Dominion Strategy Forum

Dominion => Variants and Fan Cards => Topic started by: fika monster on May 04, 2021, 03:47:49 am

Title: Fan Card Mechanics Contest week 9: too COOL for school
Post by: fika monster on May 04, 2021, 03:47:49 am
I were looking through Spineflus "atlas of fancard mechanics", and i came across Gazbags "ice token".

What is "ice Tokens"?
A number of cards in the set involve setting aside cards and putting a number of Ice tokens on them, referred to as "freezing" them. At the start of your turn you remove 1 Ice token from each card you own that is frozen with Ice tokens on it and when the last token is removed you put the card into your discard pile.

pretty neat, i think. So  this weeks challenge is to come up with a WELP or card that uses ICE TOKENS.

heres a link to the Dominion: ICE AGE expansion http://forum.dominionstrategy.com/index.php?topic=17996.msg736476#msg736476 (http://forum.dominionstrategy.com/index.php?topic=17996.msg736476#msg736476)

My judging criteria will be:
Simplicity: the cards can be complex, but it should have a purpose. my preference is for simple cards, and i will be biased towards them, altough i will try to be fair.
theme (i like cards that tell a bit of a story)
Balance: is the card utterly broken or too weak? It's fine if the card is strong or centralizing, but agonizing decisions should be possible.
Innovation: Does the card evoke new interesting possibilities? is it exciting?


DEADLINE IS 2021 MAY 9th. timezone is UTC.
Title: Re: Fan Card Mechanics Contest week 9: too COOL for school
Post by: segura on May 04, 2021, 06:51:47 am
(https://i.imgur.com/Oqr26nU.png)

Winter is coming. It is like Stables, but you gotta discard the good stuff and the good stuff cannot be redrawn this turn (this includes Clean-up and thus your next hand).
Title: Re: Fan Card Mechanics Contest week 9: too COOL for school
Post by: naitchman on May 04, 2021, 10:13:19 am
(https://i.imgur.com/Oqr26nU.png)

Winter is coming. It is like Stables, but you gotta discard the good stuff and the good stuff cannot be redrawn this turn (this includes Clean-up and thus your next hand).

I think the word "Once" is unnecessary.
Title: Re: Fan Card Mechanics Contest week 9: too COOL for school
Post by: segura on May 04, 2021, 10:19:58 am
On the contrary, it is absolutely necessary as you can also freeze a card twice, thrice, four times and so on.
Title: Re: Fan Card Mechanics Contest week 9: too COOL for school
Post by: naitchman on May 04, 2021, 10:49:23 am
On the contrary, it is absolutely necessary as you can also freeze a card twice, thrice, four times and so on.

I don't really understand. Can you give a case where 'once' will make difference?

you can't freeze a card twice from your hand since it will not be in your hand anymore. Does it mean 'once' as in you can't freeze with two scouts?
Title: Re: Fan Card Mechanics Contest week 9: too COOL for school
Post by: GendoIkari on May 04, 2021, 10:55:27 am
If "once" is intended to mean "with one ice token", then the latter is the wording used in the actual fan expansion. Igloo says "You may freeze this with 3 Ice tokens".
Title: Re: Fan Card Mechanics Contest week 9: too COOL for school
Post by: naitchman on May 04, 2021, 11:00:43 am
If "once" is intended to mean "with one ice token", then the latter is the wording used in the actual fan expansion. Igloo says "You may freeze this with 3 Ice tokens".

You are probably right. I did not even notice that it did not say how many ice tokens.
Title: Re: Fan Card Mechanics Contest week 9: too COOL for school
Post by: DunnoItAll on May 04, 2021, 11:31:27 am
(https://i.imgur.com/MuPrrRg.png)

Having messed with this mechanic a lot (we play games with the Ice Age expansion a lot, I have implemented this mechanic in my own expansions), one of the things I've found is that it can be annoying to remember/easy to forget to remove ice tokens at the start of your turns. This card helps with that by giving you more incentive to remember to do it.  It acts as a temporary Hireling, but has a nice on-play effect as well: the +$2 obviously, but a little Cellar (or what I always think of is Recycle Station from Star Realms) action, too: discard up to 2 cards and draw that many, but that comes with the side-effect of weakening your Hireling effect. Toyed with making it cost $6 like Hireling, but I don't think the on-play effects quite make up for the lack of permanence, though I think it's close.

Interested in what everyone thinks of this card.

*updated price
*updated to add description
Title: Re: Fan Card Mechanics Contest week 9: too COOL for school
Post by: segura on May 04, 2021, 11:46:25 am
On the contrary, it is absolutely necessary as you can also freeze a card twice, thrice, four times and so on.

I don't really understand. Can you give a case where 'once' will make difference?

you can't freeze a card twice from your hand since it will not be in your hand anymore. Does it mean 'once' as in you can't freeze with two scouts?
„Freeze x y times“ is a compact wording I use and prefer to „put y Ice tokens on x“ or whatever.
Title: Re: Fan Card Mechanics Contest week 9: too COOL for school
Post by: Timinou on May 04, 2021, 12:43:45 pm
This is such a cool mechanic!  I'm looking forward to seeing all the different entries, and hopefully I can come up with a decent one.
Title: Re: Fan Card Mechanics Contest week 9: too COOL for school
Post by: DunnoItAll on May 04, 2021, 12:48:48 pm
This is such a cool mechanic!  I'm looking forward to seeing all the different entries, and hopefully I can come up with a decent one.

I'm a fan also.  I experimented with it a little bit in one of my expansions.  The first 6 cards all use this mechanic:

https://dominion-fantasy.weebly.com/
Title: Re: Fan Card Mechanics Contest week 9: too COOL for school
Post by: silverspawn on May 04, 2021, 02:07:07 pm
(https://i.ibb.co/4TRk9t1/Arctic-Village.png)

Btw, I quite like this mechanic. In fact, my expansion had something very similar but without using the mechanic. Unfortunately, the card kind of sucked and I eventually took it out. But I think the fault was not with the extended-discard idea but with the fact that the card was too weak and did nothing else. To improve on that, I made this one a sort of Village. On the one hand, it's a pretty shitty trasher, but on the other, having your +Actions and deck thinning on the same card should be quite nice.
Title: Re: Fan Card Mechanics Contest week 9: too COOL for school
Post by: Timinou on May 04, 2021, 02:16:55 pm
This is such a cool mechanic!  I'm looking forward to seeing all the different entries, and hopefully I can come up with a decent one.

I'm a fan also.  I experimented with it a little bit in one of my expansions.  The first 6 cards all use this mechanic:

https://dominion-fantasy.weebly.com/

Yeah, I think I remember some of those from when you posted them on Discord.


Anyway, my half-serious submission:

(https://i.imgur.com/dmampHM.png)

I've taken a page from segura's book to say "Freeze this twice" instead of saying "Freeze this with 2 Ice Tokens".
Title: Re: Fan Card Mechanics Contest week 9: too COOL for school
Post by: spineflu on May 04, 2021, 03:23:11 pm
This might be busted with the way some freezing cards work;

(https://trello-attachments.s3.amazonaws.com/6019de42b869588d9701fbff/60917744e4882f846857dc1d/b4a60a3f02e2192f85c6df4f5fde9f86/image.png)

Quote
Glacial Village • $4 • Action
+2 Actions
You may freeze a card from your hand with 1 Ice token.

For each Ice token on your frozen cards, +1 Card
-
When you buy this, freeze it with 2 Ice tokens.
Title: Re: Fan Card Mechanics Contest week 9: too COOL for school
Post by: naitchman on May 04, 2021, 03:24:57 pm
Ok Here is my card (Please read the note lower down)
(https://i.imgur.com/iYxMqoB.png)

Theme: Straight from the lab, the alchemist has invented a solution to help thaw things faster, however it takes time to make more.

IMPORTANT NOTE: I think the ice token mechanic is overall fine. The only problem is that it discards cards at the beginning of your turn. That means the first ice token doesn't do much (instead discarding at the end of your turn, you discard at the beginning of your next, which usually doesn't make too much of a difference). The other big problem is that it cause cards to miss the shuffle. With this card in particular (with the original rules as is) it's hard to make it work no matter how many ice tokens you put on it:
1 ice token: Can have infinite loops
2 ice tokens (my original thought): If you have a chain of them and use them to remove the other ice tokens, each will have one at the end of the turn and will come back at the beginning of your next which is pretty much a lab.
3 ice tokens (the not so great solution): Ok so add one ice token and everything's fine right? Not really. Labs tend to be in decks meant to draw your deck, thus the turn before you get them back, you likely triggered a reshuffle when drawing your starting hand, meaning frozen cards will likely go into an empty discard pile. Even if your deck was still strong enough to draw to them, it would be pointless because at that point you've already drawn all of your payload. It would have this really staggered and weak lab effect.

Solution: Ice token rule change - When you remove the last ice token from a card, discard that card at the end of that turn.

This does pretty much the same (just with one less ice token) except you get to shuffle the incoming cards into your deck, and have a chance at drawing them.

Fika, can you confirm that you are ok with this rule change?
I am just using this rule change for my own card. Feel free to adopt it or ignore it.
Title: Re: Fan Card Mechanics Contest week 9: too COOL for school
Post by: fika monster on May 04, 2021, 04:02:29 pm
Ok Here is my card (Please read the note lower down)
(https://i.imgur.com/iYxMqoB.png)

Fika, can you confirm that you are ok with this rule change?
I am just using this rule change for my own card. Feel free to adopt it or ignore it.

I cant speak for the original author, but if you do it for your own card, that's fine.i don't mind if others do this as well: just write that you have that rule change under the card if this is what you feel is best design wise
Title: Re: Fan Card Mechanics Contest week 9: too COOL for school
Post by: GendoIkari on May 04, 2021, 08:18:05 pm
On the contrary, it is absolutely necessary as you can also freeze a card twice, thrice, four times and so on.

I don't really understand. Can you give a case where 'once' will make difference?

you can't freeze a card twice from your hand since it will not be in your hand anymore. Does it mean 'once' as in you can't freeze with two scouts?
„Freeze x y times“ is a compact wording I use and prefer to „put y Ice tokens on x“ or whatever.

