Dominion Strategy Forum

Miscellaneous => Forum Games => Mafia Game Threads => Topic started by: LaLight on April 11, 2017, 03:45:27 am

Title: M98: Русская Mafia (Game over! Town won!)
Post by: LaLight on April 11, 2017, 03:45:27 am
Welcome to M98: Русская Mafia by LaLight.

This game is for 11 players, and is classified as normal. It was designed by yuma as an open setup. This setup was played previously in M51 (http://forum.dominionstrategy.com/index.php?topic=11779.0)

Co-mod:

Sign ups are open. Rules to come.


1. Awaclus Lynched D1: VT
2. Robz888
3. The_Wine_Merchant Lynched D2: VT
4. schadd
5. Eevee Lynched D3: Roleblocking Traitor
6. gkrieg13 Killed N3: Town Detective
7. AndrewisFTTW Killed N2: VT
8. 2.71828..... Killed N3: Town Jailkeeper
9. faust Killed N4: Mafia Roleblocker
10. mcmcsalot Killed N1: Mafia Goon
11. kkrieg

Tags: Roadrunner7671, J Reggie, SpaceAnemone

The Rules:

The Golden Rule:
This is a game. Everyone who signs up to play must be considerate of each other, never get personal, and focus on having fun. Once the game starts, having signed up is a commitment: inactivity is just as inconsiderate as rude comments.


The Standard Rules:
1. No communication between players outside of the game thread or shared QTs at any time. This includes passing references, jokes, or cases in other games or threads, whether in context or not.
2. If the game thread is locked, do not post. If you are unsure if something is locked, ask the mod by PM.
3. Direct or verbatim quoting of mod-provided information is strictly forbidden. Paraphrasing is okay.
4. Actions with instructions that do not specify a game state will be resolved in the order they are received.
5. All night actions must be submitted within 24 hours of day ending.
6. Players must post once every 24 hours.
7. Do not edit or delete posts, ever. If you need to clarify or correct something, post again.
8. Invisible text, font size less than 10, and spoiler tags are not allowed.
9. Cryptography is not allowed.
10. The time between a lynch being reached and a flip being provided is called twilight. All players may continue posting during this time, including the lynched player.
11. Dead players may not post in thread or QT. A lynched player is not "dead" until a flip has been provided.
12. Personal multimedia, such as video or audio recordings, are not allowed in the game thread.

The Voting Rules:
1. Votes should be in this format: Vote: Playername. Unambigiuous nicknames are acceptable.
2. Unvotes should be in this format: unvote or Unvote: Playername.
3. Unvotes are not required if changing your vote from one player to another.
4. You may vote: no lynch.
5. Lynches occur when a simple majority (rounded up) of living players is reached. Once reached, a lynch cannot be undone.
6. Lynch rules vary by the number of players alive. With 10 or more players alive, the player with the most votes at the end of the day will be lynched. Ties are broken by coin flip. With nine or less players alive, if a majority lynch is not reached by the deadline, no lynch occurs.

The Rest:
1. Bold, purple text is reserved for the Mod. Players may not use it.
2. If you have an issue or problem with the game, please PM the Mod. Do not post complaints in the game thread.
3. Mods make mistakes - please point them out gently. If they can be corrected, they will. If irreversible, they will stand as final to be commiserated over after the game.
4. If a mod error disadvantages one faction greatly, the game may be called off.
5. Ask all questions and make all requests directly to the Mod via PM. Questions deemed as "universal" (defined as questions for which the answers should be available to all players) will be requested to be re-posted in the Game Thread and answered there.
7. Prods will be issued by request after 24 hours of inactivity. Players are subject to replacement or modkill upon the third prod request.
8. All rule violations will be dealt with according to their severity, as determined by the mod.

Deadlines:
1. Days will last 7 IRL days.
2. Nights will last two IRL days.
Title: Re: M98: Русская Mafia
Post by: LaLight on April 11, 2017, 03:45:34 am
The setup for this game is Traitor8 and was designed by yuma.

Traitor8 is a semi-open setup for 11 players. Setup generation is a randomized process that is open and explained below.

Mafia:
2 Mafia + 1 Roleblocking Traitor

Town:
Up to 8 players

One of the following rows or columns adding a scum add on depending on the row added:


xxxx               Column1         Column2         Column3         Column4         Add-On           
Row1              VT                  Detective         1-shot CommuterGoon Cop         1-shot Investigation Immune/SK
Row2                Watcher            JK                     VT                     Psychologist       2-shot JOAT       
Row3                1-shot Bulletproof Townie VT                     JK                     BodyguardTraitor Knows Mafia         
Row4                 1-shot CommuterPsychologist        Detective            VT                      Mafia Knows Traitor   
Add-On              2-shot JOAT       Mafia Knows Traitor/SKTraitorKnows Mafia/SK1-shot Investigation Immune      xxxxxxx           

To clarify here are the 8 options:

1. Detective, 1-shot Commuter, Goon Cop; 1-shot Investigation Immune + Serial Killer
2. Watcher, Jailkeeper, Psychologist; 2-shot JOAT
3. 1-shot BP Townie, Jailkeeper, Bodyguard; Traitor Knows Mafia
4. 1-shot Commuter, Psychologist, Detective; Mafia Knows Traitor
5. Watcher, 1-shot BP Townie, 1-shot Commuter; 2-shot JOAT
6. Detective, Jailkeeper, Psychologist; Mafia Knows Traitor + Serial Killer
7. 1-shot Commuter, Jailkeeper, Detective; Traitor Knows Mafia + Serial Killer
8. Goon Cop, Psychologist, Bodyguard; 1-shot Investigation Immune


Serial Killer: (if applicable, present 3/8 of the time)
- 2-shot JOAT, which includes a passive 1-shot Bulletproof, 1-shot Strongman, 1-shot Investigation Immune. If the Bulletproof is used up one JOAT attributes will be lost. If both the Strongman or Investigation Immune is used at night the Bulletproof will be lost as well.
- The SK may choose to give up NK and instead perform any one of the 8 town roles listed above during the night. Each role may only be used once by the Sk during the game.


Mechanics:
- All roles will be used according to mafiascum specification unless otherwise noted below.
- Daystart
- Mafia JOAT is an option of Strongman and Ninja (each can only be used once) and is not an assigned role, instead it is universal for the mafia team. But is instead a role that any alive mafia player can use it while performing the night kill.
- Mafia Investigation Immune is universal. It will return results of "Not Goon" to Goon Cops, "Not Killed" to Detectives, "Can't Kill" to Psychologists and "Didn't Target Anyone" to Watchers.
- Traitor does not know the identity of Mafia Partners unless it is added on as a bonus. Traitor will be informed at day start of the Mafia's identities in a PM if that add-on is selected.
- Mafia does not know the identity of the Traitor unless it is added on as a bonus. The Mafia will be informed at day start of the Mafia's identities in their quicktopic if that add-on is selected.
- When the Traitor dies, if at least one Mafia Goon is still alive one will be chosen at random to inherit the Roleblocking role. This Goon will be transformed from a Goon to a Mafia Roleblocker.
- If the Mafia target the Traitor with a NK, the Traitor will not die unless mafia is using a strongman kill. Otherwise, the Traitor will be recruited and become a Mafia Roleblocker and be given access to the quicktopic.
- The Traitor can Roleblock a Mafia NK.
- If the Traitor will inherit the NK and become a Mafia Roleblocker if is the only Mafia player alive.
- Goon Cop will return results of Goon or Not Goon.
- Detective will return results of having killed or not killed.
- Psychologist will return results of being capable of killing or not capable. But if a kill has been performed previously, the result will be falsified. Traitors are not capable of killing until they have been converted into Mafia Roleblockers
- Roles cannot target themselves.
- Flavor will not be indicative of alignment.

Order of Operations: (roles listed earlier in parenthesis will be performed simultaneously)
Modifiers (Ninja/Strongman)
Commuter
Blocking (Jailkeeper, Roleblocking)
Protective (Bodyguard, Bulletproof)
Killing
Investigative (Watcher, Psychologist, Detective, Goon Cop)

Win Conditions:
- Town wins when all threats to the Town have been eliminated.
- Mafia wins when Mafia (not counting the Traitor, unless the traitor has become a Mafia Roleblocker) controls at least half of the Town and the SK, if present, has been eliminated.
- Serial Killer wins when all other players have been eliminated. If a scenario exists where a Serial Killer and a Mafia the following will be followed:
   * If the Traitor is the last mafia alive, Mafia will win.
   * If either original mafia are the last mafia alive, the SK will win.

Title: Re: M98: Русская Mafia
Post by: LaLight on April 11, 2017, 03:47:28 am
Every player will get the flavor name in russian but it won't be in any way influencing the alignment.
Title: Re: M98: Русская Mafia
Post by: Awaclus on April 11, 2017, 04:05:55 am
/in
Title: Re: M98: Русская Mafia
Post by: Robz888 on April 11, 2017, 07:27:46 am
/in
Title: Re: M98: Русская Mafia
Post by: Roadrunner7671 on April 11, 2017, 07:27:57 am
/tag
Title: Re: M98: Русская Mafia (signups are open!)
Post by: The_Wine_Merchant on April 11, 2017, 08:42:54 am
Possible /in.
Title: Re: M98: Русская Mafia (signups are open!)
Post by: schadd on April 11, 2017, 08:53:42 am
/B
Title: Re: M98: Русская Mafia (signups are open!)
Post by: J Reggie on April 11, 2017, 09:59:25 am
/tagswag
Title: Re: M98: Русская Mafia (signups are open!)
Post by: Eevee on April 11, 2017, 10:50:00 am
/in
Title: Re: M98: Русская Mafia (signups are open!)
Post by: gkrieg13 on April 11, 2017, 10:57:02 am
My nemesis setup eh? 
Title: Re: M98: Русская Mafia (signups are open!)
Post by: LaLight on April 11, 2017, 10:58:55 am
just before I rolled the setup, does Strongman go through Commuter?
Title: Re: M98: Русская Mafia (signups are open!)
Post by: gkrieg13 on April 11, 2017, 10:59:23 am
just before I rolled the setup, does Strongman go through Commuter?

Нет
Title: Re: M98: Русская Mafia (signups are open!)
Post by: Eevee on April 11, 2017, 10:59:50 am
No, right? (Testing myself.)
Title: Re: M98: Русская Mafia (signups are open!)
Post by: LaLight on April 11, 2017, 10:59:57 am
just before I rolled the setup, does Strongman go through Commuter?

Нет

Спасибо, друг
Title: Re: M98: Русская Mafia (signups are open!)
Post by: gkrieg13 on April 11, 2017, 11:00:41 am
just before I rolled the setup, does Strongman go through Commuter?

Нет

Спасибо, друг
Пожалуйста
Title: Re: M98: Русская Mafia (signups are open!)
Post by: AndrewisFTTW on April 11, 2017, 11:02:30 am
/in
Title: Re: M98: Русская Mafia (4 spots left!)
Post by: 2.71828..... on April 11, 2017, 11:19:41 am
/in
Title: Re: M98: Русская Mafia (signups are open!)
Post by: Robz888 on April 11, 2017, 12:17:14 pm
just before I rolled the setup, does Strongman go through Commuter?

I do not think Strongman goes through Commuter, personally.
Title: Re: M98: Русская Mafia (3 spots left!)
Post by: schadd on April 11, 2017, 12:18:58 pm
no matter how strong u are, u can never kill someone if they're in a different place
Title: Re: M98: Русская Mafia (3 spots left!)
Post by: Joseph2302 on April 11, 2017, 06:29:08 pm
/tag
Title: Re: M98: Русская Mafia (signups are open!)
Post by: The_Wine_Merchant on April 11, 2017, 10:08:35 pm
Possible /in.

I'll turn this into a hard /in. But please note my stated VLA if this starts in the next few days.
Title: Re: M98: Русская Mafia (3 spots left!)
Post by: faust on April 13, 2017, 05:11:30 am
/in
Title: Re: M98: Русская Mafia (2 spots left!)
Post by: SpaceAnemone on April 13, 2017, 05:16:09 am
/tag

Would love to play, but I've just proven that I really can't cope with three games at once :-(
Title: Re: M98: Русская Mafia (2 spots left!)
Post by: mcmcsalot on April 13, 2017, 04:46:52 pm
/in setup looks great
Title: Re: M98: Русская Mafia (1 spot left!)
Post by: kkrieg on April 14, 2017, 01:27:47 am
I would like to play but since gkrieg is playing, I'll only play if it's ok with everyone.

We obviously wouldn't talk about the game at all outside of the forum.

If anyone is uncomfortable with me playing I totally understand!
Title: Re: M98: Русская Mafia (1 spot left!)
Post by: LaLight on April 14, 2017, 01:48:15 am
I would like to play but since gkrieg is playing, I'll only play if it's ok with everyone.

We obviously wouldn't talk about the game at all outside of the forum.

If anyone is uncomfortable with me playing I totally understand!

If it comes to me, i am perfectly fine with that
Title: Re: M98: Русская Mafia (1 spot left!)
Post by: Awaclus on April 14, 2017, 04:07:45 am
I would like to play but since gkrieg is playing, I'll only play if it's ok with everyone.

We obviously wouldn't talk about the game at all outside of the forum.

If anyone is uncomfortable with me playing I totally understand!

I don't have any problems with it.
Title: Re: M98: Русская Mafia (1 spot left!)
Post by: faust on April 14, 2017, 04:37:25 am
No probs. Also I look forward to playing with you!
Title: Re: M98: Русская Mafia (1 spot left!)
Post by: LaLight on April 14, 2017, 04:41:39 am
Okay then. I am sending pms starting in 10 minutes. Thread locked except for tags.
Title: Re: M98: Русская Mafia (PMs are out! N0)
Post by: LaLight on April 14, 2017, 04:48:56 am
PMs are out. Also, I realised that some people are VLA for the weekends, so the game will start on Monday, 17th of April, at 5am FT. Confirms your roles in QTs stating them till then, please.
Title: Re: M98: Русская Mafia (PMs are out! N0)
Post by: SirMartin on April 15, 2017, 08:58:53 pm
/tag
Title: Re: M98: Русская Mafia (PMs are out! N0)
Post by: LaLight on April 17, 2017, 05:22:35 am
Обычная русская деревня в Сибири. 12 семей, живущих здесь поколениями. Сотни лет все шло хорошо, пока однажды не прошел слух, что где-то рядом закопано золото... Кто-то решил откопать его и поделиться со всеми, но были и те, что договорились забрать все себе...

Common russian Siberian village. 12 families living in peace for generations. Hundreads of years everything went pretty normal, until one day, when some of villagers discovered gold, mined in the groung nearby. There were some who decided to split the gold evenly, but there were some who decided to cooperate and acquire more gold than others...

День 1 начался!

Vote count 1.0

Not voting (11):
Awaclus, Robz888, The_Wine_Merchant, schadd, Eevee, gkrieg13, AndrewisFTTW, 2,71828....., faust, mcmcsalot, kkrieg

With 11 alive it takes 6 to lynch. Day 1 ends Monday, 24th of April at 5 am FT. Thread unlocked.
Title: Re: M98: Русская Mafia (Day 1)
Post by: Eevee on April 17, 2017, 05:35:11 am
First!
Title: Re: M98: Русская Mafia (Day 1)
Post by: faust on April 17, 2017, 05:44:40 am
Welcome welcome welcome!

There was something about this setup that should be talked about.

I remember now. The theory of claiming.

There are 4 roles in the roster that are unique:

Goon Cop
Watcher
1-shot Bulletproof
Bodyguard

Any claim of one of them limits the set of possible setups to 2, and for any of our PRs, to 1 (i.e. they know the setup exactly). On the flip side, it also lets the mafia know the exact setup.

Now Goon Cop and Watcher are awful claims of course. But 1-shot BP and Bodyguard may actually be beneficial - Bodyguard is not hurt a lot by a claim, and 1-shot BP givesus essentially a 1-shot BP IC. Fakeclaiming these roles should is impossible without counterclaim.

Opinions?
Title: Re: M98: Русская Mafia (Day 1)
Post by: Eevee on April 17, 2017, 06:21:53 am
Makes sense to me. A named townie is arguably stronger than bodyguards actual effect. 1-shot bulletproof is less clear.

Is it a big downside to have mafia know the actual setup? They usually find out before us via the flips anyways.
Title: Re: M98: Русская Mafia (Day 1)
Post by: faust on April 17, 2017, 07:54:27 am
Oh, one other thing: Bodyguard/1-shot BP can appear in the same setup; in that case, we probably (?) do not want both to claim.

So if we decide on claims, we should probably first all claim Bodyguard/non-Bodyguard and if there was no positive, continue with BP (or vice versa).

On the other hand, a coordinated procedure may be bad for us if there's no claim, because that would let mafia know the full setup while we may be none the wiser, so there's a risk.
Title: Re: M98: Русская Mafia (Day 1)
Post by: Eevee on April 17, 2017, 08:00:18 am
Maybe easier to wait like two days, and have the 1-shot BP claim then (if they feel that's the play to make)? To not have it completely dominate the discussion early.
Title: Re: M98: Русская Mafia (Day 1)
Post by: schadd on April 17, 2017, 08:56:58 am
vote: awaclus
vote: robz
vote: twm
vote: eevee
vote: andrew
vote: e
vote: faust
vote: mcmc
vote: kkrieg

to level the playing field. and the last person on the playerlist is probably whomst i'd rvs anyway so that's nice.

bodyguard is nonzero town utility. bp probably wouldn't get nightkilled if they claimed.

because scum will almost certainly notice, and would likely nk you anyway:
we probably (?) do not want both to claim.
ya goof. c'mon
Title: Re: M98: Русская Mafia (Day 1)
Post by: schadd on April 17, 2017, 08:58:58 am
if i ruined some sort of elaborate breadcrumb wifom then i'm not sorry
Title: Re: M98: Русская Mafia (Day 1)
Post by: schadd on April 17, 2017, 08:59:33 am
and obv. feel free to not say anything about it
Title: Re: M98: Русская Mafia (Day 1)
Post by: Robz888 on April 17, 2017, 09:01:32 am
Welcome welcome welcome!

There was something about this setup that should be talked about.

I remember now. The theory of claiming.

There are 4 roles in the roster that are unique:

Goon Cop
Watcher
1-shot Bulletproof
Bodyguard

Any claim of one of them limits the set of possible setups to 2, and for any of our PRs, to 1 (i.e. they know the setup exactly). On the flip side, it also lets the mafia know the exact setup.

Now Goon Cop and Watcher are awful claims of course. But 1-shot BP and Bodyguard may actually be beneficial - Bodyguard is not hurt a lot by a claim, and 1-shot BP givesus essentially a 1-shot BP IC. Fakeclaiming these roles should is impossible without counterclaim.

Opinions?

You know what, I don't hate this plan, particularly starting with all of us claiming Bodyguard / not Bodyguard. Let's discuss a bit more, but I'm favorably inclined for us to do that.
Title: Re: M98: Русская Mafia (Day 1)
Post by: schadd on April 17, 2017, 09:01:55 am
vote: robz
Title: Re: M98: Русская Mafia (Day 1)
Post by: Robz888 on April 17, 2017, 09:02:08 am
And yes, named townie seems much stronger than Bodyguard.
Title: Re: M98: Русская Mafia (Day 1)
Post by: schadd on April 17, 2017, 09:02:43 am
robz what is your favorite color?
Title: Re: M98: Русская Mafia (Day 1)
Post by: Robz888 on April 17, 2017, 09:04:24 am
robz what is your favorite color?

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=12g2t7G54nA
Title: Re: M98: Русская Mafia (Day 1)
Post by: schadd on April 17, 2017, 09:05:16 am
vote stays, sorry. even though that is also my favorite color (buddying?)
Title: Re: M98: Русская Mafia (Day 1)
Post by: schadd on April 17, 2017, 09:08:25 am
And yes, named townie seems much stronger than Bodyguard.
is this backwards?
Title: Re: M98: Русская Mafia (Day 1)
Post by: Robz888 on April 17, 2017, 09:12:50 am
And yes, named townie seems much stronger than Bodyguard.
is this backwards?

No. Bodyguard is lame.

Cool we have the same favorite color, though.
Title: Re: M98: Русская Mafia (Day 1)
Post by: schadd on April 17, 2017, 09:13:40 am
whether it's cool depends on your alignment this game. leaning towards not cool
Title: Re: M98: Русская Mafia (Day 1)
Post by: schadd on April 17, 2017, 09:19:40 am

pagetop

hey faust


















                                                                                                           u should be townreading me by now
Title: Re: M98: Русская Mafia (Day 1)
Post by: Robz888 on April 17, 2017, 09:27:10 am
whether it's cool depends on your alignment this game. leaning towards not cool

False, it's cool anyway.
Title: Re: M98: Русская Mafia (Day 1)
Post by: schadd on April 17, 2017, 09:27:58 am
i hope that's a joke
Title: Re: M98: Русская Mafia (Day 1)
Post by: faust on April 17, 2017, 09:38:18 am
u should be townreading me by now
Have you ever been scum here? I don't recall.
Title: Re: M98: Русская Mafia (Day 1)
Post by: faust on April 17, 2017, 09:39:39 am
Maybe easier to wait like two days, and have the 1-shot BP claim then (if they feel that's the play to make)? To not have it completely dominate the discussion early.
What's the problem with that? Would you rather have RVS?
Title: Re: M98: Русская Mafia (Day 1)
Post by: schadd on April 17, 2017, 09:44:37 am
u should be townreading me by now
Have you ever been scum here? I don't recall.
twice; M87 (you weren't in it) and RMM37 (u were mod)
Title: Re: M98: Русская Mafia (Day 1)
Post by: schadd on April 17, 2017, 09:44:56 am
Maybe easier to wait like two days, and have the 1-shot BP claim then (if they feel that's the play to make)? To not have it completely dominate the discussion early.
What's the problem with that? Would you rather have RVS?
yes pleeeeeeease
Title: Re: M98: Русская Mafia (Day 1)
Post by: 2.71828..... on April 17, 2017, 09:47:51 am
being a bodyguard is lame.  I completely agree with converting them to IC.

whoever is the bodyguard (if we have one) should claim.
Title: Re: M98: Русская Mafia (Day 1)
Post by: schadd on April 17, 2017, 09:53:11 am
every time you talk about the setup before d2 a penguin dies
Title: Re: M98: Русская Mafia (Day 1)
Post by: Robz888 on April 17, 2017, 09:54:20 am
The penguin was scum, anyway.
Title: Re: M98: Русская Mafia (Day 1)
Post by: 2.71828..... on April 17, 2017, 09:54:36 am
every time you talk about the setup before d2 a penguin dies

The setup is the primary reason I joined this game.  I love this setup.  modded it twice but never played it, figured I would give it a shot
Title: Re: M98: Русская Mafia (Day 1)
Post by: schadd on April 17, 2017, 09:55:28 am
let's hope u survive d1 then
Title: Re: M98: Русская Mafia (Day 1)
Post by: Robz888 on April 17, 2017, 09:55:43 am
So I'm coming off two games where I townread Andrew hard, and we was scum both times, and we (town) lost because of it. So don't look to me for a reliable opinion on Andrew.
Title: Re: M98: Русская Mafia (Day 1)
Post by: schadd on April 17, 2017, 09:56:47 am
i'm still pissed that you said he was easy to read
Title: Re: M98: Русская Mafia (Day 1)
Post by: Robz888 on April 17, 2017, 09:59:24 am
Me too.
Title: Re: M98: Русская Mafia (Day 1)
Post by: gkrieg13 on April 17, 2017, 10:14:05 am
I like the claiming idea, and think it should also include 1-shot commuter. Their role is useless until they claim really.

Also, vote: Andrew. That guy really is always scum.
Title: Re: M98: Русская Mafia (Day 1)
Post by: mcmcsalot on April 17, 2017, 10:19:04 am
Hey everyone! I agree I like the bodyguard claiming and being an ic over being a useless bodyguard. Reading the setup though a bodyguard claim lets mafia know 100% the setup. A bodyguard is only present in two scenarios and in one of those mafia has a power.

Though I'm not sure if it's a problem if mafia know what the setup is. I feel like this setup is more solevable than most from one or two roles so I don't think mafia can really fake claim.
Title: Re: M98: Русская Mafia (Day 1)
Post by: faust on April 17, 2017, 10:20:58 am
So I'm coming off two games where I townread Andrew hard, and we was scum both times, and we (town) lost because of it. So don't look to me for a reliable opinion on Andrew.
That reminds me

Vote: mcmc
Title: Re: M98: Русская Mafia (Day 1)
Post by: mcmcsalot on April 17, 2017, 10:21:24 am
I like the claiming idea, and think it should also include 1-shot commuter. Their role is useless until they claim really.

Also, vote: Andrew. That guy really is always scum.

Can't a one-shot commuter lay low/possibly use their commute if they might be nightkilled and claim later with some I have/haven't used my commute wifom for a late day ic/nk prevention.

Bodyguard on be otherhand just dies instead of someone else.
Title: Re: M98: Русская Mafia (Day 1)
Post by: Eevee on April 17, 2017, 10:24:04 am
Maybe easier to wait like two days, and have the 1-shot BP claim then (if they feel that's the play to make)? To not have it completely dominate the discussion early.
What's the problem with that? Would you rather have RVS?
Can I have c), none of the above?
Title: Re: M98: Русская Mafia (Day 1)
Post by: Eevee on April 17, 2017, 10:33:53 am
Maybe easier to wait like two days, and have the 1-shot BP claim then (if they feel that's the play to make)? To not have it completely dominate the discussion early.
What's the problem with that? Would you rather have RVS?
Can I have c), none of the above?
Uh, that sounds harsher than I intended. I just think we get the information organically once everyone has posted, not like I vehemently oppose people claiming that way too.

I agree with mcmc's thinking about the 1-shot commuter.
Title: Re: M98: Русская Mafia (Day 1)
Post by: schadd on April 17, 2017, 10:48:42 am
eevee's town
Title: Re: M98: Русская Mafia (Day 1)
Post by: Eevee on April 17, 2017, 10:49:45 am
eevee's town
heyo!
Title: Re: M98: Русская Mafia (Day 1)
Post by: schadd on April 17, 2017, 10:53:27 am
stop
Title: Re: M98: Русская Mafia (Day 1)
Post by: Awaclus on April 17, 2017, 11:03:26 am
Andrew said he wasn't going to sign up for any games with me in them, but he signed up for this anyway. That means he's lying SCUM.

Vote: Andrew
Title: Re: M98: Русская Mafia (Day 1)
Post by: The_Wine_Merchant on April 17, 2017, 11:07:32 am
Plan sounds ok. I would stick with the BG/1-shot and not include the commuter
Title: Re: M98: Русская Mafia (Day 1)
Post by: schadd on April 17, 2017, 11:12:17 am
awaclus is maybe lockscum but robz is a more interesting vote atm
Title: Re: M98: Русская Mafia (Day 1)
Post by: Awaclus on April 17, 2017, 11:12:36 am
As far as the Bodyguard issue is concerned, I think it's fine to do it either way. I remember I played some (other?) setup as scum where we had to decide between doing something better or doing something worse but playing around Bodyguard, so it's bretty good to have it be a possibility that we have a hidden Bodyguard that scum knows nothing about. On the other hand, the IC might be better than actually having the Bodyguard. So actually what I'd suggest is that we leave it up to the Bodyguard themselves to decide whether or not they want to claim if we have one, just so we can possibly have an IC but if we don't have a Bodyguard, scum doesn't instantly know that.
Title: Re: M98: Русская Mafia (Day 1)
Post by: The_Wine_Merchant on April 17, 2017, 11:19:58 am
As far as the Bodyguard issue is concerned, I think it's fine to do it either way. I remember I played some (other?) setup as scum where we had to decide between doing something better or doing something worse but playing around Bodyguard, so it's bretty good to have it be a possibility that we have a hidden Bodyguard that scum knows nothing about. On the other hand, the IC might be better than actually having the Bodyguard. So actually what I'd suggest is that we leave it up to the Bodyguard themselves to decide whether or not they want to claim if we have one, just so we can possibly have an IC but if we don't have a Bodyguard, scum doesn't instantly know that.
I kinda like this idea.
Title: Re: M98: Русская Mafia (Day 1)
Post by: faust on April 17, 2017, 11:25:49 am
Well it's always up to the Bodyguard themselves...
Title: Re: M98: Русская Mafia (Day 1)
Post by: The_Wine_Merchant on April 17, 2017, 12:36:51 pm
Well it's always up to the Bodyguard themselves...

So true.
Title: Re: M98: Русская Mafia (Day 1)
Post by: faust on April 17, 2017, 12:37:24 pm
Vote: Awaclus
Title: Re: M98: Русская Mafia (Day 1)
Post by: The_Wine_Merchant on April 17, 2017, 12:46:23 pm
Vote: Awaclus
vote: awaclus
Title: Re: M98: Русская Mafia (Day 1)
Post by: Awaclus on April 17, 2017, 01:23:13 pm
Well it's always up to the Bodyguard themselves...

But what I mean is that we shouldn't collectively decide that the Bodyguard should claim.
Title: Re: M98: Русская Mafia (Day 1)
Post by: faust on April 17, 2017, 01:32:41 pm
Well it's always up to the Bodyguard themselves...

But what I mean is that we shouldn't collectively decide that the Bodyguard should claim.
Okay, but how do we decide on Bodyguard vs 1-shot BP claiming?
Title: Re: M98: Русская Mafia (Day 1)
Post by: Robz888 on April 17, 2017, 01:44:29 pm
I personally think a 1-shot BP should not claim. We want scum to actually shoot at a 1-shot BP--that's the best use of the PR, and it doesn't happen if a 1-shot BP claims, yes?
Title: Re: M98: Русская Mafia (Day 1)
Post by: mcmcsalot on April 17, 2017, 02:11:02 pm
I personally think a 1-shot BP should not claim. We want scum to actually shoot at a 1-shot BP--that's the best use of the PR, and it doesn't happen if a 1-shot BP claims, yes?

I agree with this.
Title: Re: M98: Русская Mafia (Day 1)
Post by: AndrewisFTTW on April 17, 2017, 02:12:34 pm
Oh there's a plan? Cool yeah do that. Let's lynch teh scum.

Vote: faust
Title: Re: M98: Русская Mafia (Day 1)
Post by: faust on April 17, 2017, 02:36:38 pm
I personally think a 1-shot BP should not claim. We want scum to actually shoot at a 1-shot BP--that's the best use of the PR, and it doesn't happen if a 1-shot BP claims, yes?
Having an unkillable IC is pretty sweet though.
Title: Re: M98: Русская Mafia (Day 1)
Post by: The_Wine_Merchant on April 17, 2017, 02:38:23 pm
I personally think a 1-shot BP should not claim. We want scum to actually shoot at a 1-shot BP--that's the best use of the PR, and it doesn't happen if a 1-shot BP claims, yes?
Having an unkillable IC is pretty sweet though.
In theory we could have both as long as we don't accidentally lynch the 1-shot BP. So maybe we shouldn't have any unannounced hammers or last minute lynches?
Title: Re: M98: Русская Mafia (Day 1)
Post by: schadd on April 17, 2017, 03:20:26 pm
in theory it might be useful to be like "i'm BP. sheep me"
Title: Re: M98: Русская Mafia (Day 1)
Post by: faust on April 17, 2017, 03:31:52 pm
I personally think a 1-shot BP should not claim. We want scum to actually shoot at a 1-shot BP--that's the best use of the PR, and it doesn't happen if a 1-shot BP claims, yes?
Having an unkillable IC is pretty sweet though.
In theory we could have both as long as we don't accidentally lynch the 1-shot BP. So maybe we shouldn't have any unannounced hammers or last minute lynches?
1. Preventing hammers and last minute lynches has never worked.
2. The 1-shot BP is only an IC as long as it does not make sense for scum to fakeclaim. Which it doesn't now, but may close to LyLo. And in this setup, LyLo can be D2.
Title: Re: M98: Русская Mafia (PMs are out! N0)
Post by: LaLight on April 17, 2017, 04:20:06 pm
Vote count 1.1

Robz888 (1): schadd
AndrewisFTTW (2): gkrieg13, Awaclus
Awaclus (2): faust, The_Wine_Merchant
faust (1): AndrewisFTTW
Not voting (5): Robz888, Eevee, 2,71828....., mcmcsalot, kkrieg

With 11 alive it takes 6 to lynch. Day 1 ends Monday, 24th of April at 5 am FT.
Title: Re: M98: Русская Mafia (Day 1)
Post by: 2.71828..... on April 17, 2017, 05:14:35 pm
in theory it might be useful to be like "i'm BP. sheep me"

I don't like this theory.
Title: Re: M98: Русская Mafia (Day 1)
Post by: schadd on April 17, 2017, 05:30:07 pm
:c


not trusting d1 reads is SACRILEGE in my village
Title: Re: M98: Русская Mafia (Day 1)
Post by: Robz888 on April 17, 2017, 06:58:31 pm
Kkrieg is gkrieg's wife, correct? Hi, kkrieg! Mcmcsalot and I are brothers, FWIW.
Title: Re: M98: Русская Mafia (Day 1)
Post by: gkrieg13 on April 17, 2017, 08:05:35 pm
Kkrieg is gkrieg's wife, correct? Hi, kkrieg! Mcmcsalot and I are brothers, FWIW.

Yes that's right!
Title: Re: M98: Русская Mafia (Day 1)
Post by: schadd on April 17, 2017, 09:35:12 pm
oh unfortunately there wasn't an SK last game so they didn't get to see my plan in action. if you are an SK it benefits you to claim in this setup
Title: Re: M98: Русская Mafia (Day 1)
Post by: kkrieg on April 17, 2017, 11:07:14 pm
Hi everyone!

Just a heads up -
1. I'm new so I might will ask some questions
2. because of my work it's sometimes hard to post throughout my day


What's a role blocking traitor?


Title: Re: M98: Русская Mafia (Day 1)
Post by: kkrieg on April 17, 2017, 11:08:03 pm
Kkrieg is gkrieg's wife, correct? Hi, kkrieg! Mcmcsalot and I are brothers, FWIW.
Hi! And thanks for the info:)
Title: Re: M98: Русская Mafia (Day 1)
Post by: gkrieg13 on April 17, 2017, 11:12:06 pm
Hi everyone!

Just a heads up -
1. I'm new so I might will ask some questions
2. because of my work it's sometimes hard to post throughout my day


What's a role blocking traitor?

A roleblocking traitor is 2 things:

1) the roleblocking part.  Each night they choose a target (Let's say Bob), any action that Bob takes won't happen (so if he doctors someone, it won't work).  This doesn't apply to 1-shot bulletproof (if Bob is 1-shot bp and scum shoots him at night and he is roleblocked, he will still be alive in the morning) or 1-shot commuter (they still run away and are untargetable by anyone).

2) the traitor part.  They are part of the mafia team, but they don't share a QT with the mafia.  And (unless we are playing a setup where this isn't the case) they don't know who the rest of the mafia team is, and the mafia team doesn't know who they are.

This also means that the traitor can't perform a night kill.

The traitor is recruited (joins the mafia team in full) if they are shot by the mafia at night, or if both of the other mafia are dead.
Title: Re: M98: Русская Mafia (Day 1)
Post by: schadd on April 17, 2017, 11:19:37 pm
wowee get a room
Title: Re: M98: Русская Mafia (Day 1)
Post by: gkrieg13 on April 17, 2017, 11:20:31 pm
wowee get a room

Ironically that is like specifically what we are trying to avoid!
Title: Re: M98: Русская Mafia (Day 1)
Post by: schadd on April 17, 2017, 11:21:38 pm
yeah


i'm still saying that every time one of you quotes the other


you maybe towntold (?)
Title: Re: M98: Русская Mafia (Day 1)
Post by: kkrieg on April 17, 2017, 11:22:54 pm
wowee get a room
No you get a room
Title: Re: M98: Русская Mafia (Day 1)
Post by: kkrieg on April 17, 2017, 11:23:16 pm
yeah


i'm still saying that every time one of you quotes the other


you maybe towntold (?)
I'll say that every time you say that
Title: Re: M98: Русская Mafia (Day 1)
Post by: schadd on April 17, 2017, 11:24:13 pm
wowee get a room
No you get a room

<---
Title: Re: M98: Русская Mafia (Day 1)
Post by: schadd on April 17, 2017, 11:26:32 pm
for posterity: my current avatar is a little house thingo


i might change it before this game is over, this one is getting a little tired.


maybe my ms avatar?
(https://forum.mafiascum.net/download/file.php?avatar=29134_1486929365.png)
Title: Re: M98: Русская Mafia (Day 1)
Post by: gkrieg13 on April 17, 2017, 11:29:29 pm
Hi everyone!

Just a heads up -
1. I'm new so I might will ask some questions
2. because of my work it's sometimes hard to post throughout my day


What's a role blocking traitor?

Also, I feel like you should have more questions (upside down emoji)
Title: Re: M98: Русская Mafia (Day 1)
Post by: schadd on April 17, 2017, 11:32:22 pm
(http://emojipedia-us.s3.amazonaws.com/cache/b8/a8/b8a873428554266b875ec50fccf542c7.png)
Title: Re: M98: Русская Mafia (Day 1)
Post by: gkrieg13 on April 17, 2017, 11:35:19 pm
for posterity: my current avatar is a little house thingo


i might change it before this game is over, this one is getting a little tired.


maybe my ms avatar?
(https://forum.mafiascum.net/download/file.php?avatar=29134_1486929365.png)

I would vote against this avatar
Title: Re: M98: Русская Mafia (Day 1)
Post by: schadd on April 17, 2017, 11:37:24 pm
maybe i'll make another h*cking poll
Title: Re: M98: Русская Mafia (Day 1)
Post by: gkrieg13 on April 17, 2017, 11:40:11 pm
As long as it is a discrete discreet diss Crete poll
Title: Re: M98: Русская Mafia (Day 1)
Post by: schadd on April 17, 2017, 11:44:07 pm
what is ur alignment
Title: Re: M98: Русская Mafia (Day 1)
Post by: gkrieg13 on April 17, 2017, 11:52:49 pm
what is ur alignment

Uh, the towniest town that ever towned. What about you?
Title: Re: M98: Русская Mafia (Day 1)
Post by: schadd on April 17, 2017, 11:54:50 pm
i think the only thing i want to claim rn is not SK
Title: Re: M98: Русская Mafia (Day 1)
Post by: AndrewisFTTW on April 17, 2017, 11:57:12 pm
what is ur alignment

Maf- Town! Town! Definitely town!
Title: Re: M98: Русская Mafia (Day 1)
Post by: AndrewisFTTW on April 17, 2017, 11:57:29 pm
U?
Title: Re: M98: Русская Mafia (Day 1)
Post by: schadd on April 18, 2017, 12:01:33 am
i think the only thing i want to claim rn is not SK
Title: Re: M98: Русская Mafia (Day 1)
Post by: gkrieg13 on April 18, 2017, 12:06:06 am
I mean I'm fine with a possible SK claiming, but why?
Title: Re: M98: Русская Mafia (Day 1)
Post by: schadd on April 18, 2017, 12:06:43 am
i'll explain after
Title: Re: M98: Русская Mafia (Day 1)
Post by: schadd on April 18, 2017, 01:00:04 am
guys i promise that if you all keep posting, i will be able to solve you and you will all become solved. try to keep it more than like 100/day for all of d1
Title: Re: M98: Русская Mafia (Day 1)
Post by: ashersky on April 18, 2017, 02:58:19 am
--tag--
Title: Re: M98: Русская Mafia (Day 1)
Post by: faust on April 18, 2017, 03:22:56 am
What's a role blocking traitor?

Are you aware that such questions can be asked in your personal QT?
Title: Re: M98: Русская Mafia (Day 1)
Post by: faust on April 18, 2017, 03:23:33 am
I really want gkrieg and kkrieg to pull off a quickhammer together just so that we can call it blitzkrieg.
Title: Re: M98: Русская Mafia (Day 1)
Post by: schadd on April 18, 2017, 03:24:07 am
ha
Title: Re: M98: Русская Mafia (Day 1)
Post by: schadd on April 18, 2017, 03:24:35 am
only one of them is scum though
Title: Re: M98: Русская Mafia (Day 1)
Post by: faust on April 18, 2017, 03:26:29 am
only one of them is scum though
At most or exactly?
Title: Re: M98: Русская Mafia (Day 1)
Post by: schadd on April 18, 2017, 03:27:25 am
exactly
i think
Title: Re: M98: Русская Mafia (Day 1)
Post by: faust on April 18, 2017, 07:15:50 am
schadd is doing that thing that I was townreading him for in that one game where he was town, then I scumread him in another game for not doing it and he still was town. I am mildly confused as to what that means.
Title: Re: M98: Русская Mafia (Day 1)
Post by: schadd on April 18, 2017, 07:50:47 am
the thing about those is you have to think about whether it makes sense to be alignment indicative and whether there might be natural reasons i might decide not to do it. one might not be led to believe so but i've been trying to thin my arsenal of tells
Title: Re: M98: Русская Mafia (Day 1)
Post by: Eevee on April 18, 2017, 08:07:01 am
the thing about those is you have to think about whether it makes sense to be alignment indicative and whether there might be natural reasons i might decide not to do it. one might not be led to believe so but i've been trying to thin my arsenal of tells
well, scum always has a motive for appearing towny and doing things that win town-cred, which is of course why this is hard.
Title: Re: M98: Русская Mafia (Day 1)
Post by: schadd on April 18, 2017, 08:17:50 am
the idea is that scum doesn't know what he's looking for. although i'm town and i do l0l
Title: Re: M98: Русская Mafia (Day 1)
Post by: Eevee on April 18, 2017, 08:24:02 am
schadd is doing that thing that I was townreading him for in that one game where he was town, then I scumread him in another game for not doing it and he still was town. I am mildly confused as to what that means.
Yeah, maybe it means that he's schadd?

Cryptic arguments ITT!

I would love to see scumschadd some day. It feels like his style would be hard to mimic, it would be fun to how he'd do it.
Title: Re: M98: Русская Mafia (Day 1)
Post by: kkrieg on April 18, 2017, 10:09:32 am
What's a role blocking traitor?

Are you aware that such questions can be asked in your personal QT?

Yea - but I know gkrieg just loves answering game questions
Title: Re: M98: Русская Mafia (Day 1)
Post by: Robz888 on April 18, 2017, 10:16:35 am
Just caught up, whole lot of completely empty posts from schadd, which I don't think is scum indicative but boy is it annoying.
Title: Re: M98: Русская Mafia (Day 1)
Post by: faust on April 18, 2017, 10:59:29 am
What's a role blocking traitor?

Are you aware that such questions can be asked in your personal QT?

Yea - but I know gkrieg just loves answering game questions
You probably shouldn't ask too many questions about Traitors if you want to stay on his good side... ;)

I rate this answer solid yet a litte disappointing.
Title: Re: M98: Русская Mafia (Day 1)
Post by: gkrieg13 on April 18, 2017, 11:08:30 am
What's a role blocking traitor?

Are you aware that such questions can be asked in your personal QT?

Yea - but I know gkrieg just loves answering game questions
You probably shouldn't ask too many questions about Traitors if you want to stay on his good side... ;)

I rate this answer solid yet a litte disappointing.

Haha stupid traitor. Worst role in the history of stupid roles.
Title: Re: M98: Русская Mafia (Day 1)
Post by: Eevee on April 18, 2017, 11:20:47 am
Do we have to lynch faust now?
Title: Re: M98: Русская Mafia (Day 1)
Post by: gkrieg13 on April 18, 2017, 11:36:00 am
the thing about those is you have to think about whether it makes sense to be alignment indicative and whether there might be natural reasons i might decide not to do it. one might not be led to believe so but i've been trying to thin my arsenal of tells

That is very anti-town of you.
Title: Re: M98: Русская Mafia (Day 1)
Post by: schadd on April 18, 2017, 11:43:09 am
Just caught up, whole lot of completely empty posts from schadd, which I don't think is scum indicative but boy is it annoying.
ok is this just an homage to last game?
Title: Re: M98: Русская Mafia (Day 1)
Post by: schadd on April 18, 2017, 11:43:28 am
er, last game in this setup
Title: Re: M98: Русская Mafia (Day 1)
Post by: Awaclus on April 18, 2017, 11:53:19 am
You probably shouldn't ask too many questions about Traitors if you want to stay on his good side... ;)

Traitors is a good band though.
Title: Re: M98: Русская Mafia (Day 1)
Post by: The_Wine_Merchant on April 18, 2017, 01:33:36 pm
Do we have to lynch faust now?

Awaclus is better.
Title: Re: M98: Русская Mafia (Day 1)
Post by: faust on April 18, 2017, 02:47:09 pm
Do we have to lynch faust now?

Awaclus is better.

You are not very talkative these days.
Title: Re: M98: Русская Mafia (Day 1)
Post by: The_Wine_Merchant on April 18, 2017, 02:51:19 pm
Do we have to lynch faust now?

Awaclus is better.

You are not very talkative these days.

Work + sick + not a lot to talk about
Title: Re: M98: Русская Mafia (Day 1)
Post by: Awaclus on April 18, 2017, 04:40:45 pm
Do we have to lynch faust now?

Awaclus is better.

I'm not.
Title: Re: M98: Русская Mafia (Day 1)
Post by: The_Wine_Merchant on April 18, 2017, 04:47:13 pm
Do we have to lynch faust now?

Awaclus is better.

I'm not.
Noted.
Title: Re: M98: Русская Mafia (Day 1)
Post by: 2.71828..... on April 18, 2017, 04:55:36 pm
Well, D1 how I love thee. Not really.

Has everyone had the chance to claim yet? If so, probably don't have a bodyguard, which is unfortunate because ICs are great things to have
Title: Re: M98: Русская Mafia (Day 1)
Post by: 2.71828..... on April 18, 2017, 04:57:33 pm
Do we have to lynch faust now?

Yes.

Vote: eevee
Title: Re: M98: Русская Mafia (Day 1)
Post by: The_Wine_Merchant on April 18, 2017, 04:58:13 pm
Well, D1 how I love thee. Not really.

Has everyone had the chance to claim yet? If so, probably don't have a bodyguard, which is unfortunate because ICs are great things to have
They are great. I think you would make a great IC. Double great.
Title: Re: M98: Русская Mafia (Day 1)
Post by: Robz888 on April 18, 2017, 05:00:35 pm
I am not a Bodyguard.
Title: Re: M98: Русская Mafia (Day 1)
Post by: mcmcsalot on April 18, 2017, 08:43:19 pm
TWM, why do you want to lynch awaclus?
Title: Re: M98: Русская Mafia (Day 1)
Post by: The_Wine_Merchant on April 18, 2017, 08:45:19 pm
TWM, why do you want to lynch awaclus?
I saw that faust was voting him. I went to look at what potential reasons faust might be voting for Awaclus and agreed with what I think the reasons are.

If you are curious, I would encourage you to go look and see if you can see what potential reasons we are voting Awaclus for and, if you agree, join us in our vote.
Title: Re: M98: Русская Mafia (Day 1)
Post by: mcmcsalot on April 18, 2017, 08:56:12 pm
TWM, why do you want to lynch awaclus?
I saw that faust was voting him. I went to look at what potential reasons faust might be voting for Awaclus and agreed with what I think the reasons are.

If you are curious, I would encourage you to go look and see if you can see what potential reasons we are voting Awaclus for and, if you agree, join us in our vote.

This is all I see
Vote: Awaclus
vote: awaclus
Title: Re: M98: Русская Mafia (Day 1)
Post by: The_Wine_Merchant on April 18, 2017, 08:58:32 pm
TWM, why do you want to lynch awaclus?
I saw that faust was voting him. I went to look at what potential reasons faust might be voting for Awaclus and agreed with what I think the reasons are.

If you are curious, I would encourage you to go look and see if you can see what potential reasons we are voting Awaclus for and, if you agree, join us in our vote.

This is all I see
Vote: Awaclus
vote: awaclus
go look and see if you can see what potential reasons we are voting Awaclus

as in, go look and see what Awaclus may or may not have posted to make us vote that way.
Title: Re: M98: Русская Mafia (Day 1)
Post by: kkrieg on April 18, 2017, 08:59:25 pm
Not a lot to add right now, but I'm not a bodyguard
Title: Re: M98: Русская Mafia (Day 1)
Post by: gkrieg13 on April 18, 2017, 09:06:15 pm
I never actually read this setup, but it is very highly variable.
Title: Re: M98: Русская Mafia (Day 1)
Post by: 2.71828..... on April 18, 2017, 09:37:39 pm
I think TWM is assuming a lot thinking he knows exactly why faust is voting the way he is
Title: Re: M98: Русская Mafia (Day 1)
Post by: The_Wine_Merchant on April 18, 2017, 09:43:33 pm
I think TWM is assuming a lot thinking he knows exactly why faust is voting the way he is
Probably. But in reality I am voting for awaclus for my own reasons. I just happen to think faust thought the same thing. I could be wrong about that. I am just telling mcmcsalot how I got there.
Title: Re: M98: Русская Mafia (Day 1)
Post by: gkrieg13 on April 18, 2017, 09:56:08 pm
vote: faust
Title: Re: M98: Русская Mafia (PMs are out! N0)
Post by: LaLight on April 19, 2017, 05:55:36 am
Vote Count 1.2

Robz888 (1): schadd
AndrewisFTTW (1): Awaclus
Awaclus (2): faust, The_Wine_Merchant
faust (2): AndrewisFTTW, gkrieg13
Eevee (1): 2,71828.....
Not voting (4): Robz888, Eevee, mcmcsalot, kkrieg

With 11 alive it takes 6 to lynch. Day 1 ends Monday, 24th of April at 5 am FT.
Title: Re: M98: Русская Mafia (Day 1)
Post by: faust on April 19, 2017, 08:07:57 am
I thought we agreed that claiming not-Bodyguard is kinda bad.
Title: Re: M98: Русская Mafia (Day 1)
Post by: mcmcsalot on April 19, 2017, 08:47:09 am
I think TWM is assuming a lot thinking he knows exactly why faust is voting the way he is
Probably. But in reality I am voting for awaclus for my own reasons. I just happen to think faust thought the same thing. I could be wrong about that. I am just telling mcmcsalot how I got there.

I've read and I can't figure out what these reasons are for either of you. How you think you know you have the same reasons is crazy.

I also thought we weren't claiming non bodyguard, 2.7 was just saying we probably don't have one since no one has claimed and robz took that to mean he should affirm that he is not the bodyguard. Kk then followed suit. All in all a pretty normal thing for those people to do.
Title: Re: M98: Русская Mafia (Day 1)
Post by: Eevee on April 19, 2017, 09:33:59 am
I think TWM is assuming a lot thinking he knows exactly why faust is voting the way he is
Probably. But in reality I am voting for awaclus for my own reasons. I just happen to think faust thought the same thing. I could be wrong about that. I am just telling mcmcsalot how I got there.

I've read and I can't figure out what these reasons are for either of you. How you think you know you have the same reasons is crazy.

I also thought we weren't claiming non bodyguard, 2.7 was just saying we probably don't have one since no one has claimed and robz took that to mean he should affirm that he is not the bodyguard. Kk then followed suit. All in all a pretty normal thing for those people to do.
Same, no idea what those reasons are. I read the initial Awaclus-vote as at least close to RVS.
Tell us the reasons!
Title: Re: M98: Русская Mafia (Day 1)
Post by: faust on April 19, 2017, 10:39:54 am
I also thought we weren't claiming non bodyguard, 2.7 was just saying we probably don't have one since no one has claimed and robz took that to mean he should affirm that he is not the bodyguard. Kk then followed suit. All in all a pretty normal thing for those people to do.
Not saying it is un-normal, but it is kinda bad.

