Title: Re: BM 34: Groundhog's Day Mafia
Post by: EFHW on January 15, 2022, 09:40:47 am
Didds, math, Galzria and Awaclus -- Why are you on Swowl today?
Title: Re: BM 34: Groundhog's Day Mafia
Post by: WestCoastDidds on January 15, 2022, 10:17:45 am
EFHW is making the most sense here. And her case on Galz is better than anything else we have seen. And it’s enhanced by Galz’s lack of response.

I’m not terribly persuaded by MiX, but I’m not sure he’s scummy in his thinking. I need to think more about that but I don’t have the bandwidth to parse his big post yet.

I’m on a girls weekend in California this weekend, though, so that bandwidth isn’t coming anytime soon. I don’t anticipate being around at deadline.

Vote: Galz
Title: Re: BM 34: Groundhog's Day Mafia
Post by: mathdude on January 15, 2022, 10:31:04 am
I just pretty much 100% with everything in your last post Math.
Also, why is mix the only option for you to divert To rather than mix or Galz?

Given the choice between you and Galz, I think you're the better exile. My next choice would be back to MiX. If it's a matter of exile or no exile though, I'll switch to Galz but he's not one of my top 2.
Title: Re: BM 34: Groundhog's Day Mafia
Post by: mathdude on January 15, 2022, 10:37:22 am
I would like to point out that wanting today to be a repeat of yesterday in terms of votes is scummy. That's Galzria and math.

If we had a night flip, or any other useful information, then I'd agree that blindly wanting to repeat votes from D1 would be scummy. We should instead discuss the extra info. But I've seen nothing come up. So why not finish what we intended yesterday? Especially this late in the day, scum wants to bring up other options and distract us and hope deadline comes up before anyone gets exiled, especially if one of them might potentially be the exile.
Title: Re: BM 34: Groundhog's Day Mafia
Post by: mathdude on January 15, 2022, 10:39:11 am
Didds, math, Galzria and Awaclus -- Why are you on Swowl today?

http://forum.dominionstrategy.com/index.php?topic=21012.msg884042#msg884042
Title: Re: BM 34: Groundhog's Day Mafia
Post by: mathdude on January 15, 2022, 10:50:47 am
Vote: Galz

So it appears that 3 left on Swowl, 3 now on Galz, and 2 on MiX, with MiX stil not voting.
Title: Re: BM 34: Groundhog's Day Mafia
Post by: scolapasta on January 15, 2022, 11:00:59 am
I would like to point out that wanting today to be a repeat of yesterday in terms of votes is scummy. That's Galzria and math.

If we had a night flip, or any other useful information, then I'd agree that blindly wanting to repeat votes from D1 would be scummy. We should instead discuss the extra info. But I've seen nothing come up. So why not finish what we intended yesterday? Especially this late in the day, scum wants to bring up other options and distract us and hope deadline comes up before anyone gets exiled, especially if one of them might potentially be the exile.

Isn't the opposite also true? If possible exiles are town, wouldn't scum really want the exile?

I'm not sure how much I'll be around today at deadline, so am considering switching away from MiX within the next 90 minutes.

I'll probably go with galz at this point mostly for the reason than my current town reads are efhw and wcd and my preferred exile choices (mathdude and mix) aren't gathering any steam.
Title: Re: BM 34: Groundhog's Day Mafia
Post by: MiX on January 15, 2022, 11:02:57 am
I reread D1 and discovered that it was Galz who got scola talking about RVS and that he spent even more time on generalizations than scola.

MiX,  effort is NAI for Galzria. Did you find his actual points about Swowl to have substance? On reread, it seemed to me like just a lot of shade.

I disagree it's NAI. Galzria puts in more effort as town than scum, and in this game he was crossed that threshold of effort.

I don't really scumread Swowl, but if he has no claim then I don't see the point of his question about why people are on Swowl. That makes much more sense for scum than town that isn't claiming very quickly. And apparently it's not hammer yet, so

Vote: Swowl
Title: Re: BM 34: Groundhog's Day Mafia
Post by: gkrieg13 on January 15, 2022, 11:19:17 am
Why would you only vote after it isn’t the hammer?!?!?!
Title: Re: BM 34: Groundhog's Day Mafia
Post by: gkrieg13 on January 15, 2022, 11:20:35 am
vote: Swowl so we don’t actually have a repeat of D1 again
Title: Re: BM 34: Groundhog's Day Mafia
Post by: gkrieg13 on January 15, 2022, 11:22:06 am
I’m not convinced that galz would be better, and also not convinced it would happen if I bird that way anyway.
Title: Re: BM 34: Groundhog's Day Mafia
Post by: scolapasta on January 15, 2022, 11:27:59 am
I’m not convinced that galz would be better, and also not convinced it would happen if I bird that way anyway.

While I disagree with the first part, I can understand it. I don't the 2nd at all - I had just posted recently I would likely switch and to Galz in the next (now) 60 minutes. So you could've easily just waited that time, seen me switch to Galz and then chosen. So it definitely could have happened. And I don't anyone would've switched off swowl, unless it was to galz, in the interim either.

Title: Re: BM 34: Groundhog's Day Mafia
Post by: scolapasta on January 15, 2022, 11:28:46 am
But regardless, that should be hammer. Let's hope joth gets in here soon to confirm.
Title: Re: BM 34: Groundhog's Day Mafia
Post by: jotheonah on January 15, 2022, 12:53:07 pm
Something strange is happening and it isn't just the repeating day! At a meeting at the diner, the town decides to exile someone for being a member of the mafia! They all line up to kick that person out the door, but it doesn't work! What kind of a mafia game is this?

Vote Count 1.3

Swowl (5): Galzria, mathdude, Awaclus, MiX, gkrieg13
Galzria (3): Swowl, EFHW, WestCoastDidds
MiX (1):  scolapasta

Not voting (0)

With 9 alive, it takes 5 to exile.

Day 1 ends at 2:30 pm ET on January 15th. That's in 1.5 hours.
Title: Re: BM 34: Groundhog's Day Mafia
Post by: scolapasta on January 15, 2022, 12:57:55 pm
We'll, this would go with my nk person can't vote hypothesis... If true, do they know?

Vote: swowl
Title: Re: BM 34: Groundhog's Day Mafia
Post by: scolapasta on January 15, 2022, 12:58:39 pm
Let's see if one more vote does it. (Don't see getting anyone else to 6 at this point)
Title: Re: BM 34: Groundhog's Day Mafia
Post by: jotheonah on January 15, 2022, 01:03:51 pm
THREAD LOCKED
Title: Re: BM 34: Groundhog's Day Mafia
Post by: jotheonah on January 15, 2022, 01:09:00 pm
Phil skipped the after-party yesterday, so he doesn't know if the town kicked Ned Ryerson, the insurance person, out of town for being in the mafia. But they definitely did in this version of Groundhog's Day.

"And don't come back!" Buster Green shouts. "Even if we didn't think you were doing organized crime, we're all real sick of your sales pitches!"

Swowl has been exiled. He was Ned Ryerson, life insurance salesman. He was a member of the Town faction.

Vote Count 1.4

Swowl (6): Galzria, mathdude, Awaclus, MiX, gkrieg13, scolapasta
Galzria (3): Swowl, EFHW, WestCoastDidds

Not voting (0)

With 9 alive, it took 5 to exile.

Day 1 ends now and Night 1 begins. It will end in 48 hours, at 1:10 pm on Monday, January 17th.

Title: Re: BM 34: Groundhog's Day Mafia
Post by: jotheonah on January 17, 2022, 01:12:45 pm
Okay, campers, rise and shine, and don't forget your booties 'cause it's cooooold out there today.

It's coooold out there every day. What is this, Miami Beach?

Not hardly. And you know, you can expect hazardous travel later today with that, you know, that, uh, that blizzard thing.

That blizzard - thing. That blizzard - thing. Oh, well, here's the report! The National Weather Service is calling for a "big blizzard thing!"

Yessss, they are. But you know, there's another reason why today is especially exciting.

Especially cold!

Especially cold, okay, but the big question on everybody's lips...

 - On their chapped lips...

 - On their chapped lips, right: Do ya think Phil is gonna come out and see his shadow?

Punxsutawney Phil!

Thats right, woodchuck-chuckers - it's

GROUNDHOG DAY!


Day 1 Begins Now

Vote Count 1.0

Not voting:  MiX, mathdude, WestCoastDidds, Galzria, scolapasta, Awaclus, EFHW, gkrieg, Swowl

With 9 alive, it takes 5 to exile.

THREAD UNLOCKED
Title: Re: BM 34: Groundhog's Day Mafia
Post by: Galzria on January 17, 2022, 01:36:07 pm
Hmm
Title: Re: BM 34: Groundhog's Day Mafia
Post by: gkrieg13 on January 17, 2022, 01:56:23 pm
Well… massclaim?
Title: Re: BM 34: Groundhog's Day Mafia
Post by: scolapasta on January 17, 2022, 02:06:02 pm
OK, so that confirm some thought I had - at least for now, every day will be d1 and everyone will be "alive".

but are people being NKed?? Does it mean anything that we exiled swowl? (reminder: do note 5 votes for some reason was not actually enough)
Title: Re: BM 34: Groundhog's Day Mafia
Post by: EFHW on January 17, 2022, 02:44:55 pm
I was going to say we should figure out whose votes don't count, but the vc's don't give us that information. Best guess is that someone on Swowl's wagon was nk'd the night before. If dying takes away your vote, but the number needed to exile stays the same, we're going to be in trouble soon.

Oh, and vote: Galzria

Title: Re: BM 34: Groundhog's Day Mafia
Post by: mathdude on January 17, 2022, 02:47:33 pm
What is joth doing to us?  Right now, it feels like a game of "figure out the setup", not "figure out the scum".

Some thoughts...

In some way, at least 1 vote yesterday appeared to not count.  We could presumably put the same 6 voters (5 at a time) on someone today, if we could coordinate that.  It might show whose vote didn't count yesterday.

But it's very possible Swowl and/or another "night kill?" vote might also not count today.  Or maybe the original "vote doesn't count" person is back, and now it's only (1 or both of) Swowl and night kill whose votes don't count today?  But if it's cumulative, we might be down to only 6 possible votes today, and barely be able to get to 5 to exile.

But if night kills don't actually seem to be happening, who are we even trying to exile?

Re: massclaim...
maybe?  But will it help anything?  I think Swowl should claim, since he is apparently still alive.  Is the "life insurance salesman" some sort of role?  Or just thematic?

I'm lost.  Any other ideas?
Title: Re: BM 34: Groundhog's Day Mafia
Post by: EFHW on January 17, 2022, 02:48:55 pm
I expect that if we "exile" someone who is already dead nothing will happen. Could make EOD a bit tricky.
Title: Re: BM 34: Groundhog's Day Mafia
Post by: Galzria on January 17, 2022, 03:32:59 pm
Well… massclaim?

OK, so that confirm some thought I had - at least for now, every day will be d1 and everyone will be "alive".

but are people being NKed?? Does it mean anything that we exiled swowl? (reminder: do note 5 votes for some reason was not actually enough)


Alright, well I’ll jump the gun on this then:

I’m an Odd-Night Doctor, which when assigned the role I didn’t realize was just “You’re a Doctor” (Always D1, apparently).

1-N1 I Doctored Awaclus & there was no NK, which is why he was top of my “Will not Exile” list on 2-D1. 2-N2 I Doctored Gkrieg. At the start of 2-D1 I thought maybe I was just a super-awesome-Doctor, now I’m less convinced about that and think the lack of NK’s might be game-mechanic related.
Title: Re: BM 34: Groundhog's Day Mafia
Post by: EFHW on January 17, 2022, 04:03:11 pm
How did you decide to target Awaclus and then gkrieg?
Title: Re: BM 34: Groundhog's Day Mafia
Post by: Galzria on January 17, 2022, 05:01:37 pm
How did you decide to target Awaclus and then gkrieg?

Fuck.

Phone reloaded page and erased entire response. 😭

Awaclus - Wasn’t on my scumdar 1-D1. I find he’s an early NK target when he’s town because his play style can come across as erratic and unpredictable. He’s active enough to be threatening, and can be difficult to debate with.

Gkrieg - This was harder. Working on the thought still that I blocked 1-N1 NK, I didn’t figure Scum to shoot the same target. Swowl flipping Green made me consider where scum might be. All on his wagon? Assuming you & WCD aren’t both scum, there is probably at least one scum on Swowl.

MiX draws a lot of attention and is an unlikely scum NK target. Between Math, Scola & Gkrieg, I find math scummiest. Then it was a coin between Scola & Gkrieg.
Title: Re: BM 34: Groundhog's Day Mafia
Post by: EFHW on January 17, 2022, 05:06:02 pm
If you found me and Didds so towny, why not pick one of us? And scola got lots of heat the first Day 1. Not a likely nk, yet you flipped a coin between him and gkrieg?
Title: Re: BM 34: Groundhog's Day Mafia
Post by: Galzria on January 17, 2022, 06:21:54 pm
If you found me and Didds so towny, why not pick one of us? And scola got lots of heat the first Day 1. Not a likely nk, yet you flipped a coin between him and gkrieg?

I didn’t find you towny. You in particular have gone way up on my scumdar yesterday. WCD is on the townier though. But if I’m wrong on my feelings about you, then WCD is probably scum. Either way it seemed doubtful Scum would attempt to shoot off Wagon.
Title: Re: BM 34: Groundhog's Day Mafia
Post by: MiX on January 17, 2022, 09:06:59 pm
Huh. I wonder how we can stop this loop? I suppose exiling scum is the way out, huh.

Mass claim seems about right. I'll wait for Swowl to set an order.

I didn't really put a lot into this game, IRL's been time consuming, but from what I've thought of the game, Galzria seems less townie based on that flip, and honestly Galzria's D2 is so confusing to me, I was initially townreading it, but I don't know now. Scola and math are also going under the radar, with scola in particular going unnoticed D2, it felt. I don't remember much else though.
Title: Re: BM 34: Groundhog's Day Mafia
Post by: WestCoastDidds on January 17, 2022, 10:11:25 pm
What?!  This is some Joth nonsense on a whole new level.

I’ll wait for Swowl to se the order to discuss further, but Galz’s choices seem odd to me.
Title: Re: BM 34: Groundhog's Day Mafia
Post by: gkrieg13 on January 17, 2022, 11:40:35 pm
Why would Swowl set the order?
Title: Re: BM 34: Groundhog's Day Mafia
Post by: EFHW on January 18, 2022, 04:25:07 am
Why would Swowl set the order?

Are you suggesting that the flip could be a mod-lie?
Title: Re: BM 34: Groundhog's Day Mafia
Post by: mathdude on January 18, 2022, 05:00:33 am
Why would Swowl set the order?

Who would you recommend instead? And why?
Title: Re: BM 34: Groundhog's Day Mafia
Post by: WestCoastDidds on January 18, 2022, 08:04:23 am
Why would Swowl set the order?

His flip was green. That doesn’t make him an IC for you?
Title: Re: BM 34: Groundhog's Day Mafia
Post by: Awaclus on January 18, 2022, 08:08:35 am
Can Swowl still post ITT?
Title: Re: BM 34: Groundhog's Day Mafia
Post by: gkrieg13 on January 18, 2022, 09:54:59 am
I see no indication that Swowl was exiled.
Title: Re: BM 34: Groundhog's Day Mafia
Post by: mathdude on January 18, 2022, 11:35:15 am
I see no indication that Swowl was exiled.

The closest indication is that there was a vote count with him at 5 indicating it wasn't the end of the day, then one with him at 6 and the day ended. It shows a town flip, but doesn't mention Swowl.

Mr Mod... did Swowl get exiled?
Title: Re: BM 34: Groundhog's Day Mafia
Post by: WestCoastDidds on January 18, 2022, 12:16:50 pm
Okay, my pop culture people… what happened in Groundhog day? How did he stop the loop?
Title: Re: BM 34: Groundhog's Day Mafia
Post by: Galzria on January 18, 2022, 12:34:54 pm
Okay, my pop culture people… what happened in Groundhog day? How did he stop the loop?

The learned to care for others, and realized that the world doesn’t just center around him. More specifically, he fell in love.

Kinda in order:

He spends much of the movie angry at his circumstances. Then acting out against everyone because he’s realized he has no consequences. Then he tries to make himself a “better” person so that he can get into Rita’s pants. Then finally he realizes he actually loves her and says that even if he has to live this day for the rest of his life, at least he gets to do it with her and that makes him happy. The next morning he wakes up to the same radio opening, but she’s still there with him.
Title: Re: BM 34: Groundhog's Day Mafia
Post by: scolapasta on January 18, 2022, 02:05:27 pm
I see no indication that Swowl was exiled.

The closest indication is that there was a vote count with him at 5 indicating it wasn't the end of the day, then one with him at 6 and the day ended. It shows a town flip, but doesn't mention Swowl.

Mr Mod... did Swowl get exiled?

The 6 person vote / flip did specifically say he was exiled. Yes, he's back in some form today but that does make sense with the repeated D1 theme, no? The question is what exactly is means. I agree with whoever posted about whether swowl can post here or not.

And on the front of things being true but not how we think, the exiled part fits into that. And possible the it takes X to exile number in some way? not sure. But it's unclear to me how being flipped as town could mean he's not town.

I also am curious about the plan to mass claim. Since we don't really know if anyone has been truly exiled or nked ("yesterday" every one did post, so if there was a NK that did not stop posting. Who else besides swowl hasn't posted today?

