| xxxx | Column1 | Column2 | Column3 | Column4 | Add-On |
| Row1 | VT | Detective | 1-shot Commuter | Goon Cop | 1-shot Investigation Immune/SK |
| Row2 | Watcher | JK | VT | Psychologist | 2-shot JOAT |
| Row3 | 1-shot Bulletproof Townie | VT | JK | Bodyguard | Traitor Knows Mafia |
| Row4 | 1-shot Commuter | Psychologist | Detective | VT | Mafia Knows Traitor |
| Add-On | 2-shot JOAT | Mafia Knows Traitor/SK | TraitorKnows Mafia/SK | 1-shot Investigation Immune | xxxxxxx |
This says it is for 11 and 12 people in different places
Gosh I desperately want to play this setup. /in to reserve a seat, will give that seat up if it starts too soon
/in
/inYou!
Yes indeed!/inYou!
Yes indeed!/inYou!
I forget, are you one of my archenemies?
Ah yes. I recall that.Yes indeed!/inYou!
I forget, are you one of my archenemies?
It was his first game and he was at 3p LyLo and you fooled him :D
Ah yes. I recall that.Yes indeed!/inYou!
I forget, are you one of my archenemies?
It was his first game and he was at 3p LyLo and you fooled him :D
Have we met before?
Ah. So another talented newcomer. I should probably brush up on the games I've missed myself.
What's the lowdown on me then?
Yes indeed!/inYou!
I forget, are you one of my archenemies?
It was his first game and he was at 3p LyLo and you fooled him :D
If you townread IG, he will townread you :P. If you scumread him...
Yes indeed!/inYou!
I forget, are you one of my archenemies?
It was his first game and he was at 3p LyLo and you fooled him :D
Even though his handwriting was super scummy! As opposed to my voice, which did not at all sound like the voice of a serial killer.
If I would've heard your voice during the game, I probably wouldn't have voted for you.Yes indeed!/inYou!
I forget, are you one of my archenemies?
It was his first game and he was at 3p LyLo and you fooled him :D
Even though his handwriting was super scummy! As opposed to my voice, which did not at all sound like the voice of a serial killer.
If you townread IG, he will townread you :P. If you scumread him...Well of course. When I'm town only scum finds me scummy.
Am I /in time for this? :-)
Am I /in time for this? :-)
Wow, looks like you hammered!
Am I /in time for this? :-)
Wow, looks like you hammered!
Tee hee.. and at 2am Moscow time, you're so excited by the game that you comment on my post within a minute :-P
Am I /in time for this? :-)
Wow, looks like you hammered!
Tee hee.. and at 2am Moscow time, you're so excited by the game that you comment on my post within a minute :-P
I just finished watching another shitty Dolan movie and heading to bed :P
Ok, the game is full as of now. M91 just started and I really don't want to start basically at the same time. Unless everyone wants to play this game immediately I still plan on waiting until M91 is at least at N1.
Remember to submit an xkcd comic to me if you want it to be used in your flavor.Does flavor have an impact on the game?
Remember to submit an xkcd comic to me if you want it to be used in your flavor.Does flavor have an impact on the game?
If we don't submit a comic, will we be assigned a random one or will you handpick one?
I'm finally town! What you just heard was a huge sigh of relief.Me too!
So let's see. I don't reckognize schadd or SpaceAnenome or Calamitas. I've never played with LaLight either, but I think he's gonna be my buddy.
That said, how about vote: schadd.
Also what do people know about this Robz guy?
Oh. And I would be having my first day of classes tomorrow, but it's a snow day!
So expect active Ichi 8)
I was joking about Robz. But information is always good. ;)
Oh.I was joking about Robz. But information is always good. ;)
Yeah, i know, but nevertheless last few Robz ganes he was always scum and always won, idk if you followed :)
Oh.I was joking about Robz. But information is always good. ;)
Yeah, i know, but nevertheless last few Robz ganes he was always scum and always won, idk if you followed :)
Yeah I was gonna ask what are the important games I've missed.
PPE: 1
Can anyone ever really know Robz is the question...
He was one of my mentors, three years ago.
I have him down as one of the unreadable people.
Robz888: The Man, The Myth, The Legend, and an unofficial guide to reading him:
If he lives past day 2, he is scum.
Mm. Generally when I'm town scum likes to vote for me.Can anyone ever really know Robz is the question...
He was one of my mentors, three years ago.
I have him down as one of the unreadable people.
any hints how to read you?
Has Calamitas ever been scum?
I feel like I've gotten to know Space, LaLight, and Calamitas really well over the past few games. I've been scum with two out of three. Will be interesting to try to read them here.
Gkrieg has read me freakishly well. If he says I'm scum, believe him. Except, if he says it here, he's a liar.
Well I hope you're town then, because I'll probably just sheep your reads on them.Not mine? :(
Sure!Well I hope you're town then, because I'll probably just sheep your reads on them.Not mine? :(
Oh.I was joking about Robz. But information is always good. ;)
Yeah, i know, but nevertheless last few Robz ganes he was always scum and always won, idk if you followed :)
Yeah I was gonna ask what are the important games I've missed.
PPE: 1
To know Calamitas and Robz read M88. To know Space Anemone, read Newbie 8. To know me, well i was scum once in my second ever game, M86, but i'm better as town.
There is some setup talk to be done here if I remember correctly. Will have to investigate later
There is some setup talk to be done here if I remember correctly. Will have to investigate later
1. Calamitas
2. Roadrunner7671
3. Awaclus
4. Robz888
5. LaLight
6. faust
7. Ichimaru Gin
8. Eevee
9. gkrieg13
10. schadd
11. SpaceAnemone
Vote: EeveeDidn't you see my first post? I'm town this time!
Because he's clearly always scum :-P
Vote: EeveeDidn't you see my first post? I'm town this time!
Because he's clearly always scum :-P
And, you know, I'm not a great lynch candidate since if I'm scum, the eventual massclaim is my big Achilles heel. Better to leave me alive for that.
vote: WW for being a traitor
vote: WW for being a traitor
Only mafia can know traitor in some setups... vote: gkrieg
So setup talking stuff. It's happening. I think I'm having the same thoughts I had in the last run.
Not all claims are created equal. Some will give us more setup information than others. There are roles in the setup matrix that exist exactly once. Take, for instance, the Bodyguard. This role has a unique place in Column4/Row3. This means that a Bodyguard claim would reduce the number of possible setups for us to 2. Any other PR would even know exactly which setup we are in. This means the for the rest of the game, scum cannot claim a PR without being counterclaimed.
The flip side of this is of course that we give scum setup information. From such a claim, scum will be able to deduce the exact setup. But I don't think that's such a big issue. They already have a pretty good idea anyway.
Then of course one needs to assess how much a PR is hurt by claiming. I think that Bodyguard is a pretty weak PR anyway and it may well be worth it to claim. Goon Cop and Watcher, two other unique roles, of course shouldn't claim. The remaining role is the 1-shot BP, which is a bit of a tossup for me.
Claiming early has certain advantages here as this is a relatively small game and the possiblity of a SK means it could move to LyLo-ish situations pretty quick, and then claims are no longer reliable.
vote: WW for being a traitor
Only mafia can know traitor in some setups... vote: gkrieg
While the mafia would most certainly like to communicate their identity to a traitor, I expect a bit more subtlety from scum!gkrieg.
Then again, it's possible he's banking on that. And using the word traitor in connection with a specific name is definitely a scum thing to do in this setup.
Okay, vote: gkrieg
I forgot that WW is not in this game.vote: WW for being a traitor
Only mafia can know traitor in some setups... vote: gkrieg
While the mafia would most certainly like to communicate their identity to a traitor, I expect a bit more subtlety from scum!gkrieg.
Then again, it's possible he's banking on that. And using the word traitor in connection with a specific name is definitely a scum thing to do in this setup.
Okay, vote: gkrieg
I get the first part, but I don't get the second part. Why does using the word traitor in connection with a specific name (a person not in this game, and that I vote every RVS) scummy?
Also if we all breadcrumb that we are the traitor, isn't that a good thing?
Why did you make that post? (Referring to the original traitor - post.)vote: WW for being a traitor
Only mafia can know traitor in some setups... vote: gkrieg
While the mafia would most certainly like to communicate their identity to a traitor, I expect a bit more subtlety from scum!gkrieg.
Then again, it's possible he's banking on that. And using the word traitor in connection with a specific name is definitely a scum thing to do in this setup.
Okay, vote: gkrieg
I get the first part, but I don't get the second part. Why does using the word traitor in connection with a specific name (a person not in this game, and that I vote every RVS) scummy?
Why did you make that post? (Referring to the original traitor - post.)vote: WW for being a traitor
Only mafia can know traitor in some setups... vote: gkrieg
While the mafia would most certainly like to communicate their identity to a traitor, I expect a bit more subtlety from scum!gkrieg.
Then again, it's possible he's banking on that. And using the word traitor in connection with a specific name is definitely a scum thing to do in this setup.
Okay, vote: gkrieg
I get the first part, but I don't get the second part. Why does using the word traitor in connection with a specific name (a person not in this game, and that I vote every RVS) scummy?
No!!
All my experiences with gkrieg lead me to be believe that he is a very sharp guy. Making traitor-jokes in this setup is.. not good. Isn't that post almost akin to someone breadcrumbing a town role that can only exist once, and then the person who actually has that role dying (and flipping their role) later and someone catching the breadcrumb someone else made. The traitor does want to signal their existence to the mafia, so there is the clear scum narrative for doing something like that, but town really has no reason to do it.
So, I'm wondering if I'm missing something. Admittedly,itt does seem a little on the nose for him to do as the traitor, hence my question.
Also if we all breadcrumb that we are the traitor, isn't that a good thing?
Plus, if I really were the traitor, why would I place that in my first post?So did you or didn't you breadcrumb Traitor?
The analogy is just meant to be a situation where someone does something that town would never have any incentive to do (breadcrumb a role they don't have <-> make a post about the traitor willy-nilly), when there is a scum narrative for it (as scum wants to do those things).No!!
