Dominion Strategy Forum
Miscellaneous => Forum Games => Mafia Game Threads => Topic started by: Glooble on August 19, 2019, 01:37:38 pm
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Welcome to RMM54: War of the Spark Mafia by Glooble.
This game will use an Original, Closed, RMM setup designed by Glooble. It is fairly advanced, but probably less than several of the recent RMM setups that have been run on this site. Knowledge of flavor is not required, but may be helpful.
There is no co-mod. It is possible a dead player may find themselves recruited to this role, but I'm not counting on it.
Sign ups are open.
1. Awaclus
2. WestCoastDidds
3. jotheonah
4. MiX
5. DatSwan
6. faust
7. UncleEurope
8. gkrieg
9. ashersky shraeye
10. raerae
11. pubby
12. Galzria
13. Jimmm
14. EFHW
15. LaLight
Game State Tracker:
Day 1 (http://forum.dominionstrategy.com/index.php?topic=19849.25)|Day 2 (http://forum.dominionstrategy.com/index.php?topic=19849.350)|Day 3 (http://forum.dominionstrategy.com/index.php?topic=19849.700)|Day 4 (http://forum.dominionstrategy.com/index.php?topic=19849.950)
The Rules:
The Golden Rule:
This is a game. Everyone who signs up to play must be considerate of each other, never get personal, and focus on having fun. Once the game starts, having signed up is a commitment: inactivity is just as inconsiderate as rude comments.
The Standard Rules:
1. No communication between players outside of the game thread or shared QTs at any time. This includes passing references, jokes, or cases in other games or threads, whether in context or not.
2. If the game thread is locked, do not post. If you are unsure if something is locked, ask the mod by PM.
3. Direct or verbatim quoting of mod-provided information is strictly forbidden. Paraphrasing is okay. If you are not sure about your paraphrase, ask the mod first.
4. Actions with instructions that do not specify a game state will be resolved in the order they are received.
5. All night actions must be submitted within 24 hours of day ending.
6. Players must post once every 24 hours.
7. Do not edit or delete posts, ever. If you need to clarify or correct something, post again.
8. Invisible text, font size less than 10, and spoiler tags are not allowed.
9. Cryptography is not allowed.
10. The time between a lynch being reached and a flip being provided is called twilight. All players may continue posting during this time, including the lynched player.
11. Dead players may not post in thread or QT, except their Role QT. A lynched player is not "dead" until a flip has been provided.
12. Personal multimedia, such as video or audio recordings, are not allowed in the game thread or QTs.
The Voting Rules:
1. Votes should be in this format: Vote: Playername. Unambiguous nicknames are acceptable.
2. Unvotes should be in this format: unvote or Unvote: Playername.
3. Unvotes are not required if changing your vote from one player to another.
4. You may vote: no lynch.
5. Lynches occur when a simple majority (rounded up) of living players is reached. Once reached, a lynch cannot be undone.
6. If a majority lynch is not reached by the deadline, no lynch occurs.
The Rest:
1. Bold, navy blue text is reserved for the Mod. Players may not use it.
2. If you have an issue or problem with the game, please PM the Mod. Do not post complaints in the game thread.
3. Mods make mistakes - please point them out gently. If they can be corrected, they will. If irreversible, they will stand as final to be commiserated over after the game.
4. If a mod error disadvantages one faction greatly, the game may be called off.
5. Ask all questions and make all requests directly to the Mod via PM or in your Role QT. Questions deemed as "universal" (defined as questions for which the answers should be available to all players) will be requested to be re-posted in the Game Thread and answered there.
6. One prod will be issued after 36 hours without posting in the game thread. Players are subject to replacement or modkill after one prod.
7. All rule violations will be dealt with according to their severity, as determined by the mod, up to modkill.
Deadlines:
1. Days will last 7 IRL days.
2. Nights will last at least 48 IRL hours.
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Public Setup Information:
Nicol Bolas and his minions have lured hundred of Planeswalkers to the city-plane of Ravnica and trapped them there with an artifact called the Immortal Sun. He means to harvest their sparks to fuel his own ascension to godhood. He must be stopped. But first, you'll have to find him, and all of the Planeswalkers he's coerced or corrupted to his side. It's a big plane, Ravnica. Lots of places to hide.
Role Madness:
1. This is a role madness game, which means there are no vanilla townies (I know it doesn't always mean that, but this time it does.) Everyone has some sort of power.
2. Almost everyone has a night action, most, but not all, are one-shot.
3. There may be ways to regain shots.
4. There may be negative utility roles, but no roles are purely negative utility.
Flavor:
1. Flavor will be based on Magic: The Gathering, specifically the “War of the Spark” storyline. All players will take on the role of Planeswalkers who were involved in that story.
2. Town in this game is known as Gatewatch-aligned. Scum is Bolas-aligned.
3. Your role PM will tell you your character’s race, what plane they come from, and what kind of mana they can wield. This information is game-relevant, though not all to the same degree. Bolas-aligned players will be given fake claims containing all of this information.
4. Do not take importance to the storyline as a measure of towniness. Some important characters were reserved for fake claims, and some minor characters are town.
5. There are some items in this game. If you find yourself with an item, you can always give it to another player at night.
6. Most of the time kill flavor will not be mechanically relevant, but if a kill is described in your role PM as looking a certain way, assume everyone will see that when it happens, and that this may reveal the flavor name of the person who committed that kill.
7. You know me- I like to write little stories to go with the vote count. A character appearing in the vote count flavor does not imply that they appear in the game.
Gatewatch Win Condition:
You win when all threats to the Gatewatch have been eliminated, or nothing can prevent this from happening.
A Note about Win Conditions:
There are a handful of players in this game whose win conditions can change if certain conditions are met. However if this is a possibility for you, you will be told about it at the beginning of the game.
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First
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/in
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/in
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First
Asssuming this is an /in.
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/in
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/in
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/in
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I just play one game at a time. If this looks like it will start before silver's game, I'll switch over (sorry silver!).
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/in but put me in slot #11
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/in
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/in
Maybe one of these days I will get a role in a RMM game that isn't negative utility.
But that's doubtful.
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/in
Maybe one of these days I will get a role in a RMM game that isn't negative utility.
But that's doubtful.
I updated the rules post. Do you feel better now?
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/in
Maybe one of these days I will get a role in a RMM game that isn't negative utility.
But that's doubtful.
I updated the rules post. Do you feel better now?
Haha, fair enough.
Appeasement achieved.
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/out
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/in
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/in
Contingent win conditions!
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Anyone else? I really want to get this going.
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INdeed.
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I may end up in two games at once, which I try to avoid, but I’ll /in to help move this along.
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Ask and you shall receive. /in
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I may end up in two games at once, which I try to avoid, but I’ll /in to help move this along.
Same
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Just need 1 more!
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Wow, I have a lot of pull here I guess. :)
raerae, get yo man
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/in, but I will be vla on Sunday.
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Sweet! I have a busy day today but I will randomize roles and get role pms out as soon as I can.
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I also might ignore my various responsibilities in order to get the role pms out ASAP.
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Does anyone know how to make colored text in quicktopic?
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Does anyone know how to make colored text in quicktopic?
<font color="red">Red</font>
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Thanks!
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Thread Locked! Role PMs going out now. If a friendly mod could move this topic, I'd appreciate it.
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Just waiting on one more confirmation.
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I just got the 5 slot notification and this is full up. Congrats.
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is this gonna fire?
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One player has still not confirmed. I have at least one, maybe two volunteers to fill the spot. So hopefully this will fire tomorrow.
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Oh, I replied in the wrong thread. I'm in if needed. plus if player X wants to reclaim their spot I'm fine to trade back.
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/tag
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Hey mailmi!
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Hey mailmi!
Hello! I’m still here, following along, way too busy with school to actually play
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Shraeye is replacing ashersky. Night 0 begins now and will last 24 hours.
THREAD ACTUALLY LOCKED.
PM me with any questions or just ask in your QT.
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Oh, and so I don't have to tell each of you this individually- you can't use your powers on Night Zero unless your PM explicitly says you can.
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You are planeswalkers- mages capable of wandering the multiverse, visiting millions of worlds- or at least you were.
Some of you live here. Some were already here, investigating Bolas’s plot, or on business of your own. Most were lured here by the interplanar beacon. However you got to Ravnica, the city plane, you’re stuck here now. You can’t planewalk away.
And then, in the center of Ravnica’s 10th district, a planar gate opened up and a seemingly-endless horde of blue lazotep-coated zombies began marching through it, killing any who stood in their way. The various armies of Ravnica- the zealous angels of the Boros Legions, the unlikely hybrid creatures of the simic combine, even the deranged circus performers known as the Cult of Rakdos- have all taken up arms in the fight. You are all prepared to fight back as well, to find a way to leave this plane, and to that end you have met up to make a desperate plan. But it is known that Bolas has agents everywhere, and you suspect this room is no exception.
Day 1 Begins Now! It will end at 10:30 am (EST) on October 16th, 2019.
With 15 players alive, it takes 8 to lynch.
Not voting (15): Awaclus, WestCoastDidds, jotheonah, MiX, DatSwan, faust, UncleEurope, gkrieg, shraeye, raerae, pubby, Galzria, Jimmm, EFHW, LaLight
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i drew all lands can I mulligan
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Here we go again!
I read the basics of the War of the Spark story and I think some things are best to be revealed, so let's go.
Nicol Bolas is an Elder Dragon and uses blue, red and black magic. There is most likely an Immortal Sun item, and I do not have it, thus I presume scum starts with it.
I think everything else is minor...
Oh, almost forgot:
Vote: joth
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I am pretty familiar with this flavor and pretty familiar with this mod, so let me know if I can answer any questions people have.
MiX, at the risk of starting the same old day 1 flavor talk game, what makes you think claiming to not have an item is good? What if scum doesn't have the immortal sun but needs it?
I would vote MiX here, but that feels trite and predictable so vote: faust. I usually end up doing that sooner or later anyway.
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Can you give us (me) your thoughts on the Immortal Sun prior to knowing your role this game?
Just talking about flavor untill everyone stops lurking, if even pubby has more posts than any of you then something is wrong :P
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I hadn't really thought about it.
Like, flavorwise we're not trying to escape. We're trying to defeat Bolas and his gang. So the Immortal Sun isn't the important thing, unless there are third parties with alt win conditions who just want to peace. I could see Ob Nixilis or Angrath being in that camp. So yeah, absent any role info, I'm less sold on it being a thing than you.
See even now I'm naming characters which PoE's me being those characters, so we are gonna give away a lot of info if we flavor talk.
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Fine, I got my info already.
Vote: Uncle
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Vote: shraeye
I'm not wrong. Join me, friends.
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Vote: shraeye
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Finally, a game.
Vote: raerae
I will be on US time (i.e. forum time) for this one, so I will get to be active the same time as most of you guys.
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Not being able to talk to faust real time will hurt my sheeping abilities this game... Still:
Vote: raerae
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Don’t worry, MiX, I won’t stop being an insomniac, so I imagine I will be around for at least a chunk of your time.
Vote: Pubby
An utter lack of PubbyGlasses means evil-Pubby as far as I’m concerned.
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holy rvs batman we're starting off with a lot of votes!
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holy rvs batman we're starting off with a lot of votes!
If you were trying to communicate something with this post then I'm afraid it didn't reach me.
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Checking in
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Hi all. I’ll be here but maybe not contributing as much as usual. Comprehensive exam and paper deadlines soon.
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Turns out being around for US evenings is a lot less exciting than I anticipated.
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Is that also how you’re finding our country generally?
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Is that also how you’re finding our country generally?
Oh I wouldn't know, I've been pretty busy so far and have not ventured out into the wild (i.e. outside of Providence) at all. Providence has been pretty fun so far, though the biking is definitely dangerous.
But that reminds me... I should go meet up with you guys. Let me know if you're free on some weekend, I'll be here until start of December.
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Welcome, faust! I hope that Rhode Island is treating you well.
Good luck with comps, gkrieg. You got this!
I am so excited to see RaeRae! And I haven't played with Jimmmmmm in forever!
I know nothing about the flavor, other than a brief bout with the game in 1995 on the debate circuit. Debatepro plays, or he used to...he currently has our kid alphabetizing the cards so he can sell them. Maybe he has your Immortal Sun!
Eddie, classes this semester? Joth, happy anniversary. MiX, hi friend! Shraeye, I am impressed by your pasta making! Pubby, I still don't know you at all. Awa, hi!
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Awaclus
-1
WestCoastDidds
+1
jotheonah
+2
MiX
-2
DatSwan
0
faust
+1
UncleEurope
+1
gkrieg
-1
raerae
+2
pubby
+1
Galzria
+1
Jimmm
+2
EFHW
0
LaLight
+2
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Also, I want to say my flavor name. Thoughts?
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Hey everyone, nice to be in a game again.
I played MtG two or three times with my friend like 10 years ago, so I don't remember anything other than that there are lands that get rotated when used and also there were some Heroes that played a very important role in the game process.
vote: gkrieg
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Not being able to talk to faust real time will hurt my sheeping abilities this game... Still:
Vote: raerae
I guess I will be here!
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I do not have it
What was your motive to reveal this? I mean, what good can claiming this be?
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I do not have it
What was your motive to reveal this? I mean, what good can claiming this be?
Reasons.
Awaclus
-1
WestCoastDidds
+1
jotheonah
+2
MiX
-2
DatSwan
0
faust
+1
UncleEurope
+1
gkrieg
-1
raerae
+2
pubby
+1
Galzria
+1
Jimmm
+2
EFHW
0
LaLight
+2
Vote: shraeye
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Also, I want to say my flavor name. Thoughts?
Thoughts? is a very interesting flavor name. Sounds like a fake claim tbh.
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I do not have it
What was your motive to reveal this? I mean, what good can claiming this be?
Reasons.
Awaclus
-1
WestCoastDidds
+1
jotheonah
+2
MiX
-2
DatSwan
0
faust
+1
UncleEurope
+1
gkrieg
-1
raerae
+2
pubby
+1
Galzria
+1
Jimmm
+2
EFHW
0
LaLight
+2
Vote: shraeye
Interesting, I found that post towny.
Then again, with my history with shraeye, he could say to the whole room, "I am a member of the mafia, but we should lynch X" and I would say "Well, too bad about the alphabet losing a member, Vote: X"
"We will never be able to find treasure again."
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Interesting, I found that post towny.
It's just a bunch of popular opinions that look towny, meh.
Your joke's 10/10 and proof you're not flipping scum D1.
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MiX is just upset because he got -2. I got +2, so I think shraeye is a strong and valuable contributor to the town.
I also have no idea what his post was about.
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Mileva unrolled the slip of paper from the messenger hawk, careful not to let anything show on her face, not just for the benefit of the young Boros recruits around her, but also the small mob of civilians they'd been tasked to protect. If they could even be civilians in a war where the enemies main goal seemed to be indiscriminate killing.
The news wasn't good. Mileva took her lieutenant, a goblin named Grorik, into the corner.
"There's no reinforcements coming," she said.
"What?" said Grorik, "How are we supposed to hold this shelter?"
Mileva looked around at the huddled masses, and what was left of her regiment.
"We can't," she said. "I want you to start organizing the civilians. We're going to engage the creatures and try and draw them off so they can get away. There's a tunnel to the undercity a few blocks west. If they can get there, maybe-"
"We have enough supplies down here to last a few more days," said Grorik. "Maybe rescue will come."
"The whole damn city is under attack," said Mileva. "No one is going to rescue us but us."
Vote Count 1.1
faust (1): jotheonah
shraeye (3): raerae, Awaclus, MiX
raerae (1): faust
pubby (1): UncleEurope
gkrieg (1): LaLight
Not voting (8 ): WestCoastDidds, DatSwan, gkrieg, shraeye, pubby, Galzria, Jimmm, EFHW
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vote: LaLight In obvious retaliation
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vote: LaLight
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vote: LaLight In obvious retaliation
Perpetuating RVS is really not the way to get a slow-starting game back on track. Shame.
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vote: LaLight
What did you do that for?
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Also, I want to say my flavor name. Thoughts?
If you think there's value to it. The downside is that maybe someone bad can do something with that information, but the upside is maybe it will actually start the game. And hey, maybe someone good can do something with that info. Also I don't think scum is in a hurry to proactively claim anything here, so you get town points for offering.
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vote: LaLight In obvious retaliation
Perpetuating RVS is really not the way to get a slow-starting game back on track. Shame.
vote: LaLight
What did you do that for?
Awaclus: Are you LaLight's scumbuddy?
PPE: And the sky is blue, and the grass' green, and...
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vote: LaLight In obvious retaliation
Perpetuating RVS is really not the way to get a slow-starting game back on track. Shame.
But I hadn’tRVSd yet!
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Also, I want to say my flavor name. Thoughts?
I think that you want to say that you want to say your flavor name more than you actually want to say your flavor name.
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vote: LaLight
What did you do that for?
Aww I feel so good, thanks faust!
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Hi everyone. I'm vla through Sunday but should be able to keep up once I catch up.
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Finally, a game.
Vote: raerae
I will be on US time (i.e. forum time) for this one, so I will get to be active the same time as most of you guys.
Not with me -- I'm in France!
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@faust, thoughts and feelings on MiX claiming the sun thing?
@shraeye, do you think everybody should flavor name claim or just you cuz you're a special flower?
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@faust, thoughts and feelings on MiX claiming the sun thing?
I don't think revealing how I feel about this is beneficial at this point.
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@faust, thoughts and feelings on MiX claiming the sun thing?
I don't think revealing how I feel about this is beneficial at this point.
Ahhhhh, so cryptic, I loave it. Do you believe it's harmful? Or are you just being sly?
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@faust, thoughts and feelings on MiX claiming the sun thing?
I don't think revealing how I feel about this is beneficial at this point.
Ahhhhh, so cryptic, I loave it. Do you believe it's harmful? Or are you just being sly?
In either of those cases, why would I answer this question?
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Flying home today - will start up for me tomorrow.
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@faust, thoughts and feelings on MiX claiming the sun thing?
I don't think revealing how I feel about this is beneficial at this point.
Ahhhhh, so cryptic, I loave it. Do you believe it's harmful? Or are you just being sly?
In either of those cases, why would I answer this question?
Because you were complaining nobody was around last night and we're both here now so I thought I'd try to make some conversation. I will absolutely avoid asking you questions you don't want to answer in the future.
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@faust, thoughts and feelings on MiX claiming the sun thing?
I don't think revealing how I feel about this is beneficial at this point.
Ahhhhh, so cryptic, I loave it. Do you believe it's harmful? Or are you just being sly?
In either of those cases, why would I answer this question?
Because you were complaining nobody was around last night and we're both here now so I thought I'd try to make some conversation. I will absolutely avoid asking you questions you don't want to answer in the future.
I don't mean to be difficult. Just keep in mind that if I expressed that I am unwilling to discuss a certain subject, then prodding me further in that direction is unlikely to yield results.
We can absolutely converse though. For instance, is your vote still RVS? Have you developed any reads so far?
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Finally, a game.
Vote: raerae
I will be on US time (i.e. forum time) for this one, so I will get to be active the same time as most of you guys.
Not with me -- I'm in France!
How exciting! Where are you? Work or fun?? I love France!
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Flying home today - will start up for me tomorrow.
Galzy, where you been?
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@faust, thoughts and feelings on MiX claiming the sun thing?
I don't think revealing how I feel about this is beneficial at this point.
Ahhhhh, so cryptic, I loave it. Do you believe it's harmful? Or are you just being sly?
In either of those cases, why would I answer this question?
Because you were complaining nobody was around last night and we're both here now so I thought I'd try to make some conversation. I will absolutely avoid asking you questions you don't want to answer in the future.
I don't mean to be difficult. Just keep in mind that if I expressed that I am unwilling to discuss a certain subject, then prodding me further in that direction is unlikely to yield results.
We can absolutely converse though. For instance, is your vote still RVS? Have you developed any reads so far?
Mostly RVS with a healthy dose of 'shraeye is always scum' mindset mixed in. No reads so far. I'm interested in what people think about shraeye's flavor name claim (honestly I just like saying that) but the lack of reaction to it is interesting too.
How about you? I feel like faust doesn't RVS so why am I scum? Where's everybody else rank on the bad guy list?
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How about you? I feel like faust doesn't RVS so why am I scum?
I know this one: It's because you got a PM saying that!
Also opening with the dead "shraeye is always scum" meme is boring, predictable and exactly what scum!raerae would do. And you addressed a question to me; the towny reason to ask people random questions is to get them to engage, and really I am the last person you need to draw into the game, so I can only suspect there's an ulterior motive behind that.
Where's everybody else rank on the bad guy list?
Below you. I don't think my other reads are at the level where sharing them is useful right now.
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How about you? I feel like faust doesn't RVS so why am I scum?
I know this one: It's because you got a PM saying that!
Also opening with the dead "shraeye is always scum" meme is boring, predictable and exactly what scum!raerae would do. And you addressed a question to me; the towny reason to ask people random questions is to get them to engage, and really I am the last person you need to draw into the game, so I can only suspect there's an ulterior motive behind that.
Where's everybody else rank on the bad guy list?
Below you. I don't think my other reads are at the level where sharing them is useful right now.
It's also exactly what town!raerae would do as evidenced by every other game I've played except the one where he was mod-confirmed town to me. So I'm just going to call that a crappy argument. As far as addressing you, I did it because I thought you'd have something to say and we're close enough to the same time zone for once so why not take advantage of that? But let's play for a minute, what is my sneaky evil motive for asking you questions? Am I just supposed to ignore you some you don't need to be prompted to join the game? That's also silly.
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So I'm just going to call that a crappy argument.
It's certainly better than any argument you have made for someone's alignment.
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Hi everyone! I've done a fair bit of thinking about Mafia in recent months but very little playing, so who knows how I'll go with this game.
My availability should generally be pretty good, except that I'll be away for about 4 days next week. I should still be able to post, just sparingly.
I know nothing about the flavour and probably won't really participate in flavour-related discussions.
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Hey All!
I was where Galz was (Denver, CO) for the entirety of last week at a conference.
This is really just a check in post - I landed like 2 hours ago, and I have read up but I have not had time to really think about anything specific.
General Assumptions:
A) I agree with whoever said talking about flavor probably not super great this game. Not for their reasons, but for the reasons that Gloobs went out of the way to post this in set up:
"4. Do not take importance to the storyline as a measure of towniness. Some important characters were reserved for fake claims, and some minor characters are town."
So aside from the normal facts of it being potential misleading to do flavor stuff this early on... that kind of makes me feel like it would be the opposite of beneficial for town.
B) This was also posted in set up:
"3. Your role PM will tell you your character’s race, what plane they come from, and what kind of mana they can wield. This information is game-relevant, though not all to the same degree. Bolas-aligned players will be given fake claims containing all of this information."
I don't see a real advantage in claiming hard anything this early on... but if anything were to be the topic, it should absolutely be the MOD-confirmed RELEVANT information (plane, race, mana) and not stuff to do with the flavor.
That is just where I am at from a skim. After I finally get some damn sleep here I will be around more regularly.
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Awaclus: Are you LaLight's scumbuddy?
I'm not.
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Finally, a game.
Vote: raerae
I will be on US time (i.e. forum time) for this one, so I will get to be active the same time as most of you guys.
Not with me -- I'm in France!
How exciting! Where are you? Work or fun?? I love France!
Husband working, me and 18 year old tagging along for fun. Paris.
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faust's points about raerae aren't bad, but it seems to me he thinks she is scum almost as often as she thinks it about Shraeye.
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A) I agree with whoever said talking about flavor probably not super great this game. Not for their reasons, but for the reasons that Gloobs went out of the way to post this in set up:
"4. Do not take importance to the storyline as a measure of towniness. Some important characters were reserved for fake claims, and some minor characters are town."
So aside from the normal facts of it being potential misleading to do flavor stuff this early on... that kind of makes me feel like it would be the opposite of beneficial for town.
I don't know what's special about this. Every well-designed game works lke this.
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Awaclus
-2
WestCoastDidds
+1
jotheonah
+3
MiX
-2
DatSwan
+1
faust
+2
UncleEurope
+1
gkrieg
-1
raerae
+0
pubby
+1
Galzria
+1
Jimmm
+2
EFHW
-1
LaLight
+2
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Wow I am really crushing it in shraeye-town. With this much plussing, I should be almost ready to ultimate.
(Seriously) going at raerae for voting for shraeye in rvs is like going for Joseph for claiming SK. Some people have their little start of game traditions, but it's about the least alignment-indicative thing I can imagine. I would vote: faust, but I think I'm already there? So I'll call it good.
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Yeah, but also people who start every game the same, sa Joseph claiming SK, again, are having an easy entrance into the game, independent of alignment. I personally think it's more scummy than not, so vote: raerae
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Who was it, gkrieg, who started every game voting for Witherweaver even if he was not in the game? Iirc, it turned out gkrieg sometimes forgot to do that as town and did that as scum every time, because it was an easy RVS post.
Not sure I remember correctly, but that was the case. Maybe it was Awaclus voting for silver though
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I am also a bit wary about shraeye making points posts. Makes him scummier in my eyes and if shraeye and raerae are scums together, it will suit my narrative and I like it
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Also also I am so freaking happy to be in a mafia game, my God the feelings
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Who was it, gkrieg, who started every game voting for Witherweaver even if he was not in the game? Iirc, it turned out gkrieg sometimes forgot to do that as town and did that as scum every time, because it was an easy RVS post.
Not sure I remember correctly, but that was the case. Maybe it was Awaclus voting for silver though
I did do that for a time but I was extremely consistent with it. I never forgot to do it as either alignment
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vote: shraeye
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vote: shraeye
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Why did I lose a point?
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Vote: pubby
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Wow I am really crushing it in shraeye-town. With this much plussing, I should be almost ready to ultimate.
(Seriously) going at raerae for voting for shraeye in rvs is like going for Joseph for claiming SK. Some people have their little start of game traditions, but it's about the least alignment-indicative thing I can imagine. I would vote: faust, but I think I'm already there? So I'll call it good.
Why do you think that me having a read that you disagree with is scummy?
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vote: pubby
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The civilians were bunched up behind the soldiers, each carrying whatever supplies they could. Mileva, Grorik, and the six soldiers left from her regiment crowded around the door, swords drawn. Mileva was holding a small metal cannister- a gift from the Boros Legion/ Izzet league collaboration known as the Warmind Inititative.
"Well," she said to her men. "It's been an honor serving with you."
She threw open the door and hurled the canister. Lightning snaked out of it, enveloping the four shining blue skeletal forms that had been banding at the door and stunning them for long enough for the soldiers to get out. There were more zombies behind them of course, but Mileva and her soldiers rushed them, hoping to make a whole large enough for the civilians to get through.
It was a vain hope, Mileva realized, bracing herself against her shield. But then she heard a beautiful sound- hoofbeats. Lots of them.
Five, Six, no Seven Centaurs rushed down the alley, mowing over the startled Zombies. Maybe the Boros hadn't been able to send reinforcement, but it looked like the Selesnya Conclave had. At their center was a fierce warrior the like of which Mileva had never seen before. A giant cat, but shaped like a person, wielding a huge double-sided axe, slicing down zombies while tossing healing and reinforcing magic at the centaurs. Some kind of new Simic construct maybe? Or some creature from so far away she'd never even heard of them?
Or could it be one of those beings from another world, the ones the rumors had been circulating about for years?
"Get them to safety!" Ajani told Mileva, "We'll handle this."
As she led her people to the tunnel, Mileva reflected on her strange savior. The people of Ravnica could never fight back this threat on their own. But maybe these visitors would come to their aid...
Vote Count 1.2
faust (1): jotheonah
shraeye (5): raerae, Awaclus, MiX, gkrieg, pubby
pubby (3): UncleEurope, faust, LaLight
Not voting (6): WestCoastDidds, DatSwan, shraeye, Galzria, Jimmm, EFHW
With 15 alive, it takes 8 to lynch. Day Ends at 10:30 am (EST) on October 16th, 2019.
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Vote: pubby
vote: pubby
How about no? This is extremely far away from what I would consider an approach town!pubby wouldn't do, and with no scum games on his belt, what's really the case beyond "he feels scummy"?
For pubby votes, I believe a small case is best, otherwise we could all just mislynch him again for the same reasons we keep finding him scummy every game. He hasn't been scum when he acts like this, why would he be scum now?
FoS both of you for this lazy vote.
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Can you add "With 15 alive, it takes 8 to lynch" to the votecount? I spent precious seconds calculating that 8.
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vote: pubby
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Vote: pubby
vote: pubby
How about no? This is extremely far away from what I would consider an approach town!pubby wouldn't do, and with no scum games on his belt, what's really the case beyond "he feels scummy"?
For pubby votes, I believe a small case is best, otherwise we could all just mislynch him again for the same reasons we keep finding him scummy every game. He hasn't been scum when he acts like this, why would he be scum now?
FoS both of you for this lazy vote.
This is also a really weird reaction to someone getting a few votes
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Can you add "With 15 alive, it takes 8 to lynch" to the votecount? I spent precious seconds calculating that 8.
Knew I was forgetting something. Fixed.
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vote: pubby
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How about no? This is extremely far away from what I would consider an approach town!pubby wouldn't do, and with no scum games on his belt, what's really the case beyond "he feels scummy"?
He's annoying and useless and anti-town.
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vote: pubby
oh boy, we got a Morgrim on our hands.
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How about no? This is extremely far away from what I would consider an approach town!pubby wouldn't do, and with no scum games on his belt, what's really the case beyond "he feels scummy"?
He's annoying and useless and anti-town.
This is all true, but why is he scum?
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Wow I am really crushing it in shraeye-town. With this much plussing, I should be almost ready to ultimate.
(Seriously) going at raerae for voting for shraeye in rvs is like going for Joseph for claiming SK. Some people have their little start of game traditions, but it's about the least alignment-indicative thing I can imagine. I would vote: faust, but I think I'm already there? So I'll call it good.
Why do you think that me having a read that you disagree with is scummy?
I don't. I think you making a lazy nonsense case is scummy. And I think you mischaracterizing my post in the way you just did is also scummy.
I want to vote pubby for self-voting but unfortunately I think he's probably town.
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How about no? This is extremely far away from what I would consider an approach town!pubby wouldn't do, and with no scum games on his belt, what's really the case beyond "he feels scummy"?
He's annoying and useless and anti-town.
This is all true, but why is he scum?
Why is he town? Are you his scumbuddy?
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How about no? This is extremely far away from what I would consider an approach town!pubby wouldn't do, and with no scum games on his belt, what's really the case beyond "he feels scummy"?
He's annoying and useless and anti-town.
This is all true, but why is he scum?
Why is he town? Are you his scumbuddy?
Because he's not acting any different from his town self. Except his self-vote, but that was after I started this.
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Wow I am really crushing it in shraeye-town. With this much plussing, I should be almost ready to ultimate.
(Seriously) going at raerae for voting for shraeye in rvs is like going for Joseph for claiming SK. Some people have their little start of game traditions, but it's about the least alignment-indicative thing I can imagine. I would vote: faust, but I think I'm already there? So I'll call it good.
Why do you think that me having a read that you disagree with is scummy?
I don't. I think you making a lazy nonsense case is scummy. And I think you mischaracterizing my post in the way you just did is also scummy.
I want to vote pubby for self-voting but unfortunately I think he's probably town.
You think making a lazy nonsense case is scummier than making no case at all?
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How about no? This is extremely far away from what I would consider an approach town!pubby wouldn't do, and with no scum games on his belt, what's really the case beyond "he feels scummy"?
He's annoying and useless and anti-town.
This is all true, but why is he scum?
There is no in-game incentive to be difficult as town, there is as scum. But other than that, if he continues to be a liability then it's worth it to eliminate him early regardless of alignment.
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Because he's not acting any different from his town self. Except his self-vote, but that was after I started this.
And does the self-vote change your opinion?
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Because he's not acting any different from his town self. Except his self-vote, but that was after I started this.
And does the self-vote change your opinion?
Yes, but I don't want the day to end now, that's anti-town. We should look into other alternatives.
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Because he's not acting any different from his town self. Except his self-vote, but that was after I started this.
And does the self-vote change your opinion?
Yes, but I don't want the day to end now, that's anti-town. We should look into other alternatives.
You can end the day now? Do you have super special multivote powers?
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Because he's not acting any different from his town self.
Vote: MiX
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Because he's not acting any different from his town self. Except his self-vote, but that was after I started this.
And does the self-vote change your opinion?
Yes, but I don't want the day to end now, that's anti-town. We should look into other alternatives.
You can end the day now? Do you have super special multivote powers?
Scum can quickhammer if I vote if I counted them correctly. Besides, pubby's not scum, so we should look into scum before lynching anti-town.
Because he's not acting any different from his town self.
Vote: MiX
Okaaay...where's the difference then?
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Because he's not acting any different from his town self. Except his self-vote, but that was after I started this.
And does the self-vote change your opinion?
Yes, but I don't want the day to end now, that's anti-town. We should look into other alternatives.
You can end the day now? Do you have super special multivote powers?
Scum can quickhammer if I vote if I counted them correctly. Besides, pubby's not scum, so we should look into scum before lynching anti-town.
So what, you thought pubby was town, then you said the self-vote changed your mind, but you still think he's town?
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You think making a lazy nonsense case is scummier than making no case at all?
Absolutely, 100%, every time. Town makes no case all the time. I guarantee there are lots of townies making no case right now, cause they have no idea who scum is. Lazy nonsense cases, on the other hand, come from people who aren't trying to catch scum at all, just stir up trouble and get townies mislynched.
You can end the day now? Do you have super special multivote powers?
This, however, reads like annoying town faust. So there's a data point in that direction.
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Because he's not acting any different from his town self. Except his self-vote, but that was after I started this.
And does the self-vote change your opinion?
Yes, but I don't want the day to end now, that's anti-town. We should look into other alternatives.
You can end the day now? Do you have super special multivote powers?
Scum can quickhammer if I vote if I counted them correctly. Besides, pubby's not scum, so we should look into scum before lynching anti-town.
So what, you thought pubby was town, then you said the self-vote changed your mind, but you still think he's town?
He's as scum as anyone else, I haven't seen towny nor scummy things yet. This means that he's most likely town, because everyone's most likely town. But I would lynch him now, due to his self-vote. So in a way my reads didn't change but my "lynch priority" did, so to speak.
I'm saying all of this, but I haven't reread him, maybe I should...
PPE: Yes. Yes. Why are you voting faust?
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PPE: Yes. Yes. Why are you voting faust?
I don't like the cut of his jib.
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Okaaay...where's the difference then?
The difference is that you're scum.
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Scum can quickhammer if I vote if I counted them correctly. Besides, pubby's not scum, so we should look into scum before lynching anti-town.
Ah yes, the day 1 scum quickhammer, a tried and true tactic.
Also, how could you even calculate this without knowing how many scum there are, which, I just double-checked, is not currently mod-supplied info?
vote: MiX
faust, I'm still keeping my eye on you.
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Scum can quickhammer if I vote if I counted them correctly. Besides, pubby's not scum, so we should look into scum before lynching anti-town.
Ah yes, the day 1 scum quickhammer, a tried and true tactic.
Also, how could you even calculate this without knowing how many scum there are, which, I just double-checked, is not currently mod-supplied info?
vote: MiX
faust, I'm still keeping my eye on you.
There's at least 3 (there's always at least 3), and I assumed pubby was scum when doing this. He has (had?) 5 votes, right? Not sure.
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I assumed pubby was scum
Scum can quickhammer if I vote if I counted them correctly. Besides, pubby's not scum
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How about no? This is extremely far away from what I would consider an approach town!pubby wouldn't do, and with no scum games on his belt, what's really the case beyond "he feels scummy"?
He's annoying and useless and anti-town.
Lynching him for those reasons is annoying, useless and anti town.
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Scum can quickhammer if I vote if I counted them correctly. Besides, pubby's not scum, so we should look into scum before lynching anti-town.
Ah yes, the day 1 scum quickhammer, a tried and true tactic.
Also, how could you even calculate this without knowing how many scum there are, which, I just double-checked, is not currently mod-supplied info?
vote: MiX
faust, I'm still keeping my eye on you.
There's at least 3 (there's always at least 3), and I assumed pubby was scum when doing this. He has (had?) 5 votes, right? Not sure.
Seems to me like the "at least" number (the lower limit) would not be the relevant number in calculating whether a quickhammer is possible. If there are, in fact, 4 scum, then the quickhammer was already possible and your vote wouldn't matter.
But that's semantics. The fact is, the quickhammer thing was an absurd thing to say. Do you really think (A) there's currently no scum on pubby and (B) all the scum in the game would jump on him quickly to get their day 1 mislynch in? Quickhammers are late game phenomena. There's no reason to be talking about a quick hammer in the early game. Also ... you assumed pubby was scum? Huh? That... that must be a typo right? Cause if you thought he was scum then worrying about a quickhammer would be extra weird.
Here's another scenario to try on for size: You're scum who wanted to jump on the bad pubby wagon but didn't want to look to eager, so you made up the quickhammer thing as a way to justify not voting now that wouldn't make you look bad if you decided to vote later.
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Scum can quickhammer if I vote if I counted them correctly. Besides, pubby's not scum, so we should look into scum before lynching anti-town.
Ah yes, the day 1 scum quickhammer, a tried and true tactic.
Also, how could you even calculate this without knowing how many scum there are, which, I just double-checked, is not currently mod-supplied info?
vote: MiX
faust, I'm still keeping my eye on you.
There's at least 3 (there's always at least 3), and I assumed pubby was scum when doing this. He has (had?) 5 votes, right? Not sure.
Seems to me like the "at least" number (the lower limit) would not be the relevant number in calculating whether a quickhammer is possible. If there are, in fact, 4 scum, then the quickhammer was already possible and your vote wouldn't matter.
But that's semantics. The fact is, the quickhammer thing was an absurd thing to say. Do you really think (A) there's currently no scum on pubby and (B) all the scum in the game would jump on him quickly to get their day 1 mislynch in? Quickhammers are late game phenomena. There's no reason to be talking about a quick hammer in the early game. Also ... you assumed pubby was scum? Huh? That... that must be a typo right? Cause if you thought he was scum then worrying about a quickhammer would be extra weird.
Here's another scenario to try on for size: You're scum who wanted to jump on the bad pubby wagon but didn't want to look to eager, so you made up the quickhammer thing as a way to justify not voting now that wouldn't make you look bad if you decided to vote later.
Careful now. This looks suspiciously like a lazy nonsense case to me.
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How about no? This is extremely far away from what I would consider an approach town!pubby wouldn't do, and with no scum games on his belt, what's really the case beyond "he feels scummy"?
He's annoying and useless and anti-town.
Lynching him for those reasons is annoying, useless and anti town.
A) No it's not. Letting lurkers lurk to the late game is what's anti-town.
B) Why is everyone (i.e. you and MiX) obsessing about who we're lynching? It's early Day 1. We're looking to run some wagons and gain info. Shutting down wagons while not creating alternatives isn't helping.
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Careful now. This looks suspiciously like a lazy nonsense case to me.
This is a suspicious lazy nonsense defense.
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Seems to me like the "at least" number (the lower limit) would not be the relevant number in calculating whether a quickhammer is possible. If there are, in fact, 4 scum, then the quickhammer was already possible and your vote wouldn't matter.
But that's semantics. The fact is, the quickhammer thing was an absurd thing to say. Do you really think (A) there's currently no scum on pubby and (B) all the scum in the game would jump on him quickly to get their day 1 mislynch in? Quickhammers are late game phenomena. There's no reason to be talking about a quick hammer in the early game. Also ... you assumed pubby was scum? Huh? That... that must be a typo right? Cause if you thought he was scum then worrying about a quickhammer would be extra weird.
Here's another scenario to try on for size: You're scum who wanted to jump on the bad pubby wagon but didn't want to look to eager, so you made up the quickhammer thing as a way to justify not voting now that wouldn't make you look bad if you decided to vote later.