So on a tyoical d3 mass claiming is usually good (I think?), but this one's weird and could just be scum trying to gain info.

Galz's early claim is interesting - if he's town then it should all be true. But I agree the choices seem off. And assuming his doctoring work when it was a repeated D1 seems like too much of a assumption. As scum, it's risky about a counter claim. though of course that's useful for the rest of his team to find the doctor (and encourage mass claim for other roles).

Si I think first things first is we should confirm everyone can still post here.
Title: Re: BM 34: Groundhog's Day Mafia
Post by: MiX on January 18, 2022, 02:07:11 pm
Agreed with waiting until Swowl posts. But we should set a deadline for Swowl to post before we move on, right? It's possible he can't post and we just don't know it.
Title: Re: BM 34: Groundhog's Day Mafia
Post by: MiX on January 18, 2022, 02:08:26 pm
Agreed with waiting until Swowl posts. But we should set a deadline for Swowl to post before we move on, right? It's possible he can't post and we won't know it, even from joth.

EBWOP, that should be clearer.
Title: Re: BM 34: Groundhog's Day Mafia
Post by: Swowl on January 18, 2022, 02:33:47 pm
I am here, but I have no clue what is going on.
one sec
Title: Re: BM 34: Groundhog's Day Mafia
Post by: Swowl on January 18, 2022, 02:42:31 pm
completely missed it took 6 to exile me yesterday.
I also agree this seems to be a figure the set up out vs a figure out who is skum game, at this point.

Who thinks we are just trapped in Day 1 forever?

Title: Re: BM 34: Groundhog's Day Mafia
Post by: scolapasta on January 18, 2022, 02:54:57 pm
OK, so everyone can post then. And swowl IC (unless we don't believe the flip).

Someone's vote did not count on second D1. That is likely related to setup, but also could be a role like mathdude's "drunk".

I agree with the solve the setup aspect, but isn't that often true of at least bastard games?

So not sure where this really leaves us.
Title: Re: BM 34: Groundhog's Day Mafia
Post by: scolapasta on January 18, 2022, 02:57:18 pm
Once we could try (but risky) is have 4 people (that were not on swowl, if we want to assume one of those were the original NK) vote for someone we suspect and then have swowl vote as #5. Of course one of those votes could be NK#2, but it could give us something useful info?

And yes, I get that info may be useful to scum as well. But so does mass claim - i.e. we're at a point were town gaining info is useful info for some scum info gaining risk, no?
Title: Re: BM 34: Groundhog's Day Mafia
Post by: scolapasta on January 18, 2022, 03:06:31 pm
Galz why did you choose to claim so early?
Title: Re: BM 34: Groundhog's Day Mafia
Post by: mathdude on January 18, 2022, 04:34:35 pm
I see no indication that Swowl was exiled.

The closest indication is that there was a vote count with him at 5 indicating it wasn't the end of the day, then one with him at 6 and the day ended. It shows a town flip, but doesn't mention Swowl.

Mr Mod... did Swowl get exiled?

The 6 person vote / flip did specifically say he was exiled.

It did not. It says "Ned Ryerson, life insurance salesman has been exiled". It does not say Swowl was exiled. We are assuming, based on normal mafia games, that this is the case. But it is an assumption.

Swowl, are you Ned the salesman?
Title: Re: BM 34: Groundhog's Day Mafia
Post by: scolapasta on January 18, 2022, 04:38:49 pm
I see no indication that Swowl was exiled.

The closest indication is that there was a vote count with him at 5 indicating it wasn't the end of the day, then one with him at 6 and the day ended. It shows a town flip, but doesn't mention Swowl.

Mr Mod... did Swowl get exiled?

The 6 person vote / flip did specifically say he was exiled.

It did not. It says "Ned Ryerson, life insurance salesman has been exiled". It does not say Swowl was exiled. We are assuming, based on normal mafia games, that this is the case. But it is an assumption.

Swowl, are you Ned the salesman?

OK, true, you made me go back and reread it again. And I see how this could be one of those "not exactly true" assumptions. But I doubt it is?
Title: Re: BM 34: Groundhog's Day Mafia
Post by: MiX on January 18, 2022, 05:04:57 pm
Before Swowl reveals the truth, I have to admit, I think math is onto something here. I find it more likely than not that Swowl isn't Ned.
Title: Re: BM 34: Groundhog's Day Mafia
Post by: EFHW on January 18, 2022, 07:15:18 pm
I think we should just exile Galzria.
Title: Re: BM 34: Groundhog's Day Mafia
Post by: scolapasta on January 18, 2022, 07:27:33 pm
EFHW, do you not believe the doctor claim?
Title: Re: BM 34: Groundhog's Day Mafia
Post by: jotheonah on January 18, 2022, 07:37:23 pm
Mr Mod... did Swowl get exiled?

I don't know what you're talking about, this is day 1. However, if there were an end-of-day post, I would have just edited it to be more inline with expetations.
Title: Re: BM 34: Groundhog's Day Mafia
Post by: scolapasta on January 18, 2022, 07:46:17 pm
OK, for those who haven't gone back, the post has been edited to clarify that Swowl was exiled. (and was Ned).
Title: Re: BM 34: Groundhog's Day Mafia
Post by: Swowl on January 18, 2022, 08:03:17 pm
Just to clarify what has now also been clarified. Yes, I am Ned and I am a traveling salesman.
Title: Re: BM 34: Groundhog's Day Mafia
Post by: Swowl on January 18, 2022, 08:04:29 pm
There is also no modifier to my role that says I should take more votes to be exiled.
Title: Re: BM 34: Groundhog's Day Mafia
Post by: Swowl on January 18, 2022, 08:18:55 pm
If we were to do it, this would be the order:

Awaclus
Math
WCD
EFHW
GK
MiX
Pasta
Title: Re: BM 34: Groundhog's Day Mafia
Post by: Swowl on January 18, 2022, 10:20:26 pm
I also think that the people who are discussing game mechanics are probably? on the right track.

Exile Town and they stick around but, assuming their vote does not count, you essentially just get this "Ghost IC" or a collection of them I suppose depending on how long it has been in the game. Or maybe it is just the next day? Or whatever, who knows. Following that concept...

Day 1 there was no exile. Because of that, we assume that Night 1 there was actually "a kill" and that the person whom was killed was someone on my wagon that was *not* Pasta (just because they did hammer and it counted). So, if this is true, then one of Galz, Math, Awaclus, MiX, GK was the target night 1 and their vote did not count.

From a balance perspective.... That layout kind of makes sense I guess. Like on one hand you get the ghost IC but on the other hand Skum assumedly knows all the votes that count vs not count.

Maybes?
Title: Re: BM 34: Groundhog's Day Mafia
Post by: Galzria on January 18, 2022, 11:06:04 pm
If we’re at 6 “Alive” then (assuming I didn’t Doctor successfully 1-N1 or 2-N1, which there doesn’t technically seem to be a way to tell), it would take 4 “Real votes” to Exile. Which would mean in a traditional 9 player game (7 town, 2 Scum), we would be in Mylo right now.
Title: Re: BM 34: Groundhog's Day Mafia
Post by: Swowl on January 18, 2022, 11:16:57 pm
It is also weird that the Vc actually says (6) people were voting yet it only took 5 to exile.
It’s a Bm but normally i think it would read 5 still right?

Title: Re: BM 34: Groundhog's Day Mafia
Post by: Swowl on January 18, 2022, 11:17:31 pm
Nope nvm realized it as I’m typing it - if this is the gimmick that would make it too easy to figure out who could vote.
Title: Re: BM 34: Groundhog's Day Mafia
Post by: Swowl on January 18, 2022, 11:21:07 pm
If we’re at 6 “Alive” then (assuming I didn’t Doctor successfully 1-N1 or 2-N1, which there doesn’t technically seem to be a way to tell), it would take 4 “Real votes” to Exile. Which would mean in a traditional 9 player game (7 town, 2 Scum), we would be in Mylo right now.

Decent point.
Lets do the claims.
I doubt it is as simple as this but I think we can discern a decent amount of info from claims… and the thread be dead this game anyways so at least we’ll have something fun to do
Title: Re: BM 34: Groundhog's Day Mafia
Post by: Swowl on January 19, 2022, 12:45:57 am
If we’re at 6 “Alive” then (assuming I didn’t Doctor successfully 1-N1 or 2-N1, which there doesn’t technically seem to be a way to tell), it would take 4 “Real votes” to Exile. Which would mean in a traditional 9 player game (7 town, 2 Scum), we would be in Mylo right now.

While this is fair, MYLO principles do not apply. We normally would not exile to get a flip at night and move forward. We have no reason to assume we will get a flip at night. We should exile today.
Title: Re: BM 34: Groundhog's Day Mafia
Post by: Swowl on January 19, 2022, 12:46:56 am
So decent point as in, yes we are not in a good spot. Not "we should not exile because it mylo"
Title: Re: BM 34: Groundhog's Day Mafia
Post by: Galzria on January 19, 2022, 12:52:20 am
So decent point as in, yes we are not in a good spot. Not "we should not exile because it mylo"

Sorry, wasn’t trying to imply that we should - I just wanted to make sure that our most likely situation based on what’s known is fully public knowledge.
Title: Re: BM 34: Groundhog's Day Mafia
Post by: Swowl on January 19, 2022, 03:11:53 am
Thinking it over because I got nothing but time. New order:


Math
EFHW
Awaclus
WCD
GK
MiX
Pasta
Title: Re: BM 34: Groundhog's Day Mafia
Post by: EFHW on January 19, 2022, 08:05:09 am
EFHW, do you not believe the doctor claim?

I do not.
Title: Re: BM 34: Groundhog's Day Mafia
Post by: WestCoastDidds on January 19, 2022, 09:00:48 am
I think we should just exile Galzria.

Perhaps if we exile scum something happens?

Vote: Galz
Title: Re: BM 34: Groundhog's Day Mafia
Post by: scolapasta on January 19, 2022, 11:44:47 am
So one thing to note is that if we do continue to have more D1s were exiled / NKed people are still able to post, then investigative roles become more powerful. Though I wonder if they can still do their thing, and this is true for any role, if exiled or NKed. At the very least, they'd be able to report back past results.

I think this makes me in favor if the mass claim - i.e if we reveal a cop and scum NKs them, they'd still be able to give us a result. (I could imagine a mechanic though were they become "insane" once exiled or removed, so we should take their results with a grain of salt).

 
Title: Re: BM 34: Groundhog's Day Mafia
Post by: scolapasta on January 19, 2022, 12:50:31 pm
I wonder what would happen if we tried to exile swowl again? Not saying we should, though...
Title: Re: BM 34: Groundhog's Day Mafia
Post by: Awaclus on January 19, 2022, 01:13:01 pm
Actually it's possible that it only takes 4 to exile today, if we only have 6 people who are still actually alive in the game.
Title: Re: BM 34: Groundhog's Day Mafia
Post by: EFHW on January 19, 2022, 01:50:26 pm
math, are you going to claim?
Title: Re: BM 34: Groundhog's Day Mafia
Post by: EFHW on January 19, 2022, 01:51:12 pm
Just curious, why am I second in the claim order?
Title: Re: BM 34: Groundhog's Day Mafia
Post by: Swowl on January 19, 2022, 01:53:15 pm
Just curious, why am I second in the claim order?

Fair question. Remind me to answer after the claims are done.
Title: Re: BM 34: Groundhog's Day Mafia
Post by: mathdude on January 19, 2022, 06:09:20 pm
Sorry for the delay in responding... absolutely hectic day with work today... from marking and planning last night, falling asleep doing it, teaching today, and following up with a hundred things after school.

Thinking it over because I got nothing but time. New order:


Math
EFHW
Awaclus
WCD
GK
MiX
Pasta

Why the change? I realize this will likely make you and others want me even more to go first, but I'll say it anyway.

I had no issues being second on the initial order, because the only person I needed to hear from before but claim was Awaclus, and you had him first. Why? For reasons.
Title: Re: BM 34: Groundhog's Day Mafia
Post by: mathdude on January 19, 2022, 06:50:08 pm
I wonder what would happen if we tried to exile swowl again? Not saying we should, though...

I was wondering the same thing. But are we too late in the game? Missing exile first D1 probably ruined this?
Title: Re: BM 34: Groundhog's Day Mafia
Post by: mathdude on January 19, 2022, 06:52:04 pm
math, are you going to claim?

Again, acknowledging that it makes me look more scummy, I'd like to hear a response from Swowl and I'd prefer to have Awaclus claim first.
Title: Re: BM 34: Groundhog's Day Mafia
Post by: Swowl on January 19, 2022, 07:40:40 pm
Sorry for the delay in responding... absolutely hectic day with work today... from marking and planning last night, falling asleep doing it, teaching today, and following up with a hundred things after school.

Thinking it over because I got nothing but time. New order:


Math
EFHW
Awaclus
WCD
GK
MiX
Pasta

Why the change? I realize this will likely make you and others want me even more to go first, but I'll say it anyway.

I had no issues being second on the initial order, because the only person I needed to hear from before but claim was Awaclus, and you had him first. Why? For reasons.

Ah yes, those "reasons".  Elusive "reasons".  Sounds very familiar... like we seem to have this discussion every other game why some people don't give their "reasons".

I posted the first list after a re read. Then I did individual IOS on everyone, which altered my opinion on what I thought the order should be.
Title: Re: BM 34: Groundhog's Day Mafia
Post by: Swowl on January 19, 2022, 07:41:38 pm
Why in the world would you as town say publicly "you need Awaclus to go first?"

Title: Re: BM 34: Groundhog's Day Mafia
Post by: Swowl on January 19, 2022, 07:57:27 pm
I wonder what would happen if we tried to exile swowl again? Not saying we should, though...

I was wondering the same thing. But are we too late in the game? Missing exile first D1 probably ruined this?

Why are so many people bringing up the concept of exiling an IC?
I get it, its a bastard game yeah yeah.... but I would think it is safe to say there is enough going on that assumes to be favoring skum without adding on lies about the flip. Which is outlandish even for a BM.

We need to stop stalling, we need to get the claims going.
Math - I am sorry the switch of order bugs you, regardless of role, if I were you, it would bug me too, but we have short days and we need to have time to process stuff.
Title: Re: BM 34: Groundhog's Day Mafia
Post by: scolapasta on January 19, 2022, 09:06:09 pm
I wonder what would happen if we tried to exile swowl again? Not saying we should, though...

I was wondering the same thing. But are we too late in the game? Missing exile first D1 probably ruined this?

Why are so many people bringing up the concept of exiling an IC?
I get it, its a bastard game yeah yeah.... but I would think it is safe to say there is enough going on that assumes to be favoring skum without adding on lies about the flip. Which is outlandish even for a BM.


To be clear, it's not exiling an IC, but exiling an already exiled IC. But yeah, I wasn't actually suggesting we do it, and speculating about it is likely just a waste of time.

Though, it did get some reaction from my (still) top scumread, so maybe that's useful?
Title: Re: BM 34: Groundhog's Day Mafia
Post by: EFHW on January 19, 2022, 10:12:53 pm
vote: math. The last time someone stalled claiming this much, they were scum (Swowl).
Title: Re: BM 34: Groundhog's Day Mafia
Post by: scolapasta on January 19, 2022, 10:26:11 pm
Joth, when does the day end? I didn't see it in the start of day post.
Title: Re: BM 34: Groundhog's Day Mafia
Post by: mathdude on January 20, 2022, 12:03:15 am
Why in the world would you as town say publicly "you need Awaclus to go first?"

As I said already... " for reasons".

Really though, he needs to claim before me. I don't want to say much more, but I will explain after.

I think it's safe to add this:
If I claim first, I believe neither I nor anyone else gets information about him, but he will be able to validate my claim.
If he claims first, then his claim can be validated or easily proven false.

I think it's better for us if we can have more information even if it makes me more suspect, rather than me claiming first and having only my claim validated.
Title: Re: BM 34: Groundhog's Day Mafia
Post by: Galzria on January 20, 2022, 12:12:45 am
So you’re soft claiming (or even hard claiming) tracker/watcher, with information on Awaclus that you don’t want to reveal first because he can then just “confirm”. If he claims first, you can “confirm” (or not) his actions.

Math - Does your role have an odd/even Night modifier like mine did?

Swowl, do you still prefer math to go first, or should Awaclus? If they’re both town, I don’t think it matters. But if one is scum, we’ll either end up in a 1-v-1 or get no further information (as math suggests). I doubt they’re both scum, the way math is dragging on this.
Title: Re: BM 34: Groundhog's Day Mafia
Post by: Swowl on January 20, 2022, 12:19:07 am
Why in the world would you as town say publicly "you need Awaclus to go first?"

As I said already... " for reasons".

Really though, he needs to claim before me. I don't want to say much more, but I will explain after.

I think it's safe to add this:
If I claim first, I believe neither I nor anyone else gets information about him, but he will be able to validate my claim.
If he claims first, then his claim can be validated or easily proven false.

I think it's better for us if we can have more information even if it makes me more suspect, rather than me claiming first and having only my claim validated.

I should elaborate - I was not asking literally why you did it, I get you said reasons. I was moderately sarcastically asking why in the world you would specifically say I want Awaclus to go ahead of me because I have info on Awaclus that I can verify and all that - because that in hand TELLS Awaclus this. That doesn't make sense.

