Dominion Strategy Forum
Dominion => Dominion General Discussion => Topic started by: Minotaur on April 04, 2017, 05:57:48 pm
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This thread is about defaming your least favorite cards for whatever reasons. Hyperbole is expected and encouraged.
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Sauna/Avanto
Some cards you can tell right away that they're there just to amplify shuffle luck and fuck you over. Before you've even looked at the prize pile, you can tell that Tournament's card art might as well be a piece of buttered toast falling through the air superimposed with the face of Murphy laughing at you. Even if Baker is on the board and you open double Tournament to play it as a Peddler, you know that they're going to land on the bottom of your deck together and the player to your left is going to hook up Vassal with Horse Traders and shuffle the Province into their hand on the turn you play them. You're just totally fucked no matter what, and you already knew there was going to be some dumbass junk prize like a Diadem left over for you to get stuck with with no fucking Villages on the fucking board. Like seriously, fucking Diadem. I knew there was going to be a turd in the prize pile somewhere, but this one exceeded the limits of my imagination.
Some cards are sneakier than Tournament, subtler. Some cards look cute and harmless, but you grow to hate them a little more every time you play with them. Sauna/Avanto is one such card. At first, it looks cute. You're just some rich dude dicking around. I want to warm up, but now I want to cool down, and now I want to warm up again. Look at all this free time I have because I am a rich dude who owns stuff that helps me dick around. But there is a dark, random, game-wreckingly awful demon lurking in the cold and hot places.
This split pile - or perhaps should I say shit pile - is the stealth Tournament of Dominion: 2nd Edition. Once you realize how shitty and unfair this stupid fucking card is, all you can ever do is pray that there's a strong combo on the board that beats it. Otherwise, you can just kiss your buttered toast goodbye as this no-skill piece of shit ruins your game, and there's nothing you can do about it. That toast is landing face down in a pile of dirt, and you're out of paper towels, and that's just Murphy's Law.
Everyone will open Sauna/Silver. The player to your left will collide them, and you won't. You will lose tempo, and the player to your left will have increasingly favorable odds of favorable collisions, rapidly ascending to probability 1, and will be drawing their deck every turn by the fifth shuffle if not sooner. There won't be any villages on the board, but there's this cool thing where Sauna/Avanto/Sauna is equivalent to two fucking Laboratories and a Village, but you can't fucking collide them because you're not the lucky ass motherfucker who was able to collide your Silvers with your Saunas every fucking shuffle and now everyone else is drawing their deck every goddamned turn and you still have five dumbass Coppers and two motherfucking Estates. Like fucking seriously. Strap me on an Acme rocket and fly me into the side of a mountain full of rabid dingos.
If you're player 3 or 4 in a multiplayer, you can fucking forget about ever even getting a second Sauna anyway. You'll just have to decide whether you want yet another Curse from Torturer or not, as your odds of colliding multiple Silvers with a Sauna slowly declines as your Curses fill the spaces between your Sauna and your Silvers because you're Player 3 and you didn't get to trash anything on Shuffle 2, and now there's Curses.
An extra insult is in store in online play to sour the experience, win or lose. If you somehow manage to become the lucky bastard who actually gets to run your engine, you'll get rewarded by constantly being asked whether you want to trash your fucking Provinces four times every fucking turn. Getting the notices to go away is worse than trying to remember how to get Siri to shut the fuck up when you turn off the highway three miles from your house and you know where the fuck you are, fucking stop it Siri my hands are full of coffee and steering wheel!!! while the other players keep texting "hurry the fuck up so I can kill myself ffs" in the chat box.
I mean, Pirate Ship was never fun, but at least it had the decency to suck balls power-wise. Tournament had the decency to wear its general RNG fuckery on its sleeve. Rebuild is mercifully quick, if nothing else good can be said about it.
From the view of player enjoyment, Sauna/Avanto is the worst of all possible worlds.
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P.S.: Ok, it's not too bad for a promo card. I forgot that it wasn't canon because it came out around the same time! Still, I hate it lots!
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but there's this cool thing where Sauna/Avanto/Sauna is equivalent to four fucking Laboratories and a Village
It's 2 Labs and a Village, not 4.
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but there's this cool thing where Sauna/Avanto/Sauna is equivalent to four fucking Laboratories and a Village
It's 2 Labs and a Village, not 4.
Fixed. :)
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I found this very entertaining.
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Staying away from really bad card ideas thread for four days went harsh for Minotaur.
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Staying away from really bad card ideas thread for four days went harsh for Minotaur.
That and Sauna takes me to a really dark place. But srsly, where my RBCI at?
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Yeah, I'm not sure trashing as a benefit for collision is such a good idea. The first person to have them collide gets the benefit, and thereafter the changes of collision are even stronger. Mercenary has a similar problem: if you're lucky enough to have Urchins collide early and use Mercenary to start to trash down, you'll do this even more often than the player that couldn't, especially with a larger hand to choose from.