I'm not sure how to answer this, other than, no, I wasn't actually calculating quickhammers when I decided not to vote. It's just general good sense to not vote up a wagon that you don't want lynched, and well I don't want pubby lynched. The quickhammer part was for why my vote mattered, which is does, in that world where scum wants to quicklynch after town votes or something. It would be a great move if pulled off correctly, and I don't want to give scum that option. Your scum!MiX theory is too tacked on, think about it and try again.
How about no? This is extremely far away from what I would consider an approach town!pubby wouldn't do, and with no scum games on his belt, what's really the case beyond "he feels scummy"?
He's annoying and useless and anti-town.
Lynching him for those reasons is annoying, useless and anti town.
A) No it's not. Letting lurkers lurk to the late game is what's anti-town.
B) Why is everyone (i.e. you and MiX) obsessing about who we're lynching? It's early Day 1. We're looking to run some wagons and gain info. Shutting down wagons while not creating alternatives isn't helping.
"Shutting down the wagon" made the wagon much stronger: pubby's self-vote strenghtened his scummyness. Questioning the wagon is part of gaining info.
Careful now. This looks suspiciously like a lazy nonsense case to me.
This is a suspicious lazy nonsense defense.
Of whom? Me?
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Okaaay...where's the difference then?
The difference is that you're scum.
What does this have to do with pubby's alignment?
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What does this have to do with pubby's alignment?
It has to do with your alignment, which is why I'm voting for you.
Of whom? Me?
Yes.
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We can keep up the MiX-faust-Awaclus-Joth bickering if you guys want, but I’d like to hear from the other 11 people in the game, especially ones like Didds and Galz who haven’t weighed in since RVS. Also pubby, I know barely playing is kind of your thing, but probably getting in here and making a post with more than 10 words is a good way to avoid being today’s lynch.
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Scum can quickhammer if I vote if I counted them correctly. Besides, pubby's not scum, so we should look into scum before lynching anti-town.
Ah yes, the day 1 scum quickhammer, a tried and true tactic.
Also, how could you even calculate this without knowing how many scum there are, which, I just double-checked, is not currently mod-supplied info?
vote: MiX
faust, I'm still keeping my eye on you.
There's at least 3 (there's always at least 3), and I assumed pubby was scum when doing this. He has (had?) 5 votes, right? Not sure.
Why would scum quickhammer themselves?
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Is MiX still the easy D1 lunch?
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Haiiiii....
I’m on a vacation weekend in North Carolina. It’s lovely!
So, there are 3 pages of content since I last read. I’m those pages, pubby and MiX are ringing all of my scum bells. MiX more than pubby, but both of them are like a -4 of a Shraeye scale for me. I don’t have good reasons more than “feels” and “seems” but it’s as good as anyone else has this early on.
LaLi- I’m so glad you’re back and excited to be back. Love!
Vote: MiX I know I tend to find him scummy pretty much always but his everything he’s said about pubby is scumdilicious
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Is MiX still the easy D1 lunch?
Obvi
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Lazy nonsense cases, on the other hand, come from people who aren't trying to catch scum at all, just stir up trouble and get townies mislynched.
You're implying that townies don't want to stir up trouble. I disagree.
Why did I lose a point?
Careful, or it could become two.
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Wow I am really crushing it in shraeye-town. With this much plussing, I should be almost ready to ultimate.
(Seriously) going at raerae for voting for shraeye in rvs is like going for Joseph for claiming SK. Some people have their little start of game traditions, but it's about the least alignment-indicative thing I can imagine. I would vote: faust, but I think I'm already there? So I'll call it good.
Why do you think that me having a read that you disagree with is scummy?
I don't. I think you making a lazy nonsense case is scummy. And I think you mischaracterizing my post in the way you just did is also scummy.
I want to vote pubby for self-voting but unfortunately I think he's probably town.
Do you really think these things make faust more likely to be scum? Or do they simply frustrating (a.k.a. things you wish he wasn't doing a.k.a. distracting from your ability scumhunt, ergo anti-town)?
It feels more like the second to me; it's valid to not want lazy cases or mischaracterizations (but were they?). Or are you actually saying that faust's actions are more likely to come from scum-faust than town-faust?
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I am finding faust scummy, but my track record on reading faust in particular is not great. That’s why I’m much more into this MiX thing for day 1.
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Wee I'm here, DAMA.
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shraeye coming in to defend me seems like a first.
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I am finding faust scummy, but my track record on reading faust in particular is not great. That’s why I’m much more into this MiX thing for day 1.
How's your track record with MiX?
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We can keep up the MiX-faust-Awaclus-Joth bickering if you guys want, but I’d like to hear from the other 11 people in the game, especially ones like Didds and Galz who haven’t weighed in since RVS. Also pubby, I know barely playing is kind of your thing, but probably getting in here and making a post with more than 10 words is a good way to avoid being today’s lynch.
It's not like our bickering is stopping others from posting. Unless we bicker so fast that there's a PPE every time they hit that post button.
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So, I barely remember pubby's and MiX's playstyles, all I remember was that in first games MiX played he was lynched every time in the beginning of the game. I guess I can see why.
pubby, can you please talk a bit about yourself and your games, or just talk? Were there any post from them other than votes? Can there be post restrictions?
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also I remind yall about my signature, weekends are coming
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also I remind yall about my signature, weekends are coming
(https://i.imgflip.com/3d44bp.jpg) (https://imgflip.com/i/3d44bp) (https://imgflip.com/memegenerator)
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So, I barely remember pubby's and MiX's playstyles, all I remember was that in first games MiX played he was lynched every time in the beginning of the game. I guess I can see why.
That was just one game, then I got better at playing and haven't been mislynched since! I'd like to keep that record clean, by the way...
Wee I'm here, DAMA.
See? I was sleeping so I passed on the opportunity of finding out faust's alignment. Clearly moving timezones is scummy.
Vote: MiX I know I tend to find him scummy pretty much always but his everything he’s said about pubby is scumdilicious
Are we scumbuddies in your eyes?
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You can end the day now? Do you have super special multivote powers?
Scum can quickhammer if I vote if I counted them correctly. Besides, pubby's not scum, so we should look into scum before lynching anti-town.
This seems worth a Day 1 vote. I think scum tend to push these sorts of worries more than Town. Somewhat ironically though, I won't vote until I've seen a vote count.
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Here's a vote count:
Vote Count 1.2
faust (1): jotheonah
shraeye (5): raerae, Awaclus, MiX, gkrieg, pubby
pubby (3): UncleEurope, faust, LaLight
Not voting (6): WestCoastDidds, DatSwan, shraeye, Galzria, Jimmm, EFHW
With 15 alive, it takes 8 to lynch. Day Ends at 10:30 am (EST) on October 16th, 2019.
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I'm pretty sure there have been some MiX votes since then. Probably not 6-7 though.
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I'm pretty sure there have been some MiX votes since then.
That's true, but it was a vote count.
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I am finding faust scummy, but my track record on reading faust in particular is not great. That’s why I’m much more into this MiX thing for day 1.
How's your track record with MiX?
...Slightly better?
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shraeye coming in to defend me seems like a first.
Right?!
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Vote: MiX I know I tend to find him scummy pretty much always but his everything he’s said about pubby is scumdilicious
Are we scumbuddies in your eyes?
Probably. Gas pubby ever been scum? Maybe now is his time.
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pubby, can you please talk a bit about yourself and your games, or just talk? Were there any post from them other than votes? Can there be post restrictions?
I have a weird ability involving votes. It's optional but I'm going to do it as much as I can.
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Gas pubby
That sounds rather violent, although I guess it depends on the gas whether it's better or worse than any other method of lynching.
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Clearly moving timezones is scummy.
Welcome to Ecological Footprint Mafia!
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Vote: Didds
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Vote: Didds
When did you decide this was a good idea?
Unrelated:
Vote: Jimmmmmmmm
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Hey Swan, that first post doesn't actually count to fulfill your "first post is a generic setup post" meta because (almost) none of that's specific to this game, you might need to look towny some other way.
Hey Galzria, it's been a day, maybe you can show up?
Hey shraeye, are you claiming the flavor name or what? Don't leave us hanging.
Also, how does one read Didds? Can someone teach me? I'm reading her scum game and I'm just seeing Didds be Didds over and over...
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Gas pubby
That sounds rather violent, although I guess it depends on the gas whether it's better or worse than any other method of lynching.
Yikes! What a terrible typo. But you’re right, of course...as fast as wats to die, gassing is pretty okay.
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Also, how does one read Didds? Can someone teach me? I'm reading her scum game and I'm just seeing Didds be Didds over and over...
Heck if I know. I know that when I was a traitor I was super nervous and checked in more frequently than I’m doing now. But I’d don’t really have much artifacts and I’m super interested in people and their lives and stuff, so what done people find scummy, is just me. I’ve been scum on Jimmmmms platform s few times, but the closest I’ve come on f.ds was a survivor (Dirk Gently) and a traitor in Dark Skies. Mostly I’m just super lucky at drawing town! :)
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How about no? This is extremely far away from what I would consider an approach town!pubby wouldn't do, and with no scum games on his belt, what's really the case beyond "he feels scummy"?
He's annoying and useless and anti-town.
Lynching him for those reasons is annoying, useless and anti town.
A) No it's not. Letting lurkers lurk to the late game is what's anti-town.
B) Why is everyone (i.e. you and MiX) obsessing about who we're lynching? It's early Day 1. We're looking to run some wagons and gain info. Shutting down wagons while not creating alternatives isn't helping.
I'm with you on putting pressure on lurkers. But if you are voting him for how he plays in general, then there's a lot less information gained from the whole wagon process. I also object to the insults. I think we try to be a friendlier group than that.
-
Is MiX still the easy D1 lunch?
I don't think he ever was.
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Attempting to start new topic bc i don’t like any of the current ones -
Does anyone have any insight that they can share regarding mana? Like is it actually needed for anything to the best of anyone knowledge? Or is it just like a flavor based piece of info?
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How about no? This is extremely far away from what I would consider an approach town!pubby wouldn't do, and with no scum games on his belt, what's really the case beyond "he feels scummy"?
He's annoying and useless and anti-town.
Lynching him for those reasons is annoying, useless and anti town.
A) No it's not. Letting lurkers lurk to the late game is what's anti-town.
B) Why is everyone (i.e. you and MiX) obsessing about who we're lynching? It's early Day 1. We're looking to run some wagons and gain info. Shutting down wagons while not creating alternatives isn't helping.
I'm with you on putting pressure on lurkers. But if you are voting him for how he plays in general, then there's a lot less information gained from the whole wagon process. I also object to the insults. I think we try to be a friendlier group than that.
It's true that I could have put this in a less antagonistic way, and I'm sorry about that. But I also want to point to what's right there in the rules:
inactivity is just as inconsiderate as rude comments
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Vote: Didds
When did you decide this was a good idea?
When pubby explained his reasons for weird voting.
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How about no? This is extremely far away from what I would consider an approach town!pubby wouldn't do, and with no scum games on his belt, what's really the case beyond "he feels scummy"?
He's annoying and useless and anti-town.
Lynching him for those reasons is annoying, useless and anti town.
A) No it's not. Letting lurkers lurk to the late game is what's anti-town.
B) Why is everyone (i.e. you and MiX) obsessing about who we're lynching? It's early Day 1. We're looking to run some wagons and gain info. Shutting down wagons while not creating alternatives isn't helping.
I'm with you on putting pressure on lurkers. But if you are voting him for how he plays in general, then there's a lot less information gained from the whole wagon process. I also object to the insults. I think we try to be a friendlier group than that.
It's true that I could have put this in a less antagonistic way, and I'm sorry about that. But I also want to point to what's right there in the rules:
inactivity is just as inconsiderate as rude comments
You can call pubby whatever you want, but he's not inactive. Or at least not inactive enough to be policy lynched due to it...
Vote: Didds
When did you decide this was a good idea?
When pubby explained his reasons for weird voting.
Oh right you were on pubby okay thanks.
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You can call pubby whatever you want, but he's not inactive. Or at least not inactive enough to be policy lynched due to it...
He's inactive. He made one post per Day since the game started, the bare minimum, and those posts mostly consisted of just a vote. If he were any less active, he would be inactive enough to be modkilled, not just policy lynched.
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Which reminds me...
Request prod on Galzria
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You can call pubby whatever you want, but he's not inactive. Or at least not inactive enough to be policy lynched due to it...
He's inactive. He made one post per Day since the game started, the bare minimum, and those posts mostly consisted of just a vote. If he were any less active, he would be inactive enough to be modkilled, not just policy lynched.
Huh. Ok. I guess I only consider inactive people that don't talk at all.
pubby, can you please talk a bit about yourself and your games, or just talk? Were there any post from them other than votes? Can there be post restrictions?
I have a weird ability involving votes. It's optional but I'm going to do it as much as I can.
Are you stopping a negative thing or making a positive thing happen?
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I also have a weird ability involving votes. It's called "voting" and the syntax is vote: MiX
-
Attempting to start new topic bc i don’t like any of the current ones -
Does anyone have any insight that they can share regarding mana? Like is it actually needed for anything to the best of anyone knowledge? Or is it just like a flavor based piece of info?
Mana isn't "necessary", it's basically a flavor-name's "affinity" to a certain mana color, which most likely (if not certainly) matters for some PRs. Ask scum if you want examples, they would know.
-
Ask scum if you want examples, they would know.
Great. Can you give us some examples?
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Ask scum if you want examples, they would know.
Great. Can you give us some examples?
Maybe, but I won't. I was thinking more about asking in the scumchat, that way I could tell you guys everything...
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Ask scum if you want examples, they would know.
Great. Can you give us some examples?
Maybe, but I won't. I was thinking more about asking in the scumchat, that way I could tell you guys everything...
Unfortunately I don't have access to the scumchat so I can't ask you there.
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Mix seems town to me right now. As does faust. Awaclus looks more like his scum meta. Still like pubby vote the best right now.
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Mix seems town to me right now. As does faust. Awaclus looks more like his scum meta. Still like pubby vote the best right now.
How is he the best choice? pubby votes look to me like scum looking for the easy mislynch.
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Yeah, not a fan of this Pubby wagon.
Which is a bit awkward.
Vote: gkrieg?
Eh, sure.
Either that or MiX, who might actually be a baddie for once, but the poor guy keeps dying.
-
Awaclus looks more like his scum meta.
No I don't. Are you MiX's scum partner?
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Awaclus looks more like his scum meta.
No I don't.
How would you know?
Yeah, not a fan of this Pubby wagon.
Which is a bit awkward.
Vote: gkrieg?
Eh, sure.
Either that or MiX, who might actually be a baddie for once, but the poor guy keeps dying.
Do I? I guess I've only lived to the end of a game once, but I wouldn't call that dying all the time...
Hmm, why is gkrieg scummy?
-
Alright, caught up.
Sorry, literally slept through Friday after getting back from Denver, and worked much of today. Took me a little extra time to find the energy to reread.
Vote:MiX
I’m very much on the same page as Joth regarding MiX’s reaction to Pubby, and the whole “scum can quick hammer” nonsense.
Joth is, I believe town, as is (oddly) faust. I’m not seeing Pubby bring anything different than normal, and Didds is setting off scum-bells as well.
Outside that, I’m wary of a few people and lean town on a few others, but don’t have any strong reads.
-
Huatli watched from the roof of the building as four of the bright blue skeletal creatures advanced on a group of vedalkan and elf scientists. It didn’t seem fair to her that Bolas could bring these things across the gap between worlds but she couldn’t bring her raptors. Still their had to be some creatures here who she could befriend to help in the fight.
Just then two of the zombies were slurped up by giant, sticky tongues, and the enormous frog-like creatures they belonged to bounded away. Huatli jumped into the fray to dispatch the other two.
“It worked, didn’t it?” Said one elf.
“They’ll never be able to digest them,” said another.
“Don’t be so sure about that,” said the Vedelkan, “I gave them digestive enzymes from a hydra. Very powerful.”
“You were using hydra parts anyway and you couldn’t have given them a second head?” Said another.
“Gentlemen,” said Huatli, “I’m interested in the work you’re doing.”
Vote Count 1.3
shraeye (1): raerae
pubby (3): LaLight, gkrieg, pubby
MiX: (4) Awaclus, jotheonah, WestCoastDidds, Galzria
WestCoastDidds: (1) faust
Jimmm: (1) MiX
gkrieg: (1) UncleEurope
Not voting (4): DatSwan, shraeye, Jimmm, EFHW
With 15 alive, it takes 8 to lynch. Day Ends at 10:30 am (EST) on October 16th, 2019.
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Vote: MiX
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Vote: Swan
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This flavor is really enjoyable.
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Vote: Swan
Sure, sure.
Vote: Swan
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This flavor is really enjoyable.
You're town right? Why make a post about this? It clutters the thread a positive amount, which is more than it should be.
Did I get 5 votes D1 again? Really?
Hey joth, give me something to sheep.
PPE: Oh okay.
-
Hey, raerae, do you have anything to offer besides RVS votes?
-
Also, RVS isn't really an appropriate name, it should rather be called "meme voting phase".
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Also, RVS isn't really an appropriate name, it should rather be called "meme voting phase".
I support the shift to MVP as the preferred term.
Vote: Swan
For old times’ sake.
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This flavor is really enjoyable.
You're town right? Why make a post about this? It clutters the thread a positive amount, which is more than it should be.
Did I get 5 votes D1 again? Really?
Hey joth, give me something to sheep.
PPE: Oh okay.
Sometimes mods like to be appreciated. It’s a pretty negligible amount of clutter. I regret I cannot give you anything to sheep as you are currently my top suspect. I guess we could give faust another whirl, but I’m starting to townread him a little.
-
This flavor is really enjoyable.
You're town right? Why make a post about this? It clutters the thread a positive amount, which is more than it should be.
Did I get 5 votes D1 again? Really?
Hey joth, give me something to sheep.
PPE: Oh okay.
This post of yours clutters the thread way more than joth's did but I guess you're not town right so that's why you can apply different standards to yourself.
-
Vote: Faust
Will be into it this evening. Weekend has been more time consuming than i anticipated.
-
Awaclus
+10
WestCoastDidds
+1
jotheonah
+5
MiX
-18
DatSwan
+0
faust
+2
UncleEurope
+0
gkrieg
+1
raerae
-2
pubby
-4
Galzria
+3
Jimmm
+2
EFHW
+0
LaLight
+3
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"want to say my flavor name"
It's a Scum move: awaclus
It's a spotlight thing: Faust
You do you, girl: joth
Antitown: datswan
Followup question: raerae
Ignored: WCD, Uncle, gkrieg, pubby, Galz, jimmm, EFHW, laLight
Ignored, except to ask if I was doing it: Mix
Majority of scum clearly in the nonresponse group (which includes MiX). Not just because that side has more people.
Let me know who I scummily mischaracterized.
Also, I haven't made up my mind yet
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Hey, raerae, do you have anything to offer besides RVS votes?
Naw, still cool with it considering he hasn't said anything other than arbitrary numbers and a half-promise about a flavor name claim. I could move to MiX probably but I'm fine where I am for now.
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"want to say my flavor name"
It's a Scum move: awaclus
It's a spotlight thing: Faust
You do you, girl: joth
Antitown: datswan
Followup question: raerae
Ignored: WCD, Uncle, gkrieg, pubby, Galz, jimmm, EFHW, laLight
Ignored, except to ask if I was doing it: Mix
Majority of scum clearly in the nonresponse group (which includes MiX). Not just because that side has more people.
Let me know who I scummily mischaracterized.
Also, I haven't made up my mind yet
Definitely not clear. Care to expand on why that's so obvious? Seems like you got some insider info, friend.
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"want to say my flavor name"
It's a Scum move: awaclus
It's a spotlight thing: Faust
You do you, girl: joth
Antitown: datswan
Followup question: raerae
Ignored: WCD, Uncle, gkrieg, pubby, Galz, jimmm, EFHW, laLight
Ignored, except to ask if I was doing it: Mix
Majority of scum clearly in the nonresponse group (which includes MiX). Not just because that side has more people.
Let me know who I scummily mischaracterized.
Also, I haven't made up my mind yet
I just think Swan’s point was well taken:
The setup post lists relevant flavor information. Name is not one of them. So name claiming (or not) serves no relevant value.
-
Pubby - Why are you voting yourself still?
-
Awaclus
+10
WestCoastDidds
+1
jotheonah
+5
MiX
-18
DatSwan
+0
faust
+2
UncleEurope
+0
gkrieg
+1
raerae
-2
pubby
-4
Galzria
+3
Jimmm
+2
EFHW
+0
LaLight
+3
You're scumbuddies with Awaclus and you're telling everyone this? Why?
Vote: shraeye
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"want to say my flavor name"
It's a Scum move: awaclus
It's a spotlight thing: Faust
You do you, girl: joth
Antitown: datswan
Followup question: raerae
Ignored: WCD, Uncle, gkrieg, pubby, Galz, jimmm, EFHW, laLight
Ignored, except to ask if I was doing it: Mix
Majority of scum clearly in the nonresponse group (which includes MiX). Not just because that side has more people.
Let me know who I scummily mischaracterized.
Also, I haven't made up my mind yet
No reads here, but definitely looks like he's scumhunting, doesn't it. In reality he's just jumping on the "MiX is scum lololololol" train which is...laaaaazy. In fact, all shraeye has been doing is post summaries of what he thinks has been happening without adding anything personal (numbers are good, but honestly there's no hot takes, it's all the obvious things shraeye would be thinking about so it's not adding anything).
I just think Swan’s point was well taken:
The setup post lists relevant flavor information. Name is not one of them. So name claiming (or not) serves no relevant value.
But the name tells everyone the rest of the important flavor information, you can just search the name on the MtG wiki, for example. Town points for Galzria trying to help.
-
No reads here, but definitely looks like he's scumhunting, doesn't it. In reality he's just jumping on the "MiX is scum lololololol" train which is...laaaaazy.
It isn't laaaaazy, it's cooooorrect.
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No reads here, but definitely looks like he's scumhunting, doesn't it. In reality he's just jumping on the "MiX is scum lololololol" train which is...laaaaazy.
It isn't laaaaazy, it's cooooorrect.
Even if it was, it's still lazy. I did forget he hadn't voted at all, so I guess I jumped the gun too soon.
You're scum for making one too many of these posts, but I'd rather go for your partner.
-
You're scum for making one too many of these posts
You're scum for having the scum alignment in your role PM.
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Will be into it this evening.
So this was you being into it?
Pubby - Why are you voting yourself still?
Impressive.
-
Depending on how I change my vote I won't get my night action. So I can vote for anyone I want, but not every vote will give me the action. Obviously I'm going for the action, but I'm not going to lynch myself should everyone jump on me.
-
You're scum for making one too many of these posts, but I'd rather go for your partner.
Why is that?
-
Depending on how I change my vote I won't get my night action. So I can vote for anyone I want, but not every vote will give me the action. Obviously I'm going for the action, but I'm not going to lynch myself should everyone jump on me.
Fine, but could you tell us who you'd be voting for if it weren't for your role?
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You're scum for making one too many of these posts, but I'd rather go for your partner.
Why is that?
Better reactions, which should help me get better reads on others. Such as yourself.
-
Town points for Galzria trying to help.
I do not give town points for this. Sounds to me like he was trying to sell something potentially harmful as harmless by failing to make an easy deductive leap vis a vis derivable information.
-
Does anyone have strong feelings against a MiX lynch? Sorry if it's been said and I missed it.
-
50 hours to deadline post count:
Awaclus: 19
Didds: 9
joth: 20
MiX: 31
Swan: 4
faust: 39
Eddie: 5
gkrieg: 8
shraeye: 7
raerae: 10
pubby: 6
Galzria: 3
Jimmmm: 6
EFHW: 8
LaLight: 10
I was going to suggest restricting the lynch pool to players with one-digit counts, but that's not much of a restriction at all, is it?
-
Does anyone have strong feelings against a MiX lynch? Sorry if it's been said and I missed it.
I don't feel great about lynching one of the few active players in this slogfest, but I don't exactly have a townread on MiX.
-
Fine, but could you tell us who you'd be voting for if it weren't for your role?
MiX lynch is OK but overblown. He'd probably be my #1 vote at the moment but that's only as a poorly informed day 1 vote.
I'm scum reading Eddie. I think his posts have been very "vanilla" and safe.
Awaclus seems more chatty than normal d1.
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You're scum for making one too many of these posts, but I'd rather go for your partner.
Why is that?
Better reactions, which should help me get better reads on others. Such as yourself.
How are the reactions improved if you go for someone else?
-
You're scum for making one too many of these posts, but I'd rather go for your partner.
Why is that?
Better reactions, which should help me get better reads on others. Such as yourself.
How are the reactions improved if you go for someone else?
Voting Awaclus doesn't do much, since there's not a lot to talk about. Pretty much anyone else's better. I also don't want to lynch Awaclus today.
Fine, but could you tell us who you'd be voting for if it weren't for your role?
MiX lynch is OK but overblown. He'd probably be my #1 vote at the moment but that's only as a poorly informed day 1 vote.
I'm scum reading Eddie. I think his posts have been very "vanilla" and safe.
Awaclus seems more chatty than normal d1.
Vote: Uncle
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Why not go back to Swan? He's a liar and a lurker, the perfect combination.
-
Fine, but could you tell us who you'd be voting for if it weren't for your role?
MiX lynch is OK but overblown. He'd probably be my #1 vote at the moment but that's only as a poorly informed day 1 vote.
I'm scum reading Eddie. I think his posts have been very "vanilla" and safe.
Awaclus seems more chatty than normal d1.
I have always liked vanilla. I feel like it has negative connotations to a lot of people, but its flavor has a sense of “purity” to it which I find quite enjoyable. It only pushes its flavor so far, which makes every single note of flavor that much more meaningful or layered.
-
Why not go back to Swan? He's a liar and a lurker, the perfect combination.
Show me lies Swan said. Then maybe. This is how we got scum!EFHW D1 in that one game after all.
-
Why not go back to Swan? He's a liar and a lurker, the perfect combination.
Show me lies Swan said. Then maybe. This is how we got scum!EFHW D1 in that one game after all.
Sure, there:
Will be into it this evening.
-
Does anyone have strong feelings against a MiX lynch? Sorry if it's been said and I missed it.
No one has expressed strong feelings, but people sure are eager to kill the wagon now that you've given them the slightest opening...
-
Does anyone have strong feelings against a MiX lynch? Sorry if it's been said and I missed it.
No one has expressed strong feelings, but people sure are eager to kill the wagon now that you've given them the slightest opening...
Who is eager to kill the wagon?
-
Why not go back to Swan? He's a liar and a lurker, the perfect combination.
Show me lies Swan said. Then maybe. This is how we got scum!EFHW D1 in that one game after all.
Sure, there:
Will be into it this evening.
Vote: Swan
Space's not in this game, maybe I can get away with all these votes.
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"want to say my flavor name"
It's a Scum move: awaclus
It's a spotlight thing: Faust
You do you, girl: joth
Antitown: datswan
Followup question: raerae
Ignored: WCD, Uncle, gkrieg, pubby, Galz, jimmm, EFHW, laLight
Ignored, except to ask if I was doing it: Mix
Majority of scum clearly in the nonresponse group (which includes MiX). Not just because that side has more people.
Let me know who I scummily mischaracterized.
Also, I haven't made up my mind yet
I am definitely on joth's side here, I don't really have any opinion if this is good or bad. It's weird, but if you want to do that, well, you do you
-
Pubby - Why are you voting yourself still?
He clearly thinks the guy he's voting is scum
-
Depending on how I change my vote I won't get my night action. So I can vote for anyone I want, but not every vote will give me the action. Obviously I'm going for the action, but I'm not going to lynch myself should everyone jump on me.
Weird, but ok. so Everyone you can vote for is less scummy than you are?
-
50 hours to deadline post count:
Awaclus: 19
Didds: 9
joth: 20
MiX: 31
Swan: 4
faust: 39
Eddie: 5
gkrieg: 8
shraeye: 7
raerae: 10
pubby: 6
Galzria: 3
Jimmmm: 6
EFHW: 8
LaLight: 10
I was going to suggest restricting the lynch pool to players with one-digit counts, but that's not much of a restriction at all, is it?
This actually is lazy, I don't like it.
I'd like to vote: MiX as of now
-
A hooded figure watched from high above the ruins of the gateway plaza and a group of blue zombies, along with a few giants bearing Azorius livery, and a handful of large, Orzhov thrulls, constructed the giant statue of a curved-horned dragon. The height of arrogance, though the figure, to be devoting resources to this when the plane was still not completely secure. And constructing a symbol of your victory was just begging to have someone tear it down.
Why were the Azorius working with him, the figure had wondered. He'd shot down several blue and white thopters in his nightly journey between the tops of the building. The Azorius, the Orzhov, some of the Golgari, many of the Gruul, although to be fair, the Gruul would follow more or less anyone who promised property destruction. The izzet were in a state of political chaos- normally a cause for celebration, but he couldn't help but think their particular brand of fiery chaos might come in handy soon.
Would more come over to his reign? What was his endgame? The creature wondered all this, then decided to move on. The Dimir would not stand for anyone to consolidate so much power, and none of the creatures working below had tasty blood. He flew off into the night in search of soft flesh and easy prey.
Vote Count 1.4
shraeye (1): raerae
pubby (2): gkrieg, pubby
MiX: (6) Awaclus, jotheonah, WestCoastDidds, Galzria, Jimmm, LaLight
DatSwan: (3) MiX, faust, UncleEurope
faust: (1) DatSwan
Not voting (2): shraeye, EFHW
With 15 alive, it takes 8 to lynch. Day Ends at 10:30 am (EST) on October 16th, 2019.
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No reads here, but definitely looks like he's scumhunting, doesn't it. In reality he's just jumping on the "MiX is scum lololololol" train which is...laaaaazy.
It isn't laaaaazy, it's cooooorrect.
Awa, I love it when you’re funny!
-
50 hours to deadline post count:
Awaclus: 19
Didds: 9
joth: 20
MiX: 31
Swan: 4
faust: 39
Eddie: 5
gkrieg: 8
shraeye: 7
raerae: 10
pubby: 6
Galzria: 3
Jimmmm: 6
EFHW: 8
LaLight: 10
I was going to suggest restricting the lynch pool to players with one-digit counts, but that's not much of a restriction at all, is it?
This actually is lazy, I don't like it.
I'd like to vote: MiX as of now
No, what's lazy is everyone with a single-digit count.
-
Why not go back to Swan? He's a liar and a lurker, the perfect combination.
I’m distracted by vacation frolicking and not following super close. What did he lie about? The lurking I see.
-
Oh, I see you’re response now. I’m not sure that’s a lie as much as an intention.
Shraeye, you do you, girl. I only really want to know your flavor bAme if it’s something awesome like She-Ra.
-
L-2 btw
-
L-2 btw
Plus pubby is kinda virtually voting for him, so it's somewhat L-1.
-
Actually the votes for MiX are kind of there, considering. shraeye has a pronounced scumread on him but is currently not voting, pubby said he'd be voting there if not for his role.
Which means, MiX is definitely the default lynch at this point. I would like to at least get another wagon going, can we agree on something there? I propose DatSwan, but maybe someone on the MiX wagon is a more realistic option.
-
All fire, no substance. This isn't townrae.
-
Awaclus
+13
WestCoastDidds
+1
jotheonah
+4
MiX
-22
DatSwan
+0
faust
+4
UncleEurope
+0
gkrieg
+1
raerae
-9
pubby
-3
Galzria
+2
Jimmm
+3
EFHW
+0
LaLight
+3
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Actually the votes for MiX are kind of there, considering. shraeye has a pronounced scumread on him but is currently not voting, pubby said he'd be voting there if not for his role.
Which means, MiX is definitely the default lynch at this point. I would like to at least get another wagon going, can we agree on something there? I propose DatSwan, but maybe someone on the MiX wagon is a more realistic option.
I'm unlynchable, so I'm far from the default lynch. I sorta think Swan is, which I am ok with.
LaLight might be a good wagon, but I forgot if they're scummy. Derailing for the sake of it doesn't help.
All fire, no substance. This isn't townrae.
Why not?
-
All fire, no substance. This isn't townrae.
So just not answering questions then? Super cool.
I'm staying here and nominate shraeye as the alternate wagon.
-
Hey, Shraeye, could you throw in the change in the cumulative scores in your posts? For clarity, mainly.
-
Actually the votes for MiX are kind of there, considering. shraeye has a pronounced scumread on him but is currently not voting, pubby said he'd be voting there if not for his role.
Which means, MiX is definitely the default lynch at this point. I would like to at least get another wagon going, can we agree on something there? I propose DatSwan, but maybe someone on the MiX wagon is a more realistic option.
I'm unlynchable, so I'm far from the default lynch. I sorta think Swan is, which I am ok with.
LaLight might be a good wagon, but I forgot if they're scummy. Derailing for the sake of it doesn't help.
All fire, no substance. This isn't townrae.
Why not?
Unlynchable???? If that's true you just made yourself the NK if you aren't scum but since you thought that was a perfectly reasonable thing to do it pretty heavily says you feel safe at night.
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Hey, Shraeye, could you throw in the change in the cumulative scores in your posts? For clarity, mainly.
How is there any clarity currently?! He hasn't explained what the numbers mean so everybody is just assuming positive is good, negative is bad but he hasn't explained anything.
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Hey, Shraeye, could you throw in the change in the cumulative scores in your posts? For clarity, mainly.
How is there any clarity currently?! He hasn't explained what the numbers mean so everybody is just assuming positive is good, negative is bad but he hasn't explained anything.
I think you have it figured out.
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Actually the votes for MiX are kind of there, considering. shraeye has a pronounced scumread on him but is currently not voting, pubby said he'd be voting there if not for his role.
Which means, MiX is definitely the default lynch at this point. I would like to at least get another wagon going, can we agree on something there? I propose DatSwan, but maybe someone on the MiX wagon is a more realistic option.
I'm unlynchable, so I'm far from the default lynch. I sorta think Swan is, which I am ok with.
LaLight might be a good wagon, but I forgot if they're scummy. Derailing for the sake of it doesn't help.
All fire, no substance. This isn't townrae.
Why not?
Unlynchable???? If that's true you just made yourself the NK if you aren't scum but since you thought that was a perfectly reasonable thing to do it pretty heavily says you feel safe at night.
This post is weird.
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Am I correct in assuming that these scores are always the current total and not rate of change since last time?
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Hey, Shraeye, could you throw in the change in the cumulative scores in your posts? For clarity, mainly.
How is there any clarity currently?! He hasn't explained what the numbers mean so everybody is just assuming positive is good, negative is bad but he hasn't explained anything.
Well he said that he finds MiX and you scummy, and you both have negative scores.
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All fire, no substance. This isn't townrae.
I'll vote for her if you do.
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All fire, no substance. This isn't townrae.
I'll vote for her if you do.
Not yet; we should not bring attention away from this MiX issue. His lies are abundant and flagrant. Way worse than DatSwans.
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Actually the votes for MiX are kind of there, considering. shraeye has a pronounced scumread on him but is currently not voting, pubby said he'd be voting there if not for his role.
Which means, MiX is definitely the default lynch at this point. I would like to at least get another wagon going, can we agree on something there? I propose DatSwan, but maybe someone on the MiX wagon is a more realistic option.
I'm unlynchable, so I'm far from the default lynch. I sorta think Swan is, which I am ok with.
LaLight might be a good wagon, but I forgot if they're scummy. Derailing for the sake of it doesn't help.
All fire, no substance. This isn't townrae.
Why not?
Unlynchable???? If that's true you just made yourself the NK if you aren't scum but since you thought that was a perfectly reasonable thing to do it pretty heavily says you feel safe at night.
This post is weird.
You think it's reasonable for town to say they aren't lynchable?
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All fire, no substance. This isn't townrae.
I'll vote for her if you do.
Not yet; we should not bring attention away from this MiX issue. His lies are abundant and flagrant. Way worse than DatSwans.
And proof this means I'm scum? Where is it?
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All fire, no substance. This isn't townrae.
So just not answering questions then? Super cool.
I'm staying here and nominate shraeye as the alternate wagon.
The first question (re flavor names) was legitimate, but not one I'm answering.
The second one (#218, "explain what's so clear, looks like you have insider info") was provacative and meaningless.
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The second one (#218, "explain what's so clear, looks like you have insider info") was provacative and meaningless.
Why is it meaningless? And why is it clear? I sincerely doubt Awaclus' answer would change, and I also doubt scum would change their responses with Awaclus' answer, so right there I disprove your theory.
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All fire, no substance. This isn't townrae.
So just not answering questions then? Super cool.
I'm staying here and nominate shraeye as the alternate wagon.
The first question (re flavor names) was legitimate, but not one I'm answering.
The second one (#218, "explain what's so clear, looks like you have insider info") was provacative and meaningless.
Disagree, you looked at two groups of people and said there was very clearly more scum in one than another. That isn't clear to me. Why would you think scum wouldn't engage? Help me understand your thought process otherwise it just looks like you're throwing shade for fun with nothing behind it. Was I sassier than necessary? Yes. Does that invalidate my question? No.
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Unvote for now. I'm having second thoughts. Gonna try to get a reread in before deadline and see if anything jumps out.
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Vote: Joth
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Ok so I did a quick reread.
The case on MiX is ... that he said one really weird thing about quickhammers. Like really weird. And I did lay out a scum narrative for why he would have said it -- that he wanted to distance himself from the pubby wagon but leave himself room to hammer if need be. It felt like how clever scum might respond to a rapidly building town wagon: stoke it while staying off of it.
So, ok, that was a decent case and I feel fine about voting based on it. But then like a lot of people jumped onto the wagon and very few of them expressed any reasons beyond that one post. Since then, MiX has been ... null? Like not supertownie but also not super scummy.
And then there's the response to the MiX wagon. No one has seemed like they're overtly trying to stop it, but people like faust have been trying to make another wagon take off for some vague reason? Actually if MiX is scum, faust looks like a likely partner.
So yeah, on reread, this feels like a better-than-average day 1 case. I'm just hesitant because I've been absolutely convinced of Mix's scumminess before and been super wrong. But in those cases, I haven't had this much support. Which is both encouraging and discouraging. Sigh.
The other thing is, I didn't see a great alternative in my reread. I'm pretty wary of Galzria, because he hasn't posted much and the posts he's made have been pretty easy, plus there was that one that seemed to be encouraging dangerous claiming. But MiX's flip will give more info about Galz than vice versa.
Anyway, I'm back on vote: MiX which I guess is still L-2
Vote: Joth
If there's anything to this, let me know and I'll try to address. Otherwise, cool story bro.
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And then there's the response to the MiX wagon. No one has seemed like they're overtly trying to stop it, but people like faust have been trying to make another wagon take off for some vague reason? Actually if MiX is scum, faust looks like a likely partner.
The vague reason is interactions. Having 2 wagons forces people to decide. Having two wagons is always better for information than having one wagon, I thought that was obvious.
But aside from that, MiX has been more townie lately, so now I definitely don't want to lynch him.
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The other thing is, I didn't see a great alternative in my reread.
Really? Like 50% of the players in this game are decent lynch targets at this point.
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It felt like how clever scum might respond to a rapidly building town wagon: stoke it while staying off of it.
One thing is very certain: If MiX is scum then he hasn't been clever.
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It's not the weird thing about quickhammers, it's his assumptions about pubby. They are back-and-forth with no outside input in between completely inconsistent stances
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And then there's the response to the MiX wagon. No one has seemed like they're overtly trying to stop it
Also... I mean didn't you say the opposite earlier?
Does anyone have strong feelings against a MiX lynch? Sorry if it's been said and I missed it.
No one has expressed strong feelings, but people sure are eager to kill the wagon now that you've given them the slightest opening...