It is a BM so anything is possible, so it is almost 100% for sure that nothing you know is easy to validate both you and Awaclus. The only exception, which (given BM) would still not be "easy", but potentially graspable at this stage, would be if you had a hard result - which you don't because you would not care if he went first or not. So you are essentially claiming tracker or watcher or some varient of that... so why would you sayyyy anything? You could of just said "I will give my N1 shit at the end" or something, that happens all the time.

PPE lol ppe galz - great minds.

Title: Re: BM 34: Groundhog's Day Mafia
Post by: Swowl on January 20, 2022, 12:21:42 am
Allllll that being said...

It is best for town at this point because, again annoying agreeing with my top skum read (but it is still true) it is very unlikely Math and Awaclus are BOTH skum ... and Math wants to make a one on one...

So yeah Awaclus you are up first please.
Second is Math.
EFHW third, then rest of list.
Title: Re: BM 34: Groundhog's Day Mafia
Post by: Awaclus on January 20, 2022, 12:31:40 am
I'm in a neighborhood with math.

That's all.
Title: Re: BM 34: Groundhog's Day Mafia
Post by: Swowl on January 20, 2022, 12:36:13 am
I'm in a neighborhood with math.

That's all.

Thanks.

I would like Math please to full claim, then Awaclus if there is any other part of your role please say so after Math has claimed.

Title: Re: BM 34: Groundhog's Day Mafia
Post by: Swowl on January 20, 2022, 12:43:00 am
Joth, when does the day end? I didn't see it in the start of day post.

If it is the same - it is on Jan 22 at 1030ish am FT
That is in like 2 and a half days.
Title: Re: BM 34: Groundhog's Day Mafia
Post by: mathdude on January 20, 2022, 02:31:57 am
I'm in a neighborhood with math.

That's all.

Thanks.

I would like Math please to full claim, then Awaclus if there is any other part of your role please say so after Math has claimed.

I am Debbie, who is one of the Punxsutawney newlyweds.  I am in a neighbourhood with Awaclus, as he said, but it is not mod-confirmed that he is town.  We only have night chat.

I was not wanting this to all lead to a 1v1.  I was hoping it would lead to us being a confirmed town pair, but every indication I've seen so far is indicating this is not the case.  He has not shared almost anything with me in our chat, and I had to lead every part of the conversation, including revealing any info to try and establish trust and confirm whether he was town (and offer some info to show I'm town).  He didn't share any information here.  Maybe that's just who he is (maybe my limited experience in neighbourhoods here has been influenced by Didds' large amount of both trust and chatter).

I get that he would be slightly hesitant to share too much, since he wouldn't know my alignment if he's town.  But (again, my limited experience) it seems that the benefit offered by a neighbourhood has to allow at least some amount of trust, even if it's to prove trustworthiness.

I had to share first in our neighbourhood.  I tried leaving minor bits untold to see if he would fill in the pieces (which might confirm to me that he had a similar PM from joth).  And I've received no assurance of that in our chat.  I also tried to generate discussion, and he didn't seem to have much interest.  It's like he was making sure not to slip info.

And now with the claims, I don't know what the standard is - but in my limited experience on these forums (I'm not even sure if I've been alive in more than 1 or 2 games still at the point that claims have happened), I was pretty sure you at least claim flavour name and then either role or other useful info... unless prearranged ahead of time that some information waits.  Yet here, he doesn't claim anything useful.  What is he not wanting to accidentally reveal?

Vote: Awaclus

Sorry newlywed... you just ooze scumtells to me.
Title: Re: BM 34: Groundhog's Day Mafia
Post by: mathdude on January 20, 2022, 02:43:25 am
Sorry if it seemed like I was claiming some kind of tracking role. If that was the case, I wouldn't have shared any of that info in thread here, to tip off my target. I was just trying to present my case that I wanted him to have one more chance to tell the truth, the whole truth, and nothing but the truth. But scum doesn't like to do that.
Title: Re: BM 34: Groundhog's Day Mafia
Post by: Awaclus on January 20, 2022, 04:11:54 am
I was not wanting this to all lead to a 1v1.  I was hoping it would lead to us being a confirmed town pair, but every indication I've seen so far is indicating this is not the case.  He has not shared almost anything with me in our chat, and I had to lead every part of the conversation, including revealing any info to try and establish trust and confirm whether he was town (and offer some info to show I'm town).  He didn't share any information here.  Maybe that's just who he is (maybe my limited experience in neighbourhoods here has been influenced by Didds' large amount of both trust and chatter).

Why would it ever lead to being a confirmed town pair? We're neighbors, not masons.

It's not entirely true that I have not shared anything with you or that you have had to lead every part of the conversation. I haven't shared anything I figured scum would substantially benefit from knowing, but I did share my flavor role to confirm that I had the same role as you presumably also did and you didn't lead that conversation. I have also shared a lot more about my thought process than I would in a thread where scum is guaranteed to be present.

I have actually answered all of your questions except one (which I wasn't sure was a good idea to answer and so the thread got locked before I reached a conclusion about that), and every night except the last one, you have said yourself that there was nothing more to talk about.

It's also worth noting that the night phases have aligned with /a/'s Sora no Woto and Madoka Magica rewatch marathons, respectively, which are important and meaningful events to me personally, so I have simply had other things to do and think about. (I'm also running in the regional elections, studying, working on a commission and trying to practice Dominion for the world cup, but those aren't specific for the night phases and don't usually require me to be somewhere at a specific time or prevent me from having enough time for this game — it's not like I don't have any time to spare at all, I just have less of it in total right now). Possibly I wouldn't have had a reason to talk more in the neighborhood even if I had had more time, but certainly not having more time didn't help me think of things that could potentially be useful to say.
Title: Re: BM 34: Groundhog's Day Mafia
Post by: Awaclus on January 20, 2022, 04:15:57 am
And now with the claims, I don't know what the standard is - but in my limited experience on these forums (I'm not even sure if I've been alive in more than 1 or 2 games still at the point that claims have happened), I was pretty sure you at least claim flavour name and then either role or other useful info... unless prearranged ahead of time that some information waits.  Yet here, he doesn't claim anything useful.  What is he not wanting to accidentally reveal?

Well, my flavor name is Fred, which I'm sure is incredibly useful for everyone to know. I already claimed my role.
Title: Re: BM 34: Groundhog's Day Mafia
Post by: Awaclus on January 20, 2022, 04:19:26 am
To clarify, when I said that's all, that was literally all. I did leave it ambiguous on purpose in hopes of tricking scum!math into fakeclaiming (or even realclaiming) more abilities, but that didn't happen apparently.
Title: Re: BM 34: Groundhog's Day Mafia
Post by: Awaclus on January 20, 2022, 04:22:33 am
I actually don't have any idea why it was important for me to claim first or why math is doing this case against me. Nothing in the QT gave me a reason to predict he would scumread me all of a sudden.
Title: Re: BM 34: Groundhog's Day Mafia
Post by: EFHW on January 20, 2022, 07:22:19 am
I'm a one-shot double voter. I don't have discord on this phone, so I'll have to check later, but iirc I'm the mayor or something like that.
Title: Re: BM 34: Groundhog's Day Mafia
Post by: jotheonah on January 20, 2022, 07:36:50 am
At this point, Phil has decided it's time to learn everything he can about everyone in the town, so that he can use that knowledge later to do cool tricks. That's right, it's time for a mass claim.

Vote Count 1.1

Galzria (1): WestCoastDidds
mathdude (1): EFHW
Awaclus (1): mathdude
Not voting:  MiX, mathdude, WestCoastDidds, Galzria, scolapasta, Awaclus, EFHW, gkrieg, Swowl

With 9 alive, it takes 5 to exile.

Properly, the day should end January 22nd at 1:10 pm but I'm extending it a bit because I've been so inattentive with vote counts and I forgot to include it in the initial post. We'll end the day January 24th (that's a Monday) at noon. And we may be doing seven-day days from here on out.
Title: Re: BM 34: Groundhog's Day Mafia
Post by: Awaclus on January 20, 2022, 07:42:38 am
Vote: mathdude
Title: Re: BM 34: Groundhog's Day Mafia
Post by: EFHW on January 20, 2022, 08:42:54 am
Ok, I'm Buster Green,  master of ceremonies and keeper of Puxsutawney Phil.
Title: Re: BM 34: Groundhog's Day Mafia
Post by: gkrieg13 on January 20, 2022, 09:21:27 am
Vote: mathdude

Heavy suspicion on MiX and scola for not exiling D1, where scum might’ve known that we don’t get NK flips and suggesting we exile someone who is already dead to avoid us getting any flips
Title: Re: BM 34: Groundhog's Day Mafia
Post by: MiX on January 20, 2022, 09:23:25 am
Do Awaclus and math have any roles other than being neighbors?
Title: Re: BM 34: Groundhog's Day Mafia
Post by: Awaclus on January 20, 2022, 09:32:20 am
Do Awaclus and math have any roles other than being neighbors?

To clarify, when I said that's all, that was literally all.
Title: Re: BM 34: Groundhog's Day Mafia
Post by: EFHW on January 20, 2022, 10:42:07 am
vote: Galzria. I was on math because he was stalling. I think he is misguided re: Awaclus, but not as scummy as Galzria. Also not comfortable with the votes accumulating on math suddenly, though I don't particularly scumread gkreig or Awaclus.
Title: Re: BM 34: Groundhog's Day Mafia
Post by: Swowl on January 20, 2022, 12:41:17 pm
EFHW does your ability have a modifier other than one shot?
Title: Re: BM 34: Groundhog's Day Mafia
Post by: Swowl on January 20, 2022, 12:42:37 pm
Math i seriously just do not understand what you were gonna accomplish here. Skum/town/sk whatever - Awaclus was obviously never going to lie in that spot. There would be zero benefit of him doing so
Title: Re: BM 34: Groundhog's Day Mafia
Post by: Swowl on January 20, 2022, 02:10:25 pm
Did you two start with this hood, or did someone target someone?
Title: Re: BM 34: Groundhog's Day Mafia
Post by: Swowl on January 20, 2022, 02:14:07 pm
Math - Hood with Awaclus
Awaclus - Hood with Math
EFHW - 1 Shot Double Voter (Day use? Night use?)

WCD -
GK
MiX
Pasta

you're up thelma :)
Title: Re: BM 34: Groundhog's Day Mafia
Post by: EFHW on January 20, 2022, 02:33:59 pm
EFHW does your ability have a modifier other than one shot?

No, and it's a day power.
Title: Re: BM 34: Groundhog's Day Mafia
Post by: mathdude on January 20, 2022, 02:36:54 pm
Do Awaclus and math have any roles other than being neighbors?

No
Title: Re: BM 34: Groundhog's Day Mafia
Post by: mathdude on January 20, 2022, 02:38:03 pm
Did you two start with this hood, or did someone target someone?

We had it since the start of game
Title: Re: BM 34: Groundhog's Day Mafia
Post by: WestCoastDidds on January 20, 2022, 03:33:23 pm
I’m a one-shot dayvig…Phil the weatherman.
Title: Re: BM 34: Groundhog's Day Mafia
Post by: Swowl on January 20, 2022, 03:35:50 pm
 fun fun
Title: Re: BM 34: Groundhog's Day Mafia
Post by: Swowl on January 20, 2022, 03:38:21 pm
Math - Hood with Awaclus
Awaclus - Hood with Math
EFHW - 1 Shot Double Voter (Day use? Night use?)
WCD - One Shot Day Vig

GK
MiX
Pasta
Title: Re: BM 34: Groundhog's Day Mafia
Post by: gkrieg13 on January 20, 2022, 03:49:13 pm
I am effectively a VT.

Larry, the local camera man and van driver. Even-night bus driver.
Title: Re: BM 34: Groundhog's Day Mafia
Post by: EFHW on January 20, 2022, 05:11:53 pm
What's the flavor for the bus driving? That's normally a scum role.
Title: Re: BM 34: Groundhog's Day Mafia
Post by: MiX on January 20, 2022, 05:19:13 pm
I'm Punxsutawney Phil, the Roleblocker.

I picked scola and then math.
Title: Re: BM 34: Groundhog's Day Mafia
Post by: mathdude on January 20, 2022, 09:26:04 pm
Math i seriously just do not understand what you were gonna accomplish here. Skum/town/sk whatever - Awaclus was obviously never going to lie in that spot. There would be zero benefit of him doing so

I was having serious doubts about him in our chat, but obviously didn't let that on to him.  I don't know what I was hoping to accomplish here.  I just felt that if he posted first, he may share more than what he had told me about.

Also, as I said, I don't recall almost any games where I was alive when claims happened, so I wasn't sure what to share - having him share first would show me what to share about the neighbourhood.  I think the only neighbourhood I've ever been in was in BM-Dwarves (where I was scum with Didds and Galz, and the 'hood was me, Didds, and Swowl, IIRC)... that was so stacked in our favour, I don't recall if we ever needed to even claim.

But when his claim was a single line with minimal info, it just seemed "short", unhelpful, and unlike the way I recall Awaclus playing.  So it added to my gut feel that he's not town.
Title: Re: BM 34: Groundhog's Day Mafia
Post by: EFHW on January 20, 2022, 10:19:08 pm
That is absolutely how Awaclus plays. When do you remember him being different?
Title: Re: BM 34: Groundhog's Day Mafia
Post by: mathdude on January 20, 2022, 11:03:50 pm
Am I mixing him up with ashersky? I thought I remembered Awaclus being very talkative. Or is he the quiet one? I haven't played very many games with either, and I often just think of each of them as the "player who starts with a".

I'm sorry if this has derailed things. I feel like I'm bringing down our chances this game. (At least I didn't claim "I'm mayor, or maybe drunk" when I was actually VT!)

Let's move on with the massclaim.
Title: Re: BM 34: Groundhog's Day Mafia
Post by: Galzria on January 20, 2022, 11:29:32 pm
Am I mixing him up with ashersky? I thought I remembered Awaclus being very talkative. Or is he the quiet one? I haven't played very many games with either, and I often just think of each of them as the "player who starts with a".

I'm sorry if this has derailed things. I feel like I'm bringing down our chances this game. (At least I didn't claim "I'm mayor, or maybe drunk" when I was actually VT!)

Let's move on with the massclaim.

Awaclus talks when he feels it’s beneficial to do so, but otherwise holds everything extremely close to his chest. This is generally true regardless of his alignment. See my reasons for Doctoring him 1-N1.
Title: Re: BM 34: Groundhog's Day Mafia
Post by: mathdude on January 20, 2022, 11:47:52 pm
Am I mixing him up with ashersky? I thought I remembered Awaclus being very talkative. Or is he the quiet one? I haven't played very many games with either, and I often just think of each of them as the "player who starts with a".

I'm sorry if this has derailed things. I feel like I'm bringing down our chances this game. (At least I didn't claim "I'm mayor, or maybe drunk" when I was actually VT!)

Let's move on with the massclaim.

Awaclus talks when he feels it’s beneficial to do so, but otherwise holds everything extremely close to his chest. This is generally true regardless of his alignment. See my reasons for Doctoring him 1-N1.

Then my being in a neighbourhood with him is no help at all.  Mod, can we re-roll roles?

Also, for massclaim, I think we're at scola... then if Swowl has anything else from his role he wants to add.
Title: Re: BM 34: Groundhog's Day Mafia
Post by: gkrieg13 on January 21, 2022, 12:26:20 am
What's the flavor for the bus driving? That's normally a scum role.

What do you mean? It just says bus driver (even though I drive a van)
Title: Re: BM 34: Groundhog's Day Mafia
Post by: scolapasta on January 21, 2022, 12:39:01 am
I'm Punxsutawney Phil, the Roleblocker.

I picked scola and then math.

Sigh. 

I'm an odd night Rolecop and got results both nights (including when I was supposedly roleblocked. Both people I've checked claimed what I was told they were.

N1 - WCD - one shot day vig
N1 - mathdude - neighbor

Oh, and Flavor is Rita, the producer.
Title: Re: BM 34: Groundhog's Day Mafia
Post by: scolapasta on January 21, 2022, 12:42:12 am
To be clear, my sigh is because my results and MiX's contradict each other.

BUT I'm wondering if gkrieg is lying about being even night? What if he switched me and someone else N1, so that someone else got blocked. Most people wouldn'r even know if blocked, since there don't seem to be many night roles (only MiX, gkrieg, and me?)
Title: Re: BM 34: Groundhog's Day Mafia
Post by: scolapasta on January 21, 2022, 12:44:03 am
...

I have actually answered all of your questions except one (which I wasn't sure was a good idea to answer and so the thread got locked before I reached a conclusion about that), and every night except the last one, you have said yourself that there was nothing more to talk about.

...

What thread got locked? Why is that relevant?
Title: Re: BM 34: Groundhog's Day Mafia
Post by: scolapasta on January 21, 2022, 12:45:09 am
Bad quoting - fixed here:

...

I have actually answered all of your questions except one (which I wasn't sure was a good idea to answer and so the thread got locked before I reached a conclusion about that), and every night except the last one, you have said yourself that there was nothing more to talk about.

...

What thread got locked? Why is that relevant?
Title: Re: BM 34: Groundhog's Day Mafia
Post by: Swowl on January 21, 2022, 01:59:30 am
I'm Punxsutawney Phil, the Roleblocker.

