Dominion Strategy Forum
Archive => Archive => Dominion: Renaissance Previews => Topic started by: Mic Qsenoch on September 26, 2018, 02:12:35 pm
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I recruited discord to help make a list of:
Cards (and card-shaped things) which make Candlestick Maker and Ducat play differently:
Draw to X and related: Library, JoAT, Watchtower, Minion, Menagerie, Scholar, Tactician, Cursed Village, Diplomat
Action Thrones: TR, KC, Procession, Crown, Disciple, Ghost, Royal Carriage
Drawing/Playing Actions: Scrying Pool, City Quarter, Herald, Golem, Ghost, Wandering Minstrel, Prince, Imp, Conclave, Vassal, Library, Shanty Town
Actions Played/In-play/In-discard: Peddler, Conspirator, Leprechaun, Emporium, Enchantress, Scheme, Coin of the Realm, Champion (Diadem), Magic Lamp*, Walled Village, Inn
Tokens: Teacher, Lost Arts, Pathfinding, Seaway, Training, Ferry, Plan, Inheritance
Type check bonuses: Ironmonger, Ironworks, Sacrifice, Sculptor, Magpie, Vineyard, Transmute, Haunted Mirror
Action Gaining/Buying: University, Lurker, Stonemason, Quarry, Summon
Impersonation: BoM, Overlord, Necromancer
Landmarks: Keep, Arena, Colonnade, Obelisk, Orchard, Triumphal Arch, Defiled Shrine, Tomb
Action Trashing: Graverobber, Death Cart, Advance, Zombie Apprentice, Lurker
Variety: Fairgrounds, Museum, Gladiator, Menagerie, Harvest
Possession (because always Possession?)
Hexes: Locusts, Delusion
Butcher (easier to use CSM Coffers)
Ducat’s cool ability which also interacts with: Priest, Tomb, Market Square, Sewers, Watchtower
Treasure things: Terminal Draw (not listing all these), Stables, Venture, Bank, Earth’s Gift, Mandarin**, Storyteller, Black Market***, Catapult, Herbalist, Poor House, Forager, Hero, Tragic Hero, Alms, Crown, Crypt, Plaza, Haunted Woods (CSM can be dead in hand)
Can/Can’t trash Treasures: Counterfeit, Loan, Bandit, Noble Brigand (affects junking), Pirate Ship, Taxman, Mint, Mine, JoAT, Spice Merchant, Hermit, Pooka
Clarifications:
* Ducat favorer because you can play multiple Ducats (some after Lamp) and still activate.
** Ducat enables Mandarin/HoP golden deck.
*** Storyteller/Black Market require some additional interactions to make meaningful differences.
All the action leading to this treasure happened here:
https://docs.google.com/document/d/1EE3Jj3W_8-WuDXX4IM74sJxe9qpNbdkL7RtioH-IWv8/edit?usp=sharing
Feel free to add anything we missed.
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Not sure Crown belongs on this list.
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Not sure Crown belongs on this list.
The +2 actions from CSM differs from what you'd get with Ducat.
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Not sure Crown belongs on this list.
The +2 actions from CSM differs from what you'd get with Ducat.
Yeah. A hand of Crown+CM+Goons+Goons is better than Crown+Ducat+Goons+Goons by a lot.
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You missed Copper.
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One test I've been doing is, randomizing a kingdom, replacing the first two cards with CM and Ducat, and seeing how often you want Candlestick Maker at all.
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One test I've been doing is, randomizing a kingdom, replacing the first two cards with CM and Ducat, and seeing how often you want Candlestick Maker at all.
How often do you want Candlestick Maker at all?
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Not sure Crown belongs on this list.
The +2 actions from CSM differs from what you'd get with Ducat.
Ah yes of course!
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The cards in the "Variety" section do not really make them play differently though, they just make it so when both are in the kingdom, you are incentivized to get both. But since that holds for both Ducat and CSM, they won't play differently.
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The cards in the "Variety" section do not really make them play differently though, they just make it so when both are in the kingdom, you are incentivized to get both.
Menagerie plays differently because when you have multiple CSMs in hand you can play some to get rid of the duplicates.
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The cards in the "Variety" section do not really make them play differently though, they just make it so when both are in the kingdom, you are incentivized to get both.
Menagerie plays differently because when you have multiple CSMs in hand you can play some to get rid of the duplicates.
Yes, but Mengerie already makes an appearance in the "draw to X and related" section for that reason.
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One test I've been doing is, randomizing a kingdom, replacing the first two cards with CM and Ducat, and seeing how often you want Candlestick Maker at all.
How often do you want Candlestick Maker at all?
when it's the only buy, advance games, procession, Cursed Village
but yeah I am with you.
And while this thread is mildly interesting, it's not that relevant unless both are on the board as the above interactions would become clear in it's own board.
That said I'd go Ducat over CSM every time unless some board interaction swayed me. Can't be drawn dead, and can trash coppers.
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I see Watchtower is on the list, but only as a draw-to-X.
It seems to merit a special entry though, allowing you to thin coppers when you trash the Ducat you buy/gain.
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If I remember correctly, Mic didn't want anything related to the on-gain effect on the list, as this is the obvious thing that the two cards differ.
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If I remember correctly, Mic didn't want anything related to the on-gain effect on the list, as this is the obvious thing that the two cards differ.
Surely it goes in the section "Ducat’s cool ability which also interacts with: Priest, Tomb, Market Square"
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If I remember correctly, Mic didn't want anything related to the on-gain effect on the list, as this is the obvious thing that the two cards differ.
Surely it goes in the section "Ducat’s cool ability which also interacts with: Priest, Tomb, Market Square"
Yes. 8)