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It's not the weird thing about quickhammers, it's his assumptions about pubby. They are back-and-forth with no outside input in between completely inconsistent stances
Consistency is not a town tell.
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It's not the weird thing about quickhammers, it's his assumptions about pubby. They are back-and-forth with no outside input in between completely inconsistent stances
That's true, and I'm not sure he's really addressed that case.
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It's not the weird thing about quickhammers, it's his assumptions about pubby. They are back-and-forth with no outside input in between completely inconsistent stances
Consistency is not a town tell.
But inconsistency can be a scum tell. If your reads are fake, it's easier to forget what they're supposed to be.
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And then there's the response to the MiX wagon. No one has seemed like they're overtly trying to stop it
Also... I mean didn't you say the opposite earlier?
Does anyone have strong feelings against a MiX lynch? Sorry if it's been said and I missed it.
No one has expressed strong feelings, but people sure are eager to kill the wagon now that you've given them the slightest opening...
That's what I meant by overtly. No one's been like "Let's not lynch MiX" (except you, just now).
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It's not the weird thing about quickhammers, it's his assumptions about pubby. They are back-and-forth with no outside input in between completely inconsistent stances
Consistency is not a town tell.
But inconsistency can be a scum tell. If your reads are fake, it's easier to forget what they're supposed to be.
I was under the impression that these things were going on in relatively quick succession. I don't buy into a narrative that poses that MiX forgot how he was supposed to feel about pubby when that was like the only topic of discussion at that point.
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Actually if MiX is scum, faust looks like a likely partner.
That's just how we interact, at this point it's NAI.
The rest of this case is paranoia. Actually the rest is scummy paranoia. I might agree with Uncle here.
It felt like how clever scum might respond to a rapidly building town wagon: stoke it while staying off of it.
One thing is very certain: If MiX is scum then he hasn't been clever.
...How would you know? This feels like scum looking clever to themselves by saying something that is true (since I'm not scum) but really isn't from town's perspective (if you have a town read on me how am I not being clever as scum?) So yeah scummypoints here.
It's not the weird thing about quickhammers, it's his assumptions about pubby. They are back-and-forth with no outside input in between completely inconsistent stances
Consistency is not a town tell.
But inconsistency can be a scum tell. If your reads are fake, it's easier to forget what they're supposed to be.
It's hilariously easy to remember what your opinions were just a few minutes ago, it's much harder to remember what you were thinking when you had all your notes a day ago. So if anything inconsistency from one post to another is towny.
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It felt like how clever scum might respond to a rapidly building town wagon: stoke it while staying off of it.
One thing is very certain: If MiX is scum then he hasn't been clever.
...How would you know? This feels like scum looking clever to themselves by saying something that is true (since I'm not scum) but really isn't from town's perspective (if you have a town read on me how am I not being clever as scum?) So yeah scummypoints here.
Well, the majority of people in this game seem to want to lynch you. And it's not like the thing that made them want to lynch you gave me a townread on you, no that came later. So the whole pubby situation has been a complete disaster for scum!you, with no real upside.
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It felt like how clever scum might respond to a rapidly building town wagon: stoke it while staying off of it.
One thing is very certain: If MiX is scum then he hasn't been clever.
...How would you know? This feels like scum looking clever to themselves by saying something that is true (since I'm not scum) but really isn't from town's perspective (if you have a town read on me how am I not being clever as scum?) So yeah scummypoints here.
Well, the majority of people in this game seem to want to lynch you. And it's not like the thing that made them want to lynch you gave me a townread on you, no that came later. So the whole pubby situation has been a complete disaster for scum!you, with no real upside.
It made pubby a real wagon, which then got shutdown with his claim, I wouldn't know that. Wouldn't call it...that bad. Sure it backfired but...I'm always close to being lynched. Remember that time we ended the day with me at L-1? That was fun.
Nullypoints then. Eh.
Hey Swan can you say more scummy things so we can lynch you? Please?
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I think faust is town, and MiX, too. Wondering about Didds. She has a scummy place on the MiX wagon. But I'm going with vote: Jimmmmm. I feel like he is usually more careful with his votes.
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And then there's the response to the MiX wagon. No one has seemed like they're overtly trying to stop it
Also... I mean didn't you say the opposite earlier?
Does anyone have strong feelings against a MiX lynch? Sorry if it's been said and I missed it.
No one has expressed strong feelings, but people sure are eager to kill the wagon now that you've given them the slightest opening...
That's what I meant by overtly. No one's been like "Let's not lynch MiX" (except you, just now).
So who did you have in mind when you talked about people who are eager to kill the wagon? What nonovert things did they do that you picked up?
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I think faust is town, and MiX, too. Wondering about Didds. She has a scummy place on the MiX wagon. But I'm going with vote: Jimmmmm. I feel like he is usually more careful with his votes.
Vote: Jimmmmm
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Vote: MiX
I think that's L-2?
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Vote: MiX
I think that's L-2?
If joth counted correctly then it's L-1.
Boo.
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What compelled you to do this now?
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Whoever hammers me is scum.
Let the game begin!
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What compelled you to do this now?
He's answered lots of other questions and addressed plenty of other things but hasn't addressed my concerns about how unlynchable comment. And the fact that he's resigned to being the lunch shows that was a lie anyway.
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me is scum.
This part here is true.
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Vote: MiX
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What compelled you to do this now?
He's answered lots of other questions and addressed plenty of other things but hasn't addressed my concerns about how unlynchable comment. And the fact that he's resigned to being the lunch shows that was a lie anyway.
Resigned? Let me find that comment real quick...
Unlynchable???? If that's true you just made yourself the NK if you aren't scum but since you thought that was a perfectly reasonable thing to do it pretty heavily says you feel safe at night.
Ah this. How do I answer this without soft claiming? The answer is I don't. So I won't.
me is scum.
This part here is true.
No.
Vote: MiX
What is this?
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The hammer, I hope.
Time to test my scum-point system!
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WHAT THE HELL DID YOU JUST HAMMER ME???
No. Just No. You are dead shraeye. DEAD!
Hold on I need to make a couple of calls. What is this bs.
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I AM A VENGEFUL TOWNY.
WHO SHOULD I KILL.
WHY SHOULDN'T IT BE SHRAEYE
HELP ME YOU BASTARDS
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So, not unlynchable, I take it?
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WHAT THE HELL DID YOU JUST HAMMER ME???
No. Just No. You are dead shraeye. DEAD!
Hold on I need to make a couple of calls. What is this bs.
But it can't be a hammer if you can't be lynched... Why are you so worried?
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Vote: MiX
Literally this
Whoever hammers me is scum.
Let the game begin!
I don't take L-1 statements lightly and neither should you.
So, not unlynchable, I take it?
DO YOU NOT KNOW WHAT HYPERBOLE MEANS??
God dammit shraeye, I was JUST answering raerae's question. What the hell.
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I AM A VENGEFUL TOWNY.
WHO SHOULD I KILL.
WHY SHOULDN'T IT BE SHRAEYE
HELP ME YOU BASTARDS
If you don't have any strong scum reads then the townie thing to do is nothing.
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Swan or shraeye. SWAN OR SHRAEYE
I WANT A POLL ON THIS RIGHT NOW.
HELP ME I WASN'T READY FOR THIS.
SHRAEYE OMG. WHY?
WHY DID YOU CUT THE DAY SHORT.
Someone tell me why shraeye shouldn't die right now.
I AM A VENGEFUL TOWNY.
WHO SHOULD I KILL.
WHY SHOULDN'T IT BE SHRAEYE
HELP ME YOU BASTARDS
If you don't have any strong scum reads then the townie thing to do is nothing.
Nah that's worthless. Ok Ok Ok I need to THINK.
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Swan or shraeye. SWAN OR SHRAEYE
I WANT A POLL ON THIS RIGHT NOW.
HELP ME I WASN'T READY FOR THIS.
SHRAEYE OMG. WHY?
WHY DID YOU CUT THE DAY SHORT.
Someone tell me why shraeye shouldn't die right now.
I AM A VENGEFUL TOWNY.
WHO SHOULD I KILL.
WHY SHOULDN'T IT BE SHRAEYE
HELP ME YOU BASTARDS
If you don't have any strong scum reads then the townie thing to do is nothing.
Nah that's worthless. Ok Ok Ok I need to THINK.
Nope, killing a townie because you just NEED to use your power is selfish and anti-town but you do you, boo.
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I can only kill who's in my wagon, that's
Awaclus, jotheonah, WestCoastDidds, Galzria, Jimmm, LaLight, raerae, shraeye
Of these I want shraeye or Didds. Mostly shraeye.
Going to reread both. I want reads on both right now, I am using my power for sure.
Nope, killing a townie because you just NEED to use your power is selfish and anti-town but you do you, boo.
My reads aren't that bad, why else would I be hammered?
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Nope, killing a townie because you just NEED to use your power is selfish and anti-town but you do you, boo.
a townie? Haven't you been scumreading shraeye like all day?
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Nope, killing a townie because you just NEED to use your power is selfish and anti-town but you do you, boo.
a townie? Haven't you been scumreading shraeye like all day?
Make that shraeye or raerae then. Joth, opinions.
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Nope, killing a townie because you just NEED to use your power is selfish and anti-town but you do you, boo.
a townie? Haven't you been scumreading shraeye like all day?
But he wasn't scum reading shraeye prior to the hammer. If I'm in his shoes I'm venging a previous scumread, not a knee jerk read on the person who hammered me.
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Nope, killing a townie because you just NEED to use your power is selfish and anti-town but you do you, boo.
a townie? Haven't you been scumreading shraeye like all day?
But he wasn't scum reading shraeye prior to the hammer. If I'm in his shoes I'm venging a previous scumread, not a knee jerk read on the person who hammered me.
Yes I was. Besides I can't kill Swan so...
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Nope, killing a townie because you just NEED to use your power is selfish and anti-town but you do you, boo.
a townie? Haven't you been scumreading shraeye like all day?
But he wasn't scum reading shraeye prior to the hammer. If I'm in his shoes I'm venging a previous scumread, not a knee jerk read on the person who hammered me.
Yes I was. Besides I can't kill Swan so...
Because he's your partner?
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shraeye's only hot take has been consistently on EFHW's points. What does this mean.
Nope, killing a townie because you just NEED to use your power is selfish and anti-town but you do you, boo.
a townie? Haven't you been scumreading shraeye like all day?
But he wasn't scum reading shraeye prior to the hammer. If I'm in his shoes I'm venging a previous scumread, not a knee jerk read on the person who hammered me.
Yes I was. Besides I can't kill Swan so...
Because he's your partner?
Look, I'm gonna flip town, and then you're gonna wonder how this could've helped you in any way. But really I can only kill people on my wagon.
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Didds is scum because no reads and no cases. Example:
Haiiiii....
I’m on a vacation weekend in North Carolina. It’s lovely!
So, there are 3 pages of content since I last read. I’m those pages, pubby and MiX are ringing all of my scum bells. MiX more than pubby, but both of them are like a -4 of a Shraeye scale for me. I don’t have good reasons more than “feels” and “seems” but it’s as good as anyone else has this early on.
LaLi- I’m so glad you’re back and excited to be back. Love!
Vote: MiX I know I tend to find him scummy pretty much always but his everything he’s said about pubby is scumdilicious
Vote: MiX I know I tend to find him scummy pretty much always but his everything he’s said about pubby is scumdilicious
Are we scumbuddies in your eyes?
Probably. Gas pubby ever been scum? Maybe now is his time.
Oh, I see you’re response now. I’m not sure that’s a lie as much as an intention.
Shraeye, you do you, girl. I only really want to know your flavor bAme if it’s something awesome like She-Ra.
Opinions here, I want to see scum bus and town to be wrong if Didds flips scum.
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Nope, killing a townie because you just NEED to use your power is selfish and anti-town but you do you, boo.
a townie? Haven't you been scumreading shraeye like all day?
Make that shraeye or raerae then. Joth, opinions.
Well, assuming that this is real and you are town and you're not trolling, first off, sorry.
I don't love raerae's reaction to your claim. It feels like "oh crap gotta keep this off my teammates".
I don't love that shraeye hammered there without giving you a chance to claim.
I'm not sure why Didds is in contention, she isn't setting off scum alarm bells for me today.
As previously mentioned, I have scumspicions about Galzria and they're stronger if you're town. Jimmm and LaLight both jumped on the wagon in the middle without much explanation, which is scummy but almost too scummy to come from scum. And Awaclus feels as towny here as he's ever felt.
So I would be ok with raerae, shraeye, or Galzria
Less ok but w/e on Jim and LaLight
Not ok with Didds or Awaclus or myself
I also think that you shouldn't shoot unless you're better than 50% sure they're scum but you seem unreceptive to that idea.
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BTW if you are scum and trolling then respect, man, this is an epic troll.
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raerae votes shraeye, parks her vote there and basically banters with faust, me and shraye. Sounds town.
shraeye says raerae isn't town. Sounds scum.
Back to shraeye/Didds.
BTW if you are scum and trolling then respect, man, this is an epic troll.
Too epic my friend. Too epic. Let me just throw away my claim my name is Chandra Nalaar and I'm gonna burn someone alive I hope I wanted better reads than D1 but shraeye decided to play with fire so he's most likely going to get burned. You're buddies with Didds if she's scum.
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I vote against a shraeye kill, though I most definitely understand the sentiment behind it.
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Didds just doesn't generally make cases day 1. She's a lot like I used to be, sticks around and is nice and hopefully helpful in the late game.
It's true that it's a meta that is exploitable as scum, but that doesn't mean she is scum. At best it means, she's 50/50.
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LaLight is town. Next suggestion.
faust, got anything?
Didds just doesn't generally make cases day 1. She's a lot like I used to be, sticks around and is nice and hopefully helpful in the late game.
It's true that it's a meta that is exploitable as scum, but that doesn't mean she is scum. At best it means, she's 50/50.
Not sure this is true. Doesn't look like it. I'll find counterexamples.
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If it's a troll, it is indeed epic. If not, you shoot away how you want.
I cut the day short because a) intense scumread, b) I'm always frustrated at the "vote to L1, claim/softclaim, everybody unvote, queue up the next L1 meta" c) I hate end-of-day scrambles.
Still don't see why you and raerae have issues with my number system. Is it unclear (raerae)? Or is it full of generic easy reads (MiX)?
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My preferred targets in order are something like Jimmmmm, Didds, Awaclus, LaLight.
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My preferred targets in order are something like Jimmmmm, Didds, Awaclus, LaLight.
is this most to least preferred?
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If it's a troll, it is indeed epic. If not, you shoot away how you want.
I cut the day short because a) intense scumread, b) I'm always frustrated at the "vote to L1, claim/softclaim, everybody unvote, queue up the next L1 meta" c) I hate end-of-day scrambles.
Still don't see why you and raerae have issues with my number system. Is it unclear (raerae)? Or is it full of generic easy reads (MiX)?
It makes you look scummy. Also you destroyed it when you have awaclus 10 points for what I assumed was a joke, because you decreased my points by the same amount. That's what it looked like.
My preferred targets in order are something like Jimmmmm, Didds, Awaclus, LaLight.
Why is shraeye town?
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Vote Count 1.5
pubby (2): gkrieg, pubby
MiX: ( 8 ) Awaclus, jotheonah, WestCoastDidds, Galzria, Jimmm, LaLight, raerae, shraeye
DatSwan: (1) MiX
faust: (1) DatSwan
joth (1): UncleEurope
Jimmm (2): EFHW, faust
With 15 alive, it took 8 to lynch. Twilight begins now and will go until at least 6 pm EST.
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My preferred targets in order are something like Jimmmmm, Didds, Awaclus, LaLight.
is this most to least preferred?
Yes.
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Jimmmmm has a very natural progression: shows up, scumreads me, doesn't vote due to no vote count, votes when I vote them, asks if someone doesn't want the wagon to exist. A very scummy progression.
I'm not vigging Awaclus. Next suggestion.
Between shraeye Didds and Jimmmmm now, good job faust.
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Raerae is scum for not engaging until I fought back at her. Raerae is always good at the back and forth, but scum raerae is not good at engaging with nobody responding to her.
Townrae is great at digging up stuff and needling away at threads.
Note how her score keeps going down bit by bit as she continued to not engage
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My preferred targets in order are something like Jimmmmm, Didds, Awaclus, LaLight.
Why is shraeye town?
His play has just been pretty out of the box today, with the points lists, the weird claim announcement that never happened, the hammer. Scum doesn't like to shake it up that much, they play within their established meta. And an aside, I liked the point lists, they are quite high effort posts that you're going to get little recognition for, opposite to posts scum wants to make.
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Awacluses score is no joke, none of the scores are me joking
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Raerae is scum for not engaging until I fought back at her. Raerae is always good at the back and forth, but scum raerae is not good at engaging with nobody responding to her.
Townrae is great at digging up stuff and needling away at threads.
Note how her score keeps going down bit by bit as she continued to not engage
My preferred targets in order are something like Jimmmmm, Didds, Awaclus, LaLight.
Why is shraeye town?
His play has just been pretty out of the box today, with the points lists, the weird claim announcement that never happened, the hammer. Scum doesn't like to shake it up that much, they play within their established meta. And an aside, I liked the point lists, they are quite high effort posts that you're going to get little recognition for, opposite to posts scum wants to make.
Well done, raerae is in, shraeye is out. Outing my reads is good because I'm gonna die anyway right?
Awacluses score is no joke, none of the scores are me joking
And I only realized that now, yes. Somewhat too late, isn't it.
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My theory that shraeye and raerae are scum together and fake-fighting is looking a bit less likely given that keeping it going at this juncture amounts to a pretty gutsy day 1 bus. Although, it would explain why raerae went straight to "don't shoot anyone"
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Raerae is scum for not engaging until I fought back at her. Raerae is always good at the back and forth, but scum raerae is not good at engaging with nobody responding to her.
Oh I kinda forgot about raerae (but she most certainly hasn't forgotten about me)... put her between Didds and Awaclus.
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Jimmmmm/Didds/raerae/No-one
Choose one.
Especially Jimmmmmm and Didds, if you appeared right now that would be great!
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I'm vigging Didds.
How long should I wait?
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Well this is just a big question mark from me, ima be honest.
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Breakdown of Didds' posts:
Haiiiii....
I’m on a vacation weekend in North Carolina. It’s lovely!
So, there are 3 pages of content since I last read. I’m those pages, pubby and MiX are ringing all of my scum bells. MiX more than pubby, but both of them are like a -4 of a Shraeye scale for me. I don’t have good reasons more than “feels” and “seems” but it’s as good as anyone else has this early on.
LaLi- I’m so glad you’re back and excited to be back. Love!
Vote: MiX I know I tend to find him scummy pretty much always but his everything he’s said about pubby is scumdilicious
Feels, seems, yep, sounds like good old Didds. Except it's missing townreads. There's no townreads at all. Only two people are mentioned and I suspect they're supposed to be her top scumreads?
Is MiX still the easy D1 lunch?
Obvi
"Please mislynch who I'm voting for"
Vote: MiX I know I tend to find him scummy pretty much always but his everything he’s said about pubby is scumdilicious
Are we scumbuddies in your eyes?
Probably. Gas pubby ever been scum? Maybe now is his time.
"This person could be scum!"
Oh, I see you’re response now. I’m not sure that’s a lie as much as an intention.
Shraeye, you do you, girl. I only really want to know your flavor bAme if it’s something awesome like She-Ra.
Does not state reads on anyone that is being mentioned.
Everything else is NAI. I'm ready.
I'll wait 1 hour of twilight, then I'll send the command.
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Well this is just a big question mark from me, ima be honest.
It's fun! I would vig you for this post but I can't!
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I'm vigging Didds.
How long should I wait?
If we can get a claim in before the final decision that would probably be useful. We still have almost 2 hours before twilight ends, I assume you have to be decided by then?
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Yeah, I am fine with a Didds hit.
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I'm vigging Didds.
How long should I wait?
If we can get a claim in before the final decision that would probably be useful. We still have almost 2 hours before twilight ends, I assume you have to be decided by then?
Yes. Also, good point. Do you know Didds' availability around this time? I don't.
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I'm vigging Didds.
How long should I wait?
If we can get a claim in before the final decision that would probably be useful. We still have almost 2 hours before twilight ends, I assume you have to be decided by then?
Yes. Also, good point. Do you know Didds' availability around this time? I don't.
No idea, and it's a holiday in (some parts of) the US, so that makes it even harder to guess.
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Alright. I'll wait 1 hour from now on then.
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At least one of Shrae/Rae is scum - both on the backs of the double quick hammer (after it was started that scum wouldn’t do something so brash D1), and based on their not-really-believable tunneling of each other all of D1.
I’m also, as stated earlier, hearing scum bells on Didds.
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At least one of Shrae/Rae is scum - both on the backs of the double quick hammer (after it was started that scum wouldn’t do something so brash D1), and based on their not-really-believable tunneling of each other all of D1.
I’m also, as stated earlier, hearing scum bells on Didds.
Not willing to venge one of them based on this: if you were correct then yes, but I'm not as sure, and I don't want to kill the town of them. Especially shraeye.
Also Didds looks scummier.
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I would say Faust but the reasons are based on me being town ... so i get that’s not happening.
Out of that i would say Joth, Shraeye, Rae , Jim in that order
Phone posting
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I would say Faust but the reasons are based on me being town ... so i get that’s not happening.
Out of that i would say Joth, Shraeye, Rae , Jim in that order
Phone posting
Ewww, but I like the blatant disrespect for everyone's opinions.
Why am I typing this my reads on you aren't worth anything. I don't think I've fully interiorized that I'm dead.
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Alright. I'll wait 1 hour from now on then.
Bah. It's been an hour. I guess I have to do this...
Incinerate: Didds
I'm sorry, regardless of alignment. I already outed my flavor so: red mana, human, Kaladesh plane. In case that matters.
Good luck everyone, and lynch shraerae for me.
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I had an item, which is why I claimed to not have the sun.
Whoever guesses which item is town.
Go!
Yes, it took me an hour to find out how to claim this.
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“I’m sorry,” said Jace, “But it just lines up too perfectly. Chandra is the one who’s been betraying this group to Bolas. We have to take her out.”
“No!” said Chandra. “I can’t believe you all. I fought the Eldrazi by your side! We helped liberate my home plane together! And now you trust all of them over me?!? Even this mysterious person who no one knows anything about! She’s the real agent of Bolas. I’ll show you all!”
Chandra jumped onto the mysterious figure, and the two exploded together in a massive fireball.
MiX has been lynched. He was Chandra Nalaar, Gatewatch-Aligned 1-Shot Active PGO/ Vengeful Townie. WestCoastDidds has been incinerated. She was The Wanderer, Gatewatch-aligned Investigation-Immune Colorproof Townie.
Night 1 begins now and will end at 6:30 pm on Wednesday, October 16th. Night actions are due at 6:30 on Tuesday, October 15th.
THREAD LOCKED
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I am making two changes. First, after much thought, I have decided my reasons for not flipping full roles were not well-thought-out, and roles will now flip as in any other game.
Second, future night action deadlines will be 36 hours instead of 24.
The game will open as scheduled tonight at 6:30 pm.
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As the sun rises over the city, the Planeswalker council reconvenes. But one of your number is missing. Eventually, with the help of some Dimir spies, his body is found- head removed, stuffed with garlic, with a wooden stake through his heart. Someone knew that Vampires work differently on different planes, and wanted to be certain.
Pubby has died. He was Sorin Markhov, Nemesis/ 1-shot Human Doctor .
Day 2 begins now, and will end at 6:30 pm on Wednesday, October 23rd.
Vote Count 2.0
Not voting (12): Awaclus, jotheonah, DatSwan, faust, UncleEurope, gkrieg, shraeye, raerae, Galzria, Jimmm, EFHW, LaLight.
With 12 alive, it takes 6 to lynch.
Thread unlocked.
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SK, I presume?
Anyway I am off to sleep now
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SK, I presume?
There's no point in an SK being a Doctor though. I think we may have 2 scum teams.
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Oh, Didds was colorproof? Doesn’t that make cards in MtG immune to any card that isn’t colorless? Or am I misunderstanding something?
I would have thought that she would have been immune to the incinerate.
I dunno.
Unless the investigation clause is tied to the colorproof thing.
I dunno.
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SK, I presume?
There's no point in an SK being a Doctor though. I think we may have 2 scum teams.
Based on OP information, I doubt we have two scum teams. Town is clearly labeled Gatewatch, and scum clearly labeled Bolos. Pubby was almost certainly third faction. What his exact wincon was, and how being a Doctor helped him achieve that, only he’s likely to know.
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SK, I presume?
There's no point in an SK being a Doctor though. I think we may have 2 scum teams.
Based on OP information, I doubt we have two scum teams. Town is clearly labeled Gatewatch, and scum clearly labeled Bolos. Pubby was almost certainly third faction. What his exact wincon was, and how being a Doctor helped him achieve that, only he’s likely to know.
Bolas*, not Bolos*
Also, if you wanted to speculate, Glooble notes there are a handful of players whose win conditions may change during the game, but they will have been given the specifics in their PM’s. It’s possible pubby’s Doctor role had some side effect of changing his alignment/wincon based on it. But again, not sure there’s much to be gained from speculating - just more of a note.
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Shraeye, do anything interesting last night?
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Vote: DatSwan
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Vote: DatSwan
I like the cut of your jib.
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So pubby wasn't town. What gave it away to those who suspected him?
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In the story, Sorin and Nahiri basically spend the whole time ignoring the larger war and fighting each other across the plane. So that’s what Nemesis is— probably some kind of lyncher situation. I wonder if that means Nahiri won?
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In the story, Sorin and Nahiri basically spend the whole time ignoring the larger war and fighting each other across the plane. So that’s what Nemesis is— probably some kind of lyncher situation. I wonder if that means Nahiri won?
Pretty sure that if someone won they wouldn't have to continue playing.
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SK, I presume?
There's no point in an SK being a Doctor though. I think we may have 2 scum teams.
Based on OP information, I doubt we have two scum teams. Town is clearly labeled Gatewatch, and scum clearly labeled Bolos. Pubby was almost certainly third faction. What his exact wincon was, and how being a Doctor helped him achieve that, only he’s likely to know.
Bolas*, not Bolos*
Also, if you wanted to speculate, Glooble notes there are a handful of players whose win conditions may change during the game, but they will have been given the specifics in their PM’s. It’s possible pubby’s Doctor role had some side effect of changing his alignment/wincon based on it. But again, not sure there’s much to be gained from speculating - just more of a note.
It's possible that he needed to end up voting for scum sufficiently often in order to be able to change alignment, and that's why he self-voted. But of course it doesn't really matter now, just an interesting thought.
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Checking in. I'm away at the moment; I get home tomorrow so I should catch up properly by the weekend.
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SK, I presume?
There's no point in an SK being a Doctor though. I think we may have 2 scum teams.
Based on OP information, I doubt we have two scum teams. Town is clearly labeled Gatewatch, and scum clearly labeled Bolos. Pubby was almost certainly third faction. What his exact wincon was, and how being a Doctor helped him achieve that, only he’s likely to know.
Bolas*, not Bolos*
Also, if you wanted to speculate, Glooble notes there are a handful of players whose win conditions may change during the game, but they will have been given the specifics in their PM’s. It’s possible pubby’s Doctor role had some side effect of changing his alignment/wincon based on it. But again, not sure there’s much to be gained from speculating - just more of a note.
It's possible that he needed to end up voting for scum sufficiently often in order to be able to change alignment, and that's why he self-voted. But of course it doesn't really matter now, just an interesting thought.
Lol I love that
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Shraeye, do anything interesting last night?
vote: Galzria
I personally tend to do exactly that when I am scum preparing a fakeclaim
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Shraeye, do anything interesting last night?
vote: Galzria
I personally tend to do exactly that when I am scum preparing a fakeclaim
Exactly what? I’m just curious if he did anything interesting. You know, after quick-unannounced-hammering MiX.
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Also, while I’m playing video games with Swan right now:
I’m quite a few cocktails deep, so semi-DAMA. This thread has been woefully silent since D2 began.
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Shraeye, do anything interesting last night?
vote: Galzria
I personally tend to do exactly that when I am scum preparing a fakeclaim
Exactly what? I’m just curious if he did anything interesting. You know, after quick-unannounced-hammering MiX.
Well, i would call it an obvious breadcrumb: I pretend to do some action as Town PR, so then I can say "I have nothing to hide, here in this post I obviously hinted I am tracker and tracked shraeye"
It's not much of a case, but it's the best i have
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Also, while I’m playing video games with Swan right now:
I’m quite a few cocktails deep, so semi-DAMA. This thread has been woefully silent since D2 began.
yay let's talk
why were you so silent yesterDay? What are your thoughts on MiX wagon?
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Also, while I’m playing video games with Swan right now:
I’m quite a few cocktails deep, so semi-DAMA. This thread has been woefully silent since D2 began.
yay let's talk
why were you so silent yesterDay? What are your thoughts on MiX wagon?
I was silent most of yesterday due to being on a work trip with Swan, Raptor & 2 others (well, many others - but just us 5 from the SF Bay Area). While there was plenty of leisure time during the trip, most of that (and I really mean most: We averaged 3.5 hours of sleep a night for 5 nights straight) was filled drinking and hanging out and socializing. Which is why I slept through Friday upon coming home...
As for the wagon. I’m actually not crazy scum reading a lot of it. It’s townie to run things up D1. It’s actually a good thing. What’s scummy af is how it ended. Hence my question to Shraeye.
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Shraeye, do anything interesting last night?
vote: Galzria
I personally tend to do exactly that when I am scum preparing a fakeclaim
Exactly what? I’m just curious if he did anything interesting. You know, after quick-unannounced-hammering MiX.
Well, i would call it an obvious breadcrumb: I pretend to do some action as Town PR, so then I can say "I have nothing to hide, here in this post I obviously hinted I am tracker and tracked shraeye"
It's not much of a case, but it's the best i have
I solemnly swear I did not target Shraeye last night.
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Also, while I’m playing video games with Swan right now:
I’m quite a few cocktails deep, so semi-DAMA. This thread has been woefully silent since D2 began.
yay let's talk
why were you so silent yesterDay? What are your thoughts on MiX wagon?
I was silent most of yesterday due to being on a work trip with Swan, Raptor & 2 others (well, many others - but just us 5 from the SF Bay Area). While there was plenty of leisure time during the trip, most of that (and I really mean most: We averaged 3.5 hours of sleep a night for 5 nights straight) was filled drinking and hanging out and socializing. Which is why I slept through Friday upon coming home...
As for the wagon. I’m actually not crazy scum reading a lot of it. It’s townie to run things up D1. It’s actually a good thing. What’s scummy af is how it ended. Hence my question to Shraeye.
Oh I got what you mean, I never thought about that!
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Shraeye, do anything interesting last night?
vote: Galzria
I personally tend to do exactly that when I am scum preparing a fakeclaim
Exactly what? I’m just curious if he did anything interesting. You know, after quick-unannounced-hammering MiX.
Well, i would call it an obvious breadcrumb: I pretend to do some action as Town PR, so then I can say "I have nothing to hide, here in this post I obviously hinted I am tracker and tracked shraeye"
It's not much of a case, but it's the best i have
I solemnly swear I did not target Shraeye last night.
uh why would you claim that
I don't feel like unvoting right now, sorry
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In the story, Sorin and Nahiri basically spend the whole time ignoring the larger war and fighting each other across the plane. So that’s what Nemesis is— probably some kind of lyncher situation. I wonder if that means Nahiri won?
Wild guess: what if they're Lyncher, that changes alignment when the Lynchee is lynched?
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if they change alignment to Town, I think it'd be better for them to step up.
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Galzria
As for the wagon. I’m actually not crazy scum reading a lot of it. It’s townie to run things up D1. It’s actually a good thing. What’s scummy af is how it ended. Hence my question to Shraeye
I don't agree here. I think there is scum on the wagon. vote: Jimmmmm.
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Shraeye, do anything interesting last night?
vote: Galzria
I personally tend to do exactly that when I am scum preparing a fakeclaim
Exactly what? I’m just curious if he did anything interesting. You know, after quick-unannounced-hammering MiX.
Well, i would call it an obvious breadcrumb: I pretend to do some action as Town PR, so then I can say "I have nothing to hide, here in this post I obviously hinted I am tracker and tracked shraeye"
It's not much of a case, but it's the best i have
I solemnly swear I did not target Shraeye last night.
uh why would you claim that
I don't feel like unvoting right now, sorry
You said you thought I was setting up some sort of fake claim against Shraeye. I’m simply stating that I’m not. I didn’t target Shraeye last night, so regardless of his answer to my question, which still stands by the way, this isn’t some sort of fake “gotcha” tactic.
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Galzria
As for the wagon. I’m actually not crazy scum reading a lot of it. It’s townie to run things up D1. It’s actually a good thing. What’s scummy af is how it ended. Hence my question to Shraeye
I don't agree here. I think there is scum on the wagon. vote: Jimmmmm.
Why
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So I have a super busy day today and may not be able to get into it until tomorrow or Saturday. But I’ll be following along best I can. I want to reread before pushing too hard, but right now I’m still feeling like the person who looks scummiest after yesterday is raerae, just based on her reaction to MiX’s vengeful townie reveal. Which I suppose also implicates Shraeye.
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Galzria
As for the wagon. I’m actually not crazy scum reading a lot of it. It’s townie to run things up D1. It’s actually a good thing. What’s scummy af is how it ended. Hence my question to Shraeye
I don't agree here. I think there is scum on the wagon. vote: Jimmmmm.
Why
From my self-centered perspective, MiX was obv!town so efforts were made to mislynch him.
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As for the wagon. I’m actually not crazy scum reading a lot of it. It’s townie to run things up D1. It’s actually a good thing. What’s scummy af is how it ended. Hence my question to Shraeye.
Actually the end of the wagon is the towniest thing about it.
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Galzria
As for the wagon. I’m actually not crazy scum reading a lot of it. It’s townie to run things up D1. It’s actually a good thing. What’s scummy af is how it ended. Hence my question to Shraeye
I don't agree here. I think there is scum on the wagon. vote: Jimmmmm.
"There is scum on the wagon" isn't really a good enough reason to vote there. How many scum do you think are on wagon? And how many are off?
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So I have a super busy day today and may not be able to get into it until tomorrow or Saturday. But I’ll be following along best I can. I want to reread before pushing too hard, but right now I’m still feeling like the person who looks scummiest after yesterday is raerae, just based on her reaction to MiX’s vengeful townie reveal. Which I suppose also implicates Shraeye.
Walk me through how raerae's reaction makes sense as scum if shraeye is town.
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Galzria
As for the wagon. I’m actually not crazy scum reading a lot of it. It’s townie to run things up D1. It’s actually a good thing. What’s scummy af is how it ended. Hence my question to Shraeye
I don't agree here. I think there is scum on the wagon. vote: Jimmmmm.
"There is scum on the wagon" isn't really a good enough reason to vote there. How many scum do you think are on wagon? And how many are off?
Yeah, I'm going through the day looking for information to help with these questions, and it isn't as simple as I thought at first.
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Pubby and I were nemeses. I could not win with him alive, but when he died I become aligned with town. My guess is that it was the same for him.
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As for the wagon. I’m actually not crazy scum reading a lot of it. It’s townie to run things up D1. It’s actually a good thing. What’s scummy af is how it ended. Hence my question to Shraeye.
Actually the end of the wagon is the towniest thing about it.
How do you mean?
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As for the wagon. I’m actually not crazy scum reading a lot of it. It’s townie to run things up D1. It’s actually a good thing. What’s scummy af is how it ended. Hence my question to Shraeye.
Actually the end of the wagon is the towniest thing about it.
How do you mean?
It was an unnecessary risk for raerae and shraeye. The wagon already had enough support to go through when LaLight voted, and there was no other wagon around that posed any danger.
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Pubby and I were nemeses. I could not win with him alive, but when he died I become aligned with town. My guess is that it was the same for him.
Do you have any insight into what pubby was going for with his voting? Do you have any voting-related abilities?
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So I have a super busy day today and may not be able to get into it until tomorrow or Saturday. But I’ll be following along best I can. I want to reread before pushing too hard, but right now I’m still feeling like the person who looks scummiest after yesterday is raerae, just based on her reaction to MiX’s vengeful townie reveal. Which I suppose also implicates Shraeye.
I stand by it. He hit town, didn't he? D1 is a stupid time to use that power especially when you're shooting based on who pissed you off most for voting for you.
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As for the wagon. I’m actually not crazy scum reading a lot of it. It’s townie to run things up D1. It’s actually a good thing. What’s scummy af is how it ended. Hence my question to Shraeye.
Actually the end of the wagon is the towniest thing about it.
How do you mean?
It was an unnecessary risk for raerae and shraeye. The wagon already had enough support to go through when LaLight voted, and there was no other wagon around that posed any danger.
I disagree. It had already been stated categorically (by you, if I recall) that scum would never just quick lynch day 1 - that it was only a tactic of scum for later days. This was during the time of discussion that MiX said he was concerned about this happening to Pubby. In so saying, you essentially opened the door and provided a free pass for scum to do exactly that.
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I should have asked this sooner but I didn't really think it would be necessary, does anybody have a good reference to understand/look up flavor?
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Here is the mtg wiki. https://mtg.gamepedia.com/Main_Page (https://mtg.gamepedia.com/Main_Page)
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Scum can quickhammer if I vote if I counted them correctly. Besides, pubby's not scum, so we should look into scum before lynching anti-town.
Ah yes, the day 1 scum quickhammer, a tried and true tactic.
Also, how could you even calculate this without knowing how many scum there are, which, I just double-checked, is not currently mod-supplied info?
vote: MiX
faust, I'm still keeping my eye on you.
There's at least 3 (there's always at least 3), and I assumed pubby was scum when doing this. He has (had?) 5 votes, right? Not sure.
Seems to me like the "at least" number (the lower limit) would not be the relevant number in calculating whether a quickhammer is possible. If there are, in fact, 4 scum, then the quickhammer was already possible and your vote wouldn't matter.
But that's semantics. The fact is, the quickhammer thing was an absurd thing to say. Do you really think (A) there's currently no scum on pubby and (B) all the scum in the game would jump on him quickly to get their day 1 mislynch in? Quickhammers are late game phenomena. There's no reason to be talking about a quick hammer in the early game. Also ... you assumed pubby was scum? Huh? That... that must be a typo right? Cause if you thought he was scum then worrying about a quickhammer would be extra weird.
Here's another scenario to try on for size: You're scum who wanted to jump on the bad pubby wagon but didn't want to look to eager, so you made up the quickhammer thing as a way to justify not voting now that wouldn't make you look bad if you decided to vote later.
Sorry, it was Joth, not Faust, that presented the “scum wouldn’t quick-hammer” D1 theory that makes it perfectly “safe” for scum to do just that.
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Also,
Vote: Swan
- Would also be very willing to vote Eddie.
- Waiting for Shraeye’s answer.
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Sorry, it was Joth, not Faust, that presented the “scum wouldn’t quick-hammer” D1 theory that makes it perfectly “safe” for scum to do just that.
Just because one person said that doesn't make it safe. In fact it makes it less safe because now you can make this argument.
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Sorry, it was Joth, not Faust, that presented the “scum wouldn’t quick-hammer” D1 theory that makes it perfectly “safe” for scum to do just that.
Just because one person said that doesn't make it safe. In fact it makes it less safe because now you can make this argument.
Which is why it makes it safe because you can defend the action with this argument.
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Pubby and I were nemeses. I could not win with him alive, but when he died I become aligned with town. My guess is that it was the same for him.
Was he named in your pm?
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So I have a super busy day today and may not be able to get into it until tomorrow or Saturday. But I’ll be following along best I can. I want to reread before pushing too hard, but right now I’m still feeling like the person who looks scummiest after yesterday is raerae, just based on her reaction to MiX’s vengeful townie reveal. Which I suppose also implicates Shraeye.