All my experiences with gkrieg lead me to be believe that he is a very sharp guy. Making traitor-jokes in this setup is.. not good. Isn't that post almost akin to someone breadcrumbing a town role that can only exist once, and then the person who actually has that role dying (and flipping their role) later and someone catching the breadcrumb someone else made. The traitor does want to signal their existence to the mafia, so there is the clear scum narrative for doing something like that, but town really has no reason to do it.
So, I'm wondering if I'm missing something. Admittedly,itt does seem a little on the nose for him to do as the traitor, hence my question.
I don't know why people are making such a big deal of this. I thought it would be fun to try to confuse scum. If they have more than one person signalling traitor to them, who do they kill?
I also don't really think your analogy works here. If the traitor actually dies, no one is going to look at my breadcrumb and think "oh he was lying about being the traitor, he must be mafia".
I mean, you cannot argue that you meant to confuse scum and that your post was so on the nose that it couldn't possibly come from Traitor!you.FTFM
Plus, if I really were the traitor, why would I place that in my first post?Except you would want to say exactly that. If you were catched with a subtle breadcrumbing there is no way you would get out of there. And the probability of scum catching the subtle one is actually smaller than the probability of town doing so (basically same info but more people).
I remember vigging Seprix in a game because he used the word traitor in his first post of the game. I would know to be much more subtle in a game where it is known that there is a traitor.
Plus, if I really were the traitor, why would I place that in my first post?To be fair, I also think gkrieg could have faked some theory around the traitor-post if he wanted to, which would point towards this being an honest mistake and not a ploy.
I remember vigging Seprix in a game because he used the word traitor in his first post of the game. I would know to be much more subtle in a game where it is known that there is a traitor.
I did not think gkrieg was breadcrumbing traitor, and if he was, maybe he's town and wants to screw with mafia. So this is a total null thing that does not matter.His breadcrumbing does not matter, but his defense was scummy.
I did not think gkrieg was breadcrumbing traitor, and if he was, maybe he's town and wants to screw with mafia. So this is a total null thing that does not matter.
Sorry being defensive probably because of IRL things not because of this game. I also thought it would be a good idea, and was surprised that I got so many votes for it at the very beginning of the game.Would you also react to my questions please?
At least we kind of skipped RVS, and I got some good reactions.
Also if we all breadcrumb that we are the traitor, isn't that a good thing?Plus, if I really were the traitor, why would I place that in my first post?So did you or didn't you breadcrumb Traitor?
Interesting! What was your plan?
So your ploy was to make a post that singals to scum that you are the Traitor while at the same time making it clear to everyone that you couldn't possibly be the Traitor?Also if we all breadcrumb that we are the traitor, isn't that a good thing?Plus, if I really were the traitor, why would I place that in my first post?So did you or didn't you breadcrumb Traitor?
Yes I did. It was a ploy that is now ruined.
I did not think gkrieg was breadcrumbing traitor, and if he was, maybe he's town and wants to screw with mafia. So this is a total null thing that does not matter.
... says the person who did not actually breadcrumb vig last game!
Sorry for being quiet. Busy day at work, but I'll read things properly when I'm home in an hour or two.
I did not think gkrieg was breadcrumbing traitor, and if he was, maybe he's town and wants to screw with mafia. So this is a total null thing that does not matter.
... says the person who did not actually breadcrumb vig last game!
Sorry for being quiet. Busy day at work, but I'll read things properly when I'm home in an hour or two.
It was sort of an unintentionally misleading fake breadcrumb.
I have a hard time believing that town!gkrieg would go for a "let's act scummy to see who votes for me" strategy.Interesting! What was your plan?
Well, if mafia thought I was the traitor, I wouldn't be killed N1, and they wouldn't know who the real traitor was.
Also, I could see if people caught on and voted for me (I didn't think this would be so sudden!) and that would give me some kind of information.
So your ploy was to make a post that singals to scum that you are the Traitor while at the same time making it clear to everyone that you couldn't possibly be the Traitor?Also if we all breadcrumb that we are the traitor, isn't that a good thing?Plus, if I really were the traitor, why would I place that in my first post?So did you or didn't you breadcrumb Traitor?
Yes I did. It was a ploy that is now ruined.
town town town town town (https://youtu.be/p6Fdm3-dnr0?t=40s)
I did not think gkrieg was breadcrumbing traitor, and if he was, maybe he's town and wants to screw with mafia. So this is a total null thing that does not matter.
I did not think gkrieg was breadcrumbing traitor, and if he was, maybe he's town and wants to screw with mafia. So this is a total null thing that does not matter.
Of all the commentary on gkrieg's breadcrumb and faust's questioning of it, this is the post that feels scummiest to me.
To me, the comment and the various reactions to it clearly matter, and it's the best non-null thing we've got going, since other than my vote on Eevee, we seem to have got away with pretty much no RVS, which is great. So why is Robz so eager to move on and not examine gkrieg's motives? I mean, if he wants to go back to faust's setup discussion or something, that's great, but he's just kind of trying to put the dampers on one conversation and not even divert to a new thing.
That said,is scummy
Well, I was joking when I voted for gkrieg, though his defence is really scummy. And THIS and this alone makes gkrieg town. See "Robz alignment indicators". Scum!gkrieg would defend himself so perfectly, you would not suspect him of anything for another 4-5 games. This is not the case, for now, town on gkrieg. UnvoteHow can you have a town read on gkrieg when 0 alignment-indicative events happened?
Prod: Awaclus i suppose?
Slight scum on everyone else. Exactly 0 alignment-indicative events happened.
Well, I was joking when I voted for gkrieg, though his defence is really scummy. And THIS and this alone makes gkrieg town. See "Robz alignment indicators". Scum!gkrieg would defend himself so perfectly, you would not suspect him of anything for another 4-5 games. This is not the case, for now, town on gkrieg. UnvoteHow can you have a town read on gkrieg when 0 alignment-indicative events happened?
Prod: Awaclus i suppose?
Slight scum on everyone else. Exactly 0 alignment-indicative events happened.
Also I am not sure that gkrieg is as good a scum player as Robz. I don't have a standout memory from a gkrieg scum game, could you provide one?
Vote: LaLight
I don't know, seems like you are trying to contribute without really saying anything. As faust points out, it's very odd to say nothing that's happened is alignment-indicative if you also developed a town read for gkrieg from it.
Unvote We are cool.
i mean it sorta makes sense. scum will be combing the thread for breadcrumbs n softclaims, much more than town (see M86). granted, the ploy has fuckall chance of working, but, i mean, as far as first posts go, it's not the dumbest thing to do.
what's happened?That said,is scummy
uh, thanks, everyone, for telling everyone how to read everyone
not a fan of the "always scum" epidemic
RR might be town
eevee might be town
i forgive you, sa
sa might be scum
spqr
ooh, wait. if there is an SK, i think that it might serve them to claim now for reasons i will explain later
I realized we are pretty much in agreement, and I was just jumping on the way you worded your post, which is dumb from my part. But at least we got you reacting to a vote out of this!Unvote We are cool.
nono, I know we're cool, i didn't try to AtE, it's just I didn't get the reasoning behind the vote :)
I realized we are pretty much in agreement, and I was just jumping on the way you worded your post, which is dumb from my part. But at least we got you reacting to a vote out of this!Unvote We are cool.
nono, I know we're cool, i didn't try to AtE, it's just I didn't get the reasoning behind the vote :)
I don't think I've ever played with schadd before. I anticipate having a tough time reading him (is it him?).
Well, I was joking when I voted for gkrieg, though his defence is really scummy. And THIS and this alone makes gkrieg town. See "Robz alignment indicators". Scum!gkrieg would defend himself so perfectly, you would not suspect him of anything for another 4-5 games. This is not the case, for now, town on gkrieg. Unvote
Prod: Awaclus i suppose?
Slight scum on everyone else. Exactly 0 alignment-indicative events happened.
Well, I was joking when I voted for gkrieg, though his defence is really scummy. And THIS and this alone makes gkrieg town. See "Robz alignment indicators". Scum!gkrieg would defend himself so perfectly, you would not suspect him of anything for another 4-5 games. This is not the case, for now, town on gkrieg. Unvote
Prod: Awaclus i suppose?
Slight scum on everyone else. Exactly 0 alignment-indicative events happened.
I don't think I can get prodded, I just posted like 14 hours ago.
I don't know what to think about that post. Typical schadd. What's spqr btw?Senatus Populusque Romanus
Vote: LaLightIt's true that gkrieg's play doesn't add up if if was really supposed to be Traitor signaling. But it also doesn't add up as a town ploy. I don't really that much think he's a Traitor, but that doesn't mean he cannot be scum.
I don't know, seems like you are trying to contribute without really saying anything. As faust points out, it's very odd to say nothing that's happened is alignment-indicative if you also developed a town read for gkrieg from it.
I think, based on gkrieg's reaction, he was surprised about the reaction for this. I think had he cooked this up as a scheme (as a traitor), he would have anticipated a reaction like this being possible more likely than town!him just thinking of a ploy on a whim and posting it, and now being surprised how it's received. All in all, I thinkfor someone capable of being measured, like gkrieg, this is a town tell. Wasn't it totally a thing in the past that our day 1 lynches were always town that had tried something a little unorthodox?
So yeah, a slight townread on gkrieg, because I think the narrative fits better that way. Glad to warp through RVS like this, so well done gkrieg in that regard!
I know that town!gkrieg is worried about being lynched D1, so why open with a post that would make him look scummy?What do you think of my theory that when good players do unexpected, arguably anti-town things, especially day 1, they are usually town, because as scum they'd be more careful not to do them?
I know that town!gkrieg is worried about being lynched D1, so why open with a post that would make him look scummy?
Usually I would agree, but what confuses me here is that gkrieg apparently still thinks his post was a good idea.I know that town!gkrieg is worried about being lynched D1, so why open with a post that would make him look scummy?What do you think of my theory that when good players do unexpected, arguably anti-town things, especially day 1, they are usually town, because as scum they'd be more careful not to do them?