TWMs feelings about Awaclus seem to come from a townie place, as does his immediate sheeping of my vote.
Title: Re: M98: Русская Mafia (Day 1)
Post by: faust on April 19, 2017, 10:40:48 am
Tell us the reasons!
Awaclus made a scummy joke IIRC.
Title: Re: M98: Русская Mafia (Day 1)
Post by: faust on April 19, 2017, 10:42:46 am
Andrew said he wasn't going to sign up for any games with me in them, but he signed up for this anyway. That means he's lying SCUM.

Vote: Andrew
Ah yes, look here. Besides being pointless RVS at a post-RVS stage, it also reads like emotional manipulation because it refers to some conflict between Andrew and Awaclus that need not have been brought up.
Title: Re: M98: Русская Mafia (Day 1)
Post by: Eevee on April 19, 2017, 10:50:59 am
I've always thought that votes with a tangible reason (like that!) are so much better than just pure RVS'ing it up. Sure, early game votes are always going to be mostly PoE and not very certain, but why not try?

I approve, although creating pointless conflict where you yourself are one of the parties doesn't jive with what I'd expect scum to want.

TWM, same reasons for you?
Title: Re: M98: Русская Mafia (Day 1)
Post by: The_Wine_Merchant on April 19, 2017, 11:07:46 am
I think TWM is assuming a lot thinking he knows exactly why faust is voting the way he is
Probably. But in reality I am voting for awaclus for my own reasons. I just happen to think faust thought the same thing. I could be wrong about that. I am just telling mcmcsalot how I got there.

I've read and I can't figure out what these reasons are for either of you. How you think you know you have the same reasons is crazy.

I also thought we weren't claiming non bodyguard, 2.7 was just saying we probably don't have one since no one has claimed and robz took that to mean he should affirm that he is not the bodyguard. Kk then followed suit. All in all a pretty normal thing for those people to do.
Same, no idea what those reasons are. I read the initial Awaclus-vote as at least close to RVS.
Tell us the reasons!
I would rather not.
Title: Re: M98: Русская Mafia (Day 1)
Post by: The_Wine_Merchant on April 19, 2017, 11:08:32 am
TWM, same reasons for you?
I guess I will say my reasons are different than faust's now that he has stated them.
Title: Re: M98: Русская Mafia (Day 1)
Post by: Awaclus on April 19, 2017, 11:29:30 am
Andrew said he wasn't going to sign up for any games with me in them, but he signed up for this anyway. That means he's lying SCUM.

Vote: Andrew
Ah yes, look here. Besides being pointless RVS at a post-RVS stage, it also reads like emotional manipulation because it refers to some conflict between Andrew and Awaclus that need not have been brought up.

There has been no conflict between me and Andrew, he just made a single joke about it in Fibonacci Mafia where I didn't play. So then I made a joke about that joke. And now it's funny because I have explained it.
Title: Re: M98: Русская Mafia (Day 1)
Post by: mcmcsalot on April 19, 2017, 11:40:38 am
TWM, same reasons for you?
I guess I will say my reasons are different than faust's now that he has stated them.

I hate every part of this. vote: twm
Title: Re: M98: Русская Mafia (Day 1)
Post by: gkrieg13 on April 19, 2017, 11:43:19 am
This feels like it is reaching from faust on Awaclus.
Title: Re: M98: Русская Mafia (Day 1)
Post by: Robz888 on April 19, 2017, 11:59:40 am
I cannot follow any of the conversation here. I don't see why people are voting Awaclus, and I don't see what TWM was getting at.
Title: Re: M98: Русская Mafia (Day 1)
Post by: gkrieg13 on April 19, 2017, 12:14:22 pm
I cannot follow any of the conversation here. I don't see why people are voting Awaclus, and I don't see what TWM was getting at.

Have you tried reading every other post backwards?  That usually helps me.
Title: Re: M98: Русская Mafia (Day 1)
Post by: The_Wine_Merchant on April 19, 2017, 12:32:08 pm
TWM, same reasons for you?
I guess I will say my reasons are different than faust's now that he has stated them.

I hate every part of this. vote: twm
If I had two votes, my second one would be on mcmcsalot.
Title: Re: M98: Русская Mafia (Day 1)
Post by: schadd on April 19, 2017, 12:37:06 pm
mcmc, do you think i think you're town or scum?


will ask again later
Title: Re: M98: Русская Mafia (Day 1)
Post by: faust on April 19, 2017, 12:56:42 pm
Andrew said he wasn't going to sign up for any games with me in them, but he signed up for this anyway. That means he's lying SCUM.

Vote: Andrew
Ah yes, look here. Besides being pointless RVS at a post-RVS stage, it also reads like emotional manipulation because it refers to some conflict between Andrew and Awaclus that need not have been brought up.

There has been no conflict between me and Andrew, he just made a single joke about it in Fibonacci Mafia where I didn't play. So then I made a joke about that joke. And now it's funny because I have explained it.
And this is still where you want your vote to be?
Title: Re: M98: Русская Mafia (Day 1)
Post by: Awaclus on April 19, 2017, 01:09:13 pm
Andrew said he wasn't going to sign up for any games with me in them, but he signed up for this anyway. That means he's lying SCUM.

Vote: Andrew
Ah yes, look here. Besides being pointless RVS at a post-RVS stage, it also reads like emotional manipulation because it refers to some conflict between Andrew and Awaclus that need not have been brought up.

There has been no conflict between me and Andrew, he just made a single joke about it in Fibonacci Mafia where I didn't play. So then I made a joke about that joke. And now it's funny because I have explained it.
And this is still where you want your vote to be?

Pretty much.
Title: Re: M98: Русская Mafia (Day 1)
Post by: gkrieg13 on April 19, 2017, 01:09:18 pm
mcmc, do you think i think you're town or scum?


will ask again later

Why are you being so strange?
Title: Re: M98: Русская Mafia (Day 1)
Post by: schadd on April 19, 2017, 01:15:18 pm
mcmc, do you think i think you're town or scum?


will ask again later

Why are you being so strange?
that's not an answerable question
Title: Re: M98: Русская Mafia (Day 1)
Post by: Robz888 on April 19, 2017, 01:17:32 pm
One of these games, weird schadd acting like weird schadd is going to be a scumtell.
Title: Re: M98: Русская Mafia (Day 1)
Post by: schadd on April 19, 2017, 01:19:05 pm
not how tells work
Title: Re: M98: Русская Mafia (Day 1)
Post by: AndrewisFTTW on April 19, 2017, 01:22:48 pm
This feels like it is reaching from faust on Awaclus.

I agree. Keeping my vote on faust for now.
Title: Re: M98: Русская Mafia (Day 1)
Post by: 2.71828..... on April 19, 2017, 02:28:40 pm
Have fairly limited access from now to the end of day 1. I will be checking in and posting when I can, but won't be able to be very active unfortunately.

That being said, still like my Eevee vote
Title: Re: M98: Русская Mafia (Day 1)
Post by: faust on April 19, 2017, 02:44:36 pm
This feels like it is reaching from faust on Awaclus.

I agree. Keeping my vote on faust for now.
I feel like I have to ask now: What does this even mean?
Title: Re: M98: Русская Mafia (Day 1)
Post by: mcmcsalot on April 19, 2017, 03:06:27 pm
mcmc, do you think i think you're town or scum?


will ask again later

I think you think I'm town.
Title: Re: M98: Русская Mafia (Day 1)
Post by: schadd on April 19, 2017, 03:12:32 pm
porquois?
Title: Re: M98: Русская Mafia (Day 1)
Post by: mcmcsalot on April 19, 2017, 03:13:49 pm
This feels like it is reaching from faust on Awaclus.

I agree. Keeping my vote on faust for now.
I feel like I have to ask now: What does this even mean?

I don't see what you don't get. Gkriegs thinks you finding awaclus scummy for his joke about andrew is reaching. Andrew agrees with gkriegs and is going to keep his vote on you.

I think it's an okay theory about why scum!awaclus would make that joke post but I see why gkriegs thinks your reaching. It's an early theory though so they are kinda all reaching. I also hink it's scummy that awaclus is leaving his vote on andrew after explaining that it was a single joke post, but I don't see the harm in his vote being here so I would t expect him to unvote either.

Basically a lot of null/early game stuff going on as opposed to mind reading twm who thought you thought the same thing he did about awaclus and voted for him and now won't say what his reasons which he thought were your reasons are/were. He's scummy.
Title: Re: M98: Русская Mafia (Day 1)
Post by: mcmcsalot on April 19, 2017, 03:15:18 pm
porquois?

It's unlikely you think many people are scum this early in the game and I don't see why you would ask me that if you did think I was scum.

What do you think I think you are?
Title: Re: M98: Русская Mafia (Day 1)
Post by: schadd on April 19, 2017, 03:17:15 pm
one of {not enough information, decline to answer}
Title: Re: M98: Русская Mafia (Day 1)
Post by: Eevee on April 19, 2017, 03:20:51 pm
I cannot follow any of the conversation here. I don't see why people are voting Awaclus, and I don't see what TWM was getting at.
I like how Robz sounds like the grumpy old guy of f.ds mafia. Is it time to call you Bobz already?
Title: Re: M98: Русская Mafia (Day 1)
Post by: Eevee on April 19, 2017, 03:22:26 pm
I cannot follow any of the conversation here. I don't see why people are voting Awaclus, and I don't see what TWM was getting at.
I like how Robz sounds like the grumpy old guy of f.ds mafia. Is it time to call you Bobz already?
Just kidding, your boyish charm and youthful good looks is a constant envy for me.
Title: Re: M98: Русская Mafia (Day 1)
Post by: Eevee on April 19, 2017, 03:48:20 pm
This feels like it is reaching from faust on Awaclus.

I agree. Keeping my vote on faust for now.
I feel like I have to ask now: What does this even mean?

I don't see what you don't get. Gkriegs thinks you finding awaclus scummy for his joke about andrew is reaching. Andrew agrees with gkriegs and is going to keep his vote on you.

I think it's an okay theory about why scum!awaclus would make that joke post but I see why gkriegs thinks your reaching. It's an early theory though so they are kinda all reaching. I also hink it's scummy that awaclus is leaving his vote on andrew after explaining that it was a single joke post, but I don't see the harm in his vote being here so I would t expect him to unvote either.

Basically a lot of null/early game stuff going on as opposed to mind reading twm who thought you thought the same thing he did about awaclus and voted for him and now won't say what his reasons which he thought were your reasons are/were. He's scummy.
I don't think it's fair to blame faust for reaching when that was so early in the game and there wasn't really much anything to go on yet.

I've never really understood not sharing your full reads or reasons to vote. Does town need to be deceptive? In the big picture, scum likes people guessing and the situation murky.
Title: Re: M98: Русская Mafia (Day 1)
Post by: The_Wine_Merchant on April 19, 2017, 03:50:06 pm
I've never really understood not sharing your full reads or reasons to vote. Does town need to be deceptive? In the big picture, scum likes people guessing and the situation murky.

In general I agree. But small picture, there are times. And in my opinion this is one of them. I am sure I'll explain at some point if people want me to and I feel it is an appropriate time.
Title: Re: M98: Русская Mafia (Day 1)
Post by: Robz888 on April 19, 2017, 03:51:58 pm
I cannot follow any of the conversation here. I don't see why people are voting Awaclus, and I don't see what TWM was getting at.
I like how Robz sounds like the grumpy old guy of f.ds mafia. Is it time to call you Bobz already?
Just kidding, your boyish charm and youthful good looks is a constant envy for me.

*Insert heart eyes emoji*
Title: Re: M98: Русская Mafia (Day 1)
Post by: Eevee on April 19, 2017, 03:56:30 pm
I've never really understood not sharing your full reads or reasons to vote. Does town need to be deceptive? In the big picture, scum likes people guessing and the situation murky.

In general I agree. But small picture, there are times. And in my opinion this is one of them. I am sure I'll explain at some point if people want me to and I feel it is an appropriate time.
But the small pictures end up coming together as the big picture!

I can't force you to say anything, of course. I'll just shake my finger at you and mumble "anti-town" under my breath.
Title: Re: M98: Русская Mafia (Day 1)
Post by: faust on April 19, 2017, 03:58:38 pm
This feels like it is reaching from faust on Awaclus.

I agree. Keeping my vote on faust for now.
I feel like I have to ask now: What does this even mean?

I don't see what you don't get. Gkriegs thinks you finding awaclus scummy for his joke about andrew is reaching. Andrew agrees with gkriegs and is going to keep his vote on you.
I think I am just not really clear on the meaning of the word "reaching" in this context. Could you paraphrase?
Title: Re: M98: Русская Mafia (Day 1)
Post by: faust on April 19, 2017, 04:00:15 pm
I cannot follow any of the conversation here. I don't see why people are voting Awaclus, and I don't see what TWM was getting at.
I like how Robz sounds like the grumpy old guy of f.ds mafia. Is it time to call you Bobz already?
Just kidding, your boyish charm and youthful good looks is a constant envy for me.

*Insert heart eyes emoji*
It's like if Awaclus explained his reads!
Title: Re: M98: Русская Mafia (Day 1)
Post by: schadd on April 19, 2017, 04:01:11 pm
This feels like it is reaching from faust on Awaclus.

I agree. Keeping my vote on faust for now.
I feel like I have to ask now: What does this even mean?

I don't see what you don't get. Gkriegs thinks you finding awaclus scummy for his joke about andrew is reaching. Andrew agrees with gkriegs and is going to keep his vote on you.
I think I am just not really clear on the meaning of the word "reaching" in this context. Could you paraphrase?
i believe they mean it like you are trying to scumread him and your reasoning is weak
Title: Re: M98: Русская Mafia (Day 1)
Post by: The_Wine_Merchant on April 19, 2017, 04:02:08 pm
I am totally reaching right now on my vote. Everyone is totally reaching right now. This shouldn't be a scumtell for early on Day 1.
Title: Re: M98: Русская Mafia (Day 1)
Post by: faust on April 19, 2017, 04:02:45 pm
Basically a lot of null/early game stuff going on as opposed to mind reading twm who thought you thought the same thing he did about awaclus and voted for him and now won't say what his reasons which he thought were your reasons are/were. He's scummy.
What's scummy about that?
Title: Re: M98: Русская Mafia (Day 1)
Post by: Eevee on April 19, 2017, 04:04:21 pm
I am totally reaching right now on my vote. Everyone is totally reaching right now. This shouldn't be a scumtell for early on Day 1.
I agree. Any reason that follows some sort of logic is way better than slinging votes completely randomly.
Title: Re: M98: Русская Mafia (Day 1)
Post by: faust on April 19, 2017, 04:05:26 pm
i believe they mean it like you are trying to scumread him and your reasoning is weak

Uh huh. Well in that case gkrieg is reaching! Also Andrew. Even though he's really just sheeping and has not contributed anything of value.

Vote: Andrew
Title: Re: M98: Русская Mafia (Day 1)
Post by: faust on April 19, 2017, 04:08:14 pm
I also hink it's scummy that awaclus is leaving his vote on andrew after explaining that it was a single joke post, but I don't see the harm in his vote being here so I would t expect him to unvote either.
I must have skipped the middle of this post. You think it's scummy, but you would not expect him to act differently? That does not seem to make a whole lot of sense.
Title: Re: M98: Русская Mafia (Day 1)
Post by: Eevee on April 19, 2017, 04:08:55 pm
Andrew's ratio of saying things to things having been said about him is very low.
Title: Re: M98: Русская Mafia (Day 1)
Post by: Robz888 on April 19, 2017, 04:11:25 pm
Andrew is being quieter here, but that's gotta look townie on him, since he was hyper active and scum in the last two games.
Title: Re: M98: Русская Mafia (Day 1)
Post by: Awaclus on April 19, 2017, 04:13:47 pm
I've never really understood not sharing your full reads or reasons to vote. Does town need to be deceptive? In the big picture, scum likes people guessing and the situation murky.

But scum doesn't like scum guessing.
Title: Re: M98: Русская Mafia (Day 1)
Post by: The_Wine_Merchant on April 19, 2017, 04:17:11 pm
Andrew is being quieter here, but that's gotta look townie on him, since he was hyper active and scum in the last two games.
He is also VLA or something.
Title: Re: M98: Русская Mafia (Day 1)
Post by: Robz888 on April 19, 2017, 04:17:33 pm
Andrew is being quieter here, but that's gotta look townie on him, since he was hyper active and scum in the last two games.
He is also VLA or something.

Oh, that's right.
Title: Re: M98: Русская Mafia (Day 1)
Post by: gkrieg13 on April 19, 2017, 04:22:47 pm
unvote . I realized reaching at the beginning is more of a faust thing, not really scum!faust.
Title: Re: M98: Русская Mafia (Day 1)
Post by: The_Wine_Merchant on April 19, 2017, 09:36:54 pm
unvote . I realized reaching at the beginning is more of a faust thing, not really scum!faust.
How did you come to that realization?
Title: Re: M98: Русская Mafia (Day 1)
Post by: gkrieg13 on April 19, 2017, 09:43:53 pm
unvote . I realized reaching at the beginning is more of a faust thing, not really scum!faust.
How did you come to that realization?

I woke up this morning and realized it.
Title: Re: M98: Русская Mafia (Day 1)
Post by: schadd on April 19, 2017, 09:56:51 pm
that is an unquestionable answer
Title: Re: M98: Русская Mafia (Day 1)
Post by: The_Wine_Merchant on April 19, 2017, 10:04:13 pm
unvote . I realized reaching at the beginning is more of a faust thing, not really scum!faust.
How did you come to that realization?

I woke up this morning and realized it.
Didn't you realize the opposite this morning?
Title: Re: M98: Русская Mafia (Day 1)
Post by: The_Wine_Merchant on April 19, 2017, 10:04:59 pm
Although I guess my morning isn't necessarily your morning, but I thought we were similar time zones.
Title: Re: M98: Русская Mafia (Day 1)
Post by: gkrieg13 on April 19, 2017, 10:49:26 pm
I mean it was something that just came to me.  It wasn't any one thing.
Title: Re: M98: Русская Mafia (Day 1)
Post by: kkrieg on April 20, 2017, 12:38:36 am
gut feel vote: Awalcus
Title: Re: M98: Русская Mafia (Day 1)
Post by: Awaclus on April 20, 2017, 02:50:08 am
gut feel vote: Awalcus

That's a pretty crappy gut feel.
Title: Re: M98: Русская Mafia (Day 1)
Post by: faust on April 20, 2017, 07:12:41 am
So this game. Kinda sucks, right? We have a weekend coming up soon and then the deadline for today will be right at the end of that weekend, Monday at 5 am. I will be around then, but I assume that none of the US people will. So we really should step it up today and tomorrow.
Title: Re: M98: Русская Mafia (Day 1)
Post by: faust on April 20, 2017, 07:21:47 am
Post count for me to see who is responsible:

Awaclus - 9
Robz888 - 17
The_Wine_Merchant - 21
шэдд (I assume this is schadd by PoE - LaLight, please change this) - 46
Eevee - 17
gkrieg13 - 19
AndrewisFTTW - 4 (VLA)
2.71828..... - 7
faust - 28
mcmcsalot - 10
kkrieg - 7

Everyone with single-digit post count and no VLA is a disgrace.

In my mind, TWM is lurking, so seeing him high up is kinda strange. But I guess it's all relative.

Vote: e LAL
Title: Re: M98: Русская Mafia (Day 1)
Post by: faust on April 20, 2017, 07:25:10 am
Some reads:

TWM is solidly town.
schadd is more townie than scummy, but eh. Anyway he's a bad lynch target for today.
Robz is somewhat towny.

Andrew is the mildest of scum reads, as much as you can get off of 4 VLA posts.
Eevee rubs me the wrong way, not sure why.
Title: Re: M98: Русская Mafia (Day 1)
Post by: Eevee on April 20, 2017, 07:52:38 am
I always rub people the wrong way, that's my curse.

Vote: e Oh my god you lurk so much!
Title: Re: M98: Русская Mafia (Day 1)
Post by: faust on April 20, 2017, 07:58:43 am
It is my curse that somebody always immediately votes for the person I voted for.
Title: Re: M98: Русская Mafia (Day 1)
Post by: Awaclus on April 20, 2017, 08:01:44 am
Everyone with single-digit post count and no VLA is a disgrace.

Good thing I don't have a single-digit post count!
Title: Re: M98: Русская Mafia (Day 1)
Post by: The_Wine_Merchant on April 20, 2017, 08:30:55 am
gk and kk should constantly give their reads of each other.
Title: Re: M98: Русская Mafia (Day 1)
Post by: The_Wine_Merchant on April 20, 2017, 08:43:57 am
I mean it was something that just came to me.  It wasn't any one thing.
I was wondering if it had more to do with the conversation in thread. Which I thought odd that you wouldn't acknowledge, but sure. I cant and don't want to dispute what you are saying.
Title: Re: M98: Русская Mafia (Day 1)
Post by: Robz888 on April 20, 2017, 09:00:37 am
Vote: E for lurking, and also, would probably be good to have a real wagon at this stage of Day 1.
Title: Re: M98: Русская Mafia (Day 1)
Post by: Eevee on April 20, 2017, 09:24:51 am
So this game. Kinda sucks, right? We have a weekend coming up soon and then the deadline for today will be right at the end of that weekend, Monday at 5 am. I will be around then, but I assume that none of the US people will. So we really should step it up today and tomorrow.
Town points for this btw, I had no idea the deadline was so close.
Title: Re: M98: Русская Mafia (PMs are out! N0)
Post by: LaLight on April 20, 2017, 09:58:37 am
Vote Count 1.3

Robz888 (1): schadd
AndrewisFTTW (1): Awaclus
Awaclus (2): The_Wine_Merchant, kkrieg
faust (1): AndrewisFTTW
Eevee (1): 2,71828.....
The_Wine_Merchant (1): mcmcsalot
2,71828..... (3): faust, Eevee, Robz888
Not voting (1): gkrieg13

With 11 alive it takes 6 to lynch. Day 1 ends Monday, 24th of April at 5 am FT.
Title: Re: M98: Русская Mafia (Day 1)
Post by: The_Wine_Merchant on April 20, 2017, 11:14:48 am
Vote: E for lurking, and also, would probably be good to have a real wagon at this stage of Day 1.
Awaclus would be just as large of a "real" wagon had you gone there instead of 2.7.
Title: Re: M98: Русская Mafia (Day 1)
Post by: faust on April 20, 2017, 11:17:32 am
Vote: E for lurking, and also, would probably be good to have a real wagon at this stage of Day 1.
Awaclus would be just as large of a "real" wagon had you gone there instead of 2.7.
What should we vote Awaclus for...? Ah right, you wouldn't tell. Well don't expect to convince a lot of people that way.
Title: Re: M98: Русская Mafia (Day 1)
Post by: The_Wine_Merchant on April 20, 2017, 11:20:06 am
Vote: E for lurking, and also, would probably be good to have a real wagon at this stage of Day 1.
Awaclus would be just as large of a "real" wagon had you gone there instead of 2.7.
What should we vote Awaclus for...? Ah right, you wouldn't tell. Well don't expect to convince a lot of people that way.
I am not trying to convince anyone. I am just telling Robz that if he wanted to make a large wagon, Awaclus was an option as well and noting that he picked 2.7 instead of Awaclus.
Title: Re: M98: Русская Mafia (Day 1)
Post by: gkrieg13 on April 20, 2017, 11:20:49 am
LAL (lynch all lurkers) day 1 has never worked.
Title: Re: M98: Русская Mafia (Day 1)
Post by: The_Wine_Merchant on April 20, 2017, 11:23:31 am
LAL (lynch all lurkers) day 1 has never worked.
Probably because you can't lynch all lurkers at the same time. You can only lynch one, which will be manipulated by mafia to make sure that if there is a mafia they aren't lynched.
Title: Re: M98: Русская Mafia (Day 1)
Post by: faust on April 20, 2017, 11:23:58 am
LAL (lynch all lurkers) day 1 has never worked.
Neither has not lynching them.
Title: Re: M98: Русская Mafia (Day 1)
Post by: gkrieg13 on April 20, 2017, 11:25:51 am
gk and kk should constantly give their reads of each other.

This is hard to do at this point. For reasons, and because she just hasn't posted that much.
Title: Re: M98: Русская Mafia (Day 1)
Post by: gkrieg13 on April 20, 2017, 11:27:04 am
vote: e
Title: Re: M98: Русская Mafia (Day 1)
Post by: faust on April 20, 2017, 11:27:58 am
Interesting™
Title: Re: M98: Русская Mafia (Day 1)
Post by: The_Wine_Merchant on April 20, 2017, 11:33:05 am
Have fairly limited access from now to the end of day 1.

PS: 2.7 has a semi less active announced. That might explain this so-called lurking.
Title: Re: M98: Русская Mafia (Day 1)
Post by: The_Wine_Merchant on April 20, 2017, 11:34:00 am
also it is telling that the people that voted for him couldn't take the 5 seconds to go and see what he had actually posted and see if he was actually lurking and find that little tidbit.
Title: Re: M98: Русская Mafia (Day 1)
Post by: faust on April 20, 2017, 11:36:03 am
also it is telling that the people that voted for him couldn't take the 5 seconds to go and see what he had actually posted and see if he was actually lurking and find that little tidbit.
If someone is VLA, they should post in the appropriate thread. If they fail to do this, that's on them and not on us.
Title: Re: M98: Русская Mafia (Day 1)
Post by: faust on April 20, 2017, 11:36:56 am
Also that post is from yesterday. e has been inactive before that.
Title: Re: M98: Русская Mafia (Day 1)
Post by: The_Wine_Merchant on April 20, 2017, 11:41:34 am
also it is telling that the people that voted for him couldn't take the 5 seconds to go and see what he had actually posted and see if he was actually lurking and find that little tidbit.
If someone is VLA, they should post in the appropriate thread. If they fail to do this, that's on them and not on us.
Sure. But I would think that players would actually go and and assess whether someone was lurking and not completely rely on your vote count. It wasn't like it was hard or onerous for me to do so.
Title: Re: M98: Русская Mafia (Day 1)
Post by: The_Wine_Merchant on April 20, 2017, 11:42:43 am
Also that post is from yesterday. e has been inactive before that.
Okay! You do what you want.
Title: Re: M98: Русская Mafia (Day 1)
Post by: faust on April 20, 2017, 11:46:09 am
also it is telling that the people that voted for him couldn't take the 5 seconds to go and see what he had actually posted and see if he was actually lurking and find that little tidbit.
If someone is VLA, they should post in the appropriate thread. If they fail to do this, that's on them and not on us.
Sure. But I would think that players would actually go and and assess whether someone was lurking and not completely rely on your vote count. It wasn't like it was hard or onerous for me to do so.
Sure I could have reread e, but why? Nothing suggested that I would find such a post. Maybe you remembered it and that is why you checked, which is fine.
Title: Re: M98: Русская Mafia (Day 1)
Post by: The_Wine_Merchant on April 20, 2017, 11:51:45 am
also it is telling that the people that voted for him couldn't take the 5 seconds to go and see what he had actually posted and see if he was actually lurking and find that little tidbit.
If someone is VLA, they should post in the appropriate thread. If they fail to do this, that's on them and not on us.
Sure. But I would think that players would actually go and and assess whether someone was lurking and not completely rely on your vote count. It wasn't like it was hard or onerous for me to do so.
Sure I could have reread e, but why? Nothing suggested that I would find such a post. Maybe you remembered it and that is why you checked, which is fine.
I didn't remember it. I wanted to look at the actual content of his posts if people are voting for him, to see if I wanted to vote for him. I am not saying people should reread him to look for that specific type of a post, but quickly rereading before voting someone rather than relying on the analysis of an unknown player (you) seems like an okish, townie sort of thing to do?
Title: Re: M98: Русская Mafia (Day 1)
Post by: AndrewisFTTW on April 20, 2017, 11:58:36 am
also it is telling that the people that voted for him couldn't take the 5 seconds to go and see what he had actually posted and see if he was actually lurking and find that little tidbit.
If someone is VLA, they should post in the appropriate thread. If they fail to do this, that's on them and not on us.
Sure. But I would think that players would actually go and and assess whether someone was lurking and not completely rely on your vote count. It wasn't like it was hard or onerous for me to do so.
Sure I could have reread e, but why? Nothing suggested that I would find such a post. Maybe you remembered it and that is why you checked, which is fine.

Can we lynch faust now? Not caring enough about possibly mislynching e to actually reread at all.

Also gkrieg's "realization" about faust is... interesting. Not sure I buy it. If one of them flips scum we should lynch the other. This isn't taking into consideration other information of course.

If there was a "Super Crazy V/LA" thread I would've posted in that. I'll be back in business on Sunday.
Title: Re: M98: Русская Mafia (Day 1)
Post by: Robz888 on April 20, 2017, 12:12:26 pm
also it is telling that the people that voted for him couldn't take the 5 seconds to go and see what he had actually posted and see if he was actually lurking and find that little tidbit.
If someone is VLA, they should post in the appropriate thread. If they fail to do this, that's on them and not on us.
Sure. But I would think that players would actually go and and assess whether someone was lurking and not completely rely on your vote count. It wasn't like it was hard or onerous for me to do so.
Sure I could have reread e, but why? Nothing suggested that I would find such a post. Maybe you remembered it and that is why you checked, which is fine.

Can we lynch faust now? Not caring enough about possibly mislynching e to actually reread at all.

That's a pretty unfair reading of what faust said in response to TWM. Vote: Andrew
Title: Re: M98: Русская Mafia (Day 1)
Post by: gkrieg13 on April 20, 2017, 03:45:35 pm
I actually don't think I'll be any better at reading kkrieg
Title: Re: M98: Русская Mafia (Day 1)
Post by: 2.71828..... on April 20, 2017, 04:39:20 pm
A wagon! Great. The best way to combat it will be to post a bunch, so I will do what I can.
Title: Re: M98: Русская Mafia (Day 1)
Post by: 2.71828..... on April 20, 2017, 04:45:19 pm
It is interesting that no one brought up my vote on eevee, rather just how I was lurking. No one wants to buddy eevee? He is such a buddy-able person. Super friendly to everyone
Title: Re: M98: Русская Mafia (Day 1)
Post by: 2.71828..... on April 20, 2017, 04:48:29 pm
So the question becomes, did scum vote for me, and does eevee have some sort of relationship with scum?

Faust voting me was a fairly standard "get the game moving" post- very alignment neutral. The following votes didn't build on it at all, mostly just sheeping, which isn't terrible, but easy for scum to do
Title: Re: M98: Русская Mafia (Day 1)
Post by: AndrewisFTTW on April 20, 2017, 04:53:32 pm
also it is telling that the people that voted for him couldn't take the 5 seconds to go and see what he had actually posted and see if he was actually lurking and find that little tidbit.
If someone is VLA, they should post in the appropriate thread. If they fail to do this, that's on them and not on us.
Sure. But I would think that players would actually go and and assess whether someone was lurking and not completely rely on your vote count. It wasn't like it was hard or onerous for me to do so.
Sure I could have reread e, but why? Nothing suggested that I would find such a post. Maybe you remembered it and that is why you checked, which is fine.

Can we lynch faust now? Not caring enough about possibly mislynching e to actually reread at all.

That's a pretty unfair reading of what faust said in response to TWM. Vote: Andrew

Yeah I guess you're right.

Unvote

BUT! faust's case on e is pretty much that he's lurking, which is kinda lame, amirite?
Title: Re: M98: Русская Mafia (Day 1)
Post by: AndrewisFTTW on April 20, 2017, 04:58:55 pm
Wait why am I directing that to you? You're responsible for this as well!

Vote: E for lurking, and also, would probably be good to have a real wagon at this stage of Day 1.

Booooo!
Title: Re: M98: Русская Mafia (Day 1)
Post by: AndrewisFTTW on April 20, 2017, 05:00:27 pm
vote: e

What's up with this? Your post before this was saying lynching lurkers doesn't work.
Title: Re: M98: Русская Mafia (Day 1)
Post by: 2.71828..... on April 20, 2017, 05:00:49 pm
LAL (lynch all lurkers) day 1 has never worked.
Neither has not lynching them.

Very accurate. Scum have lurked to victory several times. The more you post the easier it is to come across scummy...or appear towny.
Title: Re: M98: Русская Mafia (Day 1)
Post by: faust on April 20, 2017, 06:00:01 pm
BUT! faust's case on e is pretty much that he's lurking, which is kinda lame, amirite?
Lurking is also kinda lame.

There will be more substantial voting tomorrow. Pushing this "lynch all lurkers" has yielded some interesting results.
Title: Re: M98: Русская Mafia (Day 1)
Post by: The_Wine_Merchant on April 20, 2017, 06:00:34 pm
Any interest in mcmc or gkrieg?
Title: Re: M98: Русская Mafia (Day 1)
Post by: faust on April 20, 2017, 06:02:26 pm
Any interest in mcmc or gkrieg?
Not really? The only thing I remember about mcmc is that we disagreed about something. That is usually a town tell for him. gkrieg seems purposefully enigmatic, I'm not sure what's up with that, but would say it's more likely to come from town.
Title: Re: M98: Русская Mafia (Day 1)
Post by: The_Wine_Merchant on April 20, 2017, 06:03:55 pm
Any interest in mcmc or gkrieg?
Not really? The only thing I remember about mcmc is that we disagreed about something. That is usually a town tell for him.
Why is it ok for mcmc to lurk, but not 2.7?
Title: Re: M98: Русская Mafia (Day 1)
Post by: faust on April 20, 2017, 06:05:57 pm
Any interest in mcmc or gkrieg?
Not really? The only thing I remember about mcmc is that we disagreed about something. That is usually a town tell for him.
Why is it ok for mcmc to lurk, but not 2.7?
It's not. Did I not just say I don't actually want to push lurker lynches? At least not now. Close to deadline may be a different story.
Title: Re: M98: Русская Mafia (Day 1)
Post by: faust on April 20, 2017, 06:07:09 pm
The simple truth is that any lurker is offering himself up as a fallback lynch.
Title: Re: M98: Русская Mafia (Day 1)
Post by: The_Wine_Merchant on April 20, 2017, 06:11:46 pm
Any interest in mcmc or gkrieg?
Not really? The only thing I remember about mcmc is that we disagreed about something. That is usually a town tell for him.
Why is it ok for mcmc to lurk, but not 2.7?
It's not. Did I not just say I don't actually want to push lurker lynches? At least not now. Close to deadline may be a different story.
You say it's not. But your voting is indicating differently. I am trying to figure out why that is. You are voting for 2.7 and the only reason you have given is that he is a lurker. Therefore, I am concluding you want to push a lurker lynch. I am sorry if I can't read between the lines to find nonexistent subtext.
Title: Re: M98: Русская Mafia (Day 1)
Post by: schadd on April 20, 2017, 06:15:13 pm
Any interest in mcmc or gkrieg?
those are the two people i currently find most interesting. maybe other than faust
Title: Re: M98: Русская Mafia (Day 1)
Post by: faust on April 20, 2017, 06:15:41 pm
Any interest in mcmc or gkrieg?
Not really? The only thing I remember about mcmc is that we disagreed about something. That is usually a town tell for him.
Why is it ok for mcmc to lurk, but not 2.7?
It's not. Did I not just say I don't actually want to push lurker lynches? At least not now. Close to deadline may be a different story.
You say it's not. But your voting is indicating differently. I am trying to figure out why that is. You are voting for 2.7 and the only reason you have given is that he is a lurker. Therefore, I am concluding you want to push a lurker lynch. I am sorry if I can't read between the lines to find nonexistent subtext.
No need to get angry. My vote is on e because I don't know where else to put it yet. But I am also tired and need to sleep, so there will not be any big revelations today. Which, I believe, is pretty much what I already said.

There will be more substantial voting tomorrow.
Title: Re: M98: Русская Mafia (Day 1)
Post by: The_Wine_Merchant on April 20, 2017, 06:16:47 pm
I thought you meant tomorrow as in Day 2, not tomorrow as in April 21. I misread (but to be fair to me, the word tomorrow in this game has multiple meanings that aren't always completely clear).
Title: Re: M98: Русская Mafia (Day 1)
Post by: schadd on April 20, 2017, 06:18:21 pm
i usually capitalize them when i'm referring to the game time. and capitalization being interesting is one of the luxuries afforded when you don't usually do it
Title: Re: M98: Русская Mafia (Day 1)
Post by: The_Wine_Merchant on April 20, 2017, 09:24:12 pm
I want to lynch everyone! I am lacking town reads in a major way.
Title: Re: M98: Русская Mafia (Day 1)
Post by: kkrieg on April 20, 2017, 10:57:02 pm
I'm probably a lurker right now huh?
Faust seems fairly towny which makes me want to jump on the e train.
Title: Re: M98: Русская Mafia (Day 1)
Post by: 2.71828..... on April 20, 2017, 11:44:22 pm
I'm probably a lurker right now huh?
Faust seems fairly towny which makes me want to jump on the e train.

You mean the eevee train.

This post is really interesting by kkrieg. And I think scummy

Vote: kkrieg
Title: Re: M98: Русская Mafia (Day 1)
Post by: kkrieg on April 21, 2017, 12:54:21 am
I'm probably a lurker right now huh?
Faust seems fairly towny which makes me want to jump on the e train.

You mean the eevee train.

This post is really interesting by kkrieg. And I think scummy

Vote: kkrieg
Haha my reasoning for posting that was "I have no scum reads so I'll try to be helpful by showing I'm town by agreeing with someone else who seems towny."

Seems like that backfired.
Title: Re: M98: Русская Mafia (Day 1)
Post by: faust on April 21, 2017, 03:20:31 am
I thought you meant tomorrow as in Day 2, not tomorrow as in April 21. I misread (but to be fair to me, the word tomorrow in this game has multiple meanings that aren't always completely clear).
Ah, I see, sorry then, it was a bit unclear.
Title: Re: M98: Русская Mafia (Day 1)
Post by: faust on April 21, 2017, 04:22:49 am
I want to take a look at some people that we haven't talked about a lot.

First, Robz:
Beginning is some theory and then fluff, for quite a while. He continues to say that he's bad at reading Andrew. Okay. Some more theory stuff. Then this:
Just caught up, whole lot of completely empty posts from schadd, which I don't think is scum indicative but boy is it annoying.
The first post even resembling a read. Some more complaining that he doesn't follow. Oookay, the first read is on Andrew, who is town because he's quiet. So the one guy Robz said he cannot read is his first read? Also Andrew was VLA. First vote is e for lurking. Then Andrew vote again. What's with his strange obsession with Andrew? And that's it. A single read (which later flipped), nothing else. Not sure if this is scummy, but it is bad for town.
Title: Re: M98: Русская Mafia (Day 1)
Post by: faust on April 21, 2017, 04:24:25 am
Robz voting e for lurking is definitely hypocritical as Robz's whole play so far has been actilurking.
Title: Re: M98: Русская Mafia (Day 1)
Post by: faust on April 21, 2017, 08:51:29 am
And now for mcmc.

First post:
Hey everyone! I agree I like the bodyguard claiming and being an ic over being a useless bodyguard. Reading the setup though a bodyguard claim lets mafia know 100% the setup. A bodyguard is only present in two scenarios and in one of those mafia has a power.

Though I'm not sure if it's a problem if mafia know what the setup is. I feel like this setup is more solevable than most from one or two roles so I don't think mafia can really fake claim.
Interesting that mcmc thinks in terms of fakeclaims when that was not what I had in mind as a drawback.

He fights a lot with TWM. Somehow odd, I like TWM's behaviour here. I guess that is part of the disagreeing thing.
mcmc, do you think i think you're town or scum?


will ask again later

I think you think I'm town.
I think that is the answer I expect from scum.

Then this post (http://forum.dominionstrategy.com/index.php?topic=17163.msg689623#msg689623) does not make much sense; I have already addressed it.

Also, his last post is over 40 hours ago  >:(
Prod: mcmc
Title: Re: M98: Русская Mafia (Day 1)
Post by: LaLight on April 21, 2017, 08:56:37 am
Prod: mcmc

Sent.
Title: Re: M98: Русская Mafia (Day 1)
Post by: faust on April 21, 2017, 09:06:35 am
I find it difficult to judge mcmc's play. Last game we agreed a lot and he was scum. So how would scum!mcmc play this? Probably not the same. But I think he would try to interact with me. There hasn't been a lot of that. So town? Maybe it's just too early to tell.
Title: Re: M98: Русская Mafia (Day 1)
Post by: faust on April 21, 2017, 09:06:51 am
Vote: Robz
Title: Re: M98: Русская Mafia (Day 1)
Post by: mcmcsalot on April 21, 2017, 09:12:48 am
Woo I'm here! Umm I guess I don't know why more people don't think twm is scummy because I do but maybe I'm wrong. Faust seems like Faust. I would say I feel like 2.7 is lurking more then robz because I feel like I can remember the things robz has said better but that probably just because he is my brother. I don't feel like much has happened yet.
Title: Re: M98: Русская Mafia (PMs are out! N0)
Post by: LaLight on April 21, 2017, 09:13:17 am
Vote Count 1.4

Robz888 (2): schadd, faust
AndrewisFTTW (2): Awaclus, Robz888
Awaclus (2): The_Wine_Merchant, kkrieg
The_Wine_Merchant (1): mcmcsalot
2,71828..... (2): Eevee, gkrieg13
kkrieg (1): 2,71828.....
Not voting (1): AndrewisFTTW

With 11 alive it takes 6 to lynch. Day 1 ends Monday, 24th of April at 5 am FT.
Title: Re: M98: Русская Mafia (Day 1)
Post by: schadd on April 21, 2017, 09:21:26 am
I'm probably a lurker right now huh?
Faust seems fairly towny which makes me want to jump on the e train.

You mean the eevee train.

This post is really interesting by kkrieg. And I think scummy

Vote: kkrieg
Haha my reasoning for posting that was "I have no scum reads so I'll try to be helpful by showing I'm town by agreeing with someone else who seems towny."

Seems like that backfired.
that seems less like a reason for your post and more like exactly the thing that you postsed
Title: Re: M98: Русская Mafia (Day 1)
Post by: Robz888 on April 21, 2017, 09:21:59 am
Woo I'm here! Umm I guess I don't know why more people don't think twm is scummy because I do but maybe I'm wrong. Faust seems like Faust. I would say I feel like 2.7 is lurking more then robz because I feel like I can remember the things robz has said better but that probably just because he is my brother. I don't feel like much has happened yet.

Agreed. Townie post.
Title: Re: M98: Русская Mafia (Day 1)
Post by: Robz888 on April 21, 2017, 09:23:55 am
I want to take a look at some people that we haven't talked about a lot.

First, Robz:
Beginning is some theory and then fluff, for quite a while. He continues to say that he's bad at reading Andrew. Okay. Some more theory stuff. Then this:
Just caught up, whole lot of completely empty posts from schadd, which I don't think is scum indicative but boy is it annoying.
The first post even resembling a read. Some more complaining that he doesn't follow. Oookay, the first read is on Andrew, who is town because he's quiet. So the one guy Robz said he cannot read is his first read? Also Andrew was VLA. First vote is e for lurking. Then Andrew vote again. What's with his strange obsession with Andrew? And that's it. A single read (which later flipped), nothing else. Not sure if this is scummy, but it is bad for town.

I'm not obsessed with Andrew, but his vote for you was like the first thing that happened this game where I had some opinion. It was a bad vote, and I called it out. So that's a contribution, sorry there hasn't been more, but I didn't really follow the TWM thing and well, what else has even happened? And 'acti-lurking" is becoming something of a smear, where anyone who isn't lurking, but is also not the number 1 post leader, is somehow act-lurking.
Title: Re: M98: Русская Mafia (Day 1)
Post by: 2.71828..... on April 21, 2017, 09:28:47 am
I'm probably a lurker right now huh?
Faust seems fairly towny which makes me want to jump on the e train.

You mean the eevee train.

This post is really interesting by kkrieg. And I think scummy

Vote: kkrieg
Haha my reasoning for posting that was "I have no scum reads so I'll try to be helpful by showing I'm town by agreeing with someone else who seems towny."

Seems like that backfired.

It is the trying to seem helpful without actually committing to anything that I think is scummy. I know that is something that I did in one of my first scum games and was caught because of it. That is what I see here.
Title: Re: M98: Русская Mafia (Day 1)
Post by: schadd on April 21, 2017, 09:29:50 am
And 'acti-lurking" is becoming something of a smear, where anyone who isn't lurking, but is also not the number 1 post leader, is somehow act-lurking.
i beg to differ. i'm the number 1 post leader and i'm actilurking
Title: Re: M98: Русская Mafia (Day 1)
Post by: faust on April 21, 2017, 09:38:18 am
I want to take a look at some people that we haven't talked about a lot.

First, Robz:
Beginning is some theory and then fluff, for quite a while. He continues to say that he's bad at reading Andrew. Okay. Some more theory stuff. Then this:
Just caught up, whole lot of completely empty posts from schadd, which I don't think is scum indicative but boy is it annoying.
The first post even resembling a read. Some more complaining that he doesn't follow. Oookay, the first read is on Andrew, who is town because he's quiet. So the one guy Robz said he cannot read is his first read? Also Andrew was VLA. First vote is e for lurking. Then Andrew vote again. What's with his strange obsession with Andrew? And that's it. A single read (which later flipped), nothing else. Not sure if this is scummy, but it is bad for town.

I'm not obsessed with Andrew, but his vote for you was like the first thing that happened this game where I had some opinion. It was a bad vote, and I called it out. So that's a contribution, sorry there hasn't been more, but I didn't really follow the TWM thing and well, what else has even happened? And 'acti-lurking" is becoming something of a smear, where anyone who isn't lurking, but is also not the number 1 post leader, is somehow act-lurking.
I feel like I should put my standard response to this easily copy&pastable.
Title: Re: M98: Русская Mafia (Day 1)
Post by: faust on April 21, 2017, 09:41:55 am
Woo I'm here! Umm I guess I don't know why more people don't think twm is scummy because I do but maybe I'm wrong. Faust seems like Faust. I would say I feel like 2.7 is lurking more then robz because I feel like I can remember the things robz has said better but that probably just because he is my brother. I don't feel like much has happened yet.

Agreed. Townie post.
Why is it townie?
Title: Re: M98: Русская Mafia (Day 1)
Post by: The_Wine_Merchant on April 21, 2017, 09:43:56 am
I find it difficult to judge mcmc's play. Last game we agreed a lot and he was scum. So how would scum!mcmc play this? Probably not the same. But I think he would try to interact with me. There hasn't been a lot of that. So town? Maybe it's just too early to tell.

From the two games I have played with him, he is more M91 (where he was partners with me and super lurky and barely posting early) than M96 (where he was super active and basically leading the town).

So, I am finding him scummy based on that alone. But probably not worth a vote on that alone.
Title: Re: M98: Русская Mafia (Day 1)
Post by: Robz888 on April 21, 2017, 10:00:52 am
Woo I'm here! Umm I guess I don't know why more people don't think twm is scummy because I do but maybe I'm wrong. Faust seems like Faust. I would say I feel like 2.7 is lurking more then robz because I feel like I can remember the things robz has said better but that probably just because he is my brother. I don't feel like much has happened yet.

Agreed. Townie post.
Why is it townie?

Because it mirrors my thoughts, and I am a townie.
Title: Re: M98: Русская Mafia (Day 1)
Post by: faust on April 21, 2017, 10:02:39 am
Woo I'm here! Umm I guess I don't know why more people don't think twm is scummy because I do but maybe I'm wrong. Faust seems like Faust. I would say I feel like 2.7 is lurking more then robz because I feel like I can remember the things robz has said better but that probably just because he is my brother. I don't feel like much has happened yet.

Agreed. Townie post.
Why is it townie?

Because it mirrors my thoughts, and I am a townie.
You also can rembember things you said better because you are your brother?
Title: Re: M98: Русская Mafia (Day 1)
Post by: faust on April 21, 2017, 10:03:32 am
More importantly maybe, do you also think TWM is scummy?
Title: Re: M98: Русская Mafia (Day 1)
Post by: Robz888 on April 21, 2017, 10:38:31 am
Woo I'm here! Umm I guess I don't know why more people don't think twm is scummy because I do but maybe I'm wrong. Faust seems like Faust. I would say I feel like 2.7 is lurking more then robz because I feel like I can remember the things robz has said better but that probably just because he is my brother. I don't feel like much has happened yet.

Agreed. Townie post.
Why is it townie?

Because it mirrors my thoughts, and I am a townie.
You also can rembember things you said better because you are your brother?

I agree that faust seems like town, and E's lurking is worse than mine own, and nothing much has happened yet, and yes I remember things mcmc says better than other people.

I actually don't really have a scum read on TWM, though. That's because TWM has been scum in both of the other games I've played with him, and I actually had a strong hunch that he was scum very early on in both those games, and I'm not getting that hunch here.
Title: Re: M98: Русская Mafia (Day 1)
Post by: mcmcsalot on April 21, 2017, 10:53:38 am
I find it difficult to judge mcmc's play. Last game we agreed a lot and he was scum. So how would scum!mcmc play this? Probably not the same. But I think he would try to interact with me. There hasn't been a lot of that. So town? Maybe it's just too early to tell.

From the two games I have played with him, he is more M91 (where he was partners with me and super lurky and barely posting early) than M96 (where he was super active and basically leading the town).

So, I am finding him scummy based on that alone. But probably not worth a vote on that alone.

I totally get why you feel that way. I think it's more of the fact that I played a couple scum games where town was really inactive and manipulating people as scum was really easy so when I drew a town pr where getting nightkilled was beneficial I tried my absolute hardest to be a super active townie. The results of that were leading town toward two mislynches and being caught by scum who worked around my pr for an all around loss.
Title: Re: M98: Русская Mafia (Day 1)
Post by: faust on April 21, 2017, 10:53:52 am
I'm probably a lurker right now huh?
Faust seems fairly towny which makes me want to jump on the e train.
I would prefer you jumped the Robz train.
Title: Re: M98: Русская Mafia (Day 1)
Post by: faust on April 21, 2017, 10:55:08 am
I find it difficult to judge mcmc's play. Last game we agreed a lot and he was scum. So how would scum!mcmc play this? Probably not the same. But I think he would try to interact with me. There hasn't been a lot of that. So town? Maybe it's just too early to tell.

From the two games I have played with him, he is more M91 (where he was partners with me and super lurky and barely posting early) than M96 (where he was super active and basically leading the town).

So, I am finding him scummy based on that alone. But probably not worth a vote on that alone.

I totally get why you feel that way. I think it's more of the fact that I played a couple scum games where town was really inactive and manipulating people as scum was really easy so when I drew a town pr where getting nightkilled was beneficial I tried my absolute hardest to be a super active townie. The results of that were leading town toward two mislynches and being caught by scum who worked around my pr for an all around loss.
Would you answer the questions I posed earlier?
Title: Re: M98: Русская Mafia (Day 1)
Post by: mcmcsalot on April 21, 2017, 11:18:51 am
Oh my bad, all of your questions I think relate to one post.

This feels like it is reaching from faust on Awaclus.

I agree. Keeping my vote on faust for now.
I feel like I have to ask now: What does this even mean?

I don't see what you don't get. Gkriegs thinks you finding awaclus scummy for his joke about andrew is reaching. Andrew agrees with gkriegs and is going to keep his vote on you.

