1. Yeah duh
2. When you would otherwise buy your first Duchy
1. Yeah duh
2. When you would otherwise buy your first Duchy
Is that literally all there is to this?
1. Yeah duh
2. When you would otherwise buy your first Duchy
Is that literally all there is to this?
No, but those are the answers to the questions.
Is there anything else we have to know about playing with Fleet besides "buy it instead of your first Duchy"?
It would have been a more interesting card if it costed 8 and gave +buy on the bonus turn or something.
The algorithm for it is pretty straightforward :(
It would have been a more interesting card if it costed 8 and gave +buy on the bonus turn or something.
The algorithm for it is pretty straightforward :(
At $5 it was a real question whether you'd have time to buy it.
It would have been a more interesting card if it costed 8 and gave +buy on the bonus turn or something.
The algorithm for it is pretty straightforward :(
At $5 it was a real question whether you'd have time to buy it.
I've played a four player game or two where I never gained Duchy because at 3 Provinces per player it doesn't always come to that point, and from a strong position Gold can "secure the win" more consistently. So I could see my gain% of Fleet falling below 100% for that reason.
But, in multiplayer, is it truly possible to buy a Duchy before a Fleet? I'm guessing still no, I can't imagine you'd not have "time to buy Fleet" but have time to buy Duchy. The obvious exception would be if the Duchies are going to pile out but that's a 4p phenomenon, not a 3p one, and head to head picking a format to favor with the design it seems 2p deserves the design considerations over 4p.
That reduces it to a Landmark/Baker-global-effect more so than a Project, approximating out to something like, "When each player buys his or her first Duchy this game he puts it on the Island Mat". Which might subtly influence buy sequencing for engines, probably, but I think you'd have to be pretty advanced, which you know hey this doesn't take up a kingdom slot and is not in the first 7 expansions so the boxes are checked for being the right place for that level of subtlety.
It would have been a more interesting card if it costed 8 and gave +buy on the bonus turn or something.
The algorithm for it is pretty straightforward :(
What's the algorithm? And also, I'm not getting why Fleet plays out much differently in 2 player vs 4 player games?
It would have been a more interesting card if it costed 8 and gave +buy on the bonus turn or something.
The algorithm for it is pretty straightforward :(
At $5 it was a real question whether you'd have time to buy it.
I've played a four player game or two where I never gained Duchy because at 3 Provinces per player it doesn't always come to that point, and from a strong position Gold can "secure the win" more consistently. So I could see my gain% of Fleet falling below 100% for that reason.
But, in multiplayer, is it truly possible to buy a Duchy before a Fleet? I'm guessing still no, I can't imagine you'd not have "time to buy Fleet" but have time to buy Duchy. The obvious exception would be if the Duchies are going to pile out but that's a 4p phenomenon, not a 3p one, and head to head picking a format to favor with the design it seems 2p deserves the design considerations over 4p.
That reduces it to a Landmark/Baker-global-effect more so than a Project, approximating out to something like, "When each player buys his or her first Duchy this game he puts it on the Island Mat". Which might subtly influence buy sequencing for engines, probably, but I think you'd have to be pretty advanced, which you know hey this doesn't take up a kingdom slot and is not in the first 7 expansions so the boxes are checked for being the right place for that level of subtlety.
Perhaps "have time to buy it" was the wrong way to word that.
First let me address your comment about 2-player deserving the design considerations over 4-player. Too bad! That's not the way it is and it's probably never going to be that way. Donald X. plays most of his Dominion test games with 4 or 5 players. I play most of mine with 3 or 4 players. Some other testers play primarily 2-player games, but that's not most games. We do take into account 2-player games for sure, and some cards might die because they suck too much in 2-player games or 4-player games, but 2-player doesn't get "design priority" over 4-player. That's been my perception. The good news is that for most things it doesn't matter. Most stuff plays well at different player counts. And a Project takes up less space than a Kingdom card, in a sense. So I think it's fine that this one Project is usually an automatic pickup in 2-player games.
As for actually buying it in multiplayer games, you seem to be assuming that you'll always be able to get a Duchy on your Fleet turn. That has not been my experience. Buying Fleet is a risk, and I have been burned before. I have regretted those turns where my Fleet was only worth 1 VP, wishing I'd had that Duchy. I think part of this is that you can't often build those mega engines in 4-player games. Part of it is that most players aren't experts and their turns dud more often. Non-experts get to have fun too. For them an $8 Fleet would never be worth it. At $5 it's a question.
I mistakenly thought the game was being designed for 3>2>4. If it's 4>5>3>2 then 5$ Fleet definitely makes all the sense.The goal has always been to support 2-4, and to get there I aim for the best balance at 3. It's more 3-4-2-5. I don't care about 6 other than including the components.