Isn't scum!gkrieg even more likely to not want to look scummy? People put way more thought into their scum games, in my experience, although this is general, not some assumption or read on gkrieg specifically.
Usually I would agree, but what confuses me here is that gkrieg apparently still thinks his post was a good idea.I know that town!gkrieg is worried about being lynched D1, so why open with a post that would make him look scummy?What do you think of my theory that when good players do unexpected, arguably anti-town things, especially day 1, they are usually town, because as scum they'd be more careful not to do them?
Isn't scum!gkrieg even more likely to not want to look scummy? People put way more thought into their scum games, in my experience, although this is general, not some assumption or read on gkrieg specifically.
I don't know what to think about that post. Typical schadd. What's spqr btw?Senatus Populusque Romanus
Usually I would agree, but what confuses me here is that gkrieg apparently still thinks his post was a good idea.I know that town!gkrieg is worried about being lynched D1, so why open with a post that would make him look scummy?What do you think of my theory that when good players do unexpected, arguably anti-town things, especially day 1, they are usually town, because as scum they'd be more careful not to do them?
Isn't scum!gkrieg even more likely to not want to look scummy? People put way more thought into their scum games, in my experience, although this is general, not some assumption or read on gkrieg specifically.
I sort of agree too, though also what about the motivation for sk!gkrieg to post something like what he did? I did a bit more musing on that last night..
So, posting what he did, gkrieg ends up looking a bit scummy, so the scums themselves don't want to pick him off even if they know he's not the real traitor (because some set-ups let them know who it is anyway). To the scums, anyone looking a little scummy is better left alive to begin with. There's one modifier that scums might have that never intersects with an SK, and three that do, so chances are, they're in a position of thinking it's 50-50 whether or not an SK exists.
To the rest of us, there's a less-than-50% chance of there being an SK anyway. Certain roles (3/4 of the ones that only appear once) are incompatible with SK at all. For the other ones, Detective existing means a 75% chance of an SK, 1-shot commuter, goon cop and jailkeeper each give a 50% chance, and psychologist gives 25%. Anyway, we're likely to be confused (as we were!), but would rather hunt for actual scums rather than kill a traitor who isn't able to do the NK, given that we have a low(ish) prior on the existence of an SK.
tl;dr maybe I'm a little more suspicious of gkrieg than yesterday, but for different reasons, and while I think that would have been a cunning play as an SK, the chance of him actually being SK is really low.
I now expect to get voted a little bit for talking about SKs and reading the setup thoroughly, but in my defence, LL already pointed me out as a setupsy person :-)
I now expect to get voted a little bit for talking about SKs and reading the setup thoroughly, but in my defence, LL already pointed me out as a setupsy person :-)Well at least I don't have to surprise you!
I now expect to get voted a little bit for talking about SKs and reading the setup thoroughly, but in my defence, LL already pointed me out as a setupsy person :-)Well at least I don't have to surprise you!
Vote: Space-A
Vote: Space
SK hunting/theorizing is one of the only generic scumtells I actually believe in.
Well, I was joking when I voted for gkrieg, though his defence is really scummy. And THIS and this alone makes gkrieg town. See "Robz alignment indicators". Scum!gkrieg would defend himself so perfectly, you would not suspect him of anything for another 4-5 games. This is not the case, for now, town on gkrieg. Unvote
Well, I was joking when I voted for gkrieg, though his defence is really scummy. And THIS and this alone makes gkrieg town. See "Robz alignment indicators". Scum!gkrieg would defend himself so perfectly, you would not suspect him of anything for another 4-5 games. This is not the case, for now, town on gkrieg. Unvote
This is a good post.
Vote: Space
SK hunting/theorizing is one of the only generic scumtells I actually believe in.
What will you tell about schadd mentioning of SK then?
Vote: Space
SK hunting/theorizing is one of the only generic scumtells I actually believe in.
What will you tell about schadd mentioning of SK then?
I sort of agree too, though also what about the motivation for sk!gkrieg to post something like what he did? I did a bit more musing on that last night..
So, posting what he did, gkrieg ends up looking a bit scummy, so the scums themselves don't want to pick him off even if they know he's not the real traitor (because some set-ups let them know who it is anyway). To the scums, anyone looking a little scummy is better left alive to begin with. There's one modifier that scums might have that never intersects with an SK, and three that do, so chances are, they're in a position of thinking it's 50-50 whether or not an SK exists.
To the rest of us, there's a less-than-50% chance of there being an SK anyway. Certain roles (3/4 of the ones that only appear once) are incompatible with SK at all. For the other ones, Detective existing means a 75% chance of an SK, 1-shot commuter, goon cop and jailkeeper each give a 50% chance, and psychologist gives 25%. Anyway, we're likely to be confused (as we were!), but would rather hunt for actual scums rather than kill a traitor who isn't able to do the NK, given that we have a low(ish) prior on the existence of an SK.
tl;dr maybe I'm a little more suspicious of gkrieg than yesterday, but for different reasons, and while I think that would have been a cunning play as an SK, the chance of him actually being SK is really low.
I now expect to get voted a little bit for talking about SKs and reading the setup thoroughly, but in my defence, LL already pointed me out as a setupsy person :-)
Vote: Space
SK hunting/theorizing is one of the only generic scumtells I actually believe in.
What will you tell about schadd mentioning of SK then?
Merely "mentioning" the SK, as faust and schadd did, is fine. Space went significantly further than that:I sort of agree too, though also what about the motivation for sk!gkrieg to post something like what he did? I did a bit more musing on that last night..
So, posting what he did, gkrieg ends up looking a bit scummy, so the scums themselves don't want to pick him off even if they know he's not the real traitor (because some set-ups let them know who it is anyway). To the scums, anyone looking a little scummy is better left alive to begin with. There's one modifier that scums might have that never intersects with an SK, and three that do, so chances are, they're in a position of thinking it's 50-50 whether or not an SK exists.
To the rest of us, there's a less-than-50% chance of there being an SK anyway. Certain roles (3/4 of the ones that only appear once) are incompatible with SK at all. For the other ones, Detective existing means a 75% chance of an SK, 1-shot commuter, goon cop and jailkeeper each give a 50% chance, and psychologist gives 25%. Anyway, we're likely to be confused (as we were!), but would rather hunt for actual scums rather than kill a traitor who isn't able to do the NK, given that we have a low(ish) prior on the existence of an SK.
tl;dr maybe I'm a little more suspicious of gkrieg than yesterday, but for different reasons, and while I think that would have been a cunning play as an SK, the chance of him actually being SK is really low.
I now expect to get voted a little bit for talking about SKs and reading the setup thoroughly, but in my defence, LL already pointed me out as a setupsy person :-)
Merely "mentioning" the SK, as faust and schadd did, is fine. Space went significantly further than that:I sort of agree too, though also what about the motivation for sk!gkrieg to post something like what he did? I did a bit more musing on that last night..
So, posting what he did, gkrieg ends up looking a bit scummy, so the scums themselves don't want to pick him off even if they know he's not the real traitor (because some set-ups let them know who it is anyway). To the scums, anyone looking a little scummy is better left alive to begin with. There's one modifier that scums might have that never intersects with an SK, and three that do, so chances are, they're in a position of thinking it's 50-50 whether or not an SK exists.
To the rest of us, there's a less-than-50% chance of there being an SK anyway. Certain roles (3/4 of the ones that only appear once) are incompatible with SK at all. For the other ones, Detective existing means a 75% chance of an SK, 1-shot commuter, goon cop and jailkeeper each give a 50% chance, and psychologist gives 25%. Anyway, we're likely to be confused (as we were!), but would rather hunt for actual scums rather than kill a traitor who isn't able to do the NK, given that we have a low(ish) prior on the existence of an SK.
tl;dr maybe I'm a little more suspicious of gkrieg than yesterday, but for different reasons, and while I think that would have been a cunning play as an SK, the chance of him actually being SK is really low.
I now expect to get voted a little bit for talking about SKs and reading the setup thoroughly, but in my defence, LL already pointed me out as a setupsy person :-)
Prod: Awaclus
Why does the SK want to make the mafia think he is the Traitor? The mafia can recruit the traitor in this setup, yes? The SK doesn't want to convince the mafia to shoot him.
Maybe I'm missing something, you've clearly thought about this way more than I have, which, again, speaks volumes.
Why does the SK want to make the mafia think he is the Traitor? The mafia can recruit the traitor in this setup, yes? The SK doesn't want to convince the mafia to shoot him.
Maybe I'm missing something, you've clearly thought about this way more than I have, which, again, speaks volumes.
Most of those volumes are about differences in our character, I guess.
I think M84 (BSG) is the only game I've seen a traitor in before. That was a closed set-up (plus gkrieg vigged him on N1 anyway) so there was no real traitor-related set-up discussion. I hadn't actually twigged that conversion was a thing for this game, which may sound odd, but that key sentence is hidden as the second sentence on a bullet-point two thirds of the way down the mechanics words. In all my prior werewolf experience, we had a really common role called "dark villager", so I assumed "traitor" was a bit like that: a "townie" on the scum side. So my analysis works really well for that, but not so well if the traitor has the chance of becoming a scum themself. Urgh.
Looks like. I buy it.Why does the SK want to make the mafia think he is the Traitor? The mafia can recruit the traitor in this setup, yes? The SK doesn't want to convince the mafia to shoot him.
Maybe I'm missing something, you've clearly thought about this way more than I have, which, again, speaks volumes.
Most of those volumes are about differences in our character, I guess.
I think M84 (BSG) is the only game I've seen a traitor in before. That was a closed set-up (plus gkrieg vigged him on N1 anyway) so there was no real traitor-related set-up discussion. I hadn't actually twigged that conversion was a thing for this game, which may sound odd, but that key sentence is hidden as the second sentence on a bullet-point two thirds of the way down the mechanics words. In all my prior werewolf experience, we had a really common role called "dark villager", so I assumed "traitor" was a bit like that: a "townie" on the scum side. So my analysis works really well for that, but not so well if the traitor has the chance of becoming a scum themself. Urgh.