The problem with the compact version of the wording is that it's ambiguous and goes against existing cards like King's Court... [do X] [three times] is already used to mean the same as [do X][do X][do X]. In this case, the "X" would be "freeze the card", which as far as I can tell from the original expansion is defined to mean "set it aside".

It could work fine if "freeze X" were defined to "if X is not set aside, set it aside. Either way, add 1 ice token to it". That definition could work fine, and in that case "freeze X three times" would have the same effect as "freeze X with 3 ice counters on it". But as it is, "freeze X three times" seems to mean something different than the normal "do X three times" means.
Title: Re: Fan Card Mechanics Contest week 9: too COOL for school
Post by: The Alchemist on May 04, 2021, 10:33:08 pm
Sorry if I missed the memo but when did we decide to start doing separate forum posts instead of continuing the Fan Card Mechanic post?
Title: Re: Fan Card Mechanics Contest week 9: too COOL for school
Post by: NoMoreFun on May 05, 2021, 12:47:11 am
Is it "put in your discard pile", or "discard" (Like Exile)?

Similarly would gaining a card from the supply and freezing it be "gain and Freeze", or just "Freeze"?
Title: Re: Fan Card Mechanics Contest week 9: too COOL for school
Post by: Aquila on May 05, 2021, 04:04:30 am
This mechanic feels like it has a lot of potential! There's a lot it can achieve that Durations or Reserves can't, whilst the timed aspect distinguishes it from Exile.

One snag I remember being discussed is the sheer number of tokens potentially needed; even if dice were used instead of tokens, there is still a large amount of freezing potential to account for. I think the best solution reached was a Freeze mat, with spaces on it forming a countdown track? 'Freeze X times' would mean put the card (set it aside) on the relevant space on the mat. All you'd have to do is shunt the piles on each space along at the start of each turn. It would imply a limit to the number of times cards could be frozen, but that's probably for the best.

IMPORTANT NOTE: I think the ice token mechanic is overall fine. The only problem is that it discards cards at the beginning of your turn. That means the first ice token doesn't do much (instead discarding at the end of your turn, you discard at the beginning of your next, which usually doesn't make too much of a difference). The other big problem is that it cause cards to miss the shuffle. With this card in particular (with the original rules as is) it's hard to make it work no matter how many ice tokens you put on it:
1 ice token: Can have infinite loops
2 ice tokens (my original thought): If you have a chain of them and use them to remove the other ice tokens, each will have one at the end of the turn and will come back at the beginning of your next which is pretty much a lab.
3 ice tokens (the not so great solution): Ok so add one ice token and everything's fine right? Not really. Labs tend to be in decks meant to draw your deck, thus the turn before you get them back, you likely triggered a reshuffle when drawing your starting hand, meaning frozen cards will likely go into an empty discard pile. Even if your deck was still strong enough to draw to them, it would be pointless because at that point you've already drawn all of your payload. It would have this really staggered and weak lab effect.

Solution: Ice token rule change - When you remove the last ice token from a card, discard that card at the end of that turn.

This does pretty much the same (just with one less ice token) except you get to shuffle the incoming cards into your deck, and have a chance at drawing them.
So cards 'naturally thawed' at turn start would also wait until turn end to be discarded? That would mean one Freeze keeps a card out of deck for 1-and-a-bit turns, which would affect the usefulness of something like segura's Scout heavily. You could add an extra clause to this card, 'you may thaw one of your cards once; if it's then on 0, discard it at end of turn' (to use Freeze mat terms).
On the one hand, this rule change lets thawing cards work, and freeze once is a more significant delay; on the other, it's a little more confusing, since hitting 0 implies the wait is over then. The rule could be printed on the mat though...
So, I guess I'm overall in favour of this change.

So my entry will use it too:
(https://trello-attachments.s3.amazonaws.com/5f5a8e8e7ed38b522f25641a/6092382c7bf03251bd188a30/8e0a9de710f1b2de0d6ffceef54c1a63/Glaciate.png)
Quote
Glaciate - Action, $3 cost.
+1 Action
Trash a card from your hand. Gain a non-Victory card costing purely $, freezing it once per $1 it costs more than the trashed card.
Remodel where the only limitation is Victory cards, but the bigger step-up in cost you go, the longer you have to wait. Trim down your deck early, ready for the power to come in later.
Title: Re: Fan Card Mechanics Contest week 9: too COOL for school
Post by: segura on May 05, 2021, 06:36:35 am
On the contrary, it is absolutely necessary as you can also freeze a card twice, thrice, four times and so on.

I don't really understand. Can you give a case where 'once' will make difference?

you can't freeze a card twice from your hand since it will not be in your hand anymore. Does it mean 'once' as in you can't freeze with two scouts?
„Freeze x y times“ is a compact wording I use and prefer to „put y Ice tokens on x“ or whatever.

The problem with the compact version of the wording is that it's ambiguous and goes against existing cards like King's Court... [do X] [three times] is already used to mean the same as [do X][do X][do X]. In this case, the "X" would be "freeze the card", which as far as I can tell from the original expansion is defined to mean "set it aside".

It could work fine if "freeze X" were defined to "if X is not set aside, set it aside. Either way, add 1 ice token to it". That definition could work fine, and in that case "freeze X three times" would have the same effect as "freeze X with 3 ice counters on it". But as it is, "freeze X three times" seems to mean something different than the normal "do X three times" means.
„Freeze card x y times“ means literally the same as „put y Ice tokens on card x“. It is a crystal clear wording and has nothing to do with KC. That card says „play an Action card three times“.

It is basically the same as +x Coffers vs. take x Coin tokens. Both wordings are fine and unambiguous but one is shorter.
Title: Re: Fan Card Mechanics Contest week 9: too COOL for school
Post by: segura on May 05, 2021, 07:34:36 am
(https://i.ibb.co/4F0dpHV/Arctic-Village.png)

Btw, I quite like this mechanic. In fact, my expansion had something very similar but without using the mechanic. Unfortunately, the card kind of sucked and I eventually took it out. But I think the fault was not with the extended-discard idea but with the fact that the card was too weak and did nothing else. To improve on that, I made this one a sort of Village. On the one hand, it's a pretty shitty trasher, but on the other, having your +Actions and deck thinning on the same card should be quite nice.
This looks like a weaker version of Exile, or in other words, among all cards so far this ihre closest implementation of freeze to Exile. I think it is a bit too weak, a Necro that Exiles seems far worse than Sanctuary and Bounty Hunter and this card is nearly strictly worse than Exile.
One trick though is freezing Curses that you got early. With Exile they are forever in nirvana, here you might be able (it is not easy to pull off though) to freeze them and later trash them.
Title: Re: Fan Card Mechanics Contest week 9: too COOL for school
Post by: naitchman on May 05, 2021, 08:27:06 am
So cards 'naturally thawed' at turn start would also wait until turn end to be discarded? That would mean one Freeze keeps a card out of deck for 1-and-a-bit turns, which would affect the usefulness of something like segura's Scout heavily.

The ice tokens are basically a countdown tracker which is something dominion doesn't really have a way to track. As the rule was originally, one ice token is mostly the same as, "set aside this card. If you do, at the end of this turn, put it in your discard pile", which is something dominion cards can do without the mechanic. So if you want to delay cards for just this turn, use that wording, and if more, use ice tokens.

Segura's card could be worded this way without using ice tokens, though like I said, everyone is free to ignore it or adopt it; I just thought it worked better with my card.
Title: Re: Fan Card Mechanics Contest week 9: too COOL for school
Post by: silverspawn on May 05, 2021, 10:27:33 am
I agree that it's a weaker version of Exile and that a Necropolis that does this is weaker than bounty hunter and Sanctuary. But Bounty Hunter and Sanctuary are both very strong, so I think that's fine. You can have deck thinning that's much weaker than either of them without having something too weak to be playable. I tend to like weak trashers and junkers.
Title: Re: Fan Card Mechanics Contest week 9: too COOL for school
Post by: segura on May 05, 2021, 01:25:47 pm
I agree that it's a weaker version of Exile and that a Necropolis that does this is weaker than bounty hunter and Sanctuary. But Bounty Hunter and Sanctuary are both very strong, so I think that's fine. You can have deck thinning that's much weaker than either of them without having something too weak to be playable. I tend to like weak trashers and junkers.
I think it is a $2 or $3. Take Raze, after the first shuffling, I’d rather lose that VP for some draw and sifting than not. Of in many other situations, your card is better than Raze as you always get an extra Action and can pseudoexile green. But I think this opening situation illustrates the serious weakness of a non-drawing card.
Plus, my hunch is that you might need two copies to keep the junk and green permafrozen.
Title: Re: Fan Card Mechanics Contest week 9: too COOL for school
Post by: mathdude on May 05, 2021, 02:17:47 pm
Let's do a Hireling-variant...

(https://i.imgur.com/gzFi60t.png)
Quote
Permafrost
$5 - Action-Duration
At the start of each of your turns for the rest of the game, choose one: Freeze a card from your hand with 3 Ice tokens; add 2 Ice tokens to one of your Frozen cards; or remove 1 Ice token from one of your Frozen cards.
(This stays in play.)

So its intended purpose is to be able to pull cards out of your deck (similar to Exile), and a single Permafrost in play can effectively keep 2 cards out of your deck.  But I added an extra option to it, to optionally work with other Ice token cards, that if one of your cards is temporarily frozen, this card can help thaw it quicker (since permafrost is thawing with global warming!)
Title: Re: Fan Card Mechanics Contest week 9: too COOL for school
Post by: silverspawn on May 05, 2021, 04:25:19 pm
I actually agree that it's better at 2$
Title: Re: Fan Card Mechanics Contest week 9: too COOL for school
Post by: bootymancer on May 06, 2021, 03:08:33 am
Interesting mechanic!
For my submission I wanted to explore the idea of how something differs prior to being frozen/after being frozen. Here's what I landed on (hope a split-pile is acceptable):

(https://i.imgur.com/q7sNKeo.png)
Quote
+1 Card
+1 Action
+$1
If there are no Mammoths left in the supply, freeze this with 3 Ice tokens.
-
When you would thaw this, trash it instead. You may gain a Discovery.
Using 'thaw' here in place of something like 'remove the last Ice token from'.