Walk me through how raerae's reaction makes sense as scum if shraeye is town.
Well, only if raerae made the jump that, if MiX was ready to shoot shraeye he might be willing to shoot her too, given her similar position on the wagon. But I admit that's not strong. My current thinking on shraerae is that they're more likely to be both scum than one scum and one not. Again, I hope a reread will bring clarity when I have time for it.
So I have a super busy day today and may not be able to get into it until tomorrow or Saturday. But I’ll be following along best I can. I want to reread before pushing too hard, but right now I’m still feeling like the person who looks scummiest after yesterday is raerae, just based on her reaction to MiX’s vengeful townie reveal. Which I suppose also implicates Shraeye.
I stand by it. He hit town, didn't he? D1 is a stupid time to use that power especially when you're shooting based on who pissed you off most for voting for you.
This is neither here not there, since it's not your suggestion that I found scummy but the tone and timing of it. The Vengekill seemed to freak you out in a way that makes sense for scum and less so for town.
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Sorry, it was Joth, not Faust, that presented the “scum wouldn’t quick-hammer” D1 theory that makes it perfectly “safe” for scum to do just that.
Just because one person said that doesn't make it safe. In fact it makes it less safe because now you can make this argument.
Which is why it makes it safe because you can defend the action with this argument.
Based on your argument it made it less and more safe at the same time.
Basically yeah, the fact that Joth said it would make it more or less safe depending on whether Shraeye is scum, so the point is moot.
I personally think it's more scummy than not, I see shraeye yoloing this
vote: shraeye
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So I have a super busy day today and may not be able to get into it until tomorrow or Saturday. But I’ll be following along best I can. I want to reread before pushing too hard, but right now I’m still feeling like the person who looks scummiest after yesterday is raerae, just based on her reaction to MiX’s vengeful townie reveal. Which I suppose also implicates Shraeye.
Walk me through how raerae's reaction makes sense as scum if shraeye is town.
Well, only if raerae made the jump that, if MiX was ready to shoot shraeye he might be willing to shoot her too, given her similar position on the wagon. But I admit that's not strong. My current thinking on shraerae is that they're more likely to be both scum than one scum and one not. Again, I hope a reread will bring clarity when I have time for it.
Weird, but it seems the same for me. That they are more likely to both be scums
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All fire, no substance. This isn't townrae.
What happened to this read? It sounds pretty sure
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So I have a super busy day today and may not be able to get into it until tomorrow or Saturday. But I’ll be following along best I can. I want to reread before pushing too hard, but right now I’m still feeling like the person who looks scummiest after yesterday is raerae, just based on her reaction to MiX’s vengeful townie reveal. Which I suppose also implicates Shraeye.
Walk me through how raerae's reaction makes sense as scum if shraeye is town.
Well, only if raerae made the jump that, if MiX was ready to shoot shraeye he might be willing to shoot her too, given her similar position on the wagon. But I admit that's not strong. My current thinking on shraerae is that they're more likely to be both scum than one scum and one not. Again, I hope a reread will bring clarity when I have time for it.
So I have a super busy day today and may not be able to get into it until tomorrow or Saturday. But I’ll be following along best I can. I want to reread before pushing too hard, but right now I’m still feeling like the person who looks scummiest after yesterday is raerae, just based on her reaction to MiX’s vengeful townie reveal. Which I suppose also implicates Shraeye.
I stand by it. He hit town, didn't he? D1 is a stupid time to use that power especially when you're shooting based on who pissed you off most for voting for you.
This is neither here not there, since it's not your suggestion that I found scummy but the tone and timing of it. The Vengekill seemed to freak you out in a way that makes sense for scum and less so for town.
Was I supposed to say that vengekilling D1 based on nothing is a bad idea BEFORE he told us he had that power?
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Idk how I can be clearer about this. Try to put yourself in a scum mindset. You just pulled off a town lynch. Easy enough on day 1, but still, always a relief. You can exhale. It’s over. But then, your mislynch says he gets a vengekill! And he’s talking about your partner. He could shoot at any time. You gotta post something and quick. What’s the safest townie take? Try to talk him into shooting a townie? Of course not. That just makes you look bad after the shot. So you go to the old “don’t use the shot, town vigs are negative utility, etc, etc. That’s what I’m proposing.
I think the average townie reacts like the rest of us did: hey, town has a new weapon we can use. Yeah, we mislynched, but we get a do-over. Let’s put it to the best use we can.
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Idk how I can be clearer about this. Try to put yourself in a scum mindset. You just pulled off a town lynch. Easy enough on day 1, but still, always a relief. You can exhale. It’s over. But then, your mislynch says he gets a vengekill! And he’s talking about your partner. He could shoot at any time. You gotta post something and quick. What’s the safest townie take? Try to talk him into shooting a townie? Of course not. That just makes you look bad after the shot. So you go to the old “don’t use the shot, town vigs are negative utility, etc, etc. That’s what I’m proposing.
I think the average townie reacts like the rest of us did: hey, town has a new weapon we can use. Yeah, we mislynched, but we get a do-over. Let’s put it to the best use we can.
If you are making an argument that raerae is scum that relies on shraeye being scum, then you should really push shraeye and not raerae, so you have to explain why shraeye is scum.
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Idk how I can be clearer about this. Try to put yourself in a scum mindset. You just pulled off a town lynch. Easy enough on day 1, but still, always a relief. You can exhale. It’s over. But then, your mislynch says he gets a vengekill! And he’s talking about your partner. He could shoot at any time. You gotta post something and quick. What’s the safest townie take? Try to talk him into shooting a townie? Of course not. That just makes you look bad after the shot. So you go to the old “don’t use the shot, town vigs are negative utility, etc, etc. That’s what I’m proposing.
I think the average townie reacts like the rest of us did: hey, town has a new weapon we can use. Yeah, we mislynched, but we get a do-over. Let’s put it to the best use we can.
Uhhhhhh...
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Idk how I can be clearer about this. Try to put yourself in a scum mindset. You just pulled off a town lynch. Easy enough on day 1, but still, always a relief. You can exhale. It’s over. But then, your mislynch says he gets a vengekill! And he’s talking about your partner. He could shoot at any time. You gotta post something and quick. What’s the safest townie take? Try to talk him into shooting a townie? Of course not. That just makes you look bad after the shot. So you go to the old “don’t use the shot, town vigs are negative utility, etc, etc. That’s what I’m proposing.
I think the average townie reacts like the rest of us did: hey, town has a new weapon we can use. Yeah, we mislynched, but we get a do-over. Let’s put it to the best use we can.
Uhhhhhh...
Are you saying that you already have a scum mindset?
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It seems like Joth is recommending raerae to think in a scum mindset.
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Shoot! I knew I was doing something wrong...
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Sorry, it was Joth, not Faust, that presented the “scum wouldn’t quick-hammer” D1 theory that makes it perfectly “safe” for scum to do just that.
Just because one person said that doesn't make it safe. In fact it makes it less safe because now you can make this argument.
Which is why it makes it safe because you can defend the action with this argument.
You can deconstruct any argument by adding layers of WIFOM, but that is not helpful. Without a mention of scum quickhammering noone would have considered it, so it would be safe to do it. As soon as it is mentioned, it's on people's minds. So you can be scum and try a WIFOM thing, but you can't go in assuming town won't even consider it.
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Idk how I can be clearer about this. Try to put yourself in a scum mindset. You just pulled off a town lynch. Easy enough on day 1, but still, always a relief. You can exhale. It’s over. But then, your mislynch says he gets a vengekill! And he’s talking about your partner. He could shoot at any time. You gotta post something and quick. What’s the safest townie take? Try to talk him into shooting a townie? Of course not. That just makes you look bad after the shot. So you go to the old “don’t use the shot, town vigs are negative utility, etc, etc. That’s what I’m proposing.
I think the average townie reacts like the rest of us did: hey, town has a new weapon we can use. Yeah, we mislynched, but we get a do-over. Let’s put it to the best use we can.
If you are making an argument that raerae is scum that relies on shraeye being scum, then you should really push shraeye and not raerae, so you have to explain why shraeye is scum.
I get your point, but I disagree.
Rae voted for Shraeye literally the entire day up until this post:
Vote: MiX
I think that's L-2?
1) Skummy L-2 mix up. This was post #294. Less than 20 posts previously, Joth voted MiX and claimed L-2. There were no votes in between on anyone from anyone.
2) There is a three part interaction between Rae-Shraeye-Mix, that floods over into the beginning of Day 2 here.
Part 1 - Rae votes for and stays on Shraeye all day up until their vote for Mix. Throughout the day they continue to stand by their Shraeye vote as well as continue to attempt to put pressure on Shraeye:
Hey, raerae, do you have anything to offer besides RVS votes?
Naw, still cool with it considering he hasn't said anything other than arbitrary numbers and a half-promise about a flavor name claim. I could move to MiX probably but I'm fine where I am for now.
"want to say my flavor name"
It's a Scum move: awaclus
It's a spotlight thing: Faust
You do you, girl: joth
Antitown: datswan
Followup question: raerae
Ignored: WCD, Uncle, gkrieg, pubby, Galz, jimmm, EFHW, laLight
Ignored, except to ask if I was doing it: Mix
Majority of scum clearly in the nonresponse group (which includes MiX). Not just because that side has more people.
Let me know who I scummily mischaracterized.
Also, I haven't made up my mind yet
Definitely not clear. Care to expand on why that's so obvious? Seems like you got some insider info, friend.
Hey, Shraeye, could you throw in the change in the cumulative scores in your posts? For clarity, mainly.
How is there any clarity currently?! He hasn't explained what the numbers mean so everybody is just assuming positive is good, negative is bad but he hasn't explained anything.
All fire, no substance. This isn't townrae.
So just not answering questions then? Super cool.
I'm staying here and nominate shraeye as the alternate wagon.
Part 2: Rae thinks Shraeye is skum. Rae also could move to MiX, when the choices presented were Swan or MiX. This adds up still to this point, as Shraeye was on the Swan wagon at this point (why follow your skum read, right?). OK, hold onto that thought.
Part 3: Rae then towards the end of the day puts MiX at L-1, claiming it was L-2. Shraeye follows with the hammer. MiX then immediately claims their power stating they want to vengkill Shraeye. Rae then DEFENDS Shraeye:
Swan or shraeye. SWAN OR SHRAEYE
Someone tell me why shraeye shouldn't die right now.
I AM A VENGEFUL TOWNY.
WHO SHOULD I KILL.
WHY SHOULDN'T IT BE SHRAEYE
HELP ME YOU BASTARDS
If you don't have any strong scum reads then the townie thing to do is nothing.
Nah that's worthless. Ok Ok Ok I need to THINK.
Nope, killing a townie because you just NEED to use your power is selfish and anti-town but you do you, boo.
OK - So the story goes...
- You are skum reading and voting a player all day.
- You end up going for your alternate wagon (which your skum read is not on)
- Then your top skum read comes in and quick hammers the wagon.
- MiX comes out and says they have vengkill.
Why does Rae defend Shraeye there? Why are they "town being shot just because MiX is angry" all of a sudden? The only thing that changed since the previous skum read on Shraeye is that Shraeye came in and hammered MiX. When MiX says they are vengeful they are either trolling or they are truthful, so assuming truthful... this just should make Shraeye more skummy to Rae. Right?
There is of course also the narrative where they both could be skum I suppose, but as people have already touched on it, I am not gonna get into it. But in regards to an on wagon choice - I am:
Vote: RaeRae
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My other theory is that Jimm is skum along with one of EFHW/Faust. but I have not had time enough to delve into that one, and even if I did I do not think it would rank higher currently to me then my opinion on Rae.
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Idk how I can be clearer about this. Try to put yourself in a scum mindset. You just pulled off a town lynch. Easy enough on day 1, but still, always a relief. You can exhale. It’s over. But then, your mislynch says he gets a vengekill! And he’s talking about your partner. He could shoot at any time. You gotta post something and quick. What’s the safest townie take? Try to talk him into shooting a townie? Of course not. That just makes you look bad after the shot. So you go to the old “don’t use the shot, town vigs are negative utility, etc, etc. That’s what I’m proposing.
I think the average townie reacts like the rest of us did: hey, town has a new weapon we can use. Yeah, we mislynched, but we get a do-over. Let’s put it to the best use we can.
I 100% completely agree with this. Especially when the suggested "second shot" is the player that you had been skum reading all day.
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There is of course also the narrative where they both could be skum I suppose, but as people have already touched on it, I am not gonna get into it.
Wouldn't I encourage MiX voting for shraeye if I were scum and knew shraeye was town? You can't have this cake and eat it too. Either it's team shraerae all the way or I'm town and he's a mystery.
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Idk how I can be clearer about this. Try to put yourself in a scum mindset. You just pulled off a town lynch. Easy enough on day 1, but still, always a relief. You can exhale. It’s over. But then, your mislynch says he gets a vengekill! And he’s talking about your partner. He could shoot at any time. You gotta post something and quick. What’s the safest townie take? Try to talk him into shooting a townie? Of course not. That just makes you look bad after the shot. So you go to the old “don’t use the shot, town vigs are negative utility, etc, etc. That’s what I’m proposing.
I think the average townie reacts like the rest of us did: hey, town has a new weapon we can use. Yeah, we mislynched, but we get a do-over. Let’s put it to the best use we can.
I 100% completely agree with this. Especially when the suggested "second shot" is the player that you had been skum reading all day.
But MiX hadn't been reading shraeye as scum. I'm a big enough person to admit my reads aren't fact, they're opinions. So, if somebody hasn't been agreeing with my read but suddenly rage decides it's right I think it's my duty as town to tell that person to slow their roll and think logically. I wouldn't have shot if I were MiX's shoes.
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Why does Rae defend Shraeye there? Why are they "town being shot just because MiX is angry" all of a sudden? The only thing that changed since the previous skum read on Shraeye is that Shraeye came in and hammered MiX. When MiX says they are vengeful they are either trolling or they are truthful, so assuming truthful... this just should make Shraeye more skummy to Rae. Right?
So why does scum!raerae defend town!shraeye?
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"Try to put yourself in a scum mindset" was sort of a general plural "you". It was a rhetorical device designed to help explain my raerae case to everyone. Yes, scum is already in a scum mindset, including raerae if she is, in fact, scum.
DatSwan has helpfully done the work I was going to do after my reread to present this case. raerae's reaction to MiX's post-death claim is the scummiest thing that happened yesterday.
Don't worry, still planning to re-read that end of day when I have the time. But for now, can hang with vote: raerae
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Domri Rade looked over a scene of rampant destruction. Normally one of his favorite things to look over, but the was a little concerned that the Boros soldiers, the Azorius soldiers, and extraplanar zombies all seemed to be equally smashed, with no regard for which side each was on.
Concerned, but not surprised. He walked over to the giant, two-headed ogre who was presiding over the victors.
"Thar," he said. "I think we talked about this. The clans have an agreement with-"
"No agreement!" said one of the heads. "Only smash!"
"I wasn't talking to you, Ruric," said Domri.
"He's right though, whelp," said the other head. "We've never needed allies or treaties before. One rule was always enough. As Borborygmus always put it, 'Not Gruul? Then die!'"
"Borborygmus isn't in charge anymore," said Domri. "I am. And I say we have allies now. It's not too hard to figure out which ones you're allowed to smash."
"Tell Ruric who to smash, tiny man gets smashed," muttered Ruric.
"C'mon," said Domri.
"I make no promises," said Thar.
Vote Count 2.1
DatSwan (2): faust, Galzria
Jimmm (1): EFHW
shraeye (1): LaLight
raerae (2): DatSwan, jothonah
Not voting (6): Awaclus, UncleEurope, gkrieg, shraeye, raerae, Jimmm.
With 12 alive, it takes 6 to lynch. The day will end at 6:30 pm on Wednesday, October 23rd.
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Why does Rae defend Shraeye there? Why are they "town being shot just because MiX is angry" all of a sudden? The only thing that changed since the previous skum read on Shraeye is that Shraeye came in and hammered MiX. When MiX says they are vengeful they are either trolling or they are truthful, so assuming truthful... this just should make Shraeye more skummy to Rae. Right?
So why does scum!raerae defend town!shraeye?
because the only other person that was listed in MiX's list was me, and I am town.
the point you make is essentially the only reason I can entertain them both being skum.
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There is of course also the narrative where they both could be skum I suppose, but as people have already touched on it, I am not gonna get into it.
Wouldn't I encourage MiX voting for shraeye if I were scum and knew shraeye was town? You can't have this cake and eat it too. Either it's team shraerae all the way or I'm town and he's a mystery.
skum can absolutely have and eat cake. it is the advantage of being skum.
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Idk how I can be clearer about this. Try to put yourself in a scum mindset. You just pulled off a town lynch. Easy enough on day 1, but still, always a relief. You can exhale. It’s over. But then, your mislynch says he gets a vengekill! And he’s talking about your partner. He could shoot at any time. You gotta post something and quick. What’s the safest townie take? Try to talk him into shooting a townie? Of course not. That just makes you look bad after the shot. So you go to the old “don’t use the shot, town vigs are negative utility, etc, etc. That’s what I’m proposing.
I think the average townie reacts like the rest of us did: hey, town has a new weapon we can use. Yeah, we mislynched, but we get a do-over. Let’s put it to the best use we can.
I 100% completely agree with this. Especially when the suggested "second shot" is the player that you had been skum reading all day.
But MiX hadn't been reading shraeye as scum. I'm a big enough person to admit my reads aren't fact, they're opinions. So, if somebody hasn't been agreeing with my read but suddenly rage decides it's right I think it's my duty as town to tell that person to slow their roll and think logically. I wouldn't have shot if I were MiX's shoes.
mix hadn't been ANYTHING - reading Shraeye. No one had.
Shayeye
1) opened with a weird flavor claim suggestion thing
2) continued to just post these strange arbitrary number lists and then ignore questions to it
3) hammered MiX
Mix knew Mix was town, when you add 1 2 and 3 together... it really wasn't like "wrong of Mix" to be suspecting Shraeye there.
Moreso... it was extremely "wrong" of you to be defending them.
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Sorry, it was Joth, not Faust, that presented the “scum wouldn’t quick-hammer” D1 theory that makes it perfectly “safe” for scum to do just that.
Just because one person said that doesn't make it safe. In fact it makes it less safe because now you can make this argument.
Which is why it makes it safe because you can defend the action with this argument.
You can deconstruct any argument by adding layers of WIFOM, but that is not helpful. Without a mention of scum quickhammering noone would have considered it, so it would be safe to do it. As soon as it is mentioned, it's on people's minds. So you can be scum and try a WIFOM thing, but you can't go in assuming town won't even consider it.
I simply disagree. In a world where scum isn’t given a safe-pass to do something that would be considered suicide, it absolutely never happens. The WIFOM presented was when you said “in fact it makes it less safe because you made this argument.” My response was merely demonstrative of the circular logic you presented. Yes, my argument was bad - so was yours. Scum would never do what Shraeye & Raerae did D1 unless expressly presented the opportunity by a conversation saying “boy, scum would never do that!”.
I’m not arguing that the hammer makes either of them scum - simply that by virtue of scum being given the window to do it, it’s a very scummy thing to have happened. D1’s rarely if ever end like that. Town doesn’t do it. Scum doesn’t do it. Yet it happened.
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Why does Rae defend Shraeye there? Why are they "town being shot just because MiX is angry" all of a sudden? The only thing that changed since the previous skum read on Shraeye is that Shraeye came in and hammered MiX. When MiX says they are vengeful they are either trolling or they are truthful, so assuming truthful... this just should make Shraeye more skummy to Rae. Right?
So why does scum!raerae defend town!shraeye?
because the only other person that was listed in MiX's list was me, and I am town.
the point you make is essentially the only reason I can entertain them both being skum.
I don't understand. What list? What does this have to do with raerae?
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Why does Rae defend Shraeye there? Why are they "town being shot just because MiX is angry" all of a sudden? The only thing that changed since the previous skum read on Shraeye is that Shraeye came in and hammered MiX. When MiX says they are vengeful they are either trolling or they are truthful, so assuming truthful... this just should make Shraeye more skummy to Rae. Right?
So why does scum!raerae defend town!shraeye?
because the only other person that was listed in MiX's list was me, and I am town.
the point you make is essentially the only reason I can entertain them both being skum.
I don't understand. What list? What does this have to do with raerae?
The list mix Gave when Rae defended Shraeye was choosing between me or Shraeye. They prob assumed mix was gonna veng Shraeye so they protected shraeye... with the worst case being mix goes me instead
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Which would work either way (so they argued no shot). That is my theory at least.
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Why does Rae defend Shraeye there? Why are they "town being shot just because MiX is angry" all of a sudden? The only thing that changed since the previous skum read on Shraeye is that Shraeye came in and hammered MiX. When MiX says they are vengeful they are either trolling or they are truthful, so assuming truthful... this just should make Shraeye more skummy to Rae. Right?
So why does scum!raerae defend town!shraeye?
because the only other person that was listed in MiX's list was me, and I am town.
the point you make is essentially the only reason I can entertain them both being skum.
I don't understand. What list? What does this have to do with raerae?
The list mix Gave when Rae defended Shraeye was choosing between me or Shraeye. They prob assumed mix was gonna veng Shraeye so they protected shraeye... with the worst case being mix goes me instead
Can you quote this? I remember being on the chopping block too and somehow Didds died instead of any of us. So how did I pick shraeye over you? And, again, if you're both town and I'm scum, why would I defend anybody? Why would the worst case mean you dying?
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Why does Rae defend Shraeye there? Why are they "town being shot just because MiX is angry" all of a sudden? The only thing that changed since the previous skum read on Shraeye is that Shraeye came in and hammered MiX. When MiX says they are vengeful they are either trolling or they are truthful, so assuming truthful... this just should make Shraeye more skummy to Rae. Right?
So why does scum!raerae defend town!shraeye?
because the only other person that was listed in MiX's list was me, and I am town.
the point you make is essentially the only reason I can entertain them both being skum.
I don't understand. What list? What does this have to do with raerae?
The list mix Gave when Rae defended Shraeye was choosing between me or Shraeye. They prob assumed mix was gonna veng Shraeye so they protected shraeye... with the worst case being mix goes me instead
Can you quote this? I remember being on the chopping block too and somehow Didds died instead of any of us. So how did I pick shraeye over you? And, again, if you're both town and I'm scum, why would I defend anybody? Why would the worst case mean you dying?
When you responded the only two on the block were me and Shraeye. So you would defend people bc you didn’t think you were at risk.
The worst case was a figure of speech as in “you chose to defend Shraeye when the worst case at the time was me (which if you are skum, would still be good for you).”
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You and joth sure have a lot of interesting figures of speech.
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The worst case was a figure of speech as in “you chose to defend Shraeye when the worst case at the time was me (which if you are skum, would still be good for you).”
Your reasoning kinda fails in that if shraeye/you are both town, then the actual worst case for scum!raerae is noone getting shot, which is exactly what she argued for...
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People are acting like raerae took a lot of time to decide what her best course of action would be, but my point is exactly the opposite. Look at the time-stamps:
I AM A VENGEFUL TOWNY.
WHO SHOULD I KILL.
WHY SHOULDN'T IT BE SHRAEYE
HELP ME YOU BASTARDS
If you don't have any strong scum reads then the townie thing to do is nothing.
It took raerae all of three minutes to jump to "don't shoot anyone". I don't think she thought through all the possibilities. I think she saw an unexpected danger to her team's wincon and shot from the hip to try to mitigate it. MiX's all caps post there was a little unhinged. raerae could be forgiven for thinking he might pull the trigger any second. "Don't shoot anyone" was damage control. It was almost instinctive. She could have said "Yes, go ahead, do it, shoot shraeye". Maybe that would have worked. Maybe MiX would have been like "nah, you seem too eager. incinerate: raerae." But she went with the safe thing that she thought would look the towniest and be most likely to prevent her team from being vengekilled.
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I would point out that you as well don't provide a satisfying answer to the question:
So why does scum!raerae defend town!shraeye?
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I would point out that you as well don't provide a satisfying answer to the question:
So why does scum!raerae defend town!shraeye?
1. What makes you so sure shraeye is town?
2. I have given answers. Whether you find them satisfying is kinda your deal, dude.
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Vote: joth
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1. What makes you so sure shraeye is town?
This is missing the point. This isn't about me thinking shraeye must be town, this is about you being too chicken to go after shraeye when logically that is the only thing that makes sense given your stated opinions.
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Yeah, joth, get real brave and go after me. After all, you can't back down from a dare like that...
Also, hey people!
Also also, yeah I did stuff at night, it was cool stuff. But how is that relevant at all to somebody who didn't track me?? Is doing cool stuff scummy? Is NOT doing cool stuff scummy?
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The worst case was a figure of speech as in “you chose to defend Shraeye when the worst case at the time was me (which if you are skum, would still be good for you).”
Your reasoning kinda fails in that if shraeye/you are both town, then the actual worst case for scum!raerae is noone getting shot, which is exactly what she argued for...
Isn't he arguing that raerae and Shraeye are both scum?
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Also also also, the Faust/galz discussion regarding quickhammers and whether speaking about the before heightens or lessens scumminess is absurdly abstract. It's really not a fruitful discussion
I did what I did and I said why I did it. LaLight is correct that a yolo hammer is entirely in shraeyes wheelhouse. At the time, I saw both raerae and MiX as suspicious. There was a general atmosphere of people being timid to put MiX to L-1, and it seemed entirely possible for scum to vote their partner there knowing that people will get nervous and back off. Turns out MiX wasn't scum and that sucks.
If you want to be correct, you can believe me. If you want to be wrong, you can be suspicious of me. But hey peeps, that's your right to choose in action.
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@EFHW, nope.
Why does Rae defend Shraeye there? Why are they "town being shot just because MiX is angry" all of a sudden? The only thing that changed since the previous skum read on Shraeye is that Shraeye came in and hammered MiX. When MiX says they are vengeful they are either trolling or they are truthful, so assuming truthful... this just should make Shraeye more skummy to Rae. Right?
So why does scum!raerae defend town!shraeye?
because the only other person that was listed in MiX's list was me, and I am town.
the point you make is essentially the only reason I can entertain them both being skum.
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Vote: joth
Why joth over DatSwan when they're basically making the same argument?
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I don't think raerae seems panicked in her posts at eod. There's a hint that she knows Shraeye is town, but that doesn't fit with protecting Shraeye narrative. More likely she has a gut townread on Shraeye despite her campaign that he is scum.
I wish Shraeye had waited before hammering, but I don't think it was scummy.
unvote because MiX really did give people reasons to lynch him, so the wagon seems less scummy than MiX wagons usually do.
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The worst case was a figure of speech as in “you chose to defend Shraeye when the worst case at the time was me (which if you are skum, would still be good for you).”
Your reasoning kinda fails in that if shraeye/you are both town, then the actual worst case for scum!raerae is noone getting shot, which is exactly what she argued for...
Isn't he arguing that raerae and Shraeye are both scum?
I am not saying they are both skum.
And Just the same as skum might agree with a day 1 plan that they know will never happen just to look towny, so i believe Rae made the argument for not veng killing assuming the likelihood of mix shooting was extremely high.
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But if Shraeye's town and raerae is scum, why would she be upset that Shraeye might get lynched?
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But if Shraeye's town and raerae is scum, why would she be upset that Shraeye might get lynched?
Maybe she just likes to play mafia with shraeye?
(Totally don't think so, think they're both scum)
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Vote: joth
Why joth over DatSwan when they're basically making the same argument?
This.
Also, you prefer Swan. Also 2x, Rae, vote Swan with me.
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But if Shraeye's town and raerae is scum, why would she be upset that Shraeye might get lynched?
I have answered this numerous times in detail to this point - but to summarize. I think that Rae was lying because at the time of their efforts they were either a) not someone that MiX wanted to target or b) it was today (after the fact) and there was no threat. So it looks towny.
There was NO CHANGE IN INTERACTION BETWEEN SHRAYE-MIX-RAE between the time Rae thought Shraeye was skum and the time Rae was defending Shraeye.
That is the point in it's entirety. People go from reading town to skum and skum to town and everything in between... but usually there are reasons. There was no reason here. In fact if anything, there was the reverse of reason, for Rae to switch a read on Shraeye from Skum to Town given the action between Rae's votes.
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Vote: joth
Why joth over DatSwan when they're basically making the same argument?
This.
Also, you prefer Swan. Also 2x, Rae, vote Swan with me.
So you and faust are just what? like phoning it in this game?
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Vote: DatSwan
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Vote: joth
Why joth over DatSwan when they're basically making the same argument?
This.
Also, you prefer Swan. Also 2x, Rae, vote Swan with me.
So you and faust are just what? like phoning it in this game?
if you want to lynch me at least pretend to be towny and do some work.
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Faust, if I think shraeye and Rae are partners, why is one any better or worse than the other?
“You day you like chocolate AND vanilla but the ice cream you’re currently eating right now is only chocolate. Lying scum.”
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The worst case was a figure of speech as in “you chose to defend Shraeye when the worst case at the time was me (which if you are skum, would still be good for you).”
Your reasoning kinda fails in that if shraeye/you are both town, then the actual worst case for scum!raerae is noone getting shot, which is exactly what she argued for...
Isn't he arguing that raerae and Shraeye are both scum?
Yes, but he hasn't presented arguments that shraeye is scum, instead making arguments that raerae is scum that rely on shraeye being scum.
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Vote: joth
Why joth over DatSwan when they're basically making the same argument?
I've ben voting DatSwan before. But they're not making exactly the same argument - DatSwan doesn't necessarily think that shraeye is scum - and I've found DatSwan's take a bit more believable.
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DatSwan, any comment on this?
The worst case was a figure of speech as in “you chose to defend Shraeye when the worst case at the time was me (which if you are skum, would still be good for you).”
Your reasoning kinda fails in that if shraeye/you are both town, then the actual worst case for scum!raerae is noone getting shot, which is exactly what she argued for...
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I'm so tired of being mischaracterized my faust.
I am voting raerae because it's raerae's behavior that is odd and rings scummy.
The case for that behavior being scummy is neater if shraeye is scum.
But there is still a case there is shraeye is town.
The shraeye-is-town version basically relies on raerae panicking and making a suboptimal decision. But that is totally believable:
-- Things were moving fast at the end of the day
-- MiX's demeanor created a sense of urgency
-- Coming out hard against using the power AT ALL was the safe bet, because it had less possibility of backfiring
raerae's priority was to keep MiX from shooting. Everyone else's priority was to try to direct his shot to their scumreads. I think that's because her priority was to avoid her worst case scenario: MiX shooting scum.
faust, is this clear? All of this works regardless of shraeye's alignment. It is neater if they're partners, and I have additional evidence that they are partners (their not very convincing day 1 animosity) so that's what I think is most likely.
I note that you haven't really tried to address or refute the notion that raerae and shraeye are partners at all, instead framing it as prima facie scummy/stupid. It is not.
TL;DR My case on raerae does NOT depend on shraeye being scum, but I do think it's likely they're both scum, and faust is being unhelpful and disingenuous, so I honestly wouldn't rule out the three of them being the scum team.
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But if Shraeye's town and raerae is scum, why would she be upset that Shraeye might get lynched?
I have answered this numerous times in detail to this point - but to summarize. I think that Rae was lying because at the time of their efforts they were either a) not someone that MiX wanted to target or b) it was today (after the fact) and there was no threat. So it looks towny.
There was NO CHANGE IN INTERACTION BETWEEN SHRAYE-MIX-RAE between the time Rae thought Shraeye was skum and the time Rae was defending Shraeye.
That is the point in it's entirety. People go from reading town to skum and skum to town and everything in between... but usually there are reasons. There was no reason here. In fact if anything, there was the reverse of reason, for Rae to switch a read on Shraeye from Skum to Town given the action between Rae's votes.
Sorry for the repeated question. But this theory doesn't make sense unless they are both scum, but you keep insisting that is not your conclusion. I agree that the switch is weird, but to me the best explanation is that she never had a scumread on Shraeye in the first place.
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@joth, you gave MiX similar advice - only shoot if >50% sure. But then you gave him permission not to take it. I don't read raerae as panicking at all.
vote: joth
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@joth, you gave MiX similar advice - only shoot if >50% sure. But then you gave him permission not to take it. I don't read raerae as panicking at all.
vote: joth
I'm not sure how "shoot at someone if you think they're scum" and "don't shoot" are similar advice. To me they seem very different.
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Also, man, for people who are overly concerned about my scum case being intricately laid out, you and faust sure are voting for me for no stated reason other than that you disagree with me.
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Here's the advice:
I also think that you shouldn't shoot unless you're better than 50% sure they're scum but you seem unreceptive to that idea.
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Also, man, for people who are overly concerned about my scum case being intricately laid out, you and faust sure are voting for me for no stated reason other than that you disagree with me.
The advice looks different, but since there is no way to be >50% sure on Day 1, it's equivalent to raerae's. But you are making a scum case on her based on the advice she gave.
What are the chances that raerae has a legit scumread on Shraeye at the start of EVERY game?
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there is no way to be >50% sure on Day 1
citation needed.
Like, 50% sure is kind of a squishy figure and I'm sure you and I and MiX think of it differently, but I definitely wasn't thinking of it as something impossible and I doubt MiX was. 50% is a fairly low bar. Assuming a 4-person scum team and 15 players, your prior should be 28%. Fifty is much closer to that then to 100.
What are the chances that raerae has a legit scumread on Shraeye at the start of EVERY game?
She always RVS votes shraeye but this was more than that.
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Vote: joth
Why joth over DatSwan when they're basically making the same argument?
This.
Also, you prefer Swan. Also 2x, Rae, vote Swan with me.
Why?
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Like, 50% sure is kind of a squishy figure and I'm sure you and I and MiX think of it differently, but I definitely wasn't thinking of it as something impossible and I doubt MiX was. 50% is a fairly low bar. Assuming a 4-person scum team and 15 players, your prior should be 28%. Fifty is much closer to that then to 100.
Out of all the games that I played, I only remember one where I was more than 50% sure that someone was scum by the end of D1. That's saying that someone is twice as likely to be scum as the average player, by your numbers, which is a pretty big leap. If people were regularly at 50% for their D1 reads, then scum would be lynched on about 50% of all D1s.
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Pubby and I were nemeses. I could not win with him alive, but when he died I become aligned with town. My guess is that it was the same for him.
Do you have any insight into what pubby was going for with his voting? Do you have any voting-related abilities?
I have no idea and no
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Pubby and I were nemeses. I could not win with him alive, but when he died I become aligned with town. My guess is that it was the same for him.
Was he named in your pm?
Yes
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vote: Awaclus
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Pubby and I were nemeses. I could not win with him alive, but when he died I become aligned with town. My guess is that it was the same for him.
Was he named in your pm?
Yes
So presumably you were also named in his but he never voted for you. And he claimed he got night actions depending on how he voted but you got assigned to town once he was out of the way. Do I have to facts right?
Why the Awaclus vote?
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I'm so tired of being mischaracterized my faust.
I am voting raerae because it's raerae's behavior that is odd and rings scummy.
The case for that behavior being scummy is neater if shraeye is scum.
But there is still a case there is shraeye is town.
The shraeye-is-town version basically relies on raerae panicking and making a suboptimal decision.
I'll try to explain my problems as concisely as I can. There's a case for raerae being scum if shraeye is scum, fair. There is evidence that points towards raerae being scum in that case.
But the "case" if shraeye is town is not a case at all. It's not argument for raerae to be scum, it's merely (an attempt at) invalidating an argument for why she's town. There is no positive evidence of her scumminess in that case.
What also bothers me here is that in the scum!shraeye scenario you posit that scum!raerae kept it calm under pressure and did the thing that benefits her team. Yet in the town!shraeye scenario, you suggest that she's panicking (when there's no reason to panic). These are wildly different reactions, how do both of them fit raerae's meta?
I note that you haven't really tried to address or refute the notion that raerae and shraeye are partners at all, instead framing it as prima facie scummy/stupid. It is not.
I have not framed anything. I have asked questions to figure out whether your position is logically sound. Had I intended to present evidence that shraerae are town, I would have done so.
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Why does Rae defend Shraeye there? Why are they "town being shot just because MiX is angry" all of a sudden? The only thing that changed since the previous skum read on Shraeye is that Shraeye came in and hammered MiX. When MiX says they are vengeful they are either trolling or they are truthful, so assuming truthful... this just should make Shraeye more skummy to Rae. Right?
So why does scum!raerae defend town!shraeye?
because the only other person that was listed in MiX's list was me, and I am town.
the point you make is essentially the only reason I can entertain them both being skum.
I don't understand. What list? What does this have to do with raerae?
The list mix Gave when Rae defended Shraeye was choosing between me or Shraeye. They prob assumed mix was gonna veng Shraeye so they protected shraeye... with the worst case being mix goes me instead
Just gotta correct this, MiX said he couldn't vote for you because he could only vote for people on his wagon.
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Vote: joth
Why joth over DatSwan when they're basically making the same argument?
This.
Also, you prefer Swan. Also 2x, Rae, vote Swan with me.
Why?
I don't have a good answer for this. I was under the impression that DatSwan initiated the idea, but I see that is not true. I'll unvote again, since things are so murky.
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Why does Rae defend Shraeye there? Why are they "town being shot just because MiX is angry" all of a sudden? The only thing that changed since the previous skum read on Shraeye is that Shraeye came in and hammered MiX. When MiX says they are vengeful they are either trolling or they are truthful, so assuming truthful... this just should make Shraeye more skummy to Rae. Right?
So why does scum!raerae defend town!shraeye?
because the only other person that was listed in MiX's list was me, and I am town.
the point you make is essentially the only reason I can entertain them both being skum.
I don't understand. What list? What does this have to do with raerae?
The list mix Gave when Rae defended Shraeye was choosing between me or Shraeye. They prob assumed mix was gonna veng Shraeye so they protected shraeye... with the worst case being mix goes me instead
Just gotta correct this, MiX said he couldn't vote for you because he could only vote for people on his wagon.
That was not articulated until after your reaction. You reacted to this post:
Swan or shraeye. SWAN OR SHRAEYE
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raerae is a good lynch target today because of that contradiction in her attitude towards Shraeye. I can see scum jumping on that. Also town would have questions. I'm am befuddled why both joth and DatSwan think the scum!raerae, town!shraeye theory makes sense.
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Nope. See below.
I AM A VENGEFUL TOWNY.
WHO SHOULD I KILL.
WHY SHOULDN'T IT BE SHRAEYE
HELP ME YOU BASTARDS
If you don't have any strong scum reads then the townie thing to do is nothing.
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What also bothers me here is that in the scum!shraeye scenario you posit that scum!raerae kept it calm under pressure and did the thing that benefits her team. Yet in the town!shraeye scenario, you suggest that she's panicking (when there's no reason to panic). These are wildly different reactions, how do both of them fit raerae's meta?
Maybe "panicking" was the wrong word? I didn't mean it the way you're using it. I just mean, if raerae's scum, then regardless of shraeye's alignment, her reaction to MiX's claim should be read as a time-pressured reaction to clear and present danger. In a situation like that, you have to make a decision fast and commit to it (something that generally I would expect raerae to be good at). Raerae made the decision to adopt a "don't shoot" stance that would accomplish two goals: protect her team from the venge shot, and make her look townie/keep her from having to deal with the politics of trying to direct the shot*. The decision and the nature of it doesn't change that much based on shraeye's alignment. What changes is whether it was a good or bad decision. If shraeye is town, maybe it's a bad decision. But it's still one I can see scum!raerae making in a high stress moment. Does that make sense? There's no inconsistency of character between the two scenarios. The only difference is whether raerae is reacting to an explicit threat to her partner or an implicit threat, based on the fact that MiX was likely to shoot someone and it was hard to guess who.