I think it's an okay theory about why scum!awaclus would make that joke post but I see why gkriegs thinks your reaching. It's an early theory though so they are kinda all reaching. I also hink it's scummy that awaclus is leaving his vote on andrew after explaining that it was a single joke post, but I don't see the harm in his vote being here so I would t expect him to unvote either.

Basically a lot of null/early game stuff going on as opposed to mind reading twm who thought you thought the same thing he did about awaclus and voted for him and now won't say what his reasons which he thought were your reasons are/were. He's scummy.
First you ask me to paraphrase reaching because it's still confusing. I kinda thought this was explained but gkriegs is just saying you are making a case out of nothing, or that you are taking a small thing, awaclus' post, and making a bunch of jumps to conclusions. It was then discussed that that's understandable because it's early.

Then you ask
I also hink it's scummy that awaclus is leaving his vote on andrew after explaining that it was a single joke post, but I don't see the harm in his vote being here so I would t expect him to unvote either.
I must have skipped the middle of this post. You think it's scummy, but you would not expect him to act differently? That does not seem to make a whole lot of sense.
I am saying that I don't have a good read on awaclus. It's a bit strange he decided to leave his vote after explaining it was sort of a joke vote, but upon second thought it's not like there are wagons formed, it's not like Andrew has been super townie, there is no real reason I would expect town!awaclus to unvote in this situation so I shouldn't find it scummy that he doesn't.

And this question
Basically a lot of null/early game stuff going on as opposed to mind reading twm who thought you thought the same thing he did about awaclus and voted for him and now won't say what his reasons which he thought were your reasons are/were. He's scummy.
What's scummy about that?
Twm sheeped you and voted for awaclus and also said he thought he knew your reasons and that he was voting for the same reasons and tried to make me look bad for asking him about his reasons by saying why don't I go look for them. Me and a few others then looked for your reasons and really couldn't find any. That was when you clarified your reason which gkriegs called reaching and twm said he was voting for awaclus for different reasons but that he didn't want to share them. To me all of what I just described twm doing is scummy.
Title: Re: M98: Русская Mafia (Day 1)
Post by: faust on April 21, 2017, 12:22:30 pm
Basically a lot of null/early game stuff going on as opposed to mind reading twm who thought you thought the same thing he did about awaclus and voted for him and now won't say what his reasons which he thought were your reasons are/were. He's scummy.
What's scummy about that?
Twm sheeped you and voted for awaclus and also said he thought he knew your reasons and that he was voting for the same reasons and tried to make me look bad for asking him about his reasons by saying why don't I go look for them. Me and a few others then looked for your reasons and really couldn't find any. That was when you clarified your reason which gkriegs called reaching and twm said he was voting for awaclus for different reasons but that he didn't want to share them. To me all of what I just described twm doing is scummy.
I know that all of this happened; it's in the thread. But this answer brings me no closer to understanding why you think TWM is scum.
Title: Re: M98: Русская Mafia (Day 1)
Post by: mcmcsalot on April 21, 2017, 01:23:59 pm
That's why I didn't answer before, I don't really have a better answer then I think what twm did is scummy. I mean it's not even crazy scummy, it's just the scummiest thing I have seen yet. Maybe it helps if I tell a narrative that fits.

I feel like scum!twm want to add his vote to yours when he sees you vote but doesn't want to be the one "pushing" the wagon so he just sheeps and when I ask him about his reasons he gives me this its the same reasons as Faust, go see for yourself. It's just wierd for a towny to say that especially given the fact that it wasn't obviouse what your reasons were for multiple people. Furthermore once you give your reason and gkriegs says it's reaching twm doesn't back you up, he becomes more cryptic about what his reasons are. Just feels like scum hoping you or other townies will take the lead in going for an awaclus lynch.
Title: Re: M98: Русская Mafia (Day 1)
Post by: The_Wine_Merchant on April 21, 2017, 01:32:47 pm
I feel like scum!twm want to add his vote to yours when he sees you vote but doesn't want to be the one "pushing" the wagon so he just sheeps and when I ask him about his reasons he gives me this its the same reasons as Faust, go see for yourself. It's just wierd for a towny to say that especially given the fact that it wasn't obviouse what your reasons were for multiple people. Furthermore once you give your reason and gkriegs says it's reaching twm doesn't back you up, he becomes more cryptic about what his reasons are. Just feels like scum hoping you or other townies will take the lead in going for an awaclus lynch.
Weird isn't scummy. And being cryptic, which if I am town there is probably a reason for right, has brought more attention to me. If I were scum, being cryptic does nothing for me, except bring bad attention to me. It isn't like it would be hard to make up a reason for voting Awaclus.
Title: Re: M98: Русская Mafia (Day 1)
Post by: schadd on April 21, 2017, 01:41:00 pm
i don't think you had strong reason to believe it would give you negative attention
Title: Re: M98: Русская Mafia (Day 1)
Post by: The_Wine_Merchant on April 21, 2017, 01:49:56 pm
i don't think you had strong reason to believe it would give you negative attention
Hm. True I guess.
Title: Re: M98: Русская Mafia (Day 1)
Post by: schadd on April 21, 2017, 02:00:49 pm
my favorite thing in mafia is when u say something and it's Correct
Title: Re: M98: Русская Mafia (Day 1)
Post by: The_Wine_Merchant on April 21, 2017, 02:02:47 pm
my favorite thing in mafia is when u say something and it's Correct
Capitalization! Does that signify it means something different?
Title: Re: M98: Русская Mafia (Day 1)
Post by: schadd on April 21, 2017, 02:07:03 pm
it doesn't mean anything different than the word "correct"
Title: Re: M98: Русская Mafia (Day 1)
Post by: mcmcsalot on April 21, 2017, 03:11:56 pm
Weird isn't scummy. And being cryptic, which if I am town there is probably a reason for right, has brought more attention to me. If I were scum, being cryptic does nothing for me, except bring bad attention to me. It isn't like it would be hard to make up a reason for voting Awaclus.

Wierd kinda is scummy. I don't really get the reasons town has to be cryptic. And like schadd said I don't think you expected to get any attention. I think unless I asked you why you voted you were going to get no attention which is why I asked you in the first place. I can't figure out why you've clammed up and been defensive about the situation and it's more of an alignment indication then I've got anywhere else.
Title: Re: M98: Русская Mafia (Day 1)
Post by: The_Wine_Merchant on April 21, 2017, 03:16:07 pm
Weird isn't scummy. And being cryptic, which if I am town there is probably a reason for right, has brought more attention to me. If I were scum, being cryptic does nothing for me, except bring bad attention to me. It isn't like it would be hard to make up a reason for voting Awaclus.

Wierd kinda is scummy. I don't really get the reasons town has to be cryptic. And like schadd said I don't think you expected to get any attention. I think unless I asked you why you voted you were going to get no attention which is why I asked you in the first place. I can't figure out why you've clammed up and been defensive about the situation and it's more of an alignment indication then I've got anywhere else.
OK. But I don't think I have clammed up or been defensive. I have answered questions and provided my reasoning. Except for the one part that I don't want to explain.
Title: Re: M98: Русская Mafia (Day 1)
Post by: Robz888 on April 21, 2017, 03:34:11 pm
People who don't to explain stuff are usually town PRs, in my experience.
Title: Re: M98: Русская Mafia (Day 1)
Post by: AndrewisFTTW on April 21, 2017, 03:59:26 pm
People who don't to explain stuff are usually town PRs, in my experience.

Vote: Robz
Title: Re: M98: Русская Mafia (Day 1)
Post by: Eevee on April 21, 2017, 03:59:56 pm
semi-vla, very busy wekeend. i'll read and get some posts in during the day tomorrow and sunday
Title: Re: M98: Русская Mafia (Day 1)
Post by: The_Wine_Merchant on April 21, 2017, 04:04:19 pm
People who don't to explain stuff are usually town PRs, in my experience.
Yeah. I don't know what to say to that.
Title: Re: M98: Русская Mafia (Day 1)
Post by: faust on April 21, 2017, 04:11:09 pm
I may be warming up to an Andrew lynch.
Title: Re: M98: Русская Mafia (Day 1)
Post by: Robz888 on April 21, 2017, 04:13:27 pm
I may be warming up to an Andrew lynch.

He did straight-up misrepresent your comment about E.
Title: Re: M98: Русская Mafia (Day 1)
Post by: faust on April 21, 2017, 04:18:52 pm
A lot of people in this game seem to have very strange ideas about what kind of behaviour one should expect from scum.
Title: Re: M98: Русская Mafia (Day 1)
Post by: AndrewisFTTW on April 21, 2017, 04:29:56 pm
I may be warming up to an Andrew lynch.

He did straight-up misrepresent your comment about E.

Kinda sorta maybe? Not on purpose though.

A lot of people in this game seem to have very strange ideas about what kind of behaviour one should expect from scum.

Like who/what?
Title: Re: M98: Русская Mafia (Day 1)
Post by: faust on April 21, 2017, 04:46:46 pm
Like who/what?
You, Robz, mcmc. And that's just in the last 10 posts.
Title: Re: M98: Русская Mafia (Day 1)
Post by: Robz888 on April 21, 2017, 04:47:52 pm
Like who/what?
You, Robz, mcmc. And that's just in the last 10 posts.

So what should I be looking for, to find scum, then? I'm not saying you're wrong, I've had good cause to ask myself this very question in recent games.
Title: Re: M98: Русская Mafia (Day 1)
Post by: 2.71828..... on April 21, 2017, 04:56:06 pm
A lot of people in this game seem to have very strange ideas about what kind of behaviour one should expect from scum.

So that's why I go after townies as lynch targets. That being said, while I know I probably won't get much movement on kkrieg, I really like my vote
Title: Re: M98: Русская Mafia (Day 1)
Post by: AndrewisFTTW on April 21, 2017, 04:58:09 pm
A lot of people in this game seem to have very strange ideas about what kind of behaviour one should expect from scum.

So that's why I go after townies as lynch targets. That being said, while I know I probably won't get much movement on kkrieg, I really like my vote

... Where's gkrieg when you need him?
Title: Re: M98: Русская Mafia (Day 1)
Post by: The_Wine_Merchant on April 21, 2017, 05:21:53 pm
I may be warming up to an Andrew lynch.
Nah. That is actually one spot I don't like. That and 2.7.
Title: Re: M98: Русская Mafia (Day 1)
Post by: gkrieg13 on April 21, 2017, 05:49:07 pm
Ok, I'm around for a bit.  Time to do a little reading.
Title: Re: M98: Русская Mafia (Day 1)
Post by: gkrieg13 on April 21, 2017, 05:57:07 pm
only one of them is scum though

I've been thinking about this more and if you pick any two people in this game, the chances that one of them is scum is pretty high.

the thing about those is you have to think about whether it makes sense to be alignment indicative and whether there might be natural reasons i might decide not to do it. one might not be led to believe so but i've been trying to thin my arsenal of tells


That is very anti-town of you.

Also you never responded to this schadd.

Note: TWM seems a little bit more abrasive than we have seen in his scum games.  I think he is likely town here.

I think TWM is assuming a lot thinking he knows exactly why faust is voting the way he is
Probably. But in reality I am voting for awaclus for my own reasons. I just happen to think faust thought the same thing. I could be wrong about that. I am just telling mcmcsalot how I got there.

I've read and I can't figure out what these reasons are for either of you. How you think you know you have the same reasons is crazy.

I also thought we weren't claiming non bodyguard, 2.7 was just saying we probably don't have one since no one has claimed and robz took that to mean he should affirm that he is not the bodyguard. Kk then followed suit. All in all a pretty normal thing for those people to do.

On the other hand, mcmc seems more buddying like his scum games.

vote: mcmcsalot

I cannot follow any of the conversation here. I don't see why people are voting Awaclus, and I don't see what TWM was getting at.

This seems like a strange post from scum!Robz.  Seems more likely to come from town.

Ok, gotta go.  I stopped reading at #189 (for personal notes.)
Title: Re: M98: Русская Mafia (Day 1)
Post by: schadd on April 21, 2017, 06:36:53 pm
only one of them is scum though
I've been thinking about this more and if you pick any two people in this game, the chances that one of them is scum is pretty high.
are you, uh, calling me an unimpressive town player?



the thing about those is you have to think about whether it makes sense to be alignment indicative and whether there might be natural reasons i might decide not to do it. one might not be led to believe so but i've been trying to thin my arsenal of tells
That is very anti-town of you.
sorry, i didn't understand what you were calling anti-town. that i've been retiring tells i have that don't work?
Title: Re: M98: Русская Mafia (Day 1)
Post by: schadd on April 21, 2017, 06:38:33 pm
also mcmc buddied like {an analogy} last game
Title: Re: M98: Русская Mafia (Day 1)
Post by: Eevee on April 21, 2017, 08:56:20 pm
weird is towny.

robz is towny

mcmc scummy

got to give town points for faust for leading

why is andrew brought up so often as a viable lynch without accompanying vote movement?
Title: Re: M98: Русская Mafia (Day 1)
Post by: Eevee on April 21, 2017, 08:56:57 pm
weird is towny.

robz is towny

mcmc scummy

got to give town points for faust for leading

why is andrew brought up so often as a viable lynch without accompanying vote movement?
forgot the actual reason for starting this post: twm is towny
Title: Re: M98: Русская Mafia (Day 1)
Post by: schadd on April 21, 2017, 08:58:46 pm
weird is towny.

robz is towny

mcmc scummy

got to give town points for faust for leading

why is andrew brought up so often as a viable lynch without accompanying vote movement?
boom. pow. blam. whap. [bone crunching sounds]
Title: Re: M98: Русская Mafia (Day 1)
Post by: Eevee on April 21, 2017, 09:05:10 pm
weird is towny.

robz is towny

mcmc scummy

got to give town points for faust for leading

why is andrew brought up so often as a viable lynch without accompanying vote movement?
boom. pow. blam. whap. [bone crunching sounds]
unrelated, but i always feel so smart for using words like accompanying or movement, literally only because they have so many letters. i may be dumb.
Title: Re: M98: Русская Mafia (Day 1)
Post by: schadd on April 21, 2017, 09:15:54 pm

i don't think you're dumb but you might not speak english as a first language.

i am pretty sure we're not buddying each other, right now. yes?
Title: Re: M98: Русская Mafia (Day 1)
Post by: Eevee on April 21, 2017, 09:23:22 pm
that seems like a somewhat odd question, i havent even addressed you at all!

you did say you don't think i'm dumb, there might be something there. but i didn't get the feeling you said it to influence my behavior in the game, i think you are just a nice guy. (oh, and it isn't, and thanks!)

now if at some later point in the game you said "what the hell man,  i thought we were friends, i even called you not dumb, and now you are voting for me!? what is this?", then that would change
things.
Title: Re: M98: Русская Mafia (Day 1)
Post by: schadd on April 21, 2017, 09:24:37 pm
i think you are just a nice guy.
you said this a few times l@st g@me
Title: Re: M98: Русская Mafia (Day 1)
Post by: The_Wine_Merchant on April 21, 2017, 09:25:00 pm
weird is towny.

robz is towny

mcmc scummy

got to give town points for faust for leading

why is andrew brought up so often as a viable lynch without accompanying vote movement?
forgot the actual reason for starting this post: twm is towny
Hells yeah!
Title: Re: M98: Русская Mafia (Day 1)
Post by: Eevee on April 21, 2017, 09:25:04 pm
why so loose with bringing up buddying? scum narrative could be maintaining the idea in people's head that that's a scummy behavior eevee often exhibits, hoping someone will bite.
Title: Re: M98: Русская Mafia (Day 1)
Post by: The_Wine_Merchant on April 21, 2017, 09:26:30 pm
Maybe I am getting better at reading schadd? I can understand about 95% of what he is saying. Or is that scum indicative of him?
Title: Re: M98: Русская Mafia (Day 1)
Post by: Eevee on April 21, 2017, 09:27:26 pm
i think you are just a nice guy.
you said this a few times l@st g@me
you called me not dumb, what am i to say in response, call you ugly mcuglyface? no no no
Title: Re: M98: Русская Mafia (Day 1)
Post by: The_Wine_Merchant on April 21, 2017, 09:28:15 pm
i think you are just a nice guy.
you said this a few times l@st g@me
you called me not dumb, what am i to say in response, call you ugly mcuglyface? no no no
Hehe. That should replace lockjaw.
Title: Re: M98: Русская Mafia (Day 1)
Post by: Eevee on April 21, 2017, 09:29:55 pm
Maybe I am getting better at reading schadd? I can understand about 95% of what he is saying. Or is that scum indicative of him?
Interested in his flip in this game, what if not being cryptic is his scumtell (aka kryptonite)?
Title: Re: M98: Русская Mafia (Day 1)
Post by: schadd on April 21, 2017, 09:32:36 pm
why so loose with bringing up buddying? scum narrative could be maintaining the idea in people's head that that's a scummy behavior eevee often exhibits, hoping someone will bite.
not sure i follow


Maybe I am getting better at reading schadd? I can understand about 95% of what he is saying. Or is that scum indicative of him?
i am kind of trying to be Concise and Sensical. also i haven't said all that much of substance which is where things start to get misty


i think you are just a nice guy.
you said this a few times l@st g@me
you called me not dumb, what am i to say in response, call you ugly mcuglyface? no no no
you wouldn't like mafiascum, like, at all


i think you are just a nice guy.
you said this a few times l@st g@me
you called me not dumb, what am i to say in response, call you ugly mcuglyface? no no no
Hehe. That should replace lockjaw.
there is a queue of things that i'm also not putting there


Maybe I am getting better at reading schadd? I can understand about 95% of what he is saying. Or is that scum indicative of him?
Interested in his flip in this game, what if not being cryptic is his scumtell (aka kryptonite)?
robz suggested the opposite thing is also maybe a scumtell like seven seconds ago
Title: Re: M98: Русская Mafia (Day 1)
Post by: Eevee on April 21, 2017, 09:48:23 pm
just seems weird you'd bring it up. my two leading causes of daytime death are buddying and hedginess, someone who wouldn't mind seeing me lynched might want to drop those buzzwords around me hoping someone else starts painting me scummy for them. kind of like trying to get two people to fight while you slowly walk away to watch from afar.

(going to sleep now!)
Title: Re: M98: Русская Mafia (Day 1)
Post by: schadd on April 21, 2017, 09:51:56 pm
oic, you're townreading me for it.


i also don't think those are the things that get you lynched
Title: Re: M98: Русская Mafia (Day 1)
Post by: kkrieg on April 22, 2017, 12:45:05 am
only one of them is scum though

I've been thinking about this more and if you pick any two people in this game, the chances that one of them is scum is pretty high.
Well I know I'm not scum so you must be? :)
Title: Re: M98: Русская Mafia (Day 1)
Post by: kkrieg on April 22, 2017, 12:46:24 am
Like who/what?
You, Robz, mcmc. And that's just in the last 10 posts.

So what should I be looking for, to find scum, then? I'm not saying you're wrong, I've had good cause to ask myself this very question in recent games.
I feel like this is a great question.
Title: Re: M98: Русская Mafia (Day 1)
Post by: faust on April 22, 2017, 06:34:27 am
Like who/what?
You, Robz, mcmc. And that's just in the last 10 posts.

So what should I be looking for, to find scum, then? I'm not saying you're wrong, I've had good cause to ask myself this very question in recent games.
I feel like this is a great question.
And the answer is simple but doesn't help you much probably: Try to see if the player has a consistent town narrative for their actions, and furthermore, try to see whether their posts make sense from a scum perspective. There are two main mistakes to make in scumhunting:

1. Anti-town != scummy.
Scum will usually shy away from openly anit-town behaviour, especially in the early game. Robz talking about TWM being a PR is therefore not a scumtell.

2. Weird != scummy.
Scum (usually) wants town to understand their posts because they want to present themselves in a certain way. Acting strange and unrelatable is usually not a sign of scumminess.
Title: Re: M98: Русская Mafia (Day 1)
Post by: faust on April 22, 2017, 09:09:15 am
A lot of people in this game seem to have very strange ideas about what kind of behaviour one should expect from scum.

So that's why I go after townies as lynch targets. That being said, while I know I probably won't get much movement on kkrieg, I really like my vote
It's definitely one of the better ones.
Title: Re: M98: Русская Mafia (Day 1)
Post by: faust on April 22, 2017, 10:17:16 am
robz is towny
Why?
Title: Re: M98: Русская Mafia (Day 1)
Post by: Robz888 on April 22, 2017, 10:23:41 am
Like who/what?
You, Robz, mcmc. And that's just in the last 10 posts.

So what should I be looking for, to find scum, then? I'm not saying you're wrong, I've had good cause to ask myself this very question in recent games.
I feel like this is a great question.
And the answer is simple but doesn't help you much probably: Try to see if the player has a consistent town narrative for their actions, and furthermore, try to see whether their posts make sense from a scum perspective. There are two main mistakes to make in scumhunting:

1. Anti-town != scummy.
Scum will usually shy away from openly anit-town behaviour, especially in the early game. Robz talking about TWM being a PR is therefore not a scumtell.

2. Weird != scummy.
Scum (usually) wants town to understand their posts because they want to present themselves in a certain way. Acting strange and unrelatable is usually not a sign of scumminess.

This is true of course, but then if you establish this as a norm too strongly, it gives scum license to behave wacky and anti-town and get away with it... which is what scum wants to do anyway, since it's easier.
Title: Re: M98: Русская Mafia (Day 1)
Post by: schadd on April 22, 2017, 11:51:09 am
i also think the array of stuff that's demonstrably anti-town is very small
Title: Re: M98: Русская Mafia (Day 1)
Post by: faust on April 22, 2017, 12:00:24 pm
This is true of course, but then if you establish this as a norm too strongly, it gives scum license to behave wacky and anti-town and get away with it... which is what scum wants to do anyway, since it's easier.
That's right, but I don't think f.ds meta is anywhere near that level.
Title: Re: M98: Русская Mafia (Day 1)
Post by: The_Wine_Merchant on April 22, 2017, 12:10:35 pm
Awaclus why should I not be voting for you?
Title: Re: M98: Русская Mafia (Day 1)
Post by: gkrieg13 on April 22, 2017, 12:38:56 pm
This is true of course, but then if you establish this as a norm too strongly, it gives scum license to behave wacky and anti-town and get away with it... which is what scum wants to do anyway, since it's easier.
That's right, but I don't think f.ds meta is anywhere near that level.

I do think some people can get away with it better than others.
Title: Re: M98: Русская Mafia (Day 1)
Post by: The_Wine_Merchant on April 22, 2017, 12:46:56 pm
So this game. Kinda sucks, right? We have a weekend coming up soon and then the deadline for today will be right at the end of that weekend, Monday at 5 am. I will be around then, but I assume that none of the US people will. So we really should step it up today and tomorrow.
Well this didn't happen.
Title: Re: M98: Русская Mafia (Day 1)
Post by: gkrieg13 on April 22, 2017, 12:49:37 pm
Andrew's ratio of saying things to things having been said about him is very low.

Is this more likely to happen to scum or to town?
Title: Re: M98: Русская Mafia (Day 1)
Post by: gkrieg13 on April 22, 2017, 12:50:44 pm
Post count for me to see who is responsible:

Awaclus - 9
Robz888 - 17
The_Wine_Merchant - 21
шэдд (I assume this is schadd by PoE - LaLight, please change this) - 46
Eevee - 17
gkrieg13 - 19
AndrewisFTTW - 4 (VLA)
2.71828..... - 7
faust - 28
mcmcsalot - 10
kkrieg - 7

Everyone with single-digit post count and no VLA is a disgrace.

In my mind, TWM is lurking, so seeing him high up is kinda strange. But I guess it's all relative.

Vote: e LAL

Why did you pick e here over kkrieg?
Title: Re: M98: Русская Mafia (Day 1)
Post by: gkrieg13 on April 22, 2017, 12:52:08 pm
Vote: E for lurking, and also, would probably be good to have a real wagon at this stage of Day 1.

This is a little bit questionable from Robz.  He would want a partner to get a good wagon on a bad reason going D1.  Just something to think about later.
Title: Re: M98: Русская Mafia (Day 1)
Post by: gkrieg13 on April 22, 2017, 12:52:50 pm
So this game. Kinda sucks, right? We have a weekend coming up soon and then the deadline for today will be right at the end of that weekend, Monday at 5 am. I will be around then, but I assume that none of the US people will. So we really should step it up today and tomorrow.
Town points for this btw, I had no idea the deadline was so close.

I don't think this is right.  I think deadline stuff is the easiest thing to get towncred for, when it is by far the easiest thing to fake.
Title: Re: M98: Русская Mafia (Day 1)
Post by: gkrieg13 on April 22, 2017, 12:54:16 pm
also it is telling that the people that voted for him couldn't take the 5 seconds to go and see what he had actually posted and see if he was actually lurking and find that little tidbit.

Technically that would've taken more than 5 seconds.  And I think town is more likely to just vote for little reason without actually reading compared to scum.
Title: Re: M98: Русская Mafia (Day 1)
Post by: gkrieg13 on April 22, 2017, 12:58:30 pm
also it is telling that the people that voted for him couldn't take the 5 seconds to go and see what he had actually posted and see if he was actually lurking and find that little tidbit.
If someone is VLA, they should post in the appropriate thread. If they fail to do this, that's on them and not on us.
Sure. But I would think that players would actually go and and assess whether someone was lurking and not completely rely on your vote count. It wasn't like it was hard or onerous for me to do so.
Sure I could have reread e, but why? Nothing suggested that I would find such a post. Maybe you remembered it and that is why you checked, which is fine.

Can we lynch faust now? Not caring enough about possibly mislynching e to actually reread at all.

Also gkrieg's "realization" about faust is... interesting. Not sure I buy it. If one of them flips scum we should lynch the other. This isn't taking into consideration other information of course.

If there was a "Super Crazy V/LA" thread I would've posted in that. I'll be back in business on Sunday.

This seems like just a strange post.  Like why are you choosing to question these things?  Not rereading people D1 is a pretty normal thing to do.  Usually you want to reread things for interactions, so just going off of gut and cases D1 is normal.

And questioning my gut feels seems very strange.  And making such a definitive statement as we should lynch the other seems very strong D1 for someone who is saying we need to reread people already.
Title: Re: M98: Русская Mafia (Day 1)
Post by: gkrieg13 on April 22, 2017, 12:59:34 pm
It is interesting that no one brought up my vote on eevee, rather just how I was lurking. No one wants to buddy eevee? He is such a buddy-able person. Super friendly to everyone

Buddying only works if the person townreads you as a result of your buddying.  As it stands, eevee doesn't really let niceness affect his reads.
Title: Re: M98: Русская Mafia (Day 1)
Post by: gkrieg13 on April 22, 2017, 01:00:17 pm
also it is telling that the people that voted for him couldn't take the 5 seconds to go and see what he had actually posted and see if he was actually lurking and find that little tidbit.
If someone is VLA, they should post in the appropriate thread. If they fail to do this, that's on them and not on us.
Sure. But I would think that players would actually go and and assess whether someone was lurking and not completely rely on your vote count. It wasn't like it was hard or onerous for me to do so.
Sure I could have reread e, but why? Nothing suggested that I would find such a post. Maybe you remembered it and that is why you checked, which is fine.

Can we lynch faust now? Not caring enough about possibly mislynching e to actually reread at all.

That's a pretty unfair reading of what faust said in response to TWM. Vote: Andrew

Yeah I guess you're right.

Unvote

BUT! faust's case on e is pretty much that he's lurking, which is kinda lame, amirite?

And then he is convinced by Robz?  That is kinda scummy.
Title: Re: M98: Русская Mafia (Day 1)
Post by: gkrieg13 on April 22, 2017, 01:00:39 pm
vote: e

What's up with this? Your post before this was saying lynching lurkers doesn't work.

True, but wagons do work.
Title: Re: M98: Русская Mafia (Day 1)
Post by: gkrieg13 on April 22, 2017, 01:01:04 pm
LAL (lynch all lurkers) day 1 has never worked.
Neither has not lynching them.

Very accurate. Scum have lurked to victory several times. The more you post the easier it is to come across scummy...or appear towny.

Depends on the content, and on the person.
Title: Re: M98: Русская Mafia (Day 1)
Post by: gkrieg13 on April 22, 2017, 01:02:37 pm
Any interest in mcmc or gkrieg?
Not really? The only thing I remember about mcmc is that we disagreed about something. That is usually a town tell for him.
Why is it ok for mcmc to lurk, but not 2.7?
It's not. Did I not just say I don't actually want to push lurker lynches? At least not now. Close to deadline may be a different story.
You say it's not. But your voting is indicating differently. I am trying to figure out why that is. You are voting for 2.7 and the only reason you have given is that he is a lurker. Therefore, I am concluding you want to push a lurker lynch. I am sorry if I can't read between the lines to find nonexistent subtext.

I still think this is townie from TWM.  It is definitely different from the scum games he has played.
Title: Re: M98: Русская Mafia (Day 1)
Post by: gkrieg13 on April 22, 2017, 01:02:56 pm
Any interest in mcmc or gkrieg?
those are the two people i currently find most interesting. maybe other than faust

Why those three?
Title: Re: M98: Русская Mafia (Day 1)
Post by: gkrieg13 on April 22, 2017, 01:03:49 pm
I'm probably a lurker right now huh?
Faust seems fairly towny which makes me want to jump on the e train.

You mean the eevee train.

This post is really interesting by kkrieg. And I think scummy

Vote: kkrieg

What about that post was scummy?
Title: Re: M98: Русская Mafia (Day 1)
Post by: gkrieg13 on April 22, 2017, 01:05:11 pm
mcmc, do you think i think you're town or scum?


will ask again later

I think you think I'm town.
I think that is the answer I expect from scum.


What answer would you expect from town?
Title: Re: M98: Русская Mafia (Day 1)
Post by: gkrieg13 on April 22, 2017, 01:06:19 pm
Vote: Robz

Interesting to me that faust is bouncing his vote off of major wagons.  Which, with people sheeping him a lot, maybe this is a good thing.  See who gets sheeped on to, and see who doesn't get any other traction.
Title: Re: M98: Русская Mafia (Day 1)
Post by: gkrieg13 on April 22, 2017, 01:08:20 pm
And 'acti-lurking" is becoming something of a smear, where anyone who isn't lurking, but is also not the number 1 post leader, is somehow act-lurking.
i beg to differ. i'm the number 1 post leader and i'm actilurking

This is true.  I feel like I don't remember anything significant from schadd, but just fluff and things that he seems to think he will be able to get good reads from.
Title: Re: M98: Русская Mafia (Day 1)
Post by: gkrieg13 on April 22, 2017, 01:11:46 pm
That's why I didn't answer before, I don't really have a better answer then I think what twm did is scummy. I mean it's not even crazy scummy, it's just the scummiest thing I have seen yet. Maybe it helps if I tell a narrative that fits.

I feel like scum!twm want to add his vote to yours when he sees you vote but doesn't want to be the one "pushing" the wagon so he just sheeps and when I ask him about his reasons he gives me this its the same reasons as Faust, go see for yourself. It's just wierd for a towny to say that especially given the fact that it wasn't obviouse what your reasons were for multiple people. Furthermore once you give your reason and gkriegs says it's reaching twm doesn't back you up, he becomes more cryptic about what his reasons are. Just feels like scum hoping you or other townies will take the lead in going for an awaclus lynch.

I think I get your reasoning here.  And I think they only apply if people think TWM is generally townie and they like to sheep him.  Like this would be a good case on faust, but not a very good case on TWM.
Title: Re: M98: Русская Mafia (Day 1)
Post by: AndrewisFTTW on April 22, 2017, 01:14:41 pm
also it is telling that the people that voted for him couldn't take the 5 seconds to go and see what he had actually posted and see if he was actually lurking and find that little tidbit.
If someone is VLA, they should post in the appropriate thread. If they fail to do this, that's on them and not on us.
Sure. But I would think that players would actually go and and assess whether someone was lurking and not completely rely on your vote count. It wasn't like it was hard or onerous for me to do so.
Sure I could have reread e, but why? Nothing suggested that I would find such a post. Maybe you remembered it and that is why you checked, which is fine.

Can we lynch faust now? Not caring enough about possibly mislynching e to actually reread at all.

Also gkrieg's "realization" about faust is... interesting. Not sure I buy it. If one of them flips scum we should lynch the other. This isn't taking into consideration other information of course.

If there was a "Super Crazy V/LA" thread I would've posted in that. I'll be back in business on Sunday.

This seems like just a strange post.  Like why are you choosing to question these things?  Not rereading people D1 is a pretty normal thing to do.  Usually you want to reread things for interactions, so just going off of gut and cases D1 is normal.

And questioning my gut feels seems very strange.  And making such a definitive statement as we should lynch the other seems very strong D1 for someone who is saying we need to reread people already.

Nope. I only made that comment because faust mentioned he didn't feel the need to reread, which I took to imply that he would otherwise reread but feels strongly enough to vote early without doing so. As Robz pointed out, faust was really referring to rereading for a potential V/LA podt from each but he didn't feel the need to, and I simply misread.

Anyway, what do you think so this scumslip from e?

So that's why I go after townies as lynch targets. That being said, while I know I probably won't get much movement on kkrieg, I really like my vote
Title: Re: M98: Русская Mafia (Day 1)
Post by: AndrewisFTTW on April 22, 2017, 01:15:38 pm
I meant "vote e" not "vote early". Gotta watch out for those autocorrects.
Title: Re: M98: Русская Mafia (Day 1)
Post by: AndrewisFTTW on April 22, 2017, 01:16:56 pm
And also "e" instead of "each". See where technology has gotten us?
Title: Re: M98: Русская Mafia (Day 1)
Post by: gkrieg13 on April 22, 2017, 01:17:17 pm
only one of them is scum though
I've been thinking about this more and if you pick any two people in this game, the chances that one of them is scum is pretty high.
are you, uh, calling me an unimpressive town player?


Uh, I'm just saying that I don't think this really says anything.  It seems like you have talked a lot, but not too much about the game, so I was thinking this is something that looks like it is a read, but doesn't really say anything.


the thing about those is you have to think about whether it makes sense to be alignment indicative and whether there might be natural reasons i might decide not to do it. one might not be led to believe so but i've been trying to thin my arsenal of tells
That is very anti-town of you.
sorry, i didn't understand what you were calling anti-town. that i've been retiring tells i have that don't work?

I actually misread that.  I thought you were saying that you were trying to be less readable, which is anti-town.  Not that you were talking about other peoples' tells.
Title: Re: M98: Русская Mafia (Day 1)
Post by: Awaclus on April 22, 2017, 01:17:33 pm
Awaclus why should I not be voting for you?

I haven't, in any way, shape or form, indicated that I have any information that only scum would have or a scum perspective.
Title: Re: M98: Русская Mafia (Day 1)
Post by: AndrewisFTTW on April 22, 2017, 01:18:56 pm
Awaclus why should I not be voting for you?

I haven't, in any way, shape or form, indicated that I have any information that only scum would have or a scum perspective.

Who do you think has indicated they do?
Title: Re: M98: Русская Mafia (Day 1)
Post by: gkrieg13 on April 22, 2017, 01:20:41 pm
why so loose with bringing up buddying? scum narrative could be maintaining the idea in people's head that that's a scummy behavior eevee often exhibits, hoping someone will bite.

It just seems like a strange thing from schadd.  Still not sure if any of this means anything.  If I were a vig, I would consider shooting him (checked the setup and there isn't a vig possible).
Title: Re: M98: Русская Mafia (Day 1)
Post by: gkrieg13 on April 22, 2017, 01:22:06 pm
why so loose with bringing up buddying? scum narrative could be maintaining the idea in people's head that that's a scummy behavior eevee often exhibits, hoping someone will bite.
not sure i follow


Maybe I am getting better at reading schadd? I can understand about 95% of what he is saying. Or is that scum indicative of him?
i am kind of trying to be Concise and Sensical. also i haven't said all that much of substance which is where things start to get misty


i think you are just a nice guy.
you said this a few times l@st g@me
you called me not dumb, what am i to say in response, call you ugly mcuglyface? no no no
you wouldn't like mafiascum, like, at all


i think you are just a nice guy.
you said this a few times l@st g@me
you called me not dumb, what am i to say in response, call you ugly mcuglyface? no no no
Hehe. That should replace lockjaw.
there is a queue of things that i'm also not putting there


Maybe I am getting better at reading schadd? I can understand about 95% of what he is saying. Or is that scum indicative of him?
Interested in his flip in this game, what if not being cryptic is his scumtell (aka kryptonite)?
robz suggested the opposite thing is also maybe a scumtell like seven seconds ago

So if you are aware of a lot of these things, why do you still do them?  Like you say that you are anti-town with the amount of words/content you have, but you keep doing the same things.
Title: Re: M98: Русская Mafia (Day 1)
Post by: gkrieg13 on April 22, 2017, 01:23:53 pm
also it is telling that the people that voted for him couldn't take the 5 seconds to go and see what he had actually posted and see if he was actually lurking and find that little tidbit.
If someone is VLA, they should post in the appropriate thread. If they fail to do this, that's on them and not on us.
Sure. But I would think that players would actually go and and assess whether someone was lurking and not completely rely on your vote count. It wasn't like it was hard or onerous for me to do so.
Sure I could have reread e, but why? Nothing suggested that I would find such a post. Maybe you remembered it and that is why you checked, which is fine.

Can we lynch faust now? Not caring enough about possibly mislynching e to actually reread at all.

Also gkrieg's "realization" about faust is... interesting. Not sure I buy it. If one of them flips scum we should lynch the other. This isn't taking into consideration other information of course.

If there was a "Super Crazy V/LA" thread I would've posted in that. I'll be back in business on Sunday.

This seems like just a strange post.  Like why are you choosing to question these things?  Not rereading people D1 is a pretty normal thing to do.  Usually you want to reread things for interactions, so just going off of gut and cases D1 is normal.

And questioning my gut feels seems very strange.  And making such a definitive statement as we should lynch the other seems very strong D1 for someone who is saying we need to reread people already.

Nope. I only made that comment because faust mentioned he didn't feel the need to reread, which I took to imply that he would otherwise reread but feels strongly enough to vote early without doing so. As Robz pointed out, faust was really referring to rereading for a potential V/LA podt from each but he didn't feel the need to, and I simply misread.

Anyway, what do you think so this scumslip from e?

So that's why I go after townies as lynch targets. That being said, while I know I probably won't get much movement on kkrieg, I really like my vote

Doesn't look like a scum slip to me.
Title: Re: M98: Русская Mafia (Day 1)
Post by: gkrieg13 on April 22, 2017, 01:25:46 pm
Awaclus why should I not be voting for you?

I haven't, in any way, shape or form, indicated that I have any information that only scum would have or a scum perspective.

It's cute that you still think this is the only way to read you.
Title: Re: M98: Русская Mafia (Day 1)
Post by: Awaclus on April 22, 2017, 01:31:17 pm
Awaclus why should I not be voting for you?

I haven't, in any way, shape or form, indicated that I have any information that only scum would have or a scum perspective.

It's cute that you still think this is the only way to read you.

It is the only way to read anyone. Thinking otherwise is believing in pseudoscience.
Title: Re: M98: Русская Mafia (Day 1)
Post by: 2.71828..... on April 22, 2017, 01:33:02 pm
I think more people should be voting kkrieg.

Everyone seems to be playing into their meta pretty well. The only person who has done anything scummy is kkrieg, but that could also be just being new. I could possibly get behind a Robz lynch just because.

I think TWM is town, not so sure about everyone else
Title: Re: M98: Русская Mafia (Day 1)
Post by: gkrieg13 on April 22, 2017, 01:33:53 pm
I think more people should be voting kkrieg.

Everyone seems to be playing into their meta pretty well. The only person who has done anything scummy is kkrieg, but that could also be just being new. I could possibly get behind a Robz lynch just because.

I think TWM is town, not so sure about everyone else

What scummy things has she done?
Title: Re: M98: Русская Mafia (Day 1)
Post by: The_Wine_Merchant on April 22, 2017, 01:36:35 pm
Unvote
Title: Re: M98: Русская Mafia (Day 1)
Post by: kkrieg on April 22, 2017, 02:37:55 pm
I think more people should be voting kkrieg.

Everyone seems to be playing into their meta pretty well. The only person who has done anything scummy is kkrieg, but that could also be just being new. I could possibly get behind a Robz lynch just because.

I think TWM is town, not so sure about everyone else

What scummy things has she done?
Ditto question ^^^^.
Title: Re: M98: Русская Mafia (Day 1)
Post by: AndrewisFTTW on April 22, 2017, 03:08:26 pm
Awaclus why should I not be voting for you?

I haven't, in any way, shape or form, indicated that I have any information that only scum would have or a scum perspective.

It's cute that you still think this is the only way to read you.

It is the only way to read anyone. Thinking otherwise is believing in pseudoscience.

Oh God he's right! Why even bother? Everything we say is highly questionable at best!
Title: Re: M98: Русская Mafia (Day 1)
Post by: AndrewisFTTW on April 22, 2017, 03:10:32 pm
Hey Robz remember when town!gkrieg made a big deal about something that was totally not a scumslip? But now he thinks this one isn't suspect at all.
Title: Re: M98: Русская Mafia (Day 1)
Post by: gkrieg13 on April 22, 2017, 03:16:07 pm
Hey Robz remember when town!gkrieg made a big deal about something that was totally not a scumslip? But now he thinks this one isn't suspect at all.

Well because this one is obviously sarcasm
Title: Re: M98: Русская Mafia (Day 1)
Post by: AndrewisFTTW on April 22, 2017, 03:33:34 pm
Hey Robz remember when town!gkrieg made a big deal about something that was totally not a scumslip? But now he thinks this one isn't suspect at all.

Well because this one is obviously sarcasm

Really? Hold on.
Title: Re: M98: Русская Mafia (Day 1)
Post by: AndrewisFTTW on April 22, 2017, 03:35:23 pm
Upon further inspection, I think you are correct.
Title: Re: M98: Русская Mafia (Day 1)
Post by: The_Wine_Merchant on April 22, 2017, 04:19:29 pm
Awaclus why should I not be voting for you?

I haven't, in any way, shape or form, indicated that I have any information that only scum would have or a scum perspective.

Who do you think has indicated they do?
It would appear, based off his vote not moving, that he thinks you have.
Title: Re: M98: Русская Mafia (Day 1)
Post by: faust on April 22, 2017, 05:08:25 pm
Post count for me to see who is responsible:

Awaclus - 9
Robz888 - 17
The_Wine_Merchant - 21
шэдд (I assume this is schadd by PoE - LaLight, please change this) - 46
Eevee - 17
gkrieg13 - 19
AndrewisFTTW - 4 (VLA)
2.71828..... - 7
faust - 28
mcmcsalot - 10
kkrieg - 7

Everyone with single-digit post count and no VLA is a disgrace.

In my mind, TWM is lurking, so seeing him high up is kinda strange. But I guess it's all relative.

Vote: e LAL

Why did you pick e here over kkrieg?
I thought more people would follow on e, with kkrieg being a newbie and all.
Title: Re: M98: Русская Mafia (Day 1)
Post by: gkrieg13 on April 22, 2017, 05:39:19 pm
Post count for me to see who is responsible:

Awaclus - 9
Robz888 - 17
The_Wine_Merchant - 21
шэдд (I assume this is schadd by PoE - LaLight, please change this) - 46
Eevee - 17
gkrieg13 - 19
AndrewisFTTW - 4 (VLA)
2.71828..... - 7
faust - 28
mcmcsalot - 10
kkrieg - 7

Everyone with single-digit post count and no VLA is a disgrace.

In my mind, TWM is lurking, so seeing him high up is kinda strange. But I guess it's all relative.

Vote: e LAL

Why did you pick e here over kkrieg?
I thought more people would follow on e, with kkrieg being a newbie and all.

But wouldn't the reactions to kkrieg be more telling then?
Title: Re: M98: Русская Mafia (Day 1)
Post by: faust on April 22, 2017, 05:53:16 pm
I don't think a reaction for a lurker vote would be all that telling, and I didn't think there'd be a major wagon on her. e was more interesting in that regard, not only for his reaction, but also for how people treated that wagon.
Title: Re: M98: Русская Mafia (Day 1)
Post by: AndrewisFTTW on April 22, 2017, 06:04:25 pm
Awaclus why should I not be voting for you?

I haven't, in any way, shape or form, indicated that I have any information that only scum would have or a scum perspective.

Who do you think has indicated they do?
It would appear, based off his vote not moving, that he thinks you have.

That's cool. I'm curious where he got that from, and just what one would look for if they were using this strategy in general.
Title: Re: M98: Русская Mafia (Day 1)
Post by: Eevee on April 22, 2017, 07:29:54 pm
robz is towny
Why?
i think the pr-comment is much more likely to come from town.
Title: Re: M98: Русская Mafia (Day 1)
Post by: Eevee on April 22, 2017, 09:04:14 pm
i always find people i haven't played with before hard to read, applies to kkrieg very much here. although i guess if they've talked about the game at all, she's had a pretty good mentor.

still, if the case is just not saying a lot of insightful stuff, that's hard enough day 1 when you know everyone and all the game mechanics, let alone for someone who is still learning the ropes. i'm willing to give some leeway (only extends for day 1!)
Title: Re: M98: Русская Mafia (Day 1)
Post by: kkrieg on April 22, 2017, 09:31:14 pm
i always find people i haven't played with before hard to read, applies to kkrieg very much here. although i guess if they've talked about the game at all, she's had a pretty good mentor.

still, if the case is just not saying a lot of insightful stuff, that's hard enough day 1 when you know everyone and all the game mechanics, let alone for someone who is still learning the ropes. i'm willing to give some leeway (only extends for day 1!)
gkrieg and I have talked surprisingly little about mafia.

I'm fine with no leeway. If people really think I'm scum I have no problems being lynched (that sounds weird - to clarify, I do mind being lynched because I'm town, but do not expect less suspicion because I'm new)
Title: Re: M98: Русская Mafia (Day 1)
Post by: AndrewisFTTW on April 22, 2017, 10:05:43 pm
Alright let's get down to business people. Who is cool with a Robz lynch? I'm also getting the scum feels from Eevee. Pretty null on everyone else.
Title: Re: M98: Русская Mafia (Day 1)
Post by: mcmcsalot on April 22, 2017, 10:28:43 pm
I'm sorry it's my birthday tomorrow and I'm celebrating, I'll catch up Sunday evening at the latest. So I should around pre-deadline and deadline.
Title: Re: M98: Русская Mafia (Day 1)
Post by: The_Wine_Merchant on April 22, 2017, 11:59:49 pm
Reread the whole thread. mcmc had the most posts that I think could be mafia indicative. At this point at might just be pseudoscience, but its all I got at this point. Awaclus came in second, followed by schadd. Robz and gkrieg were the most conflicted with a heavy mix of town and mafia posts.

vote: mcmcsalot

(sorry to vote you on your birthday. Hope it is a good one!)
Title: Re: M98: Русская Mafia (Day 1)
Post by: 2.71828..... on April 23, 2017, 12:42:16 am
Sorry, busy day. Can't promise to be around at deadline but I will find time tomorrow to read and try to be useful as we near deadline
Title: Re: M98: Русская Mafia (Day 1)
Post by: faust on April 23, 2017, 04:20:26 am
I'm sorry it's my birthday tomorrow and I'm celebrating, I'll catch up Sunday evening at the latest. So I should around pre-deadline and deadline.
Happy birthday!
Title: Re: M98: Русская Mafia (Day 1)
Post by: faust on April 23, 2017, 04:23:51 am
robz is towny
Why?
i think the pr-comment is much more likely to come from town.
Ah yes. I see where that's coming from. But when Robz posted that, he was already under suspicion. I think any-alignment!Robz is very aware of the reactions he causes with such a post, and I believe it's a bit more likely to come from scum!Robz.
Title: Re: M98: Русская Mafia (Day 1)
Post by: faust on April 23, 2017, 04:38:53 am
I've been meaning to reread e for a while, but somehow it slipped my mind. Wel, here goes:

Stuff in the beginining is setup-related. There's an early Eevee vote.

A wagon! Great. The best way to combat it will be to post a bunch, so I will do what I can.
I don't feel good about this post. Town thinks that probably, but why post it? Oversharing isn't townie, but scum often thinks it is.

So the question becomes, did scum vote for me, and does eevee have some sort of relationship with scum?

Faust voting me was a fairly standard "get the game moving" post- very alignment neutral. The following votes didn't build on it at all, mostly just sheeping, which isn't terrible, but easy for scum to do
e asks this question, but there's never a follow-up on it. If town!e thinks that, then why not investigate further?

Then we have the kkrieg vote, which I agree with to some extent.

A lot of people in this game seem to have very strange ideas about what kind of behaviour one should expect from scum.

So that's why I go after townies as lynch targets. That being said, while I know I probably won't get much movement on kkrieg, I really like my vote
I will note that it is convenient for scum to leave their vote on someone they know will not get lynched and then potentially switch late in the day with the excuse of "had to get a lynch through!" (or stay off the lynch wagon if they know it'll be a townie). Not sure if scum!e would be so direct about it.

Not a lot more. I'm conflicted; there is scummy stuff, but I feel scummy about a number of people here.
Title: Re: M98: Русская Mafia (PMs are out! N0)
Post by: LaLight on April 23, 2017, 05:17:34 am
Vote Count 1.HAPPY BIRTHDAY, MCMCSALOT!

Robz888 (3): schadd, faust, AndrewisFTTW
AndrewisFTTW (2): Awaclus, Robz888
Awaclus (1): kkrieg
The_Wine_Merchant (1): mcmcsalot
2,71828..... (1): Eevee
kkrieg (1): 2,71828.....
mcmcsalot (2): gkrieg13, The_Wine_Merchant
Not voting (0):

With 11 alive it takes 6 to lynch. Day 1 ends Monday, 24th of April at 5 am FT. This is in 24 hours.
Title: Re: M98: Русская Mafia (Day 1)
Post by: faust on April 23, 2017, 06:12:55 am
My two biggest townreads are on mcmc. Can you convince me that he's scum?
Title: Re: M98: Русская Mafia (Day 1)
Post by: faust on April 23, 2017, 06:20:53 am
mcmc, do you think i think you're town or scum?


will ask again later

I think you think I'm town.
I think that is the answer I expect from scum.


What answer would you expect from town?
Null probably, especially at this stage in the game.
Title: Re: M98: Русская Mafia (Day 1)
Post by: Eevee on April 23, 2017, 09:03:22 am
Oh ma less than 24 hours.

Totally totally no idea who to vote for. Weekend deadlines are bad for town!
Title: Re: M98: Русская Mafia (Day 1)
Post by: The_Wine_Merchant on April 23, 2017, 09:07:48 am
My two biggest townreads are on mcmc. Can you convince me that he's scum?
Probably not. I am not even convinced myself.
Title: Re: M98: Русская Mafia (Day 1)
Post by: Robz888 on April 23, 2017, 09:19:39 am
Hey Robz remember when town!gkrieg made a big deal about something that was totally not a scumslip? But now he thinks this one isn't suspect at all.

Well because this one is obviously sarcasm

Really? Hold on.