Which becomes...

(https://i.imgur.com/rpxcOkE.png)
Quote
$2
Worth an additional $2 if you have any Ice tokens in play.
'any Ice tokens in play' could easily be 'any cards with Ice tokens on them' or 'any cards of your Frozen mat', etc. if necessary.

Standard 5/5 split. Mammoths run free until they are extinct. A frozen Mammoth makes for a truly valuable Discovery.
Funnily enough, freezing a Mammoth through other means allows a player to potentially gain a Discovery before it is uncovered in the supply.
Title: Re: Fan Card Mechanics Contest week 9: too COOL for school
Post by: mathdude on May 06, 2021, 08:08:38 am
Interesting mechanic!
For my submission I wanted to explore the idea of how something differs prior to being frozen/after being frozen. Here's what I landed on (hope a split-pile is acceptable):

(https://i.imgur.com/q7sNKeo.png)
Quote
+1 Card
+1 Action
+$1
If there are no Mammoths left in the supply, freeze this with 3 Ice tokens.
-
When you would thaw this, trash it instead. You may gain a Discovery.
Using 'thaw' here in place of something like 'remove the last Ice token from'.

Which becomes...

(https://i.imgur.com/rpxcOkE.png)
Quote
$2
Worth an additional $2 if you have any Ice tokens in play.
'any Ice tokens in play' could easily be 'any cards with Ice tokens on them' or 'any cards of your Frozen mat', etc. if necessary.

Standard 5/5 split. Mammoths run free until they are extinct. A frozen Mammoth makes for a truly valuable Discovery.
Funnily enough, freezing a Mammoth through other means allows a player to potentially gain a Discovery before it is uncovered in the supply.

This looks like a really cool interaction between the two cards (and very thematic), but I see a couple problems. Freezing the Mammoth with 3 Ice tokens is already quite the penalty for a $4 Peddler variant, if you get it back after. But having to trash it seems unnecessarily harsh. For this card alone, I'd recommend removing the trash clause.

However, removing the trash clause from Mammoth makes Discovery way too strong as it will almost always be worth $4 so I don't know what to do about that.

On a different note, your comment about freezing a Mammoth in a different way could allow you to get a Discovery before it is uncovered is not correct under current rules. Gain is defined as "from the Supply to your discard pile" unless specified otherwise. And even though all cards in Supply Piles seem to be in the Supply, only the top card of any Supply Pile can be gained. So when a Mammoth thaws, the instruction to gain a Discovery wil look at the top of the pile and if it doesn't find any, that instruction will fail and do nothing.
Title: Re: Fan Card Mechanics Contest week 9: too COOL for school
Post by: emtzalex on May 06, 2021, 12:51:55 pm
My Submission:
(Ice House; updated to improve wording)
(https://i.imgur.com/eSs5yTch.png)


Quote from: Ice House
ICE HOUSE       (http://wiki.dominionstrategy.com/images/thumb/f/f7/Coin1.png/32px-Coin1.png)
ACTION
Choose a card you have Frozen. +(http://wiki.dominionstrategy.com/images/thumb/f/f7/Coin1.png/32px-Coin1.png) per Ice token on it.


When you gain this, Freeze it 5 times.
                           

A Poor House variant, this provides terminal money in variable amounts. If you Buy them at regular intervals, they can both be the source of the Ice and the mechanism to cash in on it. But if it's the only card with the Frozen mechanic, should they run out, you could end up stuck with a lot of dead cards (and the last one you buy will never be useful).

Old version:
(https://i.imgur.com/Z3bLoeLh.png)
Title: Re: Fan Card Mechanics Contest week 9: too COOL for school
Post by: mutated on May 06, 2021, 12:59:06 pm
My Submission:

Quote from: Ice House
ICE HOUSE       (http://wiki.dominionstrategy.com/images/thumb/f/f7/Coin1.png/32px-Coin1.png)
ACTION
+(http://wiki.dominionstrategy.com/images/thumb/f/f7/Coin1.png/32px-Coin1.png) per Ice token on one Frozen card you have (your choice).


This is gained Frozen with 5 Ice tokens.
                           

A Poor House variant, this provides terminal money in variable amounts. If you Buy them at regular intervals, they can both be the source of the Ice and the mechanism to cash in on it. But if it's the only card with the Frozen mechanic, should they run out, you could end up stuck with a lot of dead cards (and the last one you buy will never be useful).

Small wording suggestion: instead of "This is gained Frozen with 5 Ice tokens", you could use "When you gain this, freeze it with 5 ice tokens" (or "freeze it 5 times" or whatever language). I think it's a little easier to read and it's more clear to me how it interacts with other alternative gains/when-gain triggers.

I like the concept either way!
Title: Re: Fan Card Mechanics Contest week 9: too COOL for school
Post by: silverspawn on May 06, 2021, 01:07:45 pm
I was going to suggest a wording change for that card, but it's for the upper half. "Choose a card you own. +1$ per Ice token on it."

(edited 'you own')
Title: Re: Fan Card Mechanics Contest week 9: too COOL for school
Post by: naitchman on May 06, 2021, 01:09:54 pm
My Submission:

Quote from: Ice House
ICE HOUSE       (http://wiki.dominionstrategy.com/images/thumb/f/f7/Coin1.png/32px-Coin1.png)
ACTION
+(http://wiki.dominionstrategy.com/images/thumb/f/f7/Coin1.png/32px-Coin1.png) per Ice token on one Frozen card you have (your choice).


This is gained Frozen with 5 Ice tokens.
                           

A Poor House variant, this provides terminal money in variable amounts. If you Buy them at regular intervals, they can both be the source of the Ice and the mechanism to cash in on it. But if it's the only card with the Frozen mechanic, should they run out, you could end up stuck with a lot of dead cards (and the last one you buy will never be useful).

Small wording suggestion: instead of "This is gained Frozen with 5 Ice tokens", you could use "When you gain this, freeze it with 5 ice tokens" (or "freeze it 5 times" or whatever language). I think it's a little easier to read and it's more clear to me how it interacts with other alternative gains/when-gain triggers.

I like the concept either way!

To be fair, in Gazbag's original post the cards use the wording "This is gained frozen with X ice tokens" (See frigid village and Glacier). Then again, there is some wording inconsistency in Gazbag's original post (sometimes it says frozen with x ice tokens, and sometimes it says to set the card aside and put x ice tokens on it).
Title: Re: Fan Card Mechanics Contest week 9: too COOL for school
Post by: scolapasta on May 06, 2021, 01:50:04 pm
So this definitely feels like a 0.1 version, but I want to get it out there to get some feedback:

(https://i.imgur.com/KdtZdxs.png)

Quote
Winter Village - Victory - $3*
2 (http://wiki.dominionstrategy.com/images/thumb/9/92/VP.png/16px-VP.png)
-
When you buy this, you may overpay for it. If you do, freeze this with an Ice token for each $1 you overpaid.

When you remove an Ice token from this, choose one: +1 Villager or +1 Coffers


Basically, the freeze mechanic seems ripe for something with overpay in order to delay it getting into your deck. And the main reason you would pay extra is if it were a stop card, I think. The villager or coffers is a little extra bonus.

Things that could need tweaking:
• number of VP this is worth
• cost
• the extra bonus*

* a different take on this I'm considering is +1 VP token instead. So it would be a victory card that you could make worth a lot more and help keep out of your deck, BUT you risk it not getting to that value, if the game ends before you collect all the tokens. The cost of this version felt a lot harder to calibrate so I figured I'd start with the posted version. But please comment on what you think of the VP version too, if that feels like a better bonus here.
Title: Re: Fan Card Mechanics Contest week 9: too COOL for school
Post by: Xen3k on May 06, 2021, 05:39:45 pm
(https://live.staticflickr.com/65535/51164256611_5a46afaedb_b.jpg)

Quote
Frozen Mine
Action - Reaction
You may trash a Treasure you have in play, or in your hand, to gain a Silver to your hand.
----
When you gain a card, you may Freeze it 4 times to play this from your hand.

A mini-Mine that has some utility. Early game it upgrades your Coppers to Silver, later it freezes Green and Junk to keep the deck clean. Probably not a card I would ever buy more than one of. Feedback is welcome.

Edit: Improved wording of the reaction part to be less ambiguous and to use the "Freeze" wording (thanks to emtzalex). Changed price to $3. When compared to Amulet, this seems fair, but it's usefulness late game really relies on the freezing ability of the reaction to temp Exile Green and junk. Could change this to $2 again if it feels weak.

Old Version
(https://live.staticflickr.com/65535/51162454983_5f7f0910fd_b.jpg)
Title: Re: Fan Card Mechanics Contest week 9: too COOL for school
Post by: mxdata on May 06, 2021, 10:47:27 pm
So this definitely feels like a 0.1 version, but I want to get it out there to get some feedback:

(https://i.imgur.com/KdtZdxs.png)

Quote
Winter Village - Victory - $3*
2 (http://wiki.dominionstrategy.com/images/thumb/9/92/VP.png/16px-VP.png)
-
When you buy this, you may overpay for it. If you do, freeze this with an Ice token for each $1 you overpaid.

When you remove an Ice token from this, choose one: +1 Villager or +1 Coffers


Basically, the freeze mechanic seems ripe for something with overpay in order to delay it getting into your deck. And the main reason you would pay extra is if it were a stop card, I think. The villager or coffers is a little extra bonus.

Things that could need tweaking:
• number of VP this is worth
• cost
• the extra bonus*

* a different take on this I'm considering is +1 VP token instead. So it would be a victory card that you could make worth a lot more and help keep out of your deck, BUT you risk it not getting to that value, if the game ends before you collect all the tokens. The cost of this version felt a lot harder to calibrate so I figured I'd start with the posted version. But please comment on what you think of the VP version too, if that feels like a better bonus here.