I picked scola and then math.

do you have a modifier?
Title: Re: BM 34: Groundhog's Day Mafia
Post by: Swowl on January 21, 2022, 02:05:09 am
Math - Hood with Awaclus
Awaclus - Hood with Math
EFHW - 1 Shot Double Voter (Day use? Night use?)
WCD - One Shot Day Vig
GK - Even Night Bus Driver
MiX - Roleblocker - Scola N1, Mathdue *N2 --- conflicts with pastas claim.
Pasta - Odd Night Role Cop - WCD N1, Math N2

Title: Re: BM 34: Groundhog's Day Mafia
Post by: Galzria on January 21, 2022, 02:06:43 am
Didds - Are you aware or not if your day kill sends us to Night, or does it just go off (and possibly extend the day?)
Title: Re: BM 34: Groundhog's Day Mafia
Post by: Swowl on January 21, 2022, 02:11:43 am
<b>Sir Joth - What happens if there were to be a day kill in this game? would we go to night or continue the day?</b>
Title: Re: BM 34: Groundhog's Day Mafia
Post by: Swowl on January 21, 2022, 02:12:02 am
Sir Joth - What happens if there were to be a day kill in this game? would we go to night or continue the day?
Title: Re: BM 34: Groundhog's Day Mafia
Post by: Galzria on January 21, 2022, 02:12:18 am
<b>Sir Joth - What happens if there were to be a day kill in this game? would we go to night or continue the day?</b>

QT scumslip
Title: Re: BM 34: Groundhog's Day Mafia
Post by: Swowl on January 21, 2022, 02:22:42 am
<b>Sir Joth - What happens if there were to be a day kill in this game? would we go to night or continue the day?</b>

QT scumslip


#discord
Title: Re: BM 34: Groundhog's Day Mafia
Post by: Galzria on January 21, 2022, 02:27:07 am
**Sir Joth - What happens if there were to be a day kill in this game? would we go to night or continue the day?**

QT scumslip


#discord

FTFY
Title: Re: BM 34: Groundhog's Day Mafia
Post by: Swowl on January 21, 2022, 02:44:14 am
open to opinions on this one. I am little bit lost in the mist.
Title: Re: BM 34: Groundhog's Day Mafia
Post by: mathdude on January 21, 2022, 07:59:00 am
Swowl, do you have anything else that might help us? Did you have a role? Do you know if it still works? Do you know anything about the fact that you were exiled but still here?
Title: Re: BM 34: Groundhog's Day Mafia
Post by: WestCoastDidds on January 21, 2022, 08:16:41 am
Didds - Are you aware or not if your day kill sends us to Night, or does it just go off (and possibly extend the day?)

I have no idea. As you all know, I’m like the very worst person to be a vig. I hate killing my friends.  But I can kill our exile choice if we want to see?
Title: Re: BM 34: Groundhog's Day Mafia
Post by: jotheonah on January 21, 2022, 09:48:42 am
Sir Joth - What happens if there were to be a day kill in this game? would we go to night or continue the day?

It's a secret.
Title: Re: BM 34: Groundhog's Day Mafia
Post by: jotheonah on January 21, 2022, 09:52:14 am
Vote Count 1.2

Galzria (2): WestCoastDidds, EFHW
mathdude (2): Awaclus, gkrieg
Awaclus (1): mathdude
Not voting (4):  MiX, Galzria, scolapasta, Swowl

With 9 alive, it takes 5 to exile.

Day 1 ends January 24th (that's a Monday) at noon. 
Title: Re: BM 34: Groundhog's Day Mafia
Post by: MiX on January 21, 2022, 10:27:01 am
I'm Punxsutawney Phil, the Roleblocker.

I picked scola and then math.

Sigh. 

I'm an odd night Rolecop and got results both nights (including when I was supposedly roleblocked. Both people I've checked claimed what I was told they were.

N1 - WCD - one shot day vig
N1 - mathdude - neighbor

Oh, and Flavor is Rita, the producer.

Audible sigh here too.

Vote: scola

Well, at least we're not all town here.

I'm Punxsutawney Phil, the Roleblocker.

I picked scola and then math.

do you have a modifier?

I'm just a full roleblocker.
Title: Re: BM 34: Groundhog's Day Mafia
Post by: Awaclus on January 21, 2022, 10:29:46 am
What thread got locked? Why is that relevant?

The QT got locked and so I was not allowed to answer the question there anymore.
Title: Re: BM 34: Groundhog's Day Mafia
Post by: MiX on January 21, 2022, 10:32:03 am
So, there's a chance we're both town and there's shenanigans going on, but given Swowl didn't die, we should exile one of us first. Unless there's some hidden deaths going on and this is secretly XiLo, we should be fine, right?

Well, time to ISO scola I guess.
Title: Re: BM 34: Groundhog's Day Mafia
Post by: scolapasta on January 21, 2022, 10:36:45 am
What thread got locked? Why is that relevant?

The QT got locked and so I was not allowed to answer the question there anymore.

So wait, is it only day? or only night? Is that typical for neighbors and not just open all the time?
Title: Re: BM 34: Groundhog's Day Mafia
Post by: MiX on January 21, 2022, 10:38:01 am
Wait, hold on, surely Didds should use her one-shot day vig today, right? It's probably not even one-shot because of the looping days.

What thread got locked? Why is that relevant?

The QT got locked and so I was not allowed to answer the question there anymore.

So wait, is it only day? or only night? Is that typical for neighbors and not just open all the time?

Most neighborhoods are night only. Well, I don't know about most, but some are.
Title: Re: BM 34: Groundhog's Day Mafia
Post by: scolapasta on January 21, 2022, 10:44:08 am
I'm Punxsutawney Phil, the Roleblocker.

I picked scola and then math.

Sigh. 

I'm an odd night Rolecop and got results both nights (including when I was supposedly roleblocked. Both people I've checked claimed what I was told they were.

N1 - WCD - one shot day vig
N1 - mathdude - neighbor

Oh, and Flavor is Rita, the producer.

Audible sigh here too.

Vote: scola

Well, at least we're not all town here.

I'm Punxsutawney Phil, the Roleblocker.

I picked scola and then math.

do you have a modifier?

I'm just a full roleblocker.

Hey, I sighed first!

So here's where my head is at:

Clearly something going on with MiX and me. I am happy to vote MiX because if it, but my gut says it's something else going on. As no other investigative role had been claimed before MiX claimed, scum!Mix I think would've assumed a good chance I might be one, and so chose as a "fake" target someone else. So I do think I suspect gkrieg here. I could see him worried about rolecop so choosing to claim even night bus driver in case a role cop only saw the bus driver part.

I think WCD likely town based on role (my guess is the bastard aspect of this game with repeating D1s is enough for there not to be other components) as that is usually a town role. While I didn't exactly breadcrumb it, you'll notice that on (second) D1 I never posted any scum read of her because I knew this role.
Title: Re: BM 34: Groundhog's Day Mafia
Post by: Awaclus on January 21, 2022, 10:55:36 am
So wait, is it only day? or only night? Is that typical for neighbors and not just open all the time?

We only have night chat.
Title: Re: BM 34: Groundhog's Day Mafia
Post by: scolapasta on January 21, 2022, 11:00:29 am
So wait, is it only day? or only night? Is that typical for neighbors and not just open all the time?

We only have night chat.

Ah, I had missed that... yesterday was a little busy for me.
Title: Re: BM 34: Groundhog's Day Mafia
Post by: EFHW on January 21, 2022, 12:48:04 pm
What's the flavor for the bus driving? That's normally a scum role.

What do you mean? It just says bus driver (even though I drive a van)

Well usually a mod will tie the power into the character or story. Like my character is a big cheese in the community, so I get an extra vote. How is mixing people up and redirecting their actions represented flavor-wise?
Title: Re: BM 34: Groundhog's Day Mafia
Post by: gkrieg13 on January 21, 2022, 01:14:57 pm
What's the flavor for the bus driving? That's normally a scum role.

What do you mean? It just says bus driver (even though I drive a van)

Well usually a mod will tie the power into the character or story. Like my character is a big cheese in the community, so I get an extra vote. How is mixing people up and redirecting their actions represented flavor-wise?

Did other people get that? Mine has absolutely none of that. Although I am the only VT.
Title: Re: BM 34: Groundhog's Day Mafia
Post by: Galzria on January 21, 2022, 01:17:30 pm
What's the flavor for the bus driving? That's normally a scum role.

What do you mean? It just says bus driver (even though I drive a van)

Well usually a mod will tie the power into the character or story. Like my character is a big cheese in the community, so I get an extra vote. How is mixing people up and redirecting their actions represented flavor-wise?

Did other people get that? Mine has absolutely none of that. Although I am the only VT.

This is interesting to me.

As is MiX being the only action role without an odd/even modifier.

Title: Re: BM 34: Groundhog's Day Mafia
Post by: Swowl on January 21, 2022, 02:17:48 pm
Swowl, do you have anything else that might help us? Did you have a role? Do you know if it still works? Do you know anything about the fact that you were exiled but still here?

No reason not to share some stuff.
I have no clue whatsoever about the mechanics of the game - like why I am alive.
I do not know if I can vote and it counts or anything like that.

I have a role, but I have no idea if it still works. Or will ever work. I am also Even Night only.
Title: Re: BM 34: Groundhog's Day Mafia
Post by: Swowl on January 21, 2022, 02:19:10 pm
Didds - Are you aware or not if your day kill sends us to Night, or does it just go off (and possibly extend the day?)

I have no idea. As you all know, I’m like the very worst person to be a vig. I hate killing my friends.  But I can kill our exile choice if we want to see?

Yeah well that was the thought I had, not sure if it is the best option or not, but yeah...
Title: Re: BM 34: Groundhog's Day Mafia
Post by: Swowl on January 21, 2022, 02:25:52 pm
What's the flavor for the bus driving? That's normally a scum role.

What do you mean? It just says bus driver (even though I drive a van)

Well usually a mod will tie the power into the character or story. Like my character is a big cheese in the community, so I get an extra vote. How is mixing people up and redirecting their actions represented flavor-wise?

Did other people get that? Mine has absolutely none of that. Although I am the only VT.

mine is actually kind of tied in, and then in the flavor role pm it is even like "explained" how it is connected to my role.
Title: Re: BM 34: Groundhog's Day Mafia
Post by: scolapasta on January 21, 2022, 02:37:19 pm
Swowl, do you have anything else that might help us? Did you have a role? Do you know if it still works? Do you know anything about the fact that you were exiled but still here?

No reason not to share some stuff.
I have no clue whatsoever about the mechanics of the game - like why I am alive.
I do not know if I can vote and it counts or anything like that.

I have a role, but I have no idea if it still works. Or will ever work. I am also Even Night only.

Interesting, that doesa give gkrieg a little more credibility on the even night part.
Title: Re: BM 34: Groundhog's Day Mafia
Post by: scolapasta on January 21, 2022, 02:37:38 pm
What's the flavor for the bus driving? That's normally a scum role.

What do you mean? It just says bus driver (even though I drive a van)

Well usually a mod will tie the power into the character or story. Like my character is a big cheese in the community, so I get an extra vote. How is mixing people up and redirecting their actions represented flavor-wise?

Did other people get that? Mine has absolutely none of that. Although I am the only VT.

mine is actually kind of tied in, and then in the flavor role pm it is even like "explained" how it is connected to my role.

Same here.
Title: Re: BM 34: Groundhog's Day Mafia
Post by: WestCoastDidds on January 21, 2022, 04:18:12 pm
We can definitely test how one-shot my shot is. I will shoot whomever Swowl says should be shot, or if he thinks I should shoot whomever we intend to exile.
Title: Re: BM 34: Groundhog's Day Mafia
Post by: Swowl on January 21, 2022, 05:36:15 pm
OK.

Roles that make sense:
1) Math and Awaclus in a Hood - Not saying they are both town, by a long shot, but roles themselves fit.
2) EFHW 1 Shot Double Voter - If Town cannot vote once they are killed, having a double voter def fits in.
3) WCD - 1 Shot Day Vig - Same concept as EFHW, a mechanic to help town catch up. Also could be reversed though if we are missing something. but role makes sense. and there is just no way WCD is lying "about the role" at a minimum.

Roles that kind of make sense:
1) Pasta Odd Night Role Cop - So there is the obv issue with the mix vs pasta claim. Which is not a small thing. But outside of that, it makes sense. It could also be a skum role that is true.
2) GK Even Night Bus Driver - It makes sense in the sense that I have an even night role. That is pretty much all I got on that.
3) Mix Perma Role Blocker - The role itself is off, but so is Even Night shit. Something to note that someone brought up before, is that when Mix Claimed there was only one person left. So it COULD be skum RB... but if it was... you would think that they actually BLOCKED pasta as opposed to just claiming it.
4) Galz Odd Night Doc - In a game with no deaths and no flips on NKs this seems like a role that could potentially exist. It is also outlandish given those parameters, but it is a BM so who knows.

The Mix v Scola thing I *think* is Town v Town and someone messed with Mix. Leaving me at either GK or Galz today.
Title: Re: BM 34: Groundhog's Day Mafia
Post by: gkrieg13 on January 21, 2022, 05:36:33 pm
I think the exile should really be either scola or MiX. Not only do they have conflicting claims, they both have stopped or tried to stop an exile this game, which is the only way we get any information on flips, so it is extremely scummy to do so.
Title: Re: BM 34: Groundhog's Day Mafia
Post by: gkrieg13 on January 21, 2022, 05:39:50 pm

What's the flavor for the bus driving? That's normally a scum role.

What do you mean? It just says bus driver (even though I drive a van)

Well usually a mod will tie the power into the character or story. Like my character is a big cheese in the community, so I get an extra vote. How is mixing people up and redirecting their actions represented flavor-wise?

Did other people get that? Mine has absolutely none of that. Although I am the only VT.

mine is actually kind of tied in, and then in the flavor role pm it is even like "explained" how it is connected to my role.

This is a useless conversation, and a distraction.
Title: Re: BM 34: Groundhog's Day Mafia
Post by: gkrieg13 on January 21, 2022, 05:43:36 pm
I wonder what would happen if we tried to exile swowl again? Not saying we should, though...

I wonder what would happen if we tried to exile swowl again? Not saying we should, though...

I was wondering the same thing. But are we too late in the game? Missing exile first D1 probably ruined this?

I wonder what would happen if we tried to exile swowl again? Not saying we should, though...

I was wondering the same thing. But are we too late in the game? Missing exile first D1 probably ruined this?

Why are so many people bringing up the concept of exiling an IC?
I get it, its a bastard game yeah yeah.... but I would think it is safe to say there is enough going on that assumes to be favoring skum without adding on lies about the flip. Which is outlandish even for a BM.


To be clear, it's not exiling an IC, but exiling an already exiled IC. But yeah, I wasn't actually suggesting we do it, and speculating about it is likely just a waste of time.

Though, it did get some reaction from my (still) top scumread, so maybe that's useful?

These three are the scummy quotes from math and scola, and then the D1 stuff with MiX and math not coming in to hammer scola.
Title: Re: BM 34: Groundhog's Day Mafia
Post by: mathdude on January 21, 2022, 07:02:34 pm
I wonder what would happen if we tried to exile swowl again? Not saying we should, though...

I wonder what would happen if we tried to exile swowl again? Not saying we should, though...

I was wondering the same thing. But are we too late in the game? Missing exile first D1 probably ruined this?

I wonder what would happen if we tried to exile swowl again? Not saying we should, though...

I was wondering the same thing. But are we too late in the game? Missing exile first D1 probably ruined this?

Why are so many people bringing up the concept of exiling an IC?
I get it, its a bastard game yeah yeah.... but I would think it is safe to say there is enough going on that assumes to be favoring skum without adding on lies about the flip. Which is outlandish even for a BM.


To be clear, it's not exiling an IC, but exiling an already exiled IC. But yeah, I wasn't actually suggesting we do it, and speculating about it is likely just a waste of time.

Though, it did get some reaction from my (still) top scumread, so maybe that's useful?

These three are the scummy quotes from math and scola, and then the D1 stuff with MiX and math not coming in to hammer scola.

There's no way I would have said that if I was scum. I try to do everything I can to not bring attention to myself. As town, I feel I more freely share my opinions, even if they may not be as acceptable mainstream.
Title: Re: BM 34: Groundhog's Day Mafia
Post by: mathdude on January 21, 2022, 07:14:15 pm
Regarding roles... as they were being claimed, the odd-night made sense, given multiple D1s. The even-night bus driver claim seemed very fabricated.

But now that Swowl has said his role is even-night, I'm questioning my initial reactions above.

Does anyone in this game know of a way to get out of this loop? I don't know if we publicly need to know how yet, but it seems like it might be helpful to know whether we can.

joth, is it possible to get to D2 in this game while the game is still running?
Title: Re: BM 34: Groundhog's Day Mafia
Post by: Swowl on January 21, 2022, 07:51:19 pm

What's the flavor for the bus driving? That's normally a scum role.

What do you mean? It just says bus driver (even though I drive a van)

Well usually a mod will tie the power into the character or story. Like my character is a big cheese in the community, so I get an extra vote. How is mixing people up and redirecting their actions represented flavor-wise?

Did other people get that? Mine has absolutely none of that. Although I am the only VT.

mine is actually kind of tied in, and then in the flavor role pm it is even like "explained" how it is connected to my role.

This is a useless conversation, and a distraction.

You are the one that made it a topic of interest.
Title: Re: BM 34: Groundhog's Day Mafia
Post by: MiX on January 21, 2022, 07:52:38 pm
This is a useless conversation, and a distraction.

You are the one that made it a topic of interest.

Not on purpose though.

Regarding roles... as they were being claimed, the odd-night made sense, given multiple D1s. The even-night bus driver claim seemed very fabricated.

But now that Swowl has said his role is even-night, I'm questioning my initial reactions above.