Wait, you are now claiming you did not know that the mafia can recruit the Traitor?
Looks like. I buy it.Why does the SK want to make the mafia think he is the Traitor? The mafia can recruit the traitor in this setup, yes? The SK doesn't want to convince the mafia to shoot him.
Maybe I'm missing something, you've clearly thought about this way more than I have, which, again, speaks volumes.
Most of those volumes are about differences in our character, I guess.
I think M84 (BSG) is the only game I've seen a traitor in before. That was a closed set-up (plus gkrieg vigged him on N1 anyway) so there was no real traitor-related set-up discussion. I hadn't actually twigged that conversion was a thing for this game, which may sound odd, but that key sentence is hidden as the second sentence on a bullet-point two thirds of the way down the mechanics words. In all my prior werewolf experience, we had a really common role called "dark villager", so I assumed "traitor" was a bit like that: a "townie" on the scum side. So my analysis works really well for that, but not so well if the traitor has the chance of becoming a scum themself. Urgh.
Wait, you are now claiming you did not know that the mafia can recruit the Traitor?
vote: gkrieg again I guess.
I know that town!gkrieg is worried about being lynched D1, so why open with a post that would make him look scummy?
Usually I would agree, but what confuses me here is that gkrieg apparently still thinks his post was a good idea.I know that town!gkrieg is worried about being lynched D1, so why open with a post that would make him look scummy?What do you think of my theory that when good players do unexpected, arguably anti-town things, especially day 1, they are usually town, because as scum they'd be more careful not to do them?
Isn't scum!gkrieg even more likely to not want to look scummy? People put way more thought into their scum games, in my experience, although this is general, not some assumption or read on gkrieg specifically.
vote: Awaclus
I think his is the scummiest vote on SA
Vote: Eevee
How did you manage to see the reasoning when I put it in invisible font? >:(Vote: Eevee
I see the reasoning but really? Too easy
How did you manage to see the reasoning when I put it in invisible font? >:(Vote: Eevee
I see the reasoning but really? Too easy
How did you manage to see the reasoning when I put it in invisible font? >:(Vote: Eevee
I see the reasoning but really? Too easy
Reasons for my vote:Lies; there is no motivator in the setup.
I want to have my vote somewhere and encourage Awaclus to post something that makes me change to someone else. (I'm such a motivator, I know.)
vote: Awaclus
I think his is the scummiest vote on SA
I was thinking between him and schadd. But iirc Awaclus sometimes votes without any explanation given as either alignment. Schadd's more strange one.
Reasons for my vote:
I want to have my vote somewhere and encourage Awaclus to post something that makes me change to someone else. (I'm such a motivator, I know.)
Reasons for my vote:
I want to have my vote somewhere and encourage Awaclus to post something that makes me change to someone else. (I'm such a motivator, I know.)
Vote: SA
Vote: SA
I really think the only notable thing was gkrieg's traitor thing, and I honestly think talk on that is scummy. Scum would try to inquire more as to whether or not gkreig was trying to softclaim traitor, because then he'd be able to sneak more crumbs into more posts that he'd make about traitors.Vote: SA
Wow, that worked fast! :-) What are your feelings about all the things that have been said in the game so far?
It doesn't work that way.I really think the only notable thing was gkrieg's traitor thing, and I honestly think talk on that is scummy. Scum would try to inquire more as to whether or not gkreig was trying to softclaim traitor, because then he'd be able to sneak more crumbs into more posts that he'd make about traitors.Vote: SA
Wow, that worked fast! :-) What are your feelings about all the things that have been said in the game so far?
I don't really think he's the traitor. I'm saying scum would want to talk about the traitor because that gives the actual traitor more of a chance to bread crumb.It doesn't work that way.I really think the only notable thing was gkrieg's traitor thing, and I honestly think talk on that is scummy. Scum would try to inquire more as to whether or not gkreig was trying to softclaim traitor, because then he'd be able to sneak more crumbs into more posts that he'd make about traitors.Vote: SA
Wow, that worked fast! :-) What are your feelings about all the things that have been said in the game so far?
If you think that gkrieg is a Traitor, you should vote for him, you know.
I really think the only notable thing was gkrieg's traitor thing, and I honestly think talk on that is scummy. Scum would try to inquire more as to whether or not gkreig was trying to softclaim traitor, because then he'd be able to sneak more crumbs into more posts that he'd make about traitors.Vote: SA
Wow, that worked fast! :-) What are your feelings about all the things that have been said in the game so far?
Strange thing is that i don't remember the last game I thought everyone is looking townie, but this is surely what happens now. Quickly reread Robz and he looks scummy and I would lynch him, but that means that he's town (and I wouldn't lynch him). Here are a few of people who are null to me: Awa, schadd, IG. The rest just looks towniesh..
Strange thing is that i don't remember the last game I thought everyone is looking townie, but this is surely what happens now. Quickly reread Robz and he looks scummy and I would lynch him, but that means that he's town (and I wouldn't lynch him). Here are a few of people who are null to me: Awa, schadd, IG. The rest just looks towniesh..
Whenever, in recent games, people have complained in D1 or so that everyone looks townie, someone has come along and suggested that townie play means that the scums are vets. Yet you've not made that conclusion here, nor even mentioned the fact, which I think means you're fishing for someone else to say so to start more wagons. That seems more likely to be a scum!LL thing than a town!LL thing, no?
I don't think that is the intention here. Would also not make sense to think the scum is "vets" because what does this even mean? When I look at the player list, 7 out of 11 people have been around long enogh to definitely be categorized as vets, 3 have already shown that they are very much capable of playing a good scum game, and then there's LaLight himself, whom I don't remember as scum.Strange thing is that i don't remember the last game I thought everyone is looking townie, but this is surely what happens now. Quickly reread Robz and he looks scummy and I would lynch him, but that means that he's town (and I wouldn't lynch him). Here are a few of people who are null to me: Awa, schadd, IG. The rest just looks towniesh..
Whenever, in recent games, people have complained in D1 or so that everyone looks townie, someone has come along and suggested that townie play means that the scums are vets. Yet you've not made that conclusion here, nor even mentioned the fact, which I think means you're fishing for someone else to say so to start more wagons. That seems more likely to be a scum!LL thing than a town!LL thing, no?
So who did you think was LaLight trying to frame?Checking things is overrated.
So who did you think was LaLight trying to frame?Checking things is overrated.
I think a more applicable theory might be that scum has more of a need to justify not having any scum reads (at least for me that's the natural state as scum, it's hard for me to fake suspicion unless I see something I would think is scummy if I was town). I didn't get that vibe from LL's post, though.
A quick summary of people and their posting habits so far. Number in brackets is post count since day start.Quite busy right now up until Friday, from then on I will have plenty of time.
Calamitas (3) where is he? He's usually quiet D1, but there's been theory talk and everything.
Strange thing is that i don't remember the last game I thought everyone is looking townie, but this is surely what happens now. Quickly reread Robz and he looks scummy and I would lynch him, but that means that he's town (and I wouldn't lynch him). Here are a few of people who are null to me: Awa, schadd, IG. The rest just looks towniesh..
Strange thing is that i don't remember the last game I thought everyone is looking townie, but this is surely what happens now. Quickly reread Robz and he looks scummy and I would lynch him, but that means that he's town (and I wouldn't lynch him). Here are a few of people who are null to me: Awa, schadd, IG. The rest just looks towniesh..
I am so proud of how far you have come in terms of reading me.
I think a more applicable theory might be that scum has more of a need to justify not having any scum reads (at least for me that's the natural state as scum, it's hard for me to fake suspicion unless I see something I would think is scummy if I was town). I didn't get that vibe from LL's post, though.
Vote: schadd for jumping on anything going.Can you explain what "jumping on anything going" means here... and why it's scummy?
Vote: schadd for jumping on anything going.Can you explain what "jumping on anything going" means here... and why it's scummy?
Unrelated question: Would you say it's easy for you to find scum reads right now?I think a more applicable theory might be that scum has more of a need to justify not having any scum reads (at least for me that's the natural state as scum, it's hard for me to fake suspicion unless I see something I would think is scummy if I was town). I didn't get that vibe from LL's post, though.
That's strange. I think it is pretty easy to have scum reads as scum D1.
Unrelated question: Would you say it's easy for you to find scum reads right now?I think a more applicable theory might be that scum has more of a need to justify not having any scum reads (at least for me that's the natural state as scum, it's hard for me to fake suspicion unless I see something I would think is scummy if I was town). I didn't get that vibe from LL's post, though.
That's strange. I think it is pretty easy to have scum reads as scum D1.
Vote Count 1.3
schadd (3): Ichimaru Gin, LaLight, SpaceAnemone
Eevee (1): faust
gkrieg13 (1): Calamitas
SpaceAnemone (3): Robz888, Awaclus, schadd
Awaclus (2): gkrieg13, Eevee
Not Voting (1): Roadrunner7671
With 11 alive it takes 6 to lynch. Day 1 will last 10 days. The deadline for Day 1 will be Thursday, 19 January, at 1 AM forum time.
Vote: schadd for jumping on anything going.lol
How so?That said,is scummy
Catching up...http://forum.dominionstrategy.com/index.php?topic=16339.0;allHow so?That said,is scummy
Ok. I get it now.Catching up...http://forum.dominionstrategy.com/index.php?topic=16339.0;allHow so?That said,is scummy
ctrl+f "that said"
So yeah. How do we get out of RVS?you're a goofball
No uSo yeah. How do we get out of RVS?you're a goofball
I don't think that is the intention here. Would also not make sense to think the scum is "vets" because what does this even mean? When I look at the player list, 7 out of 11 people have been around long enogh to definitely be categorized as vets, 3 have already shown that they are very much capable of playing a good scum game, and then there's LaLight himself, whom I don't remember as scum.Ooh ooh. Am I one of the three?