Yep, not a scumslip.
Title: Re: M98: Русская Mafia (Day 1)
Post by: Robz888 on April 23, 2017, 09:21:51 am
Well, I do not have scum reads. I have a big townread on Eevee, his post about worrying that people will see him as hedgy or buddying and suspect him for it seemed like the kind of self-aware thing you self-censor if you're scum.
Title: Re: M98: Русская Mafia (Day 1)
Post by: Robz888 on April 23, 2017, 09:22:30 am
I could vote for E or kkrieg for being sort of hard to read and on the lower activity side.
Title: Re: M98: Русская Mafia (Day 1)
Post by: Robz888 on April 23, 2017, 09:23:27 am
Hm, I'm surprised that Andrew is voting for me, given that he was also trying to rally me to think gkrieg was a hypocrite over some perceived scumslip (I think that's what that was about?)
Title: Re: M98: Русская Mafia (Day 1)
Post by: AndrewisFTTW on April 23, 2017, 11:05:19 am
Hm, I'm surprised that Andrew is voting for me, given that he was also trying to rally me to think gkrieg was a hypocrite over some perceived scumslip (I think that's what that was about?)

Not rallying, just wanted to know what you thought about it. But alas, I missed e's sarcasm.
Title: Re: M98: Русская Mafia (Day 1)
Post by: schadd on April 23, 2017, 11:09:34 am
{eevee, faust}
{kkrieg, twm}
{andrew, awaclus, e}
{robz}
{gkrieg, mcmc}
Title: Re: M98: Русская Mafia (Day 1)
Post by: Eevee on April 23, 2017, 11:22:38 am
{eevee, faust}
{kkrieg, twm}
{andrew, awaclus, e}
{robz}
{gkrieg, mcmc}
Hey, we've talked about cryptography!
Title: Re: M98: Русская Mafia (Day 1)
Post by: schadd on April 23, 2017, 11:28:03 am
Any interest in mcmc or gkrieg?
those are the two people i currently find most interesting. maybe other than faust

Why those three?
should be rather evident


only one of them is scum though

this is something that looks like it is a read, but doesn't really say anything.
it kind of definitely does say something


If I were a vig, I would consider shooting him (checked the setup and there isn't a vig possible).
this is the kind of thing i would not like to say, in a traitor environment. why would one want to vig me but not lynch me?


Maybe I am getting better at reading schadd? I can understand about 95% of what he is saying. Or is that scum indicative of him?
i am kind of trying to be Concise and Sensical. also i haven't said all that much of substance which is where things start to get misty
So if you are aware of a lot of these things, why do you still do them?  Like you say that you are anti-town with the amount of words/content you have, but you keep doing the same things.
So if you are aware of a lot of these things, why do you still do them?  Like you say that you are anti-town with the amount of words/content you have, but you keep doing the same things.
i trimmed my quote to the thing i would think this is referring to. i haven't said all that much of substance this game because i haven't uh encountered much of the kind of things i like to talk about substantially. i also don't remember saying that i'm being anti-town


My two biggest townreads are on mcmc. Can you convince me that he's scum?
i townread him hard last game for being super invested and conversational, he looks neither here
Title: Re: M98: Русская Mafia (Day 1)
Post by: schadd on April 23, 2017, 11:29:52 am
{eevee, faust}
{kkrieg, twm}
{andrew, awaclus, e}
{robz}
{gkrieg, mcmc}
Hey, we've talked about cryptography!
town


scum
Title: Re: M98: Русская Mafia (Day 1)
Post by: The_Wine_Merchant on April 23, 2017, 11:30:43 am
My two biggest townreads are on mcmc. Can you convince me that he's scum?
i townread him hard last game for being super invested and conversational, he looks neither here
To be fair, last game he was actively trying to get mafia to NK him to make good use of his PR. (Even if that strategy backfired). But I still like my vote on him.
Title: Re: M98: Русская Mafia (Day 1)
Post by: 2.71828..... on April 23, 2017, 01:31:00 pm
Vote: Robz
Title: Re: M98: Русская Mafia (Day 1)
Post by: 2.71828..... on April 23, 2017, 01:34:48 pm
I could vote for E or kkrieg for being sort of hard to read and on the lower activity side.

I am very easy to read, which is why TWM said that I am town. He knows how to read me. I am very bad at finding scum, I just enjoy the process. Which is why I posted that brutally honest post concerning how I usually (at least early on) almost always end up on a town wagon.

And yeah, I probably do overshare thoughts a bit, but when you are restricted on how much you can post due to your current situation, I feel like I need to get out what I an thinking and do what I can
Title: Re: M98: Русская Mafia (Day 1)
Post by: 2.71828..... on April 23, 2017, 01:36:21 pm
Hm, I'm surprised that Andrew is voting for me, given that he was also trying to rally me to think gkrieg was a hypocrite over some perceived scumslip (I think that's what that was about?)

Not rallying, just wanted to know what you thought about it. But alas, I missed e's sarcasm.

If you miss sarcasm I can always provide more, we just have to lynch Robz first because he believes all jokes (especially the sarcastic ones) come from scum
Title: Re: M98: Русская Mafia (Day 1)
Post by: 2.71828..... on April 23, 2017, 01:37:22 pm
That being said, I am not sure what sarcasm you are referring to. I want trying to be sarcastic with my posts
Title: Re: M98: Русская Mafia (Day 1)
Post by: The_Wine_Merchant on April 23, 2017, 01:39:44 pm
Can I just remind everyone that Awaclus is still voting Andrew because Andrew said he wouldn't sign up for anymore games with Awaclus?
Title: Re: M98: Русская Mafia (Day 1)
Post by: Awaclus on April 23, 2017, 02:29:25 pm
Can I just remind everyone that Awaclus is still voting Andrew because Andrew said he wouldn't sign up for anymore games with Awaclus?

You can.
Title: Re: M98: Русская Mafia (Day 1)
Post by: Robz888 on April 23, 2017, 02:33:41 pm
Vote: Robz


This is an L-2 vote on me.

I guess I'm not the worst lynch ever, if that's what's going to happen. I am a Vanilla Townie.
Title: Re: M98: Русская Mafia (Day 1)
Post by: Robz888 on April 23, 2017, 02:34:42 pm
Hm, I'm surprised that Andrew is voting for me, given that he was also trying to rally me to think gkrieg was a hypocrite over some perceived scumslip (I think that's what that was about?)

Not rallying, just wanted to know what you thought about it. But alas, I missed e's sarcasm.

If you miss sarcasm I can always provide more, we just have to lynch Robz first because he believes all jokes (especially the sarcastic ones) come from scum

I don't really think that anymore. I find unclear joking more annoying, than anything else.
Title: Re: M98: Русская Mafia (Day 1)
Post by: AndrewisFTTW on April 23, 2017, 02:35:03 pm
That being said, I am not sure what sarcasm you are referring to. I want trying to be sarcastic with my posts

The post where you said you try to lynch townies.
Title: Re: M98: Русская Mafia (Day 1)
Post by: AndrewisFTTW on April 23, 2017, 03:31:45 pm
Is anyone else willing to vote Robz?
Title: Re: M98: Русская Mafia (Day 1)
Post by: kkrieg on April 23, 2017, 03:58:42 pm
I don't have any strong scum reads, but I don't think Robz is.
Title: Re: M98: Русская Mafia (Day 1)
Post by: The_Wine_Merchant on April 23, 2017, 04:19:32 pm
Is anyone else willing to vote Robz?
Not at the moment.
Title: Re: M98: Русская Mafia (Day 1)
Post by: AndrewisFTTW on April 23, 2017, 04:23:07 pm
Would you guys rather no lynch on D1? Because that would suck and we're running out of time.
Title: Re: M98: Русская Mafia (Day 1)
Post by: faust on April 23, 2017, 04:26:30 pm
This feels exactly like the last time Robz was mislynched D1. I don't like it.

Vote: e

Maybe?
Title: Re: M98: Русская Mafia (Day 1)
Post by: AndrewisFTTW on April 23, 2017, 04:34:47 pm
This feels exactly like the last time Robz was mislynched D1. I don't like it.

Vote: e

Maybe?

I remember town!Robz fighting harder against his lynch before, but this is a little different. He's not at L-1 and it's D1.
Title: Re: M98: Русская Mafia (Day 1)
Post by: 2.71828..... on April 23, 2017, 04:36:22 pm
Would you guys rather no lynch on D1? Because that would suck and we're running out of time.

I am a firm believer that no lynching D1 doesn't just suck, it is literally a catastrophe for town. I would have to do research to actually back myself up with data, but I would be willing to bet town winning after a D1 no lynch is rare
Title: Re: M98: Русская Mafia (Day 1)
Post by: gkrieg13 on April 23, 2017, 04:39:22 pm
This feels exactly like the last time Robz was mislynched D1. I don't like it.

Vote: e

Maybe?

I remember town!Robz fighting harder against his lynch before, but this is a little different. He's not at L-1 and it's D1.

To be fair, he will be the go-to lynch if nothing changes soon.
Title: Re: M98: Русская Mafia (Day 1)
Post by: faust on April 23, 2017, 04:43:02 pm
Of the remaining people with >1 vote I would go Andrew over mcmc over Robz.
Title: Re: M98: Русская Mafia (Day 1)
Post by: 2.71828..... on April 23, 2017, 04:43:47 pm
This feels exactly like the last time Robz was mislynched D1. I don't like it.

Vote: e

Maybe?

I remember town!Robz fighting harder against his lynch before, but this is a little different. He's not at L-1 and it's D1.

To be fair, he will be the go-to lynch if nothing changes soon.

Faust moving his vote changes that. Speaking of which, I like
Vote: faust
Better than Robz. I have convinced myself that I believe Robz at least for today
Title: Re: M98: Русская Mafia (Day 1)
Post by: gkrieg13 on April 23, 2017, 04:47:34 pm
Of the remaining people with >1 vote I would go Andrew over mcmc over Robz.

I think I'm at mcmc over Andrew over Robz
Title: Re: M98: Русская Mafia (Day 1)
Post by: The_Wine_Merchant on April 23, 2017, 04:48:33 pm
Awaclus, mcmc or schadd.
Title: Re: M98: Русская Mafia (Day 1)
Post by: The_Wine_Merchant on April 23, 2017, 04:51:04 pm
Someone give me a reason to not vote Awaclus, other than him saying that he doesn't anything to scumslip--as he has failed to show that anyone else has done that thus far this game.
Title: Re: M98: Русская Mafia (Day 1)
Post by: kkrieg on April 23, 2017, 04:56:11 pm
I'd be ok with Awaclus or Andrew
Title: Re: M98: Русская Mafia (Day 1)
Post by: Robz888 on April 23, 2017, 04:58:10 pm
This feels exactly like the last time Robz was mislynched D1. I don't like it.

Vote: e

Maybe?

I remember town!Robz fighting harder against his lynch before, but this is a little different. He's not at L-1 and it's D1.

To be fair, he will be the go-to lynch if nothing changes soon.

Faust moving his vote changes that. Speaking of which, I like
Vote: faust
Better than Robz. I have convinced myself that I believe Robz at least for today

Why faust? I don't like this at all, actually.
Title: Re: M98: Русская Mafia (Day 1)
Post by: Robz888 on April 23, 2017, 04:58:47 pm
I would go for E if the votes were there. If not I'll stick with Andrew. Awaclus is also fine. This does not feel like scum mcmc to me.
Title: Re: M98: Русская Mafia (Day 1)
Post by: The_Wine_Merchant on April 23, 2017, 05:10:28 pm
This feels very similar to mcmc from M91. I don't like the 2.7 wagon, now or earlier.
Title: Re: M98: Русская Mafia (Day 1)
Post by: AndrewisFTTW on April 23, 2017, 05:20:15 pm
Vote: Awaclus
Title: Re: M98: Русская Mafia (Day 1)
Post by: The_Wine_Merchant on April 23, 2017, 05:40:50 pm
vote: Awaclus
Title: Re: M98: Русская Mafia (Day 1)
Post by: mcmcsalot on April 23, 2017, 05:44:36 pm
That's why I didn't answer before, I don't really have a better answer then I think what twm did is scummy. I mean it's not even crazy scummy, it's just the scummiest thing I have seen yet. Maybe it helps if I tell a narrative that fits.

I feel like scum!twm want to add his vote to yours when he sees you vote but doesn't want to be the one "pushing" the wagon so he just sheeps and when I ask him about his reasons he gives me this its the same reasons as Faust, go see for yourself. It's just wierd for a towny to say that especially given the fact that it wasn't obviouse what your reasons were for multiple people. Furthermore once you give your reason and gkriegs says it's reaching twm doesn't back you up, he becomes more cryptic about what his reasons are. Just feels like scum hoping you or other townies will take the lead in going for an awaclus lynch.

I think I get your reasoning here.  And I think they only apply if people think TWM is generally townie and they like to sheep him.  Like this would be a good case on faust, but not a very good case on TWM.
I Can understand that, I do think people think twm is towny though.
Title: Re: M98: Русская Mafia (Day 1)
Post by: The_Wine_Merchant on April 23, 2017, 05:48:37 pm
That's why I didn't answer before, I don't really have a better answer then I think what twm did is scummy. I mean it's not even crazy scummy, it's just the scummiest thing I have seen yet. Maybe it helps if I tell a narrative that fits.

I feel like scum!twm want to add his vote to yours when he sees you vote but doesn't want to be the one "pushing" the wagon so he just sheeps and when I ask him about his reasons he gives me this its the same reasons as Faust, go see for yourself. It's just wierd for a towny to say that especially given the fact that it wasn't obviouse what your reasons were for multiple people. Furthermore once you give your reason and gkriegs says it's reaching twm doesn't back you up, he becomes more cryptic about what his reasons are. Just feels like scum hoping you or other townies will take the lead in going for an awaclus lynch.

I think I get your reasoning here.  And I think they only apply if people think TWM is generally townie and they like to sheep him.  Like this would be a good case on faust, but not a very good case on TWM.
I Can understand that, I do think people think twm is towny though.
They do now. Previously, when this all was happening, they didn't, it was up in the air. I think I have done a decent job of making sure town people have had opportunities to accurately read me despite some somewhat unknown situations earlier. You are the exception, which is partially why I am suspicious of you.
Title: Re: M98: Русская Mafia (Day 1)
Post by: faust on April 23, 2017, 06:31:50 pm
OMGUS is not a very good way to find your reads.
Title: Re: M98: Русская Mafia (Day 1)
Post by: faust on April 23, 2017, 06:32:48 pm
I will be around for the deadline, but will go to sleep for now.
Title: Re: M98: Русская Mafia (Day 1)
Post by: The_Wine_Merchant on April 23, 2017, 06:46:15 pm
OMGUS is not a very good way to find your reads.
PARTIALLY
Title: Re: M98: Русская Mafia (Day 1)
Post by: 2.71828..... on April 23, 2017, 07:08:29 pm
OMGUS is not a very good way to find your reads.

Good thing I didn't vote you for OMGUS reasons. I voted you because I don't think town!faust votes me in this situation
Title: Re: M98: Русская Mafia (Day 1)
Post by: Eevee on April 23, 2017, 07:20:40 pm
Awaclus would be a total "guess" lynch for me, he has played just like I'd expect him to play day 1 either alignment. I think he is generally hard to townread with certainty, but conversely also hard to pinpoint as scum. Especially this early, this is just totally what I think both scum and town versions of Awaclus would look like.
Title: Re: M98: Русская Mafia (Day 1)
Post by: AndrewisFTTW on April 23, 2017, 07:40:49 pm
Awaclus would be a total "guess" lynch for me, he has played just like I'd expect him to play day 1 either alignment. I think he is generally hard to townread with certainty, but conversely also hard to pinpoint as scum. Especially this early, this is just totally what I think both scum and town versions of Awaclus would look like.

Empty post. I'd lynch Eevee.
Title: Re: M98: Русская Mafia (Day 1)
Post by: schadd on April 23, 2017, 07:43:07 pm
non-empty posts are scum-indicative for him
Title: Re: M98: Русская Mafia (Day 1)
Post by: Robz888 on April 23, 2017, 07:43:57 pm
Awaclus would be a total "guess" lynch for me, he has played just like I'd expect him to play day 1 either alignment. I think he is generally hard to townread with certainty, but conversely also hard to pinpoint as scum. Especially this early, this is just totally what I think both scum and town versions of Awaclus would look like.

Empty post. I'd lynch Eevee.

I think the post stakes out a fairly reasonable position on Awaclus.
Title: Re: M98: Русская Mafia (Day 1)
Post by: schadd on April 23, 2017, 08:03:47 pm
gkrieg, you prefer town right?
Title: Re: M98: Русская Mafia (Day 1)
Post by: gkrieg13 on April 23, 2017, 08:15:47 pm
gkrieg, you prefer town right?

I think my preference would be town>mafia>IC>Traitor>SK.
Title: Re: M98: Русская Mafia (Day 1)
Post by: gkrieg13 on April 23, 2017, 08:16:21 pm
Would you guys rather no lynch on D1? Because that would suck and we're running out of time.

This is what I would expect from scum!Andrew.

vote: Andrew
Title: Re: M98: Русская Mafia (Day 1)
Post by: schadd on April 23, 2017, 08:17:52 pm
gkrieg, you prefer town right?

I think my preference would be town>mafia>IC>Traitor>SK.
why town>IC?


Would you guys rather no lynch on D1? Because that would suck and we're running out of time.

This is what I would expect from scum!Andrew.

vote: Andrew
elabor8
Title: Re: M98: Русская Mafia (Day 1)
Post by: gkrieg13 on April 23, 2017, 08:18:01 pm
My two biggest townreads are on mcmc. Can you convince me that he's scum?

I mean he just seems like he is...  I think I put all of the quotes about him that I wanted to in that reread post.

This one here. (http://forum.dominionstrategy.com/index.php?topic=17163.msg690012#msg690012)
Title: Re: M98: Русская Mafia (Day 1)
Post by: gkrieg13 on April 23, 2017, 08:20:14 pm
gkrieg, you prefer town right?

I think my preference would be town>mafia>IC>Traitor>SK.
why town>IC?


Would you guys rather no lynch on D1? Because that would suck and we're running out of time.

This is what I would expect from scum!Andrew.

vote: Andrew
elabor8

Well I lost the last two games where I was IC, so not too fond of that one right now.

Uh, scum!Andrew likes to push mislynches.

Never mind, just read through M97, and I was completely misremembering it...

unvote
Title: Re: M98: Русская Mafia (Day 1)
Post by: gkrieg13 on April 23, 2017, 08:21:39 pm
Someone give me a reason to not vote Awaclus, other than him saying that he doesn't anything to scumslip--as he has failed to show that anyone else has done that thus far this game.

I think Awaclus is easier to read the longer he goes in a game.  I don't really like lynching him D1 because of that, so there isn't a real reason other than my read on him gets better with time.
Title: Re: M98: Русская Mafia (Day 1)
Post by: schadd on April 23, 2017, 08:22:54 pm
Never mind, just read through M97, and I was completely misremembering it...
in 2 minutes?
Title: Re: M98: Русская Mafia (Day 1)
Post by: gkrieg13 on April 23, 2017, 08:23:05 pm
This feels exactly like the last time Robz was mislynched D1. I don't like it.

Vote: e

Maybe?

I remember town!Robz fighting harder against his lynch before, but this is a little different. He's not at L-1 and it's D1.

To be fair, he will be the go-to lynch if nothing changes soon.

Faust moving his vote changes that. Speaking of which, I like
Vote: faust
Better than Robz. I have convinced myself that I believe Robz at least for today

Why faust? I don't like this at all, actually.

I remember e doing this before though.  The last game where I was sure he was scum, he was town, and got lynched for having these weird switches like this.  I can't think of the right word right now.
Title: Re: M98: Русская Mafia (Day 1)
Post by: The_Wine_Merchant on April 23, 2017, 08:23:10 pm
Fine. vote: mcmc

I dont see Andrew as mafia here. Source: played scum with him my last game and watched the other game he was mafia.
Title: Re: M98: Русская Mafia (Day 1)
Post by: gkrieg13 on April 23, 2017, 08:23:42 pm
Never mind, just read through M97, and I was completely misremembering it...
in 2 minutes?

Well I read the end of the day1, then remembered that he wasn't on the wagon, and was against the wagon.
Title: Re: M98: Русская Mafia (Day 1)
Post by: schadd on April 23, 2017, 08:25:14 pm
ah
Title: Re: M98: Русская Mafia (Day 1)
Post by: gkrieg13 on April 23, 2017, 08:25:24 pm
That's why I didn't answer before, I don't really have a better answer then I think what twm did is scummy. I mean it's not even crazy scummy, it's just the scummiest thing I have seen yet. Maybe it helps if I tell a narrative that fits.

I feel like scum!twm want to add his vote to yours when he sees you vote but doesn't want to be the one "pushing" the wagon so he just sheeps and when I ask him about his reasons he gives me this its the same reasons as Faust, go see for yourself. It's just wierd for a towny to say that especially given the fact that it wasn't obviouse what your reasons were for multiple people. Furthermore once you give your reason and gkriegs says it's reaching twm doesn't back you up, he becomes more cryptic about what his reasons are. Just feels like scum hoping you or other townies will take the lead in going for an awaclus lynch.

I think I get your reasoning here.  And I think they only apply if people think TWM is generally townie and they like to sheep him.  Like this would be a good case on faust, but not a very good case on TWM.
I Can understand that, I do think people think twm is towny though.
They do now. Previously, when this all was happening, they didn't, it was up in the air. I think I have done a decent job of making sure town people have had opportunities to accurately read me despite some somewhat unknown situations earlier. You are the exception, which is partially why I am suspicious of you.

This is a sort of scummy post.  I mean, yeah, every alignment wants to make sure people think they are town, but the wording "accurately read me" just sends off the scum bells in my head.
Title: Re: M98: Русская Mafia (Day 1)
Post by: gkrieg13 on April 23, 2017, 08:25:54 pm
ah

ah
/ä/
exclamation
used to express a range of emotions including surprise, pleasure, sympathy, and realization.
"ah, there you are!"
Title: Re: M98: Русская Mafia (Day 1)
Post by: schadd on April 23, 2017, 08:26:30 pm
i see
Title: Re: M98: Русская Mafia (Day 1)
Post by: schadd on April 23, 2017, 08:33:22 pm
vote: mcmc
Title: Re: M98: Русская Mafia (Day 1)
Post by: gkrieg13 on April 23, 2017, 08:37:34 pm
It looks like there are a lot of people voting for mcmcsalot, but there are only 3 if you count my vote.

vote: Mcmcsalot.
Title: Re: M98: Русская Mafia (Day 1)
Post by: Awaclus on April 23, 2017, 08:38:40 pm
Vote: mcmc
Title: Re: M98: Русская Mafia (Day 1)
Post by: Robz888 on April 23, 2017, 08:40:14 pm
Keep in mind it's his birthday, I don't know if he'll be around. Are we really comfortable lynching him without a claim? I mean, I would rather lynch him than get lynched myself, but objectively, I don't know if that's the smartest thing,
Title: Re: M98: Русская Mafia (Day 1)
Post by: schadd on April 23, 2017, 08:47:17 pm
he said he'd catch up tonight, and he posted three hours ago. it's not like we're just gonna slam down on it, too
Title: Re: M98: Русская Mafia (Day 1)
Post by: mcmcsalot on April 23, 2017, 09:18:23 pm
I am caught up, I am also a vanilla townie. I also don't have much to add. I am much less confident of my reads after failing super hard last game and think most people are playing as I expect them to be playing. I would be open to lynching andrew, twm, 2.7. kkrieg, eevee, awaclus. Also I am sleepy and slightly inebriated.
Title: Re: M98: Русская Mafia (Day 1)
Post by: schadd on April 23, 2017, 09:20:49 pm
you def. didn't fail super hard last game
Title: Re: M98: Русская Mafia (Day 1)
Post by: mcmcsalot on April 23, 2017, 09:24:47 pm
you def. didn't fail super hard last game

I misread joseph/ashersky/dylan/eevee. I had three townies on my wagon day one and allowed scum to quietly sheep me to the win.
Title: Re: M98: Русская Mafia (Day 1)
Post by: schadd on April 23, 2017, 09:26:58 pm
4 is not a lot of misreads. scum quietly sheeped you on andrew, pps loudly sheeped you on andrew
Title: Re: M98: Русская Mafia (Day 1)
Post by: schadd on April 23, 2017, 09:28:26 pm
if you are confident that you would misread people here i'd rather you do it than not bother
Title: Re: M98: Русская Mafia (Day 1)
Post by: The_Wine_Merchant on April 23, 2017, 09:35:35 pm
Well shit, now this feels mislynchy.
Title: Re: M98: Русская Mafia (Day 1)
Post by: schadd on April 23, 2017, 09:36:38 pm
it does, but mcmc is a good scum player
Title: Re: M98: Русская Mafia (Day 1)
Post by: Robz888 on April 23, 2017, 09:37:18 pm
So what are we going to do? Didn't want to lynch mcmc before, don't want to lynch him now either.
Title: Re: M98: Русская Mafia (Day 1)
Post by: Robz888 on April 23, 2017, 09:38:01 pm
I am sort of inclined to go after one of the mcmc pile-on ers. But maybe avoiding mcmc's wagon was the safest thing for scum to do.
Title: Re: M98: Русская Mafia (Day 1)
Post by: schadd on April 23, 2017, 09:38:23 pm

So what are we going to do? Didn't want to lynch mcmc before, don't want to lynch him now either.
que sera sera
Title: Re: M98: Русская Mafia (Day 1)
Post by: schadd on April 23, 2017, 09:39:57 pm
if you don't want to lynch mcmc you could try changing our minds?
Title: Re: M98: Русская Mafia (Day 1)
Post by: Robz888 on April 23, 2017, 09:49:54 pm
This just feels like genuinely busy mcmc to me, him actually being what he says makes a lot of sense. The problem is I don't have a great alternative candidate...
Title: Re: M98: Русская Mafia (Day 1)
Post by: Robz888 on April 23, 2017, 09:50:30 pm
And I don't really know who else is viable at this point.
Title: Re: M98: Русская Mafia (Day 1)
Post by: Robz888 on April 23, 2017, 09:50:44 pm
I mean, who is here right now?
Title: Re: M98: Русская Mafia (Day 1)
Post by: schadd on April 23, 2017, 09:57:21 pm
This just feels like genuinely busy mcmc to me, him actually being what he says makes a lot of sense. The problem is I don't have a great alternative candidate...
in 477 he said he was caught up; not busy, rather sleepy/inebriated. and the investment he bled when he was town in M96 can still be present even if he's busy.


I mean, who is here right now?
me!
Title: Re: M98: Русская Mafia (Day 1)
Post by: Robz888 on April 23, 2017, 09:58:24 pm
I mean if all we can do is lynch mcmc or no one, I will vote for mcmc befoere I go to sleep in about 2 hrs
Title: Re: M98: Русская Mafia (Day 1)
Post by: mcmcsalot on April 23, 2017, 09:59:58 pm
I will have the time to keep up during the next couple weeks though!
Title: Re: M98: Русская Mafia (Day 1)
Post by: schadd on April 23, 2017, 10:04:12 pm
grargh, but like, what can you do in the next couple weeks that you can't do now/couldn't have done in the last week?
Title: Re: M98: Русская Mafia (Day 1)
Post by: schadd on April 23, 2017, 10:06:36 pm
happy birthday, also.
Title: Re: M98: Русская Mafia (Day 1)
Post by: kkrieg on April 23, 2017, 10:14:54 pm
I mean if all we can do is lynch mcmc or no one, I will vote for mcmc befoere I go to sleep in about 2 hrs
I agree with this.
Title: Re: M98: Русская Mafia (Day 1)
Post by: The_Wine_Merchant on April 23, 2017, 10:30:12 pm
I am here, ish. I like mcmcsalot more than Andrew and 2.7. But I am not as enamored as I was. Awaclus was a mcmcsalot pile oner.
Title: Re: M98: Русская Mafia (Day 1)
Post by: AndrewisFTTW on April 23, 2017, 10:37:29 pm
Yeah I'd rather lynch Awaclus than mcmc.
Title: Re: M98: Русская Mafia (Day 1)
Post by: mcmcsalot on April 23, 2017, 10:51:39 pm
vote: awaclus
Title: Re: M98: Русская Mafia (Day 1)
Post by: mcmcsalot on April 23, 2017, 10:53:52 pm
request vote count
Title: Re: M98: Русская Mafia (Day 1)
Post by: The_Wine_Merchant on April 23, 2017, 10:57:42 pm
vote: awaclus
Title: Re: M98: Русская Mafia (Day 1)
Post by: Robz888 on April 23, 2017, 10:58:15 pm
Vote: awaclus
Title: Re: M98: Русская Mafia (Day 1)
Post by: schadd on April 23, 2017, 11:09:06 pm
i mean, someone that makes a point of obscuring his reasoning shouldn't be the d1 lynch because of his shoddy reasoning. what do we have on him?
Title: Re: M98: Русская Mafia (Day 1)
Post by: AndrewisFTTW on April 23, 2017, 11:10:22 pm
TWM was already voting Awaclus so he's at L-1 I think.
Title: Re: M98: Русская Mafia (Day 1)
Post by: schadd on April 23, 2017, 11:18:28 pm
o wow, yes. kkrieg, andrew, twm, mcmc, robz.


i can hammer him later, i guess. there is a thing that makes me think he's traitor and so it would be cool if he flipped traitor
Title: Re: M98: Русская Mafia (Day 1)
Post by: The_Wine_Merchant on April 23, 2017, 11:22:10 pm
TWM was already voting Awaclus so he's at L-1 I think.

Was not. Was voting mcmc
Title: Re: M98: Русская Mafia (Day 1)
Post by: kkrieg on April 23, 2017, 11:23:30 pm
hey gkrieg I know you're online what do you think about awaclus?
Title: Re: M98: Русская Mafia (Day 1)
Post by: gkrieg13 on April 23, 2017, 11:23:55 pm
I do not like that wagon. Some of the scummiest scummies on there.
Title: Re: M98: Русская Mafia (Day 1)
Post by: gkrieg13 on April 23, 2017, 11:24:46 pm
It's enough votes that we could probably switch to a better lynch. Like mcmc or Andrew
Title: Re: M98: Русская Mafia (Day 1)
Post by: gkrieg13 on April 23, 2017, 11:25:30 pm
But of course I will hammer before bed, seeing as I go to sleep about 3 hours before deadline.
Title: Re: M98: Русская Mafia (Day 1)
Post by: Robz888 on April 23, 2017, 11:26:10 pm
Look I would lynch Andrew instead, but I'm only going to be up for 40 more minutes. If the votes are there, I'll do it.
Title: Re: M98: Русская Mafia (Day 1)
Post by: schadd on April 23, 2017, 11:27:43 pm
how about you talk about why you are voting awaclus pleeeeez
Title: Re: M98: Русская Mafia (Day 1)
Post by: Robz888 on April 23, 2017, 11:30:16 pm
how about you talk about why you are voting awaclus pleeeeez

He's a person who isn't a townread.
Title: Re: M98: Русская Mafia (Day 1)
Post by: The_Wine_Merchant on April 23, 2017, 11:41:01 pm
I do not like that wagon. Some of the scummiest scummies on there.
Pshawwwwwwww
Title: Re: M98: Русская Mafia (Day 1)
Post by: The_Wine_Merchant on April 24, 2017, 12:22:20 am
HahahahahahahahahahahhahahahahahhahahahahhahHhHhHhaahahahaha
Title: Re: M98: Русская Mafia (Day 1)
Post by: The_Wine_Merchant on April 24, 2017, 12:24:04 am
Ian so totally town that you all should see it and if you don't then you are a dumb dumb dumb dumb dumb
Title: Re: M98: Русская Mafia (Day 1)
Post by: gkrieg13 on April 24, 2017, 12:25:26 am
TWM is at mcmcs party too I guess  :P
Title: Re: M98: Русская Mafia (Day 1)
Post by: schadd on April 24, 2017, 12:26:15 am
fucking
Title: Re: M98: Русская Mafia (Day 1)
Post by: schadd on April 24, 2017, 12:27:08 am
was ehunt actually town, the one time?
Title: Re: M98: Русская Mafia (Day 1)
Post by: schadd on April 24, 2017, 12:29:03 am
ok he was. for some reason i remember him actually being scum, but whatev.


in theory this is rather easy to fake
Title: Re: M98: Русская Mafia (Day 1)
Post by: The_Wine_Merchant on April 24, 2017, 12:31:55 am
TWM is at mcmcs party too I guess  :P
Partyyyyyyyyyyyyyyy!
Title: Re: M98: Русская Mafia (Day 1)
Post by: schadd on April 24, 2017, 12:32:47 am
i hope u (continue to) enjoy urself
Title: Re: M98: Русская Mafia (Day 1)
Post by: The_Wine_Merchant on April 24, 2017, 12:33:21 am
I think that I will be awake at deadline but I ahbe no idea whatbshapr I'll be in when I wake up. So you should probably lynch without me.

Kapeesh?
Title: Re: M98: Русская Mafia (Day 1)
Post by: The_Wine_Merchant on April 24, 2017, 12:33:34 am
Bed time.
Title: Re: M98: Русская Mafia (Day 1)
Post by: schadd on April 24, 2017, 12:34:50 am
capisce
Title: Re: M98: Русская Mafia (PMs are out! N0)
Post by: LaLight on April 24, 2017, 01:00:55 am
Vote Count 1.6
 
Awaclus (5): kkrieg, AndrewisFTTW, mcmcsalot, The_Wine_Merchant, Robz888
2,71828..... (2): Eevee, faust
mcmcsalot (3): schadd, gkrieg13, Awaclus
faust (1): 2,71828.....
Not voting (0):

With 11 alive it takes 6 to lynch. Day 1 ends Monday, 24th of April at 5 am FT. This is in 4 hours.
Title: Re: M98: Русская Mafia (Day 1)
Post by: gkrieg13 on April 24, 2017, 01:12:01 am
Only three more for the mcmcsalot wagon to go!  Any takers?  Kkrieg, why do you think Awaclus is a better lynch than mcmcsalot?
Title: Re: M98: Русская Mafia (Day 1)
Post by: kkrieg on April 24, 2017, 01:20:16 am
Only three more for the mcmcsalot wagon to go!  Any takers?  Kkrieg, why do you think Awaclus is a better lynch than mcmcsalot?
babe you know it's past my bedtime don't ask hard questions

he reacted pretty quickly to my initial kinda random vote at him
he hasn't been particularly helpful
he jumped on the mcmc train

honestly my reasons are weak but heyy it is day 1

Title: Re: M98: Русская Mafia (Day 1)
Post by: gkrieg13 on April 24, 2017, 01:25:25 am
Only three more for the mcmcsalot wagon to go!  Any takers?  Kkrieg, why do you think Awaclus is a better lynch than mcmcsalot?
babe you know it's past my bedtime don't ask hard questions

he reacted pretty quickly to my initial kinda random vote at him
he hasn't been particularly helpful
he jumped on the mcmc train

honestly my reasons are weak but heyy it is day 1

What is scummy about the mcmc wagon?
Title: Re: M98: Русская Mafia (Day 1)
Post by: 2.71828..... on April 24, 2017, 02:16:08 am
Bleh. It is bedtime and we need a lynch

Vote: mcmc
Title: Re: M98: Русская Mafia (Day 1)
Post by: 2.71828..... on April 24, 2017, 02:16:37 am
Nevermind

Vote: Awaclus
Title: Re: M98: Русская Mafia (Day 1)
Post by: schadd on April 24, 2017, 02:17:32 am

i'm worried that we all just fall asleep. i kind of don't think mcmc or anything will happen within 3 hours


vote: awaclus


ppe ok
Title: Re: M98: Русская Mafia (Day 1)
Post by: faust on April 24, 2017, 02:20:29 am
Was that the lynch? I guess I am some minutes too late.
Title: Re: M98: Русская Mafia (Day 1)
Post by: schadd on April 24, 2017, 02:21:35 am
yea


whomst would you have pushed?
Title: Re: M98: Русская Mafia (Day 1)
Post by: LaLight on April 24, 2017, 02:52:52 am
Twilight until i get to work which is in ~40 mins
Title: Re: M98: Русская Mafia (Day 1)
Post by: faust on April 24, 2017, 03:28:59 am
yea


whomst would you have pushed?
Of Awaclus/mcmc? Man, honestly I don't know.
Title: Re: M98: Русская Mafia (Day 1)
Post by: faust on April 24, 2017, 03:30:24 am
But I have to say I find this a bit hypocritical:

Keep in mind it's his birthday, I don't know if he'll be around. Are we really comfortable lynching him without a claim? I mean, I would rather lynch him than get lynched myself, but objectively, I don't know if that's the smartest thing,
Vote: awaclus

Probably would have gone for mcmc after the VT claim.
Title: Re: M98: Русская Mafia (PMs are out! N0)
Post by: LaLight on April 24, 2017, 03:35:21 am
Vote Count 1.final
 
Awaclus (6): kkrieg, AndrewisFTTW, mcmcsalot, The_Wine_Merchant, Robz888, 2,71828.....
2,71828..... (2): Eevee, faust
mcmcsalot (3): schadd, gkrieg13, Awaclus
Not voting (0):

With 11 alive it took 6 to lynch. Thread Locked.

Title: Re: M98: Русская Mafia (Day 1)
Post by: LaLight on April 24, 2017, 03:42:38 am
Казалось бы, ничто не предвещает беды. Все счастливо добывали золото, предвкушая, как потратят несметные богатства. Но в какой-то момент демон жадности овладел душами людей. Они начали подозрительно оглядываться на своих соседей: вдруг те пытаются загрести себе больше? И одного крика "Аваклус прячет золото под рубашкой!" хватило, чтобы люди подбежали к бедному парню и начали трясти его. Сердце бедного Аваклуса не выдержало...

Everything went fine. People were mining gold imagining precious things they will buy with it. But in one moment the demon of greed started living in people's minds... They started looking suspiciously at their neighbours to see if they try to hide some gold from them. The peace was broken at the moment one voice loudly screamed: "Awaclus is hiding extra gold under his shirt! All the village ran into Awaclus and started shaking him to look if he's cheating. Nothing was there. But the heart of the poor guy stopped.

Awaclus was lynched! He was Аваклус, the Vanilla Townie!

Night 1 starts now and ends Wednesday, April 26th at 3.30 am FT. Deadline for night actions is in 47 hours.
Title: Re: M98: Русская Mafia (PMs are out! N0)
Post by: LaLight on April 26, 2017, 03:34:30 am
Ночь была очень тревожной. Каждый спал в своем доме, опасаясь за те запасы золота, что успел собрать днем. Внезапно тишину разорвал пронзительный крик: "ПОЖАР!" Люди выскочили из своих домов и увидели, что один из домов объят пламенем. Все начали таскать ведра с водой, чтобы попытаться потушить огонь. Уже начало светать, когда дом догорел. Под развалинами нашли бедного Макмаксалота и... огромные запасы украденного золота!

The night was very troubling. Each villager was sleeping in their house having nightmares about someone coming and stealing their gold. Suddenly the silence was broken by the loud scream: "FIRE!" Everyone ran out of their huts and saw one of the houses burning. Everyone started carrying buckets of water trying to save the man inside. Fire stopped only when the sun was already rising. Under the ruined house villagers have found dead mcmcsalot and... the huge stack of stolen gold!

mcmcsalot was killed! He was Макмаксалот, the mafia goon.

День 2 начался!

Vote count 2.0

Not voting (9):
Robz888, The_Wine_Merchant, schadd, Eevee, gkrieg13, AndrewisFTTW, 2,71828....., faust, kkrieg

With 9 alive it takes 5 to lynch. Day 1 ends Wednesday, 3rd of May at 4 am FT. Thread unlocked.
Title: Re: M98: Русская Mafia (Day 2)
Post by: faust on April 26, 2017, 04:57:44 am
Huh.
Title: Re: M98: Русская Mafia (Day 2)
Post by: faust on April 26, 2017, 05:01:02 am
So we have a nice SK.

Well it does not make a lot of sense for a SK to go after a claimed VT one N1 I think. That only really works if they were afraid of mcmc. So that's a good place to start looking.

On the other hand, mcmc had a partner. That guy is also worth looking for.
Title: Re: M98: Русская Mafia (Day 2)
Post by: faust on April 26, 2017, 05:03:49 am
Also there clearly was a blocked kill. That can be any of SK/1-shot BP/JK/Traitor uwittingly blocking their partner, so I'm not sure if a claim helps us here.
Title: Re: M98: Русская Mafia (Day 2)
Post by: faust on April 26, 2017, 05:25:32 am
So rereading mcmc. I'm positive that we can figure this out.

Okay, so he is pushing pretty hard for TWM.

This is interesting interaction:
mcmc, do you think i think you're town or scum?


will ask again later

I think you think I'm town.
schadd, why did you ask mcmc?

There is more TWM tunnelling. This starts to look pretty bad for him.

I would be open to lynching andrew, twm, 2.7. kkrieg, eevee, awaclus.
Is mcmc's partner in here? Arguably yes. But it's a big list, so eh.

Okay, I feel like there isn't really a lot to take away in terms of partner reads, but it feels like TWM is the only one with a motive to kill mcmc.

Another interesting data point would be the mcmc wagon.

This is the mcmc wagon history.

gkrieg, TWM
[these two have been voting mcmc for a while through D1.

I'd be ok with Awaclus or Andrew
kkrieg does not mention mcmc at all here. Scummy.

I would go for E if the votes were there. If not I'll stick with Andrew. Awaclus is also fine. This does not feel like scum mcmc to me.
Also not too good, but it feels unlikely that both scum would claim VT on D1.

Andrew & TWM move towards Awaclus.

gkrieg votes for Andrew, and then unvotes, thus removing his vote from mcmc in a non-obvious way. That's quite crafty if intentional.

schadd votes mcmc. Town points here. Then gkrieg switches back (ok, I suppose the above was not intentioal), Then Awaclus.

If I'm seeing correctly, this is the mcmc wagon at peak:

TWM, schadd, gkrieg, Awaclus

Robz continues to push off of mcmc. Ironically, TWM takes the lead on destroying the mcmc wagon. His is the deciding vote. The others on mcmc stay there.

So schadd and gkrieg definitely look townie (or, I guess, non-SK-y). Mild scum read on Robz, stronger on kkrieg and Andrew.
Title: Re: M98: Русская Mafia (Day 2)
Post by: faust on April 26, 2017, 05:26:06 am
I think I'm happy with a vote: TWM for now.
Title: Re: M98: Русская Mafia (Day 2)
Post by: schadd on April 26, 2017, 07:46:55 am
ayyyy


vote: robz
Title: Re: M98: Русская Mafia (Day 2)
Post by: Robz888 on April 26, 2017, 07:48:36 am
Boy, I have to learn how to read mcmc.

Rough night for scum.

Yes, TWM looks very bad in light of faust's analysis. Vote: TWM
Title: Re: M98: Русская Mafia (Day 2)
Post by: schadd on April 26, 2017, 07:52:18 am
gkrieg looks sk here (a few un-townie things but he wouldn't push a partner d1) but that kill seems too obvious


This is interesting interaction:
mcmc, do you think i think you're town or scum?


will ask again later

I think you think I'm town.
schadd, why did you ask mcmc?
tone read. if you look back at how i read him it might make sense that i would just want him to talk about generic game stuff
Title: Re: M98: Русская Mafia (Day 2)
Post by: schadd on April 26, 2017, 07:53:16 am
Boy, I have to learn how to read mcmc.

Rough night for scum.

Yes, TWM looks very bad in light of faust's analysis. Vote: TWM
ho ho ho he he he ha ha ha
Title: Re: M98: Русская Mafia (Day 2)
Post by: Robz888 on April 26, 2017, 07:57:24 am
Boy, I have to learn how to read mcmc.

Rough night for scum.

Yes, TWM looks very bad in light of faust's analysis. Vote: TWM
ho ho ho he he he ha ha ha

Use your words, schadd!
Title: Re: M98: Русская Mafia (Day 2)
Post by: schadd on April 26, 2017, 08:10:53 am
Boy, I have to learn how to read mcmc.

Rough night for scum.

Yes, TWM looks very bad in light of faust's analysis. Vote: TWM
ho ho ho he he he ha ha ha
Title: Re: M98: Русская Mafia (Day 2)
Post by: schadd on April 26, 2017, 08:11:17 am
was i bussing again?
Title: Re: M98: Русская Mafia (Day 1)
Post by: schadd on April 26, 2017, 08:13:47 am
Bleh. It is bedtime and we need a lynch

Vote: mcmc
Nevermind

Vote: Awaclus
lol lol lol lol townie
Title: Re: M98: Русская Mafia (Day 2)
Post by: schadd on April 26, 2017, 08:15:04 am
gkrieg may have gotten recruited


if not, can the traitor tell us whomst they roleblocked in twilight after we lynch them?
Title: Re: M98: Русская Mafia (Day 2)
Post by: schadd on April 26, 2017, 08:22:15 am
twm as SK makes sense but i also think he might just be groupscum
Title: Re: M98: Русская Mafia (Day 2)
Post by: The_Wine_Merchant on April 26, 2017, 09:00:42 am
I think I'm happy with a vote: TWM for now.
Huh.

I was going to ask if this makes me pretty townie. I guess not.
Title: Re: M98: Русская Mafia (Day 2)
Post by: The_Wine_Merchant on April 26, 2017, 09:01:54 am
Boy, I have to learn how to read mcmc.

Rough night for scum.

Yes, TWM looks very bad in light of faust's analysis. Vote: TWM
ho ho ho he he he ha ha ha
schadd gets it.
Title: Re: M98: Русская Mafia (Day 2)
Post by: 2.71828..... on April 26, 2017, 09:03:11 am
Also there clearly was a blocked kill. That can be any of SK/1-shot BP/JK/Traitor uwittingly blocking their partner, so I'm not sure if a claim helps us here.

There is also a possible commuter that went away last night. But I think 1-shot BP/JK makes the most sense
Title: Re: M98: Русская Mafia (Day 2)
Post by: 2.71828..... on April 26, 2017, 09:03:27 am
But yeah. Great night
Title: Re: M98: Русская Mafia (Day 2)
Post by: The_Wine_Merchant on April 26, 2017, 09:03:32 am
I just need to stick to my guns. I was the primary pusher of the mcmcsalot lynch Day 1. faust's analysis seems to have completely missed that and Robx couldn't be bothered to go look for himself.
Title: Re: M98: Русская Mafia (Day 2)
Post by: The_Wine_Merchant on April 26, 2017, 09:05:39 am
mcmcsalot fooled me by looking nonchalant when he claimed and I got nervous. I am most suspicious of Robz and faust. Especially when faust told me that voting for mcmcsalot because of OMGUS was bad when that was obviously not the only reason I was voting for him.
Title: Re: M98: Русская Mafia (Day 2)
Post by: schadd on April 26, 2017, 09:06:04 am
I just need to stick to my guns. I was the primary pusher of the mcmcsalot lynch Day 1. faust's analysis seems to have completely missed that and Robx couldn't be bothered to go look for himself.
i don't think u know what the accusation on u is
Title: Re: M98: Русская Mafia (Day 2)
Post by: The_Wine_Merchant on April 26, 2017, 09:07:52 am
I just need to stick to my guns. I was the primary pusher of the mcmcsalot lynch Day 1. faust's analysis seems to have completely missed that and Robx couldn't be bothered to go look for himself.
i don't think u know what the accusation on u is
Apparently not. Obviously not mcmc's partner.
Title: Re: M98: Русская Mafia (Day 2)
Post by: The_Wine_Merchant on April 26, 2017, 09:08:27 am
Which is the main thing we should be looking for given the flip from last night.
Title: Re: M98: Русская Mafia (Day 2)
Post by: schadd on April 26, 2017, 09:10:12 am
uh, no


scum nightkill => guess at scum motivation for kill


SK nightkill => _____


fill in tha blank
Title: Re: M98: Русская Mafia (Day 2)
Post by: schadd on April 26, 2017, 09:12:00 am
and mcmc red doesn't clear you as the partner anyway (neither of you finished on each other) (heh)
Title: Re: M98: Русская Mafia (Day 2)
Post by: faust on April 26, 2017, 09:17:33 am
I just need to stick to my guns. I was the primary pusher of the mcmcsalot lynch Day 1. faust's analysis seems to have completely missed that and Robx couldn't be bothered to go look for himself.
I saw that, but it doesn't matter.
Title: Re: M98: Русская Mafia (Day 2)
Post by: faust on April 26, 2017, 09:18:50 am
Or it does matter maybe. But given the extent of mutual tunneling I would not even be surprised if you were mcmc's partner.
Title: Re: M98: Русская Mafia (Day 2)
Post by: faust on April 26, 2017, 09:19:47 am
mcmcsalot fooled me by looking nonchalant when he claimed and I got nervous. I am most suspicious of Robz and faust. Especially when faust told me that voting for mcmcsalot because of OMGUS was bad when that was obviously not the only reason I was voting for him.
I had explicitly asked you to provide a reason before that, and you did not deliver anything, so I fail to see how it was anything but OMGUS.
Title: Re: M98: Русская Mafia (Day 1)
Post by: faust on April 26, 2017, 09:20:35 am
See here:

My two biggest townreads are on mcmc. Can you convince me that he's scum?
Probably not. I am not even convinced myself.
Title: Re: M98: Русская Mafia (Day 2)
Post by: The_Wine_Merchant on April 26, 2017, 09:20:43 am
I just need to stick to my guns. I was the primary pusher of the mcmcsalot lynch Day 1. faust's analysis seems to have completely missed that and Robx couldn't be bothered to go look for himself.
I saw that, but it doesn't matter.
These are my emotions right now in regard to you:

 >:(  :o  ???  ::)  :P  :-\  :'(
Title: Re: M98: Русская Mafia (Day 1)
Post by: The_Wine_Merchant on April 26, 2017, 09:21:19 am
See here:

My two biggest townreads are on mcmc. Can you convince me that he's scum?
Probably not. I am not even convinced myself.
Oh wow. You can find one quote. Good job. I can find one too.
Title: Re: M98: Русская Mafia (Day 2)
Post by: schadd on April 26, 2017, 09:23:12 am
no, vote: twm
Title: Re: M98: Русская Mafia (Day 1)
Post by: The_Wine_Merchant on April 26, 2017, 09:24:48 am
This feels very similar to mcmc from M91. I don't like the 2.7 wagon, now or earlier.

Quote 444. Which is 5 posts before your OMGUS post. Main reason I was, at that time, voting mcmc, was because he felt similar to M91 (where I was partners with him) and different from the other game M96 or whatever it was where he was super townie.
Title: Re: M98: Русская Mafia (Day 2)
Post by: The_Wine_Merchant on April 26, 2017, 09:25:20 am
At least one scum (maybe two if SK thinks they can get on this) in faust, Robz and schadd.
Title: Re: M98: Русская Mafia (Day 2)
Post by: The_Wine_Merchant on April 26, 2017, 09:26:42 am
I am not going to have time to dig into this prior to the weekend. So let's try to not accidentally lynch me here at least until then. Cause I have thoughts to say that I think (OK. Maybe I am just being optimistic. Let's say that I hope) you guys will want to go back and read after I am lynched.
Title: Re: M98: Русская Mafia (Day 2)
Post by: faust on April 26, 2017, 09:28:40 am
At least one scum (maybe two if SK thinks they can get on this) in faust, Robz and schadd.

OMGUS is not a very good way to find your reads.
Title: Re: M98: Русская Mafia (Day 2)
Post by: The_Wine_Merchant on April 26, 2017, 09:29:11 am
At least one scum (maybe two if SK thinks they can get on this) in faust, Robz and schadd.