*To explain this point a little more, trying to direct the shot is a bit perilous for scum, since if they succeed in directing it at town they then look pretty bad.
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raerae is a good lynch target today because of that contradiction in her attitude towards Shraeye. I can see scum jumping on that. Also town would have questions. I'm am befuddled why both joth and DatSwan think the scum!raerae, town!shraeye theory makes sense.
There was no contraction. I never said, "Don't kill shraeye," I said, "Don't kill anybody unless you have a strong scum read."
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protect her team from the venge shot, and make her look townie/keep her from having to deal with the politics of trying to direct the shot*.
This my my gripe: if shraeye is town, there was no immediate danger to raerae's team. If scum!raerae thinks arguing for no shot is townie, then that's because she thinks town!her would do it. But if that's the case, why aren't we dealing with town!her to begin with? Your case seems like "raerae did something she'd do as town, so she's scum".
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raerae is a good lynch target today because of that contradiction in her attitude towards Shraeye. I can see scum jumping on that. Also town would have questions. I'm am befuddled why both joth and DatSwan think the scum!raerae, town!shraeye theory makes sense.
There was no contraction. I never said, "Don't kill shraeye," I said, "Don't kill anybody unless you have a strong scum read."
What do you think about shraeye now?
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raerae is a good lynch target today because of that contradiction in her attitude towards Shraeye. I can see scum jumping on that. Also town would have questions. I'm am befuddled why both joth and DatSwan think the scum!raerae, town!shraeye theory makes sense.
There was no contraction. I never said, "Don't kill shraeye," I said, "Don't kill anybody unless you have a strong scum read."
You said don't kill a townie.
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DatSwan, any comment on this?
The worst case was a figure of speech as in “you chose to defend Shraeye when the worst case at the time was me (which if you are skum, would still be good for you).”
Your reasoning kinda fails in that if shraeye/you are both town, then the actual worst case for scum!raerae is noone getting shot, which is exactly what she argued for...
Town cred/i told you so logic.
Not my best reason, but that’s where I’m at with it
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sometimes scum can do something that they think they would do as town/they think is townie, but actually it’s not townie or townie-seeming, because people are imperfect at counter factual thinking.
In fact, this is how scum gets caught 90% of the time. These are not hard concepts.
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Here's the reference.
Nope, killing a townie because you just NEED to use your power is selfish and anti-town but you do you, boo.
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Heads up everyone I have a really busy weekend so there might not be any official vote counts until like Monday morning. I will try and do one before bed tonight.
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sometimes scum can do something that they think they would do as town/they think is townie, but actually it’s not townie or townie-seeming, because people are imperfect at counter factual thinking.
In fact, this is how scum gets caught 90% of the time. These are not hard concepts.
You explained why you believe raerae thought it townie-seeming. You did not explain why it isn't.
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I think the average townie reacts like the rest of us did: hey, town has a new weapon we can use. Yeah, we mislynched, but we get a do-over. Let’s put it to the best use we can.
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I think the average townie reacts like the rest of us did: hey, town has a new weapon we can use. Yeah, we mislynched, but we get a do-over. Let’s put it to the best use we can.
Oh. Well I disagree. This was basically a N1 vig shot, and there are plenty of people on this site that have argued against using these in the past.
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raerae is a good lynch target today because of that contradiction in her attitude towards Shraeye. I can see scum jumping on that. Also town would have questions. I'm am befuddled why both joth and DatSwan think the scum!raerae, town!shraeye theory makes sense.
There was no contraction. I never said, "Don't kill shraeye," I said, "Don't kill anybody unless you have a strong scum read."
What do you think about shraeye now?
None of his actions today have completely released him from suspicion.
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Here's the reference.
Nope, killing a townie because you just NEED to use your power is selfish and anti-town but you do you, boo.
But this was the first time I told him not to shoot unless he was sure.
If you don't have any strong scum reads then the townie thing to do is nothing.
That's exactly what happened. He shot town because D1 reads are crap. It doesn't take a genius or a psychic to see how that was going to play out.
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Why the Awaclus vote?
Why not? Are you my scum partner?
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Why the Awaclus vote?
Why not? Are you my scum partner?
Sometimes I get the feeling that Awaclus has a word bank that he has to pull from for his posts.
Honestly, he should be commended on how far he is able to stretch it.
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does it make sense to extend the day since the site went down for a spell?
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Here's the reference.
Nope, killing a townie because you just NEED to use your power is selfish and anti-town but you do you, boo.
But this was the first time I told him not to shoot unless he was sure.
If you don't have any strong scum reads then the townie thing to do is nothing.
That's exactly what happened. He shot town because D1 reads are crap. It doesn't take a genius or a psychic to see how that was going to play out.
I agree with you. The issue is that Shraeye was on the short list and you said not to kill a townie. That strongly implies you see Shraeye as town.
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The day will be extended by 24 hours because of the site outage.
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Here's the reference.
Nope, killing a townie because you just NEED to use your power is selfish and anti-town but you do you, boo.
But this was the first time I told him not to shoot unless he was sure.
If you don't have any strong scum reads then the townie thing to do is nothing.
That's exactly what happened. He shot town because D1 reads are crap. It doesn't take a genius or a psychic to see how that was going to play out.
I agree with you. The issue is that Shraeye was on the short list and you said not to kill a townie. That strongly implies you see Shraeye as town.
So, again, why would I say not to do it if I knew his alignment? No matter what joth is saying scum!raerae isn't an idiot. She's not going to advocate something against her wincon.
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Anybody have anything else to discuss or should we just keep going with this? It really seems to be getting us places. I'd like to hear more from Uncle Eddie, gkrieg, and shraeye, just off the top of my head.
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Why the Awaclus vote?
Why not? Are you my scum partner?
I mean, should we be voting for you? They didn't give a reason but if you'd like to enlighten the crowd, please feel free.
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Nope, killing a townie because you just NEED to use your power is selfish and anti-town but you do you, boo.
a townie? Haven't you been scumreading shraeye like all day?
But he wasn't scum reading shraeye prior to the hammer. If I'm in his shoes I'm venging a previous scumread, not a knee jerk read on the person who hammered me.
Yes I was. Besides I can't kill Swan so...
Because he's your partner?
Just rereading the end of day and I want to flag this from raerae. At this point, does a townie really still think MiX is scum. I mean, I know I made a joke about an epic troll, but for me MiX is basically conf!town by then. So why is raerae making a partner snipe?
People who don’t get the raerae case, just go back and reread. There’s plenty of weirdness that reads fake town.
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Raerae is scum for not engaging until I fought back at her. Raerae is always good at the back and forth, but scum raerae is not good at engaging with nobody responding to her.
Townrae is great at digging up stuff and needling away at threads.
Note how her score keeps going down bit by bit as she continued to not engage
This post is a bit of a problem for me. Maybe shraeye has the guts to try to direct the shot to a townread, maybe he’s relatively confident he’ll fail because MiX expressed a townread on raerae earlier. Or maybe shraeye is scum and raerae is town or vice versa.
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Why the Awaclus vote?
Why not? Are you my scum partner?
Awaclus is Traitor confirmed.
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Nope, killing a townie because you just NEED to use your power is selfish and anti-town but you do you, boo.
a townie? Haven't you been scumreading shraeye like all day?
But he wasn't scum reading shraeye prior to the hammer. If I'm in his shoes I'm venging a previous scumread, not a knee jerk read on the person who hammered me.
Yes I was. Besides I can't kill Swan so...
Because he's your partner?
Just rereading the end of day and I want to flag this from raerae. At this point, does a townie really still think MiX is scum. I mean, I know I made a joke about an epic troll, but for me MiX is basically conf!town by then. So why is raerae making a partner snipe?
People who don’t get the raerae case, just go back and reread. There’s plenty of weirdness that reads fake town.
Yeah that thing it actually big part of the reason I think raerae is town. There's no reason for scum!raerae to do this, in fact it's very dangerous for her to antagonize MiX like that.
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Hmm you and I are reading this very differently. My thinking is that scum already knew MiX was town so realizing that they were supposed to know now would be an extra leap, vs town actually just realizing it, so it seems like a mistake scum is more likely to make (thinking it’s still reasonable to think MiX is scum).
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My thinking is that scum already knew MiX was town so realizing that they were supposed to know now would be an extra leap
Uh... this stuff isn't rocket science.
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My thinking is that scum already knew MiX was town so realizing that they were supposed to know now would be an extra leap
Uh... this stuff isn't rocket science.
I’m in Joth’s camp on the thinking here. I’m not sure why you’re having such a difficult time grasping his concepts. You seem to be under the impression that if something is inherently scummy, scum wouldn’t do it. That’s just backwards.
Further, you seem to be overlooking the key point to Joth’s argument that Rae’s instantaneously flipped read on Shraeye isn’t something town does very often. “Lynch Shrae, lynch Shrae, lynch Shrea... don’t veng Shrae!” It’s just off.
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raerae is a good lynch target today because of that contradiction in her attitude towards Shraeye. I can see scum jumping on that. Also town would have questions. I'm am befuddled why both joth and DatSwan think the scum!raerae, town!shraeye theory makes sense.
There was no contraction. I never said, "Don't kill shraeye," I said, "Don't kill anybody unless you have a strong scum read."
What do you think about shraeye now?
None of his actions today have completely released him from suspicion.
I've done things today?
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raerae is a good lynch target today because of that contradiction in her attitude towards Shraeye. I can see scum jumping on that. Also town would have questions. I'm am befuddled why both joth and DatSwan think the scum!raerae, town!shraeye theory makes sense.
There was no contraction. I never said, "Don't kill shraeye," I said, "Don't kill anybody unless you have a strong scum read."
What do you think about shraeye now?
None of his actions today have completely released him from suspicion.
I've done things today?
Precisely.
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My thinking is that scum already knew MiX was town so realizing that they were supposed to know now would be an extra leap
Uh... this stuff isn't rocket science.
I’m in Joth’s camp on the thinking here. I’m not sure why you’re having such a difficult time grasping his concepts. You seem to be under the impression that if something is inherently scummy, scum wouldn’t do it. That’s just backwards.
Further, you seem to be overlooking the key point to Joth’s argument that Rae’s instantaneously flipped read on Shraeye isn’t something town does very often. “Lynch Shrae, lynch Shrae, lynch Shrea... don’t veng Shrae!” It’s just off.
I never said don't kill shraeye. I said don't kill somebody you don't think is scum. He didn't have a scum read on shraeye prior to the hammer.
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I’m in Joth’s camp on the thinking here. I’m not sure why you’re having such a difficult time grasping his concepts. You seem to be under the impression that if something is inherently scummy, scum wouldn’t do it. That’s just backwards.
From my perspective, nothing has been discussed that would be inherently scummy, so I have no idea what this is getting at.
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I actually feel a bit left out of this whole conversation and also I haven't seen anything scummy from the participating parties, so I am a bit confused here.
Can everyone, like, share their top scumread and why is that so?
I start with shraeye, still haven't got answer to
All fire, no substance. This isn't townrae.
What happened to this read? It sounds pretty sure
and also don't see him at all participating in D2 and after D1 weird hammer.
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I actually feel a bit left out of this whole conversation and also I haven't seen anything scummy from the participating parties, so I am a bit confused here.
Can everyone, like, share their top scumread and why is that so?
I start with shraeye, still haven't got answer to
All fire, no substance. This isn't townrae.
What happened to this read? It sounds pretty sure
and also don't see him at all participating in D2 and after D1 weird hammer.
Are you curious about where my raerae read is at? Or are you making a point that I don't understand?
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I actually feel a bit left out of this whole conversation and also I haven't seen anything scummy from the participating parties, so I am a bit confused here.
Can everyone, like, share their top scumread and why is that so?
I start with shraeye, still haven't got answer to
All fire, no substance. This isn't townrae.
What happened to this read? It sounds pretty sure
and also don't see him at all participating in D2 and after D1 weird hammer.
Are you curious about where my raerae read is at? Or are you making a point that I don't understand?
You always say that you excellently read raerae, then you say she's scum, then you drop it, why?
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I think raerae is town. I think joth is stuck in a tunnel. Shraeye could be anything. Time to move on. How about vote: Lalight.
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Vote: LaLight
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Oh, sure
vote: uncleeurope
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I think scum was content with this whole conversation eating up the big part of the day and as soon as I propose moving on, I get voted
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Uhhh, EFHW recommended we move on, you seemed to be pushing the same people everyone else has been pushing all day.
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I think scum was content with this whole conversation eating up the big part of the day and as soon as I propose moving on, I get voted
That being said, let’s say your claim was true, then what is my plan here as scum?
I vote for the town player who has foiled my nefarious deeds? Just because they tried to move on? See, I would hope that if I wanted to double down on the line of thinking you are pulling away from, instead of voting you with no explaination, I would vote for one of the people already being discussed to convince others that we should lynch there.
Not to vote for the person encouraging us to “move on” which would encourage town to move on.
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That feels to me like it is a really shady way to play the “Vote tag” game.
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Well, none of the supposed mislynches work, so you chose me, also sheeping EFHW vote and with no explanation at all
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Well, none of the supposed mislynches work, so you chose me, also sheeping EFHW vote and with no explanation at all
See, this is a better post.
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Well, none of the supposed mislynches work, so you chose me, also sheeping EFHW vote and with no explanation at all
Why are you only challenging Eddie?
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Well, none of the supposed mislynches work, so you chose me, also sheeping EFHW vote and with no explanation at all
Why are you only challenging Eddie?
I didn't like his post being only the vote without anything else. I actually think you're both scummy for this, but he's just more
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Well, none of the supposed mislynches work, so you chose me, also sheeping EFHW vote and with no explanation at all
Why are you only challenging Eddie?
I didn't like his post being only the vote without anything else. I actually think you're both scummy for this, but he's just more
The post where EFHW votes you doesn't contain any more reasoning, so why are you making a distinction here?
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It feels like people are just being contrary. No one has shown me why I should abandon a real, substantive case on raerae for what seems to be a dart thrown at a dartboard that landed on LaLight.
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It feels like people are just being contrary. No one has shown me why I should abandon a real, substantive case on raerae for what seems to be a dart thrown at a dartboard that landed on LaLight.
But your case on raerae is that she is too towny. And don't you find Lalight's reaction a bit scummy here? I did have reasons for my vote. I chose not to share them yet.
-
Awaclus
+3
jotheonah
+6
DatSwan
+0
faust
+6
UncleEurope
-2
gkrieg
+1
raerae
+1
Galzria
+1
Jimmm
-1
EFHW
-4
LaLight
-6
-
Well, none of the supposed mislynches work, so you chose me, also sheeping EFHW vote and with no explanation at all
Why are you only challenging Eddie?
I didn't like his post being only the vote without anything else. I actually think you're both scummy for this, but he's just more
The post where EFHW votes you doesn't contain any more reasoning, so why are you making a distinction here?
I actually don't know. Feel like her vote was random and this is ok in my book, but Eddie just hopped on a wagon which is more scummy
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It feels like people are just being contrary. No one has shown me why I should abandon a real, substantive case on raerae for what seems to be a dart thrown at a dartboard that landed on LaLight.
But your case on raerae is that she is too towny. And don't you find Lalight's reaction a bit scummy here? I did have reasons for my vote. I chose not to share them yet.
I’m certainly not townreading LaLight. Let me give them a closer look and get back to you.
-
Jesus this has moved no where.
Joth - in regards to the point people are making about rae flipping back and forth on reads so quickly.... do you believe that is something one does more as town or skum?
-
Galz - Who is the skummiest person that was on wagon eod1 in your opinion?
-
Jesus this has moved no where.
Joth - in regards to the point people are making about rae flipping back and forth on reads so quickly.... do you believe that is something one does more as town or skum?
Not sure there’s a one-size-fits-all answer to this. Depends on the player and the nature of the flipping.
-
"Do we really need to do this now?" asked one of the Azorius guards as they walked through the darkened alley. "Seemd like there's bigger things to worry about right now than Rakdos crowd control."
"We got a tip things might get bad," said the other, "And it's not like the Boros will do anything right now."
Suddenly a spotlight shown on all six arresters, and a booming voice sounded from above.
"For tonight's entertainment, six, count 'em six of the traitorous Azorius scum who are helping that evil dragon terrorize our planet will be disemboweled, life, for your amusement! I don't want to ruin the fun with too many details, but lets just say heads will do more than just roll. Yes that's right. Mazrickar the head-juggler is in attendance! But that comes later. For now, let's get these heads off of their bodies!"
The crowd roared, and the arresters prepared for a fight- one that didn't seem like it would end well for them.
Vote Count 2.2
DatSwan (2): Galzria, Awaclus
raerae (2): DatSwan, jothonah
jotheonah (1): faust
Awaclus (1): gkrieg
LaLight (2): EFHW, UncleEurope
UncleEurope (1): LaLight
Not voting (3): shraeye, raerae, Jimmm.
With 12 alive, it takes 6 to lynch. The day will end at 6:30 pm on Thursday, October 24th.
-
Sorry, behind again. I was mid-way through catching up when the site went down. At this stage the case on raerae seems a bit of a stretch to me but I'll try to look into it more tomorrow night.
-
Ok, did a LaLight iso re-read.
- lots of asking questions
- lazy sheep votes on both pubby and MiX wagons
- mildly defensive reaction to the new wagon on him, but not defensive in a way that's ringing major scumbells, especially since it's an annoying hard-to-respond to wagon that would probably tick me off too.
Definitely could be scum. Fits the profile of a lie-lowing scum. Wouldn't hate it as a lynch.
OTOH
- does not look like a partner of either shraeye or raerae, my primary scum reads
- also fits the profile of a low-contributing townie who ends up being an easy mislynch
I'm open to hearing a substantive case on LaLight. I'll definitely move my vote there to get a lynch if need be. I do think we can do better.
-
Ok, did a LaLight iso re-read.
- lots of asking questions
- lazy sheep votes on both pubby and MiX wagons
- mildly defensive reaction to the new wagon on him, but not defensive in a way that's ringing major scumbells, especially since it's an annoying hard-to-respond to wagon that would probably tick me off too.
Definitely could be scum. Fits the profile of a lie-lowing scum. Wouldn't hate it as a lynch.
OTOH
- does not look like a partner of either shraeye or raerae, my primary scum reads
- also fits the profile of a low-contributing townie who ends up being an easy mislynch
I'm open to hearing a substantive case on LaLight. I'll definitely move my vote there to get a lynch if need be. I do think we can do better.
I don't have a strong case -- in fact I feel like it's still Day 1. But this post struck me as someone who doesn't feel part of town. I also didn't like his asking for everyone's top scumreads when he isn't scumhunting. And he said he wanted to move on from the current debate but then goes right back into it. He said the people involved seem towny. But then is he saying Shraeye is his top scumread? That feels like a superficial attempt to seem like he's scumhunting. joth could be right that it is more underparticipation than deception, but why underparticipate?
I actually feel a bit left out of this whole conversation and also I haven't seen anything scummy from the participating parties, so I am a bit confused here.
Can everyone, like, share their top scumread and why is that so?
I start with shraeye, still haven't got answer to
All fire, no substance. This isn't townrae.
What happened to this read? It sounds pretty sure
and also don't see him at all participating in D2 and after D1 weird hammer.
I think it is too early to be scum-hunting based on who else seems scummy. "He doesn't look like partners with Shraeye or raerae" is pretty flimsy.
Regarding his reaction to the wagon, why did he only complain about Eddie? It seems like he wants to avoid having a conflict with me.
-
@gkrieg -
Day 1 you voted 3 times, for Lalight, Shraeye and pubby. Each time the next vote placed was pubby voting for the same person as you. Do you know what that was about?
-
Another question for gkrieg - How did you decide to stay off the MiX wagon?
-
Post# Voter Wagon
74 gkrieg Lalight
75 pubby Lalight
111 gkrieg Shraeye
112 pubby Shraeye
120 gkrieg pubby
123 pubby pubby
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Ok, there's a bit of misunderstanding or misrepresentation.
And he said he wanted to move on from the current debate but then goes right back into it.
I did not move to the current debate. By current debate I meant all the hammer stuff and was it scummy or was it not or was it scummy if you say it's scummy, or is it not scummy if you say it's scummy, are you scummy for calling it scummy and so on and so on. Me asking shraeye about his read on raerae is a completely different debate.
He said the people involved seem towny. But then is he saying Shraeye is his top scumread?
Shraeye was not involved into debate above. I mean it is about him, but I was mostly talking about faust and joth, because I feel like they're the only two debating this.
Regarding his reaction to the wagon, why did he only complain about Eddie? It seems like he wants to avoid having a conflict with me.
What is the point of avoiding conflict with one player while scrutinizing another? Can you describe why would that be the case? We both know we are not scum partners, so what gives?
As I explained earlier your vote seemed random to me, while Eddie's was "hey we can make a wagon out of this" which felt scummy to me.
-
Does anybody have more knowledge or familiarity with the Nemesis role than I do? I don't understand why Pubby wouldn't have voted for gkrieg if there was some benefit to their counterpart dying.
-
Awaclus
+3
jotheonah
+6
DatSwan
+0
faust
+6
UncleEurope
-2
gkrieg
+1
raerae
+1
Galzria
+1
Jimmm
-1
EFHW
-4
LaLight
-6
I know you're kind of a fan of numbers but, seriously, any actual content would be nice.
-
Does anybody have more knowledge or familiarity with the Nemesis role than I do? I don't understand why Pubby wouldn't have voted for gkrieg if there was some benefit to their counterpart dying.
other side question to go along with this...
GK - why did you claim it out right away?
-
Alright people, we are 3 days out from deadline, going nowhere fast, and pretty far from a lynch. If you've been sitting here quietly, here are some ways you can participate:
1) Weigh in on the raerae case
2) Weigh in on the LaLight case
3) Weigh in on the ... wait, is there a real case on DatSwan?
4) Make a new case
5) Re-read day one or a part of day one and look for something interesting
-
Does anybody have more knowledge or familiarity with the Nemesis role than I do? I don't understand why Pubby wouldn't have voted for gkrieg if there was some benefit to their counterpart dying.
It is not a standard role, so this is anyone's guess. Either pubby just did weird stuff (it happened before) or gkrieg is hiding something. Maybe pubby just wanted to make sure he wouldn't get lynched. That worked pretty effectively.
-
I've decided that I would rather lynch off-wagon today. So I guess vote: DatSwan, this is a good deal of PoE.
-
I've decided that I would rather lynch off-wagon today. So I guess vote: DatSwan, this is a good deal of PoE.
How’s about EFHW instead? I stumbled on a case there while doing a re read. I’ll type it up shortly.
-
Vote: Jimmmmmmmmmmmmmmmmmmmmmmmmmmmmmmmmmmmmmm
-
I'll pre-sheep DatSwan
Vote: EFHW
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I've decided that I would rather lynch off-wagon today. So I guess vote: DatSwan, this is a good deal of PoE.
How’s about EFHW instead? I stumbled on a case there while doing a re read. I’ll type it up shortly.
I liked her recent input, but feel free to convince me otherwise.
-
Vote: Jimmmmmmmmmmmmmmmmmmmmmmmmmmmmmmmmmmmmmm
Just for fun or you got some deets behind that?
-
Eh, read his posts.
Posting that you will post later gets old after awhile.
-
Some thoughts on raerae. Apologies if I rehash things that have been addressed already.
I AM A VENGEFUL TOWNY.
WHO SHOULD I KILL.
WHY SHOULDN'T IT BE SHRAEYE
HELP ME YOU BASTARDS
If you don't have any strong scum reads then the townie thing to do is nothing.
If I understand correctly, the crux of the argument against raerae is that this post was trying to prevent MiX from killing a partner of hers. A few points at this stage:
- This seems to be a reasonable point presented in the face of some amount of chaos.
- I don't see that there's a lot of effort taken here to control or manipulate MiX. It seems more likely that she was giving an option that maybe MiX hadn't considered.
- I don't know MiX super well, but I don't imagine he is someone who is likely to do as he's told in a situation like this. I think raerae knows this and was not really expecting her advice to be followed.
...
Nah that's worthless. Ok Ok Ok I need to THINK.
Nope, killing a townie because you just NEED to use your power is selfish and anti-town but you do you, boo.
I think something was made of the fact that raerae used the word "townie" in this post. I don't think this is anything more than her explaining why her suggestion which was thoroughly dismissed might be worth considering, ie "You might hit Town, and that would be bad".
Regarding the quickhammer thing: I don't think scum were given "permission" to quickhammer, and I really doubt that seeing "scum don't quickhammer on Day 1" is likely to change their behaviour in that regard. I'm not sure I'd even call it a quickhammer (I mean it was a quick hammer by shraeye, but not a "quickhammer" as I would use the word). Unless we have some reason to believe scum have Daychat, it can't have been coordinated - raerae had no reason to believe shraeye was about to hammer even if they are both scum. I think they should receive the normal amount of scrutiny for how it went down (which is not none).
raerae: Why did you think your vote made it L-2? Did you check? Did you consider unvoting when you realised it was L-1? Were you happy for the Day to be ended at that point?
shraeye: Why the hammer? Why not give MiX a chance to claim? Would you have done so given what you now know (particularly regarding the vengekill)?
-
shraeye: Why the hammer? Why not give MiX a chance to claim?
I cut the day short because a) intense scumread, b) I'm always frustrated at the "vote to L1, claim/softclaim, everybody unvote, queue up the next L1 meta" c) I hate end-of-day scrambles.
-
But that last question jimmm asked is new and exciting.
I'll make a deal. If you summarize what you think about raerae overall, I'll answer that neato question.
-
@jimmmmmmmm, I didn't check, I vaguely remembered it being at L-2 once but thought somebody had unvoted after that. shraeye's hammer was what told me it was actually L-1 but I probably wouldn't have done much different other than announced intent to put him at L-1 if I had realized.
-
@jimmmmmmmm, I didn't check, I vaguely remembered it being at L-2 once but thought somebody had unvoted after that. shraeye's hammer was what told me it was actually L-1 but I probably wouldn't have done much different other than announced intent to put him at L-1 if I had realized.
Oh really cause I could have sworn it was this guy:
Vote: MiX
I think that's L-2?
If joth counted correctly then it's L-1.
-
@jimmmmmmmm, I didn't check, I vaguely remembered it being at L-2 once but thought somebody had unvoted after that. shraeye's hammer was what told me it was actually L-1 but I probably wouldn't have done much different other than announced intent to put him at L-1 if I had realized.
Oh really cause I could have sworn it was this guy:
Vote: MiX
I think that's L-2?
If joth counted correctly then it's L-1.
Cool, then it was you, sorry I didn't remember that and give you credit.
-
It's kind of relevant because you saw that before shraeye hammered and decided not to unvote.
-
It's kind of relevant because you saw that before shraeye hammered and decided not to unvote.
I'm still fine with it. I put my vote down that close to the end because I felt he was scum. Had he had time to claim vig I probably still wouldn't have unvoted because I wouldn't have believed him. He lied as town, had time to explain his actions, and chose not to. I'm fine with that vote.
-
It's kind of relevant because you saw that before shraeye hammered and decided not to unvote.
I'm still fine with it. I put my vote down that close to the end because I felt he was scum. Had he had time to claim vig I probably still wouldn't have unvoted because I wouldn't have believed him. He lied as town, had time to explain his actions, and chose not to. I'm fine with that vote.
He lied?
-
It's kind of relevant because you saw that before shraeye hammered and decided not to unvote.
I'm still fine with it. I put my vote down that close to the end because I felt he was scum. Had he had time to claim vig I probably still wouldn't have unvoted because I wouldn't have believed him. He lied as town, had time to explain his actions, and chose not to. I'm fine with that vote.
He lied?
Dude said he was lunch proof. Given that this is RMM it isn't out of the realm of possibility. I questioned him and he didn't respond. He said it was hyperbole after the hammer. Not a great time to clarify.
-
It's kind of relevant because you saw that before shraeye hammered and decided not to unvote.
I'm still fine with it. I put my vote down that close to the end because I felt he was scum. Had he had time to claim vig I probably still wouldn't have unvoted because I wouldn't have believed him. He lied as town, had time to explain his actions, and chose not to. I'm fine with that vote.
He lied?
Dude said he was lunch proof. Given that this is RMM it isn't out of the realm of possibility. I questioned him and he didn't respond. He said it was hyperbole after the hammer. Not a great time to clarify.
Oh, I see. I took that as boasting about all the times he was almost lynched.
-
Ok, seeing no traction for a raerae lynch, I'm going to try vote: shraeye
-
I like this. vote: shraeye
-
I like this. vote: shraeye
Careful, now. You don’t want to go around starting wagons without explaination.
-
I like this. vote: shraeye
Why?
-
Vote: LaLight
-
"C'mon old sport," said Tibalt, munching on popcorn in the front of the crowd. "This must be cheering you up at least a little. I mean head jugglers!"
"Too much spectacle," said Ob Nixilis. "Also, the ending was just too telegraphed. That's just not good theater."
One of the heads flew into the audience and a goblin jumped up to catch it. Ob Nixilis reached out, grabbed the goblin, ripped his head off and absorbed his soul.
"Excellent," said Tibalt. "A 'twist' ending!"
"Ending?" said Ob Nixilis, standing up. "I'm just getting started."
Vote Count 2.3
DatSwan (2): Galzria, faust
raerae (1): DatSwan
Awaclus (1): gkrieg
LaLight (2): EFHW, Awaclus
Jimmmmmmm (1): UncleEurope
EFHW (1): shraeye
shraeye (2): jotheonah, LaLight
Not voting (2): raerae, Jimmmmmmmmm.
With 12 alive, it takes 6 to lynch. The day will end at 6:30 pm on Thursday, October 24th.
-
Request prod on gkrieg. It's been 4 days.
-
I like this. vote: shraeye
Why?
I don't feel like he's town. I think Eddie is scum, but for the life of me can't put this feeling into words and no one really cares about voting him. I would vote for you and shraeye as well
-
Request prod on gkrieg. It's been 4 days.
Prod sent. I do have one replacement lined up if he doesn't get back to me.
-
I like this. vote: shraeye
Why?
I don't feel like he's town. I think Eddie is scum, but for the life of me can't put this feeling into words and no one really cares about voting him. I would vote for you and shraeye as well
Why do you feel he's scum? And if you've got something on Eddie let's hear it. People do tend to not be super interested in RVS D2 so putting something into words might be beneficial if you actually want to get that lunch through.
-
Sorry all, was sick yesterday and don't have much availability over the weekends. Going to go and respond to people now.
-
Pubby and I were nemeses. I could not win with him alive, but when he died I become aligned with town. My guess is that it was the same for him.
Was he named in your pm?
Yes
So presumably you were also named in his but he never voted for you. And he claimed he got night actions depending on how he voted but you got assigned to town once he was out of the way. Do I have to facts right?
Why the Awaclus vote?
That is my guess. I would think he probably had the same role as mine. I don't think he got night actions depending on how he voted, but I guess it is possible.
I think Awaclus is scum here. He is acting like his scum meta. He is being more helpful and posting more than normal, until I pointed it out, where he stopped doing those things.
-
@gkrieg -
Day 1 you voted 3 times, for Lalight, Shraeye and pubby. Each time the next vote placed was pubby voting for the same person as you. Do you know what that was about?
I have no idea.
-
Another question for gkrieg - How did you decide to stay off the MiX wagon?
I did not think MiX was scum. I was also not around when it got big. I've only been checking this game on my computer at work, so I haven't been posting in the evenings.
-
Does anybody have more knowledge or familiarity with the Nemesis role than I do? I don't understand why Pubby wouldn't have voted for gkrieg if there was some benefit to their counterpart dying.
I think to some extent, you don't want to completely tunnel the person you are trying to lynch, as that tends to not get them lynched and tends to not get them killed. Scum and town like to leave people alive that are at each others throats until late in the game.
-
Does anybody have more knowledge or familiarity with the Nemesis role than I do? I don't understand why Pubby wouldn't have voted for gkrieg if there was some benefit to their counterpart dying.
other side question to go along with this...
GK - why did you claim it out right away?
Claimed right away because I don't think there was a reason to leave it unclaimed.
-
I think raerae could definitely have told Mix what she did at the end of the day as either alignment. Her arguments today lead me to believe she is town.
-
EFHW also seems town to me because she hasn't done what she does as scum.
Not sure on faust, who I can also usually read based off meta.
Awaclus seems scum here, all based on meta.
-
I wonder if Lalight could be another Nemesis. His votes actually correspond with gkrieg's and pubby's, though not quite as closely as theirs do with each other. Empty lines mean I deleted votes by other people.
Post# Voter Wagon
65 Lalight gkrieg
74 gkrieg Lalight
75 pubby Lalight
106 Lalight raerae
111 gkrieg Shraeye
112 pubby Shraeye
116 Lalight pubby
120 gkrieg pubby
123 pubby pubby
249 Lalight MiX
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I think Awaclus is scum here. He is acting like his scum meta. He is being more helpful and posting more than normal, until I pointed it out, where he stopped doing those things.
You pointing it out 1) was not a true statement 2) had nothing to do with anything. My posting activity dropped after MiX got lynched.
-
I wonder if Lalight could be another Nemesis. His votes actually correspond with gkrieg's and pubby's, though not quite as closely as theirs do with each other. Empty lines mean I deleted votes by other people.
From what I've understood, that wouldn't make flavor sense (people who actually know flavor might want to chime in).
-
I wonder if Lalight could be another Nemesis. His votes actually correspond with gkrieg's and pubby's, though not quite as closely as theirs do with each other. Empty lines mean I deleted votes by other people.
From what I've understood, that wouldn't make flavor sense (people who actually know flavor might want to chime in).
There could be any number of Nemisis (depending on how deep into the story line we go). Somewhat doubtful on there being a factor of 3 "not mafia" skum though.
-
I went to go make my case on EFHW and it fell apart unfortunately.
It was pretty much based on a conf!bias post at the end of day 1 and in the end I just couldn't find anything more to build off of it.
Not saying hard town read, just I have nothing to push her as skum for.
-
Vote: Jimmm
-
Vote: Jimmm
What are your thoughts on the LL wagon?
-
I went to go make my case on EFHW and it fell apart unfortunately.
It was pretty much based on a conf!bias post at the end of day 1 and in the end I just couldn't find anything more to build off of it.
Not saying hard town read, just I have nothing to push her as skum for.
Great case, I'm keeping my vote
-
There could be any number of Nemisis (depending on how deep into the story line we go). Somewhat doubtful on there being a factor of 3 "not mafia" skum though.
Nem-ISIS sounds like a terrifying team to go up against.
-
I went to go make my case on EFHW and it fell apart unfortunately.
It was pretty much based on a conf!bias post at the end of day 1 and in the end I just couldn't find anything more to build off of it.
Not saying hard town read, just I have nothing to push her as skum for.
Great case, I'm keeping my vote
I openly admitted lack of a case. What's your case?
-
Vote: Jimmm
What are your thoughts on the LL wagon?
I pretty much am leaning right now AGAINST voting for anyone that has been participating in today's discussions. I am getting that "skum is sitting back" vibe.
Which is also a larger part of why I am ok with Jimm.
-
But that last question jimmm asked is new and exciting.
I'll make a deal. If you summarize what you think about raerae overall, I'll answer that neato question.
She's spent a lot of her posts arguing with a wide variety of people, which makes me think that she's raerae.
She seems genuine enough. Lean Town.
-
Vote: Jimmm
What are your thoughts on the LL wagon?
I pretty much am leaning right now AGAINST voting for anyone that has been participating in today's discussions. I am getting that "skum is sitting back" vibe.
Which is also a larger part of why I am ok with Jimm.
Scum ended D1 in a pretty strong position, why do you think they wouldn't want to control the pace and conversation of D2?
-
Vote: Jimmm
What are your thoughts on the LL wagon?
I pretty much am leaning right now AGAINST voting for anyone that has been participating in today's discussions. I am getting that "skum is sitting back" vibe.
Which is also a larger part of why I am ok with Jimm.
Scum ended D1 in a pretty strong position, why do you think they wouldn't want to control the pace and conversation of D2?
Same point different conclusions - I do think they are controlling the pace... as in keeping it slow moving and letting us talk in circles.
-
I see how it seems unlikely that there are 3 third party players, but am I the only one who finds that vote pattern really striking? I think if they have the ability to become town then it could make sense balance-wise. I don't think we should discount evidence in front of us because of speculation about what the mod would or wouldn't do.
-
For ease of reference:
I wonder if Lalight could be another Nemesis. His votes actually correspond with gkrieg's and pubby's, though not quite as closely as theirs do with each other. Empty lines mean I deleted votes by other people.
Post# Voter Wagon
65 Lalight gkrieg
74 gkrieg Lalight
75 pubby Lalight
106 Lalight raerae
111 gkrieg Shraeye
112 pubby Shraeye
116 Lalight pubby
120 gkrieg pubby
123 pubby pubby
249 Lalight MiX
-
I know this makes LL a lower priority target, since he wouldn't be full scum, but pubby must have had some anti-town function, or there wouldn't be a point to his faction, right?
-
Vote: Jimmm
What are your thoughts on the LL wagon?
I pretty much am leaning right now AGAINST voting for anyone that has been participating in today's discussions. I am getting that "skum is sitting back" vibe.
Which is also a larger part of why I am ok with Jimm.
Scum ended D1 in a pretty strong position, why do you think they wouldn't want to control the pace and conversation of D2?
Same point different conclusions - I do think they are controlling the pace... as in keeping it slow moving and letting us talk in circles.
I think they would have come out strong and pushed a target. That makes you or joth tops on my list but that feels very biased since I was the target.
-
I know this makes LL a lower priority target, since he wouldn't be full scum, but pubby must have had some anti-town function, or there wouldn't be a point to his faction, right?
I'm having a real difficult time following this love of thinking. Can you dumb it way down? Sorry to ask but I just don't get it.
-
I know this makes LL a lower priority target, since he wouldn't be full scum, but pubby must have had some anti-town function, or there wouldn't be a point to his faction, right?
I'm having a real difficult time following this love of thinking. Can you dumb it way down? Sorry to ask but I just don't get it.
*Line, not love
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I am 100% sure that there are two and only two nemeses, Sorin and Nahiri.
Check out this card from the set that this is based on: https://gatherer.wizards.com/Pages/Card/Details.aspx?name=single%20combat
Basically, Sorin and Nahiri's feud was a thing in the block. Other third parties could exist -- I can think of other characters who weren't really on either side in the war -- but as far as pubby's exact role, it's gotta be just the two of them.
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I see how it seems unlikely that there are 3 third party players, but am I the only one who finds that vote pattern really striking? I think if they have the ability to become town then it could make sense balance-wise. I don't think we should discount evidence in front of us because of speculation about what the mod would or wouldn't do.
I see pubby/gkrieg and those line up. I see absolutely no correlations if you throw LaLight in the mix.
-
Yeah I'd still have hammered MiX if he had said "vengeful town" right before my vote was cast. I was pretty darn sure of his scumminess.
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I like this. vote: shraeye
Why?
I don't feel like he's town. I think Eddie is scum, but for the life of me can't put this feeling into words and no one really cares about voting him. I would vote for you and shraeye as well
Why do you feel he's scum? And if you've got something on Eddie let's hear it. People do tend to not be super interested in RVS D2 so putting something into words might be beneficial if you actually want to get that lunch through.
Actually sorry for being absent, I am swamped with work, I am an accountant now, who knew it would be this time consuming.
I don't have much to talk about Eddie, he feels very inactive and under the radar, Eddie that I remember is active (though fluffy a lot). This time it feels like he stays fluffy, but not so active. I also really feel scum vibes from that jump on my wagon, I can't really explain this. In my head this action is 100% scum would do.
I also continue to think that shraeye is scum because even if people tell me it's his meta to be careless, he seems trying to play his meta, not just playing it.
The hammer, these posts:
I'll pre-sheep DatSwan
Vote: EFHW
But that last question jimmm asked is new and exciting.