Hey, I'm one of the vets! But I think faust meant that SA, Calamitas, and schadd are three non-vets who are good at scum.I don't think that is the intention here. Would also not make sense to think the scum is "vets" because what does this even mean? When I look at the player list, 7 out of 11 people have been around long enogh to definitely be categorized as vets, 3 have already shown that they are very much capable of playing a good scum game, and then there's LaLight himself, whom I don't remember as scum.Ooh ooh. Am I one of the three?
Oh right. I think I misread it. Carry on ;DHey, I'm one of the vets! But I think faust meant that SA, Calamitas, and schadd are three non-vets who are good at scum.I don't think that is the intention here. Would also not make sense to think the scum is "vets" because what does this even mean? When I look at the player list, 7 out of 11 people have been around long enogh to definitely be categorized as vets, 3 have already shown that they are very much capable of playing a good scum game, and then there's LaLight himself, whom I don't remember as scum.Ooh ooh. Am I one of the three?
So yeah. How do we get out of RVS?
I think technically this is true, but it doesn't feel like it.So yeah. How do we get out of RVS?
We've been out of RVS for ages already.
calamitas and spaceanemone are math
Vote: schadd for jumping on anything going.Can you explain what "jumping on anything going" means here... and why it's scummy?
He has 6 posts, 3 of them are votes. I think SA meant that he just jumps on wagons.
Also I really only have the time for this game and not so much to familiarize myself with people I don't know by reading past games right now.
So is there some must-know information about any/all of: Calamitas, LaLight, schadd, and SpaceAnenome?
- schadd feels like the sort of person I will always think is scumditto. well, maybe not always.
I think schadd is in the US, but I don't actually feel like know him very well myself. Hi schadd :-)forum time -1. hi!
calamitas and spaceanemone are math
I'm British, so that makes me "maths" :-)
i'm pretty sure it's short for mathematicscalamitas and spaceanemone are math
I'm British, so that makes me "maths" :-)
Which is short for mathematicses.
Vote Count 1.3
schadd (3): Ichimaru Gin, LaLight, SpaceAnemone
Eevee (1): faust
gkrieg13 (1): Calamitas
SpaceAnemone (3): Robz888, Awaclus, schadd
Awaclus (2): gkrieg13, Eevee
Not Voting (1): Roadrunner7671
With 11 alive it takes 6 to lynch. Day 1 will last 10 days. The deadline for Day 1 will be Thursday, 19 January, at 1 AM forum time.
I unvoted
So - what about the second part of my question?Vote: schadd for jumping on anything going.Can you explain what "jumping on anything going" means here... and why it's scummy?
He has 6 posts, 3 of them are votes. I think SA meant that he just jumps on wagons.
Yes, exactly this :-)
So - what about the second part of my question?Vote: schadd for jumping on anything going.Can you explain what "jumping on anything going" means here... and why it's scummy?
He has 6 posts, 3 of them are votes. I think SA meant that he just jumps on wagons.
Yes, exactly this :-)
he seemed to be voting to sheep others' opinionswasn't
Let's lynch someone. I nominate Awaclus, for lurking and content-free posts.
What was there to like about it? schadd's content-per-words ratio is definitely higher than that of Awaclus.Let's lynch someone. I nominate Awaclus, for lurking and content-free posts.
Sure, my main choice was between schadd and Awaclus before. What didn't you like about the schadd wagon, though?
I don't even know why we are talking about content-words ratios right now. It has been proven over and over again that this doesn't really show anything about someone's alignment, it is just an easy thing to quantify.Agreed, but I thought the accusation against schadd was specifically that he was low on content.
What was there to like about it? schadd's content-per-words ratio is definitely higher than that of Awaclus.Let's lynch someone. I nominate Awaclus, for lurking and content-free posts.
Sure, my main choice was between schadd and Awaclus before. What didn't you like about the schadd wagon, though?
What was there to like about it? schadd's content-per-words ratio is definitely higher than that of Awaclus.Let's lynch someone. I nominate Awaclus, for lurking and content-free posts.
Sure, my main choice was between schadd and Awaclus before. What didn't you like about the schadd wagon, though?
I was looking for a comment from Robz in particular.
Schadd already had a wagon, which got up to three people. His play so far has not been massively different from Awaclus's, except that he has a few more very short posts. I just wondered why Robz wanted to ignore that one completely and go for Awaclus instead. Perhaps I should have asked him to clarify the differences he sees between Awaclus and Schadd instead.
I don't even know why we are talking about content-words ratios right now. It has been proven over and over again that this doesn't really show anything about someone's alignment, it is just an easy thing to quantify.
I don't even know why we are talking about content-words ratios right now. It has been proven over and over again that this doesn't really show anything about someone's alignment, it is just an easy thing to quantify.
I don't know if I agree with that.
I don't even know why we are talking about content-words ratios right now. It has been proven over and over again that this doesn't really show anything about someone's alignment, it is just an easy thing to quantify.
I don't know if I agree with that.
People have tried to get me lynched based on it, and it has always been when I was town.
It's pretty definitely true for Awaclus though.I don't even know why we are talking about content-words ratios right now. It has been proven over and over again that this doesn't really show anything about someone's alignment, it is just an easy thing to quantify.
I don't know if I agree with that.
People have tried to get me lynched based on it, and it has always been when I was town.
That might be true for you. I suspect it's true for me, too: I bet I tend to participate more vigorously, and supply content, in my scum games. But I don't think it's true for everyone, or even, for most people.
what about Ichi?What about me?
what about Ichi?What about me?
what about Ichi?What about me?
Depends on the game and how busy I am irl mostly.what about Ichi?What about me?
Do you post more useful content as town or as scum?
I don't recall much about him. How does one read Eevee?what about Ichi?What about me?
Why are you not voting for Eevee?
I don't even know why we are talking about content-words ratios right now. It has been proven over and over again that this doesn't really show anything about someone's alignment, it is just an easy thing to quantify.It's better for town the more people contribute, so it's pro-town to encourage people to post meaningful things.
Don't lynch Ichi until LyLo.
That's overratedDon't lynch Ichi until LyLo.
But make sure to actually lynch him in LyLo if he's the serial killer again.
Let's lynch someone. I nominate Awaclus, for lurking and content-free posts.
Let's lynch someone. I nominate Awaclus, for lurking and content-free posts.
Actually I have mixed feelings this post. Looked like Robz is trying to play his meta being a little scummy so everybody will think he's town. It's not a feeling enough to vote for Robz but still.
Let's lynch someone. I nominate Awaclus, for lurking and content-free posts.
Actually I have mixed feelings this post. Looked like Robz is trying to play his meta being a little scummy so everybody will think he's town. It's not a feeling enough to vote for Robz but still.
What was scummy about the post, though?
Let's lynch someone. I nominate Awaclus, for lurking and content-free posts.
Actually I have mixed feelings this post. Looked like Robz is trying to play his meta being a little scummy so everybody will think he's town. It's not a feeling enough to vote for Robz but still.
What was scummy about the post, though?
Let's lynch someone. I nominate Awaclus, for lurking and content-free posts.
Actually I have mixed feelings this post. Looked like Robz is trying to play his meta being a little scummy so everybody will think he's town. It's not a feeling enough to vote for Robz but still.
What was scummy about the post, though?
The very "Let's lynch someone." phrase. It's like you don't want to actually scumhunt but going to the early end of the day for some reason.
Let's lynch someone. I nominate Awaclus, for lurking and content-free posts.
Actually I have mixed feelings this post. Looked like Robz is trying to play his meta being a little scummy so everybody will think he's town. It's not a feeling enough to vote for Robz but still.
What was scummy about the post, though?
The very "Let's lynch someone." phrase. It's like you don't want to actually scumhunt but going to the early end of the day for some reason.
You're really imagining things. I opted to put some pressure on Awaclus for not contributing, that's all.
Ya this is the first game I've played where my Robz scum alarm bells haven't gone off yet.
That's what I'm saying. At least so far, you seem town to me.Ya this is the first game I've played where my Robz scum alarm bells haven't gone off yet.
Well, I have been scum in most of those games.
That's what I'm saying. At least so far, you seem town to me.Ya this is the first game I've played where my Robz scum alarm bells haven't gone off yet.
Well, I have been scum in most of those games.
Finshed my re-read and I still think gkrieg is the best option. I still don't like his traitor post (and the follow ups) and consider them to be evidence for everything but him being town. Pretty much null on the rest.
There really hasn't been much going on. We need something to talk about! Day 1's can be really, really tough. 6 days until deadline now.Finshed my re-read and I still think gkrieg is the best option. I still don't like his traitor post (and the follow ups) and consider them to be evidence for everything but him being town. Pretty much null on the rest.
That's all you got out of your re-read? Sort of disappointing.
ooh, yes, i remember doing thatI don't even know why we are talking about content-words ratios right now. It has been proven over and over again that this doesn't really show anything about someone's alignment, it is just an easy thing to quantify.
I don't know if I agree with that.
People have tried to get me lynched based on it, and it has always been when I was town.
I don't recall much about him. How does one read Eevee?unfortunately there can't be a tracker in this setup so i dunno (l0l)
noLet's lynch someone. I nominate Awaclus, for lurking and content-free posts.
Actually I have mixed feelings this post. Looked like Robz is trying to play his meta being a little scummy so everybody will think he's town. It's not a feeling enough to vote for Robz but still.
What was scummy about the post, though?
The very "Let's lynch someone." phrase. It's like you don't want to actually scumhunt but going to the early end of the day for some reason.
Schadd already had a wagon, which got up to three people.i was very nervous. you can see me buckle a bit in 225
Day 1's can be really, really tough.D:
At least he did comment on the one thing that has happened in this game. So town points to Calamitas.Wow.
Hold on, I'm the biggest wagon? Why aren't more people doing something more useful?
Hold on, I'm the biggest wagon? Why aren't more people doing something more useful?
Like what? Give me an example.
*unvoted
I thought I invoted...