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Yeah, I'm not sure trashing as a benefit for collision is such a good idea. The first person to have them collide gets the benefit, and thereafter the changes of collision are even stronger. Mercenary has a similar problem: if you're lucky enough to have Urchins collide early and use Mercenary to start to trash down, you'll do this even more often than the player that couldn't, especially with a larger hand to choose from.
I forgot about Urchin. It's not as bad, but on the other hand, it's not a promo card, so it should be held to a higher standard.
I also have some mean things to say about Josephine. I mean seriously, if that card were named after me, and I were friends with Donald before, I wouldn't be anymore.
EDIT: Holy crap, is he trying to get divorced?!?
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I haven't played much recently, is Sauna/Silver really that good? Is it rarely right to do Silver/other $4 and start buying Saunas turn 3 or turn 4?
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I haven't played much recently, is Sauna/Silver really that good? Is it rarely right to do Silver/other $4 and start buying Saunas turn 3 or turn 4?
I'm not actually good at Dominion, but it depends on the board, and more importantly, it massively depends on the shuffle luck. If you have 4 Silver, 2-3 Avanto and 2-3 Sauna, then you'll draw your deck and buy a Province every turn. But the lucky fool who gets the trashing the first two reshuffles is massively ahead if so.
If Chapel is available, you probably don't want to screw around with Sauna. But if it's the only trashing and the only pseudo-village, then things get weird, random, and unfair pretty quickly.
Stupid promo card. I hate you.
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I haven't played much recently, is Sauna/Silver really that good? Is it rarely right to do Silver/other $4 and start buying Saunas turn 3 or turn 4?
It's similar to delaying Urchin to the second shuffle. It can work out, but you may end up regretting it.
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I haven't played much recently, is Sauna/Silver really that good? Is it rarely right to do Silver/other $4 and start buying Saunas turn 3 or turn 4?
If someone wants you to play with Sauna, punch them and say no.
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Similar things can be said for sentry... But I agree Sauna is worse. The most offensive aspect to me though, is actually that this card itself is a too strong engine enabler.
You know, not the best feeling in the world trying hard, but can barely beat a mindless sauna+silver opening (and you know, it is not that bad once you start that pile, just to continue working on that pile).
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Similar things can be said for sentry... But I agree Sauna is worse.
Sentry tries to be Junk Dealer and Cartographer at the same time, but fails too often at both. I get that it's supposed to be an expensive way to play Lookout without all the rage quitting, but it just doesn't seem to work out too often.
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Similar things can be said for sentry... But I agree Sauna is worse.
Sentry tries to be Junk Dealer and Cartographer at the same time, but fails too often at both. I get that it's supposed to be an expensive way to play Lookout without all the rage quitting, but it just doesn't seem to work out too often.
Last time I bought a Sentry it missed the second reshuffle and then hit both my opening buys. It finally hit a single Estate on turn (guessing) 15 or some shit. Fuck Sentry.
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I've never laughed and spit on my keyboard before this thread. Just when I thought it was safe another one would come.
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Sentry is very, very swingy, potentially as much as Sauna/Avanto. The thing is though when Sentry is good it is crazy nuts good. Also, getting 5/2 with Sentry is the definition of unfair since almost always that player will severely out trash the other player and win in a landslide.
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Similar things can be said for sentry... But I agree Sauna is worse.
Sentry tries to be Junk Dealer and Cartographer at the same time, but fails too often at both. I get that it's supposed to be an expensive way to play Lookout without all the rage quitting, but it just doesn't seem to work out too often.
Last time I bought a Sentry it missed the second reshuffle and then hit both my opening buys. It finally hit a single Estate on turn (guessing) 15 or some shit. Fuck Sentry.
This seriously happens to me every single time I go for Sentry. I have never been able to consistently trash more than four or five cards with it, tops. It's massively overrated.
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(http://i.imgur.com/eWWGG4W.jpg)
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Sealab 2021 reference:
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=2J1gCcP8ZnM
Their first Magpie: I gotta have a baby, I gotta have a baby, I gotta have a baby!
Your first Magpie: Hesh wants some SEX! Hesh wants SEX! *thrusts a Copper in your face*
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You know I think you've missed the king of bend-over-going-in-dry here, that moment where long to grab the deck and pitch it straight at your opponent, force feed him cardboard while he chokes. That horrific moment when your opponent plays Page->Warrior. And you have a Warrior. And it's not in your hand, and it's in your deck, and you know, you just know, you just know what's in the top two cards. It's your own fucking Warrior, who will not be joining you on this magical adventure. Nor will the next Warrior, because she's taking a trip to trashville too. Meanwhile your opponent is assembling his engine of terminal actions because why the fuck not, you haven't even PLAYED a goddamn Warrior this game, nor will you ever, because two are in the trash and three are in their deck, smirking at you.