Does anyone in this game know of a way to get out of this loop? I don't know if we publicly need to know how yet, but it seems like it might be helpful to know whether we can.

joth, is it possible to get to D2 in this game while the game is still running?

We massclaimed already, so it seems no one knows a way out. So let's keep flipping players.
Title: Re: BM 34: Groundhog's Day Mafia
Post by: Swowl on January 21, 2022, 07:54:08 pm
GK you f it’s mix or pasta for you - which one and why?
Title: Re: BM 34: Groundhog's Day Mafia
Post by: WestCoastDidds on January 21, 2022, 08:13:45 pm
The Mix v Scola thing I *think* is Town v Town and someone messed with Mix. Leaving me at either GK or Galz today.

I agree with this
Title: Re: BM 34: Groundhog's Day Mafia
Post by: gkrieg13 on January 21, 2022, 08:28:16 pm
GK you f it’s mix or pasta for you - which one and why?

I think MiX is scummier, and the claim is scummier, which is why I'm voting MiX. I think there is very little chance they are both town.
Title: Re: BM 34: Groundhog's Day Mafia
Post by: mathdude on January 21, 2022, 08:33:46 pm
Awaclus and I had chat about during N0. Could/did anyone else use actions N0?

And once Day 1 is gone, you can’t get it back!

I'm going to press X to doubt here.

Technically, this statement should always be true. But it was obviously meant to either impart or obscure some meaning here. I'm almost now reading this to say we may get out of the loop at some point. But I'm wondering if that might not happen until game over... otherwise, I wonder if we can get to D2 during the game, might we get stuck there? This could give even night roles some use?
Title: Re: BM 34: Groundhog's Day Mafia
Post by: MiX on January 21, 2022, 08:41:50 pm
This is a bastard game, right? I would be more surprised if the even-night roles could do anything at all in practice than not.
Title: Re: BM 34: Groundhog's Day Mafia
Post by: Swowl on January 21, 2022, 11:36:29 pm
GK you f it’s mix or pasta for you - which one and why?

I think MiX is scummier, and the claim is scummier, which is why I'm voting MiX. I think there is very little chance they are both town.

So MiX fake claimed RB and faked a target on the only person not to have yet claimed (other than me)... he took that risk why in your mind?
Title: Re: BM 34: Groundhog's Day Mafia
Post by: Swowl on January 21, 2022, 11:53:34 pm
I think the exile should really be either scola or MiX. Not only do they have conflicting claims, they both have stopped or tried to stop an exile this game, which is the only way we get any information on flips, so it is extremely scummy to do so.

Day 1 it was going to be MiX or Swowl. Here is the 2 hour out VC:

MiX (3): gkrieg13, mathdude, Awaclus
Swowl (3): Galzria, WestCoastDidds, EFHW
scolapasta (1): MiX
Awaclus (1): Swowl
mathdude (1): scolapasta

Then Pasta votes for MiX.

Then, here is the final VC:
MiX (4): gkrieg13, mathdude, Awaclus, Swowl
Swowl (4): Galzria, WestCoastDidds, EFHW, scolapasta
scolapasta (1): MiX

A) Pasta and MiX are not skum together. Or they are, but not entertaining the idea.
B) I am Town.

MiX:
1) MiX not going to vote himself.
2) If MiX is Skum, since I am town, it is not so much withholding info... that is skum choosing to not hammer town with a hand it to me on a silver plate excuse to do so.

Pasta:
1) Pasta got on the MiX wagon.
2) Pasta voiced he would move to me to get exile off, and then followed through by voting for me.


Day 2 - Both of them were on my wagon... which is the only flip we have.


How does any of that add up to "they have both stopped or tried to stop getting an exile through this game"?

Title: Re: BM 34: Groundhog's Day Mafia
Post by: Swowl on January 21, 2022, 11:57:22 pm
Could everyone please weigh in on the MiX v Pasta thing when you have a chance. There are still a couple that have not voiced opinions.
Title: Re: BM 34: Groundhog's Day Mafia
Post by: Swowl on January 21, 2022, 11:58:34 pm
We also need to have enough time to coordinate a good way to determine if everyone can vote, or if they can't and if not, then who can't. Which is actually, surprisingly, kind of easy enough. But we need time to do it, so everyone should get their piece in asap
Title: Re: BM 34: Groundhog's Day Mafia
Post by: EFHW on January 22, 2022, 05:00:47 am

What's the flavor for the bus driving? That's normally a scum role.

What do you mean? It just says bus driver (even though I drive a van)

Well usually a mod will tie the power into the character or story. Like my character is a big cheese in the community, so I get an extra vote. How is mixing people up and redirecting their actions represented flavor-wise?

Did other people get that? Mine has absolutely none of that. Although I am the only VT.

mine is actually kind of tied in, and then in the flavor role pm it is even like "explained" how it is connected to my role.

This is a useless conversation, and a distraction.

No it isn't. You have claimed a scummy role. I was giving you a chance to show that joth had given it a town spin somehow.
Title: Re: BM 34: Groundhog's Day Mafia
Post by: EFHW on January 22, 2022, 05:05:19 am
I think the exile should really be either scola or MiX. Not only do they have conflicting claims, they both have stopped or tried to stop an exile this game, which is the only way we get any information on flips, so it is extremely scummy to do so.
You are scumreading them because of the no exile? Everyone carries responsibility for that, including you. Why single them out? How else did they try to stop an exile?
Title: Re: BM 34: Groundhog's Day Mafia
Post by: EFHW on January 22, 2022, 05:09:31 am
The Mix v Scola thing I *think* is Town v Town and someone messed with Mix. Leaving me at either GK or Galz today.

I agree with this

Same. gkrieg has joined Galz at the top of my scum list.
Title: Re: BM 34: Groundhog's Day Mafia
Post by: mathdude on January 22, 2022, 08:28:36 am
The Mix v Scola thing I *think* is Town v Town and someone messed with Mix. Leaving me at either GK or Galz today.

Why do some of you think it's TvT?
And then if someone messed with MiX (why couldn't they have also/instead messed with scola?)... why does that leave you at gk or Galz? I get that gk could be lying about the even-night (and figured in BM he could get away with claiming a scummy role as scum).

But I think we have to resolve this MiX and Scola thing. How does Galz factor in?
Title: Re: BM 34: Groundhog's Day Mafia
Post by: EFHW on January 22, 2022, 08:56:38 am
The Mix v Scola thing I *think* is Town v Town and someone messed with Mix. Leaving me at either GK or Galz today.

Why do some of you think it's TvT?
And then if someone messed with MiX (why couldn't they have also/instead messed with scola?)... why does that leave you at gk or Galz? I get that gk could be lying about the even-night (and figured in BM he could get away with claiming a scummy role as scum).

But I think we have to resolve this MiX and Scola thing. How does Galz factor in?

Galz and gkrieg are scummier than scola and MiX. What's the urgency to figure out scola v. MiX?
Title: Re: BM 34: Groundhog's Day Mafia
Post by: EFHW on January 22, 2022, 08:58:21 am
gkrieg and math are both pushing resolving the 1:1 problem. That feels like manufactured urgency to me and therefore scummy.
Title: Re: BM 34: Groundhog's Day Mafia
Post by: WestCoastDidds on January 22, 2022, 09:12:03 am
The Mix v Scola thing I *think* is Town v Town and someone messed with Mix. Leaving me at either GK or Galz today.

Why do some of you think it's TvT?
And then if someone messed with MiX (why couldn't they have also/instead messed with scola?)... why does that leave you at gk or Galz? I get that gk could be lying about the even-night (and figured in BM he could get away with claiming a scummy role as scum).

But I think we have to resolve this MiX and Scola thing. How does Galz factor in?

This reads super scummy to me. Why is math pushing a 1v1 when Swowl and others have reasons they suspect it is two town? The deliberate “why do you think that” when there are explanations/questions regarding the timing of their claims (why would scumMiX fake claim an action on the only person left to claim, why would scumScola set up a 1v1 purposefully) feels disingenuous to me. Deflecting attention from Galz just adds to that.

I’m seeing the game as three pools right now:
Scum Pond
Galz
Gkrieg
Math

Indeterminate waters
MiX
Scola
Awaclus

Soothing town fountain
Swowl
EFHW
WCD
Title: Re: BM 34: Groundhog's Day Mafia
Post by: MiX on January 22, 2022, 09:18:18 am
I don't understand why people are not going for the 1v1. Last time this happened town lost horribly by making the worst possible exiles, since the 1v1 threw everyone off. Just kill scola, if he flips scum then we know what happened, otherwise we can talk. We have a dayvig, we can take risks. Flipping gkrieg or Galzria and no one else is just avoiding hard decisions.
Title: Re: BM 34: Groundhog's Day Mafia
Post by: gkrieg13 on January 22, 2022, 10:11:30 am

What's the flavor for the bus driving? That's normally a scum role.

What do you mean? It just says bus driver (even though I drive a van)

Well usually a mod will tie the power into the character or story. Like my character is a big cheese in the community, so I get an extra vote. How is mixing people up and redirecting their actions represented flavor-wise?

Did other people get that? Mine has absolutely none of that. Although I am the only VT.

mine is actually kind of tied in, and then in the flavor role pm it is even like "explained" how it is connected to my role.

This is a useless conversation, and a distraction.

No it isn't. You have claimed a scummy role. I was giving you a chance to show that joth had given it a town spin somehow.

It is talking about wording of a role description, which is essentially why quoting mod provided stuff is not allowed.
Title: Re: BM 34: Groundhog's Day Mafia
Post by: gkrieg13 on January 22, 2022, 10:12:41 am
I don't understand why people are not going for the 1v1. Last time this happened town lost horribly by making the worst possible exiles, since the 1v1 threw everyone off. Just kill scola, if he flips scum then we know what happened, otherwise we can talk. We have a dayvig, we can take risks. Flipping gkrieg or Galzria and no one else is just avoiding hard decisions.

This is what I’m thinking. Especially since MiX and pasta had to both be alive N1.
Title: Re: BM 34: Groundhog's Day Mafia
Post by: gkrieg13 on January 22, 2022, 10:14:39 am
gkrieg and math are both pushing resolving the 1:1 problem. That feels like manufactured urgency to me and therefore scummy.

It’s not at all manufactured urgency. You are pushing a wild theory that it is town v town with MiX and pasta, which requires a crazy night action resolution, instead of just assuming one of them is lying about their role.
Title: Re: BM 34: Groundhog's Day Mafia
Post by: gkrieg13 on January 22, 2022, 10:16:01 am
The Mix v Scola thing I *think* is Town v Town and someone messed with Mix. Leaving me at either GK or Galz today.

I agree with this

Same. gkrieg has joined Galz at the top of my scum list.

Why?
Title: Re: BM 34: Groundhog's Day Mafia
Post by: gkrieg13 on January 22, 2022, 10:18:31 am
GK you f it’s mix or pasta for you - which one and why?

I think MiX is scummier, and the claim is scummier, which is why I'm voting MiX. I think there is very little chance they are both town.

So MiX fake claimed RB and faked a target on the only person not to have yet claimed (other than me)... he took that risk why in your mind?

I think you’re right. It makes more sense that scola just messed up their claim.
Title: Re: BM 34: Groundhog's Day Mafia
Post by: EFHW on January 22, 2022, 10:20:52 am
The Mix v Scola thing I *think* is Town v Town and someone messed with Mix. Leaving me at either GK or Galz today.

I agree with this

Same. gkrieg has joined Galz at the top of my scum list.

Why?
Scummy role, Complaining about flavor question.  Pushing 1:1. Aggressive tone.
Title: Re: BM 34: Groundhog's Day Mafia
Post by: EFHW on January 22, 2022, 10:22:17 am
Didds, What happens to the day if you dayvig? If we can have a vig and an exile we can address both questions.
Title: Re: BM 34: Groundhog's Day Mafia
Post by: WestCoastDidds on January 22, 2022, 11:03:21 am
Didds, What happens to the day if you dayvig? If we can have a vig and an exile we can address both questions.

I don’t know,  it I can ask.
Title: Re: BM 34: Groundhog's Day Mafia
Post by: WestCoastDidds on January 22, 2022, 11:05:48 am
I asked Joth in discord about the shot. I’ll report back when I know more!
Title: Re: BM 34: Groundhog's Day Mafia
Post by: Awaclus on January 22, 2022, 11:09:50 am
What's the vote count?
Title: Re: BM 34: Groundhog's Day Mafia
Post by: mathdude on January 22, 2022, 11:19:57 am
The Mix v Scola thing I *think* is Town v Town and someone messed with Mix. Leaving me at either GK or Galz today.

Why do some of you think it's TvT?
And then if someone messed with MiX (why couldn't they have also/instead messed with scola?)... why does that leave you at gk or Galz? I get that gk could be lying about the even-night (and figured in BM he could get away with claiming a scummy role as scum).

But I think we have to resolve this MiX and Scola thing. How does Galz factor in?

Galz and gkrieg are scummier than scola and MiX. What's the urgency to figure out scola v. MiX?

There is a clear discrepancy. I'm not saying we exile one of them. I think it's very possible it was actually gk who caused the shenanigans. But at this point, I don't see why we would exile outside those 3.

I get that Galz' claim (timing, word choices) looks scummy. But unless Swowl counterclaims Doctor, the roles we have look standard enough that having a Doctor makes sense for Town. So I don't think that's the Exile for today.

PPE 11... started this post earlier today, forgot to hit post
Title: Re: BM 34: Groundhog's Day Mafia
Post by: mathdude on January 22, 2022, 11:36:53 am
gkrieg and math are both pushing resolving the 1:1 problem. That feels like manufactured urgency to me and therefore scummy.

Have you now added MiX to your scummy list?
As has been said recently - with vig plus potentially exile too, why would we not try to sort out this 1v1-ish?
Title: Re: BM 34: Groundhog's Day Mafia
Post by: EFHW on January 22, 2022, 01:37:55 pm
gkrieg and math are both pushing resolving the 1:1 problem. That feels like manufactured urgency to me and therefore scummy.

Have you now added MiX to your scummy list?
As has been said recently - with vig plus potentially exile too, why would we not try to sort out this 1v1-ish?

I'm saying the the apparent urgency attached to resolving it seems artificial. Obviously it will need to be resolved somehow. MiX is one of the two parties in question, so his agenda seems less scummy.
Title: Re: BM 34: Groundhog's Day Mafia
Post by: mathdude on January 22, 2022, 01:59:49 pm
I'm going to go ahead and
Vote: scola

I want to vote MiX and have him be scum so I can say I was right D1. But at this point, my gut is telling me it's probably scola.

I know we have no idea how joth would set up roles in a game, let alone BM. But Rolecop feels like it could be scum even in this game, just like Bus Driver could be. The claiming last meant he didn't need to guess any roles, even if the claim is a lie. And if it is his role and he got blocked last night, claiming a result gives him a chance (1v1)  at exiling our RBer.
Title: Re: BM 34: Groundhog's Day Mafia
Post by: mathdude on January 22, 2022, 02:10:42 pm
Math - Hood with Awaclus
Awaclus - Hood with Math
EFHW - 1 Shot Double Voter (Day use? Night use?)
WCD - One Shot Day Vig
GK - Even Night Bus Driver
MiX - Roleblocker - Scola N1, Mathdue *N2 --- conflicts with pastas claim.
Pasta - Odd Night Role Cop - WCD N1, Math N2

For the * on MiX... shouldn't it be N1 that conflicts with Scola?

Also, scola could have been the killer N1 and that's why there was no death. It means the Doctor didn't necessarily prevent both nights, as was Galz's initial thought.
Title: Re: BM 34: Groundhog's Day Mafia
Post by: MiX on January 22, 2022, 02:51:29 pm
I don't think the lack of flips is due to my roleblocking. It doesn't make sense in the theme of this game to have nightly flips. Although given scola's claim, I did probably block the N1 kill.
Title: Re: BM 34: Groundhog's Day Mafia
Post by: WestCoastDidds on January 22, 2022, 04:56:22 pm
Answer to how the dayvig works! The kill happens and the day resets.
Title: Re: BM 34: Groundhog's Day Mafia
Post by: gkrieg13 on January 22, 2022, 05:11:25 pm
gkrieg and math are both pushing resolving the 1:1 problem. That feels like manufactured urgency to me and therefore scummy.

Have you now added MiX to your scummy list?
As has been said recently - with vig plus potentially exile too, why would we not try to sort out this 1v1-ish?

I'm saying the the apparent urgency attached to resolving it seems artificial. Obviously it will need to be resolved somehow. MiX is one of the two parties in question, so his agenda seems less scummy.

I mean, there is likely 6 people actually alive with 2 scum, so we are at MyXo, so it is not really artificial.
Title: Re: BM 34: Groundhog's Day Mafia
Post by: gkrieg13 on January 22, 2022, 05:12:24 pm
vote: scola

What swowl said made me rethink, and I think it is more likely that scola is the scum in this situation.
Title: Re: BM 34: Groundhog's Day Mafia
Post by: gkrieg13 on January 22, 2022, 05:22:53 pm
The Mix v Scola thing I *think* is Town v Town and someone messed with Mix. Leaving me at either GK or Galz today.

I agree with this

Same. gkrieg has joined Galz at the top of my scum list.

Why?
Scummy role, Complaining about flavor question.  Pushing 1:1. Aggressive tone.

The role matches up with Swowl's role (being even-night, basically a VT).

I'm complaining about the nature of the flavor question. It is saying that either the mod did not include flavor information in one of the roles, or in a fakeclaim, both of which I have no control over and are questioning the wording of my QT.