I've lost like gazillion games in a row as Town, I don't remember my last win. Let's do it this time, please.
And with that are you going to vote or just cast doubt? ???I've lost like gazillion games in a row as Town, I don't remember my last win. Let's do it this time, please.
You know, you've been making a lot of comments about how much you are Town. You've been doing it all game, but I didn't feel comfortable commenting on that while I was still modding a game you were alive in! No such problem any more...
I've lost like gazillion games in a row as Town, I don't remember my last win. Let's do it this time, please.
You know, you've been making a lot of comments about how much you are Town. You've been doing it all game, but I didn't feel comfortable commenting on that while I was still modding a game you were alive in! No such problem any more...
And with that are you going to vote or just cast doubt? ???I've lost like gazillion games in a row as Town, I don't remember my last win. Let's do it this time, please.
You know, you've been making a lot of comments about how much you are Town. You've been doing it all game, but I didn't feel comfortable commenting on that while I was still modding a game you were alive in! No such problem any more...
(http://forum.dominionstrategy.com/Themes/core/images/dice_warn.gif) This dice roll may have been tampered with!
Rolled 2d11 : 8, 6, total 14
(http://forum.dominionstrategy.com/Themes/core/images/dice_warn.gif) This dice roll may have been tampered with!
Rolled 2d11 : 8, 6, total 14
Eevee, Faust.
We really just need something to talk about. Are we all playing so cautiously that there really is nothing to talk about? The games are usually shot to action with some incident, and gkrieg's thing clearly hasn't been enough for us yet.
I really don't think I can say I have reads to speak of yet either, which is super bad for this late in day 1. I'm sure things will speed up come the deadline, but the mad scrambles against time are probably pretty beneficial for scum? I actually don't even know, because sometimes people come out looking extremely townie out of them too.
Yes, and then fail to adhere to it! It will be just like old times!
..No, but seriously, I think that's a good idea. 24 hours before the deadline, 1AM on Wednesday would probably make sense? Anyone opposed to doing this?
Yes, and then fail to adhere to it! It will be just like old times!No opposition from me.
..No, but seriously, I think that's a good idea. 24 hours before the deadline, 1AM on Wednesday would probably make sense? Anyone opposed to doing this?
Wow, this game got boring :-(
Vote: Calamitas since he's not posted in almost a day and a half, and that's longer than anyone else. Plus, he didn't post very much of content even when he did post.
Also:
Prod Calamitas (January 13, 2017, 10:04:46 am)
Prod Eevee (January 13, 2017, 10:22:16 am)
Prod gkrieg13 (January 13, 2017, 10:32:23 am)
Prod faust (January 13, 2017, 11:59:58 am)
Prod Awaclus (January 13, 2017, 03:30:39 pm)
Prod Ichimaru Gin (January 13, 2017, 03:59:54 pm)
Prod Robz888 (January 13, 2017, 04:05:36 pm)
... and with that, I've going to go away and read something non-internetty for a while, and the be unconscious for at least 8 hours :-P
Can we please vote Eevee? His posts are super forgettable and don't help us move forward in any way. Like the only thing he did post after the prod is some super inconsequential stuff about soft deadlines that never do anything and just help keep the discussion at a point where noone contributes because "I agree" is all the interaction that seems necessary (see posts from LaLight, Ichi).
Yes, and then fail to adhere to it! It will be just like old times!
..No, but seriously, I think that's a good idea. 24 hours before the deadline, 1AM on Wednesday would probably make sense? Anyone opposed to doing this?
Well, I was prodded and had nothing to say. Why me and not Robz?Because this is the exact behaviour I saw from scum!you in the game I modded.
Yep, I'm indeed the same guy, just different alignment this time. :)Well, I was prodded and had nothing to say. Why me and not Robz?Because this is the exact behaviour I saw from scum!you in the game I modded.
And as much as I hate doing this at all, but vote: faust. Looks like he's looking for easy mislynch.Can you provide an example of a scum game from me where I was looking for an eas mislynch?
I disagree with the SA wagon as well, they look towny and also at this point have an activity pass for today from me as well for activity. Why are the votes for awaclus garbage?Because Awaclus is not doing anything that would warrant a vote and you cannot vote Awaclus for reactions, so the votes are pretty useless.
I thinks it's shown in my play that I'm pretty relieved to be town (with no IC responsibilities) for a change. I've definitely been posting much more care-free than in the previous two games.Did you though?
If there is no reaction, that just means there aren't enough votes!I disagree with the SA wagon as well, they look towny and also at this point have an activity pass for today from me as well for activity. Why are the votes for awaclus garbage?Because Awaclus is not doing anything that would warrant a vote and you cannot vote Awaclus for reactions, so the votes are pretty useless.
Post more care-free? I think so, I haven't really been filtering myself at all, even dabbled on unsubstantiated voting in the case of Awaclus.I thinks it's shown in my play that I'm pretty relieved to be town (with no IC responsibilities) for a change. I've definitely been posting much more care-free than in the previous two games.Did you though?
I haven't really been filtering myself at allmore so or less so than the drunk ama that you did
And as much as I hate doing this at all, but vote: faust. Looks like he's looking for easy mislynch.Can you provide an example of a scum game from me where I was looking for an eas mislynch?
And as much as I hate doing this at all, but vote: faust. Looks like he's looking for easy mislynch.Can you provide an example of a scum game from me where I was looking for an eas mislynch?
I refuse to be an easy mislynch though!
I don't think Eevee is a good lynch at all. He's not producing a ton of content, but really no one is other than Space.
And I disagree with faust that Eevee is playing like he did in Mafia 90, when he was scum. It's hard to identify exactly what's different here, but he seems, I don't know, a little more carefree, perhaps--like he's feeling liberated from the burden of being scum. This is a feelings rather than evidence thing for me, but it's more than enough to not lynch Eevee today.
I don't find faust scummy for thinking the other way on this, though.
I'm still pretty keen on lynching uber-lurker Calamitas. RR is also a serious consideration, though I agree with Eevee that "struggling town" fits here. I've never seen Calamitas struggle to contribute as town, though.
Found Eevee's partner!
RR is also a serious consideration:(
Found Eevee's partner!
But surely I wouldn't be on a scum team with Eevee, and opt for the strategy of buddying/defending him, for a third consecutive game!
I kid, because that's totally something I would do. Though incidentally, it's not what I'm doing here.
Any reads, RR?I think you're pretty towny. And I'd be willing to vote for Faust for pushing a strained 'case' against you.
RR is also a serious consideration:(
Any reads, RR?I think you're pretty towny. And I'd be willing to vote for Faust for pushing a strained 'case' against you.
Awaclus is playing quite the same as in RMM38 which was the only one where i saw him. So, scummy.
Awaclus is playing quite the same as in RMM38 which was the only one where i saw him. So, scummy.
Did the thought ever occur to you that I might be similar to how I was in RMM38 not because I have the same alignment as I had in RMM38, but because I'm the same person as I was in RMM38?
I'm having deja vu. Didn't Eevee just say this?Awaclus is playing quite the same as in RMM38 which was the only one where i saw him. So, scummy.
Did the thought ever occur to you that I might be similar to how I was in RMM38 not because I have the same alignment as I had in RMM38, but because I'm the same person as I was in RMM38?
So, if I got you right, reads in Mafia are completely useless. We are all the same people as in other games. Let's not try to read each other.
I'm having deja vu. Didn't Eevee just say this?Awaclus is playing quite the same as in RMM38 which was the only one where i saw him. So, scummy.
Did the thought ever occur to you that I might be similar to how I was in RMM38 not because I have the same alignment as I had in RMM38, but because I'm the same person as I was in RMM38?
I don't like alluding to having reasons to think someone is scum but not sharing them. Why would you do that as town?Any reads, RR?I think you're pretty towny. And I'd be willing to vote for Faust for pushing a strained 'case' against you.
Faust's case is good though, and it's not even all of the reasons to think Eevee is scum.
Awaclus is playing quite the same as in RMM38 which was the only one where i saw him. So, scummy.
Did the thought ever occur to you that I might be similar to how I was in RMM38 not because I have the same alignment as I had in RMM38, but because I'm the same person as I was in RMM38?
So, if I got you right, reads in Mafia are completely useless. We are all the same people as in other games. Let's not try to read each other.
I don't like alluding to having reasons to think someone is scum but not sharing them. Why would you do that as town?
So, if I got you right, reads in Mafia are completely useless. We are all the same people as in other games. Let's not try to read each other.
Yeah, not a fan of this argument from Awaclus at all.
Yes and no. Generally, your personality will determine the factors that will be apparent in your playing style regardless of your alignment. Your alignment will determine your perspective, which will also be apparent in your playing style, regardless of your personality. If anyone had paid any attention to the perspective stuff in RMM38, you would've caught me red-handed the moment I voted for you even though gkrieg and J Reggie should have been closer to guaranteed scum from the fake perspective I had been constructing for myself. But you can't find any flaws in my narrative in this game, because there aren't any.
I'll return to vote: Awaclus I guess.
Which is more because it's not too difficult to keep a consistent narrative for half of D1 compared to a whole game.So, if I got you right, reads in Mafia are completely useless. We are all the same people as in other games. Let's not try to read each other.
Yes and no. Generally, your personality will determine the factors that will be apparent in your playing style regardless of your alignment. Your alignment will determine your perspective, which will also be apparent in your playing style, regardless of your personality. If anyone had paid any attention to the perspective stuff in RMM38, you would've caught me red-handed the moment I voted for you even though gkrieg and J Reggie should have been closer to guaranteed scum from the fake perspective I had been constructing for myself. But you can't find any flaws in my narrative in this game, because there aren't any.
Why? Obviously you can read someone better once you have experienced him as both town and scum. LaLight only saw scum!Awaclus, so if he's finding him scummy for being the same as there, that argument does have less validity than it would coming from someone who knows town!Awaclus.Awaclus is playing quite the same as in RMM38 which was the only one where i saw him. So, scummy.