I'll make a deal. If you summarize what you think about raerae overall, I'll answer that neato question.
It's like "see, people, I am town!shraeye, I play like town!shraeye, you see? See?"
I don't feel it genuine.
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It seems this needs a little push.
Vote: Jimmmmm
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Double push
Vote: jimmmmm
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Any actual case behind that, guys?
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Any actual case behind that, guys?
Yes. Do you have a reason to keep Jimmmmm alive?
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He's bad.
Do you have a case on someone?
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Any actual case behind that, guys?
Yes. Do you have a reason to keep Jimmmmm alive?
I looked back and didn't see anything. DatSwan's cool with it so that makes me less excited to blindly follow.
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What's the problem with DatSwan?
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I know this makes LL a lower priority target, since he wouldn't be full scum, but pubby must have had some anti-town function, or there wouldn't be a point to his faction, right?
I'm having a real difficult time following this love of thinking. Can you dumb it way down? Sorry to ask but I just don't get it.
They vote in the order ll, gk, pubby three times thru followed by another ll.
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Any actual case behind that, guys?
Yes. Do you have a reason to keep Jimmmmm alive?
I found his review of raerae pretty towny.
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Reread shraeye. I continue to find MiX scummy even after his flip, so hammering him I think is null.
However I'm not convinced by shraeye's read on raerae. This seems to be his main case on her:
Raerae is scum for not engaging until I fought back at her. Raerae is always good at the back and forth, but scum raerae is not good at engaging with nobody responding to her.
Townrae is great at digging up stuff and needling away at threads.
Note how her score keeps going down bit by bit as she continued to not engage
The first sentence makes little sense to me. How can you have a "back and forth" if nobody's responding? Seems like a handwavy case that people might just accept because of course shraeye knows how raerae plays.
shraeye is correct that his raerae scores have strictly decreased up until this point. I'm getting a premeditated vibe from this, as if the whole point of the point system was to reduce raerae's score over time and then make this meta argument. Let's follow these scores and see how much sense they make.
Vote: shraeye
I'm not wrong. Join me, friends.
raerae
+2
raerae gets an initial score of +2 for an RVS/meme vote. Seems like an easy 2 points, but sure.
@faust, thoughts and feelings on MiX claiming the sun thing?
@shraeye, do you think everybody should flavor name claim or just you cuz you're a special flower?
@faust, thoughts and feelings on MiX claiming the sun thing?
I don't think revealing how I feel about this is beneficial at this point.
Ahhhhh, so cryptic, I loave it. Do you believe it's harmful? Or are you just being sly?
In either of those cases, why would I answer this question?
Because you were complaining nobody was around last night and we're both here now so I thought I'd try to make some conversation. I will absolutely avoid asking you questions you don't want to answer in the future.
I don't mean to be difficult. Just keep in mind that if I expressed that I am unwilling to discuss a certain subject, then prodding me further in that direction is unlikely to yield results.
We can absolutely converse though. For instance, is your vote still RVS? Have you developed any reads so far?
Mostly RVS with a healthy dose of 'shraeye is always scum' mindset mixed in. No reads so far. I'm interested in what people think about shraeye's flavor name claim (honestly I just like saying that) but the lack of reaction to it is interesting too.
How about you? I feel like faust doesn't RVS so why am I scum? Where's everybody else rank on the bad guy list?
How about you? I feel like faust doesn't RVS so why am I scum?
I know this one: It's because you got a PM saying that!
Also opening with the dead "shraeye is always scum" meme is boring, predictable and exactly what scum!raerae would do. And you addressed a question to me; the towny reason to ask people random questions is to get them to engage, and really I am the last person you need to draw into the game, so I can only suspect there's an ulterior motive behind that.
Where's everybody else rank on the bad guy list?
Below you. I don't think my other reads are at the level where sharing them is useful right now.
It's also exactly what town!raerae would do as evidenced by every other game I've played except the one where he was mod-confirmed town to me. So I'm just going to call that a crappy argument. As far as addressing you, I did it because I thought you'd have something to say and we're close enough to the same time zone for once so why not take advantage of that? But let's play for a minute, what is my sneaky evil motive for asking you questions? Am I just supposed to ignore you some you don't need to be prompted to join the game? That's also silly.
raerae
+0
So two questions and this exchange with faust has removed raerae's points. If anyone's not engaging here it's faust for not answering raerae's questions (which is probably reasonable). But there is back and forth, resulting in raerae labelling faust's argument as "crappy". Seems like she's engaging just fine.
Why would scum quickhammer themselves?
Is MiX still the easy D1 lunch?
raerae
-2
I fail to see what raerae is not engaging with that is costing her points. She was voted for by LL for voting shraeye every game, but I'm not sure that's really worth responding to.
Hey, raerae, do you have anything to offer besides RVS votes?
Naw, still cool with it considering he hasn't said anything other than arbitrary numbers and a half-promise about a flavor name claim. I could move to MiX probably but I'm fine where I am for now.
I suppose this is the post that the "not engaging" is responding to? I don't know, not offering a strong case is different than refusing to engage.
"want to say my flavor name"
...
Majority of scum clearly in the nonresponse group (which includes MiX). Not just because that side has more people.
Definitely not clear. Care to expand on why that's so obvious? Seems like you got some insider info, friend.
The "insider info" comment (ie "you must be scum to know this") is neither here nor there, but otherwise this seems to be a sensible question. Scum have fake flavour names, so as far as I know no one should have any preferences regarding flavour name claims (apart from it being a waste of time and space).
All fire, no substance. This isn't townrae.
raerae
-9
So these two posts earned raerae an extra -7. There's not a heck of a lot of fire, and having little substance is fairly standard for Day 1.
All fire, no substance. This isn't townrae.
So just not answering questions then? Super cool.
I'm staying here and nominate shraeye as the alternate wagon.
The first question (re flavor names) was legitimate, but not one I'm answering.
The second one (#218, "explain what's so clear, looks like you have insider info") was provacative and meaningless.
Disagree, you looked at two groups of people and said there was very clearly more scum in one than another. That isn't clear to me. Why would you think scum wouldn't engage? Help me understand your thought process otherwise it just looks like you're throwing shade for fun with nothing behind it. Was I sassier than necessary? Yes. Does that invalidate my question? No.
raerae asking a "provocative and meaningless" question is not particularly unusual. I'm fairly sure it's not worth the conclusion "This isn't townrae".
So at this point this whole thing from shraeye seems like a planned attempt to build a case against raerae. I don't agree with his reasons for reducing her points over time or for the big jump down to -9. I think he presented a confusing case that is easy for people to just accept because he knows her so well.
But then his long built-up scumread on raerae just disappears.
I start with shraeye, still haven't got answer to
All fire, no substance. This isn't townrae.
What happened to this read? It sounds pretty sure
and also don't see him at all participating in D2 and after D1 weird hammer.
Are you curious about where my raerae read is at? Or are you making a point that I don't understand?
raerae
+1
shreaye is clearly aware that his "raerae read" is significant, but seems hesitant to comment on it, and instead of answering a clear question about it (asked twice), he simply gives his list, in which raerae suddenly has +1.
So, shraeye, what happened? Who exactly was raerae not engaging with, and what changed her from your biggest scum read to a slight Town read? Or was the whole thing faked from the start?
(sorry for the wall of text)
Vote: shraeye
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I stand by my Swan vote & encourage those who wish to lynch scum to vote there.
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Sorry Jimmm, but I'm not going to give you the response that your work deserves.
I don't understand how your initial anaylsis misunderstands " not engaging". You're pulling quotes by raerae and guessing which one I'm referring to by "not engaging"??? I was referring to the ones that aren't there. Your take on that just reads scummy scummy.
True that my scumread on raerae has decreased, but Im not explaining why
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I don't understand how your initial anaylsis misunderstands " not engaging". You're pulling quotes by raerae and guessing which one I'm referring to by "not engaging"??? I was referring to the ones that aren't there.
Which ones?
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Jimmmmm: Why do you think scum!shraeye would hatch a scheme to scumread raerae at the start of the game? What does scum gain from that?
-
"I guess I just don't understand why you couldn't test this in a lab," said the Centaur. It was a strange little squad that had assembled- Centaurs and wolfrider from the conclave surrounding a small group of goggle-wearing goblins carrying various instruments, and one tall, silver-haired human in the middle holding a very large... well, something.
"You want to try trapping some of those interplanar monsters in such a way that they can be used as guinea pigs, be my guest," said Ral Zarek. "This way it better. Here is good. We're going to get set-up, while you lure them here."
"And what if your weapon doesn't work?" asked the centaur.
"Oh, it'll work," said Ral. "But if it doesn't, you all are the ones who can run fast. Actually, you'll probably want to do that either way. The blast radius on this puppy is..."
Ral just whistled.
Vote Count 2.4
DatSwan (1): Galzria
Awaclus (1): gkrieg
LaLight (2): EFHW, Awaclus
Jimmmmmmm (4): UncleEurope, DatSwan, faust, shraeye
shraeye (3): jotheonah, LaLight, Jimmmmmmmm
Not voting (1): raerae
With 12 alive, it takes 6 to lynch. The day will end at 6:30 pm on Thursday, October 24th. That's in less than 12 hours.
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I stand by my Swan vote & encourage those who wish to lynch scum to vote there.
Do you have particular insight based on your irl knowledge of him?
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Jimmmm voters, if Jimmmm is town, what does that get us? LaLight voters, same question.
I think shraeye is a better wagon because he has a much richer set of interactions. We learn so much from his lynch either way. I also happen to think he's more likely to flip scum, but that's neither here nor there.
Galzria, all due respect, either make a real case on DatSwan or move your vote somewhere useful. Same goes for gkreig re: Awaclus. We're 9 hours from deadline, time to pick a real wagon.
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Jimmmmm: Why do you think scum!shraeye would hatch a scheme to scumread raerae at the start of the game? What does scum gain from that?
Why does scum anyone plan to scumread anyone? To appear to be scumhunting, to try to control the lynch, etc. I think he's been a bit less active than usual; it's possible he felt he could use his point system to come up with a reasonable case that would take less effort than normal. Obviously I can only speculate as to the why. The point is the regular reductions on raerae's points seem convenient and unwarranted.
And his refusal to give any reason for his change of heart doesn't help things at all.
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Vote: DatSwan
I still think scum would have come in strong and pushed a case today. That means joth or DatSwan.
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Jimmmm voters, if Jimmmm is town, what does that get us? LaLight voters, same question.
It increases the average activity in the game. Also, we get a wagon to analyze.
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Vote: DatSwan
I still think scum would have come in strong and pushed a case today. That means joth or DatSwan.
Even with this, there would be scum who didn't push a case, so why do you focus on those who did?
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I trust Shraeye at the moment.
At least I trust him more than a bucket of people.
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Vote: DatSwan
I still think scum would have come in strong and pushed a case today. That means joth or DatSwan.
Even with this, there would be scum who didn't push a case, so why do you focus on those who did?
Six of one, half dozen of another. I'm focusing on one group either way and I'd rather look at the ones I know more about. Focusing on the less active ones feels like more of a shot in the dark.
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Rereading Swan, without knowing or remembering why others are voting for him. Nothing of note from Day 1.
DatSwan joins joth's argument against raerae. If I understand correctly, the case boils down to 1) raerae put MiX on L-1, claiming it was L-2 and 2) raerae "DEFENDS" shraeye against a MiX vengekill.
I think claiming that she defended him is a stretch. MiX was seemingly emotional and about to make a kneejerk reaction. I also think there's a big difference between wanting to advocate someone's lynch and wanting them to be the second kill of a Day with no extra information, moreso in an RMM.
He also states "There is of course also the narrative where they both could be skum I suppose, but as people have already touched on it, I am not gonna get into it." I'm pretty sure the raerae scum narrative had been touched on as well, so why the need to mention shraeye without commenting?
Nothing else really jumps out at me from Swan. Seems like an okay lynch, and his "I suppose shraeye could be scum" makes him seem a reasonable candidate for a partner of shraeye's.
I quickly looked over the votes for Swan and reread Galz (who I'm a tad suspicious of, but that's work for another day) to find out why he's been voted for, and found very little. Those voting for him - why?
I'm off to bed now. I'll be on for an hour or so before deadline.
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I stand by my Swan vote & encourage those who wish to lynch scum to vote there.
Do you have particular insight based on your irl knowledge of him?
In real life reason? No. In game reason? Yes.
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I stand by my Swan vote & encourage those who wish to lynch scum to vote there.
Do you have particular insight based on your irl knowledge of him?
In real life reason? No. In game reason? Yes.
your in this game?
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Jimmmm voters, if Jimmmm is town, what does that get us? LaLight voters, same question.
I think shraeye is a better wagon because he has a much richer set of interactions. We learn so much from his lynch either way. I also happen to think he's more likely to flip scum, but that's neither here nor there.
Galzria, all due respect, either make a real case on DatSwan or move your vote somewhere useful. Same goes for gkreig re: Awaclus. We're 9 hours from deadline, time to pick a real wagon.
If we lynch shraeye and shraeye flips town, what does it get us?
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I will be around (on mobile mostly) up until deadline.
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I stand by my Swan vote & encourage those who wish to lynch scum to vote there.
Do you have particular insight based on your irl knowledge of him?
In real life reason? No. In game reason? Yes.
your in this game?
Yes, and I know you’re not aligned with the Gatewatch.
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Rereading Swan, without knowing or remembering why others are voting for him. Nothing of note from Day 1.
DatSwan joins joth's argument against raerae. If I understand correctly, the case boils down to 1) raerae put MiX on L-1, claiming it was L-2 and 2) raerae "DEFENDS" shraeye against a MiX vengekill.
I think claiming that she defended him is a stretch. MiX was seemingly emotional and about to make a kneejerk reaction. I also think there's a big difference between wanting to advocate someone's lynch and wanting them to be the second kill of a Day with no extra information, moreso in an RMM.
He also states "There is of course also the narrative where they both could be skum I suppose, but as people have already touched on it, I am not gonna get into it." I'm pretty sure the raerae scum narrative had been touched on as well, so why the need to mention shraeye without commenting?
Nothing else really jumps out at me from Swan. Seems like an okay lynch, and his "I suppose shraeye could be scum" makes him seem a reasonable candidate for a partner of shraeye's.
I quickly looked over the votes for Swan and reread Galz (who I'm a tad suspicious of, but that's work for another day) to find out why he's been voted for, and found very little. Those voting for him - why?
I'm off to bed now. I'll be on for an hour or so before deadline.
just mentioned shraeye in regards to Rae!Shraeye being a possibility. However, as it was the beginning of Day 2, I did not want to present a case that was based on 2 exact players being skum buddies... I thought the other points I had to make held more merit and deserved more focus.
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I stand by my Swan vote & encourage those who wish to lynch scum to vote there.
Do you have particular insight based on your irl knowledge of him?
In real life reason? No. In game reason? Yes.
your in this game?
Yes, and I know you’re not aligned with the Gatewatch.
correct.
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I stand by my Swan vote & encourage those who wish to lynch scum to vote there.
Do you have particular insight based on your irl knowledge of him?
In real life reason? No. In game reason? Yes.
your in this game?
Yes, and I know you’re not aligned with the Gatewatch.
correct.
wait what
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Jimmmm voters, if Jimmmm is town, what does that get us? LaLight voters, same question.
I think shraeye is a better wagon because he has a much richer set of interactions. We learn so much from his lynch either way. I also happen to think he's more likely to flip scum, but that's neither here nor there.
Galzria, all due respect, either make a real case on DatSwan or move your vote somewhere useful. Same goes for gkreig re: Awaclus. We're 9 hours from deadline, time to pick a real wagon.
If we lynch shraeye and shraeye flips town, what does it get us?
A whole lot more information about raerae and faust and ADK and all the other people who have been interacting with and reacting to shraeye since day 1!
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I stand by my Swan vote & encourage those who wish to lynch scum to vote there.
Do you have particular insight based on your irl knowledge of him?
In real life reason? No. In game reason? Yes.
your in this game?
Yes, and I know you’re not aligned with the Gatewatch.
correct.
wait what
he is correct... well at least in this quote.
I am factionless.
While I am actually not Gatewatch aligned, I am also not aligned with Bolos or any other faction.
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So DatSwan claimed scum? Okay then.
Vote: DatSwan
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I am factionless.
What is your wincon? Why should we let you live?
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Oh, I just figured out what's happening here. Hmm. Yeah, ok. What EFHW said.
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So DatSwan claimed scum? Okay then.
Vote: DatSwan
did you read what I said like at all?
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So DatSwan claimed scum? Okay then.
Vote: DatSwan
did you read what I said like at all?
Why is what you claimed any different than what a Bolos would claim here?
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So DatSwan claimed scum? Okay then.
Vote: DatSwan
did you read what I said like at all?
Yes.
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I'll be out like one hour before deadline.
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I am factionless.
What is your wincon? Why should we let you live?
I am a Survivor, I can win along side either Gatewatch or Bolos.
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So DatSwan claimed scum? Okay then.
Vote: DatSwan
did you read what I said like at all?
Why is what you claimed any different than what a Bolos would claim here?
I suppose they wouldn't of given your off hand comment as much weight. They probably also would then try to attack you and say you are lying.
I claimed it right away because your lurky non-commitment style of play is either skum!Galz or town!Galz with value. As you used the exact words "Not Gatewatch Aligned" instead of "Skum", I could either ignore it or get into it.
If I ignore it, and you ever flip (assuming you are town) - I get lynched. Getting ahead of it was the only way I could think of that may actually have have a scenario in it where I live.
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So DatSwan claimed scum? Okay then.
Vote: DatSwan
did you read what I said like at all?
Why is what you claimed any different than what a Bolos would claim here?
I suppose they wouldn't of given your off hand comment as much weight. They probably also would then try to attack you and say you are lying.
I claimed it right away because your lurky non-commitment style of play is either skum!Galz or town!Galz with value. As you used the exact words "Not Gatewatch Aligned" instead of "Skum", I could either ignore it or get into it.
If I ignore it, and you ever flip (assuming you are town) - I get lynched. Getting ahead of it was the only way I could think of that may actually have have a scenario in it where I live.
Wouldn't scum!Swan use exactly the same thought process though?
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What's the play here if we take Swan at his word? Survivors can definitely be a liability in the late game, especially if it gets close. We had an example of that fairly recently I believe, in the gladiator game. On the other hand, I'd rather lynch scum.
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So DatSwan claimed scum? Okay then.
Vote: DatSwan
did you read what I said like at all?
Why is what you claimed any different than what a Bolos would claim here?
I suppose they wouldn't of given your off hand comment as much weight. They probably also would then try to attack you and say you are lying.
I claimed it right away because your lurky non-commitment style of play is either skum!Galz or town!Galz with value. As you used the exact words "Not Gatewatch Aligned" instead of "Skum", I could either ignore it or get into it.
If I ignore it, and you ever flip (assuming you are town) - I get lynched. Getting ahead of it was the only way I could think of that may actually have have a scenario in it where I live.
Naw, it’s RMM - everybody has something they can do. I’m just lurky because I feel I have better reads overall when I’m less engaged and more oversight-y (example: I’m generally extremely good at finding scum when I spectate games and can’t do anything about it).
I think you “getting out ahead of it because it’s the only way you could possibly survive” fits just as well if you’re Bolos: You would make the same assumptions - if I flip at any point and show I’m Town you know you’re done for anyway - and you would believe, rightly so, that you couldn’t just ignore it in the “now” as I wasn’t likely to drop it.
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What's the play here if we take Swan at his word? Survivors can definitely be a liability in the late game, especially if it gets close. We had an example of that fairly recently I believe, in the gladiator game. On the other hand, I'd rather lynch scum.
I would put it at reasonably equally possible that he’s either.
If he’s Bolos, punching him now is 100% the right play.
If he’s Survivor, then it’s better to lynch Bolos than him, but the more Gatewatch that die the more Bolos aligned he becomes and the worse it is that he continues to live.
He also rolled Survivor like, three games ago, and I just don’t believe he did so again here.
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So DatSwan claimed scum? Okay then.
Vote: DatSwan
did you read what I said like at all?
Why is what you claimed any different than what a Bolos would claim here?
I suppose they wouldn't of given your off hand comment as much weight. They probably also would then try to attack you and say you are lying.
I claimed it right away because your lurky non-commitment style of play is either skum!Galz or town!Galz with value. As you used the exact words "Not Gatewatch Aligned" instead of "Skum", I could either ignore it or get into it.
If I ignore it, and you ever flip (assuming you are town) - I get lynched. Getting ahead of it was the only way I could think of that may actually have have a scenario in it where I live.
Wouldn't scum!Swan use exactly the same thought process though?
yeah to an extent.
I mean I would probably try to gun for Galz first and get the trade, right? I feel like that would be the skum play. Yeah even if it works then I get lynched next, but I would be taking it from more of a "team mindset" if I had "team mates".
Instead... it just me. If I die, nothing else matters, my win con instantly becomes not-achievable.
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What's the play here if we take Swan at his word? Survivors can definitely be a liability in the late game, especially if it gets close. We had an example of that fairly recently I believe, in the gladiator game. On the other hand, I'd rather lynch scum.
I would put it at reasonably equally possible that he’s either.
If he’s Bolos, lynching him now is 100% the right play.
If he’s Survivor, then it’s better to lynch Bolos than him, but the more Gatewatch that die the more Bolos aligned he becomes and the worse it is that he continues to live.
He also rolled Survivor like, three games ago, and I just don’t believe he did so again here.
EBWOP
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What's the play here if we take Swan at his word? Survivors can definitely be a liability in the late game, especially if it gets close. We had an example of that fairly recently I believe, in the gladiator game. On the other hand, I'd rather lynch scum.
I would put it at reasonably equally possible that he’s either.
If he’s Bolos, punching him now is 100% the right play.
If he’s Survivor, then it’s better to lynch Bolos than him, but the more Gatewatch that die the more Bolos aligned he becomes and the worse it is that he continues to live.
He also rolled Survivor like, three games ago, and I just don’t believe he did so again here.
don't punch me that is just rude (kidding, saw the EBWOP)
also, you have played with me a lot. this is absolutely not how I would role this off as skum. yes yes, I would say that if I were skum yadda yadda. but for real.
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What's the play here if we take Swan at his word? Survivors can definitely be a liability in the late game, especially if it gets close. We had an example of that fairly recently I believe, in the gladiator game. On the other hand, I'd rather lynch scum.
I would put it at reasonably equally possible that he’s either.
If he’s Bolos, punching him now is 100% the right play.
If he’s Survivor, then it’s better to lynch Bolos than him, but the more Gatewatch that die the more Bolos aligned he becomes and the worse it is that he continues to live.
I think we need to lynch him. There is the possibility he is Bolos-aligned, though I'm inclined to believe him here. And we would probably mislynch today instead and then, like you said, he becomes more Bolos-aligned.
vote: DatSwan
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Honestly, seeing how long it took for the Survivor thing to come out, I'm inclined to believe that the delay was DatSwan trying to figure out a reasonable fakeclaim. If DatSwan was really super concerned about surviving, he wouldn't just throw a "I'm not town" out there and not clarify for an hour.
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He also rolled Survivor like, three games ago, and I just don’t believe he did so again here.
I want to lynch Swan, but I also want to point out that this is nonsensical reasoning and whether Swan has been Survivor recently has no impact whatsoever on whether he is this time around.
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He also rolled Survivor like, three games ago, and I just don’t believe he did so again here.
Isn't this like a classic probability fallacy? Like "winning the lottery twice is much more unlikely than winning the lottery once, but once you've won once you're exactly as likely to win again as anybody else"? I feel like I learned about this in stats.
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Honestly, seeing how long it took for the Survivor thing to come out, I'm inclined to believe that the delay was DatSwan trying to figure out a reasonable fakeclaim. If DatSwan was really super concerned about surviving, he wouldn't just throw a "I'm not town" out there and not clarify for an hour.
Your like half right. The delay wasn't to create a fake claim, it was to decide how much of my role to reveal. Which I am currently reconsidering.
Also I was walking to get coffee, which took like 30 minutes.
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He also rolled Survivor like, three games ago, and I just don’t believe he did so again here.
I want to lynch Swan, but I also want to point out that this is nonsensical reasoning and whether Swan has been Survivor recently has no impact whatsoever on whether he is this time around.
Duh.
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He also rolled Survivor like, three games ago, and I just don’t believe he did so again here.
Isn't this like a classic probability fallacy? Like "winning the lottery twice is much more unlikely than winning the lottery once, but once you've won once you're exactly as likely to win again as anybody else"? I feel like I learned about this in stats.
Yes. It’s purely an emotional point, not a logical one.
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So rn we're at 12 people, right? We don't know how many scum there is, but four seems like the most there could be.
So if we lynch non-scum survivor today and then scum shoots town tonight, we start tomorrow with 10 players, 6 town and 4 scum, which is definitely MyLo.
If we try to lynch scum and miss though, we start tomorrow with 10 players --5 town, 4 scum, and a survivor. That's worse than LyLo. As soon as any townie votes for another townie, theoretically scum + swan could quick hammer for the win. Admittedly, that would be hard to coordinate for them.
If we lynch scum successfully, of course, then we're in a much better spot. But that's almost worth leaving out of the analysis, since Swan could be scum, so there's a chance of hitting scum either way.
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vote: Datswan
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Ral Zarek was not exagerrating about the blast radius, thought the Centaur, as soon as it was safe to stop and catch his breath.
The two surrounding buildings had been demolished.
The zombie hippo was still standing.
"Well, shit," said Ral.
Vote Count 2.5
DatSwan (5): Galzria, raerae, faust, EFHW, grkrieg
LaLight (1): Awaclus
Jimmmmmmm (3): UncleEurope, DatSwan, shraeye
shraeye (3): jotheonah, LaLight, Jimmmmmmmm
With 12 alive, it takes 6 to lynch. The day will end at 6:30 pm on Thursday, October 24th. That's in about 4 hours.
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So rn we're at 12 people, right? We don't know how many scum there is, but four seems like the most there could be.
So if we lynch non-scum survivor today and then scum shoots town tonight, we start tomorrow with 10 players, 6 town and 4 scum, which is definitely MyLo.
If we try to lynch scum and miss though, we start tomorrow with 10 players --5 town, 4 scum, and a survivor. That's worse than LyLo. As soon as any townie votes for another townie, theoretically scum + swan could quick hammer for the win. Admittedly, that would be hard to coordinate for them.
If we lynch scum successfully, of course, then we're in a much better spot. But that's almost worth leaving out of the analysis, since Swan could be scum, so there's a chance of hitting scum either way.
def not the pressing matter right now, but I suppose I should point some things out here if they could help me:
1) My text color is NOT in a color (just standard black).
2) My Role PM states that I can win alongside Gatewatch or Bolos. It does NOT mention anything about Nemisis, or any other faction.
so, that's what I know about me. When I take that, and add it up with....
1) the fact that WCD flipped color proof
2) The Nemesis faction had the need for a Doctor
.... Kind of makes me think there are not that many skum. Or if they are, they are on two different teams. If there were 4 Bolos, 2 Nemesis, 1 Survivor, and 8 Gatewatch... that would be starting the game at essentially 8 town vs 7 other... which seems skewed.
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damnit.
There is no not skummy way to say this.
Someone unvote me for a second.
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at L-1 I don't have a choice, I am just gonna claim out. chill for a second.
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I am Liliana Vess, Even-night Necromancer Survivor. I am a Human that uses Black Mana from Dominaria.
I can use a power of a dead player on even nights.
So, if we want to do something with that, you guys could like choose who you want to not die tonight, and I can use Pubby's doc shot on that player. Or whatever, that is just an idea.
And here is the super skummy part I am praying to FDS-Jesus someone has the ability to confirm...
My role contains the words "your alignment may become Gatewatch if certain criteria are met".
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My role contains the words "your alignment may become Gatewatch if certain criteria are met".
Can we get a modkill?
3. Direct or verbatim quoting of mod-provided information is strictly forbidden. Paraphrasing is okay. If you are not sure about your paraphrase, ask the mod first.
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unvote
I want to see the rules violation taken care of first. Maybe we don't need to lynch here.
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That is all I got.
The whole "can be changed to Gatewatch" thing was the main reason I was so quick to claim. I am assuming it will take some amount of signaling to someone to get it to happen.
At this point I would plead to pick someone else today.
1) I can get turned into Town, I have no idea how that happens, but if it does that could be a pretty nice swing after a pretty bad start.
2) Once I flip, Galz is essentially a conf!cop. I can use Pubby to keep him alive which gives Town somewhere between an MIC and an IC tomorrow.
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My role contains the words "your alignment may become Gatewatch if certain criteria are met".
Can we get a modkill?
3. Direct or verbatim quoting of mod-provided information is strictly forbidden. Paraphrasing is okay. If you are not sure about your paraphrase, ask the mod first.
I purposely changed the exact wording of the quote so I would not break the rule. I did not copy paste.
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I purposely changed the exact wording of the quote so I would not break the rule. I did not copy paste.
Then why did you say that it contains those exact words?
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My role contains the words "your alignment may become Gatewatch if certain criteria are met".
Can we get a modkill?
3. Direct or verbatim quoting of mod-provided information is strictly forbidden. Paraphrasing is okay. If you are not sure about your paraphrase, ask the mod first.
Datswan did not violate rule #3.
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I purposely changed the exact wording of the quote so I would not break the rule. I did not copy paste.
Then why did you say that it contains those exact words?
because I typed it up, realized what I was doing while I was speed typing, and then went back and changed words that hold absolutely zero bearing to anyone strictly so that I would not break the rule.
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My role contains the words "your alignment may become Gatewatch if certain criteria are met".
Can we get a modkill?
3. Direct or verbatim quoting of mod-provided information is strictly forbidden. Paraphrasing is okay. If you are not sure about your paraphrase, ask the mod first.
Datswan did not violate rule #3.
also obviously MODs have a certain amount of understanding when it comes to quoting from your Role PM. If they didn't half the field every game would get mod killed in like every game I have played when it came time for someone to claim.
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that was directed at the game, not at you Glooble. Mis-Quote, sorry.
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Ah, so Swan was lying. Well I personally think that fabricated quotes should be subject to the same rules as real ones - because because this way we get confirmation that this was a lie.
Vote: DatSwan
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Of course Swan conveniently "changed the words" to exactly match the OP:
There are a handful of players in this game whose win conditions can change if certain conditions are met. However if this is a possibility for you, you will be told about it at the beginning of the game.
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Vote: DatSwan
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faust you're being reductive.
Swan, you would say anything right now to not get lynched. But as the flavor guy ... this works. In the story, Lilliana is on Bolas's team at the beginning of the War of the Spark, but then switches sides at a pivotal moment and is instrumental in his defeat. I think. I'm actually a little fuzzy on the specifics.
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and... that was the hammer wasn't it.
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Ah, so Swan was lying. Well I personally think that fabricated quotes should be subject to the same rules as real ones - because because this way we get confirmation that this was a lie.
Vote: DatSwan
Swan is not lying. and the rule literally says "verbatim quoting". By changing one letter of one word, it is no longer "verbatim quoting"
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meh. well I guess it doesn't matter what I think anymore as I don't care who wins lol. Everything I said was true.
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Ah, so Swan was lying. Well I personally think that fabricated quotes should be subject to the same rules as real ones - because because this way we get confirmation that this was a lie.
Vote: DatSwan
Swan is not lying. and the rule literally says "verbatim quoting". By changing one letter of one word, it is no longer "verbatim quoting"
1. I think it's pretty clear what the spirit of the rule is.
2. The rule even says "direct or verbatim quoting". I'd argue that it would still be a direct quote.
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Ah, so Swan was lying. Well I personally think that fabricated quotes should be subject to the same rules as real ones - because because this way we get confirmation that this was a lie.
Vote: DatSwan
Swan is not lying. and the rule literally says "verbatim quoting". By changing one letter of one word, it is no longer "verbatim quoting"
1. I think it's pretty clear what the spirit of the rule is.
2. The rule even says "direct or verbatim quoting". I'd argue that it would still be a direct quote.
dude - I cleared it with Glooble.
It's ok, to each there own, and you were voting me for other reasons anyways. Not something I have a desire to argue about. I take your point, but in this game Glooble gets final say and they said it was ok.
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Regardless of whether you're telling the truth or not, I still want to say that there is a good reason to have that rule, and that it shouldn't be taken lightly. But that's a discussion we can have after the game.
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Regardless of whether you're telling the truth or not, I still want to say that there is a good reason to have that rule, and that it shouldn't be taken lightly. But that's a discussion we can have after the game.
for sure - and I do get your point. You'll be able to read the QT after the game. I assume it will make more sense then.
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welp - good luck everyone! was super fun set up, wish I was around longer.
Thanks for the game Glooble.
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I guess yelling at Awaclus for quickhammering is an inherently futile effort, but geez. We had 3.5 hours to talk about that claim.
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Day 2 Final Vote Count
DatSwan (6): Galzria, raerae, EFHW, gkrieg, faust, Awaclus
Jimmmmmmm (3): UncleEurope, DatSwan, shraeye
shraeye (3): jotheonah, LaLight, Jimmmmmmmm
With 12 alive, it took 6 to lynch. Twilight begins now and will last between two and three hours depending on Newton/ Cambridge traffic.
Faust, I would love to have this conversation with you once the game ends and you can see DatSwan's pm.
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I don't think there is any townie justification for cutting the day short like that when there was new information and so many people who hadn't weighed in on it.
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I don't think there is any townie justification for cutting the day short like that when there was new information and so many people who hadn't weighed in on it.
I would have done the exact same thing if I was town in Awaclus's position.
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I guess yelling at Awaclus for quickhammering is an inherently futile effort, but geez. We had 3.5 hours to talk about that claim.
Which is why it was good to hammer him while I had a chance.
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Why tho? Where is the harm in taking some time to evaluate a claim? I had information about the flavor that made me more inclined to believe Swan. I didn't have time to share it.
Do you both think you're so much smarter than everyone else that you get to make this decision unilaterally? I think that is blatantly anti-town play. I also know we won't punish you for it tomorrow just like we didn't punish shraeye today for his scummy quickhammer yesterday.
I know the whole "get a claim, lynch someone else" thing is a played-out bummer of a meta, but this meta is not better. This is a role madness game. Everyone is going to have a claim. I think we should make a policy of hearing them out before we lynch someone.
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Do you both think you're so much smarter than everyone else that you get to make this decision unilaterally?
I think I'm more likely to be town than everyone else.
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Do you both think you're so much smarter than everyone else that you get to make this decision unilaterally?
I think I'm more likely to be town than everyone else.
Oddly, I do not agree.
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Dude, he literally claimed not-town, and added a part about being able to switch alignment that was the most vague and fake-looking thing ever and that he would have had incentive to make up even if he was telling the truth about the Survivor bit. Lynching him was ideal, and risking that scum or misguided town steers the lynch last minute to someone else (who by the way would probably not have had a chance to claim and get the same treatment) was definitely not worth it.
It's not like we made a unilateral decision here, the majority of players decided that DatSwan was a good vote regardless of his claim, or they wouldn't have voted for him before he claimed.
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, the majority of players decided that DatSwan was a good vote regardless of his claim, or they wouldn't have voted for him before he claimed.
This is the opposite of true. A majority of players thought he was a good vote based on incomplete info. We don’t know how many players would have thought he was a good vote based on his full claim. You have deprived us of that number.
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, the majority of players decided that DatSwan was a good vote regardless of his claim, or they wouldn't have voted for him before he claimed.
This is the opposite of true. A majority of players thought he was a good vote based on incomplete info. We don’t know how many players would have thought he was a good vote based on his full claim. You have deprived us of that number.
I don't get what info in ther you think might have changed people's minds.
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voted Swan before any claim: Galzria, raerae
voted Swan after claiming not-Gatewatch, but before additional claiming: faust
voted Swan after survivor claim, but before claiming the possibility of an alignment switch: EFHW, gkreig
voted Swan after full claim which included (A) extremely useful powers and (B) the possibility of an alignment switch: faust again, Awaclus
So, yes, despite your protestations, you two did basically make a decision for the whole town to throw away the value of Swan's night actions and to lynch non-scum. For zero reason other than your own impatience and self-importance.
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voted Swan after full claim which included (A) extremely useful powers and (B) the possibility of an alignment switch
and (C) no reason to believe that any of it was true
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“Whoever killed Sorin knew how to kill a Vampire,” said Arlinn Kord, “An Innistrad vampire specifically. So they must have spent time there.”
“And be familiar with the undead,” said Gideon.
“No,” said Lilliana, “Surely you- I took an *oath*, you can trust me. I wouldn’t have-”
“I knew we couldn’t trust her,” said Nissa.
Lilliana tried to summon up some zombies to protect her, but there were too many planeswalkers closing in, and not enough time.
DatSwan has been lynched. He was Lilliana Vess, Even-Night Necromancer Survivor . Night 2 begins now and will end at 5:10 pm EST on Saturday, October 26th. Night actions are due at 5:10 am EST on Saturday, October 26th.
THREAD LOCKED
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Everyone heard the commotion. The street opening up in the rubble belt, the massive creature emerging from the deep. It did a lot of damage. Perhaps this prophecied Agent of Chaos was the only thing that could lay waste to Ravnica's Living Guildpact. But there he is, in the morning, clearly trampled to death.
Galzria has died. He was Jace Beleren, Gatewatch-Aligned Modified Tracker/ 1-shot alignment Cop.
Day 3 begins now, and will end at 5:30 pm on Saturday, November 2nd. I will not be on at deadline, so you will probably have to wait several hours for the flip.
Vote Count 3.0
Not voting (10): Awaclus, jotheonah, faust, UncleEurope, gkrieg, shraeye, raerae, Jimmm, EFHW, LaLight.
With 10 alive, it takes 6 to lynch.
Thread unlocked.
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Not voting (12): Awaclus, jotheonah, faust, UncleEurope, gkrieg, shraeye, raerae, Jimmm, EFHW, LaLight.
With 10 alive, it takes 5 to lynch.
Shouldn't the 12 be a 10 and the 5 a 6?
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Also, thread title needs an update.
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Why did no one call me on this Day 2? DatSwan should have taken one more vote to lynch.
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Nothing to be done about it now I guess. But ugh. I’m sorry guys.
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Vote: DatSwan
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Vote: DatSwan
Um, what is that?
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I thought the DatSwan wagon was surprisingly quick to conclude, but didn't make the connection. Anyways, these things happen in modding, and it's not affecting the game too much I think.
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Well, anyway, vote: Awaclus.
I’ve decided that holding scummy quickhammers accountable is the hill I want to die on.
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Well, anyway, vote: Awaclus.
I’ve decided that holding scummy quickhammers accountable is the hill I want to die on.
That can be arranged.
Vote: joth
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Well, anyway, vote: Awaclus.
I’ve decided that holding scummy quickhammers accountable is the hill I want to die on.
Is Awaclus' hammer more, less, or equally as scummy as shraeye's?
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I think Awaclus' hammer is less scummy than shraeye because Awaclus is Awaclus and because DS claimed non-town.
I think the town's non-desire to acknowledge shraeye/raerae scum team is what will be our demise.
vote: raerae
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I drank alcohol for the first time in 3 months and I can feel like I clearly see the whole scumteam which is shraeye/raerae/Faust
I also think gkrieg is not town, bit SK or survivor.
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Pubby kill is what bothering me. Why pubby? I mean I am not super familiar with his meta, but this kill is weird
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Galz kill is alright, he had this result on DatSwan
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Falling asleep as I write this, 3.30 am on the clock, but I think we should be much more alert about vocal players. And don't rush this time, pleasr
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I thought the DatSwan wagon was surprisingly quick to conclude, but didn't make the connection. Anyways, these things happen in modding, and it's not affecting the game too much I think.
I checked that it was really six but not if 6 was the right number.