And you just have to sit back and ask "what drooling neanderthal at Rio Grande smashed their club on the keyboard and accidentally copied text from the 'cards too stupid to be put in Dominion' file into Warrior's textbox?" Because man, the worst possible thing that could happen in a "chain these actions together to win the game" card would be for some stupid attack to trash one in the middle of the chain. That would just be awful! So let's print it on the middle card of the chain! Then we'll make the end card of the chain make you immune to that effect so that if life kicks you in the balls once, it'll kick you in the balls if you try to get up again!
Fucking Page line.
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You know I think you've missed the king of bend-over-going-in-dry here, that moment where long to grab the deck and pitch it straight at your opponent, force feed him cardboard while he chokes. That horrific moment when your opponent plays Page->Warrior. And you have a Warrior. And it's not in your hand, and it's in your deck, and you know, you just know, you just know what's in the top two cards. It's your own fucking Warrior, who will not be joining you on this magical adventure. Nor will the next Warrior, because she's taking a trip to trashville too. Meanwhile your opponent is assembling his engine of terminal actions because why the fuck not, you haven't even PLAYED a goddamn Warrior this game, nor will you ever, because two are in the trash and three are in their deck, smirking at you.
And you just have to sit back and ask "what drooling neanderthal at Rio Grande smashed their club on the keyboard and accidentally copied text from the 'cards too stupid to be put in Dominion' file into Warrior's textbox?" Because man, the worst possible thing that could happen in a "chain these actions together to win the game" card would be for some stupid attack to trash one in the middle of the chain. That would just be awful! So let's print it on the middle card of the chain! Then we'll make the end card of the chain make you immune to that effect so that if life kicks you in the balls once, it'll kick you in the balls if you try to get up again!
Fucking Page line.
Also happens with Sea Hag. And Knights. And Giants.
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You know I think you've missed the king of bend-over-going-in-dry here, that moment where long to grab the deck and pitch it straight at your opponent, force feed him cardboard while he chokes. That horrific moment when your opponent plays Page->Warrior. And you have a Warrior. And it's not in your hand, and it's in your deck, and you know, you just know, you just know what's in the top two cards. It's your own fucking Warrior, who will not be joining you on this magical adventure. Nor will the next Warrior, because she's taking a trip to trashville too. Meanwhile your opponent is assembling his engine of terminal actions because why the fuck not, you haven't even PLAYED a goddamn Warrior this game, nor will you ever, because two are in the trash and three are in their deck, smirking at you.
And you just have to sit back and ask "what drooling neanderthal at Rio Grande smashed their club on the keyboard and accidentally copied text from the 'cards too stupid to be put in Dominion' file into Warrior's textbox?" Because man, the worst possible thing that could happen in a "chain these actions together to win the game" card would be for some stupid attack to trash one in the middle of the chain. That would just be awful! So let's print it on the middle card of the chain! Then we'll make the end card of the chain make you immune to that effect so that if life kicks you in the balls once, it'll kick you in the balls if you try to get up again!
Fucking Page line.
The thing that pisses me off about Sauna/Avanto, though, is that everyone expects Tournament/Warrior/etc to be totally unfair. I never really stopped to think how horrible it is to have only five copies available before, though.
Four-player Page games should probably be made a federal crime, since Warrior duels become significantly more likely while simultaneously that much less likely to be recovered from. Worst of all, Warrior is the least likely to be Exchanged Traveler in the sequence (aside from the very first). Not only do some go in the trash, but once you win the race, you would be incentivized to collect Warriors even if it were not a simple denial tactic.
Write to your senator or equivalent legislator for your national government. This cannot be allowed anywhere ever.
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You know I think you've missed the king of bend-over-going-in-dry here, that moment where long to grab the deck and pitch it straight at your opponent, force feed him cardboard while he chokes. That horrific moment when your opponent plays Page->Warrior. And you have a Warrior. And it's not in your hand, and it's in your deck, and you know, you just know, you just know what's in the top two cards. It's your own fucking Warrior, who will not be joining you on this magical adventure. Nor will the next Warrior, because she's taking a trip to trashville too. Meanwhile your opponent is assembling his engine of terminal actions because why the fuck not, you haven't even PLAYED a goddamn Warrior this game, nor will you ever, because two are in the trash and three are in their deck, smirking at you.
And you just have to sit back and ask "what drooling neanderthal at Rio Grande smashed their club on the keyboard and accidentally copied text from the 'cards too stupid to be put in Dominion' file into Warrior's textbox?" Because man, the worst possible thing that could happen in a "chain these actions together to win the game" card would be for some stupid attack to trash one in the middle of the chain. That would just be awful! So let's print it on the middle card of the chain! Then we'll make the end card of the chain make you immune to that effect so that if life kicks you in the balls once, it'll kick you in the balls if you try to get up again!
Fucking Page line.
Also happens with Sea Hag. And Knights. And Giants.
At least Knights trash each other. (But if two Knights clash in multiplayer, each player not involved in the clash is the winner.)