Did the thought ever occur to you that I might be similar to how I was in RMM38 not because I have the same alignment as I had in RMM38, but because I'm the same person as I was in RMM38?
So, if I got you right, reads in Mafia are completely useless. We are all the same people as in other games. Let's not try to read each other.
Yeah, not a fan of this argument from Awaclus at all.
Why? Obviously you can read someone better once you have experienced him as both town and scum. LaLight only saw scum!Awaclus, so if he's finding him scummy for being the same as there, that argument does have less validity than it would coming from someone who knows town!Awaclus.Awaclus is playing quite the same as in RMM38 which was the only one where i saw him. So, scummy.
Did the thought ever occur to you that I might be similar to how I was in RMM38 not because I have the same alignment as I had in RMM38, but because I'm the same person as I was in RMM38?
So, if I got you right, reads in Mafia are completely useless. We are all the same people as in other games. Let's not try to read each other.
Yeah, not a fan of this argument from Awaclus at all.
I'm not a fan of how LaLight plays this game. Might do a quick reread later on.
Also it's weird that I always seem to understand Awaclus better than most other people. Or maybe just I agree with him more.
Which is more because it's not too difficult to keep a consistent narrative for half of D1 compared to a whole game.
I thought Awaclus was saying people always play the same because they are the same people.
I've never seen Calamitas struggle to contribute as town, though.I agree that I haven't struggled to this extent besides maybe RMM35 but it is clearly not alignment-indicative. This game is just the emptiest I have ever seen and I don't see anything alignment indicative besides gkriegs traitor comment at all.
I don't really want to lynch Awaclus or Robz from what I have read. RR also seems townie. I think Calamitas has earned a D1 pass.
I would be fine with Eevee and LaLight feels different here.
LaLight feels different here.I think he felt different already in RMM38 and there he ended up being town. So he probably just evolved in regard to his playstyle.
I've never seen Calamitas struggle to contribute as town, though.I agree that I haven't struggled to this extent besides maybe RMM35 but it is clearly not alignment-indicative. This game is just the emptiest I have ever seen and I don't see anything alignment indicative besides gkriegs traitor comment at all.
No need for filters when you are town! I don't remember what I said then, but it was clearly a ploy because I was scum and nothing I did or said was honest.uhm, do you by any chance work in customer service?
vote: robzVote: RRRR is also a serious consideration:(
:)vote: robzVote: RRRR is also a serious consideration:(
he's clearly paying attentionha ha ha...what?
he's clearly paying attentionha ha ha...what?
I'll lynch RR, Calamitas, Awaclus, or schadd.
I don't really want to lynch Awaclus or Robz from what I have read. RR also seems townie. I think Calamitas has earned a D1 pass.
I would be fine with Eevee and LaLight feels different here.
How do i feel different?
I don't really want to lynch Awaclus or Robz from what I have read. RR also seems townie. I think Calamitas has earned a D1 pass.
I would be fine with Eevee and LaLight feels different here.
How do i feel different?
I'm not really sure yet. You don't exude towniness like usual. And trust me, you usually are extremely townie. I tried to get you lynched like a lot lately as scum and it has never worked...
Space Count
Eevee (3): faust, Ichi, Awaclus
Awaclus (3): gkrieg, Eevee, LL
Not Voting (1): RR
Sound like a plan to me!I don't really want to lynch Awaclus or Robz from what I have read. RR also seems townie. I think Calamitas has earned a D1 pass.
I would be fine with Eevee and LaLight feels different here.
How do i feel different?
I'm not really sure yet. You don't exude towniness like usual. And trust me, you usually are extremely townie. I tried to get you lynched like a lot lately as scum and it has never worked...
Try it and it will. And I am not joking at all now. I feel not really useful D1, reread Literature or Bonkers. I can radiate towniness when I am scumhunting (i must have reads for that which I don't really now) or when i am on the edge being lynched (when i resist argumenta of other people). Wait a little, you'll see. And reread D1 of Literature. People tended to think i'm scum the whole game, thanks god i was killed and kept my statistics clean :)
Sound like a plan to me!I don't really want to lynch Awaclus or Robz from what I have read. RR also seems townie. I think Calamitas has earned a D1 pass.
I would be fine with Eevee and LaLight feels different here.
How do i feel different?
I'm not really sure yet. You don't exude towniness like usual. And trust me, you usually are extremely townie. I tried to get you lynched like a lot lately as scum and it has never worked...
Try it and it will. And I am not joking at all now. I feel not really useful D1, reread Literature or Bonkers. I can radiate towniness when I am scumhunting (i must have reads for that which I don't really now) or when i am on the edge being lynched (when i resist argumenta of other people). Wait a little, you'll see. And reread D1 of Literature. People tended to think i'm scum the whole game, thanks god i was killed and kept my statistics clean :)
Vote: LaLight
Faust, can you pinpoint how LL looks different to you in this game?Will try a reread later today and see if I can figure it out.
Try it and it will. And I am not joking at all now. I feel not really useful D1, reread Literature or Bonkers. I can radiate towniness when I am scumhunting (i must have reads for that which I don't really now) or when i am on the edge being lynched (when i resist argumenta of other people). Wait a little, you'll see. And reread D1 of Literature. People tended to think i'm scum the whole game, thanks god i was killed and kept my statistics clean :)hm.
What's our deadline? Vote Awaclus because I much prefer that wagon to Eevee, although I'm surprised there isn't more interest in RR or Calamitas.
What's our deadline? Vote Awaclus because I much prefer that wagon to Eevee, although I'm surprised there isn't more interest in RR or Calamitas.
i don't think i really ever plan to elaborate on a gkrieg vote
it doesn't mean more than what i saidi don't think i really ever plan to elaborate on a gkrieg voteI'm not sure what this is supposed to mean.
Vote Count 1.8
Eevee (2): Ichimaru Gin, Awaclus
gkrieg13 (2): Calamitas, schadd
Awaclus (3): gkrieg13, Eevee, LaLight
Calamitas (1): SpaceAnemone
Roadrunner7671 (1): Robz888
LaLight (1): faust
Not Voting (1): Roadrunner7671
With 11 alive it takes 6 to lynch. Day 1 will last 10 days. The deadline for Day 1 will be Thursday, 19 January, at 1 AM forum time.What's our deadline? Vote Awaclus because I much prefer that wagon to Eevee, although I'm surprised there isn't more interest in RR or Calamitas.
Please be careful with your voting snytax if you want your votes to count. This vote does not have a colon.
Vote Count 1.8
Eevee (2): Ichimaru Gin, Awaclus
gkrieg13 (2): Calamitas, schadd
Awaclus (3): gkrieg13, Eevee, LaLight
Calamitas (1): SpaceAnemone
Roadrunner7671 (1): Robz888
LaLight (1): faust
Not Voting (1): Roadrunner7671
With 11 alive it takes 6 to lynch. Day 1 will last 10 days. The deadline for Day 1 will be Thursday, 19 January, at 1 AM forum time.What's our deadline? Vote Awaclus because I much prefer that wagon to Eevee, although I'm surprised there isn't more interest in RR or Calamitas.
Please be careful with your voting snytax if you want your votes to count. This vote does not have a colon.
This is wrong, I moved my vote.
I don't really want to lynch Awaclus or Robz from what I have read. RR also seems townie. I think Calamitas has earned a D1 pass.
I don't really want to lynch Awaclus or Robz from what I have read. RR also seems townie. I think Calamitas has earned a D1 pass.
Hmm.. do you really feel that Calamitas's minimal posting level is D1-pass-worthy? He's quiet in D1 every game, and it must be such a trivial meta for him to copy as scum.
I don't really want to lynch Awaclus or Robz from what I have read. RR also seems townie. I think Calamitas has earned a D1 pass.
Hmm.. do you really feel that Calamitas's minimal posting level is D1-pass-worthy? He's quiet in D1 every game, and it must be such a trivial meta for him to copy as scum.
Ya but the fact he is consistent has bought him a D1 pass. If he weren't a strong town player, I would not give him this pass.
I don't really want to lynch Awaclus or Robz from what I have read. RR also seems townie. I think Calamitas has earned a D1 pass.
Hmm.. do you really feel that Calamitas's minimal posting level is D1-pass-worthy? He's quiet in D1 every game, and it must be such a trivial meta for him to copy as scum.
Ya but the fact he is consistent has bought him a D1 pass. If he weren't a strong town player, I would not give him this pass.
Sure, but he's a very strong scum player too!
very unfortunate.yes
Having done some re-reading, I don't quite get the Awaclus wagon. He seemed quite nit-picky in D1 as scum over in RMM38, and while he was certainly wrong in his vote for me earlier in this game, I do at least understand a reasonable thought process behind it.
Why do several of the old vet people think he's our most likely scum?
The resistance to Calamitas makes him even more appealing IMO.eww and also what
Uh. Why do people want to lynch Calamitas?
Uh. Why do people want to lynch Calamitas?He sure hasn't looked very townie.
His posts are very short and content free.
The resistance to Calamitas makes him even more appealing IMO.
Robz and Eevee. Again, working as a team. huhuh I'll consider that. Calamitas is not really that scummy. I'd better vote: SA at this point (Awa is townie, got it)
Robz and Eevee. Again, working as a team. huhuh I'll consider that. Calamitas is not really that scummy. I'd better vote: SA at this point (Awa is townie, got it)
Space is a terrible vote right now. Extremely townie and helpful. Shame on you!
Space feels very much like the exact same Space from Mafia 90, to me.
Also I'm slightly drunk right now.
Sorry that was a lie, more than slightly.
Space feels very much like the exact same Space from Mafia 90, to me.
Might be because Space is the exact same Space.
Space feels very much like the exact same Space from Mafia 90, to me.
Might be because Space is the exact same Space.
Who knows if there is more people writing from their account. conspiracyconspiracyconspiracy
Also it's 9:30 AM and I've been up all night, AMA.
Also it's 9:30 AM and I've been up all night, AMA.
don't you want to scumslip?