OMGUS is not a very good way to find your reads.
oh my fuck.
Title: Re: M98: Русская Mafia (Day 2)
Post by: The_Wine_Merchant on April 26, 2017, 09:29:29 am
Worked once this game so far. Why not again?
Title: Re: M98: Русская Mafia (Day 2)
Post by: schadd on April 26, 2017, 09:30:09 am
why did you vote with him at eod?
Title: Re: M98: Русская Mafia (Day 2)
Post by: faust on April 26, 2017, 09:30:51 am
Worked once this game so far. Why not again?
We should lynch all players whose name contains an m. It worked once this game so far. Why not again?
Title: Re: M98: Русская Mafia (Day 2)
Post by: schadd on April 26, 2017, 09:32:52 am
ha
Title: Re: M98: Русская Mafia (Day 2)
Post by: The_Wine_Merchant on April 26, 2017, 09:35:06 am
Worked once this game so far. Why not again?
We should lynch all players whose name contains an m. It worked once this game so far. Why not again?
cause that is totally the same thing that I am saying here.

vote: faust for being deliberately combative and caustic here. For deliberately ignoring important parts of my play and narrative when making a case against me. He has to be aggressive and desperate to get a win here and this is what he is doing.

There you happy?
Title: Re: M98: Русская Mafia (Day 2)
Post by: faust on April 26, 2017, 09:39:41 am
Worked once this game so far. Why not again?
We should lynch all players whose name contains an m. It worked once this game so far. Why not again?
cause that is totally the same thing that I am saying here.
That is indeed my point.

vote: faust for being deliberately combative and caustic here. For deliberately ignoring important parts of my play and narrative when making a case against me. He has to be aggressive and desperate to get a win here and this is what he is doing.

Which parts am I ignoring? That you pushed mcmc? I'm not ignoring that. Is there anything else?
Title: Re: M98: Русская Mafia (Day 2)
Post by: The_Wine_Merchant on April 26, 2017, 09:45:14 am
Oh go away for a little bit.

You are obviously going to be able to win any argument that I put at you because you are better at twisting words and using select quotes and appealing to emotions in a way that people still like you at the end of it.

So I am not even going to try and get frustrated with you. I'll put up some stuff later today (today as in today in this game by the way, like Saturday or Sunday) as long as I don't get lynched.

Then you can just totally demolish it and get everyone to ignore it.
Title: Re: M98: Русская Mafia (Day 2)
Post by: The_Wine_Merchant on April 26, 2017, 09:45:54 am
Oops. That should say I'll go away, not that you should. Obviously I can't tell you what to do. And that wouldn't be nice.
Title: Re: M98: Русская Mafia (Day 2)
Post by: faust on April 26, 2017, 09:49:38 am
Oops. That should say I'll go away, not that you should. Obviously I can't tell you what to do. And that wouldn't be nice.
Well it's very much possible that I should too.
Title: Re: M98: Русская Mafia (Day 2)
Post by: schadd on April 26, 2017, 09:51:54 am
i'm trying to think of a better analogy than "i'm such a good starcraft player, look at how many minerals i have"


you pushed on him during the day, yes. end of day is whenlynches happen and at end of day you lynched awaclus for voting the guy you're trying to get towncred for pushing
Title: Re: M98: Русская Mafia (Day 2)
Post by: schadd on April 26, 2017, 09:55:50 am
and if you hadn't made the switcheroo it would have likely been a d1 correct lynch. it seems as though e would have voted mcmc and faust would have kind of been forced into it
Title: Re: M98: Русская Mafia (Day 2)
Post by: gkrieg13 on April 26, 2017, 10:07:48 am
gkrieg looks sk here (a few un-townie things but he wouldn't push a partner d1) but that kill seems too obvious


This is interesting interaction:
mcmc, do you think i think you're town or scum?


will ask again later

I think you think I'm town.
schadd, why did you ask mcmc?
tone read. if you look back at how i read him it might make sense that i would just want him to talk about generic game stuff

Uh, I don't think SK wants to kill scum N1 here. If I were SK I would want to let mcmc live and try to lynch him again today. You get towncred for lynching scum, so you want them alive for that. At least the first night.
Title: Re: M98: Русская Mafia (Day 2)
Post by: gkrieg13 on April 26, 2017, 10:09:00 am
gkrieg may have gotten recruited


if not, can the traitor tell us whomst they roleblocked in twilight after we lynch them?

I don't get why you are so sure I'm not town. Like what did I do?
Title: Re: M98: Русская Mafia (Day 2)
Post by: schadd on April 26, 2017, 10:13:23 am
well you might keep doing it, we'll see. i'm not considering you as much as it probably sounds like
Title: Re: M98: Русская Mafia (Day 2)
Post by: gkrieg13 on April 26, 2017, 10:13:35 am
Oh go away for a little bit.

You are obviously going to be able to win any argument that I put at you because you are better at twisting words and using select quotes and appealing to emotions in a way that people still like you at the end of it.

So I am not even going to try and get frustrated with you. I'll put up some stuff later today (today as in today in this game by the way, like Saturday or Sunday) as long as I don't get lynched.

Then you can just totally demolish it and get everyone to ignore it.

Uh I'm really surprised you are so touchy about this. Say why doing what you did D 1 is townie. Also I know kkrieg was online and could've voted mcmcsalot. vote: kkrieg
Title: Re: M98: Русская Mafia (Day 2)
Post by: faust on April 26, 2017, 10:14:08 am
Uh, I don't think SK wants to kill scum N1 here. If I were SK I would want to let mcmc live and try to lynch him again today. You get towncred for lynching scum, so you want them alive for that. At least the first night.
Yeah; that is why the mcmc kill makes very little sense to me. If the SK thinks mcmc is scum, they want to keep him alive and push a lynch. If they think he's town, then they would much rather kill a PR than a claimed VT.

It speaks to newb!SK, and the fact that TWM thought this flip would make him look townie adds to that narrative.
Title: Re: M98: Русская Mafia (Day 2)
Post by: faust on April 26, 2017, 10:14:55 am
Uh I'm really surprised you are so touchy about this. Say why doing what you did D 1 is townie. Also I know kkrieg was online and could've voted mcmcsalot. vote: kkrieg
Gah. You know that that is the kind of thing you should try to avoid, right?
Title: Re: M98: Русская Mafia (Day 2)
Post by: schadd on April 26, 2017, 10:17:24 am
Oh go away for a little bit.

You are obviously going to be able to win any argument that I put at you because you are better at twisting words and using select quotes and appealing to emotions in a way that people still like you at the end of it.

So I am not even going to try and get frustrated with you. I'll put up some stuff later today (today as in today in this game by the way, like Saturday or Sunday) as long as I don't get lynched.

Then you can just totally demolish it and get everyone to ignore it.

Uh I'm really surprised you are so touchy about this. Say why doing what you did D 1 is townie. Also I know kkrieg was online and could've voted mcmcsalot. vote: kkrieg
babe u knew it was last her bedtime & u shouldn't have asked difficult questions
Title: Re: M98: Русская Mafia (Day 2)
Post by: schadd on April 26, 2017, 10:17:38 am
past
Title: Re: M98: Русская Mafia (Day 2)
Post by: gkrieg13 on April 26, 2017, 10:28:29 am
Uh I'm really surprised you are so touchy about this. Say why doing what you did D 1 is townie. Also I know kkrieg was online and could've voted mcmcsalot. vote: kkrieg
Gah. You know that that is the kind of thing you should try to avoid, right?

Yes. I'm pretty sure we shouldn't be in games together...
Title: Re: M98: Русская Mafia (Day 2)
Post by: gkrieg13 on April 26, 2017, 10:51:17 am
I'm actually not entirely sure she checked the forum again, but she had ample opportunity to switch her vote and she didn't and the reasoning wasn't very good.
Title: Re: M98: Русская Mafia (Day 1)
Post by: gkrieg13 on April 26, 2017, 10:55:33 am
Only three more for the mcmcsalot wagon to go!  Any takers?  Kkrieg, why do you think Awaclus is a better lynch than mcmcsalot?
babe you know it's past my bedtime don't ask hard questions

he reacted pretty quickly to my initial kinda random vote at him
he hasn't been particularly helpful
he jumped on the mcmc train

honestly my reasons are weak but heyy it is day 1
Title: Re: M98: Русская Mafia (Day 2)
Post by: The_Wine_Merchant on April 26, 2017, 11:09:59 am
i'm trying to think of a better analogy than "i'm such a good starcraft player, look at how many minerals i have"
I don't know what that means.

you pushed on him during the day, yes. end of day is whenlynches happen and at end of day you lynched awaclus for voting the guy you're trying to get towncred for pushing
I am aware at how mediocre my Day 1 performance was. Thank you very much. And I am not saying I should be the IC. I just don't think I should be the default lynch or the go-to suspect today. I think the evidence argues against that.
Title: Re: M98: Русская Mafia (Day 2)
Post by: The_Wine_Merchant on April 26, 2017, 11:10:20 am
and if you hadn't made the switcheroo it would have likely been a d1 correct lynch. it seems as though e would have voted mcmc and faust would have kind of been forced into it
Yes. Yes. Yes. I am a bad town player and I should feel bad.
Title: Re: M98: Русская Mafia (Day 2)
Post by: The_Wine_Merchant on April 26, 2017, 11:11:07 am
Uh, I don't think SK wants to kill scum N1 here. If I were SK I would want to let mcmc live and try to lynch him again today. You get towncred for lynching scum, so you want them alive for that. At least the first night.
Yeah; that is why the mcmc kill makes very little sense to me. If the SK thinks mcmc is scum, they want to keep him alive and push a lynch. If they think he's town, then they would much rather kill a PR than a claimed VT.

It speaks to newb!SK, and the fact that TWM thought this flip would make him look townie adds to that narrative.
Wait, you think I am the SK?
Title: Re: M98: Русская Mafia (Day 2)
Post by: The_Wine_Merchant on April 26, 2017, 11:12:46 am
Oh go away for a little bit.

You are obviously going to be able to win any argument that I put at you because you are better at twisting words and using select quotes and appealing to emotions in a way that people still like you at the end of it.

So I am not even going to try and get frustrated with you. I'll put up some stuff later today (today as in today in this game by the way, like Saturday or Sunday) as long as I don't get lynched.

Then you can just totally demolish it and get everyone to ignore it.

Uh I'm really surprised you are so touchy about this. Say why doing what you did D 1 is townie.
I will. I am just not going to have an opportunity to go back and spend an adequate amount of time to put that together until the weekend. I have a feeling I will get derphammered before I have a chance and that once I do someone (faust) who is better with words will manipulate it and tear it to shreds. But I will give it a try.
Title: Re: M98: Русская Mafia (Day 2)
Post by: schadd on April 26, 2017, 11:17:34 am
i'm trying to think of a better analogy than "i'm such a good starcraft player, look at how many minerals i have"
I don't know what that means.

you pushed on him during the day, yes. end of day is whenlynches happen and at end of day you lynched awaclus for voting the guy you're trying to get towncred for pushing
I am aware at how mediocre my Day 1 performance was. Thank you very much. And I am not saying I should be the IC. I just don't think I should be the default lynch or the go-to suspect today. I think the evidence argues against that.
well it also so happens that leaving a bus through the emergency exit is your scum thing
Title: Re: M98: Русская Mafia (Day 2)
Post by: AndrewisFTTW on April 26, 2017, 11:21:57 am
If you guys think TWM is the SK why are you referring to his interactions with mcmc so much?
Title: Re: M98: Русская Mafia (Day 2)
Post by: faust on April 26, 2017, 11:22:26 am
Uh, I don't think SK wants to kill scum N1 here. If I were SK I would want to let mcmc live and try to lynch him again today. You get towncred for lynching scum, so you want them alive for that. At least the first night.
Yeah; that is why the mcmc kill makes very little sense to me. If the SK thinks mcmc is scum, they want to keep him alive and push a lynch. If they think he's town, then they would much rather kill a PR than a claimed VT.

It speaks to newb!SK, and the fact that TWM thought this flip would make him look townie adds to that narrative.
Wait, you think I am the SK?
Erm, yes. That's what I've been saying all along.
Title: Re: M98: Русская Mafia (Day 2)
Post by: faust on April 26, 2017, 11:23:20 am
If you guys think TWM is the SK why are you referring to his interactions with mcmc so much?
I think that. I think him being mcmc's partner is also an option, but significantly less likely. His interactions with mcmc are relevant because they show he had motive to kill mcmc.
Title: Re: M98: Русская Mafia (Day 2)
Post by: AndrewisFTTW on April 26, 2017, 11:23:54 am
If you guys think TWM is the SK why are you referring to his interactions with mcmc so much?
I think that. I think him being mcmc's partner is also an option, but significantly less likely. His interactions with mcmc are relevant because they show he had motive to kill mcmc.

Oh please.
Title: Re: M98: Русская Mafia (Day 2)
Post by: faust on April 26, 2017, 11:24:18 am
If you guys think TWM is the SK why are you referring to his interactions with mcmc so much?
I think that. I think him being mcmc's partner is also an option, but significantly less likely. His interactions with mcmc are relevant because they show he had motive to kill mcmc.

Oh please.
?
Title: Re: M98: Русская Mafia (Day 2)
Post by: AndrewisFTTW on April 26, 2017, 11:27:13 am
You observed that TWM pushed mcmc's wagon and then "destroyed" it, as you said, and then he decided to kill him as SK?
Title: Re: M98: Русская Mafia (Day 1)
Post by: Eevee on April 26, 2017, 11:37:32 am
Oh, we are back on!

Only three more for the mcmcsalot wagon to go!  Any takers?  Kkrieg, why do you think Awaclus is a better lynch than mcmcsalot?
babe you know it's past my bedtime don't ask hard questions

he reacted pretty quickly to my initial kinda random vote at him
he hasn't been particularly helpful
he jumped on the mcmc train

honestly my reasons are weak but heyy it is day 1
I remember being surprised kkrieg could come up with that many that good reasons for the switch (and wondering why hadn't she said those things before being asked - kind of felt like she made the vote, and then only thought of the reasons after being pressed for it).

Just phone access now, but mcmc being the almost-lynch of yesterday should be helpful in determining the second mafia at least. Like, probably not e based on his voting, so my suspicion on yesterday was wrong on that at least (again, probably).
Title: Re: M98: Русская Mafia (Day 2)
Post by: Robz888 on April 26, 2017, 11:38:38 am
Uh, I don't think SK wants to kill scum N1 here. If I were SK I would want to let mcmc live and try to lynch him again today. You get towncred for lynching scum, so you want them alive for that. At least the first night.
Yeah; that is why the mcmc kill makes very little sense to me. If the SK thinks mcmc is scum, they want to keep him alive and push a lynch. If they think he's town, then they would much rather kill a PR than a claimed VT.

It speaks to newb!SK, and the fact that TWM thought this flip would make him look townie adds to that narrative.

I think this is a valid point, although then we could also look to kkrieg as a contender. Really, they are both contenders for both, in my view.

TWM's righteous indignation is reading a little townie to me though.

I must say I'm pretty suspicious of kkrieg at the moment. I gave her a newbie pass on Day 1, but now I'm getting a bad feeling.
Title: Re: M98: Русская Mafia (Day 2)
Post by: faust on April 26, 2017, 11:39:00 am
You observed that TWM pushed mcmc's wagon and then "destroyed" it, as you said, and then he decided to kill him as SK?
The point is that mcmc scumread TWM.
Title: Re: M98: Русская Mafia (Day 2)
Post by: Eevee on April 26, 2017, 11:39:07 am
TWM repeatedly saying how good faust is in forming arguments feels panicky to me, like feels to me like he is anticipating not having good enough arguments and having to "resort to" discrediting the person, not the argument that's bringing the suspicion on him.
Title: Re: M98: Русская Mafia (Day 2)
Post by: Robz888 on April 26, 2017, 11:39:11 am
Vote: Kkrieg
Title: Re: M98: Русская Mafia (Day 2)
Post by: Robz888 on April 26, 2017, 11:39:31 am
TWM repeatedly saying how good faust is in forming arguments feels panicky to me, like feels to me like he is anticipating not having good enough arguments and having to "resort to" discrediting the person, not the argument that's bringing the suspicion on him.

Definitely, but that's sort of townie, isn't it?
Title: Re: M98: Русская Mafia (Day 2)
Post by: Eevee on April 26, 2017, 11:39:36 am
I think someone who was suspected by mcmc is far far more likely to shoot him.
Title: Re: M98: Русская Mafia (Day 2)
Post by: AndrewisFTTW on April 26, 2017, 11:42:32 am
I think someone who was suspected by mcmc is far far more likely to shoot him.

I really don't think so.
Title: Re: M98: Русская Mafia (Day 2)
Post by: Eevee on April 26, 2017, 11:43:52 am
TWM repeatedly saying how good faust is in forming arguments feels panicky to me, like feels to me like he is anticipating not having good enough arguments and having to "resort to" discrediting the person, not the argument that's bringing the suspicion on him.

Definitely, but that's sort of townie, isn't it?
Is it? I could see it going both ways, but I feel TWM is being more panicky than I would expect, which makes me feel there are other circumstances in play I'm not aware of (such as him being scum and quite unluckily going from narrowly escaping his partners lynch to losing said partner and finding himself in hot water).

Title: Re: M98: Русская Mafia (Day 2)
Post by: Eevee on April 26, 2017, 11:46:24 am
I think someone who was suspected by mcmc is far far more likely to shoot him.

I really don't think so.
Why? Mcmc is what I'd call an influencial townie - definitely someone who is willing to push for their opinions, and often is pretty stubborn about them too. Scum teams usually think "who can we get lynched tomorrow?" and "what risks might there be for getting one of those lynches too", and to me being heavily suspected by mcmc would definitely constitute a risk that I would want to eliminate.

Actually, I guess the better question is, how do you think they'd decide who to shoot if not like that? Why else would they have shot a claimed VT?
Title: Re: M98: Русская Mafia (Day 2)
Post by: Robz888 on April 26, 2017, 11:53:29 am
TWM repeatedly saying how good faust is in forming arguments feels panicky to me, like feels to me like he is anticipating not having good enough arguments and having to "resort to" discrediting the person, not the argument that's bringing the suspicion on him.

Definitely, but that's sort of townie, isn't it?
Is it? I could see it going both ways, but I feel TWM is being more panicky than I would expect, which makes me feel there are other circumstances in play I'm not aware of (such as him being scum and quite unluckily going from narrowly escaping his partners lynch to losing said partner and finding himself in hot water).

Well I've never actually seen town TWM. I've seen very calculated, cautious scum TWM.
Title: Re: M98: Русская Mafia (Day 2)
Post by: The_Wine_Merchant on April 26, 2017, 12:01:39 pm
Uh, I don't think SK wants to kill scum N1 here. If I were SK I would want to let mcmc live and try to lynch him again today. You get towncred for lynching scum, so you want them alive for that. At least the first night.
Yeah; that is why the mcmc kill makes very little sense to me. If the SK thinks mcmc is scum, they want to keep him alive and push a lynch. If they think he's town, then they would much rather kill a PR than a claimed VT.

It speaks to newb!SK, and the fact that TWM thought this flip would make him look townie adds to that narrative.
Wait, you think I am the SK?
Erm, yes. That's what I've been saying all along.
Well, fuck me sideways. I had no idea.

That completely changes my response. Basically I can say it in one sentence.

There is no way I would have played the way I did if I were SK. I would have stayed in the background, jumped quietly onto a wagon like 2.7's or Andrew's and brought zero to little attention to myself.

Imagine if I had stayed on mcmc and the lynch had gone through. I would be the primary, number 1, NK target for mafia and there would have ended my game. No that would have been too risky.

The SK is someone who stayed in the background and made little to zero waves. Certainly not me.
Title: Re: M98: Русская Mafia (Day 2)
Post by: The_Wine_Merchant on April 26, 2017, 12:01:54 pm
Well I guess that was more than one sentence.
Title: Re: M98: Русская Mafia (Day 2)
Post by: Robz888 on April 26, 2017, 01:08:23 pm
There is no way I would have played the way I did if I were SK. I would have stayed in the background, jumped quietly onto a wagon like 2.7's or Andrew's and brought zero to little attention to myself.

Imagine if I had stayed on mcmc and the lynch had gone through. I would be the primary, number 1, NK target for mafia and there would have ended my game. No that would have been too risky.

The SK is someone who stayed in the background and made little to zero waves. Certainly not me.

This doesn't acquit you as much as you think. If you were SK, and you had stayed on mcmc, and the lynch had gone through, you would have been a prime NK target... only if mcmc was mafia. But of course, that's not something you knew at the time you voted him, so you could have very well done it as SK and then been genuinely surprised (and relieved you weren't nightkilled) after mcmc's flip.
Title: Re: M98: Русская Mafia (Day 2)
Post by: Robz888 on April 26, 2017, 01:10:01 pm
Actually... was that a scumslip from TWM? The logic of what he posted only holds if he new mcmc's scum alignment ahead of time.
Title: Re: M98: Русская Mafia (Day 2)
Post by: The_Wine_Merchant on April 26, 2017, 01:16:11 pm
There is no way I would have played the way I did if I were SK. I would have stayed in the background, jumped quietly onto a wagon like 2.7's or Andrew's and brought zero to little attention to myself.

Imagine if I had stayed on mcmc and the lynch had gone through. I would be the primary, number 1, NK target for mafia and there would have ended my game. No that would have been too risky.

The SK is someone who stayed in the background and made little to zero waves. Certainly not me.

This doesn't acquit you as much as you think. If you were SK, and you had stayed on mcmc, and the lynch had gone through, you would have been a prime NK target... only if mcmc was mafia. But of course, that's not something you knew at the time you voted him, so you could have very well done it as SK and then been genuinely surprised (and relieved you weren't nightkilled) after mcmc's flip.
No. I get that. What I am saying is that it a risk I don't have to take. Or even if mcmc flips town. I don't want to appear in any way, shape or form to be a town leader and a good NK option.
Title: Re: M98: Русская Mafia (Day 2)
Post by: The_Wine_Merchant on April 26, 2017, 01:16:55 pm
Actually... was that a scumslip from TWM? The logic of what he posted only holds if he new mcmc's scum alignment ahead of time.
You are putting logic onto me that I never had. Not sure if you are doing confirmation bias here or scum reaching.
Title: Re: M98: Русская Mafia (Day 2)
Post by: Robz888 on April 26, 2017, 01:24:14 pm
Actually... was that a scumslip from TWM? The logic of what he posted only holds if he new mcmc's scum alignment ahead of time.
You are putting logic onto me that I never had. Not sure if you are doing confirmation bias here or scum reaching.

You said this "imagine if I was SK and I had stayed on mcmc and the lynch had gone thru... I would have been the number 1 target for mafia." Because this would be a bad move for the SK, you therefore are not the SK.

This is really only a fear, though, if you know mcmc will flip scum, which isn't something you would have known at the time, unless you were his partner.
Title: Re: M98: Русская Mafia (Day 2)
Post by: The_Wine_Merchant on April 26, 2017, 01:37:57 pm
Actually... was that a scumslip from TWM? The logic of what he posted only holds if he new mcmc's scum alignment ahead of time.
You are putting logic onto me that I never had. Not sure if you are doing confirmation bias here or scum reaching.

You said this "imagine if I was SK and I had stayed on mcmc and the lynch had gone thru... I would have been the number 1 target for mafia." Because this would be a bad move for the SK, you therefore are not the SK.

This is really only a fear, though, if you know mcmc will flip scum, which isn't something you would have known at the time, unless you were his partner.
Except I am saying it now, when it is known that mcmc is scum. I am using speculative ideas to speculate about what I might have done as SK.

And you aren't addressing my actual point. And that is that SK would want to stay in the background and not risk being a prime NK target, regardless of whether or not mafia was flipped.
Title: Re: M98: Русская Mafia (Day 2)
Post by: faust on April 26, 2017, 02:53:37 pm
Like every scum, the SK has to play to their town meta or they will be lynched. The cannot just stay in the background.
Title: Re: M98: Русская Mafia (Day 2)
Post by: Eevee on April 26, 2017, 03:01:13 pm
Actually... was that a scumslip from TWM? The logic of what he posted only holds if he new mcmc's scum alignment ahead of time.
You are putting logic onto me that I never had. Not sure if you are doing confirmation bias here or scum reaching.

You said this "imagine if I was SK and I had stayed on mcmc and the lynch had gone thru... I would have been the number 1 target for mafia." Because this would be a bad move for the SK, you therefore are not the SK.

This is really only a fear, though, if you know mcmc will flip scum, which isn't something you would have known at the time, unless you were his partner.

I... think Robz is making sense here. That's a valid point, right?
Title: Re: M98: Русская Mafia (Day 2)
Post by: The_Wine_Merchant on April 26, 2017, 03:01:19 pm
Like every scum, the SK has to play to their town meta or they will be lynched. The cannot just stay in the background.
Which I have done in previous games to a certain extent perfectly fine.
Title: Re: M98: Русская Mafia (Day 2)
Post by: Robz888 on April 26, 2017, 03:02:52 pm
And you aren't addressing my actual point. And that is that SK would want to stay in the background and not risk being a prime NK target, regardless of whether or not mafia was flipped.

No, I don't think that's true. The logic here only holds for mcmc being mafia, as you noted, in your initial post, which made this presumption, and is I think quite possibly a scumslip.
Title: Re: M98: Русская Mafia (Day 2)
Post by: Robz888 on April 26, 2017, 03:03:01 pm
Vote: TWM
Title: Re: M98: Русская Mafia (Day 2)
Post by: The_Wine_Merchant on April 26, 2017, 03:27:13 pm
And you aren't addressing my actual point. And that is that SK would want to stay in the background and not risk being a prime NK target, regardless of whether or not mafia was flipped.

No, I don't think that's true. The logic here only holds for mcmc being mafia, as you noted, in your initial post, which made this presumption, and is I think quite possibly a scumslip.
It isn't.
Title: Re: M98: Русская Mafia (Day 2)
Post by: The_Wine_Merchant on April 26, 2017, 03:29:16 pm
So am I SK or mafia? I can't be both. Someone tell me my alignment please, cause I obviously don't know what it is. I thought I was town. But really smart, good mafia players are telling me otherwise and everyone seems to be agreeing with them even though they can't decide what they agree about.
Title: Re: M98: Русская Mafia (Day 2)
Post by: AndrewisFTTW on April 26, 2017, 03:41:02 pm
Actually... was that a scumslip from TWM? The logic of what he posted only holds if he new mcmc's scum alignment ahead of time.
You are putting logic onto me that I never had. Not sure if you are doing confirmation bias here or scum reaching.

You said this "imagine if I was SK and I had stayed on mcmc and the lynch had gone thru... I would have been the number 1 target for mafia." Because this would be a bad move for the SK, you therefore are not the SK.

This is really only a fear, though, if you know mcmc will flip scum, which isn't something you would have known at the time, unless you were his partner.

I... think Robz is making sense here. That's a valid point, right?

Nope. Not seeing a scumslip anywhere. I think Robz is thinking about this too hard and is confusing himself.
Title: Re: M98: Русская Mafia (Day 2)
Post by: The_Wine_Merchant on April 26, 2017, 03:43:54 pm
Seriously?

Which is it:

Mafia that purposely bussed his partner hard on Day 1 (sure I left the wagon, but still that is a ballsy, risky move) and vice versa from him? This must be the case if Robz's scumslip theory is true.

Or SK that decided it was a good idea to play a really pro-active and pushing, aggressive style that would make me a high candidate for the mafia kill when it would have been easier and better play to stay back and low key? And then decided to kill off the same player that could still have been a good mislynch target the next day (from SK's perspective everyone is a mislynch target)?

OOOOOOOORRRRRRRRR

Town who played a pretty decent, but ultimately suboptimal Day 1 and an even worse Day 2, who is being framed by what is probably desperate mafia and/or SK who wants to take advantage of the situation along with other eager townies who are seeing only what they want to see?
Title: Re: M98: Русская Mafia (Day 2)
Post by: The_Wine_Merchant on April 26, 2017, 03:45:25 pm
Also Andrew is town. SK or mafia would be clamoring all over this opportunity to get a mislynch here. Scum has zero reason to defend me here. Remember that when I am dead.

He could be the traitor thinking that I am the other mafia and wanting to save me from being lynched. But I guess that is probably a long shot.
Title: Re: M98: Русская Mafia (Day 2)
Post by: AndrewisFTTW on April 26, 2017, 03:46:21 pm
I think TWM's point is if he was SK he would not draw attention to himself as much as he did yesterday with all the mcmc wagon stuff so as not to be a target for mafia. He used scum!Mcmc as an example but I think he meant regardless of the person's alignment he would want to lay low.
Title: Re: M98: Русская Mafia (Day 2)
Post by: AndrewisFTTW on April 26, 2017, 03:51:29 pm
TWM your point about saving mcmc as he could be a potential mislynch later, that's not really a point in your favor specifically. I think everyone would've had the same train of thought and would not've shot mcmc. Thus I think there was some other PR at work and maybe trying to tie a direct link from the mcmc kill to someone else is a little shoddy. And those who have been trying to do just that are a little scummy. Now would be a good time to look at the setup.
Title: Re: M98: Русская Mafia (Day 2)
Post by: The_Wine_Merchant on April 26, 2017, 03:54:11 pm
TWM your point about saving mcmc as he could be a potential mislynch later, that's not really a point in your favor specifically. I think everyone would've had the same train of thought and would not've shot mcmc. Thus I think there was some other PR at work and maybe trying to tie a direct link from the mcmc kill to someone else is a little shoddy. And those who have been trying to do just that are a little scummy. Now would be a good time to look at the setup.
I am not using it in my favor. I am using it as an argument for why faust wants to lynch me. He thinks that I shot mcmc because he was suspicious of me. His being a good mislynch I think would have over-rid that if I were actually the SK in this hypothetical scenario.
Title: Re: M98: Русская Mafia (Day 2)
Post by: AndrewisFTTW on April 26, 2017, 03:58:49 pm
Request for vote count.
Title: Re: M98: Русская Mafia (PMs are out! N0)
Post by: LaLight on April 26, 2017, 04:31:40 pm
Vote count 2.1
The_Wine_Merchant (3): faust, schadd, Robz888
faust (1): The_Wine_Merchant
kkrieg (1): gkrieg13
Not voting (4): Eevee, AndrewisFTTW, 2,71828....., kkrieg

With 9 alive it takes 5 to lynch. Day 1 ends Wednesday, 3rd of May at 4 am FT.
Title: Re: M98: Русская Mafia (Day 2)
Post by: 2.71828..... on April 26, 2017, 05:23:28 pm
Vote: kkrieg

TWM is town, like I said D1
Title: Re: M98: Русская Mafia (Day 2)
Post by: AndrewisFTTW on April 26, 2017, 05:53:18 pm
Vote: kkrieg

TWM is town, like I said D1

What's the case on kkrieg?
Title: Re: M98: Русская Mafia (Day 1)
Post by: 2.71828..... on April 26, 2017, 06:00:30 pm
I'm probably a lurker right now huh?
Faust seems fairly towny which makes me want to jump on the e train.

You mean the eevee train.

This post is really interesting by kkrieg. And I think scummy

Vote: kkrieg

There was some scummy stuff D1 in my opinion, and then wagon stuff with the flip pointed out by gkrieg
Title: Re: M98: Русская Mafia (Day 2)
Post by: The_Wine_Merchant on April 26, 2017, 08:50:55 pm
Vote: kkrieg

TWM is town, like I said D1
Well now I am glad that I didn't go for either your or Andrew's lynch Day 1.
Title: Re: M98: Русская Mafia (Day 2)
Post by: AndrewisFTTW on April 26, 2017, 09:24:36 pm
Vote: kkrieg

TWM is town, like I said D1
Well now I am glad that I didn't go for either your or Andrew's lynch Day 1.

Don't push your luck.
Title: Re: M98: Русская Mafia (Day 2)
Post by: kkrieg on April 27, 2017, 12:12:52 am
Oh go away for a little bit.

You are obviously going to be able to win any argument that I put at you because you are better at twisting words and using select quotes and appealing to emotions in a way that people still like you at the end of it.

So I am not even going to try and get frustrated with you. I'll put up some stuff later today (today as in today in this game by the way, like Saturday or Sunday) as long as I don't get lynched.

Then you can just totally demolish it and get everyone to ignore it.

Uh I'm really surprised you are so touchy about this. Say why doing what you did D 1 is townie. Also I know kkrieg was online and could've voted mcmcsalot. vote: kkrieg
Yea I won't deny that. I could have switched my vote but I honestly thought Awaclus was scummier than mcmc.


Title: Re: M98: Русская Mafia (Day 1)
Post by: kkrieg on April 27, 2017, 12:14:42 am
Vote: Robz


This is an L-2 vote on me.

I guess I'm not the worst lynch ever, if that's what's going to happen. I am a Vanilla Townie.
Also I totally believed this. I mean it was bolded and seemed official you know.
Title: Re: M98: Русская Mafia (Day 1)
Post by: kkrieg on April 27, 2017, 12:15:55 am
I am caught up, I am also a vanilla townie. I also don't have much to add. I am much less confident of my reads after failing super hard last game and think most people are playing as I expect them to be playing. I would be open to lynching andrew, twm, 2.7. kkrieg, eevee, awaclus. Also I am sleepy and slightly inebriated.
Oops totally meant to quote this one.
Title: Re: M98: Русская Mafia (Day 2)
Post by: kkrieg on April 27, 2017, 12:20:07 am
Leaning toward a TWM vote right now.

Does town win if the SK is still alive?
Title: Re: M98: Русская Mafia (Day 2)
Post by: gkrieg13 on April 27, 2017, 12:26:34 am
Leaning toward a TWM vote right now.

Does town win if the SK is still alive?

Check the win con in your role PM.
Title: Re: M98: Русская Mafia (Day 2)
Post by: gkrieg13 on April 27, 2017, 12:29:02 am
Leaning toward a TWM vote right now.

Does town win if the SK is still alive?

Check the win con in your role PM.

Actually in the OP. The short answer is no. Town doesn't win with the SK alive.
Title: Re: M98: Русская Mafia (Day 2)
Post by: 2.71828..... on April 27, 2017, 01:25:22 am
Leaning toward a TWM vote right now.

Does town win if the SK is still alive?

Cautious town or "doesn't want to over commit to a mislynch" scum?

I am leaning towards the latter of the two
Title: Re: M98: Русская Mafia (Day 2)
Post by: kkrieg on April 27, 2017, 01:37:28 am
Leaning toward a TWM vote right now.

Does town win if the SK is still alive?

Cautious town or "doesn't want to over commit to a mislynch" scum?

I am leaning towards the latter of the two
Cautious town. I feel like garbage for voting Awaclus.
Title: Re: M98: Русская Mafia (Day 2)
Post by: faust on April 27, 2017, 02:14:37 am
TWM your point about saving mcmc as he could be a potential mislynch later, that's not really a point in your favor specifically. I think everyone would've had the same train of thought and would not've shot mcmc. Thus I think there was some other PR at work and maybe trying to tie a direct link from the mcmc kill to someone else is a little shoddy. And those who have been trying to do just that are a little scummy. Now would be a good time to look at the setup.
I am not really sure what this means.
Title: Re: M98: Русская Mafia (Day 2)
Post by: faust on April 27, 2017, 02:30:59 am
There can be no other PR at work. The only explanation for mcmc dying is that the SK shot him. This is fairly obvious.
Title: Re: M98: Русская Mafia (Day 2)
Post by: The_Wine_Merchant on April 27, 2017, 07:46:52 am
And the only possible person who could have shot him is me because mcmc suspected me.

Way to narrow your line of thinking. Maybe I'll decide it must have been Robz because he feared mcmc being able to read him. That makes just as much sense right?

The beauty of your line of thinking is that I can't do anything about it. All of the evidence are things that mcmc said, not things that I said, yet I am being held accountable for them.
Title: Re: M98: Русская Mafia (Day 2)
Post by: schadd on April 27, 2017, 08:23:50 am
The beauty of your line of thinking is that I can't do anything about it. All of the evidence are things that mcmc said, not things that I said, yet I am being held accountable for them.
someone's like "I'm detective and twm killed someone" and you're like "ok that's something they said why am i accountable for it?
Title: Re: M98: Русская Mafia (Day 2)
Post by: Eevee on April 27, 2017, 09:04:53 am
Eevee emotional analysis:

Sometimes in mafia, being suspected makes the target frustrated. I think there are three different kinds of frustration:

1. Omgus'ing, maybe saying "you should know better", getting aggressive towards the people suspecting you, calling them dumb.
2. Being unhappy with yourself for putting town in this position, the "woe is me".
3. Being frustrated at the arguments other people are making, calling the arguments terrible while not necessarily suspecting the people making them.


I think the first is pretty much a toss-up regarding their alignment, it's usually just a sign that someone is upset. The second I think is towny, because scum in that position is in fight-mode, not looking to concede it could be their fault, but rather looking to claw their way out of the trouble (robz really fooled me with acting resigned and blaming himself as scum in a recent game, but I'm not claiming these are perfect heuristics and Robz knows how I think pretty well and is good at manipulating me specifically). The third I think is a scum frame of mind "No, guys, if you only saw that argument is terrible, you'd realize you shouldn't suspect me", I think this often comes with not suspecting your accusers (because you know they are town), but trying to disprove their specific arguments because you don't feel they are legitimate (and the frustration comes from being in a bad spot with the suspicion but not feeling it's deserved because the arguments aren't "right").

TWM sounds to me like he is frustrated about the reasons for the suspicion, rather than being worried about the consequences for town, which seems to me like scum behavior.
Title: Re: M98: Русская Mafia (Day 2)
Post by: The_Wine_Merchant on April 27, 2017, 09:06:20 am
The beauty of your line of thinking is that I can't do anything about it. All of the evidence are things that mcmc said, not things that I said, yet I am being held accountable for them.
someone's like "I'm detective and twm killed someone" and you're like "ok that's something they said why am i accountable for it?
Don't be ridiculous.
Title: Re: M98: Русская Mafia (Day 2)
Post by: The_Wine_Merchant on April 27, 2017, 09:09:10 am
TWM sounds to me like he is frustrated about the reasons for the suspicion, rather than being worried about the consequences for town, which seems to me like scum behavior.
That is a fair criticism of me. I should care a bit more about what the impact of my mislynch will have on the game, but it is hard to do when players are approaching it with what I think is a somewhat reckless manner. See schadd's above comment. Is that comment supposed to make me feel better about town (assuming he is town) or more apathetic about whether or not we win after I get lynched?
Title: Re: M98: Русская Mafia (Day 2)
Post by: faust on April 27, 2017, 09:46:04 am
And the only possible person who could have shot him is me because mcmc suspected me.
Not only; I also think that no veteran SK would have shot mcmc.

The beauty of your line of thinking is that I can't do anything about it. All of the evidence are things that mcmc said, not things that I said, yet I am being held accountable for them.
That's true. I suppose that would suck for you, but it does not make my line of thinking any less valid.
Title: Re: M98: Русская Mafia (Day 2)
Post by: The_Wine_Merchant on April 27, 2017, 10:08:56 am
Well then I guess I am going to get lynched unless other people disagree about your assessment.
Title: Re: M98: Русская Mafia (Day 2)
Post by: 2.71828..... on April 27, 2017, 11:14:59 am
What is the case on TWM?

I eevee had a really good post, I disagree with the conclusion
Title: Re: M98: Русская Mafia (Day 2)
Post by: The_Wine_Merchant on April 27, 2017, 11:27:09 am
What is the case on TWM?

mcmc was voting for me, so it is likely that I shot him. This makes me the SK.

I voted for mcmc but then left the wagon late at a time when if I had stayed and pressed the issue, he might have been lynched. This makes me mcmc's partner.

Pick your poison. And yes, I am sure there are some subtleties that I am purposefully leaving out (others can add them in as they see fit), but that is basically what it boils down to, right?
Title: Re: M98: Русская Mafia (Day 2)
Post by: Robz888 on April 27, 2017, 11:31:16 am
What is the case on TWM?

I eevee had a really good post, I disagree with the conclusion

I think it's decently likely he's mcmc's partner given his comment refuting the SK logic, which only makes sense if he knew mcmc was scum.

Alternatively, it's possible he is the SK, for reasons faust has stated.

This makes him a pretty good person to lynch.
Title: Re: M98: Русская Mafia (Day 2)
Post by: AndrewisFTTW on April 27, 2017, 11:45:07 am
There can be no other PR at work. The only explanation for mcmc dying is that the SK shot him. This is fairly obvious.

Wait what? How are you sure? The setups with SK have no PR that could interfere, but the kill could've also come from a JOAT and no town NK could've been from a BP townie or a communter:

2. Watcher, Jailkeeper, Psychologist; 2-shot JOAT
5. Watcher, 1-shot BP Townie, 1-shot Commuter; 2-shot JOAT

If there was a SK it would be one of these:

1. Detective, 1-shot Commuter, Goon Cop; 1-shot Investigation Immune + Serial Killer
6. Detective, Jailkeeper, Psychologist; Mafia Knows Traitor + Serial Killer
7. 1-shot Commuter, Jailkeeper, Detective; Traitor Knows Mafia + Serial Killer

In which case a lack of a town NK could also be explained in 1 & 7 by the commuter. If the JK blocked the kill we would know by now I think, which makes me think we're not in 6. Similarly I don't think we're in 2. So I'm thinking we're in 1, 5, or 7.

Also, what does a Detective do? I can't find an entry for it.
Title: Re: M98: Русская Mafia (Day 2)
Post by: gkrieg13 on April 27, 2017, 12:12:39 pm
How does scum get killer without SK?
Title: Re: M98: Русская Mafia (Day 2)
Post by: gkrieg13 on April 27, 2017, 12:12:52 pm
Killed
Title: Re: M98: Русская Mafia (Day 2)
Post by: AndrewisFTTW on April 27, 2017, 12:31:17 pm
JOAT as vig.
Title: Re: M98: Русская Mafia (Day 2)
Post by: Robz888 on April 27, 2017, 12:36:58 pm
Andrew, what on earth are you talking about?
Title: Re: M98: Русская Mafia (Day 2)
Post by: gkrieg13 on April 27, 2017, 12:41:58 pm
Mafia JOAT and they have strongman and ninja
Title: Re: M98: Русская Mafia (Day 2)
Post by: AndrewisFTTW on April 27, 2017, 12:44:14 pm
Oh JOAT is a mafia role. Well, nevermind. SK it is.
Title: Re: M98: Русская Mafia (Day 2)
Post by: gkrieg13 on April 27, 2017, 12:47:47 pm
Now, lots of things could've blocked the shot like commuter, JK, mafia shot SK.
Title: Re: M98: Русская Mafia (Day 2)
Post by: faust on April 27, 2017, 01:10:29 pm
In which case a lack of a town NK could also be explained in 1 & 7 by the commuter. If the JK blocked the kill we would know by now I think, which makes me think we're not in 6. Similarly I don't think we're in 2. So I'm thinking we're in 1, 5, or 7.
There's a bunch of explanations for a missing nightkill. I have no idea why we would know if the JK blocked the kill.
Title: Re: M98: Русская Mafia (Day 2)
Post by: faust on April 27, 2017, 01:13:53 pm
Andrew's post is so out there I don't think it's a purposeful townslip. So if we are in a JOAT setup, that means he's likely town.

... wrote that and then realized that there are no setups with both JOAT and SK. Boo hoo. That means it's not a townslip at all. Or maybe it is? I mean I would think that scum would have taken a closer look at the setup.
Title: Re: M98: Русская Mafia (Day 2)
Post by: Robz888 on April 27, 2017, 01:22:43 pm
Andrew's post is so out there I don't think it's a purposeful townslip. So if we are in a JOAT setup, that means he's likely town.

... wrote that and then realized that there are no setups with both JOAT and SK. Boo hoo. That means it's not a townslip at all. Or maybe it is? I mean I would think that scum would have taken a closer look at the setup.

It makes me think he is very unlikely to be mafia, but could still be SK.
Title: Re: M98: Русская Mafia (Day 2)
Post by: The_Wine_Merchant on April 27, 2017, 01:24:28 pm
Andrew's post is so out there I don't think it's a purposeful townslip. So if we are in a JOAT setup, that means he's likely town.

... wrote that and then realized that there are no setups with both JOAT and SK. Boo hoo. That means it's not a townslip at all. Or maybe it is? I mean I would think that scum would have taken a closer look at the setup.

It makes me think he is very unlikely to be mafia, but could still be SK.
If he was the SK he would be thrilled to vote for me. But he isn't. So he isn't the SK.
Title: Re: M98: Русская Mafia (Day 2)
Post by: gkrieg13 on April 27, 2017, 01:55:53 pm
TWM, it's not all about you.
Title: Re: M98: Русская Mafia (Day 2)
Post by: The_Wine_Merchant on April 27, 2017, 02:16:28 pm
TWM, it's not all about you.
Sure it is. I have three votes right now and have had probably 80% of the posts today surrounding me.

But to be more serious, if you take as a given that I am town (which you can't know, but just go with me), if you or anyone else is mafia or SK I would think they would be jumping onto this, or at least leaving the door open to joining this wagon. Because I will concede there are items that point toward me being SK or mafia. I don't think they are great, but they are certainly there. I would basically be a great opportunity to get a townie lynched with little to zero blame or accountability. They could easily point back and say, Hey there was some really good evidence there, guess we were wrong as a whole.

There is little benefit for either Andrew or 2.7 as SK or mafia to flat out read me as town. The only benefit is if I say something like I am now. But there is no way they could anticipate I would react this way prior to them saying it and they couldn't even know if it would end up being useful as they wouldn't know if I might end up flipping SK or mafia and thus wouldn't be a trustworthy assessor of their alignment.

Morale of the story. I am townreading Andrew and 2.7 and you should to if I should die and when I flip town.
Title: Re: M98: Русская Mafia (Day 2)
Post by: schadd on April 27, 2017, 02:17:55 pm

green -> not green; nobody especially seems sk other than twm and kind of maybe gkrieg
{eevee, faust}
{e}
{kkrieg}
{andrew, gkrieg}
{robz, twm}
Title: Re: M98: Русская Mafia (Day 2)
Post by: The_Wine_Merchant on April 27, 2017, 02:24:17 pm
something happened.
Title: Re: M98: Русская Mafia (Day 2)
Post by: Robz888 on April 27, 2017, 02:27:34 pm
TWM, it's not all about you.
Sure it is. I have three votes right now and have had probably 80% of the posts today surrounding me.

But to be more serious, if you take as a given that I am town (which you can't know, but just go with me), if you or anyone else is mafia or SK I would think they would be jumping onto this, or at least leaving the door open to joining this wagon. Because I will concede there are items that point toward me being SK or mafia. I don't think they are great, but they are certainly there. I would basically be a great opportunity to get a townie lynched with little to zero blame or accountability. They could easily point back and say, Hey there was some really good evidence there, guess we were wrong as a whole.

There is little benefit for either Andrew or 2.7 as SK or mafia to flat out read me as town. The only benefit is if I say something like I am now. But there is no way they could anticipate I would react this way prior to them saying it and they couldn't even know if it would end up being useful as they wouldn't know if I might end up flipping SK or mafia and thus wouldn't be a trustworthy assessor of their alignment.

Morale of the story. I am townreading Andrew and 2.7 and you should to if I should die and when I flip town.

I don't want to be giving a potential scum player advice, but... there will be more days this game, and it's probably in scum's advantage to have scummy-seeming people live beyond today. That way they will be around for mislynching later. So I don't think it's quite this obvious that scum (if not you) would be absolutely trying to get you lynched right now.
Title: Re: M98: Русская Mafia (Day 2)
Post by: faust on April 27, 2017, 02:28:52 pm
There is little benefit for either Andrew or 2.7 as SK or mafia to flat out read me as town.

There would be if you would end up flipping town. That should be obvious. That you don't factor that in... well, it does make it look like that is not an option for you.
Title: Re: M98: Русская Mafia (Day 2)
Post by: AndrewisFTTW on April 27, 2017, 02:29:20 pm

green -> not green; nobody especially seems sk other than twm and kind of maybe gkrieg
{eevee, faust}
{e}
{kkrieg}
{andrew, gkrieg}
{robz, twm}

Who do you think is more likely SK? Super active/overly defensive TWM or slightly lurky/jokey gkrieg?
Title: Re: M98: Русская Mafia (Day 2)
Post by: gkrieg13 on April 27, 2017, 02:31:38 pm

green -> not green; nobody especially seems sk other than twm and kind of maybe gkrieg
{eevee, faust}
{e}
{kkrieg}
{andrew, gkrieg}
{robz, twm}

Who do you think is more likely SK? Super active/overly defensive TWM or slightly lurky/jokey gkrieg?

I'm not sure where I got the jokey title in this. 
Title: Re: M98: Русская Mafia (Day 2)
Post by: gkrieg13 on April 27, 2017, 02:32:20 pm
It is also interesting that even looking at the interactions on the mcmc wagon, it is possible that only 1 of 3 scum actually knew mcmcsalot was mafia.
Title: Re: M98: Русская Mafia (Day 2)
Post by: The_Wine_Merchant on April 27, 2017, 02:34:15 pm
There is little benefit for either Andrew or 2.7 as SK or mafia to flat out read me as town.

There would be if you would end up flipping town. That should be obvious. That you don't factor that in... well, it does make it look like that is not an option for you.
What is the benefit? Who is going to give them credit?
Title: Re: M98: Русская Mafia (Day 2)
Post by: AndrewisFTTW on April 27, 2017, 02:34:54 pm
faust reminds me of me as scum, constantly reminding everyone of possible edge cases and really pushing TWM and at the very least hinting that everything he says is scummy. Whether that's scum indicative or not of faust I don't know, but it reads scum to me.
Title: Re: M98: Русская Mafia (Day 2)
Post by: AndrewisFTTW on April 27, 2017, 02:35:45 pm

green -> not green; nobody especially seems sk other than twm and kind of maybe gkrieg
{eevee, faust}
{e}
{kkrieg}
{andrew, gkrieg}
{robz, twm}

Who do you think is more likely SK? Super active/overly defensive TWM or slightly lurky/jokey gkrieg?

I'm not sure where I got the jokey title in this.

The "TWM it's not all about you" comment, mostly.
Title: Re: M98: Русская Mafia (Day 2)
Post by: The_Wine_Merchant on April 27, 2017, 02:36:11 pm
faust reminds me of me as scum, constantly reminding everyone of possible edge cases and really pushing TWM and at the very least hinting that everything he says is scummy. Whether that's scum indicative or not of faust I don't know, but it reads scum to me.
YES!
Title: Re: M98: Русская Mafia (Day 2)
Post by: gkrieg13 on April 27, 2017, 02:39:46 pm

green -> not green; nobody especially seems sk other than twm and kind of maybe gkrieg
{eevee, faust}
{e}
{kkrieg}
{andrew, gkrieg}
{robz, twm}

Who do you think is more likely SK? Super active/overly defensive TWM or slightly lurky/jokey gkrieg?

I'm not sure where I got the jokey title in this.

The "TWM it's not all about you" comment, mostly.