I kinda feel like the ability to overpay for freezing would be beneficial on its own with Victory cards, without adding extra benefits
Title: Re: Fan Card Mechanics Contest week 9: too COOL for school
Post by: The Alchemist on May 06, 2021, 11:35:03 pm
Ah, seems someone has beaten me to this name while I was playtesting it. Oh well, here is my submission:

(https://imgur.com/cQ8oBw8.png)

A cantrip delayed workshop, but one that can speed up its gains the more you play. Keep your frozen cards stored in the Ice house until they're ready to be gained!
Title: Re: Fan Card Mechanics Contest week 9: too COOL for school
Post by: mxdata on May 07, 2021, 12:58:22 am
(https://i.imgur.com/laAQ4Wq.png)
Quote
Frozen Village
Action
$5
Freeze this with 3 Ice tokens
-
When you remove an Ice token from this, +1 Action

Essentially a sort of quasi-Duration card using the Ice mechanic.  On the turn you play it, you get no benefit, but on the next 3 turns, you get a Village effect at the start of turn

New version:
(https://i.imgur.com/RAjEOk8.png)
Quote
Frozen Village
Action
$5
+1 Action
Freeze this with 2 Ice tokens
-
When you gain this, freeze it with 1 Ice token. When you remove an Ice token from this, +1 Card +1 Action

It has a Ghost Town effect on two sequential turns and, like Ghost Town, takes effect on the turn immediately after gaining it.  Unlike Ghost Town, and also unlike conventional Duration cards, it gets discarded at the start of the last turn that it has an effect, thanks to the Ice mechanic, and can thus potentially be drawn back into your hand on that same turn
Title: Re: Fan Card Mechanics Contest week 9: too COOL for school
Post by: segura on May 07, 2021, 01:15:39 am
(https://i.imgur.com/laAQ4Wq.png)
Quote
Frozen Village
Action
$5
Freeze this with 3 Ice tokens
-
When you remove an Ice token from this, +1 Action

Essentially a sort of quasi-Duration card using the Ice mechanic.  On the turn you play it, you get no benefit, but on the next 3 turns, you get a Village effect at the start of turn
This looks weaker and more expensive than Fishing Village.
Title: Re: Fan Card Mechanics Contest week 9: too COOL for school
Post by: mxdata on May 07, 2021, 01:25:14 am
(https://i.imgur.com/laAQ4Wq.png)
Quote
Frozen Village
Action
$5
Freeze this with 3 Ice tokens
-
When you remove an Ice token from this, +1 Action

Essentially a sort of quasi-Duration card using the Ice mechanic.  On the turn you play it, you get no benefit, but on the next 3 turns, you get a Village effect at the start of turn
This looks weaker and more expensive than Fishing Village.
Fishing Village only lasts one turn, though, and this lasts 3
Title: Re: Fan Card Mechanics Contest week 9: too COOL for school
Post by: segura on May 07, 2021, 01:31:42 am
(https://i.imgur.com/laAQ4Wq.png)
Quote
Frozen Village
Action
$5
Freeze this with 3 Ice tokens
-
When you remove an Ice token from this, +1 Action

Essentially a sort of quasi-Duration card using the Ice mechanic.  On the turn you play it, you get no benefit, but on the next 3 turns, you get a Village effect at the start of turn
This looks weaker and more expensive than Fishing Village.
Fishing Village only lasts one turn, though, and this lasts 3
This provides net +2 Actions, spread over 3-4 turns (depends on whether you draw into it the turn you discard it), whereas Fishing Village provides net +2 Actions +2 Coins, spread over 2 turns.
Title: Re: Fan Card Mechanics Contest week 9: too COOL for school
Post by: mxdata on May 07, 2021, 01:37:19 am
(https://i.imgur.com/laAQ4Wq.png)
Quote
Frozen Village
Action
$5
Freeze this with 3 Ice tokens
-
When you remove an Ice token from this, +1 Action

Essentially a sort of quasi-Duration card using the Ice mechanic.  On the turn you play it, you get no benefit, but on the next 3 turns, you get a Village effect at the start of turn
This looks weaker and more expensive than Fishing Village.
Fishing Village only lasts one turn, though, and this lasts 3
This provides net +2 Actions, spread over 3-4 turns (depends on whether you draw into it the turn you discard it), whereas Fishing Village provides net +2 Actions +2 Coins, spread over 2 turns.
That's a good point
Title: Re: Fan Card Mechanics Contest week 9: too COOL for school
Post by: mxdata on May 07, 2021, 03:19:21 am
(https://i.imgur.com/laAQ4Wq.png)
Quote
Frozen Village
Action
$5
Freeze this with 3 Ice tokens
-
When you remove an Ice token from this, +1 Action

Essentially a sort of quasi-Duration card using the Ice mechanic.  On the turn you play it, you get no benefit, but on the next 3 turns, you get a Village effect at the start of turn

New version:
(https://i.imgur.com/RAjEOk8.png)
Quote
Frozen Village
Action
$5
+1 Action
Freeze this with 2 Ice tokens
-
When you gain this, freeze it with 1 Ice token. When you remove an Ice token from this, +1 Card +1 Action
Made it stronger, now it's non-terminal the turn you play it, plus it also gives an extra card at the start of each turn, and works on the turn immediately after buying it.  It's thus similar to Ghost Town, except acting over two turns. One major difference is that, due to the Ice mechanic, it gets discarded at the start of the last turn that it has an effect, and thus may potentially be drawn back into your hand on the same turn.  Three Ice tokens would probably be overpowered with these stronger effects, so I reduced it to two.
Title: Re: Fan Card Mechanics Contest week 9: too COOL for school
Post by: segura on May 07, 2021, 03:45:39 am
I like this version. The vanillas, Lost City with a Village on top look crazy at first but Archive is a DoubleLab and not overpowered due to the delay. Managing to draw into this during the very turn you discard it would be pretty sweet.
In general that is a nice feature of these cards, unlike Durations they get discarded at the start of the turn.
Title: Re: Fan Card Mechanics Contest week 9: too COOL for school
Post by: DunnoItAll on May 07, 2021, 06:12:56 am
I love this mechanic so much, and it is so fun reading everyone's ideas on it.  I was going to choose this mechanic for the contest the week I ran it, but I thought it would just be too on the nose for me.  I also intentionally avoided picking it because I was hopeful someone else would so I could enter and enjoy the cards without having to worry about judging them.

Yay! Everyone's ideas are so good.
Title: Re: Fan Card Mechanics Contest week 9: too COOL for school
Post by: naitchman on May 07, 2021, 10:11:12 am
(https://live.staticflickr.com/65535/51162454983_5f7f0910fd_b.jpg)

Quote
Frozen Mine
Action - Reaction
You may trash a Treasure you have in play, or in your hand, to gain a Silver to your hand.
----
When you gain a card, you may play this from your hand to set that card aside with 4 Ice tokens on it.

A mini-Mine that has some utility. Early game it upgrades your Coppers to Silver, later it freezes Green and Junk to keep the deck clean. Probably not a card I would ever buy more than one of. Feedback is welcome.

This seems too cheap. It can mostly mimic the benefits of a mine while providing some benefit in the later game. Also, you probably don't need the in play clause because it's very rare to have treasures in play during action phase (mine just allows trashing from hand).
Title: Re: Fan Card Mechanics Contest week 9: too COOL for school
Post by: mathdude on May 07, 2021, 10:20:16 am
(https://live.staticflickr.com/65535/51162454983_5f7f0910fd_b.jpg)

Quote
Frozen Mine
Action - Reaction
You may trash a Treasure you have in play, or in your hand, to gain a Silver to your hand.
----
When you gain a card, you may play this from your hand to set that card aside with 4 Ice tokens on it.

A mini-Mine that has some utility. Early game it upgrades your Coppers to Silver, later it freezes Green and Junk to keep the deck clean. Probably not a card I would ever buy more than one of. Feedback is welcome.

This seems too cheap. It can mostly mimic the benefits of a mine while providing some benefit in the later game. Also, you probably don't need the in play clause because it's very rare to have treasures in play during action phase (mine just allows trashing from hand).

You do need the "in play" because of the reaction that lets you play it when you gain a card.

But I also agree that it's too cheap. I would think it needs to cost at least $4. Otherwise it's almost a no-brainer to open with 2 of them.
Title: Re: Fan Card Mechanics Contest week 9: too COOL for school
Post by: naitchman on May 07, 2021, 11:15:20 am
(https://live.staticflickr.com/65535/51162454983_5f7f0910fd_b.jpg)

Quote
Frozen Mine
Action - Reaction
You may trash a Treasure you have in play, or in your hand, to gain a Silver to your hand.
----
When you gain a card, you may play this from your hand to set that card aside with 4 Ice tokens on it.

A mini-Mine that has some utility. Early game it upgrades your Coppers to Silver, later it freezes Green and Junk to keep the deck clean. Probably not a card I would ever buy more than one of. Feedback is welcome.

This seems too cheap. It can mostly mimic the benefits of a mine while providing some benefit in the later game. Also, you probably don't need the in play clause because it's very rare to have treasures in play during action phase (mine just allows trashing from hand).

You do need the "in play" because of the reaction that lets you play it when you gain a card.

But I also agree that it's too cheap. I would think it needs to cost at least $4. Otherwise it's almost a no-brainer to open with 2 of them.

Now that you mention it's not exactly clear how the reaction works. If I gain a card, can I play frozen mine for free (and trasha treasure for a silver) and freeze the gained card? This just makes it even more powerful.
Title: Re: Fan Card Mechanics Contest week 9: too COOL for school
Post by: GendoIkari on May 07, 2021, 11:45:56 am
(https://live.staticflickr.com/65535/51162454983_5f7f0910fd_b.jpg)

Quote
Frozen Mine
Action - Reaction
You may trash a Treasure you have in play, or in your hand, to gain a Silver to your hand.
----
When you gain a card, you may play this from your hand to set that card aside with 4 Ice tokens on it.

A mini-Mine that has some utility. Early game it upgrades your Coppers to Silver, later it freezes Green and Junk to keep the deck clean. Probably not a card I would ever buy more than one of. Feedback is welcome.