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I'm in Boston/Cambridge, Hi joth/Glooble
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I drank alcohol for the first time in 3 months and I can feel like I clearly see the whole scumteam which is shraeye/raerae/Faust
I also think gkrieg is not town, bit SK or survivor.
So you think he was fakeclaiming?
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Pubby kill is what bothering me. Why pubby? I mean I am not super familiar with his meta, but this kill is weird
He might not have been the original target.
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I think Awaclus' hammer is less scummy than shraeye because Awaclus is Awaclus and because DS claimed non-town.
I think the town's non-desire to acknowledge shraeye/raerae scum team is what will be our demise.
vote: raerae
Man, you can not let go of this shraerae scumteam that seems to be called out at least once in every game we play (probably games we don't play, since you all love it so much).
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But also
vote: jimmmm
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Vote: EFHW
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I'm in Boston/Cambridge, Hi joth/Glooble
What. Wanna hang out?
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I'm in Boston/Cambridge, Hi joth/Glooble
What. Wanna hang out?
Too short a trip, but thanks!
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Vote: EFHW
Care to elaborate?
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Vote: EFHW
Care to elaborate?
omg, I'm dying. Best zing of the game.
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Vote: EFHW
Care to elaborate?
omg, I'm dying. Best zing of the game.
I don't get it.
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Isn't that raerae's catchphrase?
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Vote: EFHW
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Vote: DatSwan
Um, what is that?
Sorry, I was just indicating that the error didn't matter; Swan would have been lynched regardless.
-
Vote: shraeye
Based on his posts Today, I'd also be inclined to vote for LaLight.
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Awaclus
+1
jotheonah
+3
faust
+6
UncleEurope
-4
gkrieg
+2
raerae
+5
Jimmm
-3
EFHW
-2
LaLight
-8
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unvote
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Can this game drag much more? I'm going to vote a lurker.
-
vote: Eddie
-
Vote: EFHW
Care to elaborate?
omg, I'm dying. Best zing of the game.
True. Solid zing even if unintended.
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Vote: shraeye
Based on his posts Today, I'd also be inclined to vote for LaLight.
So LL is pushing his partner as a potential lunch target for today? Totes makes sense.
-
Vote: EFHW
I'm that convincing, huh?
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Vote: EFHW
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Vote: shraeye
Based on his posts Today, I'd also be inclined to vote for LaLight.
So LL is pushing his partner as a potential lunch target for today? Totes makes sense.
A) Pushing for one of my scumreads is not enough for me to give someone a pass and B) one scum is enough for Today.
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Jimmm that is wrong.
-
What is?
-
Part B
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What are you suggesting? That anyone with a read in common with me gets a free pass? In considering LaLight, I'm not going to assume that I'm right about you and that he wouldn't bus you.
Besides, unless he changes his vote to you, LaLight's stance on you is irrelevant if raerae is Town.
-
See now I'm having trouble parsing what you mean in that reply.
And you've skirted the issue that I brought up in the first place by doubling down on the part A bit.
Vote: Jimmmm
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skirted the issue
You'd know about that, wouldn't you?
One scum is enough for Today, ie I'm looking for one scum at a time not partners, ie I consider each player on their own merits until we have more information, therefore in considering LaLight, I'm not going to assume that I'm right about you and that he wouldn't bus you.
-
I'll reword in case I was legitimately not clear.
A) I don't see why shraeye and LL can't both be scum. B) Even if I was convinced they're not both scum, I would remain suspicious of each of them.
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Although my assessment of LL is based purely on his posts from Today; I'll reread him properly soon.
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Vote: EFHW
Is this your way of not lurking? You are the third vote for me without explanation. What am I missing?
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Vote: EFHW
Is this your way of not lurking? You are the third vote for me without explanation. What am I missing?
You're missing that you're scum.
Why should we not vote for you?
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You all know this is possibly MyLo, right? We should be past the point of throwing votes around willy-nilly if we want to have any chance of winning. We need serious votes based on serious cases. If we don’t get our heads in the game we’re gonna hand it to scum.
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You all know this is possibly MyLo, right? We should be past the point of throwing votes around willy-nilly if we want to have any chance of winning. We need serious votes based on serious cases. If we don’t get our heads in the game we’re gonna hand it to scum.
Why would it be MyLo? We mislynched once, how hard this game would be for us if two mislynches can lose us the game?
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Vote: EFHW
Is this your way of not lurking? You are the third vote for me without explanation. What am I missing?
You're missing that you're scum.
Why should we not vote for you?
So you have any information we don't? I didn't see you voting for EFHW once in this game
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Vote: EFHW
Is this your way of not lurking? You are the third vote for me without explanation. What am I missing?
You're missing that you're scum.
Why should we not vote for you?
Do you have any information we don't? I didn't see you voting for EFHW once in this game
EBWOP
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With the death of the living guildpact, relations between the guilds have devolved even further towards total chaos. Now as well as fighting zombies in the streets, the citizens of Ravnica are fighting each other. As the Planeswalkers look out at the battles raging in the streets, they know their only hope to save this city is to find the traitor in their midst.
Vote Count 3.1
Awaclus (1): jotheonah
raerae (1): LaLight
EFHW (3): raerae, faust, UncleEurope
shraeye (1):Jimmmm
UncleEurope (1): EFHW
Jimmmmmm (1): shraeye
Not voting (2): Awaclus, gkrieg,
With 10 alive, it takes 6 to lynch. Day 3 will end at 5:30 on Saturday, November 2nd.
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You all know this is possibly MyLo, right? We should be past the point of throwing votes around willy-nilly if we want to have any chance of winning. We need serious votes based on serious cases. If we don’t get our heads in the game we’re gonna hand it to scum.
Why would it be MyLo? We mislynched once, how hard this game would be for us if two mislynches can lose us the game?
We also vig-killed a townie? I mean, it also might not be MyLo, all the third parties running around suggest a smaller scum team to me. But, like, math is math. Four scum is not out of the question. There are 10 players alive. A mislynch today, a nightkill tonight, then we're at 8. If 4 are scum, they win.
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You all know this is possibly MyLo, right? We should be past the point of throwing votes around willy-nilly if we want to have any chance of winning. We need serious votes based on serious cases. If we don’t get our heads in the game we’re gonna hand it to scum.
Is this your idea of a serious vote based on a serious case?
Well, anyway, vote: Awaclus.
I’ve decided that holding scummy quickhammers accountable is the hill I want to die on.
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You all know this is possibly MyLo, right? We should be past the point of throwing votes around willy-nilly if we want to have any chance of winning. We need serious votes based on serious cases. If we don’t get our heads in the game we’re gonna hand it to scum.
Why would it be MyLo? We mislynched once, how hard this game would be for us if two mislynches can lose us the game?
We also vig-killed a townie? I mean, it also might not be MyLo, all the third parties running around suggest a smaller scum team to me. But, like, math is math. Four scum is not out of the question. There are 10 players alive. A mislynch today, a nightkill tonight, then we're at 8. If 4 are scum, they win.
Oh I totally forgot about vigkill.
-
Vote: EFHW
Is this your way of not lurking? You are the third vote for me without explanation. What am I missing?
You're missing that you're scum.
Why should we not vote for you?
So you have any information we don't? I didn't see you voting for EFHW once in this game
I do have some information that I presume you do not have.
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You all know this is possibly MyLo, right? We should be past the point of throwing votes around willy-nilly if we want to have any chance of winning. We need serious votes based on serious cases. If we don’t get our heads in the game we’re gonna hand it to scum.
Is this your idea of a serious vote based on a serious case?
Well, anyway, vote: Awaclus.
I’ve decided that holding scummy quickhammers accountable is the hill I want to die on.
Kinda, yeah. We're in this mess largely because you and shraeye (and to a lesser extent faust and raerae) decided you knew best and quickhammered, either without a claim or before town could react to a claim. So as far as I'm concerned you're all pretty likely to be scum.
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Vote: EFHW
Is this your way of not lurking? You are the third vote for me without explanation. What am I missing?
You're missing that you're scum.
Why should we not vote for you?
I have been a bit cursory due to traveling. That's done now, so I will try to be more engaged.
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Kinda, yeah. We're in this mess largely because you and shraeye (and to a lesser extent faust and raerae) decided you knew best and quickhammered, either without a claim or before town could react to a claim. So as far as I'm concerned you're all pretty likely to be scum.
Town could react to DatSwan's claim and the way town reacted was by hammering him.
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Okay, if we're legitimately close to MyLo then we should be claiming, right? joth, since the rest of us can't do anything right I suppose you'd like to start?
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Okay, if we're legitimately close to MyLo then we should be claiming, right? joth, since the rest of us can't do anything right I suppose you'd like to start?
Why wasn't he suggesting it?
I don't think this could be mylo, but I'm ok with a mass claim and starting with joth sounds perfect. Do we have anyone to set an order?
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I'm not sure I'm sold on a massclaim here, but I'm happy to go first if we all decide we want to do one.
-
I just did iso on joth, and even though I have had scum vibes here and there, I think he is more likely town. So I'd rather Lalight, Shraeye or Awaclus went first.
I'm trying to think if there is a way to do massclaim that optimizes the use of investigation results for catching scum.
-
I don't think a massclaim is in our interest.
-
Good thing I'm already voting for EFHW.
-
Vote: Jimmmmmmmmm
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I don't think a massclaim is in our interest.
You're making a lot of statements without sharing your thoughts. What is your objection to massclaim?
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You all know this is possibly MyLo, right? We should be past the point of throwing votes around willy-nilly if we want to have any chance of winning. We need serious votes based on serious cases. If we don’t get our heads in the game we’re gonna hand it to scum.
Yeah, that's why Jimmm is so wrong, and also why him ignoring that part of my complaint is just insane.
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unvote
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Awaclus
+0
jotheonah
+5
faust
+6
UncleEurope
-5
gkrieg
+4
raerae
+7
Jimmm
-3
EFHW
-5
LaLight
-7
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Vote: Jimmmmmmmmm
Can you explain this vote? If Jimmmmmmmm were entirely off the table who would be your next best bet and why?
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I don't think a massclaim is in our interest.
You're making a lot of statements without sharing your thoughts. What is your objection to massclaim?
It gives scum all the information they need to avoid being caught, and having only 2 nights under our belt is unlikely to give us useful information.
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All the MyLo panic is a bit overstated I think. With a Survivor and 2 other (not-complete) towns I find it hard to believe that we have a 4-player scumteam.
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Vote: Jimmmmmmmmm
Can you explain this vote? If Jimmmmmmmm were entirely off the table who would be your next best bet and why?
EFHW. And Y left the alphabet at the same time X was removed.
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skirted the issue
You'd know about that, wouldn't you?
One scum is enough for Today, ie I'm looking for one scum at a time not partners, ie I consider each player on their own merits until we have more information, therefore in considering LaLight, I'm not going to assume that I'm right about you and that he wouldn't bus you.
This strikes me as towny from Jimmmmm.
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You all know this is possibly MyLo, right? We should be past the point of throwing votes around willy-nilly if we want to have any chance of winning. We need serious votes based on serious cases. If we don’t get our heads in the game we’re gonna hand it to scum.
Yeah, that's why Jimmm is so wrong, and also why him ignoring that part of my complaint is just insane.
I still don't get your objection. Sorry if I'm being dense. Can you spell it out?
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Kinda, yeah. We're in this mess largely because you and shraeye (and to a lesser extent faust and raerae) decided you knew best and quickhammered, either without a claim or before town could react to a claim. So as far as I'm concerned you're all pretty likely to be scum.
Town could react to DatSwan's claim and the way town reacted was by hammering him.
Except you didn't give most of us the chance to react.
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Except you didn't give most of us the chance to react.
Well yeah, I was offered the chance to make a decision that I was happy with so I took that chance while I could.
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You all know this is possibly MyLo, right? We should be past the point of throwing votes around willy-nilly if we want to have any chance of winning. We need serious votes based on serious cases. If we don’t get our heads in the game we’re gonna hand it to scum.
Yeah, that's why Jimmm is so wrong, and also why him ignoring that part of my complaint is just insane.
I didn't ignore anything; repeated stating I did doesn't change that. Your complaint was "Jimmm that is wrong... Part B". I addressed Part B as I understand it. If you want me to address something else you're going to have to be less vague.
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Vote: Jimmmmmmmmm
Can you explain this vote? If Jimmmmmmmm were entirely off the table who would be your next best bet and why?
EFHW. And Y left the alphabet at the same time X was removed.
You've been mostly unhelpful. This is D3. Explain why we shouldn't lynch you today.
Unvote
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Vote: Jimmmmmmmmm
Can you explain this vote? If Jimmmmmmmm were entirely off the table who would be your next best bet and why?
EFHW. And Y left the alphabet at the same time X was removed.
You've been mostly unhelpful. This is D3. Explain why we shouldn't lynch you today.
Unvote
Why did you unvote EFHW?
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Vote: Jimmmmmmmmm
Can you explain this vote? If Jimmmmmmmm were entirely off the table who would be your next best bet and why?
EFHW. And Y left the alphabet at the same time X was removed.
You've been mostly unhelpful. This is D3. Explain why we shouldn't lynch you today.
Unvote
Unhelpful =/= Scum.
Scum like being helpful.
I like being helpful as scum.
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But you also like being helpful as town
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Then my behavior right now must be really confusing.
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Sorry guys. I’ve had really low availability because of a paper deadline on Friday. Hopefully I’ll be waiting for my advisor to do stuff and will have time to reread.
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Hopefully I’ll be waiting for my advisor to do stuff and will have time to reread.
He's going to discard the best 1/3 of the paper.
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Vote: Jimmmmmmmmm
Can you explain this vote? If Jimmmmmmmm were entirely off the table who would be your next best bet and why?
EFHW. And Y left the alphabet at the same time X was removed.
You've been mostly unhelpful. This is D3. Explain why we shouldn't lynch you today.
Unvote
Why did you unvote EFHW?
Because I'm frustrated.
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I don't think a massclaim is in our interest.
You're making a lot of statements without sharing your thoughts. What is your objection to massclaim?
It gives scum all the information they need to avoid being caught, and having only 2 nights under our belt is unlikely to give us useful information.
Ok, then what is your suggestion for getting things moving better?
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Vote: EFHW
Is this your way of not lurking? You are the third vote for me without explanation. What am I missing?
You're missing that you're scum.
Why should we not vote for you?
So you have any information we don't? I didn't see you voting for EFHW once in this game
I do have some information that I presume you do not have.
But you don't want to share it? If you think I am scum, shouldn't you be trying to make a case and sharing your info?
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I don't think a massclaim is in our interest.
You're making a lot of statements without sharing your thoughts. What is your objection to massclaim?
It gives scum all the information they need to avoid being caught, and having only 2 nights under our belt is unlikely to give us useful information.
Ok, then what is your suggestion for getting things moving better?
I suggest more people vote for you.
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Vote: EFHW
Is this your way of not lurking? You are the third vote for me without explanation. What am I missing?
You're missing that you're scum.
Why should we not vote for you?
So you have any information we don't? I didn't see you voting for EFHW once in this game
I do have some information that I presume you do not have.
But you don't want to share it? If you think I am scum, shouldn't you be trying to make a case and sharing your info?
Yes. No.
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I suggest more people vote for you.
What reason do I have to think you're town and EFHW is scum, rather than the other way around?
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I suggest more people vote for you.
What reason do I have to think you're town and EFHW is scum, rather than the other way around?
I don't know, you tell me!
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I'm down with that
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Vote: EFHW
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Okay, since nobody else feels the need to explain anything, I'm voting for EFHW's reactions to my wagon and DatSwan's claim. I HATE how little shraeye, Eddie, and Awaclus are contributing but I don't know if that makes them scum or just extra frustrating.
Vote: EFHW
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I'm voting EFHW because of my increasing scum read and also because Faust.
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I'm voting EFHW because of my increasing scum read and also because Faust.
Eye. Roll.
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L-2 I think? I'm inclined to just claim now, since my guess is that faust has a misleading result on me. Objections?
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L-2 I think? I'm inclined to just claim now, since my guess is that faust has a misleading result on me. Objections?
Totally your call.
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I'm a motion detector/vig.
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I'm a motion detector/vig.
Every night? Who've you targeted?
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I'm a motion detector/vig.
Every night? Who've you targeted?
Only motion detector is every night. gkrieg had no motion n1, Lalight returned no result n2.
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I suggest more people vote for you.
What reason do I have to think you're town and EFHW is scum, rather than the other way around?
I don't know, you tell me!
You claimed to have some info on EFHW. Maybe it's time to reveal it?
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LaLight:
Yeah, but also people who start every game the same, sa Joseph claiming SK, again, are having an easy entrance into the game, independent of alignment. I personally think it's more scummy than not, so vote: raerae
Who was it, gkrieg, who started every game voting for Witherweaver even if he was not in the game? Iirc, it turned out gkrieg sometimes forgot to do that as town and did that as scum every time, because it was an easy RVS post.
Not sure I remember correctly, but that was the case. Maybe it was Awaclus voting for silver though
Granted it was early Day 1, but I think this is a scummy case.
I am also a bit wary about shraeye making points posts. Makes him scummier in my eyes and if shraeye and raerae are scums together, it will suit my narrative and I like it
I don't know if this means anything, but LaLight mentioning team shraerae so early in the game is interesting.
Shraeye, do anything interesting last night?
vote: Galzria
I personally tend to do exactly that when I am scum preparing a fakeclaim
Exactly what? I’m just curious if he did anything interesting. You know, after quick-unannounced-hammering MiX.
Well, i would call it an obvious breadcrumb: I pretend to do some action as Town PR, so then I can say "I have nothing to hide, here in this post I obviously hinted I am tracker and tracked shraeye"
It's not much of a case, but it's the best i have
Galz' comment struck me as too obvious to be a scum breadcrumb, but I agree that it was strange. "it's the best i have" is interesting, given that this is after the MiX lynch but before joth started pushing the shraerae narrative, which indicates that LL didn't find it suspicious at this point.
Based on your argument it made it less and more safe at the same time.
Basically yeah, the fact that Joth said it would make it more or less safe depending on whether Shraeye is scum, so the point is moot.
I personally think it's more scummy than not, I see shraeye yoloing this
vote: shraeye
My current thinking on shraerae is that they're more likely to be both scum than one scum and one not. Again, I hope a reread will bring clarity when I have time for it.
Weird, but it seems the same for me. That they are more likely to both be scums
I'm not super convinced by LL's agreement here.
All fire, no substance. This isn't townrae.
What happened to this read? It sounds pretty sure
You always say that you excellently read raerae, then you say she's scum, then you drop it, why?
This is a line of questioning I can get behind. LL in fact asked the first question again later and as far as I've seen it still hasn't been answered.
I also continue to think that shraeye is scum because even if people tell me it's his meta to be careless, he seems trying to play his meta, not just playing it.
The hammer, these posts:
I'll pre-sheep DatSwan
Vote: EFHW
But that last question jimmm asked is new and exciting.
I'll make a deal. If you summarize what you think about raerae overall, I'll answer that neato question.
It's like "see, people, I am town!shraeye, I play like town!shraeye, you see? See?"
I don't feel it genuine.
I don't really have a comment on these particular arguments except to say that I'll now admit that a LL/shraeye team seems less likely than your average pair of scummy players.
I think the town's non-desire to acknowledge shraeye/raerae scum team is what will be our demise.
vote: raerae
I'm not really sure why, but I don't like this statement. Maybe it's partly just because I remain unconvinced of team shraerae. I guess also I think comments fearing "our demise" etc tend to more often come from scum trying to be Town than Town.
I drank alcohol for the first time in 3 months and I can feel like I clearly see the whole scumteam which is shraeye/raerae/Faust
I also think gkrieg is not town, bit SK or survivor.
I don't think there's any reason at all to believe gkrieg is an SK or Survivor. We haven't seen multiple deaths and it seems unlikely that we'd have a Survivor (DatSwan) and also another Survivor/Nemesis. The fact that he's just thrown this out there with nothing to back it up seems wrong.
Pubby kill is what bothering me. Why pubby? I mean I am not super familiar with his meta, but this kill is weird
Galz kill is alright, he had this result on DatSwan
I think this kind of argument comes from scum pretending to be surprised more often than from Town. They're not really helpful or saying anything other than "Look how much I'm not scum".
So I come away leaning scum on LL. He does get some Town points for his questioning of shraeye. Could they be scum together? Maybe. If LL stays on raerae then I would say yes, it seems likely that the push for shraerae was actually a push for raerae. If it turns out he's equally happy to lynch either then maybe he gets some more Town points.
Questions for LaLight:
What was your initial response to the events around the MiX lynch? Did shraerae seem scummy to you at the time, or did you only develop that opinion based on others' arguments? If the latter, what convinced you?
What makes you think gkrieg is non-Town? Is that a read on him or on the setup?
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I suggest more people vote for you.
What reason do I have to think you're town and EFHW is scum, rather than the other way around?
I don't know, you tell me!
You claimed to have some info on EFHW. Maybe it's time to reveal it?
I did no such thing.
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I'm a motion detector/vig.
Every night? Who've you targeted?
Only motion detector is every night. gkrieg had no motion n1, Lalight returned no result n2.
So the vig is 1-shot?
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Do people think Glooble would give us both a vig AND a vengeful townie? That's the only place I'm hung up on this claim. Seems like a lot of town killing power.
I don't have any info that conflicts with the tracker results.
gkreig, LaLight-- is this accurate?
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Okay, since nobody else feels the need to explain anything, I'm voting for EFHW's reactions to my wagon and DatSwan's claim.
Vote: EFHW
What was scummy in my reaction to your wagon and DatSwan's claim?
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Do people think Glooble would give us both a vig AND a vengeful townie? That's the only place I'm hung up on this claim. Seems like a lot of town killing power.
I don't have any info that conflicts with the tracker results.
gkreig, LaLight-- is this accurate?
The last time I played the "mod totally wouldn't have given town these two powers" game, mod had totally given town those two powers.
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Okay, since nobody else feels the need to explain anything, I'm voting for EFHW's reactions to my wagon and DatSwan's claim.
Vote: EFHW
What was scummy in my reaction to your wagon and DatSwan's claim?
I can pull quotes later but at one point you said MiX was obv!town from your POV then another time you said he was being scummy, it felt like you waffled a lot on the case but it didn't feel like genuine waffles (I know I'm going a lot off feelings here), and the way you voted on DatSwan post claim seemed opportunistic and rushed.
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I suggest more people vote for you.
What reason do I have to think you're town and EFHW is scum, rather than the other way around?
I don't know, you tell me!
You claimed to have some info on EFHW. Maybe it's time to reveal it?
I did no such thing.
You sure did seem to have a reason behind your vote. Maybe you could share that with the crowd?
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Okay, since nobody else feels the need to explain anything, I'm voting for EFHW's reactions to my wagon and DatSwan's claim.
Vote: EFHW
What was scummy in my reaction to your wagon and DatSwan's claim?
I can pull quotes later but at one point you said MiX was obv!town from your POV then another time you said he was being scummy, it felt like you waffled a lot on the case but it didn't feel like genuine waffles (I know I'm going a lot off feelings here), and the way you voted on DatSwan post claim seemed opportunistic and rushed.
I did feel MiX was obv!town, but when I went back I could see why other people would have thought he was scummy, which made their votes less scummy to me. My opinion of MiX didn't change, it was my opinion of the votes that changed.
I was a little rushed re: DatSwan because of traveling, and I missed the second part of his claim for that reason (and because of the quickhammer). I would have unvoted given the chance. But I did genuinely believe at the time of my vote that he was the best lynch. I wasn't confident we would find scum and survivor is so much of a wild card.
But you said my reaction to your wagon was scummy. When was that?
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EFHW, since you've already claimed, would you be willing to flavor claim? Would definitely help me evaluate your claim.
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Okay, since nobody else feels the need to explain anything, I'm voting for EFHW's reactions to my wagon and DatSwan's claim.
Vote: EFHW
What was scummy in my reaction to your wagon and DatSwan's claim?
I can pull quotes later but at one point you said MiX was obv!town from your POV then another time you said he was being scummy, it felt like you waffled a lot on the case but it didn't feel like genuine waffles (I know I'm going a lot off feelings here), and the way you voted on DatSwan post claim seemed opportunistic and rushed.
I did feel MiX was obv!town, but when I went back I could see why other people would have thought he was scummy, which made their votes less scummy to me. My opinion of MiX didn't change, it was my opinion of the votes that changed.
I was a little rushed re: DatSwan because of traveling, and I missed the second part of his claim for that reason (and because of the quickhammer). I would have unvoted given the chance. But I did genuinely believe at the time of my vote that he was the best lynch. I wasn't confident we would find scum and survivor is so much of a wild card.
But you said my reaction to your wagon was scummy. When was that?
Bolded, sorry that definitely wasn't clear. Like I said, I'll find some quotes in a bit. Our furnace has died on us so I'm a bit over my head at the moment.
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EFHW, since you've already claimed, would you be willing to flavor claim? Would definitely help me evaluate your claim.
Nissa Revane, green mana
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I'm a motion detector/vig.
Every night? Who've you targeted?
Only motion detector is every night. gkrieg had no motion n1, Lalight returned no result n2.
By "no result", you mean to imply that your action failed? What are your thoughts about what that means?
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Aside from a mild vig skepticism, I don't see a strong reason to disbelieve EFHW's claim. I also don't have a super strong reason to believe it, and it's possible she's a scum motion detector (RM is weird). Nissa is definitely not a scum character, but it could very easily be a fake claim. Those powers don't feel like they especially match the character to me, not to the extent that, say, Mix's and Galz's did, IMO.
I'd like to explore the possibility of leaving EFHW alive and directing her vig kill, treating it as a quasi-second lynch. That gives us a second chance to stay in the game if we ARE at MyLo and we mislynch.
Of course, scum might have a roleblocker or even a doctor, so maybe that's a bad plan... Hmmm.
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Aside from a mild vig skepticism, I don't see a strong reason to disbelieve EFHW's claim. I also don't have a super strong reason to believe it, and it's possible she's a scum motion detector (RM is weird). Nissa is definitely not a scum character, but it could very easily be a fake claim. Those powers don't feel like they especially match the character to me, not to the extent that, say, Mix's and Galz's did, IMO.
I'd like to explore the possibility of leaving EFHW alive and directing her vig kill, treating it as a quasi-second lynch. That gives us a second chance to stay in the game if we ARE at MyLo and we mislynch.
Of course, scum might have a roleblocker or even a doctor, so maybe that's a bad plan... Hmmm.
None of us trust each other enough to pick a vig target and I don't trust EFHW enough to believe she'd direct it at the target we picked if we did. Other than that I'm with you, no reason to believe or disbelieve.
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@EFHW, why'd you target those two in particular?
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Do people think Glooble would give us both a vig AND a vengeful townie? That's the only place I'm hung up on this claim. Seems like a lot of town killing power.
I don't have any info that conflicts with the tracker results.
gkreig, LaLight-- is this accurate?
Yes accurate
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I'm a motion detector/vig.
Every night? Who've you targeted?
Only motion detector is every night. gkrieg had no motion n1, Lalight returned no result n2.
By "no result", you mean to imply that your action failed? What are your thoughts about what that means?
Yes, I assume it failed. The usual suspects, rb, jk, rolestopper, commuter ...
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@EFHW, why'd you target those two in particular?
This being RMM, motion detector didn't seem very useful since a lot of people would be taking night actions or be a target. I thought gkrieg was not likely to be a target, at least, and I always scumread him regardless of alignment, so additional info on him would be helpful. Lalight I suspected of having the same role as gkrieg, so he seemed a logical choice.
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You sure did seem to have a reason behind your vote. Maybe you could share that with the crowd?
I'm relatively confident that some scum was off the MiX wagon, and EFHW seemed the most likely choice, so I thought I'd see what happened if I voted there. All the towny people supported the wagon and none of the scummy people did, so now I'm feeling a lot better about that EFHW read.
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I'm a motion detector/vig.
Every night? Who've you targeted?
Only motion detector is every night. gkrieg had no motion n1, Lalight returned no result n2.
So the vig is 1-shot?
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I'm a motion detector/vig.
Every night? Who've you targeted?
Only motion detector is every night. gkrieg had no motion n1, Lalight returned no result n2.
So the vig is 1-shot?
Yes
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You sure did seem to have a reason behind your vote. Maybe you could share that with the crowd?
I'm relatively confident that some scum was off the MiX wagon, and EFHW seemed the most likely choice, so I thought I'd see what happened if I voted there. All the towny people supported the wagon and none of the scummy people did, so now I'm feeling a lot better about that EFHW read.
You caught me this way before, but not this time. Who are the scummy people inyour mind?
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I'm with joth. A Vig claim is potentially verifiable. If we are at mylo then the a vig could save the game Tonight, and if we're not then it could get us down to an odd number.
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You sure did seem to have a reason behind your vote. Maybe you could share that with the crowd?
I'm relatively confident that some scum was off the MiX wagon, and EFHW seemed the most likely choice, so I thought I'd see what happened if I voted there. All the towny people supported the wagon and none of the scummy people did, so now I'm feeling a lot better about that EFHW read.
You caught me this way before, but not this time. Who are the scummy people inyour mind?
You can probably get some idea of this based on the composition of your wagon. I don't want to go into more detail at the moment.
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@EFHW: Can you use your Motion Detector and your Vig the same Night?
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@EFHW: Can you use your Motion Detector and your Vig the same Night?
Yes
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Hey Awaclus, when can I expect a vote from you?
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Hey Awaclus, when can I expect a vote from you?
Well, that can be arranged. vote: faust
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Hey Awaclus, when can I expect a vote from you?
Well, that can be arranged. vote: faust
You are too predictable.
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vote: Lalight. Jimmmmm, any interest?
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Do people think Glooble would give us both a vig AND a vengeful townie? That's the only place I'm hung up on this claim. Seems like a lot of town killing power.
I don't have any info that conflicts with the tracker results.
gkreig, LaLight-- is this accurate?
Well, I did move, and I didn't do anything that could mess with EFHW results
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Hey Awaclus, when can I expect a vote from you?
Well, that can be arranged. vote: faust
You are too predictable.
Why did you want me to vote for you?
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Galz' comment struck me as too obvious to be a scum breadcrumb, but I agree that it was strange. "it's the best i have" is interesting, given that this is after the MiX lynch but before joth started pushing the shraerae narrative, which indicates that LL didn't find it suspicious at this point.
I did find it suspicious, but it was not a good case. Galz's case at the time was better to me than just something based on my feelings about shraerae team.
Questions for LaLight:
What was your initial response to the events around the MiX lynch? Did shraerae seem scummy to you at the time, or did you only develop that opinion based on others' arguments? If the latter, what convinced you?
What makes you think gkrieg is non-Town? Is that a read on him or on the setup?
They did seem scummy to me at the time, I clearly remember thinking I solved the game back then.
I think it is more probable for the setup to change alignment of nemesises (nemesi?) to slef-aligned in some way, not town ones. That's what I'd do anyway, most of the time. Maybe even Traitor?
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Hey Awaclus, when can I expect a vote from you?
Well, that can be arranged. vote: faust
You are too predictable.
Why did you want me to vote for you?
I wanted you to vote, but I had little faith that anything I say could yield a reasonable result. Still, it was worth a try.
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Jace's funeral draws a massive crowd- despite being absent a lot, he was still the living guildpact. Of course Bolas decides to take the opportunity to harvest more sparks. In the battle that ensues, a tiny blue homonculus finds himself jostled and carried until he's in a part of the city he absolutely does not recognize.
Oh no.
Not again.
Vote Count 3.2
Awaclus (1): jotheonah
raerae (1): LaLight
EFHW (3): faust, shraeye, raerae
shraeye (1):Jimmmm
Jimmmmmm (1): UncleEurope
faust (1): Awaclus
LaLight (1): EFHW
Not voting (1): gkrieg,
With 10 alive, it takes 6 to lynch. Day 3 will end at 5:30 on Saturday, November 2nd.
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I'm really frustrated with how the game is going. I have lots of suspicions but no strong reads. Can we reconsider mass claim? I know everyone probably wants to protect their prs so they can use them tonight, but scum can't stop all of them and they'll probably prioritize stopping me.
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Day 3 will end at 5:30 on Saturday, November 2nd.
am or pm?
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Day 3 will end at 5:30 on Saturday, November 2nd.
am or pm?
PM.
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vote: faust. Holding up the game
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@EFHW, why'd you target those two in particular?
When will we see the posts of mine you thought were scummy? You still haven't addressed my question about how my reaction to votes on you was scummy.
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I'm voting EFHW because of my increasing scum read and also because Faust.
Scumread based on what?
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If we are at MiLo, is there any merit to a “no lynch” here? Get us to an odd number? Of course, I guess the vig shot would accomplish that too...
The EFHW lynch feels wrong to me. No one is coming to her defense. On the other hand, it has sort of stalled out here at L-2.
EFHW, do you really think faust is scum? Why?
Everyone on the wagon, are you confident enough to risk losing the game if you’re wrong? If so, why?
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vote: faust. Holding up the game
What? How?
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Everyone on the wagon, are you confident enough to risk losing the game if you’re wrong? If so, why?
Yes, because A) it's not a big risk B) if there are 4 scum, it's closed to guaranteed there they weren't all on MiX, so that makes an EFHW lynch look better C) Noone that I think is scummy supports an EFHW lynch.
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If we are at MiLo, is there any merit to a “no lynch” here? Get us to an odd number? Of course, I guess the vig shot would accomplish that too...
The EFHW lynch feels wrong to me. No one is coming to her defense. On the other hand, it has sort of stalled out here at L-2.
I think if EFHW's telling the truth, we want to use the vig shot rather than no-lynch to fix the parity. If she's lying it may be difficult for her to explain the lack of a second kill.
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If we are at MiLo, is there any merit to a “no lynch” here? Get us to an odd number? Of course, I guess the vig shot would accomplish that too...
The EFHW lynch feels wrong to me. No one is coming to her defense. On the other hand, it has sort of stalled out here at L-2.
I think if EFHW's telling the truth, we want to use the vig shot rather than no-lynch to fix the parity. If she's lying it may be difficult for her to explain the lack of a second kill.
Difficult like "oh I must have gotten roleblocked, which is the excuse I literally breadcrumbed I would use":
scum can't stop all of them and they'll probably prioritize stopping me.
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Yeah, I back what Faust said. It would be 0% difficult
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If we are at MiLo, is there any merit to a “no lynch” here? Get us to an odd number? Of course, I guess the vig shot would accomplish that too...
The EFHW lynch feels wrong to me. No one is coming to her defense. On the other hand, it has sort of stalled out here at L-2.
I think if EFHW's telling the truth, we want to use the vig shot rather than no-lynch to fix the parity. If she's lying it may be difficult for her to explain the lack of a second kill.
Difficult like "oh I must have gotten roleblocked, which is the excuse I literally breadcrumbed I would use":
scum can't stop all of them and they'll probably prioritize stopping me.
Maybe. Worst case we get the information "Either EFHW is scum or scum used some kind of blocking ability on her". Regardless I think we should look elsewhere for Today's lynch.
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@EFHW, why'd you target those two in particular?
When will we see the posts of mine you thought were scummy? You still haven't addressed my question about how my reaction to votes on you was scummy.
When my furnace works again and it isn't Halloween. I already addressed the second half of this and apologized for how unclear it was when I originally posted it.
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Anybody down for a joth or Jimmmm vote? I'd still be happy with an EFHW vote but those two are looking more and more appealing with every post.
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If we are at MiLo, is there any merit to a “no lynch” here? Get us to an odd number? Of course, I guess the vig shot would accomplish that too...
The EFHW lynch feels wrong to me. No one is coming to her defense. On the other hand, it has sort of stalled out here at L-2.
I think if EFHW's telling the truth, we want to use the vig shot rather than no-lynch to fix the parity. If she's lying it may be difficult for her to explain the lack of a second kill.
Difficult like "oh I must have gotten roleblocked, which is the excuse I literally breadcrumbed I would use":
scum can't stop all of them and they'll probably prioritize stopping me.
Maybe. Worst case we get the information "Either EFHW is scum or scum used some kind of blocking ability on her". Regardless I think we should look elsewhere for Today's lynch.
You mean like, the information we already have because EFHW claimed to have been blocked last night?
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You mean like, the information we already have because EFHW claimed to have been blocked last night?
Ah I guess I missed that.
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vote: faust. Holding up the game
What? How?
I asked you to reconsider massclaim. You posted without responding. Also, you are sitting on my stagnant L-3 wagon without doing anything useful.
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Everyone on the wagon, are you confident enough to risk losing the game if you’re wrong? If so, why?
Yes, because A) it's not a big risk B) if there are 4 scum, it's closed to guaranteed there they weren't all on MiX, so that makes an EFHW lynch look better C) Noone that I think is scummy supports an EFHW lynch.
Only 2 people besides you support my lynch according to the vote count. You are using uncertain reads on two other people to confirm your also uncertain read on me? Are they the only two towny people in your opinion?
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@EFHW, why'd you target those two in particular?
When will we see the posts of mine you thought were scummy? You still haven't addressed my question about how my reaction to votes on you was scummy.
When my furnace works again and it isn't Halloween. I already addressed the second half of this and apologized for how unclear it was when I originally posted it.
I didn't understand how that clarified things. Still don't.
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vote: faust. Holding up the game
What? How?
I asked you to reconsider massclaim. You posted without responding. Also, you are sitting on my stagnant L-3 wagon without doing anything useful.
I thought that was more a question to everyone rather than me. I think I made my stance clear before and if you think that I will reconsider just because my top scumread asks nicely then I don't know what to tell you.
I have done plenty of useful things already, I made your wagon a thing and now I am continuing to push the main wagon. That you single me out as "holding up the game" when there are plenty of people out there who have done nothing beyond voicing vague concerns about your wagon and failed to take any meaningful action is ridiculous and a sign of desperation.
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If we are at MiLo, is there any merit to a “no lynch” here? Get us to an odd number? Of course, I guess the vig shot would accomplish that too...
The EFHW lynch feels wrong to me. No one is coming to her defense. On the other hand, it has sort of stalled out here at L-2.
I think if EFHW's telling the truth, we want to use the vig shot rather than no-lynch to fix the parity. If she's lying it may be difficult for her to explain the lack of a second kill.
Difficult like "oh I must have gotten roleblocked, which is the excuse I literally breadcrumbed I would use":
scum can't stop all of them and they'll probably prioritize stopping me.
How do you explain my correct result on gkrieg?
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If we are at MiLo, is there any merit to a “no lynch” here? Get us to an odd number? Of course, I guess the vig shot would accomplish that too...
The EFHW lynch feels wrong to me. No one is coming to her defense. On the other hand, it has sort of stalled out here at L-2.
I think if EFHW's telling the truth, we want to use the vig shot rather than no-lynch to fix the parity. If she's lying it may be difficult for her to explain the lack of a second kill.
Difficult like "oh I must have gotten roleblocked, which is the excuse I literally breadcrumbed I would use":
scum can't stop all of them and they'll probably prioritize stopping me.
How do you explain my correct result on gkrieg?
I assume scum has an investigative power. Shocker.
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vote: faust. Holding up the game
What? How?
I asked you to reconsider massclaim. You posted without responding. Also, you are sitting on my stagnant L-3 wagon without doing anything useful.
I thought that was more a question to everyone rather than me. I think I made my stance clear before and if you think that I will reconsider just because my top scumread asks nicely then I don't know what to tell you.
I have done plenty of useful things already, I made your wagon a thing and now I am continuing to push the main wagon. That you single me out as "holding up the game" when there are plenty of people out there who have done nothing beyond voicing vague concerns about your wagon and failed to take any meaningful action is ridiculous and a sign of desperation.
Everyone includes you, and you have not been pushing my wagon except in response to questions. Otherwise you seem content for things to languish.
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Everyone on the wagon, are you confident enough to risk losing the game if you’re wrong? If so, why?