Oh, that wasn't really a joke...  It was honest criticism.  I think only looking at interactions of people with you as a means of reading people is not a very good method.
Title: Re: M98: Русская Mafia (Day 2)
Post by: The_Wine_Merchant on April 27, 2017, 02:40:22 pm
Noted.
Title: Re: M98: Русская Mafia (Day 2)
Post by: schadd on April 27, 2017, 03:31:48 pm

green -> not green; nobody especially seems sk other than twm and kind of maybe gkrieg
{eevee, faust}
{e}
{kkrieg}
{andrew, gkrieg}
{robz, twm}

Who do you think is more likely SK? Super active/overly defensive TWM or slightly lurky/jokey gkrieg?
those are not exactly the things i'm looking for in SK, nor do i think discussing that is productive
Title: Re: M98: Русская Mafia (Day 2)
Post by: schadd on April 27, 2017, 03:32:36 pm
also gkrieg isn't lurking, nor do i think that's indicative of anything
Title: Re: M98: Русская Mafia (Day 2)
Post by: Robz888 on April 27, 2017, 03:37:54 pm
Most lurky person is probably kkrieg and 2.7.
Title: Re: M98: Русская Mafia (Day 2)
Post by: 2.71828..... on April 27, 2017, 05:37:58 pm
faust reminds me of me as scum, constantly reminding everyone of possible edge cases and really pushing TWM and at the very least hinting that everything he says is scummy. Whether that's scum indicative or not of faust I don't know, but it reads scum to me.
YES!

I like it. Vote: faust
Title: Re: M98: Русская Mafia (Day 2)
Post by: 2.71828..... on April 27, 2017, 05:40:00 pm
Most lurky person is probably kkrieg and 2.7.

Good thing lurky does not mean scummy.
Title: Re: M98: Русская Mafia (Day 2)
Post by: faust on April 27, 2017, 05:47:31 pm
faust reminds me of me as scum, constantly reminding everyone of possible edge cases and really pushing TWM and at the very least hinting that everything he says is scummy. Whether that's scum indicative or not of faust I don't know, but it reads scum to me.
I don't think reminding people of edge cases is a scum trait as much as a mathematician trait. I also don't really know where I did that.

I am probably also subject to some confirmation bias. Not everything TWM says is scummy, and in fact there are things that made me stop and wonder if he's town. But ultimately I believe he's the best lynch not because he exhibits so much scumminess, but because of the evidence i.e. mcmc's death. I have not heard another reasonable theory for why that happened.
Title: Re: M98: Русская Mafia (Day 2)
Post by: faust on April 27, 2017, 05:47:45 pm
Most lurky person is probably kkrieg and 2.7.

Good thing lurky does not mean scummy.
No, that's not a good thing.
Title: Re: M98: Русская Mafia (Day 2)
Post by: AndrewisFTTW on April 27, 2017, 06:10:02 pm

green -> not green; nobody especially seems sk other than twm and kind of maybe gkrieg
{eevee, faust}
{e}
{kkrieg}
{andrew, gkrieg}
{robz, twm}

Who do you think is more likely SK? Super active/overly defensive TWM or slightly lurky/jokey gkrieg?
those are not exactly the things i'm looking for in SK, nor do i think discussing that is productive

Ok but you said you were thinking either TWM or gkrieg for SK. Why?

also gkrieg isn't lurking, nor do i think that's indicative of anything

He's not lurking but he's also not at the forefront really.
Title: Re: M98: Русская Mafia (Day 2)
Post by: schadd on April 27, 2017, 07:24:11 pm
twm because of the stuff we've talked about to death


gkrieg because uh he was confident mcmc was scum & was like "no i'm not SK"
Title: Re: M98: Русская Mafia (Day 2)
Post by: The_Wine_Merchant on April 27, 2017, 07:28:26 pm
But ultimately I believe he's the best lynch not because he exhibits so much scumminess, but because of the evidence i.e. mcmc's death. I have not heard another reasonable theory for why that happened.
1. Robz is SK and feared that mcmc would accurately read him as SK better than anyone else.
2. faust is SK and killed mcmc to frame me today.

What happens when I die and flip town? Just roll with that idea, K. What is your theory then?
Title: Re: M98: Русская Mafia (Day 2)
Post by: schadd on April 27, 2017, 08:42:52 pm
But ultimately I believe he's the best lynch not because he exhibits so much scumminess, but because of the evidence i.e. mcmc's death. I have not heard another reasonable theory for why that happened.
1. Robz is SK and feared that mcmc would accurately read him as SK better than anyone else.
they don't actually have a very good track record on each other. mcmc scumread robz m96, that's the only have that played where mcmc was town.


2. faust is SK and killed mcmc to frame me today.
took you long enough


What happens when I die and flip town? Just roll with that idea, K. What is your theory then?
robz is probably scum, though i don't see that as especially related to your flip. faust looked town to me since d1 & wouldn't change. andrew is probably town or something
Title: Re: M98: Русская Mafia (Day 2)
Post by: The_Wine_Merchant on April 27, 2017, 10:34:35 pm
I think schadd might be a better lynch than faust.
Title: Re: M98: Русская Mafia (Day 2)
Post by: schadd on April 28, 2017, 12:04:08 am
What Happens When I Flip Town How Does Your Theory Change Then?
Title: Re: M98: Русская Mafia (Day 2)
Post by: schadd on April 28, 2017, 12:07:57 am
sorry i'm immune to ate bro ¯\_(ツ)_/¯
Title: Re: M98: Русская Mafia (Day 2)
Post by: The_Wine_Merchant on April 28, 2017, 12:12:57 am
What Happens When I Flip Town How Does Your Theory Change Then?
Nothing. You will be dead.
Title: Re: M98: Русская Mafia (Day 2)
Post by: 2.71828..... on April 28, 2017, 12:15:27 am
I think schadd might be a better lynch than faust.

I disagree. I think faust is an excellent lynch. Or kkrieg
Title: Re: M98: Русская Mafia (PMs are out! N0)
Post by: LaLight on April 28, 2017, 01:04:47 am
Vote count 2.2
The_Wine_Merchant (3): faust, schadd, Robz888
faust (2): The_Wine_Merchant, 2,71828.....
kkrieg (1): gkrieg13
Not voting (3): Eevee, AndrewisFTTW, kkrieg

With 9 alive it takes 5 to lynch. Day 1 ends Wednesday, 3rd of May at 4 am FT.
Title: Re: M98: Русская Mafia (Day 2)
Post by: kkrieg on April 28, 2017, 01:16:57 am
I'll catch up tomorrow...
Title: Re: M98: Русская Mafia (Day 2)
Post by: faust on April 28, 2017, 05:43:25 am
1. Robz is SK and feared that mcmc would accurately read him as SK better than anyone else.
I don't think Robz would be worried about that.

2. faust is SK and killed mcmc to frame me today.
I am surprised it took you this long.

But it doesn't work. A SK has no need to frame anyone; they can just do normal scumhunting because well, they want to be lynching the other scum. If mcmc had been killed by mafia, I could see a framing angle, but not this way. (Fun fact: it is not actually impossible that the mafia killed mcmc)

What happens when I die and flip town? Just roll with that idea, K. What is your theory then?
Well it depends. I would look for interactions with you today specifically. I could kind of see kkrieg or Andrew doing the mcmc kill just because they are new and/or not very invested in the game. I find it very hard to believe that any of {Eevee, gkrieg, e, Robz} did that kill; schadd is also unlikely, but I have less data on his scum play.
Title: Re: M98: Русская Mafia (Day 2)
Post by: faust on April 28, 2017, 05:45:25 am
I think schadd might be a better lynch than faust.
How is schadd scummy?
Title: Re: M98: Русская Mafia (Day 2)
Post by: Robz888 on April 28, 2017, 09:24:28 am
Want to lynch: TWM, kkrieg
Could lynch: 2.7, schadd, Andrew
Not inclined to lynch: gkrieg
Won't lynch (not today): Eevee, faust
Title: Re: M98: Русская Mafia (Day 2)
Post by: The_Wine_Merchant on April 28, 2017, 09:49:50 am
1. Robz is SK and feared that mcmc would accurately read him as SK better than anyone else.
I don't think Robz would be worried about that.

2. faust is SK and killed mcmc to frame me today.
I am surprised it took you this long.

But it doesn't work. A SK has no need to frame anyone; they can just do normal scumhunting because well, they want to be lynching the other scum. If mcmc had been killed by mafia, I could see a framing angle, but not this way. (Fun fact: it is not actually impossible that the mafia killed mcmc)

What happens when I die and flip town? Just roll with that idea, K. What is your theory then?
Well it depends. I would look for interactions with you today specifically. I could kind of see kkrieg or Andrew doing the mcmc kill just because they are new and/or not very invested in the game. I find it very hard to believe that any of {Eevee, gkrieg, e, Robz} did that kill; schadd is also unlikely, but I have less data on his scum play.
I am not saying they are amazing theories, but you asked and walla! But they are better than your theory, which I know is wrong.

And on your last statement, about only newbies killing mcmc, you have said that a couple of times,but haven't explained why ( again sorry if you did already, I tried to do a search, but forum is being bad on my mobile). Why would a vet not kill mcmc?
Title: Re: M98: Русская Mafia (Day 2)
Post by: The_Wine_Merchant on April 28, 2017, 10:01:50 am
I think schadd might be a better lynch than faust.
How is schadd scummy?
I don't know. Mostly he is parroting what you are saying and then not adding anything valuable to the discussion. At least you are talking a bit with me.
Title: Re: M98: Русская Mafia (Day 2)
Post by: schadd on April 28, 2017, 10:12:18 am
And on your last statement, about only newbies killing mcmc, you have said that a couple of times,but haven't explained why ( again sorry if you did already, I tried to do a search, but forum is being bad on my mobile). Why would a vet not kill mcmc?
i believe i know what this reasoning is but you might rather have faust say it


I think schadd might be a better lynch than faust.
How is schadd scummy?
I don't know. Mostly he is parroting what you are saying and then not adding anything valuable to the discussion. At least you are talking a bit with me.
I Thought I Would At Least Not Be The Prime Target Today For Pushing Mcmc
Title: Re: M98: Русская Mafia (Day 2)
Post by: The_Wine_Merchant on April 28, 2017, 10:14:47 am
O.maybe you did say already? But I couldn't find you saying it. But I'll guess? Cause mcmc claimed VT and a SK would want to take out a PR?

I guess I can see that. But I think a vet could overrule that for other reasons. And I think it unfair (although you haven't actually said it, so sorry if I am putting words in your mouth) to think that a newbie would automatically play poorly.
Title: Re: M98: Русская Mafia (Day 2)
Post by: The_Wine_Merchant on April 28, 2017, 10:15:11 am
Post deleted due to mentioning of the ongoing game.
Title: Re: M98: Русская Mafia (Day 2)
Post by: schadd on April 28, 2017, 10:15:25 am
uhoh
Title: Re: M98: Русская Mafia (Day 2)
Post by: gkrieg13 on April 28, 2017, 10:21:20 am
Want to lynch: TWM, kkrieg
Could lynch: 2.7, schadd, Andrew
Not inclined to lynch: gkrieg
Won't lynch (not today): Eevee, faust

These lists are interesting because it is possible that no one knows anyone else's identity, which means that looking for partner interactions is maybe not possible... 
Title: Re: M98: Русская Mafia (Day 2)
Post by: schadd on April 28, 2017, 10:24:36 am
well there's a 2/3 we're in one of {m knows t, t knows m}, and someone could have gotten recruited last night. but yes
Title: Re: M98: Русская Mafia (Day 2)
Post by: faust on April 28, 2017, 10:26:52 am
And on your last statement, about only newbies killing mcmc, you have said that a couple of times,but haven't explained why ( again sorry if you did already, I tried to do a search, but forum is being bad on my mobile). Why would a vet not kill mcmc?
Well, I think an SK's killing priorities (especially on N1) are this:

Town PR >> scum > VT.

mcmc was a claimed VT. That means it is a pretty bad kill. You'd want to be killing off PRs who could out you or block your kills.

There's also the fact that a SK can do stuff in this setup when they don't kill. I think some vets might have gone for that over any kill and certainly over a claimed VT kill.
Title: Re: M98: Русская Mafia (Day 2)
Post by: faust on April 28, 2017, 10:31:46 am
I think schadd might be a better lynch than faust.
How is schadd scummy?
I don't know. Mostly he is parroting what you are saying and then not adding anything valuable to the discussion. At least you are talking a bit with me.
I was under the impression that schadd is pushing a mafia!TWM angle while I believe you're the SK.
Title: Re: M98: Русская Mafia (Day 2)
Post by: faust on April 28, 2017, 10:33:59 am
I guess I can see that. But I think a vet could overrule that for other reasons. And I think it unfair (although you haven't actually said it, so sorry if I am putting words in your mouth) to think that a newbie would automatically play poorly.
Well it's just more likely. The vast majority of people play better with more experience. I don't know why assuming so is unfair. It's also not just an assumption - I have actually been scum with most of the vets here, so I know a thing or two about how they would play this.
Title: Re: M98: Русская Mafia (Day 2)
Post by: faust on April 28, 2017, 10:34:35 am
Want to lynch: TWM, kkrieg
Could lynch: 2.7, schadd, Andrew
Not inclined to lynch: gkrieg
Won't lynch (not today): Eevee, faust

These lists are interesting because it is possible that no one knows anyone else's identity, which means that looking for partner interactions is maybe not possible...
I find that this makes them less interesting.
Title: Re: M98: Русская Mafia (Day 2)
Post by: schadd on April 28, 2017, 10:35:34 am
same magnitude of interesting, different direction
Title: Re: M98: Русская Mafia (Day 2)
Post by: faust on April 28, 2017, 10:36:17 am
The other thing for the SK is that a surviving mcmc would likely have drawn a lot of attention today.
Title: Re: M98: Русская Mafia (Day 2)
Post by: gkrieg13 on April 28, 2017, 10:37:12 am
Want to lynch: TWM, kkrieg
Could lynch: 2.7, schadd, Andrew
Not inclined to lynch: gkrieg
Won't lynch (not today): Eevee, faust

These lists are interesting because it is possible that no one knows anyone else's identity, which means that looking for partner interactions is maybe not possible...
I find that this makes them less interesting.

I guess I meant it is interesting that they are less interesting.
Title: Re: M98: Русская Mafia (Day 2)
Post by: faust on April 28, 2017, 10:42:34 am
Thinking about reads, I have no opinion on e, gkrieg, Eevee. I think gkrieg was townie for some reason? I don't remember what reason that was though.

I guess there's some rereading to be done.
Title: Re: M98: Русская Mafia (Day 2)
Post by: The_Wine_Merchant on April 28, 2017, 03:26:54 pm
Finally able to do some rereading of my own in no particular order at all.

So gkrieg is not mcmc's partner. Right, like can we all agree on that. Maybe traitor buddy, but not partner. He is egging on people to vote for him when Awaclus was at L-1.

schadd I had kind of forgotten that he was more pushing for mcmc. Those two guys were on before me and pushed harder than me. I guess I over remembered my involvement with voting mcmc (partially because that night and subsequent morning were a bit of a blur).

2.7 is probably the most interesting of them all. As he vote for mcmc, but then immediately switched to Awaclus. This is the sort of thing that I immediately want to think of as scummy, but isn't actually something scum would do. Because for him to do this, he would have to work himself up to vote mcmc, like probably doing a lot of double checking on where he is at, weighing benefits, etc. But to immediately then unvote and go to awaclus, just looks more like town who wanted to get a lynch on a suspicious person and be sure a lynch went through and then switched to awaclus when he saw it was more likely to go there. So probably really not mcmc's partner. Probably equal with gkrieg

I think I am missing something with the kkrieg points? Can someone expand on those again?

Who else? Robz tries to push away from voting him on his birthday, but that might just be brotherly affection.

And I kind of feel like Andrew and faust somewhat ignore mcmc. faust asks if anyone can convince him at one point. Neither of us go a great job at it, but it doesn't really go anywhere after that.

As for my defense in regard to him being my partner. I don't think we would buss Day 1 the way we did with each other.

And I really did think this felt like a townie response:
I am caught up, I am also a vanilla townie. I also don't have much to add. I am much less confident of my reads after failing super hard last game and think most people are playing as I expect them to be playing. I would be open to lynching andrew, twm, 2.7. kkrieg, eevee, awaclus. Also I am sleepy and slightly inebriated.

tl;dr

gkrieg and 2.7 are townie, or at least not his partner. Could still be SK or traitor (this is the big takeaway)
I guess I overstated my townieness initially today. Sorry about that.
Am confused about the kkrieg stuff.
faust is mildly suspicious as is Robz

Probably more to come today.
Title: Re: M98: Русская Mafia (Day 2)
Post by: The_Wine_Merchant on April 28, 2017, 04:43:37 pm
As for SK, I really don't think I found anything super worthwhile to talk about here. So I guess I can see why faust is latching onto what he thinks is something that points toward me.

In my mind it makes much more sense to focus on finding the other mafia, not the SK. faust thought this as well right at the start of the day.

So we have a nice SK.

Well it does not make a lot of sense for a SK to go after a claimed VT one N1 I think. That only really works if they were afraid of mcmc. So that's a good place to start looking.

On the other hand, mcmc had a partner. That guy is also worth looking for.
Which I haven't really seen him do much of aside from saying that if I am not the SK, I must be mafia and am a good lynch. What a cop out.
Title: Re: M98: Русская Mafia (Day 2)
Post by: 2.71828..... on April 28, 2017, 04:50:11 pm
I like most everything that TWM said in his post. I am very suspicious of faust
Title: Re: M98: Русская Mafia (Day 2)
Post by: 2.71828..... on April 28, 2017, 04:52:32 pm
The big long one like 3 posts ago that is
Title: Re: M98: Русская Mafia (Day 2)
Post by: The_Wine_Merchant on April 28, 2017, 04:58:06 pm
I like most everything that TWM said in his post. I am very suspicious of faust
Yes. To be clear, my current suspicion of faust and Robz is more based off today's actions, call it OMGUS if you will, but I know I am town and I would probably be responding very much the way they are to me if I were mafia responding to myself.

And a little bit of it is simple removal of townier individuals (2.7, gkrieg, Andrew) leaving them as my main suspects.
Title: Re: M98: Русская Mafia (Day 2)
Post by: AndrewisFTTW on April 28, 2017, 05:00:19 pm
Vote: faust
Title: Re: M98: Русская Mafia (Day 2)
Post by: Robz888 on April 28, 2017, 05:02:10 pm
I don't think faust is acting like scum at all.
Title: Re: M98: Русская Mafia (Day 2)
Post by: The_Wine_Merchant on April 28, 2017, 05:07:23 pm
I don't think faust is acting like scum at all.
How would he act if he were scum in this situation?
Title: Re: M98: Русская Mafia (Day 2)
Post by: Robz888 on April 28, 2017, 05:14:40 pm
I think we would keep a lower profile.

Also, I will call your read on him OMGUS, per your invitation to do so.
Title: Re: M98: Русская Mafia (Day 2)
Post by: Robz888 on April 28, 2017, 05:15:04 pm
he*
Title: Re: M98: Русская Mafia (Day 2)
Post by: The_Wine_Merchant on April 28, 2017, 05:29:23 pm
I think we would keep a lower profile.
You just lost your partner during the night. Your night kill didn't go through. Things are looking kinda bad if you are mafia. Is that really a great time to keep a lower profile and just hope things work out? Or do you need to push the issue?

If we are talking about faust as SK. Then yes, I absolutely agree. I am saying the same thing about myself, but I others shot that down pretty hard. Double standard?
Title: Re: M98: Русская Mafia (Day 2)
Post by: Robz888 on April 28, 2017, 05:33:20 pm
The only strike I see against faust--and I guess I shouldn't write it off as much as I have--is that he has this long and complicated theory for why you are the SK, and I guess arguably that's most likely to be coming from mafia who's stinging from the loss of a partner last night. The impulse to extra super duper SK hunt has to be strong with mafia right now.
Title: Re: M98: Русская Mafia (Day 2)
Post by: Robz888 on April 28, 2017, 05:35:27 pm
I'm talking about faust as mafia, and you as mafia, mostly, though I do see his argument for why you could be SK, and the fact that there's a case against you on both fronts is why I'm voting for you.

People who are disproportionately concerned about finding SK over mafia are more likely to themselves be mafia. This is a tell that's held pretty well, actually, in previous games.
Title: Re: M98: Русская Mafia (Day 2)
Post by: The_Wine_Merchant on April 28, 2017, 05:40:00 pm
No, Iam at the point where I get the votes on me. I obviously don't agree with them, but I see the appeal and I am kind of anticipating being the lynch at this point, which, ok, fine, especially now that I got my thoughts down and hopefully people will find them mildly useful and remember them going into tomorrow.

It would be better to lynch elsewhere, but I think I only have 2.7 and Andrew on myside, but am unlikely to get support anywhere else.
Title: Re: M98: Русская Mafia (Day 2)
Post by: Robz888 on April 28, 2017, 05:42:46 pm
No, Iam at the point where I get the votes on me. I obviously don't agree with them, but I see the appeal and I am kind of anticipating being the lynch at this point, which, ok, fine, especially now that I got my thoughts down and hopefully people will find them mildly useful and remember them going into tomorrow.

It would be better to lynch elsewhere, but I think I only have 2.7 and Andrew on myside, but am unlikely to get support anywhere else.

You are way too resigned! In fact, it makes me suspicious, because it's too weird to be genuine.
Title: Re: M98: Русская Mafia (Day 2)
Post by: The_Wine_Merchant on April 28, 2017, 05:45:01 pm
No, Iam at the point where I get the votes on me. I obviously don't agree with them, but I see the appeal and I am kind of anticipating being the lynch at this point, which, ok, fine, especially now that I got my thoughts down and hopefully people will find them mildly useful and remember them going into tomorrow.

It would be better to lynch elsewhere, but I think I only have 2.7 and Andrew on myside, but am unlikely to get support anywhere else.

You are way too resigned! In fact, it makes me suspicious, because it's too weird to be genuine.
Go reread this whole last day man. Put yourself in my shoes. From the very first posts to your last one the trend has been me getting lynched at the end of day. Imagine that I am town and how despondent I must feel about my chances from what people have said.
Title: Re: M98: Русская Mafia (Day 2)
Post by: faust on April 28, 2017, 05:47:15 pm
So we have a nice SK.

Well it does not make a lot of sense for a SK to go after a claimed VT one N1 I think. That only really works if they were afraid of mcmc. So that's a good place to start looking.

On the other hand, mcmc had a partner. That guy is also worth looking for.
Which I haven't really seen him do much of aside from saying that if I am not the SK, I must be mafia and am a good lynch. What a cop out.
Err. I never said that?

Also, I reread mcmc right after that thing you quoted to look for partners. This is rather ridiculous misrepresentation.
Title: Re: M98: Русская Mafia (Day 2)
Post by: faust on April 28, 2017, 05:48:34 pm
The sad truth is that mcmc did not have a lot of interactions apart from his end-of-day wagon. Which I analyzed and formed some reads upon.
Title: Re: M98: Русская Mafia (Day 2)
Post by: gkrieg13 on April 28, 2017, 05:49:28 pm
I think we would keep a lower profile.

Also, I will call your read on him OMGUS, per your invitation to do so.

Uh, no he wouldn't.  Have you read his traitor game?
Title: Re: M98: Русская Mafia (Day 2)
Post by: faust on April 28, 2017, 05:50:53 pm
The only strike I see against faust--and I guess I shouldn't write it off as much as I have--is that he has this long and complicated theory for why you are the SK, and I guess arguably that's most likely to be coming from mafia who's stinging from the loss of a partner last night. The impulse to extra super duper SK hunt has to be strong with mafia right now.
And you think I would just give in to that as mafia?

I don't think my theory is "long and complicated", it's fairly obvious.
Title: Re: M98: Русская Mafia (Day 2)
Post by: faust on April 28, 2017, 05:52:36 pm
I think we would keep a lower profile.

Also, I will call your read on him OMGUS, per your invitation to do so.

Uh, no he wouldn't.  Have you read his traitor game?
I do believe that traitors should play way differently than SKs for the record. A traitor wants to do out there things that would be too dangerous for the mafia.

That said I probably wouldn't ever keep a low profile. It doesn't become me.
Title: Re: M98: Русская Mafia (Day 2)
Post by: The_Wine_Merchant on April 28, 2017, 05:57:55 pm
So we have a nice SK.

Well it does not make a lot of sense for a SK to go after a claimed VT one N1 I think. That only really works if they were afraid of mcmc. So that's a good place to start looking.

On the other hand, mcmc had a partner. That guy is also worth looking for.
Which I haven't really seen him do much of aside from saying that if I am not the SK, I must be mafia and am a good lynch. What a cop out.
Err. I never said that?

Also, I reread mcmc right after that thing you quoted to look for partners. This is rather ridiculous misrepresentation.
You are correct. Robz said it.

And yes, you assessed it, but to actually quote you this time:
I saw that, but it doesn't matter.
Title: Re: M98: Русская Mafia (Day 2)
Post by: gkrieg13 on April 28, 2017, 06:04:52 pm
Am confused about the kkrieg stuff.


Confused about what stuff?
Title: Re: M98: Русская Mafia (Day 2)
Post by: gkrieg13 on April 28, 2017, 06:05:33 pm
I think we would keep a lower profile.

Also, I will call your read on him OMGUS, per your invitation to do so.

Uh, no he wouldn't.  Have you read his traitor game?
I do believe that traitors should play way differently than SKs for the record. A traitor wants to do out there things that would be too dangerous for the mafia.

That said I probably wouldn't ever keep a low profile. It doesn't become me.

It is very true.  A quiet faust is a dead faust.
Title: Re: M98: Русская Mafia (Day 2)
Post by: The_Wine_Merchant on April 28, 2017, 06:09:22 pm
Am confused about the kkrieg stuff.


Confused about what stuff?
Why she is suspicious.
Title: Re: M98: Русская Mafia (Day 2)
Post by: schadd on April 28, 2017, 08:38:13 pm
what is gkrieg's track record reading faust & vice versa?
Title: Re: M98: Русская Mafia (Day 2)
Post by: kkrieg on April 28, 2017, 08:41:15 pm
I think gkrieg could be scummy. He is pretty accurate at reading me IRL. I think he knows I'm not scum and yet he's voting for me. Granted I am crap at reading gkrieg so you never know.


I think we would keep a lower profile.

I kinda agree with this. I think scum has reason to either lay low (like e, maybe eevee) or be super defensive (like twm)
Title: Re: M98: Русская Mafia (Day 2)
Post by: Robz888 on April 28, 2017, 09:23:35 pm
I think gkrieg could be scummy. He is pretty accurate at reading me IRL. I think he knows I'm not scum and yet he's voting for me.

Interesting.
Title: Re: M98: Русская Mafia (Day 2)
Post by: gkrieg13 on April 28, 2017, 09:28:20 pm
what is gkrieg's track record reading faust & vice versa?

I think it is pretty bad both ways.
Title: Re: M98: Русская Mafia (Day 2)
Post by: schadd on April 29, 2017, 10:49:40 am
I think gkrieg could be scummy. He is pretty accurate at reading me IRL. I think he knows I'm not scum and yet he's voting for me.
what have you done here that you would expect him to townread you for?
Title: Re: M98: Русская Mafia (Day 2)
Post by: The_Wine_Merchant on April 29, 2017, 11:05:25 am
I think gkrieg could be scummy. He is pretty accurate at reading me IRL. I think he knows I'm not scum and yet he's voting for me. Granted I am crap at reading gkrieg so you never know.


I think we would keep a lower profile.

I kinda agree with this. I think scum has reason to either lay low (like e, maybe eevee) or be super defensive (like twm)
Vote: kkrieg
Title: Re: M98: Русская Mafia (Day 2)
Post by: 2.71828..... on April 29, 2017, 11:24:52 am
I haven't done post counts or anything, but TWM has done more to move this game forward and find scum than anyone else. Sure, he has put himself out there and done some things that can be construed as scummy, but to me (especially what he has done D2) feels a lot like what I have found myself get in trouble for a lot, that is, act as if I am an IC and nothing can touch me and just post thoughts with impunity.....then get called scummy for it.

His level of activity, content, and drive is really what has been pushing the game forward in my opinion, and even if he is scum (which I doubt) I think we should try to lynch the other scums  (SK/traitor/goon) rather than him. A few more flips and we will be able to read TWM very well based on his positions. We just should not lynch him today at least.

That being said, wagons are cool. Back to

Vote: kkrieg
Title: Re: M98: Русская Mafia (Day 2)
Post by: The_Wine_Merchant on April 29, 2017, 12:29:08 pm
Title: Re: M98: Русская Mafia (PMs are out! N0)
Post by: LaLight on April 29, 2017, 12:33:38 pm
Vote count 2.3
The_Wine_Merchant (3): faust, schadd, Robz888
faust (1): AndrewisFTTW
kkrieg (3): gkrieg13, The_Wine_Merchant, 2,71828.....
Not voting (2): Eevee, kkrieg

With 9 alive it takes 5 to lynch. Day 2 ends Wednesday, 3rd of May at 4 am FT.
Title: Re: M98: Русская Mafia (Day 2)
Post by: Eevee on April 29, 2017, 12:40:53 pm
Vote: TWM L-1.

I think there are parallels with his level of activity and effort here to the last day of fibonacci (?) mafia where we were scum together.
Title: Re: M98: Русская Mafia (Day 2)
Post by: Eevee on April 29, 2017, 12:42:29 pm
Have others had trouble accessing the forum today?
Title: Re: M98: Русская Mafia (Day 2)
Post by: 2.71828..... on April 29, 2017, 12:56:16 pm
Have others had trouble accessing the forum today?

Yes
Title: Re: M98: Русская Mafia (Day 2)
Post by: faust on April 29, 2017, 01:34:19 pm
I haven't done post counts or anything, but TWM has done more to move this game forward and find scum than anyone else. Sure, he has put himself out there and done some things that can be construed as scummy, but to me (especially what he has done D2) feels a lot like what I have found myself get in trouble for a lot, that is, act as if I am an IC and nothing can touch me and just post thoughts with impunity.....then get called scummy for it.

His level of activity, content, and drive is really what has been pushing the game forward in my opinion, and even if he is scum (which I doubt) I think we should try to lynch the other scums  (SK/traitor/goon) rather than him. A few more flips and we will be able to read TWM very well based on his positions. We just should not lynch him today at least.
You say that and yet you have been voting for me not too long ago.

It would be nice if ou actually shared your read on TWM and the reasons for it instead of just saying we shouldn't lynch him because he can post more than twice a day.
Title: Re: M98: Русская Mafia (Day 2)
Post by: gkrieg13 on April 29, 2017, 01:45:34 pm
kkrieg's wagon is wayyyyyy townier than TWM's.  Robz and schadd are null at best.
Title: Re: M98: Русская Mafia (Day 2)
Post by: 2.71828..... on April 29, 2017, 01:46:36 pm
I haven't done post counts or anything, but TWM has done more to move this game forward and find scum than anyone else. Sure, he has put himself out there and done some things that can be construed as scummy, but to me (especially what he has done D2) feels a lot like what I have found myself get in trouble for a lot, that is, act as if I am an IC and nothing can touch me and just post thoughts with impunity.....then get called scummy for it.

His level of activity, content, and drive is really what has been pushing the game forward in my opinion, and even if he is scum (which I doubt) I think we should try to lynch the other scums  (SK/traitor/goon) rather than him. A few more flips and we will be able to read TWM very well based on his positions. We just should not lynch him today at least.
You say that and yet you have been voting for me not too long ago.

It would be nice if ou actually shared your read on TWM and the reasons for it instead of just saying we shouldn't lynch him because he can post more than twice a day.

I did that in the post you quoted....I will expand further though.

Not quoting spacific references because that is too hard on the phone

1) his initial townread on me from D1 was not something that I think he does as scum. I had made a few posts, said a few things, and he comes out saying I am 100% town. Ok, not quite like that, but I don't think scum!TWM reads me quite like that.

2) the way he entered into D2 and got suspicion and stuff felt very much like how I post sometimes as town when I feel like everything I have done makes me obv!town. I usually do the whole claim IC thing even though I am not, but his posts have the feel of someone who thinks they can post with impunity and there is no way town would ever lynch them. Except town does lynch them.

I still remember dice mafia where I had 9 town lynch me on D2 without a single scum on the wagon. I have a way of getting (unintentionally) into TvT battles. I feel like that is happening somewhat with TWM.

Except, of course, I think faust is scum on the wagon.
Title: Re: M98: Русская Mafia (Day 2)
Post by: The_Wine_Merchant on April 29, 2017, 02:10:05 pm
vote: faust
Title: Re: M98: Русская Mafia (Day 2)
Post by: faust on April 29, 2017, 02:13:36 pm
kkrieg's wagon is wayyyyyy townier than TWM's.  Robz and schadd are null at best.
Well you are town, TWM is scum and e is null, so it kinda cancels out.
Title: Re: M98: Русская Mafia (Day 2)
Post by: faust on April 29, 2017, 02:16:58 pm
vote: faust
What's up with the switching around?
Title: Re: M98: Русская Mafia (Day 2)
Post by: The_Wine_Merchant on April 29, 2017, 02:19:42 pm
vote: faust
What's up with the switching around?
I thought maybe that kkrieg had a better chance of being lynched than you. Realized that is futile and now just want my vote to be on you at the end of day so people will better remember to be suspicious of you when I flip town.
Title: Re: M98: Русская Mafia (Day 2)
Post by: The_Wine_Merchant on April 29, 2017, 02:20:10 pm
I don't really find kkrieg suspicious, but she is a better lynch than me.
Title: Re: M98: Русская Mafia (Day 2)
Post by: faust on April 29, 2017, 02:21:25 pm
1) his initial townread on me from D1 was not something that I think he does as scum. I had made a few posts, said a few things, and he comes out saying I am 100% town. Ok, not quite like that, but I don't think scum!TWM reads me quite like that.

2) the way he entered into D2 and got suspicion and stuff felt very much like how I post sometimes as town when I feel like everything I have done makes me obv!town. I usually do the whole claim IC thing even though I am not, but his posts have the feel of someone who thinks they can post with impunity and there is no way town would ever lynch them. Except town does lynch them.
Okay, that's something I can work with.

1) I don't remember the particular incident, but do you think SK!TWM would have played it different from mafia!TWM? I mean usually it's pretty difficult to notice the difference.

2) I never got the feeling from TWM that he thought there's no way town would lynch him. He seemed pretty aware of that possibility the whole time. The only thing I can remember is posting something about how he thought the flip made him townie in his very first D2 post. I am not sure where you get that vibe from otherwise.
Title: Re: M98: Русская Mafia (Day 2)
Post by: faust on April 29, 2017, 02:22:50 pm
vote: faust
What's up with the switching around?
I thought maybe that kkrieg had a better chance of being lynched than you. Realized that is futile and now just want my vote to be on you at the end of day so people will better remember to be suspicious of you when I flip town.
Is that a VT claim?
Title: Re: M98: Русская Mafia (Day 2)
Post by: 2.71828..... on April 29, 2017, 02:24:09 pm
So rereading mcmc. I'm positive that we can figure this out.

Okay, so he is pushing pretty hard for TWM.

This is interesting interaction:
mcmc, do you think i think you're town or scum?


will ask again later

I think you think I'm town.
schadd, why did you ask mcmc?

There is more TWM tunnelling. This starts to look pretty bad for him.

I would be open to lynching andrew, twm, 2.7. kkrieg, eevee, awaclus.
Is mcmc's partner in here? Arguably yes. But it's a big list, so eh.

Okay, I feel like there isn't really a lot to take away in terms of partner reads, but it feels like TWM is the only one with a motive to kill mcmc.

Another interesting data point would be the mcmc wagon.

This is the mcmc wagon history.

gkrieg, TWM
[these two have been voting mcmc for a while through D1.

I'd be ok with Awaclus or Andrew
kkrieg does not mention mcmc at all here. Scummy.

I would go for E if the votes were there. If not I'll stick with Andrew. Awaclus is also fine. This does not feel like scum mcmc to me.
Also not too good, but it feels unlikely that both scum would claim VT on D1.

Andrew & TWM move towards Awaclus.

gkrieg votes for Andrew, and then unvotes, thus removing his vote from mcmc in a non-obvious way. That's quite crafty if intentional.

schadd votes mcmc. Town points here. Then gkrieg switches back (ok, I suppose the above was not intentioal), Then Awaclus.

If I'm seeing correctly, this is the mcmc wagon at peak:

TWM, schadd, gkrieg, Awaclus

Robz continues to push off of mcmc. Ironically, TWM takes the lead on destroying the mcmc wagon. His is the deciding vote. The others on mcmc stay there.

So schadd and gkrieg definitely look townie (or, I guess, non-SK-y). Mild scum read on Robz, stronger on kkrieg and Andrew.

I just reread TWM and this case feels really fabricated to me. First of all, TWM was voting awaclus much more throughout d1 than he was voting mcmc. He had a clear scum read on both, and as the day was nearing the end he landed on Awaclus. Saying he left mcmc because he felt like the lynch would land there is just false
Title: Re: M98: Русская Mafia (Day 2)
Post by: The_Wine_Merchant on April 29, 2017, 02:24:19 pm
vote: faust
What's up with the switching around?
I thought maybe that kkrieg had a better chance of being lynched than you. Realized that is futile and now just want my vote to be on you at the end of day so people will better remember to be suspicious of you when I flip town.
Is that a VT claim?
No.
Title: Re: M98: Русская Mafia (Day 2)
Post by: faust on April 29, 2017, 02:25:30 pm
I don't really find kkrieg suspicious, but she is a better lynch than me.
And yet you voted for her specifically in response to one of her posts. That does not look like you just wanted slef-preservation; it looks like something in that post made you think she's scummy.
Title: Re: M98: Русская Mafia (Day 2)
Post by: The_Wine_Merchant on April 29, 2017, 02:26:19 pm
Yeah I left the mcmc wagon cause I got fooled by his claim post and felt others saw it similarly and thought I had something better in awaclus late in the day
Title: Re: M98: Русская Mafia (Day 2)
Post by: The_Wine_Merchant on April 29, 2017, 02:27:13 pm
I don't really find kkrieg suspicious, but she is a better lynch than me.
And yet you voted for her specifically in response to one of her posts. That does not look like you just wanted slef-preservation; it looks like something in that post made you think she's scummy.
Sorry I made it look that way. I didn't realize it would be construed that way.

I have asked others to show why she was suspicious, but those haven't responded.
Title: Re: M98: Русская Mafia (Day 2)
Post by: The_Wine_Merchant on April 29, 2017, 02:28:57 pm
Oh.i voted that way cause I am on iPad and it is easer to reply by quoting than scrolling up or down to the reply button.

There were posts inbetween the Top and bottom between her post. Sorry.
Title: Re: M98: Русская Mafia (Day 2)
Post by: The_Wine_Merchant on April 29, 2017, 02:30:06 pm
Why do I feel like whatever I did there Faust would have found it scummy?
Title: Re: M98: Русская Mafia (Day 2)
Post by: faust on April 29, 2017, 02:30:11 pm
I just reread TWM and this case feels really fabricated to me. First of all, TWM was voting awaclus much more throughout d1 than he was voting mcmc. He had a clear scum read on both, and as the day was nearing the end he landed on Awaclus. Saying he left mcmc because he felt like the lynch would land there is just false
Not sure why you're quoting that whole post from me as if responding to a "case" (it was not a case) and then all you really respond to is half a sentence from it...

Anyway I don't know why you are even picking this. It's not why I am voting for TWM.
Title: Re: M98: Русская Mafia (Day 2)
Post by: 2.71828..... on April 29, 2017, 02:31:41 pm
The first time TWM votes mcmc is 24 hours prior to deadline. Before that he was all about awaclus. He then switches back to awaclus, back to mcmc, then back to awaclus.

Scum does not do that D1 with a partner. Maybe make a case for SK or traitor, but I just don't see that situation with the rest of his play (outside of end of D1)
Title: Re: M98: Русская Mafia (Day 2)
Post by: faust on April 29, 2017, 02:31:57 pm
Why do I feel like whatever I did there Faust would have found it scummy?
I have no idea. You have to admit that for any objective observer it would have to look like you voted for kkrieg as a reaction to that post, no?
Title: Re: M98: Русская Mafia (Day 2)
Post by: faust on April 29, 2017, 02:32:45 pm
Scum does not do that D1 with a partner. Maybe make a case for SK or traitor, but I just don't see that situation with the rest of his play (outside of end of D1)
I have a feeling that so far you have not read a single one of my posts.
Title: Re: M98: Русская Mafia (Day 2)
Post by: The_Wine_Merchant on April 29, 2017, 02:35:45 pm
Why do I feel like whatever I did there Faust would have found it scummy?
I have no idea. You have to admit that for any objective observer it would have to look like you voted for kkrieg as a reaction to that post, no?
Sure. But once hearing that I did not suspect her I think an objective observer could easily conclude that I in fact didn't.
Title: Re: M98: Русская Mafia (Day 2)
Post by: 2.71828..... on April 29, 2017, 02:37:04 pm
Scum does not do that D1 with a partner. Maybe make a case for SK or traitor, but I just don't see that situation with the rest of his play (outside of end of D1)
I have a feeling that so far you have not read a single one of my posts.

Have you read a single one of TWM's?
Title: Re: M98: Русская Mafia (Day 2)
Post by: The_Wine_Merchant on April 29, 2017, 02:38:12 pm
Scum does not do that D1 with a partner. Maybe make a case for SK or traitor, but I just don't see that situation with the rest of his play (outside of end of D1)
I have a feeling that so far you have not read a single one of my posts.
Faust thinks I am SK cause mcmc voted for me and that I must have felt sort of newbie anxiety about that and killed him ignoring that he had claimed VT and can't imagine that anyone else could have any reason to kill him.
Title: Re: M98: Русская Mafia (Day 2)
Post by: 2.71828..... on April 29, 2017, 02:38:46 pm
I don't really find kkrieg suspicious, but she is a better lynch than me.
And yet you voted for her specifically in response to one of her posts. That does not look like you just wanted slef-preservation; it looks like something in that post made you think she's scummy.
Sorry I made it look that way. I didn't realize it would be construed that way.

I have asked others to show why she was suspicious, but those haven't responded.

She calls things scummy but is very hesitant to cast a vote for the cases she presents. The hedge factor is strong and scummy with kkrieg
Title: Re: M98: Русская Mafia (Day 2)
Post by: 2.71828..... on April 29, 2017, 02:41:57 pm
Scum feel like their biggest threat is the SK, and that is also how they can appear towny, if they help catch the SK.

Faust-> goon
kkrieg-> SK
Don't know the traitor
Title: Re: M98: Русская Mafia (Day 2)
Post by: 2.71828..... on April 29, 2017, 02:44:11 pm
Basically, faust is not scum hunting, he is SK-hunting. Which I think is scummy.

That being said, let's lynch the SK first, then we can lynch faust tomorrow
Title: Re: M98: Русская Mafia (Day 2)
Post by: faust on April 29, 2017, 03:09:01 pm
Basically, faust is not scum hunting, he is SK-hunting. Which I think is scummy.

That being said, let's lynch the SK first, then we can lynch faust tomorrow
You are SK-hunting! You're scummy. ..

Did I do that right?

Like you, I have ideas for who the other mafia is. Like you, I think lynching the SK is better. Not sure where the difference is here.

Also you jump from "faust is scummy because he thinks TWM is mafia" to "faust is scummy because he thinks TWM is the SK" without blinking. You didn't stop for a minute to think how this should change your read on me.

I am not talking as much about who mcmc's partner is because I think the evidence against TWM is much stronger than against Robz or kkrieg.
Title: Re: M98: Русская Mafia (Day 2)
Post by: 2.71828..... on April 29, 2017, 03:22:57 pm
Actually, my read on kkrieg was really one that she is not-town more than a specific goon/traitor/sk. She fits into your "newbie kills mcmc" mold very well, and when TWM mentioned it is really when I thought she could be. She may actually be the traitor who knows mafia, which would make sense with her mcmc hedge on D1. She was scum for me D1 before mcmc ever factored into things.

But you are definitely goon material. I don't think your SK-hunting is indicative of you being sk or really traitor, I think you are the last goon.

So I am actually SCUM hunting, and certain scum fall in certain categories. You are SK-hunting. Which is scummy.
Title: Re: M98: Русская Mafia (Day 2)
Post by: 2.71828..... on April 29, 2017, 03:32:22 pm
I would also love if someone switched off TWM. We really don't need kkrieg swooping in and lynching him before we get around to lynching her.
Title: Re: M98: Русская Mafia (Day 2)
Post by: schadd on April 29, 2017, 03:52:24 pm
unvote but like why do you think she would do that
Title: Re: M98: Русская Mafia (Day 2)
Post by: The_Wine_Merchant on April 29, 2017, 03:53:32 pm
Plus 2.7 is super townie for other reasons. Could be traitor. That is it.
Title: Re: M98: Русская Mafia (Day 2)
Post by: 2.71828..... on April 29, 2017, 03:55:33 pm
Town reads:
The_Wine_Merchant
schadd

Middle of the road/need to reread:
Eevee
gkrieg13
AndrewisFTTW
Robz888

Scum:
faust
kkrieg
Title: Re: M98: Русская Mafia (Day 2)
Post by: 2.71828..... on April 29, 2017, 03:58:12 pm
unvote but like why do you think she would do that

I don't actually think she would, but it was possible, now it is not.
Title: Re: M98: Русская Mafia (Day 2)
Post by: faust on April 29, 2017, 04:00:55 pm
Actually, my read on kkrieg was really one that she is not-town more than a specific goon/traitor/sk. She fits into your "newbie kills mcmc" mold very well, and when TWM mentioned it is really when I thought she could be. She may actually be the traitor who knows mafia, which would make sense with her mcmc hedge on D1. She was scum for me D1 before mcmc ever factored into things.

But you are definitely goon material. I don't think your SK-hunting is indicative of you being sk or really traitor, I think you are the last goon.

So I am actually SCUM hunting, and certain scum fall in certain categories. You are SK-hunting. Which is scummy.
Except there is no difference between what we do.

I looked at everything that happens, and I am pushing for the player who is most likely to flip scum. That this player is much more likely to be SK than other scum is just coincidence.
Title: Re: M98: Русская Mafia (Day 2)
Post by: 2.71828..... on April 29, 2017, 04:12:09 pm
So rereading mcmc. I'm positive that we can figure this out.

Okay, so he is pushing pretty hard for TWM.

This is interesting interaction:
mcmc, do you think i think you're town or scum?


will ask again later

I think you think I'm town.
schadd, why did you ask mcmc?

There is more TWM tunnelling. This starts to look pretty bad for him.

I would be open to lynching andrew, twm, 2.7. kkrieg, eevee, awaclus.
Is mcmc's partner in here? Arguably yes. But it's a big list, so eh.

Okay, I feel like there isn't really a lot to take away in terms of partner reads, but it feels like TWM is the only one with a motive to kill mcmc.

Another interesting data point would be the mcmc wagon.

This is the mcmc wagon history.

gkrieg, TWM
[these two have been voting mcmc for a while through D1.

I'd be ok with Awaclus or Andrew

kkrieg does not mention mcmc at all here. Scummy.


I would go for E if the votes were there. If not I'll stick with Andrew. Awaclus is also fine. This does not feel like scum mcmc to me.
Also not too good, but it feels unlikely that both scum would claim VT on D1.

Andrew & TWM move towards Awaclus.

gkrieg votes for Andrew, and then unvotes, thus removing his vote from mcmc in a non-obvious way. That's quite crafty if intentional.

schadd votes mcmc. Town points here. Then gkrieg switches back (ok, I suppose the above was not intentioal), Then Awaclus.

If I'm seeing correctly, this is the mcmc wagon at peak:

TWM, schadd, gkrieg, Awaclus

Robz continues to push off of mcmc. Ironically, TWM takes the lead on destroying the mcmc wagon. His is the deciding vote. The others on mcmc stay there.

So schadd and gkrieg definitely look townie (or, I guess, non-SK-y). Mild scum read on Robz, stronger on kkrieg and Andrew.

From the very beginning you are trying to figure out who would kill mcmc, not who would be mcmc's partner. You cast suspicion elsewhere, and have reaffirmed suspicions, but the only thing you care about in the end is that you think TWM has motive to kill. I think the points you make against kkrieg are far better than the conclusion that TWM is SK. But you aren't hunting for a partner. You are hunting for a SK
Title: Re: M98: Русская Mafia (Day 2)
Post by: 2.71828..... on April 29, 2017, 04:29:00 pm
Also, sitting in the back of a vehicle for 6 hours with nothing to do but check f.ds does wonders for your post count. If only the forum wasn't being so temperamental.
Title: Re: M98: Русская Mafia (Day 2)
Post by: Robz888 on April 29, 2017, 04:45:39 pm
I'm having a lot of trouble with the forums right now, but E has made a really good case for switching from TWM to kkrieg.
Title: Re: M98: Русская Mafia (Day 2)
Post by: faust on April 29, 2017, 05:09:25 pm
From the very beginning you are trying to figure out who would kill mcmc, not who would be mcmc's partner. You cast suspicion elsewhere, and have reaffirmed suspicions, but the only thing you care about in the end is that you think TWM has motive to kill.
This is all just wrong. You have bolded some stuff in my post, but that doesn't allow for the conclusions ou're drawing here at all. I reread mcmc; the only really noticable he's done is tunnel TWM. Just because you don't think I'm right in my suspicion of TWM doesn't mean I've been SK hunting.
Title: Re: M98: Русская Mafia (Day 2)
Post by: faust on April 29, 2017, 05:11:47 pm
I mean you say it yourslef; you think the conclusions I draw on kkrieg are better than those on TWM. I don't. Just because we disagree on this doesn't make me scum.
Title: Re: M98: Русская Mafia (Day 2)
Post by: gkrieg13 on April 29, 2017, 07:32:46 pm
Forum is completely unusable at my house.
Title: Re: M98: Русская Mafia (Day 2)
Post by: The_Wine_Merchant on April 29, 2017, 08:17:33 pm
Forum is completely unusable at my house.
Everywhere
Title: Re: M98: Русская Mafia (Day 2)
Post by: kkrieg on April 29, 2017, 11:46:14 pm
Definitely realized I could have hammered TWM earlier today but I didn't.

She calls things scummy but is very hesitant to cast a vote for the cases she presents. The hedge factor is strong and scummy with kkrieg
This is true. I have commitment problems and don't want to be wrong.

Title: Re: M98: Русская Mafia (Day 2)
Post by: The_Wine_Merchant on April 30, 2017, 12:29:39 am
vote: kkrieg
PS faust; this time I am voting her because i find her suspicious
Title: Re: M98: Русская Mafia (Day 2)
Post by: LaLight on April 30, 2017, 01:55:40 am
Vote count 2.4
The_Wine_Merchant (3): faust, Robz888, Eevee
faust (1): AndrewisFTTW
kkrieg (3): gkrieg13, 2,71828....., The_Wine_Merchant
Not voting (2): kkrieg, schadd

With 9 alive it takes 5 to lynch. Day 2 ends Wednesday, 3rd of May at 4 am FT. If the forum continues to be so slow, i will prolong the deadline.
Title: Re: M98: Русская Mafia (Day 2)
Post by: faust on April 30, 2017, 02:42:28 pm
So does nobody have something to say anymore?

I'm going to do an Eevee reread since I don't remember anything about that guy.
Title: Re: M98: Русская Mafia (Day 2)
Post by: Robz888 on April 30, 2017, 02:47:39 pm
Why is kkrieg not voting for TWM out of sheer self-preservation? Is she enough that she doesn't know to do that?
Title: Re: M98: Русская Mafia (Day 2)
Post by: Robz888 on April 30, 2017, 02:47:52 pm
I'm trying to decide if that says anything about her.
Title: Re: M98: Русская Mafia (Day 2)
Post by: Robz888 on April 30, 2017, 02:48:29 pm
So does nobody have something to say anymore?