This seems too cheap. It can mostly mimic the benefits of a mine while providing some benefit in the later game. Also, you probably don't need the in play clause because it's very rare to have treasures in play during action phase (mine just allows trashing from hand).

You do need the "in play" because of the reaction that lets you play it when you gain a card.

But I also agree that it's too cheap. I would think it needs to cost at least $4. Otherwise it's almost a no-brainer to open with 2 of them.

Now that you mention it's not exactly clear how the reaction works. If I gain a card, can I play frozen mine for free (and trasha treasure for a silver) and freeze the gained card? This just makes it even more powerful.

Yeah pretty sure that's what it means; it's the reason it allows you to trash from in-play; because when you gain a card normally during your buy phase, you'll play this from hand to trash a Copper that you had played.

But early on, when you're more likely to have Copper in play, you don't want to freeze your incoming card. So freezing the card is a penalty, but it's awkward because normally "you may do X to do Y" is used when Y is something you want to do, and X is the price you have to pay to do it. Here, it's the opposite... you want to do X, but doing so would force you to also do Y.

Later in the game when you want to freeze your incoming green cards, you just play this from hand as a reaction and choose to do nothing on-play (since the on-play is "may"), because you likely don't have Copper in play anyway.

The other awkward thing is that you gain the Silver to your hand, but if you played this as a reaction after buying a card, you can't play that Silver.

So I think the reaction works as an interesting decision; but I do think it's weird to have "You may do X to do Y" be used when Y is a penalty.
Title: Re: Fan Card Mechanics Contest week 9: too COOL for school
Post by: segura on May 07, 2021, 12:05:20 pm
(https://live.staticflickr.com/65535/51162454983_5f7f0910fd_b.jpg)

Quote
Frozen Mine
Action - Reaction
You may trash a Treasure you have in play, or in your hand, to gain a Silver to your hand.
----
When you gain a card, you may play this from your hand to set that card aside with 4 Ice tokens on it.

A mini-Mine that has some utility. Early game it upgrades your Coppers to Silver, later it freezes Green and Junk to keep the deck clean. Probably not a card I would ever buy more than one of. Feedback is welcome.

This seems too cheap. It can mostly mimic the benefits of a mine while providing some benefit in the later game. Also, you probably don't need the in play clause because it's very rare to have treasures in play during action phase (mine just allows trashing from hand).

You do need the "in play" because of the reaction that lets you play it when you gain a card.

But I also agree that it's too cheap. I would think it needs to cost at least $4. Otherwise it's almost a no-brainer to open with 2 of them.
Mine would be weak at $4, and without the Reaction this is significantly weaker than Mine.
About the Reaction, being able to quais-Exile green you gain is pretty sweet in the endgame, but the ability to Mine Coppers into Silvers is largely irrelevant back then.

So I don't know how strong it is but it is definitely far below the power level of a $5. So it is a $2, $3 or a $4.
Title: Re: Fan Card Mechanics Contest week 9: too COOL for school
Post by: Xen3k on May 07, 2021, 12:20:42 pm
(https://live.staticflickr.com/65535/51162454983_5f7f0910fd_b.jpg)

Quote
Frozen Mine
Action - Reaction
You may trash a Treasure you have in play, or in your hand, to gain a Silver to your hand.
----
When you gain a card, you may play this from your hand to set that card aside with 4 Ice tokens on it.

A mini-Mine that has some utility. Early game it upgrades your Coppers to Silver, later it freezes Green and Junk to keep the deck clean. Probably not a card I would ever buy more than one of. Feedback is welcome.

This seems too cheap. It can mostly mimic the benefits of a mine while providing some benefit in the later game. Also, you probably don't need the in play clause because it's very rare to have treasures in play during action phase (mine just allows trashing from hand).

You do need the "in play" because of the reaction that lets you play it when you gain a card.

But I also agree that it's too cheap. I would think it needs to cost at least $4. Otherwise it's almost a no-brainer to open with 2 of them.
Mine would be weak at $4, and without the Reaction this is significantly weaker than Mine.
About the Reaction, being able to quais-Exile green you gain is pretty sweet in the endgame, but the ability to Mine Coppers into Silvers is largely irrelevant back then.

So I don't know how strong it is but it is definitely far below the power level of a $5. So it is a $2, $3 or a $4.

I basically designed it to be useful for getting rid of Copper if there are no better trashers, defend against Junkers if there are no better Moats, and allow Greening pretty early without hurting the deck. If you do play this early game for free by reacting to a gain, the freezing is intended as a penalty. I get that it is a bit unusual in how all the elements work together, but I didn't intend for it to be a powerhouse. I can see it may be considered a bit too cheap at $2, especially when compared to something kinda similar like Amulet, so maybe bumping it up to $3 would be a good change.
Title: Re: Fan Card Mechanics Contest week 9: too COOL for school
Post by: emtzalex on May 07, 2021, 02:56:50 pm
My Submission:
(https://i.imgur.com/Z3bLoeLh.png)


Quote from: Ice House
ICE HOUSE       (http://wiki.dominionstrategy.com/images/thumb/f/f7/Coin1.png/32px-Coin1.png)
ACTION
+(http://wiki.dominionstrategy.com/images/thumb/f/f7/Coin1.png/32px-Coin1.png) per Ice token on one Frozen card you have (your choice).


This is gained Frozen with 5 Ice tokens.
                           

Thanks to mutated, silverspawn, and naitchman for the feedback.

Small wording suggestion: instead of "This is gained Frozen with 5 Ice tokens", you could use "When you gain this, freeze it with 5 ice tokens" (or "freeze it 5 times" or whatever language). I think it's a little easier to read and it's more clear to me how it interacts with other alternative gains/when-gain triggers.

I like the concept either way!

To be fair, in Gazbag's original post the cards use the wording "This is gained frozen with X ice tokens" (See frigid village and Glacier). Then again, there is some wording inconsistency in Gazbag's original post (sometimes it says frozen with x ice tokens, and sometimes it says to set the card aside and put x ice tokens on it).

As naitchman figured out, I took this wording directly from some of Gazbag's original cards (http://forum.dominionstrategy.com/index.php?topic=17996.msg736476#msg736476) to use the mechanic in his Ice Age expansion. When putting together the wording for my cards, I like to start with official cards (which is why I keep this list of cards (http://wiki.dominionstrategy.com/index.php/List_of_cards) bookmarked/open in a tab, so I can Ctrl+F to find wording) and model my language after them. With fan mechanic, I like to do the same, looking to the person who initially designed the mechanic (or who designed the incarnation of it I am following).

As naitchman also pointed out, this mechanic has some inconsistency, and different suggestions for wording. There is...


I did not spend that much time thinking about the different wordings, and had not read the (http://forum.dominionstrategy.com/index.php?topic=20780.msg869067#msg869067) discussion (http://forum.dominionstrategy.com/index.php?topic=20780.msg869068#msg869068) of (http://forum.dominionstrategy.com/index.php?topic=20780.msg869070#msg869070) it (http://forum.dominionstrategy.com/index.php?topic=20780.msg869072#msg869072) already (http://forum.dominionstrategy.com/index.php?topic=20780.msg869075#msg869075) posted (http://forum.dominionstrategy.com/index.php?topic=20780.msg869078#msg869078) in (http://forum.dominionstrategy.com/index.php?topic=20780.msg869114#msg869114) the thread (http://forum.dominionstrategy.com/index.php?topic=20780.msg869157#msg869157) when I designed my card. The wording I choose seemed the cleanest and most efficient for the application I was using. However, having considered it further, I think I prefer segura's wording for efficiency of phrasing. In addition to being at least as clear and effective as any other wording when cards are being frozen, it also allows using the same wording to describe putting Ice tokens on non-Frozen cards (thus changing their status from not Frozen to Frozen) and putting additional Ice tokens on already-Frozen cards.

I recognize that this does conceptually change the meaning from the original context. In Gazbag's and DunnoItAll's cards, to "Freeze" a card always means to change its status from non-Frozen to Frozen. With segura's wording, that is generally the effect of Freezing a card, but not definitionally a part of it. But I still think this is superior, because it allows more potential designs using that tight terminology. Thus, I would propose this

Syntax/rule clarification (or maybe change):

Thus, I will probably change the bottom half of the card to say:
Quote from: Ice House
When you gain this, Freeze it 5 times.



I was going to suggest a wording change for that card, but it's for the upper half. "Choose a card you own. +1$ per Ice token on it."

(edited 'you own')

Thanks so much for this input. I had toyed with this a bit as well, and was not entirely happy with what I came up with. I was a bit hesitant to use the word "Choose" since it usually is used in the context of "Choose one:" which is a specific mechanic that I'm not using. However, now that I see your suggestion, it's obviously much clearer.

I don't think I want to "you own," as that seems to be a rather specific syntax that isn't really part of Dominion (if I recall from back in the day, to "own" a card is (or at least was) a term-of-art in M:tG). I think a more official-Dominion equivalent is to refer to cards you "have [status]." Official cards/WELPs reference cards (or a card) that "you have in play" (Mint, Changeling), that "you have in Exile" (Transport), or that you "you have . . . in hand" (Library, Shanty Town, Diplomat). Based on your suggestion (with my modification), I think I am going to go with:

Quote from: Ice House
Choose a card you have Frozen. +$1 per Ice token on it.

Title: Re: Fan Card Mechanics Contest week 9: too COOL for school
Post by: emtzalex on May 07, 2021, 03:05:33 pm
(https://live.staticflickr.com/65535/51162454983_5f7f0910fd_b.jpg)

Quote
Frozen Mine
Action - Reaction
You may trash a Treasure you have in play, or in your hand, to gain a Silver to your hand.
----
When you gain a card, you may play this from your hand to set that card aside with 4 Ice tokens on it.

A mini-Mine that has some utility. Early game it upgrades your Coppers to Silver, later it freezes Green and Junk to keep the deck clean. Probably not a card I would ever buy more than one of. Feedback is welcome.

This seems too cheap. It can mostly mimic the benefits of a mine while providing some benefit in the later game. Also, you probably don't need the in play clause because it's very rare to have treasures in play during action phase (mine just allows trashing from hand).