Yes, because A) it's not a big risk B) if there are 4 scum, it's closed to guaranteed there they weren't all on MiX, so that makes an EFHW lynch look better C) Noone that I think is scummy supports an EFHW lynch.
Only 2 people besides you support my lynch according to the vote count. You are using uncertain reads on two other people to confirm your also uncertain read on me? Are they the only two towny people in your opinion?
I have seen this post but I choose to not respond.
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Anybody down for a joth or Jimmmm vote? I'd still be happy with an EFHW vote but those two are looking more and more appealing with every post.
i know you aren't asking me, but they seem towny.
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Everyone on the wagon, are you confident enough to risk losing the game if you’re wrong? If so, why?
Yes, because A) it's not a big risk B) if there are 4 scum, it's closed to guaranteed there they weren't all on MiX, so that makes an EFHW lynch look better C) Noone that I think is scummy supports an EFHW lynch.
Only 2 people besides you support my lynch according to the vote count. You are using uncertain reads on two other people to confirm your also uncertain read on me? Are they the only two towny people in your opinion?
I have seen this post but I choose to not respond.
Thank you for the acknowledgement.
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Everyone includes you, and you have not been pushing my wagon except in response to questions. Otherwise you seem content for things to languish.
I don't see anything useful coming out of this discussion, so I'll end it here. You're of course free to campaign against me to your heart's content, but I doubt "faust is the reason this game isn't moving forward" is going to catch on.
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Everyone includes you, and you have not been pushing my wagon except in response to questions. Otherwise you seem content for things to languish.
I don't see anything useful coming out of this discussion, so I'll end it here. You're of course free to campaign against me to your heart's content, but I doubt "faust is the reason this game isn't moving forward" is going to catch on.
How do you explain nothing happening? People are following your lead.
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Yeah, I back what Faust said. It would be 0% difficult
Could you answer my question about the basis of your scumread?
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Eddie, what is your opinion on massclaim?
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Everyone includes you, and you have not been pushing my wagon except in response to questions. Otherwise you seem content for things to languish.
I don't see anything useful coming out of this discussion, so I'll end it here. You're of course free to campaign against me to your heart's content, but I doubt "faust is the reason this game isn't moving forward" is going to catch on.
How do you explain nothing happening? People are following your lead.
I mean, there's multiple reasons. Maybe scum are just busy and don't have time for the game. Maybe scum are waiting for town to come up with an alternative wagon because they don't want to be seen scrambling for alternatives.
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Eddie, what is your opinion on massclaim?
I feel like we have enough information to lynch without one.
Probably.
Maybe.
The issue I am having is that I trust all of the people you distrust, and distrust all of the people you trust.
It is very possible I have been bamboozled by the people close to me, and part of me wants to random-lynch one of them for fun, but I think Jimmm/You are my gut scum reads.
So maybe you can vote Jimmm and hope for the best? I dunno.
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Eddie, what is your opinion on massclaim?
I'm against
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Request prod on gkrieg
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I’m going to do a re-read today (I’m off work) looking especially at EFHW, Jimmm, and faust. Then I will vote for one of them.
I’m kind of not super-surprised EFHW’s wagon has stalled
out if she IS scum, and I think it might be my fault. I have been yelling at people for hammering, now everyone is spooked to take someone to L-2.
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I’m only halfway through my re-read, but you know what?
Vote: raerae
I spent all of yesterday arguing that raerae and shraeye were scum. That’s like all we talked about for most of the day. Yet somehow we ended up lynching DatSwan, the only person who agreed with me on that case.
And then guess who got nightkilled? Galzria, the other person who expressed some support for me and Swan’s case.
I think, based on this re-read, the scum team is shraeye, raerae, and faust and they have cooked up this EFHW thing to steer us away from getting back to my case from yesterday. I could be persuaded to vote either of the others as well.
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Sorry, behind again. I was mid-way through catching up when the site went down. At this stage the case on raerae seems a bit of a stretch to me but I'll try to look into it more tomorrow night.
Did you do this, Jim? Any thoughts?
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Sorry, behind again. I was mid-way through catching up when the site went down. At this stage the case on raerae seems a bit of a stretch to me but I'll try to look into it more tomorrow night.
Did you do this, Jim? Any thoughts?
Wait I see you did. You meant real-life night.
Listen y’all, I’m gonna stop posting until I’m all done rereading.
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Alright, got through the end of yesterday and I’m stopping there. This is what makes sense to me.
I will say, EFHW also participated in the dismissing of and trying to move on from my case yesterday.
After reread, I’m finding faust and raerae especially scummy. Shraeye notsomuch, he’s only guilty by association. If it weren’t for the fact that faust and raerae were on EFHW today (ie looking only at yesterday) I would have her pegged as their
Team mate.
But all in all I think we’ve been letting raerae and faust drive the bus of this game too long and I would instead like to see it run them over and that’s where I am.
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Also, FYI everyone, deadline is tomorrow
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Request prod on gkrieg
Sorry, paper deadline today at 5 eastern
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@Glooble, can you fix the link for the start of D2, please?
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Okay, I'll try to make this as succinct as possible.
EFHW's reaction to the case on me is mostly directed at joth but occasionally she's responding to DatSwan's arguments as well. She starts out not seeming to understand it/sort of defending me. (I am trimming the hell out of posts to get to the meat of it and so this isn't enormous, fair warning.)
Isn't he arguing that raerae and Shraeye are both scum?
I don't think raerae seems panicked in her posts at eod. There's a hint that she knows Shraeye is town, but that doesn't fit with protecting Shraeye narrative. More likely she has a gut townread on Shraeye despite her campaign that he is scum.
But if Shraeye's town and raerae is scum, why would she be upset that Shraeye might get lynched?
She votes joth here:
@joth, you gave MiX similar advice - only shoot if >50% sure. But then you gave him permission not to take it. I don't read raerae as panicking at all.
vote: joth
But unvotes here because she thought DS brought up the idea originally? This is unclear to me and doesn't seem to follow the rest of her reasoning.
Vote: joth
Why joth over DatSwan when they're basically making the same argument?
This.
Also, you prefer Swan. Also 2x, Rae, vote Swan with me.
Why?
I don't have a good answer for this. I was under the impression that DatSwan initiated the idea, but I see that is not true. I'll unvote again, since things are so murky.
And then this is just out of left field. She goes from semi-defending me to voting for the person pushing my lynch, to agreeing I should be the lynch even though up to this point she'd disagreed with the case?
raerae is a good lynch target today because of that contradiction in her attitude towards Shraeye. I can see scum jumping on that. Also town would have questions. I'm am befuddled why both joth and DatSwan think the scum!raerae, town!shraeye theory makes sense.
After that we fight a bit about what terminology was used when, she unvotes, and moves on.
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Alright, now I see where you are coming from. When I said you were a good lynch target that did not mean I wanted to lynch you. It meant people looking for lynches would use eod to make an argument against you.
I was finding joth scummy in part because I thought he had opportunistically latched onto DatSwan's idea to bolster an otherwise not great case. But then it turned out he had brought the idea up first.
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Alright, now I see where you are coming from. When I said you were a good lynch target that did not mean I wanted to lynch you. It meant people looking for lynches would use eod to make an argument against you.
I was finding joth scummy in part because I thought he had opportunistically latched onto DatSwan's idea to bolster an otherwise not great case. But then it turned out he had brought the idea up first.
When you talk about mass claiming, how much information are you thinking? Race/role/mana/whatever other info we have or just a selection from those options?
In your perfect world (clearly one where you're a viable lynch contestant isn't it) when would you use your vig powers?
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I think it's pretty much all or nothing re: claims.
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I can't really speculate about when I would use the vig.
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@Glooble, can you fix the link for the start of D2, please?
Fixed, and added Day 3. Unfortunately can’t do a vote count right now.
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Request prods on Awaclus and LaLight
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We're heading closer to no lynch. I don't really know what to do, I'm still on the biggest wagon and I haven't seen any reason to move elsewhere. We now have two other, terrible wagons. I really need to hear from gkrieg soon, luckily it seem his deadline is only an hour away.
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vote: Lalight
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Vote: LaLight
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Well that's better than what alternatives we currently have.
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Well that's better than what alternatives we currently have.
Tell me why.
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Well that's better than what alternatives we currently have.
Tell me why.
Alternatives as in alternatives to EFHW. Before the LaLight votes the people with more than one vote other than EFHW were you and me. Do I need to explain why that wasn't desirable?
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Well that's better than what alternatives we currently have.
Tell me why.
Alternatives as in alternatives to EFHW. Before the LaLight votes the people with more than one vote other than EFHW were you and me. Do I need to explain why that wasn't desirable?
Naw, I just didn't realize the other wagons. Do you think LL is a better lunch or just that EFHW won't happen?
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Well that's better than what alternatives we currently have.
Tell me why.
Alternatives as in alternatives to EFHW. Before the LaLight votes the people with more than one vote other than EFHW were you and me. Do I need to explain why that wasn't desirable?
Naw, I just didn't realize the other wagons. Do you think LL is a better lunch or just that EFHW won't happen?
I think EFHW is the better lynch, but it's good to have an alternative wagon that isn't garbage.
I reread some LaLight and in the light of that am not terribly excited about that wagon. I'm also noticing that there is a multitude of players who did not at all discuss their actual read on EFHW. Like gkrieg obviously, but also LaLight never said anything and I don't think joth made any definitive statement either. I believe that there is still definite chance that we can get an EFHW lynch, but it is really crucial that gkrieg finally shows up.
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vote: EFHW
I go back and forth with my opinion on her, but now I just think she is scum, and if we're in MyLo she just picked me as an easy mislynch Target and was pushing for a lot of this day, just because some people were expressing scumread on me and no one really expressed a town read, so why not try this. Easier than any other player, right
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vote: EFHW
I go back and forth with my opinion on her, but now I just think she is scum, and if we're in MyLo she just picked me as an easy mislynch Target and was pushing for a lot of this day, just because some people were expressing scumread on me and no one really expressed a town read, so why not try this. Easier than any other player, right
This seems like OMGUS to me.
Vote: LaLight
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That’s a bit disingenuous, we are approaching deadline, I think getting on a competitive wagon is fine.
Voting for me after I voted for him, however, is what you describe...
I still wanna lynch Jimmm.
How many votes does EFHW have? I almost voted but now I am concerned about hammering.
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How many votes does EFHW have? I almost voted but now I am concerned about hammering.
It should be L-2. me, shraeye, raerae, LaLight.
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That’s a bit disingenuous, we are approaching deadline, I think getting on a competitive wagon is fine.
It's not the fact that he voted for her, it's how he tried to justify it. The reason given seems to be just "She's trying to lynch me".
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Sorry I’ve been an inattentive mod. My parents are in town and I’ve been busy. I’ll try and get a vote count up before I go to bed.
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Sorry I’ve been an inattentive mod. My parents are in town and I’ve been busy. I’ll try and get a vote count up before I go to bed.
Are they really parents or they haven't offered to help? I'm moving my vote to them.
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Sorry I’ve been an inattentive mod. My parents are in town and I’ve been busy. I’ll try and get a vote count up before I go to bed.
Are they really parents IF they haven't offered to help? I'm moving my vote to them.
The joke gets better when you have to correct it, right?
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Vote Count 3.3
raerae (1): joth
EFHW (4): faust, shraeye, raerae, LaLight
Jimmmmmm (1): UncleEurope
LaLight (3): EFHW, Awaclus, Jimmmm
Not voting (1): gkrieg
With 10 alive, it takes 6 to lynch. Day 3 will end at 5:30 on Saturday, November 2nd.
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vote: EFHW
I go back and forth with my opinion on her, but now I just think she is scum, and if we're in MyLo she just picked me as an easy mislynch Target and was pushing for a lot of this day, just because some people were expressing scumread on me and no one really expressed a town read, so why not try this. Easier than any other player, right
I've been consistently suspecting you since Day 2. Why do you think you are an easy mislynch?
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Awaclus
-2
jotheonah
+5
faust
+9
UncleEurope
-6
gkrieg
+7
raerae
+8
Jimmm
-6
EFHW
-11
LaLight
-4
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I'm buying a little bit of what LaLight is selling here. He does seem like the easiest alternative to EFHW.
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Request prod on gkrieg
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Hey gkrieg; vote for EFHW, it's a grrrrreeeeat idea!!
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What’s the cases in LaLight and EFHW?
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Request prod on gkrieg
He checked in after you posted this so I know he’s reading the thread.
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Faust seems to be more worried about the game over scum hunting. As in more worried about deadlines and people voting etc
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Ugh I don’t have many town reads which makes sheeping hard
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I don’t feel great about faust. EFHW doesn’t seem scummy to me this game
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Sorry reading on phone so no good quote walls like normal gkrieg
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There really haven’t been many good votes to analyze either
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I think the EFHW wagon is full of scumsters. Although I’m not sure LaLight is the scummiest there.
I think shraeye is scummier, but vote: LaLight
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Faust seems to be more worried about the game over scum hunting. As in more worried about deadlines and people voting etc
I have a good scumread. What I don't have is people making meaningful contributions.
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There really haven’t been many good votes to analyze either
Oh look, you even found the problem yourself.
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I think the EFHW wagon is full of scumsters. Although I’m not sure LaLight is the scummiest there.
I think shraeye is scummier, but vote: LaLight
I'd be ok with Shraeye. I think joth would be, too.
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What’s the cases in LaLight and EFHW?
It hard to imagine that all scum were on the MiX wagon, and among the off-wagon people we have you, me, Eddie and EFHW. I believe your claim for the most part, and Eddie I also read as town, so there's some PoE right here.
EFHW also did some strange third party hunting on D2, for what that's worth.
I mostly voted her today to get reactions. It seems that all the other people I find scummy are pushing back against the lynch, though I suppose you read things differently if shraeye is your top scumread.
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I think the EFHW wagon is full of scumsters. Although I’m not sure LaLight is the scummiest there.
I think shraeye is scummier, but vote: LaLight
I'd be ok with Shraeye. I think joth would be, too.
I'm onboard.
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vote: Shraeye
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Vote: shraeye
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No. Do not do that.
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Vote: shraeye
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No. Do not do that.
Why not?
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Vote: shraeye
No, I was counting on you!
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No. Do not do that.
Why not?
Because it's impulsive and a bad idea.
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And not a single one of you has given a reason for it.
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And not a single one of you has given a reason for it.
Here are two reasons: It's not impulsive and it's a great idea.
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And not a single one of you has given a reason for it.
Here are two reasons: It's not impulsive and it's a great idea.
So you swoop in on the last few hours of the day and tell me you've thought this through and have a great argument for it and can totally get all of town on board with your brilliant idea? This is trying to avoid an EFHW lynch, plain and simple.
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No. Do not do that.
Why not?
Because it's impulsive and a bad idea.
I've been considering Shraeye off and on. He quickhammered MiX, he is tunneling me (with no explanation despite two requests), he definitively stated that you must be scum and then completely dropped it, he's against mass claim despite our total floundering about trying to find scum, and he has contributed nothing to scum hunting. You yourself claimed he was scum for all of day 1. What changed your mind?
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No. Do not do that.
Why not?
Because it's impulsive and a bad idea.
I've been considering Shraeye off and on. He quickhammered MiX, he is tunneling me (with no explanation despite two requests), he definitively stated that you must be scum and then completely dropped it, he's against mass claim despite our total floundering about trying to find scum, and he has contributed nothing to scum hunting. You yourself claimed he was scum for all of day 1. What changed your mind?
You're fishing for a claim and that's not happening.
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No. Do not do that.
Why not?
Because it's impulsive and a bad idea.
I've been considering Shraeye off and on. He quickhammered MiX, he is tunneling me (with no explanation despite two requests), he definitively stated that you must be scum and then completely dropped it, he's against mass claim despite our total floundering about trying to find scum, and he has contributed nothing to scum hunting. You yourself claimed he was scum for all of day 1. What changed your mind?
You're fishing for a claim and that's not happening.
No, I'm trying to help town win the game. I realize that my most recent scum game has very likely eroded my ability to be perceived as town no matter what I do, but I'm trying anyway.
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That explanation doesn't pan out, actually. So can someone make a case on me based on something other than I didn't vote MiX? I'm 100% on reading MiX, by the way.
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That explanation doesn't pan out, actually.
I love that you admit that your explanation of "I'm trying to help town win the game" doesn't pan out. At least that's the way I choose to interpret this.
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That explanation doesn't pan out, actually.
I love that you admit that your explanation of "I'm trying to help town win the game" doesn't pan out. At least that's the way I choose to interpret this.
Creative!
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Right.
EFHWs defense: make a case on me that doesn't involve Mixs wagon.
EFHWs attack on shraeye: he hammered Mix (I thought that you wanted to look past Mix?) and he's tunnelled EFHW (patently false)
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Also,
EFHWs lynch is hard, now feeling impossible.
Support for LaLight and shraeye lynch seemed to instantly appear.
In a scum-filled town, you gotta pause and ask yourself what's the likely explanation.
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Idk if I’m going to be back before deadline, so
Vote: shraeye
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Also,
EFHWs lynch is hard, now feeling impossible.
Support for LaLight and shraeye lynch seemed to instantly appear.
In a scum-filled town, you gotta pause and ask yourself what's the likely explanation.
Actually this is a good point. No way town!EFHW is this hard to lynch.
Vote: EFHW
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Vote Count 3.4
EFHW (5): faust, shraeye, raerae, LaLight, joth
Jimmmmmm (1): UncleEurope
Shraeye (3): EFHW, Jimmmm, Awaclus
Not voting (1): gkrieg
With 10 alive, it takes 6 to lynch. Day 3 will end at 5:30 on Saturday, November 2nd. That’s in an hour and a half.
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Also,
EFHWs lynch is hard, now feeling impossible.
Support for LaLight and shraeye lynch seemed to instantly appear.
In a scum-filled town, you gotta pause and ask yourself what's the likely explanation.
Actually this is a good point. No way town!EFHW is this hard to lynch.
Vote: EFHW
But you're wrong.
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Right.
EFHWs defense: make a case on me that doesn't involve Mixs wagon.
EFHWs attack on shraeye: he hammered Mix (I thought that you wanted to look past Mix?) and he's tunnelled EFHW (patently false)
I made 5 points against you. You've only mentioned two and presented arguments against zero.
-
Should I end it?
Should we move on?
-
Should I end it?
Should we move on?
Kill it.
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Yes
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I approve.
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8m left... can anyone hammer?
If I switch to shraeye can we make that happen? Is no lynch here ok?
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Vote: EFHW
Forgot about this.
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If EFHW is town, it would be nice if she could confirm my future claim without revealing what it's going to be. If she's telling the truth, there should be a thing.
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Flavor to be added later.
Final Vote Count
EFHW (6): faust, shraeye, raerae, LaLight, joth, UncleEurope
Shraeye (3): EFHW, Jimmmm, Awaclus
Not voting (1): gkrieg
With 10 alive, it took 6 to lynch. Twilight begins now and is going to go long.
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If EFHW is town, it would be nice if she could confirm my future claim without revealing what it's going to be. If she's telling the truth, there should be a thing.
If she's telling the truth about what? About being town?
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I'm town. I don't know what you mean, Awaclus.
At least I don't have to decide who to vig.
Oh, at the end of N1 I was given another shot of my power. Don't know how or why. In case the info is helpful...
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”Whoever killed Jace,” said Ral Zarse, “Must have been someone who was against Ravnica. Against technology. Against Progress.”
“What about this one?” said Teferi. “I’ve seen her performing rituals on plants. She seems like someone who might hate this city.”
“I’m just trying to commune with the mana of the plane!” cried Nissa. She looked down and focused hard, and the small trees in the square and the cobblestones began to rise up to defend her. The assembled planeswalkers all started slinging spells. The rising elementals couldn’t block enough.
EFHW has been lynched. She was Nissa Revane, the Gatewatch-Aligned Modified Motion Detector/ 1-shot Vigilante. Night 3 begins now and will end at 9:00 pm on Monday, November 4th. Night actions are due at 9am on Monday, November 4th.
Thread locked.
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Start of Day is going to be delayed until tomorrow morning. Sorry.
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It seems the Greatest Thief in the Multiverse has pulled off his last heist. You find his body on the street. His spark, it seems, has been stolen.
Raerae has died. She was Dack Fayden, the (Gatewatch-aligned) Greatest Thief in the Multiverse.
Day 4 begins now, and will end at 7:30 am on Tuesday, November 12th.
Vote Count 4.0
Not voting ( 8 ): Awaclus, jotheonah, faust, UncleEurope, gkrieg, shraeye, Jimmm, LaLight.
With 8 alive, it takes 5 to lynch.
Thread unlocked.
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Now is a good time for a massclaim. Eddie should determine an order.
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I would like to say first and foremost that something happened to someone last night. Do not reveal that element under any cercumstances. It is possible (very likely) that a member of the mafia knows what that element is and will encourage your demise.
Hinting is equitable to a full reveal for this.
Don’t do it.
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So, we aren't allowed to say anything at all about anything that happened last night?
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So, we aren't allowed to say anything at all about anything that happened last night?
I think Eddie is overly vague here. Basically the deal is, if you've received an item last night it would be beneficial to not reveal that fact. I mean, we've seen from your end of Day performance what happens when things are phrased too vaguely.
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So, we aren't allowed to say anything at all about anything that happened last night?
I think Eddie is overly vague here. Basically the deal is, if you've received an item last night it would be beneficial to not reveal that fact. I mean, we've seen from your end of Day performance what happens when things are phrased too vaguely.
Why do you know what Eddie is talking about?
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So, we aren't allowed to say anything at all about anything that happened last night?
I think Eddie is overly vague here. Basically the deal is, if you've received an item last night it would be beneficial to not reveal that fact. I mean, we've seen from your end of Day performance what happens when things are phrased too vaguely.
Why do you know what Eddie is talking about?
You'll find out when we do the massclaim.
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So where is everyone?
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I'm down for massclaim, Im low-key trying to figure out best order.
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Awaclus
-5
jotheonah
+6
faust
+6
UncleEurope
-2
gkrieg
+9
Jimmm
-9
LaLight
-6
Updated numbers, not quite my desired order though. I'd like
LaLight, Jimmmm, Awaclus, Faust, joth, Uncle, shraeye, gkrieg
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But before we even get there, let's discuss if we need it...assuming people have opinions they want to say
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We do need it.
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I think we gotta at this point.
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Updated numbers, not quite my desired order though. I'd like
LaLight, Jimmmm, Awaclus, Faust, joth, Uncle, shraeye, gkrieg
I can live with this.
The important thing is to get going so we'll have some time left after the claims to figure stuff out.
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We will use shraeye’s order, then.
Begin.
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Here
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Request prods on LaLight, Jimmmmm
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Request prods on LaLight, Jimmmmm
Already sent.
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Sorry, I got really caught up into stuff and I think I overvalued my free time, not gonna happen again.
I am Tamiyo, one-shot roleblocker using Green Mana, N1 I rb'ed DatSwan.
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Request prods on LaLight, Jimmmmm
I was waiting for my turn to claim.
I am a Watcher. I watched raerae last Night, but sadly saw no one. I would like to withhold my other results until more people have claimed.
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I'm Ajani Goldmane, Recharger. It means that each night, I can target a player and if they have a 1-shot ability, they receive a second shot of it. I can't target the same player more than once per game.
I targeted EFHW, Galzria and Jimmmmmmm in this order.
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Change of plans:
Joth
Shraeye
Jimmy finish claim
Gkrieg
Faust
Me
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Change of plans:
Joth
Shraeye
Jimmy finish claim
Gkrieg
Faust
Me
Is there a reason you get to direct everyone?
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Yeah, I’m town.
Semi-confirmable by other players that aren’t me.
This is the smartest play because I can keep other people honest.
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Yeah, I’m town.
Semi-confirmable by other players that aren’t me.
This is the smartest play because I can keep other people honest.
Can you direct me to where this was semi-confirmed please?
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LaLight, what compelled you to use your power N1?
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Yeah, I’m town.
Semi-confirmable by other players that aren’t me.
This is the smartest play because I can keep other people honest.
Can you direct me to where this was semi-confirmed please?
It wasn’t publicly semi-confirmed.
Sorry that it’s hapoening like this, but also not sorry in the slightest.
New order is a go.
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Yeah, I’m town.
Semi-confirmable by other players that aren’t me.
This is the smartest play because I can keep other people honest.
Can you direct me to where this was semi-confirmed please?
It wasn’t publicly semi-confirmed.
Sorry that it’s hapoening like this, but also not sorry in the slightest.
New order is a go.
I assume all of this will be revealed once it's your/their turn to claim?
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I definitely don’t plan on keeping my townieness a secret.
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it's suspicious as hell to me that Eddie is changing the order right before faust's turn to claim and moving faust from up next to very last. I am happy to claim, but I'm not going to enable this malarkey. The point of setting an order at the beginning is to follow it. faust, you're up.
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Nope, Faust is not up.
Joth is up.
Joth is about to be lynched, too.
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it's suspicious as hell to me that Eddie is changing the order right before faust's turn to claim and moving faust from up next to very last. I am happy to claim, but I'm not going to enable this malarkey. The point of setting an order at the beginning is to follow it. faust, you're up.
No, you're up.
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I don't think a big fight about this is worth it, but I will need some time to type out my claim and I'm going to sleep now.
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The rest of the order was
Faust
Joth
Uncle
Shraeye
Gkrieg
I'm not down with Uncle's new order but will agree to
(Joth
Faust)...plus or minus whatever
(Shraeye, full Jimmmm), again, swap is fine
(Uncle
gkrieg)...same gig
But also, can somebody reexplain me what a watcher does? In theory Jimm should have seen somebody visit raerae? Or would he have seen if raerae did an action? I never know what the difference between all those styles of roles are.
And Is it clear what a "modified motion detector" is?
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And we'll decide about joth when we decide about joth. I don't need this dark foreboding stuff.
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I also don’t like the order change
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But also, can somebody reexplain me what a watcher does? In theory Jimm should have seen somebody visit raerae? Or would he have seen if raerae did an action? I never know what the difference between all those styles of roles are.
I should have seen whoever killed her. My result was that no one targeted her (rather than No Result), indicating that it was a Ninja kill (rather than that I was Roleblocked).
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I suppose it also could have been some kind of redirecting.
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I really don’t care that you all hate it.
Once I claim you will wish my order is what happened. (At least I am not seeing any possible situation where is isn’t the best)
It will become abundantly clear as to why my order is better on my claim as well.
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LaLight, what compelled you to use your power N1?
Firstly, I thought that it may work as a quasicop, if I block a nightkill, secondly I thought I will be lynched pretty soon based on my activity level and didn't want my shot to go to waste
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I really don’t care that you all hate it.
Once I claim you will wish my order is what happened. (At least I am not seeing any possible situation where is isn’t the best)
It will become abundantly clear as to why my order is better on my claim as well.
It seems that you're basing this on info you plan on claiming. But you also ok'ed the initial order. So I'm confused why it's now the worst. Can you explain the change?
I'm not too chuffed about changing order, just that we're doing it after everything seemed to be agreed to.
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Wait just realized chuffed probably means the opposite of what I meant. Did I mean plussed? Anyway, still seems mildly annoying, but not massively annoying
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Maybe my claim will convince people to change it up? We'll see.
I am Ugin, a Thiefproof 1-shot Neighborizer.
N1, I neighborized Eddie, with the intent of using the Neighborhood to figure out his alignment. Suffice to say that stuff happened and now Eddie is my top townread based on that stuff, which has to do with Eddie's role. I am not going to reveal anything that relates to Eddie's powers just yet, I can come back and claim more/confirm stuff once we're through.
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I am Vivien Reed, a green mana-using, Gatewatch-aligned Planeswalker from the plane of Skalla.
Vivien’s thing is that she has a magical bow called the arcbow and all the arrows contain the souls of extinct animals from her now-dead plane.
I’m a Jack of All Trades. I had three different arrows (1-shot powers) that correspond to different animals.
- 1-shot Roleblock (Boa Constrictor)
- 1-shot Doctor (Otter)
- 1-shot Mana Cop (Bird of Paradise)
Night 1 I investigated raerae and found that she uses red and blue mana
Night 2 I doctored Galz. I assume either I was roleblocked or scum used a strongman kill
Night 3 I roleblocked raerae, who at that point I was pretty sure was scum (oops)
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Night 3 I roleblocked raerae, who at that point I was pretty sure was scum (oops)
So you're contradicting Jimmmmm's claim?
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Also why have a town role that is stronger than another town role but basically the same?
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yeah, joth's role is strictly better than mine
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yeah, joth's role is strictly better than mine
well I think your role is suspiciously weak compared to other people's
Night 3 I roleblocked raerae, who at that point I was pretty sure was scum (oops)
So you're contradicting Jimmmmm's claim?
I'm claiming my role and night actions. My claim does seem to conflict with Jim's. Perhaps other claims will bring the discrepancy to light. Or perhaps Jimmm is lying.
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Also why have a town role that is stronger than another town role but basically the same?
It's not impossible for that to happen in a game design, especially themed ones like this. I mean, not the likeliest thing ever but I would be hesitant to jump to conclusions just on that basis.
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And Is it clear what a "modified motion detector" is?
No, it just means the role works in some nonstandard way. EFHW seemed to think that it was a normal Motion Detector... so I guess it's not a very pronounced change?
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It's not impossible for that to happen in a game design, especially themed ones like this.
It happens more often in games that have Vanilla Townies.
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shraeye is next. Just in case that needed spelling out.
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Busy day, free now.
I'm a bodyguard, Gideon Jura, human, Theros.
Protected Faust, Galz (failed obvs), Faust.
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Night 1: Galz, UncleEurope and shraeye targeted faust
Night 2: No one targeted gkrieg
Night 3: No one targeted raerae
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I'll probably be busy when it actually does come to my turn, but I am Nahiri, nemesis (could not win while pubby was alive, but then became gatewatch-aligned when he died) and a 1-shot jailkeeper. I am not going to share if I have the jailkeeper shot still or not.
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I am an inventor-boy.
I could give a variety of 1-shots to players once per night.
I gave 2 of them to Faust for the first two nights and the third one to one of you guys.
Jimm predicting I handed it to Faust N1 suggests to me that if Jimm is Evil, then so is Faust.
So there’s that.
I will let Faust tell you what I handed him, I guess.
Also, I almost want to put what item I threw out into the world to see if I was RB’d. If the person I handed it to didn’t receive an item...
That would be hugely informative.
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Also, I almost want to put what item I threw out into the world to see if I was RB’d. If the person I handed it to didn’t receive an item...
That would be hugely informative.
Maybe, but there is no way for us to learn that information that way. If someone didn't receive an item, they're not going to know they were the one who was supposed to receive it just because you say what item it would have been.
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Sorry, I meant to suggest that I just ask directly to the specific player and out who I gave it to.
But it is a negligible boon for us, I believe.
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I got an active 1-shot Bulletproof from Eddie N1. After our Neighborhood opened, he quickly claimed that and of course that gave me a massive townread on him. Then, Night 2, I decided to pass that 1-shot BP on to Galzria, unfortunately too late for him to use it. I also received my second item, a Tracker, that Night.
I tried to use the Tracker last Night (on joth), but I was blocked
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Here's what I am thinking:
1. We have 2 unexplained failings of Night action. I feel like it would be beneficial for gkrieg to clarify whether he JKed me or joth tonight, since it's very unlikely that scum can block 2 people, and if gkrieg didn't do that, that means that joth is scum.
2. joth/Jimmmmm don't make sense as a scumteam because they wouldn't confict each other's claims. So with the assumption that joth is scum, Jimmmmm would be town, but if gkrieg is responsible for the blocking it's less clear.
3. LaLight's claim is softer conflicting with joth's, to an extent where scum wouldn't do that either. They are also unlikely to be scum together.
So the scumteam would be either joth/Awaclus/shraeye or 3 or Jimmmmm/LaLight/Awaclus/shraeye. Barring further info from gkrieg, I think the best bet is lynching among Awaclus/shraeye, and of those I think that shraeye is decidedly scummier.
vote: shraeye
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Gideon, Saheeli, Nahiri and Ajani stand surrounded by their enemies, zombies on all sides of them - the last four planeswalkers on Ravnica. Nicol Bolas cackles and stares them down.
"Once I have your sparks," he screams, "I will have the true power of a god!"
With that, zombified God Eternal swings down and attacks each of the last Gatewatch members. Gideon tried to fend off Oketra, but tragically falls to an arrow. Saheeli sends a small flock of thopters and servos at Bontu, but the Crocodile god snaps them all out of the way and snaps her in half. Nahiri furiously tries to raise the cobblestones only to be beaten down by Rhonas. And Ajani leaps into the air, swinging his double axe wildly at Kefnet before finally falling to his doom.
Nicol Bolas absorbs all of their sparks, and turns to his lieutenants, Domri Rade, Dovin Baan, and Vraska.
"This planes is yours now," he says, "Or at least what's left of it. I go to conquer the multiverse!
The game is over. The scum team of faust, jotheonah, LaLight, and Jimmmmm wins flawlessly.
This game has been a big ol' pile of me messing up, so it's fitting it ends with me not realizing the town is actually endgamed. I'm sorry for dragging it out- I genuinely did think you guys had a chance after gkrieg kept faust from making shraeye hated. I didn't realize that even though scum didn't have the votes to autolynch, town also didn't have any remaining way of taking out a scum player. But now that faust has pointed it out to me, it seems mean to let it continue.
I apologize for any imbalance in the setup. Ironically, I was concerned I had made town too strong, but now I'm nearly certain I made them too weak. In my defense, there was a lot of bad luck, including an entire mechanic I came up with never being relevant. Also, scum did play extremely well.
That being said, I clearly wasn't ready to moderate a setup of this complexity by myself. While I have lots of RMM ideas still, I think the best thing for me to do is moderate a few premade setups and learn more about the fundamentals of the game.
Speccy link: https://www.quicktopic.com/52/H/439UUeZ63Qnjx
Scum QT: https://www.quicktopic.com/52/H/pVwJQrdchin
I hope people were able to have fun in spite of everything. People can share their own QTs at their discretion.
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DatSwan would have switched sides if faust neighborized him or if shraeye protected him. In retrospect, its a good thing that didn't happen, it would have ended the game very fast.
I had 5 items - lockets which recharged powers for either side but only in two specific colors of mana. This is why I told everyone what kind of mana their powers used. There were five events which would trigger a particular player receiving a locket. None of them happened this game! Including what I thought would be a freebie - the Dimir (blue/black) locket was supposed to go to the first player to get to L-1 without dying that day. But this freaking town never let anyone get there!
Other locket triggers were pubby using his power, EFHW using her vig shot, LaLight roleblocking raerae, and Datswan choosing a side.
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Sweeps ftw
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I apologize for any imbalance in the setup. Ironically, I was concerned I had made town too strong, but now I'm nearly certain I made them too weak. In my defense, there was a lot of bad luck, including an entire mechanic I came up with never being relevant. Also, scum did play extremely well.
Not sure. Town had a lot of powers that made them able to semi-confirm themselves, and extra kills. I do think that including a Survivor to a game with this many scum is a bad idea. (Survivors are arguably a bad idea a lot of the time) Scum got somewhat lucky, and town had an activity problem.
That being said, I clearly wasn't ready to moderate a setup of this complexity by myself. While I have lots of RMM ideas still, I think the best thing for me to do is moderate a few premade setups and learn more about the fundamentals of the game.
It may be worth it to just get another pair of eyes to look at your setup before starting out. It's easy to get lose sight of the bigger picture the more you refine your setup. If you want a more detailed critique of this setup, I can try to compile my thoughts.
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This neighborhood with Eddie was a lot of fun: https://www.quicktopic.com/52/H/MwHWDpUfEFep
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I don't have words for this game, so I'm gonna choose to say "screw Jimmmmm for not being active D1 enough for me to vig him" and...and yeah.
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Ironically, I was concerned I had made town too strong, but now I'm nearly certain I made them too weak.
Welcome to running a custom setup.
I think you did a good job. It was a fun game. Sorry got utterly botching my fakeclaim.
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I was actually Domri and I had a strongman kill (used on Galz) and a ninja kill (used on raerae)
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QT: https://www.quicktopic.com/52/H/pKb6wQV4LMHKQ
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What was pubby’s power?
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What was pubby’s power?
Doctor but it only worked on humans. Flavored as creating an Angel (like he created Avacyn.)
A bit of a stretch I know.
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It’s gonna take me a long time to stop being mad at MiX
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It’s gonna take me a long time to stop being mad at MiX
Same tbh
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Had a good time, but boy oh boy did I help sink town hard and fast.
https://www.quicktopic.com/52/H/j6SDAACqmA8uy
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I feel 2% justified in that I had scummy reads on LaLight and Jimmm, but utterly messed up on Faust & joth & mix & EFHW. Not a high point in my mafia career.
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I feel 2% justified in that I had scummy reads on LaLight and Jimmm, but utterly messed up on Faust & joth & mix & EFHW. Not a high point in my mafia career.
I love the final post in your QT - actually it was both! I was scum and 1-shot BP.
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My indignation about quickhammers was like 65% real, btw.
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I feel 2% justified in that I had scummy reads on LaLight and Jimmm, but utterly messed up on Faust & joth & mix & EFHW. Not a high point in my mafia career.
I love the final post in your QT - actually it was both! I was scum and 1-shot BP.
Why be wrong once when you can be wrong twice?!
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Good game all.
I feel 2% justified in that I had scummy reads on LaLight and Jimmm, but utterly messed up on Faust & joth & mix & EFHW. Not a high point in my mafia career.
I'd still like to know what happened to your read on raerae. Was it a fake scum read?
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I don't have words for this game, so I'm gonna choose to say "screw Jimmmmm for not being active D1 enough for me to vig him" and...and yeah.
Why do you require a certain level of activity to vig someone?
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I had the game virtually solved once EFHW died.
Too late, though.
I really just wanted Jimmmm to die days ago, but no one else was on board with that, and I figured out with 80% certainty that Faust has to have been evil after EFHW died. Which meant that Jimmm was a likely candidate for being evil as well.
I also would never have guessed 4 person mafia... Ever.
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That being said, I goofed us pretty hard.
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Good game all.
I feel 2% justified in that I had scummy reads on LaLight and Jimmm, but utterly messed up on Faust & joth & mix & EFHW. Not a high point in my mafia career.
I'd still like to know what happened to your read on raerae. Was it a fake scum read?
It disappeared when I reconsidered end of day, up to then my read was based on how she was interacting more differently than I expected. End of day brought out town rae
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I don't have words for this game, so I'm gonna choose to say "screw Jimmmmm for not being active D1 enough for me to vig him" and...and yeah.
Why do you require a certain level of activity to vig someone?
Just imagine if you were town. Then I vigged someone with no content, promised to make more content had shraeye not hammered and that was less fair than Didds, that didn't say they were VLA explicitely and pushed scummier things. Bah.
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I think 4 scum made it too hard to lynch scum. On the day I was lynched, all 6 town would have had to agree to get a scum lynch.
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What was gkrieg's move that almost saved the game?
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I think 4 scum made it too hard to lynch scum. On the day I was lynched, all 6 town would have had to agree to get a scum lynch.
You did have options to kill scum without lynching though. It might have been better if one of the scumteam had been a Traitor. However I feel that if scum had gotten lynched at some point, and the game gone on longer, it would have become pretty difficult for us to not get PoE'd.
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What was gkrieg's move that almost saved the game?
He jailkept Faust when Faust uses a power to make Shraeye hated.
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Thanks for the game, Glooble. I hope you will do more!
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MVP is probably faust? Sure. Faust.
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MVP is probably faust? Sure. Faust.
Support.
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MVP is probably faust? Sure. Faust.
Yeah I have the same enthusiasm at giving someone MVP as you. But yeah, faust.
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MVP is probably faust? Sure. Faust.
+1
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Yup