Already addressed above, but I don't understand why it is scummy for pushing a 1v1 when we are at either MyLo or Xlo (if Didds vigs).

The aggressive tone is because of the second point, mainly. I really don't like that I'm being called scummy because of the wording of my QT.
Title: Re: BM 34: Groundhog's Day Mafia
Post by: mathdude on January 22, 2022, 06:24:12 pm
Answer to how the dayvig works! The kill happens and the day resets.

If we are at 6, with 2 scum (which I think is worst case right now), the move is usually no exile. Because a misexile lets scum night-kill to get to 2-2 which is likely a win. No exile lets scum being it to 3-2 and still have a chance the next day.

But if the day resets, then we can bring it to 4-1 or 3-2 and a new day, both of which are probably better than where we're at right now anyway.

So I think day-vig is the way to go.

Of course, with the potentials of RB and doctor, numbers aren't quite so clear-cut. But it's probably still our best move. Confirm a role and reset the day so we can start testing voting patterns.

Unvote

I still think scola could be killed today though.
Title: Re: BM 34: Groundhog's Day Mafia
Post by: mathdude on January 22, 2022, 06:25:46 pm
joth, will we be informed every time someone dies this game?
Title: Re: BM 34: Groundhog's Day Mafia
Post by: Galzria on January 22, 2022, 07:33:17 pm
It’s worth noting that scum will likely be pushing to exile town that they HAVEN’T targeted at night  previously to kill (1. We don’t even know if they ARE exiable and 2. If they aren’t, scum wouldn’t want to give us the information of who they’ve targeted.).
Title: Re: BM 34: Groundhog's Day Mafia
Post by: MiX on January 22, 2022, 08:18:35 pm
Answer to how the dayvig works! The kill happens and the day resets.

Whaaaaat! That's so bastard!

Oh wait.
Title: Re: BM 34: Groundhog's Day Mafia
Post by: scolapasta on January 22, 2022, 09:49:13 pm
Hi all, busy day for me, but let me comment on some posts:

I think the exile should really be either scola or MiX. Not only do they have conflicting claims, they both have stopped or tried to stop an exile this game, which is the only way we get any information on flips, so it is extremely scummy to do so.

So this was already responded to more eloquently by Swowl in post 454, but HUH??




What's the flavor for the bus driving? That's normally a scum role.

What do you mean? It just says bus driver (even though I drive a van)

Well usually a mod will tie the power into the character or story. Like my character is a big cheese in the community, so I get an extra vote. How is mixing people up and redirecting their actions represented flavor-wise?

Did other people get that? Mine has absolutely none of that. Although I am the only VT.

mine is actually kind of tied in, and then in the flavor role pm it is even like "explained" how it is connected to my role.

This is a useless conversation, and a distraction.

At first I disagreed with this, but you know it sort of is. Mostly because I do believe the bus driver claim.



There's no way I would have said that if I was scum. I try to do everything I can to not bring attention to myself. As town, I feel I more freely share my opinions, even if they may not be as acceptable mainstream.

The bold part is meaningless. I mean sure as scum, you often try not to bring attention, but a) sometimes you mix it up purposefully, and b) sometimes you might mess up and then this is a "convenient" excuse.



Regarding roles... as they were being claimed, the odd-night made sense, given multiple D1s. The even-night bus driver claim seemed very fabricated.

But now that Swowl has said his role is even-night, I'm questioning my initial reactions above.

Does anyone in this game know of a way to get out of this loop? I don't know if we publicly need to know how yet, but it seems like it might be helpful to know whether we can.

joth, is it possible to get to D2 in this game while the game is still running?

I went through the same thought process - even night is weird, but then swowl, our IC is even night, so it's not impossible. But of course, this is the pefect kind of thing to post here by mathdude to try to look like he's helping town.

Add to that all the questions to mod seem, I don't know, trying to also look purposefully towny.



I've suspected mathdude since (first) D1 for some reason. His posts continue to ping me. BUT...

I do think my vote for today should be based on the 1v1. And I really don't currently read MiX as scum (mostly because I don't see him taking the risk and saying he blocked me). So I still see it as gkrieg bus driving us (and actually being odd day)

Vote: gkrieg

Title: Re: BM 34: Groundhog's Day Mafia
Post by: scolapasta on January 22, 2022, 09:50:30 pm
It’s worth noting that scum will likely be pushing to exile town that they HAVEN’T targeted at night  previously to kill (1. We don’t even know if they ARE exiable and 2. If they aren’t, scum wouldn’t want to give us the information of who they’ve targeted.).

This is a good post. And it's quite towny in a way that wasn't obvious to me and doesn't feel like scum trying to be towny.
Title: Re: BM 34: Groundhog's Day Mafia
Post by: mathdude on January 23, 2022, 12:25:09 am
There's no way I would have said that if I was scum. I try to do everything I can to not bring attention to myself. As town, I feel I more freely share my opinions, even if they may not be as acceptable mainstream.

The bold part is meaningless. I mean sure as scum, you often try not to bring attention, but a) sometimes you mix it up purposefully, and b) sometimes you might mess up and then this is a "convenient" excuse.

If you're going to claim it's meaningless, at least state that my self-awareness of it makes the statement less effective of an argument. Through self-awareness, I could then do exactly what I "would never do" as scum, then claim I would never do it.

Yes, scum can mess up on strategy.  But really... discussing the possibility of re-exiling what is as close to a confirmed townie as we can get?  It's discussion to try and figure out this game.  It's getting thoughts out there.

Regarding roles... as they were being claimed, the odd-night made sense, given multiple D1s. The even-night bus driver claim seemed very fabricated.

But now that Swowl has said his role is even-night, I'm questioning my initial reactions above.

Does anyone in this game know of a way to get out of this loop? I don't know if we publicly need to know how yet, but it seems like it might be helpful to know whether we can.

joth, is it possible to get to D2 in this game while the game is still running?

I went through the same thought process - even night is weird, but then swowl, our IC is even night, so it's not impossible. But of course, this is the pefect kind of thing to post here by mathdude to try to look like he's helping town.

Add to that all the questions to mod seem, I don't know, trying to also look purposefully towny.

You thought it but didn't say it, so that means we should believe you're town.  I thought it and said it, so that makes me scum trying to look like town?  I get that you have a "math is scum"-filter that you're wearing, but this really is a stretch.

And all the questions to the mod to seem "purposefully towny"... yes, that's exactly what I'm doing.  No, I'm actually trying to see how much useful information we can get from the mod, because that might help us solve things.

I've suspected mathdude since (first) D1 for some reason. His posts continue to ping me.

You are either scum really sticking to your guns.  Or you're a very sadly mistaken town, who will obviously not let this up until either I die or the game ends and you realize you've been wrong this whole game.
Title: Re: BM 34: Groundhog's Day Mafia
Post by: scolapasta on January 23, 2022, 11:40:19 am
There's no way I would have said that if I was scum. I try to do everything I can to not bring attention to myself. As town, I feel I more freely share my opinions, even if they may not be as acceptable mainstream.

The bold part is meaningless. I mean sure as scum, you often try not to bring attention, but a) sometimes you mix it up purposefully, and b) sometimes you might mess up and then this is a "convenient" excuse.

If you're going to claim it's meaningless, at least state that my self-awareness of it makes the statement less effective of an argument. Through self-awareness, I could then do exactly what I "would never do" as scum, then claim I would never do it.

That is what I meant by (a).



Yes, scum can mess up on strategy.  But really... discussing the possibility of re-exiling what is as close to a confirmed townie as we can get?  It's discussion to try and figure out this game.  It's getting thoughts out there.

I wasn't discussing the specific merits of what you said, just the "There's no way I would have said that if I was scum" part.



Regarding roles... as they were being claimed, the odd-night made sense, given multiple D1s. The even-night bus driver claim seemed very fabricated.

But now that Swowl has said his role is even-night, I'm questioning my initial reactions above.

Does anyone in this game know of a way to get out of this loop? I don't know if we publicly need to know how yet, but it seems like it might be helpful to know whether we can.

joth, is it possible to get to D2 in this game while the game is still running?

I went through the same thought process - even night is weird, but then swowl, our IC is even night, so it's not impossible. But of course, this is the pefect kind of thing to post here by mathdude to try to look like he's helping town.

Add to that all the questions to mod seem, I don't know, trying to also look purposefully towny.

You thought it but didn't say it, so that means we should believe you're town.  I thought it and said it, so that makes me scum trying to look like town?  I get that you have a "math is scum"-filter that you're wearing, but this really is a stretch.

I wasn't trying to make any kind of argument for my towni-ness. Just agreeing with you, but then also pointing out that this is something that I think all town probably considered and is the kind of statement the kind scum will try to post to appear towny. But sure, it's also something towny might post. (for an example of somethingI find useful to town, see Glaz's post)



And all the questions to the mod to seem "purposefully towny"... yes, that's exactly what I'm doing.  No, I'm actually trying to see how much useful information we can get from the mod, because that might help us solve things.

So I'll need to find the questions so it'll go in another post, but I guess when I read the questions, my initial reaction was usually, "yeah, joth isn't going to answer this". Doesn't mean it hurts to ask, but I do think asking questions is another thing scum sometimes to appear towny.




I've suspected mathdude since (first) D1 for some reason. His posts continue to ping me.

You are either scum really sticking to your guns.  Or you're a very sadly mistaken town, who will obviously not let this up until either I die or the game ends and you realize you've been wrong this whole game.

Maybe you're right and I'm just tunneling. Several my reasons are things I think scum will do to appear towny, but could, of course, just be legitimately towny.

The fact that you're just a neighbor could be a sign you're just town, as I might have expected two scum PRs. On the other hand, if the town doctors and roleblockers are weakened by the fact that we don't actually know if they worked at night.
Title: Re: BM 34: Groundhog's Day Mafia
Post by: scolapasta on January 23, 2022, 11:53:56 am
OK, so I went back quickly and found 3 questions. Feel free to let me know if I missed any:

Quote
Mr Mod... did Swowl get exiled?

This one is fine and did help, as it had the mod actually edit the post. But to me at least it was clear that Swowl was Ned. I think I said before that the repeating D1's seems bastard enough that there won't be anything else too crazy.


Quote
joth, is it possible to get to D2 in this game while the game is still running?

This one to me seemed pointless to ask -the repeating D1s is the gimmick, so I don't expect the mod to reveal that.

Quote
joth, will we be informed every time someone dies this game?

This one also seemed pointless to ask - again, the whole point of the repeating D1s is that everything seemingly resets so there's no place to tell us about NKs. So it seems an obvious "no", but more likely that joth would just not answer. (and we had had 2 nights without flips - this could mean we got lucky both nks were averted by and doctor saveing and/or roleblocker blocking, but I think that's not likely.)

AND this is one that scum has extra knowledge on, so only a town person would even need to consider asking this.


So, sure, pointless questions doesn't mean scum, but they also don't actually help town in any truly meaninglful way.

Case in point: joth, is mathdude scum?

Title: Re: BM 34: Groundhog's Day Mafia
Post by: EFHW on January 23, 2022, 12:08:10 pm
It’s worth noting that scum will likely be pushing to exile town that they HAVEN’T targeted at night  previously to kill (1. We don’t even know if they ARE exiable and 2. If they aren’t, scum wouldn’t want to give us the information of who they’ve targeted.).

This is a good post. And it's quite towny in a way that wasn't obvious to me and doesn't feel like scum trying to be towny.
This is an interesting post by scola. Looking at all the combinations of scola town/scum, Galz town/scum. Town!scola would be making a specific effort to defend someone who has gotten some pressure but not a lot. Mostly me being noisy, some from Swowl and Didds. Scum!scola could be white knighting town!Galz or protecting scumpartner!Galz, though kind of too blatantly to be likely, except WIFOM.

Then there's Galz's post to consider. Scum could prefer to exile someone already dead because we wouldn't have time to scramble up a new exile and town wouldn't get a flip. And then it's not one of them. The information about who has been nk'd isn't all that valuable and not a bad trade for a no exile. Finally, trying to avoid some town exiles narrows the focus, making a scum exile more likely.  Galz also doesn't follow up with any implications of his point for scumhunting. This does sound like something scum would consider while looking for a voting strategy, but I doubt it would be at all significant or discernible in their play. This fits right into my belief that Galz is scum..
Title: Re: BM 34: Groundhog's Day Mafia
Post by: gkrieg13 on January 23, 2022, 12:15:47 pm
Hi all, busy day for me, but let me comment on some posts:

I think the exile should really be either scola or MiX. Not only do they have conflicting claims, they both have stopped or tried to stop an exile this game, which is the only way we get any information on flips, so it is extremely scummy to do so.

So this was already responded to more eloquently by Swowl in post 454, but HUH??

My point is that even though they avoid an exile, if they know that there are going to not be flips, except on exile, and that town won't even know they are dead, it would be worth it to avoid a town exile.



What's the flavor for the bus driving? That's normally a scum role.

What do you mean? It just says bus driver (even though I drive a van)

Well usually a mod will tie the power into the character or story. Like my character is a big cheese in the community, so I get an extra vote. How is mixing people up and redirecting their actions represented flavor-wise?

Did other people get that? Mine has absolutely none of that. Although I am the only VT.

mine is actually kind of tied in, and then in the flavor role pm it is even like "explained" how it is connected to my role.

This is a useless conversation, and a distraction.

At first I disagreed with this, but you know it sort of is. Mostly because I do believe the bus driver claim.

It's just obviously not a fakeclaim I would make as scum.

Regarding roles... as they were being claimed, the odd-night made sense, given multiple D1s. The even-night bus driver claim seemed very fabricated.

But now that Swowl has said his role is even-night, I'm questioning my initial reactions above.

Does anyone in this game know of a way to get out of this loop? I don't know if we publicly need to know how yet, but it seems like it might be helpful to know whether we can.

joth, is it possible to get to D2 in this game while the game is still running?

I went through the same thought process - even night is weird, but then swowl, our IC is even night, so it's not impossible. But of course, this is the pefect kind of thing to post here by mathdude to try to look like he's helping town.

Add to that all the questions to mod seem, I don't know, trying to also look purposefully towny.

This is something math tends to do as scum, things that look townie, but don't really benefit town.

I've suspected mathdude since (first) D1 for some reason. His posts continue to ping me. BUT...

I do think my vote for today should be based on the 1v1. And I really don't currently read MiX as scum (mostly because I don't see him taking the risk and saying he blocked me). So I still see it as gkrieg bus driving us (and actually being odd day)

Vote: gkrieg

Consider that Swowl had not claimed when I claimed, or even when I was defending my claim. He is also even-night, essentially a VT. So I would have had to just decide that even-night was a clever thing in this game, without knowing about the singular even-night role (Swowl's in this hypothetical).

PPEs
Title: Re: BM 34: Groundhog's Day Mafia
Post by: mathdude on January 23, 2022, 12:52:08 pm
Regarding roles... as they were being claimed, the odd-night made sense, given multiple D1s. The even-night bus driver claim seemed very fabricated.

But now that Swowl has said his role is even-night, I'm questioning my initial reactions above.

Does anyone in this game know of a way to get out of this loop? I don't know if we publicly need to know how yet, but it seems like it might be helpful to know whether we can.

joth, is it possible to get to D2 in this game while the game is still running?

I went through the same thought process - even night is weird, but then swowl, our IC is even night, so it's not impossible. But of course, this is the pefect kind of thing to post here by mathdude to try to look like he's helping town.

Add to that all the questions to mod seem, I don't know, trying to also look purposefully towny.

This is something math tends to do as scum, things that look townie, but don't really benefit town.

Let me correct that for you.

"This is something math tends to do.  Period."

I have apparently done it in some of my recent scum games, because it's apparently what I do.  Things that I post, and questions that I ask, that I think are helpful (whether I'm town or scum)... I'm hearing from the general population that they think it looks scummy.

I disagree.  If I ask 4 questions, even if some seem trivial, yet get 1 helpful answer, then it's still useful to have asked questions.

You can agree to disagree.  But I'm not going to stop doing it.
Title: Re: BM 34: Groundhog's Day Mafia
Post by: scolapasta on January 23, 2022, 03:38:14 pm
This is something math tends to do as scum, things that look townie, but don't really benefit town.

Let me correct that for you.

"This is something math tends to do.  Period."


You get that "this" is "things that look townie, but don't really benefit town"?? :p

Anyway, I'll be away for a while, but back either tonight or in time for deadline tomorrow.
Title: Re: BM 34: Groundhog's Day Mafia
Post by: EFHW on January 23, 2022, 07:42:48 pm
Why aren't people looking more at Galzria? He engineered the Swowl exile!
Title: Re: BM 34: Groundhog's Day Mafia
Post by: gkrieg13 on January 23, 2022, 07:56:43 pm
Why aren't people looking more at Galzria? He engineered the Swowl exile!

I'm fine to look more at galz, especially since he has kind of disappeared after the Swowl exile.
Title: Re: BM 34: Groundhog's Day Mafia
Post by: mathdude on January 23, 2022, 08:13:45 pm
Why aren't people looking more at Galzria? He engineered the Swowl exile!

That sounds like a great topic for next D1.  Why aren't people more interested in finishing this day, and actually figuring out if MiX or scola is lying, or if gkrieg was lying and messed with things?

Why don't we just sort of agree on something, and let the day-vig do the kill?  Then we can loop back and see what info we gain there, and then look into Galz in more detail if needed?