I'm going to do an Eevee reread since I don't remember anything about that guy.

I should probably re-read too. Eevee is flying super duper under the radar right now.
Title: Re: M98: Русская Mafia (Day 2)
Post by: 2.71828..... on April 30, 2017, 02:50:44 pm
So does nobody have something to say anymore?

I'm going to do an Eevee reread since I don't remember anything about that guy.

I feel all talked out until people have had a chance to respond to what was said between faust, TWM, and myself
Title: Re: M98: Русская Mafia (Day 2)
Post by: faust on April 30, 2017, 03:19:38 pm
D1 Eevee does a lot of conversation, some poking at people's opinions, other stuff is just banter. In terms of Eevee's own opinions there is very little.

The first vote is jumping on e for lurking. He has a scumread on mcmc, that's interesting. Town on Robz, TWM, me.

The back and forth with schadd... I want to say not partners, but well that does not tell us anything really.

Eevee keeps his vote on e for a long time even though he expressed a scumread on mcmc. There may be something here. ... yes, the vote stays there until the end.

This is Eevee's last D1 post:
Awaclus would be a total "guess" lynch for me, he has played just like I'd expect him to play day 1 either alignment. I think he is generally hard to townread with certainty, but conversely also hard to pinpoint as scum. Especially this early, this is just totally what I think both scum and town versions of Awaclus would look like.
At that point there are already two votes on mcmc, Eevee's only expressed scumread. That is... bad. And then Eevee is just gone, without doing anything worthwhile. It looks to me like he was scared of committing.

Though timing is relevant. Eevee's my time zone, so his final post was 1:30 am. Reasonable enough time to go to sleep. But then why did he not say something or switch his vote? One hour later, the mcmc wagon picks up. At this point it is very likely that mafia!Eevee would be afraid of either lynching his partner or incriminating himself and thus disappears.

Okay, starting D2!

He goes with my TWM suspicion, which is unfortunately not really an alignment-tell.

Actually, I guess the better question is, how do you think they'd decide who to shoot if not like that? Why else would they have shot a claimed VT?
Actually, he's pushing the angle pretty hard, which makes sense for mafia!Eevee to get himself out of the spotlight. While people talk about the nightkill, they don't talk about the end of D1, and that's how Eevee could get suspected.

Okay, so that's pretty much much. Going into D2, Eevee said this:
Just phone access now, but mcmc being the almost-lynch of yesterday should be helpful in determining the second mafia at least. Like, probably not e based on his voting, so my suspicion on yesterday was wrong on that at least (again, probably).
Yet he does never do anything even resembling looking for mcmc's partner and instead focuses solely in the TWM thing. All this is quite scummy. Like right now I think Eevee is a better lynch target than kkrieg, but not convinced he's better than TWM.

I'd add that Eevee is unlikely to be SK though; his confusion about the nightkill looks real enough.
Title: Re: M98: Русская Mafia (Day 2)
Post by: kkrieg on April 30, 2017, 03:25:18 pm
Why is kkrieg not voting for TWM out of sheer self-preservation? Is she enough that she doesn't know to do that?
1. I don't need to vote in self-preservation. I am town/ don't think I will get lynched/ don't feel a need to be defensive.

2. Also didn't vote for TWM because I think people would read me as desperate and scummy for doing so.
Title: Re: M98: Русская Mafia (Day 2)
Post by: The_Wine_Merchant on April 30, 2017, 04:10:24 pm
Do you think I am scummy? If you do, you should vote for me. Commit to that read.
Title: Re: M98: Русская Mafia (Day 2)
Post by: kkrieg on April 30, 2017, 04:48:25 pm
Do you think I am scummy? If you do, you should vote for me. Commit to that read.
Okkkkkk. Vote: TWM.
L-1 I believe.
Title: Re: M98: Русская Mafia (Day 2)
Post by: The_Wine_Merchant on April 30, 2017, 05:10:55 pm
Niiiiiicccceeee
Title: Re: M98: Русская Mafia (Day 2)
Post by: AndrewisFTTW on April 30, 2017, 06:32:29 pm
Been busier than I anticipated this week. I got time tomorrow to look over everything though.
Title: Re: M98: Русская Mafia (Day 2)
Post by: schadd on April 30, 2017, 06:53:33 pm
fake hammer: twm
Title: Re: M98: Русская Mafia (Day 2)
Post by: schadd on April 30, 2017, 06:53:40 pm
react please
Title: Re: M98: Русская Mafia (Day 2)
Post by: gkrieg13 on April 30, 2017, 07:06:16 pm
My goal is to be voting scum at the end of each day. So I'm not changing my vote.
Title: Re: M98: Русская Mafia (Day 2)
Post by: schadd on April 30, 2017, 07:08:30 pm
cool
Title: Re: M98: Русская Mafia (Day 2)
Post by: schadd on April 30, 2017, 07:09:02 pm
shouldn't your goal be to lynch that person?
Title: Re: M98: Русская Mafia (Day 2)
Post by: The_Wine_Merchant on April 30, 2017, 07:11:12 pm
fake hammer: twm
:-X
Title: Re: M98: Русская Mafia (Day 2)
Post by: schadd on April 30, 2017, 07:22:33 pm
bad reaction


fake hammer: twm
Title: Re: M98: Русская Mafia (Day 2)
Post by: The_Wine_Merchant on April 30, 2017, 07:25:26 pm
fake hammer: twm
8)?
Title: Re: M98: Русская Mafia (Day 2)
Post by: schadd on April 30, 2017, 07:27:05 pm
real hammer: twm
Title: Re: M98: Русская Mafia (Day 2)
Post by: The_Wine_Merchant on April 30, 2017, 07:28:44 pm
real hammer: twm
:-*??
Title: Re: M98: Русская Mafia (Day 2)
Post by: schadd on April 30, 2017, 07:32:28 pm
what is your opinion on robz
Title: Re: M98: Русская Mafia (Day 2)
Post by: The_Wine_Merchant on April 30, 2017, 07:33:35 pm
what is your opinion on robz
Slightly scummy. Less so than others. Should probably be given a chance to decide if he wants to switch to kkrieg before you hammer me for realz.
Title: Re: M98: Русская Mafia (Day 2)
Post by: schadd on April 30, 2017, 07:36:23 pm
that's all i needed to hear


final, real hammer: twm
Title: Re: M98: Русская Mafia (Day 2)
Post by: The_Wine_Merchant on April 30, 2017, 07:39:41 pm
final, real hammer: twm
:o???
Title: Re: M98: Русская Mafia (Day 2)
Post by: schadd on April 30, 2017, 07:44:52 pm
should i vote u?
Title: Re: M98: Русская Mafia (Day 2)
Post by: The_Wine_Merchant on April 30, 2017, 07:45:47 pm
should i vote u?
No.
Title: Re: M98: Русская Mafia (Day 2)
Post by: schadd on April 30, 2017, 07:46:16 pm
porq?
Title: Re: M98: Русская Mafia (Day 2)
Post by: The_Wine_Merchant on April 30, 2017, 07:48:34 pm
porq?
(https://encrypted-tbn3.gstatic.com/images?q=tbn:ANd9GcTwRQqfc9u0WWKaanpCRw4qTc1-RsCvypy0kz_Yf-Ta7ZctDyhl6mFweNE)
Title: Re: M98: Русская Mafia (Day 2)
Post by: schadd on April 30, 2017, 07:49:12 pm
thin ice.
Title: Re: M98: Русская Mafia (Day 2)
Post by: schadd on April 30, 2017, 07:53:58 pm
(http://i.imgur.com/wMxowey.png)
Title: Re: M98: Русская Mafia (Day 2)
Post by: The_Wine_Merchant on April 30, 2017, 07:55:58 pm
thin ice.
(http://www.pembinavalleyonline.com/images/stories/NEWS/Altona/altona_thin_ice1.JPG)
Title: Re: M98: Русская Mafia (Day 2)
Post by: schadd on April 30, 2017, 07:57:07 pm
i totally can & totally would. why shouldn't i vote you?
Title: Re: M98: Русская Mafia (Day 2)
Post by: The_Wine_Merchant on April 30, 2017, 07:58:04 pm
i totally can & totally would. why shouldn't i vote you?
Lots of posts explaining this in the thread. Feel free to look them up.
Title: Re: M98: Русская Mafia (Day 2)
Post by: schadd on April 30, 2017, 07:59:56 pm
yes i've been reading the thread. i want to hear what your current answer to the question is
Title: Re: M98: Русская Mafia (Day 2)
Post by: The_Wine_Merchant on April 30, 2017, 08:00:05 pm
But this one in particular:

Ian so totally town that you all should see it and if you don't then you are a dumb dumb dumb dumb dumb
Title: Re: M98: Русская Mafia (Day 2)
Post by: The_Wine_Merchant on April 30, 2017, 08:00:31 pm
yes i've been reading the thread. i want to hear what your current answer to the question is
My answer is the same. If you have a specific question about what I posted earlier, feel free to ask.
Title: Re: M98: Русская Mafia (Day 2)
Post by: schadd on April 30, 2017, 08:00:52 pm
same as what?
Title: Re: M98: Русская Mafia (Day 2)
Post by: The_Wine_Merchant on April 30, 2017, 08:02:44 pm
same as what?
Same as all my posts in this thread. I am not going to say anything new or different that I haven't said already. If you thought my responses were inadequate before, they will be inadequate now.
Title: Re: M98: Русская Mafia (Day 2)
Post by: schadd on April 30, 2017, 08:06:59 pm
let it be inadequate then. i would like a summary


how about:
-do you think it is impossible that i change my mind right now?
-do you think you have played well this game?
Title: Re: M98: Русская Mafia (Day 2)
Post by: Robz888 on April 30, 2017, 08:10:59 pm
I'm sort of losing confidence in either TWM or kkrieg flipping scum. I don't know, TWM's righteous indignation about being suspected is all of a sudden feeling more townie to me. And when I called kkrieg out for not voting TWM yet, her reaction seemed pretty townie to me.

But I don't what the next best option would be.
Title: Re: M98: Русская Mafia (Day 2)
Post by: Robz888 on April 30, 2017, 08:11:48 pm
Actually it's very possible schadd is the next best option. I sort of totally forgot about schadd here, which is not something that usually happens.
Title: Re: M98: Русская Mafia (Day 2)
Post by: Robz888 on April 30, 2017, 08:11:57 pm
I should unvote
Title: Re: M98: Русская Mafia (Day 2)
Post by: schadd on April 30, 2017, 08:12:40 pm
was i bussing again?
Title: Re: M98: Русская Mafia (Day 2)
Post by: The_Wine_Merchant on April 30, 2017, 08:12:50 pm
-do you think it is impossible that i change my mind right now?
If you are town then I think you can change your mind. I think it unlikely given your attitude toward me.

If you are mafia I don't see you pretending to change your mind. I think you go through the motions here of pretending to be open minded and then hammer me regardless of what I say.

I don't know which of those above is more likely. Probably the top one.
-do you think you have played well this game?
I think I already answered this. But no, I have not played well. I should have stayed on mcmc and not been duped by his claim. I should have not thought more highly of myself and thinking I was townier than I actually was. I shouldn't have gotten into silly arguments with faust at the beginning of the day.

But after that I feel I have played decent in trying to argue against my lynch and toward others who I think would be better. That Andrew and 2.7 agree with me makes me feel good. But obviously getting only 2 out of 9 players to agree with you isn't exactly a great stat. So I guess it depends if I end up being right about faust and Robz and now kkrieg.
Title: Re: M98: Русская Mafia (Day 2)
Post by: Robz888 on April 30, 2017, 08:14:21 pm
In schadd's recent interactions with TWM, it looks like he's trying to get TWM to slip up in some way, thus justifying a vote that hopefully (from schadd's POV) won't looking scummy even after TWM's flip.
Title: Re: M98: Русская Mafia (Day 2)
Post by: The_Wine_Merchant on April 30, 2017, 08:15:29 pm
A faust vote is better than a schadd vote.
Title: Re: M98: Русская Mafia (Day 2)
Post by: Robz888 on April 30, 2017, 08:16:18 pm
A faust vote is better than a schadd vote.

Nah, I'd rather lynch you than faust.
Title: Re: M98: Русская Mafia (Day 2)
Post by: schadd on April 30, 2017, 08:24:04 pm
In schadd's recent interactions with TWM, it looks like he's trying to get TWM to slip up in some way, thus justifying a vote that hopefully (from schadd's POV) won't looking scummy even after TWM's flip.
what might qualify as a slip up?
Title: Re: M98: Русская Mafia (Day 2)
Post by: schadd on April 30, 2017, 08:24:41 pm
and how do you know i'm not town looking for such a slip up
Title: Re: M98: Русская Mafia (Day 2)
Post by: Robz888 on April 30, 2017, 08:31:15 pm
In schadd's recent interactions with TWM, it looks like he's trying to get TWM to slip up in some way, thus justifying a vote that hopefully (from schadd's POV) won't looking scummy even after TWM's flip.
what might qualify as a slip up?

Not sure, TWM just saying something kind of scummy and you going, "I was on the fence before, but not I will vote for you for this," and then later you'll say, "Well, he did do X." I don't know. Like you want to vote for TWM, but you need him to screw up worse first.
Title: Re: M98: Русская Mafia (Day 2)
Post by: Robz888 on April 30, 2017, 08:31:28 pm
Maybe I'm not making any sense.
Title: Re: M98: Русская Mafia (Day 2)
Post by: schadd on April 30, 2017, 08:31:59 pm
you mean like responding to a question with a picture of a pig?
Title: Re: M98: Русская Mafia (Day 2)
Post by: The_Wine_Merchant on April 30, 2017, 08:42:26 pm
you mean like responding to a question with a picture of a pig?
You said pork. That isn't a question.
Title: Re: M98: Русская Mafia (Day 2)
Post by: schadd on April 30, 2017, 08:42:52 pm
i said porq
Title: Re: M98: Русская Mafia (Day 2)
Post by: The_Wine_Merchant on April 30, 2017, 08:43:39 pm
i said porq
I have no idea what that means. I thought you had a typo.
Title: Re: M98: Русская Mafia (Day 2)
Post by: schadd on April 30, 2017, 08:44:25 pm
i also didn't actually think much of it at the time. but saying i could have claimed to


q key isn't next to k key in any keyboard layout
Title: Re: M98: Русская Mafia (Day 2)
Post by: schadd on April 30, 2017, 08:44:53 pm
porque, porquois are both questions i like to ask
Title: Re: M98: Русская Mafia (Day 2)
Post by: schadd on April 30, 2017, 08:45:15 pm
i have tended toward the latter lately because french is kinda cool
Title: Re: M98: Русская Mafia (Day 2)
Post by: The_Wine_Merchant on April 30, 2017, 08:45:58 pm
Dude. Don't blame me that half of your posts are complete nonsense. You want to communicate with me, learn some communication skills.
Title: Re: M98: Русская Mafia (Day 2)
Post by: schadd on April 30, 2017, 08:46:48 pm
i wasn't blaming you
Title: Re: M98: Русская Mafia (Day 2)
Post by: The_Wine_Merchant on April 30, 2017, 08:47:31 pm
you mean like responding to a question with a picture of a pig?
Title: Re: M98: Русская Mafia (Day 2)
Post by: schadd on April 30, 2017, 08:48:16 pm
i also didn't actually think much of it at the time. but saying i could have claimed to
Title: Re: M98: Русская Mafia (Day 2)
Post by: The_Wine_Merchant on April 30, 2017, 08:48:53 pm
Hey Robz.

vote: schadd
Title: Re: M98: Русская Mafia (Day 2)
Post by: schadd on April 30, 2017, 08:49:21 pm
i bet
Title: Re: M98: Русская Mafia (Day 2)
Post by: Robz888 on April 30, 2017, 09:00:45 pm
Vote: schadd
Title: Re: M98: Русская Mafia (Day 2)
Post by: schadd on April 30, 2017, 09:02:08 pm
yeah
Title: Re: M98: Русская Mafia (Day 2)
Post by: kkrieg on April 30, 2017, 09:24:36 pm
I'm sort of losing confidence in either TWM or kkrieg flipping scum. I don't know, TWM's righteous indignation about being suspected is all of a sudden feeling more townie to me. And when I called kkrieg out for not voting TWM yet, her reaction seemed pretty townie to me.

But I don't what the next best option would be.
I honestly don't feel great about TWM vote. I wasn't voting him originally because I think voting scum is better than having the attitude of "voting anyone as long as it isn't me." But I'm currently voting him because we need to lynch someone to get this game moving.

What are some scummy points on schadd?
Title: Re: M98: Русская Mafia (Day 2)
Post by: Robz888 on April 30, 2017, 10:00:03 pm
The problem here is I am predisposed to find schadd's weird humor scummy, even though it's not really alignment indicative for him.
Title: Re: M98: Русская Mafia (Day 2)
Post by: schadd on April 30, 2017, 10:15:45 pm
i'm pretty sure i have done other stuff. whether or not you should find my sense of humor scummy is not a dichotomy i think will be helpful
Title: Re: M98: Русская Mafia (Day 2)
Post by: The_Wine_Merchant on April 30, 2017, 10:40:41 pm
The problem here is I am predisposed to find schadd's weird humor scummy, even though it's not really alignment indicative for him.
This is a problem.

vote: faust
Title: Re: M98: Русская Mafia (Day 2)
Post by: faust on May 01, 2017, 04:42:01 am
Why has everyone been ignoring my Eevee reread?
Title: Re: M98: Русская Mafia (Day 2)
Post by: faust on May 01, 2017, 04:42:47 am
In particular I'm confused about Robz, who wanted some attention on Eevee and who's currently looking for an alternative lynch.
Title: Re: M98: Русская Mafia (Day 2)
Post by: faust on May 01, 2017, 04:55:28 am
I'm sort of losing confidence in either TWM or kkrieg flipping scum. I don't know, TWM's righteous indignation about being suspected is all of a sudden feeling more townie to me. And when I called kkrieg out for not voting TWM yet, her reaction seemed pretty townie to me.

But I don't what the next best option would be.
I honestly don't feel great about TWM vote. I wasn't voting him originally because I think voting scum is better than having the attitude of "voting anyone as long as it isn't me." But I'm currently voting him because we need to lynch someone to get this game moving.

What are some scummy points on schadd?
I thought you're voting for him because you think he's scummy:
Do you think I am scummy? If you do, you should vote for me. Commit to that read.
Okkkkkk. Vote: TWM.
L-1 I believe.
Title: Re: M98: Русская Mafia (Day 2)
Post by: Robz888 on May 01, 2017, 08:46:17 am
In particular I'm confused about Robz, who wanted some attention on Eevee and who's currently looking for an alternative lynch.

If the conclusion of your Eevee read was "Eevee is suspicious" than I misread it.
Title: Re: M98: Русская Mafia (Day 2)
Post by: schadd on May 01, 2017, 09:21:50 am
faust can u give a readlist?
Title: Re: M98: Русская Mafia (Day 2)
Post by: faust on May 01, 2017, 10:44:34 am
In particular I'm confused about Robz, who wanted some attention on Eevee and who's currently looking for an alternative lynch.

If the conclusion of your Eevee read was "Eevee is suspicious" than I misread it.
I suppose you did. Not sure how ou could read that and conclude otherwise.
Title: Re: M98: Русская Mafia (Day 2)
Post by: faust on May 01, 2017, 10:45:15 am
faust can u give a readlist?
Sure; it may have to wait until tomorrow.
Title: Re: M98: Русская Mafia (Day 2)
Post by: Robz888 on May 01, 2017, 11:35:55 am
In particular I'm confused about Robz, who wanted some attention on Eevee and who's currently looking for an alternative lynch.

If the conclusion of your Eevee read was "Eevee is suspicious" than I misread it.
I suppose you did. Not sure how ou could read that and conclude otherwise.

Well you said you didn't think Eevee was likely to be the SK, which I think doesn't make him the best lynch right now.
Title: Re: M98: Русская Mafia (Day 2)
Post by: The_Wine_Merchant on May 01, 2017, 12:00:23 pm
Jesus. I just typed and sent lynch instead of lunch in a work e-mail to the boss of my boss.

Thanks a lot mafia.
Title: Re: M98: Русская Mafia (Day 2)
Post by: Eevee on May 01, 2017, 12:52:46 pm
Sorry for being absent, first of may is a huge national holiday in finland, haven't been to the internet at all. And before that, the forums weren't working.
I think schadd has a playstyle where he can easily become really obviously town when he is town, so the fact he is not looking obviously towny now kind of does make him more likely to be scum. I wasn't really even thinking about it until it got brought up, has anyone suspected schadd much this game? I feel he has been very present, but not really much in opposition with anyone.
Title: Re: M98: Русская Mafia (Day 2)
Post by: Robz888 on May 01, 2017, 12:55:13 pm
I think schadd has a playstyle where he can easily become really obviously town when he is town, so the fact he is not looking obviously towny now kind of does make him more likely to be scum. I wasn't really even thinking about it until it got brought up, has anyone suspected schadd much this game? I feel he has been very present, but not really much in opposition with anyone.

Yes, I agree with this.
Title: Re: M98: Русская Mafia (Day 2)
Post by: faust on May 01, 2017, 01:01:37 pm
In particular I'm confused about Robz, who wanted some attention on Eevee and who's currently looking for an alternative lynch.

If the conclusion of your Eevee read was "Eevee is suspicious" than I misread it.
I suppose you did. Not sure how ou could read that and conclude otherwise.

Well you said you didn't think Eevee was likely to be the SK, which I think doesn't make him the best lynch right now.
So you think schadd is the SK? Why?
Title: Re: M98: Русская Mafia (Day 2)
Post by: Robz888 on May 01, 2017, 01:12:05 pm
In particular I'm confused about Robz, who wanted some attention on Eevee and who's currently looking for an alternative lynch.

If the conclusion of your Eevee read was "Eevee is suspicious" than I misread it.
I suppose you did. Not sure how ou could read that and conclude otherwise.

Well you said you didn't think Eevee was likely to be the SK, which I think doesn't make him the best lynch right now.
So you think schadd is the SK? Why?

What I meant is we should lynch someone who has some likelihood to be either SK or mafia, not that we should specifically try to lynch the SK.
Title: Re: M98: Русская Mafia (Day 2)
Post by: The_Wine_Merchant on May 01, 2017, 01:17:41 pm
has anyone suspected schadd much this game? I feel he has been very present, but not really much in opposition with anyone.
Oh! I have! Never really got much going though.
Title: Re: M98: Русская Mafia (Day 2)
Post by: LaLight on May 01, 2017, 03:30:45 pm
Vote count 2.5
The_Wine_Merchant (3): faust, Eevee, kkrieg
faust (2): AndrewisFTTW, The_Wine_Merchant
kkrieg (2): gkrieg13, 2,71828.....
schadd (1): Robz888
Not voting (1): schadd

With 9 alive it takes 5 to lynch. Day 2 ends Wednesday, 3rd of May at 4 am FT.
Title: Re: M98: Русская Mafia (Day 2)
Post by: gkrieg13 on May 01, 2017, 03:39:35 pm
kkrieg is where it is at people!  Just reread her D1, and her regard to the mcmc wagon!  I may just post those posts here in a bit for ease of rereading.
Title: Re: M98: Русская Mafia (Day 2)
Post by: faust on May 01, 2017, 03:52:53 pm
In particular I'm confused about Robz, who wanted some attention on Eevee and who's currently looking for an alternative lynch.

If the conclusion of your Eevee read was "Eevee is suspicious" than I misread it.
I suppose you did. Not sure how ou could read that and conclude otherwise.

Well you said you didn't think Eevee was likely to be the SK, which I think doesn't make him the best lynch right now.
So you think schadd is the SK? Why?

What I meant is we should lynch someone who has some likelihood to be either SK or mafia, not that we should specifically try to lynch the SK.

I think we should lynch the player who is most likely to flip scum, no matter the actual role. If someone is 90% mafia and 0% SK; that's completely fine.

Still not sure why schadd is a thing
Title: Re: M98: Русская Mafia (Day 2)
Post by: Robz888 on May 01, 2017, 04:12:31 pm
In particular I'm confused about Robz, who wanted some attention on Eevee and who's currently looking for an alternative lynch.

If the conclusion of your Eevee read was "Eevee is suspicious" than I misread it.
I suppose you did. Not sure how ou could read that and conclude otherwise.

Well you said you didn't think Eevee was likely to be the SK, which I think doesn't make him the best lynch right now.
So you think schadd is the SK? Why?

What I meant is we should lynch someone who has some likelihood to be either SK or mafia, not that we should specifically try to lynch the SK.

I think we should lynch the player who is most likely to flip scum, no matter the actual role. If someone is 90% mafia and 0% SK; that's completely fine.

Still not sure why schadd is a thing

If someone else is maybe 50% likely to flip mafia and 45% likely to flip SK, we should lynch that person, no?  I'm absolutely the worst at math, though.

Schadd is a thing for the exact reason Eevee said.
Title: Re: M98: Русская Mafia (Day 2)
Post by: kkrieg on May 01, 2017, 04:19:06 pm

I thought you're voting for him because you think he's scummy:
[/quote]

I do think he's scummy I'm just not confident about it. Also hadn't thought about Scadd at all
Title: Re: M98: Русская Mafia (Day 2)
Post by: kkrieg on May 01, 2017, 04:19:20 pm
Quote fail
Title: Re: M98: Русская Mafia (Day 2)
Post by: The_Wine_Merchant on May 01, 2017, 04:22:22 pm
schadd I think might be worth looking at more tomorrow. I don't want to lynch him today. Probably same with Eevee.
Title: Re: M98: Русская Mafia (Day 2)
Post by: Robz888 on May 01, 2017, 04:23:46 pm
schadd I think might be worth looking at more tomorrow. I don't want to lynch him today. Probably same with Eevee.

Am I not worth looking at tomorrow, from your perspective? I'm actually baffled to be receiving so little suspicion. I don't know it means.

It arguably points to newbie scum, I suppose. Might push me to vote kkrieg.
Title: Re: M98: Русская Mafia (Day 2)
Post by: kkrieg on May 01, 2017, 04:31:18 pm
schadd I think might be worth looking at more tomorrow. I don't want to lynch him today. Probably same with Eevee.

Am I not worth looking at tomorrow, from your perspective? I'm actually baffled to be receiving so little suspicion. I don't know it means.

It arguably points to newbie scum, I suppose. Might push me to vote kkrieg.
If I ever play mafia and am scum, I sure hope I play a better game than whatever game I'm playing now as town.
Title: Re: M98: Русская Mafia (Day 2)
Post by: AndrewisFTTW on May 01, 2017, 04:31:28 pm
Ok I'm all caught up now. I'm pretty confident TWM is town. I think Robz is town too for second guessing himself on TWM's lynch and unvoting. Town!Robz second guesses himself a lot I think. schadd I can't read whatsoever. I'd like to see which posts gkrieg is referring to in terms of kkrieg's interactions with mcmc. Feeling less sure about faust but I'll keep my vote there for now.
Title: Re: M98: Русская Mafia (Day 2)
Post by: faust on May 01, 2017, 04:32:44 pm
schadd I think might be worth looking at more tomorrow. I don't want to lynch him today. Probably same with Eevee.

Am I not worth looking at tomorrow, from your perspective? I'm actually baffled to be receiving so little suspicion. I don't know it means.

It arguably points to newbie scum, I suppose. Might push me to vote kkrieg.
I have been forced to accept that lackluster play is a town tell for you.
Title: Re: M98: Русская Mafia (Day 2)
Post by: faust on May 01, 2017, 04:35:10 pm
If someone else is maybe 50% likely to flip mafia and 45% likely to flip SK, we should lynch that person, no?  I'm absolutely the worst at math, though.

Schadd is a thing for the exact reason Eevee said.
True.

Yet the evidence on Eevee makes him significantly more likely to be scum than someone could be because they're "very present, yet not in opposition to anyone".
Title: Re: M98: Русская Mafia (Day 2)
Post by: Robz888 on May 01, 2017, 04:35:31 pm
schadd I think might be worth looking at more tomorrow. I don't want to lynch him today. Probably same with Eevee.

Am I not worth looking at tomorrow, from your perspective? I'm actually baffled to be receiving so little suspicion. I don't know it means.

It arguably points to newbie scum, I suppose. Might push me to vote kkrieg.
I have been forced to accept that lackluster play is a town tell for you.

Sweet, thanks! Hey wait...
Title: Re: M98: Русская Mafia (Day 2)
Post by: The_Wine_Merchant on May 01, 2017, 05:07:00 pm
schadd I think might be worth looking at more tomorrow. I don't want to lynch him today. Probably same with Eevee.

Am I not worth looking at tomorrow, from your perspective? I'm actually baffled to be receiving so little suspicion. I don't know it means.

It arguably points to newbie scum, I suppose. Might push me to vote kkrieg.
You most certainly are. But we were talking specifically about people who had just started receiving suspicion today (Eevee and schadd). You didn't fall into that group as no one wants to talk about you except for yourself apparently.
Title: Re: M98: Русская Mafia (Day 2)
Post by: 2.71828..... on May 01, 2017, 07:16:50 pm
schadd I think might be worth looking at more tomorrow. I don't want to lynch him today. Probably same with Eevee.

Am I not worth looking at tomorrow, from your perspective? I'm actually baffled to be receiving so little suspicion. I don't know it means.

It arguably points to newbie scum, I suppose. Might push me to vote kkrieg.
I have been forced to accept that lackluster play is a town tell for you.

Yeah, until D3/D4 rolls around. Once Robz figures (or thinks he has figured) things out he becomes quite active and useful
Title: Re: M98: Русская Mafia (Day 1)
Post by: gkrieg13 on May 01, 2017, 08:01:48 pm
Keep in mind it's his birthday, I don't know if he'll be around. Are we really comfortable lynching him without a claim? I mean, I would rather lynch him than get lynched myself, but objectively, I don't know if that's the smartest thing,

I am sort of inclined to go after one of the mcmc pile-on ers. But maybe avoiding mcmc's wagon was the safest thing for scum to do.

This just feels like genuinely busy mcmc to me, him actually being what he says makes a lot of sense. The problem is I don't have a great alternative candidate...

I mean if all we can do is lynch mcmc or no one, I will vote for mcmc befoere I go to sleep in about 2 hrs
I agree with this.

hey gkrieg I know you're online what do you think about awaclus?

how about you talk about why you are voting awaclus pleeeeez

He's a person who isn't a townread.

Only three more for the mcmcsalot wagon to go!  Any takers?  Kkrieg, why do you think Awaclus is a better lynch than mcmcsalot?
babe you know it's past my bedtime don't ask hard questions

he reacted pretty quickly to my initial kinda random vote at him
he hasn't been particularly helpful
he jumped on the mcmc train

honestly my reasons are weak but heyy it is day 1

Ok, so these are the posts that I feel pushed from mcmc to Andrew.  I think Robz is pretty solidly partnery, and the fact that kkrieg didn't trust my reads is a little shady.  I really think she would go to the effort to at least tell me why mcmcsalot was townie, instead of just telling me why she thought Awaclus was scummy.  The reasoning to stay on the Awa wagon are SUPER weak.  Like none of them are scummy at all. 

The fact that she stayed on Awaclus instead of switching to mcmcsalot with those reasons (and not giving reasons why mcmc was townier than Awa) is really scummy from her.  She generally trusts me a lot more in social deduction games.
Title: Re: M98: Русская Mafia (Day 2)
Post by: The_Wine_Merchant on May 01, 2017, 08:27:29 pm
I have a hard time trusting this in completion as you didn't include my posts.

My post 482:

Well shit, now this feels mislynchy.

And post 497:

I am here, ish. I like mcmcsalot more than Andrew and 2.7. But I am not as enamored as I was. Awaclus was a mcmcsalot pile oner.

Are right between the posts of Robz and kkrieg (475-528)

Also just happened to see this right after my 482 from schadd:

it does, but mcmc is a good scum player

schadd isn't mcmc's partner. He isn't going to be talking me into a lynch right after I express an opinion that I want to avoid it and then further tries to put the brakes on the Awaclus wagon:

i mean, someone that makes a point of obscuring his reasoning shouldn't be the d1 lynch because of his shoddy reasoning. what do we have on him?

Sorry I missed this before, but I am putting schadd up there along with 2.7 and gkrieg of not mcmc's partner. (This conclusion totally overrode the original intent of this post, but I guess it was worth it).
Title: Re: M98: Русская Mafia (Day 2)
Post by: gkrieg13 on May 01, 2017, 08:36:15 pm
I didn't include your posts because I was trying to make people go back and reread the end of the day themselves. 

Your post also says nothing about the conclusions I made.
Title: Re: M98: Русская Mafia (Day 2)
Post by: 2.71828..... on May 01, 2017, 09:06:37 pm
I didn't include your posts because I was trying to make people go back and reread the end of the day themselves. 

Your post also says nothing about the conclusions I made.

Yeah, not sure what TWM was trying to prove, the conclusion of the matter is that everyone should be voting kkrieg, nor that TWM is town or scum (at least that's what I got)
Title: Re: M98: Русская Mafia (Day 2)
Post by: The_Wine_Merchant on May 01, 2017, 09:17:03 pm
I didn't include your posts because I was trying to make people go back and reread the end of the day themselves. 

Your post also says nothing about the conclusions I made.
Then I misunderstood your intent. I just read what you had put down and knew there were somethings that were missing from it.
Title: Re: M98: Русская Mafia (Day 2)
Post by: The_Wine_Merchant on May 01, 2017, 09:21:17 pm
I guess I don't love that I am relying on your understanding of kkrieg, which I don't have, to base much of this read. But, then again, I think kkrieg could easily state that it wasn't a fair assessment of you (and probably not something that you would want to do anyways to maintain marital harmony).

So yeah. I am still in the lynching kkrieg isn't a bad idea camp, but I don't completely share your complete confidence.
Title: Re: M98: Русская Mafia (Day 2)
Post by: Robz888 on May 01, 2017, 11:15:25 pm
Alright, Vote: Kkrieg. Gkrieg telling us to vote for her matters, and also, she's a relative newbie who might have shot mcmc (as SK), but could also be a mcmc partner.
Title: Re: M98: Русская Mafia (Day 2)
Post by: The_Wine_Merchant on May 01, 2017, 11:22:47 pm
vote: kkrieg

That should be L-1
Title: Re: M98: Русская Mafia (Day 2)
Post by: gkrieg13 on May 02, 2017, 12:06:42 am
Also now that newbie mafia is over, I can say that she looks a lot different here than she did there.
Title: Re: M98: Русская Mafia (Day 2)
Post by: schadd on May 02, 2017, 12:11:45 am
how so
Title: Re: M98: Русская Mafia (Day 2)
Post by: kkrieg on May 02, 2017, 12:14:39 am
guys I was literally making gkrieg dinner and cookies while he was throwing me under the bus haha.


I've tried not to be too defensive because I really didn't think people would want to lynch me today. I disagree with gkrieg; I think I am playing similarly to the last game. Both games I have had nothing interesting to say and no strong reads at the beginning of the game. I need more time and less people to keep track of before being confident in my reads.


I may actually be a good town lynch (if that's a thing) to reveal gkrieg as scummy (or whatever not town role he is).


What do you guys want me to do? At what point do you want me to claim?
Title: Re: M98: Русская Mafia (Day 2)
Post by: gkrieg13 on May 02, 2017, 12:16:05 am
Even by D2, you had some pretty strong reads in either direction. 

In this game, I haven't seen very much at all from you in way of reads.
Title: Re: M98: Русская Mafia (Day 2)
Post by: gkrieg13 on May 02, 2017, 12:17:08 am
guys I was literally making gkrieg dinner and cookies while he was throwing me under the bus haha.


I've tried not to be too defensive because I really didn't think people would want to lynch me today. I disagree with gkrieg; I think I am playing similarly to the last game. Both games I have had nothing interesting to say and no strong reads at the beginning of the game. I need more time and less people to keep track of before being confident in my reads.


I may actually be a good town lynch (if that's a thing) to reveal gkrieg as scummy (or whatever not town role he is).


What do you guys want me to do? At what point do you want me to claim?

Also are you saying I'm scummy for finding you scummy?  What about the other points in my post above about you not wanting to switch your vote from Awaclus to mcmcsalot?
Title: Re: M98: Русская Mafia (Day 2)
Post by: kkrieg on May 02, 2017, 12:17:49 am
Even by D2, you had some pretty strong reads in either direction. 

In this game, I haven't seen very much at all from you in way of reads.
This game is much more complicated in setup than the newbie game. That makes it hard for me to follow all the role and relationship possibilities.
Title: Re: M98: Русская Mafia (Day 2)
Post by: schadd on May 02, 2017, 12:18:15 am
fake hammer: kkrieg
Title: Re: M98: Русская Mafia (Day 2)
Post by: gkrieg13 on May 02, 2017, 12:18:52 am
I also know that you had many interesting things to say last time, and did much more rereading and such after LaLight was killed to find the other scum.  It seems like you aren't really trying as hard this game.

And part of it is really the fact that you wouldn't sheep me onto scum D1.  I think you would've as town.
Title: Re: M98: Русская Mafia (Day 2)
Post by: gkrieg13 on May 02, 2017, 12:19:22 am
Even by D2, you had some pretty strong reads in either direction. 

In this game, I haven't seen very much at all from you in way of reads.
This game is much more complicated in setup than the newbie game. That makes it hard for me to follow all the role and relationship possibilities.

But even then you should still have reads on people.  Even your Awaclus vote was pretty weak.
Title: Re: M98: Русская Mafia (Day 2)
Post by: kkrieg on May 02, 2017, 12:19:33 am
fake hammer: kkrieg
But for real please don't hammer. Is anyone interested in me claiming?
Title: Re: M98: Русская Mafia (Day 2)
Post by: schadd on May 02, 2017, 12:20:59 am
forreal hammer: kkrieg


not especially interested, no
Title: Re: M98: Русская Mafia (Day 2)
Post by: kkrieg on May 02, 2017, 12:21:35 am
Even by D2, you had some pretty strong reads in either direction. 

In this game, I haven't seen very much at all from you in way of reads.
This game is much more complicated in setup than the newbie game. That makes it hard for me to follow all the role and relationship possibilities.

But even then you should still have reads on people.  Even your Awaclus vote was pretty weak.
It was pretty weak. I think I even said that when I listed my reasons.

guys I was literally making gkrieg dinner and cookies while he was throwing me under the bus haha.


I've tried not to be too defensive because I really didn't think people would want to lynch me today. I disagree with gkrieg; I think I am playing similarly to the last game. Both games I have had nothing interesting to say and no strong reads at the beginning of the game. I need more time and less people to keep track of before being confident in my reads.


I may actually be a good town lynch (if that's a thing) to reveal gkrieg as scummy (or whatever not town role he is).


What do you guys want me to do? At what point do you want me to claim?

Also are you saying I'm scummy for finding you scummy?  What about the other points in my post above about you not wanting to switch your vote from Awaclus to mcmcsalot?
I believed mcmcs claim as vanilla town.
Title: Re: M98: Русская Mafia (Day 2)
Post by: 2.71828..... on May 02, 2017, 12:21:38 am
Also, now that newbie mafia is over, my interaction with TWM in that game is heavily influencing my town read on TWM in this game
Title: Re: M98: Русская Mafia (Day 2)
Post by: schadd on May 02, 2017, 12:22:34 am
how so
Title: Re: M98: Русская Mafia (Day 2)
Post by: 2.71828..... on May 02, 2017, 12:23:03 am
fake hammer: kkrieg
But for real please don't hammer. Is anyone interested in me claiming?

What, you have a fake claim all ready just waiting for someone to ask you to claim?
Title: Re: M98: Русская Mafia (Day 2)
Post by: kkrieg on May 02, 2017, 12:24:10 am
forreal hammer: kkrieg


not especially interested, no
That's fine; I am interested in me claiming.

fake hammer: kkrieg
But for real please don't hammer. Is anyone interested in me claiming?

What, you have a fake claim all ready just waiting for someone to ask you to claim?
No I actually thought my role was really cool and want to tell everyone about it.

I am the one shot commuter.
Title: Re: M98: Русская Mafia (Day 2)
Post by: schadd on May 02, 2017, 12:26:03 am
kool
Title: Re: M98: Русская Mafia (Day 2)
Post by: 2.71828..... on May 02, 2017, 12:26:40 am
kool

Unvote
Title: Re: M98: Русская Mafia (Day 2)
Post by: gkrieg13 on May 02, 2017, 12:27:23 am
gut feel vote: Awalcus

I'm probably a lurker right now huh?
Faust seems fairly towny which makes me want to jump on the e train.

I don't have any strong scum reads, but I don't think Robz is.

I'd be ok with Awaclus or Andrew

Only three more for the mcmcsalot wagon to go!  Any takers?  Kkrieg, why do you think Awaclus is a better lynch than mcmcsalot?
babe you know it's past my bedtime don't ask hard questions

he reacted pretty quickly to my initial kinda random vote at him
he hasn't been particularly helpful
he jumped on the mcmc train

honestly my reasons are weak but heyy it is day 1

Oh go away for a little bit.

You are obviously going to be able to win any argument that I put at you because you are better at twisting words and using select quotes and appealing to emotions in a way that people still like you at the end of it.

So I am not even going to try and get frustrated with you. I'll put up some stuff later today (today as in today in this game by the way, like Saturday or Sunday) as long as I don't get lynched.

Then you can just totally demolish it and get everyone to ignore it.

Uh I'm really surprised you are so touchy about this. Say why doing what you did D 1 is townie. Also I know kkrieg was online and could've voted mcmcsalot. vote: kkrieg
Yea I won't deny that. I could have switched my vote but I honestly thought Awaclus was scummier than mcmc.

Leaning toward a TWM vote right now.

Does town win if the SK is still alive?

I think gkrieg could be scummy. He is pretty accurate at reading me IRL. I think he knows I'm not scum and yet he's voting for me. Granted I am crap at reading gkrieg so you never know.


I think we would keep a lower profile.

I kinda agree with this. I think scum has reason to either lay low (like e, maybe eevee) or be super defensive (like twm)

Do you think I am scummy? If you do, you should vote for me. Commit to that read.
Okkkkkk. Vote: TWM.
L-1 I believe.

I'm sort of losing confidence in either TWM or kkrieg flipping scum. I don't know, TWM's righteous indignation about being suspected is all of a sudden feeling more townie to me. And when I called kkrieg out for not voting TWM yet, her reaction seemed pretty townie to me.

But I don't what the next best option would be.
I honestly don't feel great about TWM vote. I wasn't voting him originally because I think voting scum is better than having the attitude of "voting anyone as long as it isn't me." But I'm currently voting him because we need to lynch someone to get this game moving.

What are some scummy points on schadd?

So here are all of kkrieg's posts that have some sort of read in them (I'm pretty sure I didn't miss anything).  She has 34 posts this game, and if you look at these, they are very flimsy reads.  She uses the words leaning and phrases like "yea I won't deny that".  Those are hedgy posts.

And that post for reasons of Awaclus over mcmcsalot is just super weak. 

Sorry babe, you're scum! :)
Title: Re: M98: Русская Mafia (Day 2)
Post by: schadd on May 02, 2017, 12:28:14 am
ha
Title: Re: M98: Русская Mafia (Day 2)
Post by: 2.71828..... on May 02, 2017, 12:28:22 am
The question that obviously follows is of you commuted or not, but I really don't think you should answer that question. Although it could be extremely relevant due to the no kill last night.
Title: Re: M98: Русская Mafia (Day 2)
Post by: kkrieg on May 02, 2017, 12:29:25 am
She uses the words leaning and phrases like "yea I won't deny that".  Those are hedgy posts.


"Yea I won't deny that" is a much townier response than "everything you say about me is completely wrong"
Title: Re: M98: Русская Mafia (Day 2)
Post by: 2.71828..... on May 02, 2017, 12:29:38 am
Her claim is easily counterclaimed, so I am willing to believe it until such a counter
Title: Re: M98: Русская Mafia (Day 2)
Post by: schadd on May 02, 2017, 12:29:59 am
if she didn't the setup is confirmed. but we ought to wait for our fausts and our gkriegs to have a go
Title: Re: M98: Русская Mafia (Day 2)
Post by: gkrieg13 on May 02, 2017, 12:30:06 am
hmmmmm.  unvote until a counterclaim I guess. 

7. 1-shot Commuter, Jailkeeper, Detective; Traitor Knows Mafia + Serial Killer
or
1. Detective, 1-shot Commuter, Goon Cop; 1-shot Investigation Immune + Serial Killer

then.  If you are a PR not in that list, you may want to consider claiming.
Title: Re: M98: Русская Mafia (Day 2)
Post by: gkrieg13 on May 02, 2017, 12:30:38 am
The question that obviously follows is of you commuted or not, but I really don't think you should answer that question. Although it could be extremely relevant due to the no kill last night.

Uh, I think this should never be claimed.
Title: Re: M98: Русская Mafia (Day 2)
Post by: gkrieg13 on May 02, 2017, 12:31:12 am
if she didn't the setup is confirmed. but we ought to wait for our fausts and our gkriegs to have a go

??  How confirmed?
Title: Re: M98: Русская Mafia (Day 2)
Post by: schadd on May 02, 2017, 12:33:51 am
didn't commute => kill prevented by other means; only other protective to coexist is jk (and traitor rb i guess but let's hesitantly call that unlikely)
Title: Re: M98: Русская Mafia (Day 2)
Post by: Robz888 on May 02, 2017, 12:35:49 am
Okay unvote

So gkrieg was hilariously wrong about kkrieg. But this doesn't actually make me suspicious of gkrieg, who has been hilariously wrong (as town) a lot in the games I've played with him recently.
Title: Re: M98: Русская Mafia (Day 2)
Post by: schadd on May 02, 2017, 12:37:36 am
he is often hilariously right
Title: Re: M98: Русская Mafia (Day 2)
Post by: gkrieg13 on May 02, 2017, 12:37:44 am
if she didn't the setup is confirmed. but we ought to wait for our fausts and our gkriegs to have a go

??  How confirmed?
Title: Re: M98: Русская Mafia (Day 2)
Post by: gkrieg13 on May 02, 2017, 12:38:16 am
Okay unvote

So gkrieg was hilariously wrong about kkrieg. But this doesn't actually make me suspicious of gkrieg, who has been hilariously wrong (as town) a lot in the games I've played with him recently.

vote: Robz

This is what Dylan did to me in the game he was scum.  Tried to make me doubt my reads.
Title: Re: M98: Русская Mafia (Day 2)
Post by: 2.71828..... on May 02, 2017, 12:38:22 am
With that, I fairly certain I will jump back over to voting faust, but will give it some time and let everyone have a chance to post
Title: Re: M98: Русская Mafia (Day 2)
Post by: schadd on May 02, 2017, 12:38:34 am

if she didn't the setup is confirmed. but we ought to wait for our fausts and our gkriegs to have a go

??  How confirmed?
i.e. we know which setup it is
Title: Re: M98: Русская Mafia (Day 2)
Post by: gkrieg13 on May 02, 2017, 12:39:08 am
With that, I fairly certain I will jump back over to voting faust, but will give it some time and let everyone have a chance to post

Or you could read Robz and then vote for him.  My first kkrieg post has a lot of stuff about Robz and his EoD with mcmcsalot.
Title: Re: M98: Русская Mafia (Day 2)
Post by: gkrieg13 on May 02, 2017, 12:39:27 am

if she didn't the setup is confirmed. but we ought to wait for our fausts and our gkriegs to have a go

??  How confirmed?
i.e. we know which setup it is

...  How, and which setup?
Title: Re: M98: Русская Mafia (Day 2)
Post by: 2.71828..... on May 02, 2017, 12:40:33 am
if she didn't the setup is confirmed. but we ought to wait for our fausts and our gkriegs to have a go

??  How confirmed?

Only confirmed to scum, goon cop, or Jailkeeper.
Title: Re: M98: Русская Mafia (Day 2)
Post by: Robz888 on May 02, 2017, 12:41:14 am
Okay unvote

So gkrieg was hilariously wrong about kkrieg. But this doesn't actually make me suspicious of gkrieg, who has been hilariously wrong (as town) a lot in the games I've played with him recently.

vote: Robz

This is what Dylan did to me in the game he was scum.  Tried to make me doubt my reads.

I actually didn't doubt your read that much, until your read was proven to be wrong.
Title: Re: M98: Русская Mafia (Day 2)
Post by: 2.71828..... on May 02, 2017, 12:42:07 am
With that, I fairly certain I will jump back over to voting faust, but will give it some time and let everyone have a chance to post

Or you could read Robz and then vote for him.  My first kkrieg post has a lot of stuff about Robz and his EoD with mcmcsalot.

I could see this as well. But yeah, I would have to go back and reread
Title: Re: M98: Русская Mafia (Day 2)
Post by: Robz888 on May 02, 2017, 12:43:37 am
But gkrieg WAS wrong kkrieg. I am not so much doubting gkrieg's read as I am acknowledging that it wad wrong. And also, why am I responsible for Dylan? I don't understand.
Title: Re: M98: Русская Mafia (Day 2)
Post by: schadd on May 02, 2017, 12:43:54 am

if she didn't the setup is confirmed. but we ought to wait for our fausts and our gkriegs to have a go

??  How confirmed?
i.e. we know which setup it is

...  How, and which setup?
didn't commute => kill prevented by other means; only other protective to coexist is jk (and traitor rb i guess but let's hesitantly call that unlikely)
if she didn't commute it is very likely column 3
Title: Re: M98: Русская Mafia (Day 2)
Post by: schadd on May 02, 2017, 12:45:56 am
i don't really think that merits her claiming whether she did though
Title: Re: M98: Русская Mafia (Day 2)
Post by: Robz888 on May 02, 2017, 12:47:04 am
She should absolutely not claim whether she commuted.
Title: Re: M98: Русская Mafia (Day 2)
Post by: kkrieg on May 02, 2017, 12:50:41 am
Not planning on letting you all know if I did or not.
Title: Re: M98: Русская Mafia (Day 2)
Post by: gkrieg13 on May 02, 2017, 12:50:55 am

if she didn't the setup is confirmed. but we ought to wait for our fausts and our gkriegs to have a go

??  How confirmed?
i.e. we know which setup it is

...  How, and which setup?
didn't commute => kill prevented by other means; only other protective to coexist is jk (and traitor rb i guess but let's hesitantly call that unlikely)
if she didn't commute it is very likely column 3

Also scum shooting SK or traitor.
Title: Re: M98: Русская Mafia (Day 2)
Post by: 2.71828..... on May 02, 2017, 12:52:03 am
With 9 alive it takes 5 to lynch. Day 2 ends Wednesday, 3rd of May at 4 am FT.

Even though tonight is still Monday for me (yay west coast) Early Wednesday morning is only like 30 hours away.

I will take a serious look at Robz tomorrow, but still really like a faust lynch.

I think gkrieg is town due to his tunnelling of kkrieg, and schadd slightly scummier for his "we know the setup now" thing
Title: Re: M98: Русская Mafia (Day 2)
Post by: kkrieg on May 02, 2017, 12:52:58 am
I'm keeping my vote on TWM for now.
I want to reread more but Robz is another I'd be ok voting for.
Title: Re: M98: Русская Mafia (Day 2)
Post by: kkrieg on May 02, 2017, 12:54:17 am
I think gkrieg is town due to his tunnelling of kkrieg, and schadd slightly scummier for his "we know the setup now" thing
I think that is a good point on gkrieg. I am just personally surprised he was (maybe possibly genuinely) wrong on my read.
Title: Re: M98: Русская Mafia (Day 2)
Post by: gkrieg13 on May 02, 2017, 12:54:25 am
With 9 alive it takes 5 to lynch. Day 2 ends Wednesday, 3rd of May at 4 am FT.