You do need the "in play" because of the reaction that lets you play it when you gain a card.

But I also agree that it's too cheap. I would think it needs to cost at least $4. Otherwise it's almost a no-brainer to open with 2 of them.
Mine would be weak at $4, and without the Reaction this is significantly weaker than Mine.
About the Reaction, being able to quais-Exile green you gain is pretty sweet in the endgame, but the ability to Mine Coppers into Silvers is largely irrelevant back then.

So I don't know how strong it is but it is definitely far below the power level of a $5. So it is a $2, $3 or a $4.

I basically designed it to be useful for getting rid of Copper if there are no better trashers, defend against Junkers if there are no better Moats, and allow Greening pretty early without hurting the deck. If you do play this early game for free by reacting to a gain, the freezing is intended as a penalty. I get that it is a bit unusual in how all the elements work together, but I didn't intend for it to be a powerhouse. I can see it may be considered a bit too cheap at $2, especially when compared to something kinda similar like Amulet, so maybe bumping it up to $3 would be a good change.

I like that this does a few different things not as well as some other cards. I think the versatility balances out the relative inefficiency in some of the things it does. I like it at $2; since you are "missing" buying a Silver, this can (sort of) make up for that.

However, the wording "...you may play this from your hand to..." is a bit ambiguous, as it isn't clear whether (a) you're playing the card (and resolving it's effect normally) plus icing the gained card; or (b) playing the card and getting the icing ability instead of the normal effect (like an internal Way). From your comment ("If you do play this early game for free by reacting to a gain, the freezing is intended as a penalty"), it seems clear that you meant it to be (a). You might want to clarify the language by saying...

Quote
"When you gain a card, you may Freeze it 4 times to play this from your hand."

...or if you don't want to use the "Freeze [the card] x times" suggested by segura (that I very much like, see my previous post), it could be...

Quote
"When you gain a card, you may set it aside with 4 Ice tokens on it to play this from your hand."
Title: Re: Fan Card Mechanics Contest week 9: too COOL for school
Post by: silverspawn on May 07, 2021, 04:00:34 pm
Quote from: Ice House
Choose a card you have Frozen. +$1 per Ice token on it.

Yeah, this is better than my suggestion for sure.
Title: Re: Fan Card Mechanics Contest week 9: too COOL for school
Post by: Xen3k on May 07, 2021, 07:20:42 pm
(https://live.staticflickr.com/65535/51162454983_5f7f0910fd_b.jpg)

Quote
Frozen Mine
Action - Reaction
You may trash a Treasure you have in play, or in your hand, to gain a Silver to your hand.
----
When you gain a card, you may play this from your hand to set that card aside with 4 Ice tokens on it.

A mini-Mine that has some utility. Early game it upgrades your Coppers to Silver, later it freezes Green and Junk to keep the deck clean. Probably not a card I would ever buy more than one of. Feedback is welcome.

This seems too cheap. It can mostly mimic the benefits of a mine while providing some benefit in the later game. Also, you probably don't need the in play clause because it's very rare to have treasures in play during action phase (mine just allows trashing from hand).

You do need the "in play" because of the reaction that lets you play it when you gain a card.

But I also agree that it's too cheap. I would think it needs to cost at least $4. Otherwise it's almost a no-brainer to open with 2 of them.
Mine would be weak at $4, and without the Reaction this is significantly weaker than Mine.
About the Reaction, being able to quais-Exile green you gain is pretty sweet in the endgame, but the ability to Mine Coppers into Silvers is largely irrelevant back then.

So I don't know how strong it is but it is definitely far below the power level of a $5. So it is a $2, $3 or a $4.

I basically designed it to be useful for getting rid of Copper if there are no better trashers, defend against Junkers if there are no better Moats, and allow Greening pretty early without hurting the deck. If you do play this early game for free by reacting to a gain, the freezing is intended as a penalty. I get that it is a bit unusual in how all the elements work together, but I didn't intend for it to be a powerhouse. I can see it may be considered a bit too cheap at $2, especially when compared to something kinda similar like Amulet, so maybe bumping it up to $3 would be a good change.

I like that this does a few different things not as well as some other cards. I think the versatility balances out the relative inefficiency in some of the things it does. I like it at $2; since you are "missing" buying a Silver, this can (sort of) make up for that.

However, the wording "...you may play this from your hand to..." is a bit ambiguous, as it isn't clear whether (a) you're playing the card (and resolving it's effect normally) plus icing the gained card; or (b) playing the card and getting the icing ability instead of the normal effect (like an internal Way). From your comment ("If you do play this early game for free by reacting to a gain, the freezing is intended as a penalty"), it seems clear that you meant it to be (a). You might want to clarify the language by saying...

Quote
"When you gain a card, you may Freeze it 4 times to play this from your hand."

...or if you don't want to use the "Freeze [the card] x times" suggested by segura (that I very much like, see my previous post), it could be...

Quote
"When you gain a card, you may set it aside with 4 Ice tokens on it to play this from your hand."

Original Post Updated (http://forum.dominionstrategy.com/index.php?topic=20780.msg869309#msg869309)

(https://live.staticflickr.com/65535/51164256611_5a46afaedb_b.jpg)

Changed it to the suggested wording. Kinda strange how the reaction is triggered by gaining a card, but the conditional requirement of having Frozen Mine in your hand is not checked until after the Freezing instructions. The original wording used the Black Cat template, but the added Freezing effect did make it ungainly. I like this more. My only concern is whether there are any situations where you can play Frozen Mine without Freezing something, but I can't think of any.
Title: Re: Fan Card Mechanics Contest week 9: too COOL for school
Post by: mathdude on May 07, 2021, 08:47:39 pm
Original Post Updated (http://forum.dominionstrategy.com/index.php?topic=20780.msg869309#msg869309)

(https://live.staticflickr.com/65535/51164256611_a043b8d308_b.jpg)

Changed it to the suggested wording. Kinda strange how the reaction is triggered by gaining a card, but the conditional requirement of having Frozen Mine in your hand is not checked until after the Freezing instructions. The original wording used the Black Cat template, but the added Freezing effect did make it ungainly. I like this more. My only concern is whether there are any situations where you can play Frozen Mine without Freezing something, but I can't think of any.

I think the wording and reaction have been very well updated. The card has good potential. I think your final question is not specifically referring to playing Frozen Mine, but playing it from its Reaction (since its regular Play ability doesn't Freeze anything). And I can't think of any cases where you could React to play it without Freezing a card, since the Play is conditional on the Freezing.

I did wonder about another potential issue though. Are there times that you can have Treasures in play (i.e. they have already generated their value), and still Gain a card without yet being in the Buy part of your Buy phase? If so, then the Reaction could be used to Play Frozen Mines, trash a Treasure from play, Gain a Silver to hand, and still play it.

The two obvious cases are Storyteller and Black Market. So you can trash a Copper or Silver you played (and used) with them, get a Silver to hand, and still use it for 2 more coins. It's even worse with these since it's not just Village, Storyteller/BM, Workshop (or any gainer) where you don't want to Freeze the gained card 4 times just to get 2 extra coins this turn. But it's Village, Storyteller/BM, Frozen Mine. But these combinations are fringe enough that we can call that a perk of the card if you can ever manage to make it happen.

The bigger concern is if there are any Treasure cards that cause a gain when played (and still in the "play treasures" part, not the "buy cards" part of your Buy phase). Looking them up, there's a lot more than I expected:

* Coin of the Realm - when called back into play from Tavern Mat, this can easily be trashed more consistently than Storyteller/BM since it is the Village that lets you play Frozen Mines... but you then have to trash this card, not a Copper.

* Supplies, Horn of Plenty, Lucky Coin all let you gain cards you won't likely want to Freeze, but there may be times you would do it for an extra 2 coins this turn.

* Ill-gotten Gains could change Copper to hand into Frozen Copper and Silver to hand, a pretty good deal.

* Treasure Trove can also Freeze a gained Copper for extra benefit.

* Cursed Gold is the big winner with Frozen Mines. Freeze that gained Curse, get an extra 2 coins this turn, win all around.
Title: Re: Fan Card Mechanics Contest week 9: too COOL for school
Post by: fika monster on May 08, 2021, 09:44:56 am
DEADLINE IS IN APROXIMETELY 24 HOURS
Title: Re: Fan Card Mechanics Contest week 9: too COOL for school
Post by: silverspawn on May 08, 2021, 09:59:02 am
@emtzalex: remember to actually update the image
Title: Re: Fan Card Mechanics Contest week 9: too COOL for school
Post by: emtzalex on May 08, 2021, 10:16:44 pm
@emtzalex: remember to actually update the image

Thanks for the reminder, silverspawn. I updated it to reflect the clearer language.
Title: Re: Fan Card Mechanics Contest week 9: too COOL for school
Post by: NoMoreFun on May 09, 2021, 08:50:42 am
(https://i.imgur.com/ca7wnBR.png)

Fur Trader
Action - $5
+$3
Add an Ice Token to a Supply Pile
____________
Setup: Add an Ice Token to each Supply Pile. When a player gains a card, they freeze it with the Ice Tokens from its pile.
Title: Re: Fan Card Mechanics Contest week 9: too COOL for school
Post by: silverspawn on May 09, 2021, 12:22:03 pm
There is an interesting synergy here with this card and your name
Title: Re: Fan Card Mechanics Contest week 9: too COOL for school
Post by: fika monster on May 09, 2021, 02:02:54 pm
Submissions are closed

making a list of all the submissions now. i think my judgement will be done 11 may. might be done earlier
Title: Re: Fan Card Mechanics Contest week 9: too COOL for school
Post by: fika monster on May 09, 2021, 02:15:33 pm
My judgment of this weeks cards.

Reminder for myself since I am forgetful
What is "ice Tokens"?
A number of cards in the set involve setting aside cards and putting a number of Ice tokens on them, referred to as "freezing" them. At the start of your turn you remove 1 Ice token from each card you own that is frozen with Ice tokens on it and when the last token is removed you put the card into your discard pile.


A quick note: I will be attempting to "grade" the cards. but since I have never done that before, don't take the final score of your card too seriously. I will also write both what i think of the card itself, and how it uses the freeze mechanic. And as always, thanks for everyone that has submitted cards!