Where is everyone?
Title: Re: BM 34: Groundhog's Day Mafia
Post by: WestCoastDidds on January 23, 2022, 09:28:07 pm
Busy Sunday! But it doesn’t look like anything has been decided?

The deadline is tomorrow.  I teach in the morning, but I should be able to check in.

Swowl, I’m looking at you to direct the shot. Left to my own devices I’m gonna shoot where I’m voting (Galz).
Title: Re: BM 34: Groundhog's Day Mafia
Post by: Swowl on January 23, 2022, 10:22:23 pm
Alright so DL is 9AM my time.
It is currently like 7pm my  time. So I will get stuff out tonight as opposed to the morning to be safe.
Title: Re: BM 34: Groundhog's Day Mafia
Post by: Swowl on January 23, 2022, 10:29:22 pm
My problem with Didds shooting is that if exiling is the only way to establish a flip, that kind of puts us in a rough spot.
Title: Re: BM 34: Groundhog's Day Mafia
Post by: EFHW on January 23, 2022, 10:49:02 pm
My problem with Didds shooting is that if exiling is the only way to establish a flip, that kind of puts us in a rough spot.

I think that is unlikely given that we think the dayvig is there to compensate for a lack of voters. But I also think exile is better if we can manage it, for vca later.

I won't be on at deadline, but will be earlier in the day.
Title: Re: BM 34: Groundhog's Day Mafia
Post by: EFHW on January 23, 2022, 11:01:46 pm
If we have to do the 1:1, I'm leaning towards MiX for low effort.
Title: Re: BM 34: Groundhog's Day Mafia
Post by: Swowl on January 24, 2022, 02:42:36 am
sigh... it seems so lazy to just say shoot galz but I am coming up blank
Title: Re: BM 34: Groundhog's Day Mafia
Post by: Swowl on January 24, 2022, 02:54:27 am
whatever, I have not been phoning this in, been thinking a lot, but ultimately it should be mix, pasta, or galz. 9 person game so there isnt really a hella lot to be gained from VCA but on the off chance we get info out of it those are the best shots. and extremely unfortunately I cannot get over the anti town vibes I am getting from galz this game.

So, if I am choosing the shot it is Galz.

Vote: Galz
Title: Re: BM 34: Groundhog's Day Mafia
Post by: EFHW on January 24, 2022, 10:02:51 am
vote count please!

Joth, will you be around to give us quick vote count feedback on the results of our actions?
Title: Re: BM 34: Groundhog's Day Mafia
Post by: scolapasta on January 24, 2022, 10:26:44 am
So, does no one else read Galz's post as townie in a way scum would not do?
Title: Re: BM 34: Groundhog's Day Mafia
Post by: Galzria on January 24, 2022, 11:03:56 am
Didds, you MUST shoot me here, and hope you’re still alive for it to count -

If scum has successfully killed 1-N1 & 2-N1 (ie. I didn’t block successfully either night, which they know because I claimed my targets), then we are in MyLo. This is why EFHW is pushing for my Exile so incessantly.

My guess is that between the 1:1 situation, there’s actually a NK’d townie - and the reason scum don’t want to let us exile there is that we’ll either hit scum (bad for them), or exile an already NK’d town (which is the same as no-exile, which leads to ExLo tomorrow with the other side of the 1:1 an easy flip), or we find we can’t exile the NK’d townie and instead get the other side of the 1:1.

Either way, we CANNOT mis-exile here or we lose. Didds, if your PR resets the day, I’ll be dead, but we’ll be ExLo instead of game over.
Title: Re: BM 34: Groundhog's Day Mafia
Post by: Galzria on January 24, 2022, 11:06:11 am
Between MiX & Pasta,

Vote: MiX,

But I’m honestly not sure. I’m mostly sus of his claim not having a modifier - but he claimed late and there would be no reason for him not to include it - unless he had information about how the days can change from Odd to Even and wanted to be able to continue to claim use of his PR.
Title: Re: BM 34: Groundhog's Day Mafia
Post by: Galzria on January 24, 2022, 11:08:41 am
My problem with Didds shooting is that if exiling is the only way to establish a flip, that kind of puts us in a rough spot.

I think that is unlikely given that we think the dayvig is there to compensate for a lack of voters. But I also think exile is better if we can manage it, for vca later.

I won't be on at deadline, but will be earlier in the day.

There is no VCA later if I’m mid-exiled, which I’ve pointed out earlier in the day and you’ve conveniently ignored. The game will be over in a Scum win. Didds 100% needs to shoot and reset the day - either hopefully hitting Scum, or at worst putting us into ExLo instead of MyLo.
Title: Re: BM 34: Groundhog's Day Mafia
Post by: scolapasta on January 24, 2022, 11:13:54 am
Can someone remind me again what ExLo and Mylo are? (i.e. what's the difference)
Title: Re: BM 34: Groundhog's Day Mafia
Post by: Galzria on January 24, 2022, 11:18:56 am
Then there's Galz's post to consider. Scum could prefer to exile someone already dead because we wouldn't have time to scramble up a new exile and town wouldn't get a flip. And then it's not one of them. The information about who has been nk'd isn't all that valuable and not a bad trade for a no exile. Finally, trying to avoid some town exiles narrows the focus, making a scum exile more likely.  Galz also doesn't follow up with any implications of his point for scumhunting. This does sound like something scum would consider while looking for a voting strategy, but I doubt it would be at all significant or discernible in their play. This fits right into my belief that Galz is scum..

This is wrong on literally every level.

Bold - Town WOULD effectively get a flip, because they would know that the player in question is town.

Italicized - They would learn this information at the (potential) expense of an Exile, as you say, but that’s not a bad trade for town at all, because it would put us at ExLo tomorrow with another IC along Swowl. Whereas a mis-exile ends the game.

Underlined - You’re right. So scum not advocating for exile within the 1:1 would definitely be making noise about controlling the exile somewhere else to make sure it doesn’t fall on them. Now I wonder who’s been doing that…

Title: Re: BM 34: Groundhog's Day Mafia
Post by: Galzria on January 24, 2022, 11:22:39 am
Can someone remind me again what ExLo and Mylo are? (i.e. what's the difference)

MyLo - 6 Alive, 2 scum: (Mis-Exile and Lose) - if you Exile incorrectly you go to Night with 5 players alive, scum kills one and the game is over because scum controls half the town. In the Case of a no Exile with 6, scum kills at night and the game continues with 5 players the following day in…

ExLo - 5 Alive, 2 scum: (Exile or Lose) - You must Exile correctly in ExLo. A No-Exile results in scum shooting and controlling half the town. A mis-exile ends the game as well.
Title: Re: BM 34: Groundhog's Day Mafia
Post by: Galzria on January 24, 2022, 11:25:04 am
In this case:

We started with 9. Assuming I’ve not blocked a NK:

No Exile 1-D1, Scum NK brings us to 8 Alive.
Exile Swowl on 2-D1, scum NK brings us to 6 Alive.

So we’re likely in MyLo.

However, if WCD can shoot me, and it skips night resetting the day, then we’ll replay with 5 Alive in ExLo.
Title: Re: BM 34: Groundhog's Day Mafia
Post by: Galzria on January 24, 2022, 11:37:29 am
My phone is at 11% - throwing it on the charger and taking a quick shower. I think deadline is in 20 minutes?

Didds - if you get here, you need to shoot me. That’s far preferable to a no-exile, as we’ll hopefully get my flip (and if it doesn’t go through, means you’re either lying scum (unlikely in my book - scum!you doesn’t fake claim that), or a previously NK’d townie, which IC’s you for tomorrow).

The best order of things goes:

Didds shoots scum
Scum-Exile
Didds shoots town
No-Exile
Mis-Exile

Anything above the last option either keeps us in MyLo, or at worst moves to us ExLo. Only the last option should end the game.
Title: Re: BM 34: Groundhog's Day Mafia
Post by: scolapasta on January 24, 2022, 11:38:37 am
OH, I think I missed that WCD shooting resets the day with no night.

Or at least, that's not how I read "reset:" the day, since we've "reset" the day every day this game (i.e. groundhog's day).

Now have to go back and reread to see we have actually confirmed reset means what you think it means.
Title: Re: BM 34: Groundhog's Day Mafia
Post by: scolapasta on January 24, 2022, 11:41:29 am
I guess day resetting without NK is a standard way dayvigs can work?

Because yeah, I definitely did not read it that way.

BUT if it does, I do think WCD clearly should do that to say us from Mylo.

I would vote she shoot gkrieg (or math) instead of Galz, but sounds like she'll listen to swowl. Assuming she logs in in the next 20 minutes.

Would love to see an actual vote count, but I personally have no time for a scolacounta.
Title: Re: BM 34: Groundhog's Day Mafia
Post by: Galzria on January 24, 2022, 11:43:17 am
Answer to how the dayvig works! The kill happens and the day resets.

This is the quote - “Reset” is normally synonymous with “restart”, which is what I took it to mean - although I suppose that could be wrong - In which case shooting me would likely end the game same as exiling me.
Title: Re: BM 34: Groundhog's Day Mafia
Post by: scolapasta on January 24, 2022, 11:48:34 am
Answer to how the dayvig works! The kill happens and the day resets.

This is the quote - “Reset” is normally synonymous with “restart”, which is what I took it to mean - although I suppose that could be wrong - In which case shooting me would likely end the game same as exiling me.

I think you're likely right - since I doubt joth would reveal the groundhog's day mechanic that way. (even if we already discovered it).

So I'm definitely ok with WCD shooting.
Title: Re: BM 34: Groundhog's Day Mafia
Post by: scolapasta on January 24, 2022, 11:57:57 am
How is no one around??? 3 minutes to DL. I don't think there's anything I can do here on my own.
Title: Re: BM 34: Groundhog's Day Mafia
Post by: Galzria on January 24, 2022, 11:59:19 am
How is no one around??? 3 minutes to DL. I don't think there's anything I can do here on my own.

😢
Title: Re: BM 34: Groundhog's Day Mafia
Post by: Galzria on January 24, 2022, 11:59:32 am
Diiiiiiids! Come shoot me!!!!
Title: Re: BM 34: Groundhog's Day Mafia
Post by: scolapasta on January 24, 2022, 11:59:39 am
I mean unless dayvig happens in the discord and so WCD has done her shot and it's just joth not around.

But I'd still think WCD would tell us here.
Title: Re: BM 34: Groundhog's Day Mafia
Post by: Galzria on January 24, 2022, 12:00:04 pm
Diiiiiiiiiiiiiiiiiiiiiids!
Title: Re: BM 34: Groundhog's Day Mafia
Post by: Galzria on January 24, 2022, 12:00:24 pm
I mean unless dayvig happens in the discord and so WCD has done her shot and it's just joth not around.

But I'd still think WCD would tell us here.

Only hope at this point.
Title: Re: BM 34: Groundhog's Day Mafia
Post by: scolapasta on January 24, 2022, 12:03:11 pm
I mean we could be wrong about how NKs happen too. But based on (second) D2 votes, I doubt it. Which means you did not save whoever it was that night, and who knows about last night.
Title: Re: BM 34: Groundhog's Day Mafia
Post by: Galzria on January 24, 2022, 12:05:43 pm
I mean unless dayvig happens in the discord and so WCD has done her shot and it's just joth not around.

But I'd still think WCD would tell us here.

Only hope at this point.

Well, and not only hope. Worst here is just that we no-exiled, which means we’re in ExLo tomorrow with no additional information, but at least the game continues.
Title: Re: BM 34: Groundhog's Day Mafia
Post by: jotheonah on January 24, 2022, 12:12:46 pm
Sorry guys. I had the deadline wrong in my head. But sadly that is THREAD LOCKED. Vote count coming soon.
Title: Re: BM 34: Groundhog's Day Mafia
Post by: jotheonah on January 24, 2022, 12:17:59 pm
Blissfully unaware that the day is repeating, the townspeople do exactly what they did the first day.

No one was exiled.

Vote Count 1.3

Galzria (3): WestCoastDidds, EFHW, Swowl
mathdude (1): Awaclus
scolapasta (2): MiX, gkreig
gkreig (1): scolapasta
MiX (1): Galzria

Not voting (1): mathdude

With 9 alive, it takes 5 to exile.

Night 1 begins now and ends in 48 hours.
Title: Re: BM 34: Groundhog's Day Mafia
Post by: jotheonah on January 26, 2022, 12:20:34 pm
Okay, campers, rise and shine, and don't forget your booties 'cause it's cooooold out there today.

It's coooold out there every day. What is this, Miami Beach?

Not hardly. And you know, you can expect hazardous travel later today with that, you know, that, uh, that blizzard thing.

That blizzard - thing. That blizzard - thing. Oh, well, here's the report! The National Weather Service is calling for a "big blizzard thing!"

Yessss, they are. But you know, there's another reason why today is especially exciting.

Especially cold!

Especially cold, okay, but the big question on everybody's lips...

 - On their chapped lips...

 - On their chapped lips, right: Do ya think Phil is gonna come out and see his shadow?

Punxsutawney Phil!

Thats right, woodchuck-chuckers - it's

GROUNDHOG DAY!


Day 1 Begins Now

Vote Count 1.0

Not voting:  MiX, mathdude, WestCoastDidds, Galzria, scolapasta, Awaclus, EFHW, gkrieg, Swowl

With 9 alive, it takes 5 to exile.

THREAD UNLOCKED

Day 1 begins now and will end one week from today, February 1 at 12:20 pm forum time.
Title: Re: BM 34: Groundhog's Day Mafia
Post by: mathdude on January 26, 2022, 12:22:36 pm
Ok dayvig y u no kill yesterday?
Also, vote: joth
Reason: give us something useful!
Title: Re: BM 34: Groundhog's Day Mafia
Post by: WestCoastDidds on January 26, 2022, 12:55:58 pm
I am SO sorry! We had this kind of huge covid debacle at school that started on Sunday night and got really confusing on Monday and created an onslaught of student email and I *completely* forgot. Like not even an inkling if a memory.

I will shoot whenever ready! I feel more confident that scola’s claim was scummier than MiX, so I’m leaning toward shooting him.
Title: Re: BM 34: Groundhog's Day Mafia
Post by: WestCoastDidds on January 26, 2022, 12:57:52 pm
Actually, let’s just see what happens. It will reset the day so no loss…and I think we’re all kind of weary of this

Dayvig: Scola
Title: Re: BM 34: Groundhog's Day Mafia
Post by: EFHW on January 26, 2022, 12:59:14 pm
I'm very curious to see what happens!
Title: Re: BM 34: Groundhog's Day Mafia
Post by: jotheonah on January 26, 2022, 01:00:21 pm
THREAD LOCKED
Title: Re: BM 34: Groundhog's Day Mafia
Post by: jotheonah on January 26, 2022, 01:09:50 pm
Phil Collins awakens to the unexpected blissful silence of not hearing that same thing on the radio over and over again.

He's done it! He's escaped the loop. And all it took was murdering a lot of people, as a member of the mafia, which he was all along.

Day 2 begins now.

Game Over. The Mafia wins.

Galzria, the Puxsutawney neurologist and odd-night doctor, was killed Night 1.

Swowl, insurance salesman and even-night jailkeeper Ned Ryerson, was exiled Day 1.

Gkrieg, even-night bus driver Larry, was killed Night 1.

EFHW, double voter Buster Green, was killed Night 1.

scolapasta, role cop and producer Rita, was killed Day 1.

mathdude and Awaclus, neighbors/newlyweds Debbie and Fred, were endgamed.

WestCoastDidds, dayvig and weatherman Phil Connors, and MiX, roleblocker and groundhog Puxcatawney Phil, win the game!

THREAD UNLOCKED
Title: Re: BM 34: Groundhog's Day Mafia
Post by: Galzria on January 26, 2022, 01:11:43 pm
Phil Collins

🤣🤣🤣
Title: Re: BM 34: Groundhog's Day Mafia
Post by: jotheonah on January 26, 2022, 01:12:13 pm
So yeah. I mean, two things going on here. One, the setup was more scum-sided than I anticipated and I should have buffed up town more.

But also, town no-exiled twice. Hard to imagine town ever winning a game that way. And scum managed to eliminate town's most powerful role on night 1.

So, you know, you can't blame me for everything.

You were supposed to get half of the flips -- the ones from exiles -- which I thought would give enough info to make the game playable. And scola had a secret secondary ability that would tell him if players were dead if he copped them. But then you guys only ever managed one exile so you only ever got one flip.
Title: Re: BM 34: Groundhog's Day Mafia
Post by: jotheonah on January 26, 2022, 01:12:25 pm
Phil Collins

🤣🤣🤣

Oops. Well, I'm leaving it now.
Title: Re: BM 34: Groundhog's Day Mafia
Post by: Galzria on January 26, 2022, 01:17:35 pm
So yeah. I mean, two things going on here. One, the setup was more scum-sided than I anticipated and I should have buffed up town more.

But also, town no-exiled twice. Hard to imagine town ever winning a game that way. And scum managed to eliminate town's most powerful role on night 1.

So, you know, you can't blame me for everything.

You were supposed to get half of the flips -- the ones from exiles -- which I thought would give enough info to make the game playable. And scola had a secret secondary ability that would tell him if players were dead if he copped them. But then you guys only ever managed one exile so you only ever got one flip.

I actually thought the setup was really inspired and has a TON of potential nuance. In a non-BM more open setup where the general mechanic is known, there’s a lot to play around with here. Clearly throwing away our only known means of obtaining information TWICE was never going to result in a town win.
Title: Re: BM 34: Groundhog's Day Mafia -- GAME OVER, mafia wins flawlessly
Post by: jotheonah on January 26, 2022, 01:20:20 pm
My big regret is that I don't get the feeling the game ended up being particularly fun for anyone involved. So for that, I aopologize.