Even though tonight is still Monday for me (yay west coast) Early Wednesday morning is only like 30 hours away.

I will take a serious look at Robz tomorrow, but still really like a faust lynch.

I think gkrieg is town due to his tunnelling of kkrieg, and schadd slightly scummier for his "we know the setup now" thing

Ya, I won't be awake for deadline, even though I'm on the west coast.
Title: Re: M98: Русская Mafia (Day 2)
Post by: Robz888 on May 02, 2017, 12:54:36 am
I would lynch TWM, I guess, or schadd. Perhaps I'd lynch Eevee. In fact, sure, I'd lynch Eevee.

I'm just not a fan of this faust wagon. Gkrieg and kkrieg both seem like definitely town. Who does that leave? Andrew and 2.7, I'm leaning townier.
Title: Re: M98: Русская Mafia (Day 2)
Post by: 2.71828..... on May 02, 2017, 12:56:19 am
I think gkrieg is town due to his tunnelling of kkrieg, and schadd slightly scummier for his "we know the setup now" thing
I think that is a good point on gkrieg. I am just personally surprised he was (maybe possibly genuinely) wrong on my read.

I find that it is hard to fake being just plain wrong as scum. Assuming we don't get a counterclaim, then he was just that. Just plain wrong. And so was I, but I won't go calling myself am IC (yet).
Title: Re: M98: Русская Mafia (Day 2)
Post by: schadd on May 02, 2017, 01:00:09 am
hard to fake, maybe, but something scum actively doesn't want to do, probably yes
Title: Re: M98: Русская Mafia (Day 2)
Post by: schadd on May 02, 2017, 01:00:58 am
i mean you're kind of assuming scum is incapable of making cases on people, and i'm pretty sure i did that way back when
Title: Re: M98: Русская Mafia (Day 2)
Post by: faust on May 02, 2017, 03:24:33 am
I'm not sure how much this tells us about gkrieg. kkrieg would have been an easy lynch to push for scum, but it also makes sense for town!gkrieg - that's why it whould have been so easy.

Can we lynch TWM now?
Title: Re: M98: Русская Mafia (Day 2)
Post by: faust on May 02, 2017, 03:41:46 am
I should do that reads list schadd asked for. Will include kkrieg's pre-claim position for completeness.

Since SK and mafia reads are substantially different, I will give them separately. Scores will be x / y where x and y are number between 0 and 10. 10 means definitely [mafia for X/SK for y], 5 means neutral, 0 means definitely not that. Maybe it would make sense to include a separate Traitor category. Actually, with kkrieg's claim, we know that either Traitor knows Mafia or they don't know about each other. I don't think I will go through the trouble of separating these.

Well, here we go!

Robz888 - 4 / 7 [slightly unlikely to be mafia, mostly due to activity level and content, which I think would be higher then. It's good for an SK trying to stay under the radar a bit and to not get shot. Also mcmc at least has a connection to Robz, so that kill would make some sense.]
The_Wine_Merchant - 3 / 9 [I kinda doubt that mcmc and TWM would go for hard bussing. Reasons for being SK have been explained.]
schadd - 6 / 2 [Uncomfortable position for an SK - exposed and both likely to get lynched and nightkilled. As scum I could see him doing that more.]
Eevee - 8 / 2 [See Eevee reread; the way he treats the mcmc wagon is extremely suspicious, plus showing no interest to investigate that wagon today. I don't think SK!Eevee shoots mcmc.]
gkrieg13 - 3 / 4 [Overall townie read, but nothing stands out to make him obvtown. D1 suggests he's not mcmc's partner.]
AndrewisFTTW - 5 / 4 [Mostly neutral. Was slightly scummy on mcmc IIRC, but then later it seemed he didn't think about the setup at all, which he would have done as scum and as the SK.]
2.71828..... -  e / e ... no, just kidding. Similar though, maybe 4 / 4 [I cannot really speak to him, I think I need to reread. He's made a townie impression, but that's just based on tone.]
kkrieg - 6 / 7 [I thought that she had some kind of role without a partner. SK or Traitor made sense. Now she's town unless we get a counterclaim, which I sort of doubt.]
Title: Re: M98: Русская Mafia (Day 2)
Post by: LaLight on May 02, 2017, 04:32:55 am
Vote count 2.6
The_Wine_Merchant (3): faust, Eevee, kkrieg
faust (1): AndrewisFTTW
kkrieg (1): The_Wine_Merchant
Robz888 (1): gkrieg13
Not voting (3): schadd, 2,71828....., Robz888

With 9 alive it takes 5 to lynch. Day 2 ends Wednesday, 3rd of May at 4 am FT. This is in 24ish hours
Title: Re: M98: Русская Mafia (Day 2)
Post by: faust on May 02, 2017, 05:16:39 am
hmmmmm.  unvote until a counterclaim I guess. 

7. 1-shot Commuter, Jailkeeper, Detective; Traitor Knows Mafia + Serial Killer
or
1. Detective, 1-shot Commuter, Goon Cop; 1-shot Investigation Immune + Serial Killer

then.  If you are a PR not in that list, you may want to consider claiming.
Quick double-check since I didn't see anyone do that:

The remaining SK setup is:

6. Detective, Jailkeeper, Psychologist; Mafia Knows Traitor + Serial Killer

Which has a Psychologist that the two setups above don't have. So any Psychologists and 1-shot Commuters need to come out and claim now. I don't think it will happen, but if it does, it should happen now, not some time at LyLo.

There is a conspiracy theory in which there is no SK and scum!mcmc urges his partner kkrieg to shoot him to make her claim more believable. That would require mafia to know that there is no SK, because otherwise um it would be crazy foolhardy. Setups in which this is possible: Mafia has 1-shot investigation immune or 2-shot JOAT. 2-shot JOAT has an actual Commuter, 1-shot Investigation Immune can have a Pschyologist who can counterclaim Commuter. Okay, it's not possible.
Title: Re: M98: Русская Mafia (Day 2)
Post by: The_Wine_Merchant on May 02, 2017, 07:52:43 am
Well back to Vote: faust
Title: Re: M98: Русская Mafia (Day 2)
Post by: The_Wine_Merchant on May 02, 2017, 08:01:59 am
faust's reads above are crap. And not even just the one on me. His read on schadd is just bad.
Title: Re: M98: Русская Mafia (Day 2)
Post by: faust on May 02, 2017, 08:11:36 am
faust's reads above are crap. And not even just the one on me. His read on schadd is just bad.
Your read is bad!
Title: Re: M98: Русская Mafia (Day 2)
Post by: The_Wine_Merchant on May 02, 2017, 08:27:10 am
faust's reads above are crap. And not even just the one on me. His read on schadd is just bad.
Your read is bad!
Probably.
Title: Re: M98: Русская Mafia (Day 2)
Post by: faust on May 02, 2017, 08:29:50 am
Wanna lynch Eevee? Just checking. I don't want to be the default lynch if we don't manage to lynch you.
Title: Re: M98: Русская Mafia (Day 2)
Post by: faust on May 02, 2017, 08:30:25 am
Why is Andrew even voting for me? I think there was a reason somewhere...
Title: Re: M98: Русская Mafia (Day 2)
Post by: The_Wine_Merchant on May 02, 2017, 08:30:51 am
Wanna lynch Eevee? Just checking. I don't want to be the default lynch if we don't manage to lynch you.
Probably not today
Title: Re: M98: Русская Mafia (Day 2)
Post by: The_Wine_Merchant on May 02, 2017, 08:31:11 am
Why is Andrew even voting for me? I think there was a reason somewhere...
He liked my reasons for voting you I think
Title: Re: M98: Русская Mafia (Day 2)
Post by: faust on May 02, 2017, 08:45:15 am
Why is Andrew even voting for me? I think there was a reason somewhere...
He liked my reasons for voting you I think
I think I forgot your reasons too. I only remember what e has said about SK hunting, but I don't think that was your angle.
Title: Re: M98: Русская Mafia (Day 2)
Post by: faust on May 02, 2017, 08:56:40 am
I found Andrew's reasons at least:

faust reminds me of me as scum, constantly reminding everyone of possible edge cases and really pushing TWM and at the very least hinting that everything he says is scummy. Whether that's scum indicative or not of faust I don't know, but it reads scum to me.

Which I think I addressed but clearly not in a manner that was sufficiently convincing.

I get that the thing is appealing if Andrew truly thinks I look the same way he does as scum. But we are different people, and pointing out edge cases is certainly not a scum tell for me.

I don't really get how pushing TWM hard is scummy. I think he's scum, so I push him. Applying pressure hopefully tells me even more about him. Scum has no reason to expose themselves like this; it's reasonable enough to think that the SK, after killing a scum early, would try to gun for town next; that's actually a plus for the mafia. The only reason for scum to push is to divert attention, and what I've been doing has certainly not achieved that.
Title: Re: M98: Русская Mafia (Day 2)
Post by: 2.71828..... on May 02, 2017, 10:19:33 am
Did my Robz reread, and I think he is town.  There is a chance that he could be the SK, but I don't think so.  The biggest aspect of Robz game that makes me think he is town is his general lack of reads on D1.  As scum in M88 he was the first to vote on 3 different wagons, garnering votes on all of them and really working the D1 lynch.

In this game we have this:
This just feels like genuinely busy mcmc to me, him actually being what he says makes a lot of sense. The problem is I don't have a great alternative candidate...

He knows who he doesn't want to lynch, but has nothing to offer in exchange.  This is slightly different than

I have been forced to accept that lackluster play is a town tell for you.

But it almost falls in the same category. 

Either way, I don't think that Robz is scum here
Title: Re: M98: Русская Mafia (Day 2)
Post by: 2.71828..... on May 02, 2017, 10:22:16 am
With that being said, this is where I am at:

Town: e, kkrieg
Town reads: Robz, gkrieg, TWM
Nullish reads: Eevee, schadd, Andrew
Scum reads: faust
Title: Re: M98: Русская Mafia (Day 2)
Post by: Robz888 on May 02, 2017, 10:22:24 am
I associate less active Eevee with scum!Eevee, which is I think what's tipping me toward thinking Eevee is scum all of a sudden. I understand it's a busy time for him IRL though.
Title: Re: M98: Русская Mafia (Day 2)
Post by: AndrewisFTTW on May 02, 2017, 10:34:15 am
I found Andrew's reasons at least:

faust reminds me of me as scum, constantly reminding everyone of possible edge cases and really pushing TWM and at the very least hinting that everything he says is scummy. Whether that's scum indicative or not of faust I don't know, but it reads scum to me.

Which I think I addressed but clearly not in a manner that was sufficiently convincing.

I get that the thing is appealing if Andrew truly thinks I look the same way he does as scum. But we are different people, and pointing out edge cases is certainly not a scum tell for me.

I don't really get how pushing TWM hard is scummy. I think he's scum, so I push him. Applying pressure hopefully tells me even more about him. Scum has no reason to expose themselves like this; it's reasonable enough to think that the SK, after killing a scum early, would try to gun for town next; that's actually a plus for the mafia. The only reason for scum to push is to divert attention, and what I've been doing has certainly not achieved that.

Yeah well, it's more of a gut read right now. But I don't see TWM killing mcmc last night. I do see you doing it and then blaming TWM for it, however.
Title: Re: M98: Русская Mafia (Day 2)
Post by: 2.71828..... on May 02, 2017, 10:39:30 am
Eevee reread.  I think he is scum.  There are two different points I have

1) The mcmc point
weird is towny.

robz is towny

mcmc scummy

got to give town points for faust for leading

why is andrew brought up so often as a viable lynch without accompanying vote movement?

Oh ma less than 24 hours.

Totally totally no idea who to vote for. Weekend deadlines are bad for town!

Granted, these are a couple days apart and reads develop, and unfortunately Eevee never posted after the mcmc wagon took off (no matter how short-lived it was), but going from mcmc being your only scum read to not having any clue who to lynch is slightly suspicious

2)  The "call me scum" point
why so loose with bringing up buddying? scum narrative could be maintaining the idea in people's head that that's a scummy behavior eevee often exhibits, hoping someone will bite.

just seems weird you'd bring it up. my two leading causes of daytime death are buddying and hedginess, someone who wouldn't mind seeing me lynched might want to drop those buzzwords around me hoping someone else starts painting me scummy for them. kind of like trying to get two people to fight while you slowly walk away to watch from afar.

(going to sleep now!)

Both of these posts have eevee explaining things about his playstyle that he might do as scum.  Or be accused of doing and get lynched for it as town.  Instructing people on how they should go after him if they want to lynch him.  I think this is the stronger of the two points against eevee.

Lets see how it goes

vote: eevee
Title: Re: M98: Русская Mafia (Day 2)
Post by: Robz888 on May 02, 2017, 10:52:53 am
Vote: Eevee
Title: Re: M98: Русская Mafia (Day 2)
Post by: The_Wine_Merchant on May 02, 2017, 10:58:18 am
I would rather Vote: Robz, but vote: faust is still preferable
Title: Re: M98: Русская Mafia (Day 2)
Post by: LaLight on May 02, 2017, 11:00:39 am
Vote count 2.7
The_Wine_Merchant (3): faust, Eevee, kkrieg
faust (2): AndrewisFTTW, The_Wine_Merchant
Robz888 (1): gkrieg13
Eevee (2): 2,71828....., Robz888
Not voting (1): schadd

With 9 alive it takes 5 to lynch. Day 2 ends Wednesday, 3rd of May at 4 am FT. This is in 15 hours
Title: Re: M98: Русская Mafia (Day 2)
Post by: faust on May 02, 2017, 11:09:36 am
Vote: Eevee
How exactly did e's post convince you to this vote in a way that mine did not? And whatever happened to "let's lynch the SK, which Eevee is not"?
Title: Re: M98: Русская Mafia (Day 2)
Post by: faust on May 02, 2017, 11:10:52 am
I found Andrew's reasons at least:

faust reminds me of me as scum, constantly reminding everyone of possible edge cases and really pushing TWM and at the very least hinting that everything he says is scummy. Whether that's scum indicative or not of faust I don't know, but it reads scum to me.

Which I think I addressed but clearly not in a manner that was sufficiently convincing.

I get that the thing is appealing if Andrew truly thinks I look the same way he does as scum. But we are different people, and pointing out edge cases is certainly not a scum tell for me.

I don't really get how pushing TWM hard is scummy. I think he's scum, so I push him. Applying pressure hopefully tells me even more about him. Scum has no reason to expose themselves like this; it's reasonable enough to think that the SK, after killing a scum early, would try to gun for town next; that's actually a plus for the mafia. The only reason for scum to push is to divert attention, and what I've been doing has certainly not achieved that.

Yeah well, it's more of a gut read right now. But I don't see TWM killing mcmc last night. I do see you doing it and then blaming TWM for it, however.
Really?

Well I think we never have been scum together, so fair enough. Know that I would never, and I also explained why the SK framing TWM makes no sense.
Title: Re: M98: Русская Mafia (Day 2)
Post by: gkrieg13 on May 02, 2017, 11:17:11 am
Fine I'll put together a whole Robz case.
Title: Re: M98: Русская Mafia (Day 2)
Post by: gkrieg13 on May 02, 2017, 11:18:19 am
I think Eevee is the only one left to post after the claim.
Title: Re: M98: Русская Mafia (Day 2)
Post by: Robz888 on May 02, 2017, 11:18:57 am
Vote: Eevee
How exactly did e's post convince you to this vote in a way that mine did not? And whatever happened to "let's lynch the SK, which Eevee is not"?

Well, now we don't have kkrieg as a lynch option, so Eevee is automatically more appealing. And, for reasons they might not actually indicate anything, I'm feeling more like he's scum--he's been gone longer now, and as I said, low-participation Eevee is scum Eevee.
Title: Re: M98: Русская Mafia (Day 2)
Post by: faust on May 02, 2017, 11:24:06 am
Vote: Eevee
How exactly did e's post convince you to this vote in a way that mine did not? And whatever happened to "let's lynch the SK, which Eevee is not"?

Well, now we don't have kkrieg as a lynch option, so Eevee is automatically more appealing. And, for reasons they might not actually indicate anything, I'm feeling more like he's scum--he's been gone longer now, and as I said, low-participation Eevee is scum Eevee.
Would you reconsider TWM?
Title: Re: M98: Русская Mafia (Day 2)
Post by: faust on May 02, 2017, 11:25:47 am
I can be around for the deadline btw, but not sure how much more I will be able to post tonight. Probably some, but I'm not hyper-active.
Title: Re: M98: Русская Mafia (Day 2)
Post by: Robz888 on May 02, 2017, 11:28:52 am
Vote: Eevee
How exactly did e's post convince you to this vote in a way that mine did not? And whatever happened to "let's lynch the SK, which Eevee is not"?

Well, now we don't have kkrieg as a lynch option, so Eevee is automatically more appealing. And, for reasons they might not actually indicate anything, I'm feeling more like he's scum--he's been gone longer now, and as I said, low-participation Eevee is scum Eevee.
Would you reconsider TWM?

Yes... I just think he stood up to the wagon pretty well, and is not generally behaving like his scum self from previous games. But yes, I would.
Title: Re: M98: Русская Mafia (Day 2)
Post by: faust on May 02, 2017, 11:30:47 am
Maybe I should reread a scum game of his. But that won't happen pre-deadline. Still, SK is different from other scum.
Title: Re: M98: Русская Mafia (Day 2)
Post by: The_Wine_Merchant on May 02, 2017, 11:39:06 am
Maybe I should reread a scum game of his. But that won't happen pre-deadline. Still, SK is different from other scum.
And again, I say that if I were SK I would be playing this completely differently. I certainly wouldn't have come out after Night 1 basically shouting, "Hey I am solidly town!" Even if that were true, that is pretty much waving a flag and saying, "hey mafia make sure you kill me tonight!" SK doesn't want to do that.

Now, I was wrong about how townie I thought I was, but I honestly felt like I was on the townier side. SK isn't going to draw attention to that for himself.
Title: Re: M98: Русская Mafia (Day 2)
Post by: Eevee on May 02, 2017, 12:46:42 pm
Oh noo, I've been a bad bad townie. Sorry guys, I haven't been engaged enough with the game lately. Forgetting all my reads too, makes catching up even less fun.

First of all, no counterclaim from me. In the end the outcome with kkrieg seems pretty good for us actually.

@e
I remember thinking mcmc was scummy for saying weird is scummy, sort of seemed he was trying throw stuff at the wall to see what sticks.. and then I forgot. I wasn't there for the mcmc wagon, but I don't know what I would have done.

What do you mean with the second point? I wasn't instructing schadd how to go about suspecting me, I was calling him scummy for potentially trying to be subtle about getting me lynched. What's the scum narrative you are suggesting?
Title: Re: M98: Русская Mafia (Day 2)
Post by: Eevee on May 02, 2017, 12:47:07 pm
Kkrieg is confirmed town now, right?
Title: Re: M98: Русская Mafia (Day 2)
Post by: Eevee on May 02, 2017, 12:49:12 pm
I don't feel great about lynching Robz (eh, same read than mcmc last night, I don't have a reason to be against this lynch but I've seen no reason to suspect him other than "He is Robz and he is still alive") or faust (although he has been more and more aggressive as the leader (and main scumhunter!), which I guess is reading scummier to me because it could be a disguise for pushing towny lynches). Still would like TWM, but I don't know if that's happening anymore.
Title: Re: M98: Русская Mafia (Day 2)
Post by: Eevee on May 02, 2017, 12:49:49 pm
What about schadd? The post e quoted made me realize my earlier exchanges with him. I could vote for schadd.
Title: Re: M98: Русская Mafia (Day 2)
Post by: 2.71828..... on May 02, 2017, 01:06:05 pm
Kkrieg is confirmed town now, right?

I would say so since we don't have counter claims
Title: Re: M98: Русская Mafia (Day 2)
Post by: Robz888 on May 02, 2017, 01:17:23 pm
Boy does that sound like town Eevee to me. Unvote
Title: Re: M98: Русская Mafia (Day 2)
Post by: Robz888 on May 02, 2017, 01:18:22 pm
What about schadd? The post e quoted made me realize my earlier exchanges with him. I could vote for schadd.

I would also go schadd, but I tried it earlier and no one supported it.

Vote: TWM, I guess, because that's the best wagon option.
Title: Re: M98: Русская Mafia (Day 2)
Post by: The_Wine_Merchant on May 02, 2017, 01:23:16 pm
That is L-1. I guess I should say that if I were scum I would have counterclaimed kkrieg. Might still have ended up with me being the lynch, but at least it would have given me a chance of survival for at least the day. As once she claimed it became pretty apparent I was going to be the lynch.

That I didn't should at the least raise some eyebrows, but I don't really expect this to be a reason why people won't vote for me.
Title: Re: M98: Русская Mafia (Day 2)
Post by: faust on May 02, 2017, 01:23:42 pm
The kkrieg wagon at peak:

gkrieg, e, Robz, TWM

kkrieg would have been a good lynch for scum. I would think that mafia is on here somewhere, but all of these players are non-mafia reads for. So probably my reads are off.
Title: Re: M98: Русская Mafia (Day 2)
Post by: faust on May 02, 2017, 01:24:30 pm
That is L-1. I guess I should say that if I were scum I would have counterclaimed kkrieg. Might still have ended up with me being the lynch, but at least it would have given me a chance of survival for at least the day. As once she claimed it became pretty apparent I was going to be the lynch.
As the SK you wouldn't because one day doesn't help you.

But yes, it makes you less likely to be mafia.
Title: Re: M98: Русская Mafia (Day 2)
Post by: The_Wine_Merchant on May 02, 2017, 01:25:05 pm
That is L-1. I guess I should say that if I were scum I would have counterclaimed kkrieg. Might still have ended up with me being the lynch, but at least it would have given me a chance of survival for at least the day. As once she claimed it became pretty apparent I was going to be the lynch.
As the SK you wouldn't because one day doesn't help you.
Yes. That is a fair point.
Title: Re: M98: Русская Mafia (Day 2)
Post by: faust on May 02, 2017, 01:26:54 pm
Out of Robz/gkrieg/e, Robz is probably the mafia-est.
Title: Re: M98: Русская Mafia (Day 2)
Post by: The_Wine_Merchant on May 02, 2017, 01:31:00 pm
Out of Robz/gkrieg/e, Robz is probably the mafia-est.
Agreed.
Title: Re: M98: Русская Mafia (Day 2)
Post by: schadd on May 02, 2017, 01:32:30 pm
fake hammer etc.
Title: Re: M98: Русская Mafia (Day 2)
Post by: schadd on May 02, 2017, 01:38:21 pm
twm, how does this game feel different/similar to nm10?
Title: Re: M98: Русская Mafia (Day 2)
Post by: The_Wine_Merchant on May 02, 2017, 01:48:47 pm
twm, how does this game feel different/similar to nm10?
Um. Very different.

More wagons, less RR-Jake distractions. I didn't claim a PR early Day 2. Scum died on Night 1. I mean they are pretty much completely different games.

I do think that the feel of the L-1 wagon on me in NM10 was somewhat similar to the L-1 wagon on me in this game. I feel that LaLight's comments in his scum QT could be applied to what mafia is probably thinking about me this game.
Title: Re: M98: Русская Mafia (Day 2)
Post by: schadd on May 02, 2017, 01:53:30 pm
how about, like, emotionally


[dr phil]and how does that make you feel[/dr phil]
Title: Re: M98: Русская Mafia (Day 2)
Post by: The_Wine_Merchant on May 02, 2017, 02:00:15 pm
how about, like, emotionally


[dr phil]and how does that make you feel[/dr phil]
I feel good.
Title: Re: M98: Русская Mafia (Day 2)
Post by: schadd on May 02, 2017, 02:01:14 pm
in a special way?


in this game or because of the town win?
Title: Re: M98: Русская Mafia (Day 2)
Post by: The_Wine_Merchant on May 02, 2017, 02:08:50 pm
in a special way?


in this game or because of the town win?
I feel like you are making me feel special.

The town win was nice because I realized that even if I play poorly the game isn't doomed, cause I sucked it up pretty bad in that game aside from one good PR choice.

Here I am somewhat resigned to my fate of being lynched. But I think town is in an opportunity to move past it and recapture some of the momentum. Earlier I was frustrated and then embarrassed. But now, I am just good.
Title: Re: M98: Русская Mafia (Day 2)
Post by: schadd on May 02, 2017, 02:12:06 pm
that might be the morphine
Title: Re: M98: Русская Mafia (Day 2)
Post by: schadd on May 02, 2017, 02:13:26 pm
who would you shoot right now if you had a day vigilante
Title: Re: M98: Русская Mafia (Day 2)
Post by: AndrewisFTTW on May 02, 2017, 02:15:05 pm
Out of Robz/gkrieg/e, Robz is probably the mafia-est.
Agreed.

I disagree. I think Robz going with the flow and not being committed to one lynch is pretty towny of him. Out of those three I find gkrieg the scummiest. faust why did you feel compelled to single those three people out?
Title: Re: M98: Русская Mafia (Day 2)
Post by: The_Wine_Merchant on May 02, 2017, 02:17:30 pm
who would you shoot right now if you had a day vigilante
I wouldn't. At least not right now in the game state or day state.

Well that isn't true. Would I publicly post that I had performed a day vig? And then become IC as a result? That would be worth it there alone to shoot someone, instead of just getting lynched. In that case? Probably faust.
Title: Re: M98: Русская Mafia (Day 2)
Post by: The_Wine_Merchant on May 02, 2017, 02:18:46 pm
Out of Robz/gkrieg/e, Robz is probably the mafia-est.
Agreed.

I disagree. I think Robz going with the flow and not being committed to one lynch is pretty towny of him. Out of those three I find gkrieg the scummiest. faust why did you feel compelled to single those three people out?
If you look at the mcmc wagon and how it formed and how it was responded to gkrieg and e come out super townie. This is why Robz is the mafia-est.

He singled them out because they were the kkrieg wagon + me and faust doesn't think I am super likely to be mcmc's partner due to heavy bussing.
Title: Re: M98: Русская Mafia (Day 2)
Post by: The_Wine_Merchant on May 02, 2017, 02:28:44 pm
But they still could be SK or Traitor (in the one scenario where traitor doesn't know who mafia is). If we are in the other scenario where Traitor knows things, then they are unlikely to be traitors as well.
Title: Re: M98: Русская Mafia (Day 2)
Post by: gkrieg13 on May 02, 2017, 02:32:29 pm
Out of Robz/gkrieg/e, Robz is probably the mafia-est.
Agreed.

I disagree. I think Robz going with the flow and not being committed to one lynch is pretty towny of him. Out of those three I find gkrieg the scummiest. faust why did you feel compelled to single those three people out?

How am I the scummiest of those three?
Title: Re: M98: Русская Mafia (Day 2)
Post by: LaLight on May 02, 2017, 02:55:25 pm
Vote count 2.8
The_Wine_Merchant (4): faust, Eevee, kkrieg, Robz888
faust (2): AndrewisFTTW, The_Wine_Merchant
Robz888 (1): gkrieg13
Eevee (1): 2,71828.....
Not voting (1): schadd

With 9 alive it takes 5 to lynch. Day 2 ends Wednesday, 3rd of May at 4 am FT. This is in 13 hours
Title: Re: M98: Русская Mafia (Day 2)
Post by: The_Wine_Merchant on May 02, 2017, 03:05:57 pm
So schadd are you going to vote for me? 2.7, gkrieg and Andrew I don't think are (although I think 2.7 would to get a lynch through, and I now respect that). If you aren't then my wagon needs to dissipate and go elsewhere.

So what is your decision?
Title: Re: M98: Русская Mafia (Day 2)
Post by: Robz888 on May 02, 2017, 03:07:21 pm
To me the only alternative to TWM is schadd.
Title: Re: M98: Русская Mafia (Day 2)
Post by: The_Wine_Merchant on May 02, 2017, 03:12:45 pm
To me the only alternative to TWM is schadd.
Well thanks for making his decision that much easier. I really don't think this was the optimal time to say that.
Title: Re: M98: Русская Mafia (Day 2)
Post by: The_Wine_Merchant on May 02, 2017, 03:12:54 pm
vote: Robz
Title: Re: M98: Русская Mafia (Day 2)
Post by: Robz888 on May 02, 2017, 03:19:49 pm
I think it was fine.
Title: Re: M98: Русская Mafia (Day 2)
Post by: schadd on May 02, 2017, 03:57:27 pm

So schadd are you going to vote for me? 2.7, gkrieg and Andrew I don't think are (although I think 2.7 would to get a lynch through, and I now respect that). If you aren't then my wagon needs to dissipate and go elsewhere.

So what is your decision?
i have strong nagging sensations that you are both town and scum.


you're vt, presumably?
Title: Re: M98: Русская Mafia (Day 2)
Post by: schadd on May 02, 2017, 04:01:01 pm
game-related sigging is yucky but my current stance is that choosing to remove/not remove it is also yucky
Title: Re: M98: Русская Mafia (Day 2)
Post by: kkrieg on May 02, 2017, 04:24:04 pm
The kkrieg wagon at peak:

gkrieg, e, Robz, TWM

kkrieg would have been a good lynch for scum. I would think that mafia is on here somewhere, but all of these players are non-mafia reads for. So probably my reads are off.
Who was awake/ in a place with a reasonable time zone that could have hammered?
Title: Re: M98: Русская Mafia (Day 2)
Post by: Eevee on May 02, 2017, 04:41:37 pm
The kkrieg wagon at peak:

gkrieg, e, Robz, TWM

kkrieg would have been a good lynch for scum. I would think that mafia is on here somewhere, but all of these players are non-mafia reads for. So probably my reads are off.
Who was awake/ in a place with a reasonable time zone that could have hammered?
You claimed one hour after TWM put you at L-1. I don't think we can expect that scum would have hammered kkrieg if they weren't on the wagon already, there wasn't enough time.
Title: Re: M98: Русская Mafia (Day 2)
Post by: Eevee on May 02, 2017, 05:31:40 pm
Time starting to be an issue.  I can get up for the deadline, but not much before.

schadd, uhm.. if we can't get the TWM lynch through, my second preference of the people currently having votes on them would be you. And that's not meant as a godfather-type move! I just realized that the deadline is super close and people are unlikely to be around for it (again), earth is approaching rapidlyyy.
Title: Re: M98: Русская Mafia (Day 2)
Post by: The_Wine_Merchant on May 02, 2017, 05:36:40 pm
you're vt, presumably?
I have declined to state that at this point. You are free to infer whatever you want.
Title: Re: M98: Русская Mafia (Day 2)
Post by: Robz888 on May 02, 2017, 05:37:02 pm
Time starting to be an issue.  I can get up for the deadline, but not much before.

schadd, uhm.. if we can't get the TWM lynch through, my second preference of the people currently having votes on them would be you. And that's not meant as a godfather-type move! I just realized that the deadline is super close and people are unlikely to be around for it (again), earth is approaching rapidlyyy.

That's exactly what I said!
Title: Re: M98: Русская Mafia (Day 2)
Post by: The_Wine_Merchant on May 02, 2017, 05:37:51 pm
The kkrieg wagon at peak:

gkrieg, e, Robz, TWM

kkrieg would have been a good lynch for scum. I would think that mafia is on here somewhere, but all of these players are non-mafia reads for. So probably my reads are off.
Who was awake/ in a place with a reasonable time zone that could have hammered?
You claimed one hour after TWM put you at L-1. I don't think we can expect that scum would have hammered kkrieg if they weren't on the wagon already, there wasn't enough time.
And stupid to do so without claim, etc. the person who did that would be highly suspected the next day.
Title: Re: M98: Русская Mafia (Day 2)
Post by: Robz888 on May 02, 2017, 05:38:12 pm
Presumably we could get TWM to vote for schadd, but that's still just three of us, and no one else has expressed any interest in this lynch.

Someone willing to do schadd? Andrew? kkrieg?
Title: Re: M98: Русская Mafia (Day 2)
Post by: The_Wine_Merchant on May 02, 2017, 05:39:10 pm
Presumably we could get TWM to vote for schadd, but that's still just three of us, and no one else has expressed any interest in this lynch.

Someone willing to do schadd? Andrew? kkrieg?
I don't think schadd can conceivably be mcmc's partner. What do you say to that?
Title: Re: M98: Русская Mafia (Day 2)
Post by: faust on May 02, 2017, 05:41:39 pm
Going to sleep now; will be here half an hour before deadline.
Title: Re: M98: Русская Mafia (Day 2)
Post by: schadd on May 02, 2017, 05:42:36 pm
twm, do you think it is a fair assessment you've been more harsh at people pressuring you this game than in the newbie?
Title: Re: M98: Русская Mafia (Day 2)
Post by: Robz888 on May 02, 2017, 05:44:57 pm
Presumably we could get TWM to vote for schadd, but that's still just three of us, and no one else has expressed any interest in this lynch.

Someone willing to do schadd? Andrew? kkrieg?
I don't think schadd can conceivably be mcmc's partner. What do you say to that?

I would say: schadd can conceivably be mcmc's partner. Anyone could conceivably be mcmc's partner, except kkrieg. And Andrew is very unlikely, because of the slip.
Title: Re: M98: Русская Mafia (Day 2)
Post by: The_Wine_Merchant on May 02, 2017, 05:46:01 pm
twm, do you think it is a fair assessment you've been more harsh at people pressuring you this game than in the newbie?
Yes.

But again context. Newbie game was Day 1, which i would say was similar to today's Day 1, and then I was a claimed IC. You can't compare Day 2s because my situation is so different.

I wash pretty harsh to you and Jake/RR in newbie game but because of pressure, but vice versa.
Title: Re: M98: Русская Mafia (Day 2)
Post by: The_Wine_Merchant on May 02, 2017, 05:47:31 pm
Presumably we could get TWM to vote for schadd, but that's still just three of us, and no one else has expressed any interest in this lynch.

Someone willing to do schadd? Andrew? kkrieg?
I don't think schadd can conceivably be mcmc's partner. What do you say to that?

I would say: schadd can conceivably be mcmc's partner. Anyone could conceivably be mcmc's partner, except kkrieg. And Andrew is very unlikely, because of the slip.
Ok. That was a bad choice of words. I think it highly unlikely that he is compared with others based off how he responded to the mcmc wagon and breakup. For that reason he isn't a great vote, but if it between him and me, I would go for it, but wouldn't be thrilled.
Title: Re: M98: Русская Mafia (Day 2)
Post by: schadd on May 02, 2017, 05:49:23 pm
i'm trying to think of a better analogy than "i'm such a good starcraft player, look at how many minerals i have"
I don't know what that means.

you pushed on him during the day, yes. end of day is whenlynches happen and at end of day you lynched awaclus for voting the guy you're trying to get towncred for pushing
I am aware at how mediocre my Day 1 performance was. Thank you very much. And I am not saying I should be the IC. I just don't think I should be the default lynch or the go-to suspect today. I think the evidence argues against that.
well it also so happens that leaving a bus through the emergency exit is your scum thing
do you know what i was referring to with this?
Title: Re: M98: Русская Mafia (Day 2)
Post by: Robz888 on May 02, 2017, 05:50:27 pm
Presumably we could get TWM to vote for schadd, but that's still just three of us, and no one else has expressed any interest in this lynch.

Someone willing to do schadd? Andrew? kkrieg?
I don't think schadd can conceivably be mcmc's partner. What do you say to that?

I would say: schadd can conceivably be mcmc's partner. Anyone could conceivably be mcmc's partner, except kkrieg. And Andrew is very unlikely, because of the slip.
Ok. That was a bad choice of words. I think it highly unlikely that he is compared with others based off how he responded to the mcmc wagon and breakup. For that reason he isn't a great vote, but if it between him and me, I would go for it, but wouldn't be thrilled.

I will try to go back and look at it more carefully, but I'm not sure I'll have time before deadline.
Title: Re: M98: Русская Mafia (Day 2)
Post by: The_Wine_Merchant on May 02, 2017, 05:51:47 pm
i'm trying to think of a better analogy than "i'm such a good starcraft player, look at how many minerals i have"
I don't know what that means.

you pushed on him during the day, yes. end of day is whenlynches happen and at end of day you lynched awaclus for voting the guy you're trying to get towncred for pushing
I am aware at how mediocre my Day 1 performance was. Thank you very much. And I am not saying I should be the IC. I just don't think I should be the default lynch or the go-to suspect today. I think the evidence argues against that.
well it also so happens that leaving a bus through the emergency exit is your scum thing
do you know what i was referring to with this?
Sure. I did it twice in previous scum games.

Once with RR in your game and once with Andrew in the other. But neither time on Day 1?
Title: Re: M98: Русская Mafia (Day 2)
Post by: The_Wine_Merchant on May 02, 2017, 05:52:03 pm
Presumably we could get TWM to vote for schadd, but that's still just three of us, and no one else has expressed any interest in this lynch.

Someone willing to do schadd? Andrew? kkrieg?
I don't think schadd can conceivably be mcmc's partner. What do you say to that?

I would say: schadd can conceivably be mcmc's partner. Anyone could conceivably be mcmc's partner, except kkrieg. And Andrew is very unlikely, because of the slip.
Ok. That was a bad choice of words. I think it highly unlikely that he is compared with others based off how he responded to the mcmc wagon and breakup. For that reason he isn't a great vote, but if it between him and me, I would go for it, but wouldn't be thrilled.

I will try to go back and look at it more carefully, but I'm not sure I'll have time before deadline.

I'll go find my post.
Title: Re: M98: Русская Mafia (Day 2)
Post by: schadd on May 02, 2017, 05:54:12 pm
i'm trying to think of a better analogy than "i'm such a good starcraft player, look at how many minerals i have"
I don't know what that means.

you pushed on him during the day, yes. end of day is whenlynches happen and at end of day you lynched awaclus for voting the guy you're trying to get towncred for pushing
I am aware at how mediocre my Day 1 performance was. Thank you very much. And I am not saying I should be the IC. I just don't think I should be the default lynch or the go-to suspect today. I think the evidence argues against that.
well it also so happens that leaving a bus through the emergency exit is your scum thing
do you know what i was referring to with this?
Sure. I did it twice in previous scum games.

Once with RR in your game and once with Andrew in the other. But neither time on Day 1?
why would it be different d1?
Title: Re: M98: Русская Mafia (Day 2)
Post by: The_Wine_Merchant on May 02, 2017, 05:54:24 pm
Quote
Also just happened to see this right after my 482 from schadd:

it does, but mcmc is a good scum player

schadd isn't mcmc's partner. He isn't going to be talking me into a lynch right after I express an opinion that I want to avoid it and then further tries to put the brakes on the Awaclus wagon:

i mean, someone that makes a point of obscuring his reasoning shouldn't be the d1 lynch because of his shoddy reasoning. what do we have on him?

Sorry I missed this before, but I am putting schadd up there along with 2.7 and gkrieg of not mcmc's partner. (This conclusion totally overrode the original intent of this post, but I guess it was worth it).

Messed up the quoting so tried to do an easy fix, but the relevant schadd quotes are still there.
Title: Re: M98: Русская Mafia (Day 2)
Post by: schadd on May 02, 2017, 05:55:46 pm
schadd, uhm.. if we can't get the TWM lynch through, my second preference of the people currently having votes on them would be you.
i don't have any votes


(except for the ones that people will cast in response to this post)
Title: Re: M98: Русская Mafia (Day 2)
Post by: The_Wine_Merchant on May 02, 2017, 05:56:53 pm
i'm trying to think of a better analogy than "i'm such a good starcraft player, look at how many minerals i have"
I don't know what that means.

you pushed on him during the day, yes. end of day is whenlynches happen and at end of day you lynched awaclus for voting the guy you're trying to get towncred for pushing
I am aware at how mediocre my Day 1 performance was. Thank you very much. And I am not saying I should be the IC. I just don't think I should be the default lynch or the go-to suspect today. I think the evidence argues against that.
well it also so happens that leaving a bus through the emergency exit is your scum thing
do you know what i was referring to with this?
Sure. I did it twice in previous scum games.

Once with RR in your game and once with Andrew in the other. But neither time on Day 1?
why would it be different d1?
Because I think a correct scum lynch would be much harder to overcome if it went through, so risky. The other days it was apparent that Andrew and RR had good chances of being lynched going into the day and I wanted to be a part of it for credit. Day 1 starts with an open slate, so no plan or precog going on.
Title: Re: M98: Русская Mafia (Day 2)
Post by: schadd on May 02, 2017, 05:58:45 pm
you didn't finish the day voting him though. if you're scum you wouldn't have planned to, and you've gotten away with such rather easily in the past.
Title: Re: M98: Русская Mafia (Day 2)
Post by: The_Wine_Merchant on May 02, 2017, 06:01:59 pm
you didn't finish the day voting him though. if you're scum you wouldn't have planned to, and you've gotten away with such rather easily in the past.

I know I wasn't.

And gotten away with such? Jumping off a wagon? Sure, because they didn't get lynched. But again if mcmc gets lynched because of a wagon I started,whether I am on it or not, is going to be very bad for mafia, right? And it isn't like I got on early and then jumped. I got on late.
Title: Re: M98: Русская Mafia (Day 2)
Post by: The_Wine_Merchant on May 02, 2017, 06:03:24 pm
This seems ridiculous. I am trying to answer questions of what I would have done as scum, when I really can only speculate. It doesn't seem very useful. Go look at my posts and ask me why I did them as town. That I can answer, not this speculation shit.
Title: Re: M98: Русская Mafia (Day 2)
Post by: schadd on May 02, 2017, 06:06:15 pm
But again if mcmc gets lynched because of a wagon I started,whether I am on it or not, is going to be very bad for mafia, right?
you didn't start the wagon, as you note in the next sentence.


do you remember if you thought mcmc was scum during n1?
Title: Re: M98: Русская Mafia (Day 2)
Post by: schadd on May 02, 2017, 06:08:28 pm
This seems ridiculous. I am trying to answer questions of what I would have done as scum, when I really can only speculate. It doesn't seem very useful. Go look at my posts and ask me why I did them as town. That I can answer, not this speculation shit.
yeah, i know. the thing about scumreads is that they're weak if the thing they did has a reasonable town explanation. i'm doing my derndest
Title: Re: M98: Русская Mafia (Day 2)
Post by: The_Wine_Merchant on May 02, 2017, 06:08:59 pm
But again if mcmc gets lynched because of a wagon I started,whether I am on it or not, is going to be very bad for mafia, right?
you didn't start the wagon, as you note in the next sentence.


do you remember if you thought mcmc was scum during n1?
Help move along then.

And I didn't do any thinking about the game during the night.
Title: Re: M98: Русская Mafia (Day 2)
Post by: The_Wine_Merchant on May 02, 2017, 06:09:37 pm
This seems ridiculous. I am trying to answer questions of what I would have done as scum, when I really can only speculate. It doesn't seem very useful. Go look at my posts and ask me why I did them as town. That I can answer, not this speculation shit.
yeah, i know. the thing about scumreads is that they're weak if the thing they did has a reasonable town explanation. i'm doing my derndest
Oh sure. I am not being critical of you, I just can't answer your questions very well.
Title: Re: M98: Русская Mafia (Day 2)
Post by: The_Wine_Merchant on May 02, 2017, 06:10:26 pm
I think I just VT slipped, so I guess I am stating I am a VT. Sorry.
Title: Re: M98: Русская Mafia (Day 2)
Post by: schadd on May 02, 2017, 06:14:35 pm
But again if mcmc gets lynched because of a wagon I started,whether I am on it or not, is going to be very bad for mafia, right?
you didn't start the wagon, as you note in the next sentence.


do you remember if you thought mcmc was scum during n1?
Help move along then.

And I didn't do any thinking about the game during the night.
well that's the worst vt claim i've seen in my adult life


what i'm getting at is that it's super weird to me that you came in to d2 expecting some amount of towncred for pushing mcmc - not because you didn't deserve it, but because if you did change your mind at the day, you would have been thinking "dern, i was pushing town this whole time" up until the flip, whereas if you knew you were bussing you would be like "hey man where's my towncred"


This seems ridiculous. I am trying to answer questions of what I would have done as scum, when I really can only speculate. It doesn't seem very useful. Go look at my posts and ask me why I did them as town. That I can answer, not this speculation shit.
yeah, i know. the thing about scumreads is that they're weak if the thing they did has a reasonable town explanation. i'm doing my derndest
Oh sure. I am not being critical of you, I just can't answer your questions very well.
the tip to improving at mafia et al. is that you can be critical of yourself more often than you're supposed to.


how about.


you said at the start of toDay that you should stick to your guns more. how have you been doing that?

(i'm just a job interviewer now i guess)


ppe lma000
Title: Re: M98: Русская Mafia (Day 2)
Post by: The_Wine_Merchant on May 02, 2017, 06:18:25 pm
I literally saw mcmc flip as scum and thought. Hey I remember voting for him a bit and wanting others to vote for him. That should make me look good. And then was surprised that others, mostly Faust, immediately thought differently.
Title: Re: M98: Русская Mafia (Day 2)
Post by: The_Wine_Merchant on May 02, 2017, 06:18:53 pm
Yeah. I think I am done with questions.
Title: Re: M98: Русская Mafia (Day 2)
Post by: schadd on May 02, 2017, 06:19:53 pm
hhhhhhhh.
Title: Re: M98: Русская Mafia (Day 2)
Post by: schadd on May 02, 2017, 06:20:43 pm
yeah sorry for kind of making you vt slip. i did worry about that in asking the question
Title: Re: M98: Русская Mafia (Day 2)
Post by: The_Wine_Merchant on May 02, 2017, 06:22:10 pm
yeah sorry for kind of making you vt slip. i did worry about that in asking the question
It wasn't my brightest moment ever.
Title: Re: M98: Русская Mafia (Day 2)
Post by: schadd on May 02, 2017, 06:28:30 pm
it was a bit of a useless exercise because this is the sort of thing you're good at as scum anyway but i need to do something, at least for you to know what you're dealing with if you're town


yeah sorry for kind of making you vt slip. i did worry about that in asking the question
It wasn't my brightest moment ever.
future so bright u need shades  8)


at present i do think you are more likely to flip scum, and i have for most of toDay. i leave for work in a bit under an hour. anything else you want to talk about?
Title: Re: M98: Русская Mafia (Day 2)
Post by: The_Wine_Merchant on May 02, 2017, 06:32:08 pm
Hmmm. Not really. You, schadd and gkrieg are not mcmc partners.

Robz I think is likely one of he three. Don't know which.

Andrew I am tow reading from reverse-WIFOM. So maybe that isn't that strong.

And I still think faust is different if I stick to my guns that is where I should stick. Vote: faust
Title: Re: M98: Русская Mafia (Day 2)
Post by: schadd on May 02, 2017, 06:33:22 pm
different from what?
Title: Re: M98: Русская Mafia (Day 2)
Post by: The_Wine_Merchant on May 02, 2017, 06:39:42 pm
different from what?
Don't think I meant to say different there. I find him scummy.
Title: Re: M98: Русская Mafia (Day 1)
Post by: gkrieg13 on May 02, 2017, 06:42:45 pm
Keep in mind it's his birthday, I don't know if he'll be around. Are we really comfortable lynching him without a claim? I mean, I would rather lynch him than get lynched myself, but objectively, I don't know if that's the smartest thing,

I am sort of inclined to go after one of the mcmc pile-on ers. But maybe avoiding mcmc's wagon was the safest thing for scum to do.

This just feels like genuinely busy mcmc to me, him actually being what he says makes a lot of sense. The problem is I don't have a great alternative candidate...

I mean if all we can do is lynch mcmc or no one, I will vote for mcmc befoere I go to sleep in about 2 hrs
I agree with this.

hey gkrieg I know you're online what do you think about awaclus?

how about you talk about why you are voting awaclus pleeeeez

He's a person who isn't a townread.

Only three more for the mcmcsalot wagon to go!  Any takers?  Kkrieg, why do you think Awaclus is a better lynch than mcmcsalot?
babe you know it's past my bedtime don't ask hard questions

he reacted pretty quickly to my initial kinda random vote at him
he hasn't been particularly helpful
he jumped on the mcmc train

honestly my reasons are weak but heyy it is day 1

Ok, so these are the posts that I feel pushed from mcmc to Andrew.  I think Robz is pretty solidly partnery, and the fact that kkrieg didn't trust my reads is a little shady.  I really think she would go to the effort to at least tell me why mcmcsalot was townie, instead of just telling me why she thought Awaclus was scummy.  The reasoning to stay on the Awa wagon are SUPER weak.  Like none of them are scummy at all. 

The fact that she stayed on Awaclus instead of switching to mcmcsalot with those reasons (and not giving reasons why mcmc was townier than Awa) is really scummy from her.  She generally trusts me a lot more in social deduction games.

Reposting. Good stuff about Robz
Title: Re: M98: Русская Mafia (Day 2)
Post by: schadd on May 02, 2017, 07:02:40 pm
fake hammer: twm
Title: Re: M98: Русская Mafia (Day 2)
Post by: schadd on May 02, 2017, 07:11:40 pm
vote: twm
Title: Re: M98: Русская Mafia (Day 2)
Post by: gkrieg13 on May 02, 2017, 07:13:13 pm
Would be surprised if he was scum.
Title: Re: M98: Русская Mafia (Day 2)
Post by: schadd on May 02, 2017, 07:13:35 pm
thanks for telling me
Title: Re: M98: Русская Mafia (Day 2)
Post by: schadd on May 02, 2017, 07:14:22 pm
like why say that now
Title: Re: M98: Русская Mafia (Day 2)
Post by: gkrieg13 on May 02, 2017, 07:18:44 pm
I guess still possible that he is the SK. Was going to give my full Robz case after work. Been busy with end of semester stuff
Title: Re: M98: Русская Mafia (Day 2)
Post by: gkrieg13 on May 02, 2017, 07:19:11 pm
Did we get scum TWM?
Title: Re: M98: Русская Mafia (Day 2)
Post by: gkrieg13 on May 02, 2017, 07:20:26 pm
Flip probably won't be for a while
Title: Re: M98: Русская Mafia (Day 2)
Post by: schadd on May 02, 2017, 07:21:06 pm
oh yeah tell us who you rb'd if traitor
Title: Re: M98: Русская Mafia (Day 2)
Post by: The_Wine_Merchant on May 02, 2017, 07:36:33 pm
it was a bit of a useless exercise because this is the sort of thing you're good at as scum anyway but i need to do something, at least for you to know what you're dealing with if you're town

All of this felt like schadd trying to make it look like he was actually trying to think about this. But he always wanted to hammer me. Nothing I said actually had an impact on him. Makes him a lot scummier.
Title: Re: M98: Русская Mafia (Day 2)
Post by: The_Wine_Merchant on May 02, 2017, 07:37:24 pm
Did we get scum TWM?
(http://vignette3.wikia.nocookie.net/parksandrecreation/images/3/38/Leslie.png/revision/latest?cb=20111015205925)
Title: Re: M98: Русская Mafia (Day 2)
Post by: The_Wine_Merchant on May 02, 2017, 07:48:03 pm
it was a bit of a useless exercise because this is the sort of thing you're good at as scum anyway but i need to do something, at least for you to know what you're dealing with if you're town

All of this felt like schadd trying to make it look like