(https://i.imgur.com/Oqr26nU.png) - Scout by Segura

A fun stables variant. Its quite simple, but it usually gives the players a tricky decision, but even if you don't have any actions too freeze it gives you +buy, making it something you might buy even if you don't have action cards to freeze. it loves boards with cheap cantrip actions like Pearl diver, and it LOVES Ruins boards.
It makes good use of the freeze mechanic: If you were to simply discard actions with this, you could easily draw them back before the end of the turn. By freezing them, you are making a tougher decision.

Rating: 9/10


(https://i.imgur.com/MuPrrRg.png) - Ice Pond byDunnoItAll

An interesting take on the freeze mechanic. This gives you 2$, which is on the lower end of the power spectrum. But it's passive effect, "+1 card when a ice token is removed" is what makes it interesting. This essentially becomes a Hireling variant. But unlike hireling, which stays in play the entire game, you might have to deal with an inflood of Ice Ponds if you get too trigger happy. This should also interact quite nicely with any other Ice token cards, since you want this to be frozen as long as possible.

I think it uses the Ice token mechanic well.

Rating: 8/10


(https://i.ibb.co/4TRk9t1/Arctic-Village.png) - Artic Village by silverspawn

I feel a bit bad, but for whatever reason i just dont like this card? It seems fine and well balanced, and i cant see any problems with it but I'm just not feeling it, ie, it doesn't excite me? sorry for not having a more concrete critisism
Rating: 6/10 (?)


(https://i.imgur.com/dmampHM.png) - Way of The Scrat by Timinou

Its a quite fun and different way: normally you wouldn't want to use ways on expensive cards, but this makes that a viable option, especially for expensive cards ( i imagine doing this with a card like prince especially).  But doing this means you dont have access to that card for two turns, unless you have some card that unfreezes. It also gives a different pilout option.

I think it uses the Ice token for a way very creatively

Rating 9/10


(https://trello-attachments.s3.amazonaws.com/6019de42b869588d9701fbff/60917744e4882f846857dc1d/b4a60a3f02e2192f85c6df4f5fde9f86/image.png) - Glacial Village by spineflu

This card feels like a bizarre delayed City with a bit of thinning. I basically like it, but i worry that it may become absurdly strong late game: if there is another Ice token card that gives you a lot of Icetokens on something, and you have a lot of different cards, then i imagine you could easily get +10 cards on it. This issue lowers its rating for me. An easy fix in my mind would to have you choose 1 card on the ice token mat that you then draw +1 per token on that card. This still makes Glacial Village very strong in the late game, but would limit its power a bit.

It Uses the Ice token well, its just too strong at 4$ for the moment.

Rating 7/10


(https://i.imgur.com/iYxMqoB.png) - Dissolve by Naitchman

This card uses Ice token rule change - When you remove the last ice token from a card, discard that card at the end of that turn.

A lab variant. If I've understood correctly, with the rule change, if you play this on say, turn 3, it freezes and then you will discard it from the freeze mat at the end of turn 4, meaning you have it back in your deck on turn 5. And if you have two dissolve in hand, you can get one of them back into the deck turn 4.

This seems like a pretty fun dance. I imagine that most decks would want to pick up a cheap lab, even with it being the only Freeze card, and it being out of your deck for some turns. I mean, i buy ride occasionally, and that's a 1 time lab.

It should work well with command cards too: they cant just play it infinitely like they can with experiments, meaning its a bit tougher of a decision.

The Rule change suggestion seems very relevant for this card: If it didn't have it i would probably have rated it lower.

I think it uses the Ice Token very well

Rating: 9/10


(https://trello-attachments.s3.amazonaws.com/5f5a8e8e7ed38b522f25641a/6092382c7bf03251bd188a30/8e0a9de710f1b2de0d6ffceef54c1a63/Glaciate.png) - Glaciate by Aquila

This card uses Ice token rule change - When you remove the last ice token from a card, discard that card at the end of that turn.

A fun non-terminal Remodel variant. The Non victory clause is very smart, as it would have been broken without it. You can remodel into anything, but you have to "overpay" with Ice tokens on the gained card. The fact that its non terminal probably makes it strong. Im not quite sure where its powerlevel is. i like that it has to be pure $ on the gained card: means you cant just gain some potion or debt cards, since they are stronger.

Its a simple and fun card. i like it. It uses the Ice Token Well, and the rule change works for this card as well, albeit its not as relevant.

9/10


(https://i.imgur.com/gzFi60t.png) - Permafrost by mathdude

This card is like hirelings Thinning Cousin. Its probably very strong, as it can, depending on your choice, be a sortof-Exiling cathedral, or Get some card you want out of Ice Mat a bit quicker. I think its probably underpriced, and should probably be priced at 6$, similar to hireling. i think i would probably get this on every board i see it even with a 6$tag.

This card would probably like the Rule change proposed by Naitchman.

8/10


(https://i.imgur.com/q7sNKeo.png) - Mammoth and Discovery by Bootymancer

(https://i.imgur.com/rpxcOkE.png)

A peddler variant. I like it a lot thematiclly, and a 4$ peddler is neat! Discoverys extra $ seems usually pretty easy to trigger, even with no other ice token cards. Mathdudes comments about it mammoth being too easily trashed in most circumstances is true, but i dont think that's a problem, as you usually get a discovery. i cant really think of any criticisms here, i think its good..

8/10



(https://i.imgur.com/eSs5yTch.png) - Ice House by Emtzalex
This one is fun! This is probably pretty good on most boards with weak thinning, and loves other ice token cards. The fact that its gained frozen means that if you open this, you will have just one gained card into your next shuffle, which seems interesting. I also give +points for coming up with a good 1$ card: Its always fun to have more of them.

If Ice house is the only ice token card, i might buy another ice house before the first one is frozen: potentially getting +4$ seems very good.

Fun use of the ice token mechanic.

9/10


(https://i.imgur.com/KdtZdxs.png) - Winter Estate by scolapasta

I dont think I've seen a victory card you can overpay for! Being able to pay extra to keep it out of your deck is nice, and is something that wouldn't work the exile mat as that one is a binary "exiled or not exiled". In addition, getting a coffers or villager every time you remove ice tokens from it is neat: In a game with another ice token remover card, i imagine that you would like to remove ice tokens from winter estate, even if you run the risk into cluttering the deck.

Very good use of the ice token mat, and easy to understand.

9/10

(https://live.staticflickr.com/65535/51164256611_5a46afaedb_b.jpg) - Frozen Mine by Xen3k
Hey this is a fun reaction! I'm one of those people that like the base game mine card, despite it not being very good, so having a cheaper alternative with a fun reaction is nice. I imagine that i would want one or two of these, but that's fine.

This probably likes to hang out with groom and capital: With groom, you can freeze estate AND get +1 card +1 Action AND get the silver to your hand, and its probably strong with capital in the end game, since you dont have to get debt from the capital if you use this, but unlike with counterfeit, you dont get extra money. 3$ is probably the right price for this: since its a silver gainer,/thinner having it be 2$ would make it too good.

Overall, a fun card with a creative reaction.

9/10


(https://imgur.com/cQ8oBw8.png) - Icehouse by The alchemist

hmmm. Im not sure why, but i dont love this card? i think it probably shouldn't be a cantrip, as having 5 of these would mean you can draw through your deck and gain a gold or something. The non victory part here is good tho: It would be absurd if you could play 4 of these and gain 4 frozen provinces.

I think i would like it more if it either gave you +2 Action OR +2 Cards: That would mean you cant just build a deck with this.

Im not sure potion should just get 1 ice token on it, but on the other hand, writing "+2 Ice tokens per Potion" would probably make this card cluttered.
Good use of the Frozen mechanic.

7/10


(https://i.imgur.com/RAjEOk8.png) - by Frozen Village mxdata

A Ghost town variant. Its a lot more expensive, but can stay out of your deck a lot longer then ghost town, and is probably very good.

I like it. Good use of Ice token mechanic.

8/10


(https://i.imgur.com/ca7wnBR.png) - Fur Trader by NoMoreFun
Im probably not the right person to judge this card, as i dont like embargo and this is essentially an icey embargo. But i think its a good card card, and its setup is very interesting. it basically makes it so that the cards you buy on turn 2 stay out of your deck next shuffle. However, with the current way the ice token works, the setup is rendered a bit less meaningful: after that first shuffle, this is less likely to show up, unless you have workshops. On the one hand, this would probably like the rule change proposes by some. but that rule change would also probably make it too harsh? idk

its semi attack is interesting: you could use it on your own turn to then buy a victory card and keep it out of your deck, or try to harm your opponent on their turn. Its more fun than embargo: getting curses when you try to buy something isn't fun for me, but getting the card a bit later is nailbiting i think.

I think its priced appropriately, and it being a 3$  when played is cool: there aren't many terminal golds in dominion.

I like the theming btw. and the ice mechanic use here is neat.

9/10


Runner ups:
Glaciate by Aquila
Way of the scrat by Timinou

An the winner is....
Winner is: winter Estate by scolapasta!!

There were a lot of great entries this week! i hope i did an okay job judging this. (judging this took, i think 3 hours in total invested time spread out over two days, in case anyone is wondering. not sure if that is fast or slow)
Title: Re: Fan Card Mechanics Contest week 9: too COOL for school
Post by: fika monster on May 11, 2021, 09:16:04 am
Judgment has been posted! Apologies for taking time
Title: Re: Fan Card Mechanics Contest week 9: too COOL for school
Post by: naitchman on May 11, 2021, 09:37:58 am
Thanks for the feedback. Just to clarify, if you played dissolve on turn 3 (without another one) you'd remove the first ice token on turn 4, and the second on turn 5, so you'd get it back at the end of turn 5 not turn 4.
Title: Re: Fan Card Mechanics Contest week 9: too COOL for school
Post by: fika monster on May 11, 2021, 09:57:02 am
Thanks for the feedback. Just to clarify, if you played dissolve on turn 3 (without another one) you'd remove the first ice token on turn 4, and the second on turn 5, so you'd get it back at the end of turn 5 not turn 4.

ah, oops

my brain melted a bit during this contest judging, was a ton of cards too judge. i don't think it would have been my win pick even if I had understood it correctly
Title: Re: Fan Card Mechanics Contest week 9: too COOL for school
Post by: silverspawn on May 11, 2021, 10:22:32 am
ah, oops

my brain melted a bit during this contest judging, was a ton of cards too judge. i don't think it would have been my win pick even if I had understood it correctly

The trick is to pick a less popular mechanic so that fewer people will participate.