If I had it to do again, I probably would have instituted a mandatory plurality exile. It honestly didn't occur to me that would be an issue.
Title: Re: BM 34: Groundhog's Day Mafia -- GAME OVER, mafia wins flawlessly
Post by: jotheonah on January 26, 2022, 01:20:44 pm
Also, I really need to have a co-mod. I am awful at giving enough vote counts.
Title: Re: BM 34: Groundhog's Day Mafia -- GAME OVER, mafia wins flawlessly
Post by: scolapasta on January 26, 2022, 01:27:04 pm
Oh wow. At first I was really upset at WCD for just up and dayvigging me so early in the day.... ah, but she was scum, so that explains it.

Yes, this past night, I checked gkrieg and confirmed his claim and that he was dead.

I guess if WCD had dayvigged the day before, we would have made it a little longer, as she woudln't have still had the shot. (did you purposefully not shoot galz since you knew he was already dead? or were you legit busy)

Here's one aspect of my limited experience maybe. Once I learned WCD was dayvig, I assumed she was town because that seems to be a town role. (too powerful for scum to have NK and a day kill)

Overall, I enjoyed the game and loved the repeated D1 setup. (one really nice thing is that it allowed dead people to still participate). I think it's on us that we did not exile first D1 or third D1.
Title: Re: BM 34: Groundhog's Day Mafia -- GAME OVER, mafia wins flawlessly
Post by: jotheonah on January 26, 2022, 01:30:14 pm
Oh yeah, I purposely flaunted expectations. I gave town a rolecop, scum a dayvig, and I made the main character scum.
Title: Re: BM 34: Groundhog's Day Mafia -- GAME OVER, mafia wins flawlessly
Post by: jotheonah on January 26, 2022, 01:30:51 pm
And of course all the even-night roles were just a troll, there was no way to trigger Day 2.
Title: Re: BM 34: Groundhog's Day Mafia -- GAME OVER, mafia wins flawlessly
Post by: scolapasta on January 26, 2022, 01:31:10 pm
It does feel a little scum sided with both the roleblocker and the dayvig.

(I am surprised that Mix didn't block me on the last night)

Town only really had a double voter, a doctor, and a role cop. Neighbors seems basically close to VT (since they're not masons), and Even night as well.

(was there ever anything that was going to get us to D2? I assume not)

Also, if dead, would PRs not work? That was another assumption I had.
Title: Re: BM 34: Groundhog's Day Mafia -- GAME OVER, mafia wins flawlessly
Post by: jotheonah on January 26, 2022, 01:38:30 pm
they wouldn't.

btw, neighbors where both are town was another intentional subversion of expectations. I think every time I've ever done neighbors there's been a scum in the neighborhood.
Title: Re: BM 34: Groundhog's Day Mafia -- GAME OVER, mafia wins flawlessly
Post by: J Reggie on January 26, 2022, 01:46:17 pm
This was a fun read! As I was saying in the speccy, I was sure the lack of exiles was on purpose because of someone's role. It made the second D1 seem even more like a real D1.
Title: Re: BM 34: Groundhog's Day Mafia -- GAME OVER, mafia wins flawlessly
Post by: EFHW on January 26, 2022, 01:54:14 pm
MiX and Didds are our uber-reliable, count on them to vote at deadline players. Makes sense we had trouble exiling, not knowing they weren't motivated as usual.

Good job Didds! You had everyone fooled. Sorry Galzria, gkrieg. I was trying but I was wrong.
Title: Re: BM 34: Groundhog's Day Mafia -- GAME OVER, mafia wins flawlessly
Post by: jotheonah on January 26, 2022, 02:36:05 pm
I do think I succeeded in evoking the feeling of hopelessness and frustration that a real time loop would engender.
Title: Re: BM 34: Groundhog's Day Mafia -- GAME OVER, mafia wins flawlessly
Post by: jotheonah on January 26, 2022, 02:37:25 pm
By the way, With 9 alive, it takes 5 to exile was a lie after Night 1 (the first Night 1). It actually worked like normal, but dead players' votes didn't count and exiling a dead player wouldn't end the day.
Title: Re: BM 34: Groundhog's Day Mafia -- GAME OVER, mafia wins flawlessly
Post by: WestCoastDidds on January 26, 2022, 02:38:16 pm
Oh wow. At first I was really upset at WCD for just up and dayvigging me so early in the day.... ah, but she was scum, so that explains it.

Yes, this past night, I checked gkrieg and confirmed his claim and that he was dead.

I guess if WCD had dayvigged the day before, we would have made it a little longer, as she woudln't have still had the shot. (did you purposefully not shoot galz since you knew he was already dead? or were you legit busy)

Here's one aspect of my limited experience maybe. Once I learned WCD was dayvig, I assumed she was town because that seems to be a town role. (too powerful for scum to have NK and a day kill)

Overall, I enjoyed the game and loved the repeated D1 setup. (one really nice thing is that it allowed dead people to still participate). I think it's on us that we did not exile first D1 or third D1.

I was legit dealing with work emergency crap. I had very intention of following Swowl's directive, and I was beating myself up about it on Monday afternoon and then I got annoyed that ya'll didn't just exile him instead. I was voting so the stagnant part was not my fault.

Excellent work copping me by the way! I am just lucky it was a town role.
Title: Re: BM 34: Groundhog's Day Mafia -- GAME OVER, mafia wins flawlessly
Post by: WestCoastDidds on January 26, 2022, 02:40:53 pm
MiX and Didds are our uber-reliable, count on them to vote at deadline players. Makes sense we had trouble exiling, not knowing they weren't motivated as usual.

Good job Didds! You had everyone fooled. Sorry Galzria, gkrieg. I was trying but I was wrong.

Thank you! I will say that we were as lost as you. There is literally no chat in our QT because we couldn't figure out what the heck was going on, so the confusion was entirely authentic.
Title: Re: BM 34: Groundhog's Day Mafia -- GAME OVER, mafia wins flawlessly
Post by: MiX on January 26, 2022, 02:52:53 pm
I think we won?

That was the least amount of effort I have put in a game. It's also the least amount of effort I've put into the day phase, which is similar to overall, except I expected to think more at night given the nothing I was doing at day.

I screwed up my fakeclaim because I wanted to put scola in the same roleblocker conflict as last game. I knew with my luck he would've known he wasn't roleblocked. Also, I thought my targets were the only justifiable ones.

PPE every post after the reveal.
Title: Re: BM 34: Groundhog's Day Mafia -- GAME OVER, mafia wins flawlessly
Post by: MiX on January 26, 2022, 02:59:44 pm
MiX and Didds are our uber-reliable, count on them to vote at deadline players. Makes sense we had trouble exiling, not knowing they weren't motivated as usual.

Good job Didds! You had everyone fooled. Sorry Galzria, gkrieg. I was trying but I was wrong.

Accurate, although I really wasn't there in D1. In D3, yeah, I was not even slightly motivated to flip anyone, given galzria and gkrieg were already dead (and since we didn't know more than town, we assumed that the consensus of "people are secretly dead" was true).

By the way, With 9 alive, it takes 5 to exile was a lie after Night 1 (the first Night 1). It actually worked like normal, but dead players' votes didn't count and exiling a dead player wouldn't end the day.

Ah, I see. So since we had 8 players alive when Swowl was executed, it still took 5 to exile, but Galzria's vote just didn't count. That makes sense, and I'm kinda disappointed I didn't conclude that somewhere.
Title: Re: BM 34: Groundhog's Day Mafia -- GAME OVER, mafia wins flawlessly
Post by: mathdude on January 26, 2022, 03:39:36 pm
I think we needed more players and a longer game to work out the mechanics here. I get that we failed to exile people a few times, and that was the only way to get info. But even if we were all active enough, it would have been very difficult for Town to win here.

It sure didn't help that Mafia both didn't need to fake claim. But one claims happened, I don't think we stood a chance, especially with both of them still alive. They can kill one during the day and block one of our few PRs each night. I was sure that the DayVig had to be a Town role. Guess i was wrong.

But I should have stuck with my initial thought that MiX was scum, instead of switching over to scola.

Just curious Didds... if majority of us wanted MiX dead, would you have killed him to play for the long endgame? Or would you have come up with some reason not to?
Title: Re: BM 34: Groundhog's Day Mafia -- GAME OVER, mafia wins flawlessly
Post by: WestCoastDidds on January 26, 2022, 03:45:19 pm
I would have killed him!
Title: Re: BM 34: Groundhog's Day Mafia -- GAME OVER, mafia wins flawlessly
Post by: Awaclus on January 26, 2022, 03:52:11 pm
For me, it was just a mistake to sign up for the game knowing that I had the elections, the streams and the World Cup coming. I thought I'd have enough time, and I would have, but my attention was largely elsewhere and I underestimated that.
Title: Re: BM 34: Groundhog's Day Mafia -- GAME OVER, mafia wins flawlessly
Post by: Galzria on January 26, 2022, 04:10:02 pm
I knew with 100% certainty Didds wasn’t lying about her role. And I knew with 100% certainty that she and EFHW weren’t both town. I just really didn’t think Didd’s PR could be scum! 🤣
Title: Re: BM 34: Groundhog's Day Mafia -- GAME OVER, mafia wins flawlessly
Post by: jotheonah on January 26, 2022, 04:14:41 pm
I'm trying to train people not to think that way!
Title: Re: BM 34: Groundhog's Day Mafia -- GAME OVER, mafia wins flawlessly
Post by: gkrieg13 on January 26, 2022, 05:31:59 pm
Thanks for the game everyone!

I feel better knowing MiX was actually scum, I feel like my MiXdar is pretty strong.

I think part of our inability to exile is tied to not wanting to exile early D1 and general fear of putting someone at X-1, which were both exacerbated by the small player count.
Title: Re: BM 34: Groundhog's Day Mafia -- GAME OVER, mafia wins flawlessly
Post by: gkrieg13 on January 26, 2022, 05:36:24 pm
Oh yeah, I purposely flaunted expectations. I gave town a rolecop, scum a dayvig, and I made the main character scum.

I would say giving scum a dayvig is the only thing in there that dramatically tips the game in scum's favor. The other two have to happen sometimes.
Title: Re: BM 34: Groundhog's Day Mafia -- GAME OVER, mafia wins flawlessly
Post by: WestCoastDidds on January 26, 2022, 06:14:55 pm
I knew with 100% certainty Didds wasn’t lying about her role. And I knew with 100% certainty that she and EFHW weren’t both town. I just really didn’t think Didd’s PR could be scum! 🤣

How did you know??
Title: Re: BM 34: Groundhog's Day Mafia -- GAME OVER, mafia wins flawlessly
Post by: Galzria on January 26, 2022, 06:34:54 pm
I knew with 100% certainty Didds wasn’t lying about her role. And I knew with 100% certainty that she and EFHW weren’t both town. I just really didn’t think Didd’s PR could be scum! 🤣

How did you know??

That you weren’t lying? That sort of lie isn’t in your skill set. It’s bold, somewhat checkable, and puts you in a position of having to either prove it, or argue why your inability to do so isn’t scummy. It draws attention in a way scum!you doesn’t like to answer for.

Why couldn’t you both be town? Seemed highly unlikely that town was given two separate day altering abilities, both of which were, in theory, checkable. And if one of those were to be a scum power, it mostly *had* to be EFHW for balance reasons.

As it turns out, wrong, but then that was pretty much the only unbalanced part of this setup.
Title: Re: BM 34: Groundhog's Day Mafia
Post by: Galzria on January 26, 2022, 06:43:22 pm
So yeah. I mean, two things going on here. One, the setup was more scum-sided than I anticipated and I should have buffed up town more.

But also, town no-exiled twice. Hard to imagine town ever winning a game that way. And scum managed to eliminate town's most powerful role on night 1.

So, you know, you can't blame me for everything.

You were supposed to get half of the flips -- the ones from exiles -- which I thought would give enough info to make the game playable. And scola had a secret secondary ability that would tell him if players were dead if he copped them. But then you guys only ever managed one exile so you only ever got one flip.

I actually thought the setup was really inspired and has a TON of potential nuance. In a non-BM more open setup where the general mechanic is known, there’s a lot to play around with here. Clearly throwing away our only known means of obtaining information TWICE was never going to result in a town win.

To expand on this:

I loved the concept of dead players still being able to participate and voice their opinions. I loved the concept behind not knowing who was actually dead. I thought everybody was on the same page with what was going on due to the VC’s - although apparently I was wrong on that. I loved that dead votes still appeared in the VC. I think it opens up a fun nuance on trying to figure out who is alive and who is dead. An exiled town becomes an IC with no vote. An exiled scum … well, who knows what’s optimal to their play? I think the entire setup lends itself to a fantastic version of play with a lot of new, nuanced VCA. Plus the uncertainty of any given player’s PR still being in play or not. Mass claims FEEL like they would significantly help scum more than town, but that’s unclear. I almost want to play a more vanilla game (Rolecop/Goon vs Jailkeeper/Doctor/5 VT) with this setup.
Title: Re: BM 34: Groundhog's Day Mafia -- GAME OVER, mafia wins flawlessly
Post by: MiX on January 26, 2022, 07:39:38 pm
This setup feels really boring for scum. I wanted to kill Galzria because they always catch Didds and would catch me, and then I wanted to kill gkrieg because he woke up and realized I was scum. Except even if they're dead, they get to talk. It felt futile trying to put up an effort when I can't silence the important voices.
Title: Re: BM 34: Groundhog's Day Mafia -- GAME OVER, mafia wins flawlessly
Post by: WestCoastDidds on January 26, 2022, 08:19:46 pm
This setup feels really boring for scum. I wanted to kill Galzria because they always catch Didds and would catch me, and then I wanted to kill gkrieg because he woke up and realized I was scum. Except even if they're dead, they get to talk. It felt futile trying to put up an effort when I can't silence the important voices.

Is that boring? Seems really challenging if we had more flips and were actually doing VCA. But not knowing what was happening with nothing yo help figure it out was a drag.
Title: Re: BM 34: Groundhog's Day Mafia -- GAME OVER, mafia wins flawlessly
Post by: WestCoastDidds on January 26, 2022, 08:20:32 pm
But MiX! I shot Scola! Right off the bat! I figured you’d be pleased. :)
Title: Re: BM 34: Groundhog's Day Mafia -- GAME OVER, mafia wins flawlessly
Post by: J Reggie on January 26, 2022, 08:31:24 pm
I was wondering what would happen if scum were exiled. Would they still be able to post in the thread? What would they say that could help their win condition besides just spamming the thread with off topic stuff?
Title: Re: BM 34: Groundhog's Day Mafia -- GAME OVER, mafia wins flawlessly
Post by: MiX on January 26, 2022, 09:03:13 pm
But MiX! I shot Scola! Right off the bat! I figured you’d be pleased. :)

I was extremely pleased :P
Title: Re: BM 34: Groundhog's Day Mafia -- GAME OVER, mafia wins flawlessly
Post by: scolapasta on January 26, 2022, 09:13:01 pm
But MiX! I shot Scola! Right off the bat! I figured you’d be pleased. :)

I was extremely pleased :P

I was less pleased.
Title: Re: BM 34: Groundhog's Day Mafia -- GAME OVER, mafia wins flawlessly
Post by: jotheonah on January 26, 2022, 09:46:43 pm
the day reset was supposed to weaken the day vig. Like it deprives town of an exile, but scum doesn't get a night kill that night. I maybe should have made it fail at ExLo or MexLo? Eh, I shouldn't have given scum a dayvig at all let's be real.
Title: Re: BM 34: Groundhog's Day Mafia -- GAME OVER, mafia wins flawlessly
Post by: WestCoastDidds on January 26, 2022, 09:57:58 pm
But MiX! I shot Scola! Right off the bat! I figured you’d be pleased. :)

I was extremely pleased :P

I was less pleased.

Entirely fair. But I still ❤️ you
Title: Re: BM 34: Groundhog's Day Mafia -- GAME OVER, mafia wins flawlessly
Post by: WestCoastDidds on January 26, 2022, 10:02:59 pm
That you weren’t lying? That sort of lie isn’t in your skill set. It’s bold, somewhat checkable, and puts you in a position of having to either prove it, or argue why your inability to do so isn’t scummy. It draws attention in a way scum!you doesn’t like to answer for.


A million miles outside my skill set!
Title: Re: BM 34: Groundhog's Day Mafia -- GAME OVER, mafia wins flawlessly
Post by: Swowl on January 27, 2022, 12:55:05 am
I knew with 100% certainty Didds wasn’t lying about her role. And I knew with 100% certainty that she and EFHW weren’t both town. I just really didn’t think Didd’s PR could be scum! 🤣

Gah! Same damn mindset. I was taking so long to get back because original plan was to have didds pop efoo and then if efoo is town exile didds... not that it would of mattered, still would of lost lol

Good game everyone - super interesting set up Joth!
Title: Re: BM 34: Groundhog's Day Mafia -- GAME OVER, mafia wins flawlessly
Post by: Swowl on January 27, 2022, 01:00:33 am
yeah damn... I just never would of got mix like ever this game. well done.
Title: Re: BM 34: Groundhog's Day Mafia -- GAME OVER, mafia wins flawlessly
Post by: EFHW on February 02, 2022, 01:02:30 pm
Happy Groundhog Day :) And it's 2/2/22, too!