Congrats @ scolapasta. Winter Estate was my favorite entry as well.
Title: Re: Fan Card Mechanics Contest week 9: too COOL for school
Post by: emtzalex on May 11, 2021, 12:56:01 pm
Judgment has been posted! Apologies for taking time

Thanks for the great judging, fika monster, and for the feedback on my card.

I do have one request. Would you consider naming a runner-up, or one or two finalists? In the Hall of Fame I have posted winners and
runners-up/finalists for each contest. It's certainly not required, and there is no hurry, but if you had a sense of the one or two cards that were just behind Winter Estate, I can put them in the HoF.
Title: Re: Fan Card Mechanics Contest week 9: too COOL for school
Post by: fika monster on May 11, 2021, 01:02:44 pm
Judgment has been posted! Apologies for taking time

Thanks for the great judging, fika monster, and for the feedback on my card.

I do have one request. Would you consider naming a runner-up, or one or two finalists? In the Hall of Fame I have posted winners and
runners-up/finalists for each contest. It's certainly not required, and there is no hurry, but if you had a sense of the one or two cards that were just behind Winter Estate, I can put them in the HoF.
added runners up, tho all 9/10s could be considered runner ups

Runner ups:
Glaciate by Aquila
Way of the scrat by Timinou
Title: Re: Fan Card Mechanics Contest week 9: too COOL for school
Post by: scolapasta on May 11, 2021, 01:12:52 pm
Woot! This is the first time I've won any of these contests (I've had a few runners-up!)

Thanks fika monster, I thought I had a decent shot, because like i said, it felt like ice tokens would "synergize" so well with overpay on a victory card. But there were so many other good entries, I wouldn't have been surprised with receiving another runner-up either.

And interestingly enough, both my entries this week were alt-VP and both did well, so maybe I should just stick with that from now on. :)

I'll get a new contest up in a couple of days - 1) because I want to think about if I can come up with a new mechanic or I just borrow one from the almanac, 2) this contest and the weekly contest have both been ending around the same time, and (at least to me) it would be nice to stagger then a little.
Title: Re: Fan Card Mechanics Contest week 9: too COOL for school
Post by: scolapasta on May 11, 2021, 01:14:53 pm
Judgment has been posted! Apologies for taking time

Thanks for the great judging, fika monster, and for the feedback on my card.

I do have one request. Would you consider naming a runner-up, or one or two finalists? In the Hall of Fame I have posted winners and
runners-up/finalists for each contest. It's certainly not required, and there is no hurry, but if you had a sense of the one or two cards that were just behind Winter Estate, I can put them in the HoF.

I've been meaning to say thank you so much for creating and keeping the Hall of Fame post up to date! You did miss 3rd place on the "aquatic" theme week. It was your entry, so I'm thinking you may have left if off on purpose? But no reason to be humble, 3rd place is great and official and deserves a spot on the HoF.
Title: Re: Fan Card Mechanics Contest week 9: too COOL for school
Post by: emtzalex on May 11, 2021, 01:15:23 pm
Judgment has been posted! Apologies for taking time

Thanks for the great judging, fika monster, and for the feedback on my card.

I do have one request. Would you consider naming a runner-up, or one or two finalists? In the Hall of Fame I have posted winners and
runners-up/finalists for each contest. It's certainly not required, and there is no hurry, but if you had a sense of the one or two cards that were just behind Winter Estate, I can put them in the HoF.
added runners up, tho all 9/10s could be considered runner ups

Runner ups:
Glaciate by Aquila
Way of the scrat by Timinou

Thank you!!!
Title: Re: Fan Card Mechanics Contest week 9: too COOL for school
Post by: emtzalex on May 11, 2021, 01:34:36 pm
As people have pointed out, this mechanic is a lot of fun, and I think the contest has done a good job exploring it. I have a few more thoughts and some other cards I designed. Similar to scolapasta (and others), another great use of the mechanic I toyed with is the capacity keeping dead Victory cards out of your deck (e.g. a temporary Exile). For example:

(https://i.imgur.com/vuXnQl4h.png)

Quote from: Arctic Expansion
Arctic Expansion -- $10
Event
Gain a Province. If you do, Freeze it six times.
                                               

A variant on Domination, instead of giving extra VP, it Freezes the Province for six turns. If bought while greening, this will likely keep the Province out for the rest of the game (or at least not hit a reshuffle). If you get a big confluence of money early on, it allows you to green early (if you have the $2 extra) without slowing your building. In the same vein:

(https://i.imgur.com/JROb3aMh.png)
Quote from: Let It Go
Let It Go -- $4
Action
+1 Card
+1 Action
-----
While this is in play, when you gain a Victory card, Freeze it four times.
                                 

I know I'm not the only one on here with younger kids/nieces/nephews/cousins/siblings who watched Frozen constantly a few years ago. We've had plenty of pop-culture references in this contest, and this seems like a very obvious. A variant of Groundskeeper which (like Arctic Expansion) substitutes Freezing for extra VP. This is also an example of where "Freeze [the card] x times" is a useful syntax, since it allows you to stack these, and have more than one.

Finally, the mechanic has the potential as an Attack, Freezing opponent's cards.

(https://i.imgur.com/ogNFPr3h.png)

Quote from: Woods and Frozen Lake
Woods and Frozen Lake -- $6
Night - Duration - Attack
Until your next turn, when any other player discards an Action card from play, Freeze it twice.
At the start of your next turn, gain a Horse.
                                 


On that front, I came up with this Haunted Woods variant, which Freezes your opponent's Action cards (and is a reference to a much less commercial piece of culture).


Title: Re: Fan Card Mechanics Contest week 9: too COOL for school
Post by: fika monster on May 11, 2021, 03:14:47 pm
Woot! This is the first time I've won any of these contests (I've had a few runners-up!)

Thanks fika monster, I thought I had a decent shot, because like i said, it felt like ice tokens would "synergize" so well with overpay on a victory card. But there were so many other good entries, I wouldn't have been surprised with receiving another runner-up either.

And interestingly enough, both my entries this week were alt-VP and both did well, so maybe I should just stick with that from now on. :)

I'll get a new contest up in a couple of days - 1) because I want to think about if I can come up with a new mechanic or I just borrow one from the almanac, 2) this contest and the weekly contest have both been ending around the same time, and (at least to me) it would be nice to stagger then a little.

Glad to hear your happy! i forgot to mention it, but I think I would have rated the "vp overpay" version and 8 or 7 out of ten: That one would have ran the risk of dragging the game too much, and for some reason, the coffer and villager version seems better too me. But I like that version as well, just not as much
Title: Re: Fan Card Mechanics Contest week 9: too COOL for school
Post by: naitchman on May 11, 2021, 06:37:50 pm
(https://i.imgur.com/BpDafb6.png)
This is another card I thought of with this mechanic. You can set an action card to sleep and reactivate on a precise schedule. The benefit is you get to continuously play it every three turns, the downside is it's no longer in your deck. Can also be used to get rid of actions you no longer need (moneylender, witch, etc.).
Title: Re: Fan Card Mechanics Contest week 9: too COOL for school
Post by: mxdata on May 11, 2021, 08:58:15 pm
One possible use I had toyed with, but ended up not going with in my entry, is the idea of a below-the-line effect "when you remove the last Ice token from this, play it".  This would probably work best combined with a "when you gain this, freeze it X times", but it could also be done as part of a split pile where the other half allows you to freeze an Action card (otherwise it would all too often show up in games without any way to freeze it).  It seems to me that that could have some good potential, perhaps a kind of "time-bomb" attack?

Another possibility might be an "underpay" mechanism.  E.g., a card that costs $X, but you can reduce the cost by freezing it
Title: Re: Fan Card Mechanics Contest week 9: too COOL for school
Post by: mxdata on May 11, 2021, 09:02:27 pm
Quote from: Woods and Frozen Lake
Woods and Frozen Lake -- $6
Night - Duration - Attack
Until your next turn, when any other player discards an Action card from play, Freeze it twice.
At the start of your next turn, gain a Horse.
                                 




On that front, I came up with this Haunted Woods variant, which Freezes your opponent's Action cards (and is a reference to a much less commercial piece of culture).

If I'm reading that correctly, that would cause all the Action cards they played to be Frozen?  If so, that would be a massive hit to deck-drawing engines!
Title: Re: Fan Card Mechanics Contest week 9: too COOL for school
Post by: emtzalex on May 12, 2021, 01:37:53 pm
Judgment has been posted! Apologies for taking time

Thanks for the great judging, fika monster, and for the feedback on my card.

I do have one request. Would you consider naming a runner-up, or one or two finalists? In the Hall of Fame I have posted winners and
runners-up/finalists for each contest. It's certainly not required, and there is no hurry, but if you had a sense of the one or two cards that were just behind Winter Estate, I can put them in the HoF.

I've been meaning to say thank you so much for creating and keeping the Hall of Fame post up to date! You did miss 3rd place on the "aquatic" theme week. It was your entry, so I'm thinking you may have left if off on purpose? But no reason to be humble, 3rd place is great and official and deserves a spot on the HoF.

You're very welcome. I am enjoying this contest and like having a centralized place to look back on previous weeks.

Regarding the Aquatic contest and the 3rd place entry, when I was first putting the HoF I looked at the one for the WDC, and it seemed to only include the winner and second place, unless the finalists were listed as a group, so after your Week (which did not rank the three finalists), I only included two for Weeks 2-5. Since then we have had more judgings with multiple finalists (or with multi-card winners), so I will probably go back and add 3rd place finishers where applicable (but I didn't want to start it with my card).