Also it's 9:30 AM and I've been up all night, AMA.
don't you want to scumslip?
Good thing I'm not scum, otherwise that could be a problem.
The other way around, it's not a problem for scum to scumslip, harder for town.
It's true that my content is free, but there's a ton of it concentrated in all of my posts!
The other way around, it's not a problem for scum to scumslip, harder for town.
No, it's definitely a problem for scum if they scumslip.
There has been just way less content than in any other game. If you want to see a town game where I barely contributed at all D1 you may look at RMM35.Uh. Why do people want to lynch Calamitas?
He's had much less to say so far than in any other game we've played together. I've seen town!Calamitas have no trouble participating previously.
I've had been scum with him once, and I do feel like his activity was a little more muted that game too. (Gut feeling, could be wrong.)
Speaking of setup discussion, did we reach a conclusion about claiming?
Speaking of setup discussion, did we reach a conclusion about claiming?We should not claim for similar reasons I pointed out in NM9. Every claim results in an IC without a counterclaim and counterclaiming isn't really bad for us since it reduces the lynchpool to 2 players.
Have to correct myself, was assuming scum would be forced to claim from within the correct row/column when making the fakeclaim.Speaking of setup discussion, did we reach a conclusion about claiming?We should not claim for similar reasons I pointed out in NM9. Every claim results in an IC without a counterclaim and counterclaiming isn't really bad for us since it reduces the lynchpool to 2 players.
And those odds are really really good.
For reference my setup post from NM9 where the situation was quite similar:
As someone who played this setup before, I can tell you that the claims absolutely do not sort themselves out.Have to correct myself, was assuming scum would be forced to claim from within the correct row/column when making the fakeclaim.Speaking of setup discussion, did we reach a conclusion about claiming?We should not claim for similar reasons I pointed out in NM9. Every claim results in an IC without a counterclaim and counterclaiming isn't really bad for us since it reduces the lynchpool to 2 players.
And those odds are really really good.
For reference my setup post from NM9 where the situation was quite similar:
But the point still stands mostly since claims from other rows/colums would get sorted out through or flips or a massclaim.
This is an interesting exchange between two of my scummish reads.Vote: LaLight
I don't know, seems like you are trying to contribute without really saying anything. As faust points out, it's very odd to say nothing that's happened is alignment-indicative if you also developed a town read for gkrieg from it.
I am trying to contribute, that's the point. I think gkrieg is town. Outside of that, I don't see anything. Yet. Voting for me is strange, given that all our conversation consisted of gkrieg's ploy discussion, I just try to think wider and analyse the analysis.
I don't know why and how it will help anyone, but Eevee's vote a little offended me :)This seems like a towncred grab.
And this this. Uh. That's a bad post.Unvote We are cool.
nono, I know we're cool, i didn't try to AtE, it's just I didn't get the reasoning behind the vote :)
I've lost like gazillion games in a row as Town, I don't remember my last win. Let's do it this time, please.LaLight talks about how he's always town in every other post. I don't like it.
Robz and Eevee. Again, working as a team. huhuh I'll consider that. Calamitas is not really that scummy. I'd better vote: SA at this point (Awa is townie, got it)This goes contrary to earlier posts where LaLight defended Spacey. What changed?
It's true that my content is free, but there's a ton of it concentrated in all of my posts!The other way around, it's not a problem for scum to scumslip, harder for town.
No, it's definitely a problem for scum if they scumslip.
::)
Why is schadd townie? I'm interested in thoughts on how to read him, or thoughts on what people think about him here.the two people that had substantial reads (i would say) on me in M87 were the cop, who got a guilty result (though he chose the right dude) and the rb, who rb'd me and noticed somebody still died
Agreed about not liking LL inserting them being town in so many posts.
Why is schadd townie? I'm interested in thoughts on how to read him, or thoughts on what people think about him here. Reading people you haven't played with is very difficult, especially before the first scum flip or meaningful night action result conflict.
Why not? Every piece of information (at least) halves the number of potential setups (pieces of information are PR flips and PR claims). And three pieces of info guarantee counterclaimability and I don't think it's unrealistic to gather those 3 pieces.As someone who played this setup before, I can tell you that the claims absolutely do not sort themselves out.Have to correct myself, was assuming scum would be forced to claim from within the correct row/column when making the fakeclaim.Speaking of setup discussion, did we reach a conclusion about claiming?We should not claim for similar reasons I pointed out in NM9. Every claim results in an IC without a counterclaim and counterclaiming isn't really bad for us since it reduces the lynchpool to 2 players.
And those odds are really really good.
For reference my setup post from NM9 where the situation was quite similar:
But the point still stands mostly since claims from other rows/colums would get sorted out through or flips or a massclaim.
With 11 alive it takes 6 to lynch. Day 1 will last 10 days. The deadline for Day 1 will be Thursday, 19 January, at 1 AM forum time.
Ok. Been super busy. I will try and catch up and contribute more in ~4 hours.
Deadline is in 2 days?
schadd is hard to read in the same sense that Awaclus or Hydrad is hard to read. There doesn't seem to be that much behind the posts, and they tend to play games that are not very alignment-indicative. He is easier to sort out later though.
schadd is hard to read in the same sense that Awaclus or Hydrad is hard to read. There doesn't seem to be that much behind the posts, and they tend to play games that are not very alignment-indicative. He is easier to sort out later though.
Isn't "easier to sort out later" true for most people, though?
What is your lynch pool right now?
Case on me, huh.
I stopped telling in other every post I'm townie. Not even because it's suspicious, more like it's boring, I guess I wanted just to tell you my PoV.
I was defending Space when they were clear in their intentions. Now I'm not so sure and their strange confidence in Awaclus' scumminess is not based on something really scummy. So I am comfortable about where my vote is right now.
Now Ichi is going to sheep faust. That I don't like, faust is dangerous actually. I would sheep him, but only if I thought he's town. I am not going to sheep anyone here today.
Case on me, huh.
I stopped telling in other every post I'm townie. Not even because it's suspicious, more like it's boring, I guess I wanted just to tell you my PoV.
I was defending Space when they were clear in their intentions. Now I'm not so sure and their strange confidence in Awaclus' scumminess is not based on something really scummy. So I am comfortable about where my vote is right now.
Now Ichi is going to sheep faust. That I don't like, faust is dangerous actually. I would sheep him, but only if I thought he's town. I am not going to sheep anyone here today.
Ichi came from a time when it was the norm to sheep Faust. I don't think he is very scummy because of it.
Whoa whoa, so what's changed since then?Case on me, huh.
I stopped telling in other every post I'm townie. Not even because it's suspicious, more like it's boring, I guess I wanted just to tell you my PoV.
I was defending Space when they were clear in their intentions. Now I'm not so sure and their strange confidence in Awaclus' scumminess is not based on something really scummy. So I am comfortable about where my vote is right now.
Now Ichi is going to sheep faust. That I don't like, faust is dangerous actually. I would sheep him, but only if I thought he's town. I am not going to sheep anyone here today.
Ichi came from a time when it was the norm to sheep Faust. I don't think he is very scummy because of it.
Whoa whoa, so what's changed since then?Case on me, huh.
I stopped telling in other every post I'm townie. Not even because it's suspicious, more like it's boring, I guess I wanted just to tell you my PoV.
I was defending Space when they were clear in their intentions. Now I'm not so sure and their strange confidence in Awaclus' scumminess is not based on something really scummy. So I am comfortable about where my vote is right now.
Now Ichi is going to sheep faust. That I don't like, faust is dangerous actually. I would sheep him, but only if I thought he's town. I am not going to sheep anyone here today.
Ichi came from a time when it was the norm to sheep Faust. I don't think he is very scummy because of it.
How long have I been asleep?
PPE: LaLight sounds like me in the time I come from!
But people would usually not listen to me since although I'm pretty good at saving my own skin, I'm never been the
so-good-at-convincing-other-people guy.
Damn. Well that's pretty interesting. We should be like a meta-team or something.But people would usually not listen to me since although I'm pretty good at saving my own skin, I'm never been the
so-good-at-convincing-other-people guy.
You are talking about me here. I have never been lynched and I took mvp only once being half-IC. That's what falls under the description you put in here.
Damn. Well that's pretty interesting. We should be like a meta-team or something.But people would usually not listen to me since although I'm pretty good at saving my own skin, I'm never been the
so-good-at-convincing-other-people guy.
You are talking about me here. I have never been lynched and I took mvp only once being half-IC. That's what falls under the description you put in here.
Vote Count 1.9
Eevee (3): Ichimaru Gin, Awaclus, gkrieg13
gkrieg13 (2): Calamitas, schadd
Calamitas (3): SpaceAnemone, Eevee, Robz888
LaLight (1): faust
SpaceAnemone (1): LaLight
Not Voting (1): Roadrunner7671
With 11 alive it takes 6 to lynch. Day 1 will last 10 days. The deadline for Day 1 will be Thursday, 19 January, at 1 AM forum time.
Just to make sure everyone is clear, this is the same time as 18 January at 10 PM pacific time US (which is what time it will be for me).
Now Ichi is going to sheep faust. That I don't like, faust is dangerous actually. I would sheep him, but only ifFTFYI thought he's townhe's not voting for me. I am not going to sheep anyone here today.
Now Ichi is going to sheep faust. That I don't like, faust is dangerous actually. I would sheep him, but only ifFTFYI thought he's townhe's not voting for me. I am not going to sheep anyone here today.
The very idea that I am defending Space is quite hilarious [...] I defended themSure.
Taking me as a reread target is a strange idea I don't really get. Well, the only explanation I can make is "why not" and this is legit, of course.No, the reason is you felt scummy.
I wonder what makes people think I'm scum in every single game and I guess this is what is called my personal meta which I don't know yet.Let me explain it in your words:
You all look scummy to me, some more, some less
The very idea that I am defending Space is quite hilarious [...] I defended themSure.
I'm never been theWay to rub it in!
so-good-at-convincing-other-people guy.
It's alive!I'm never been theWay to rub it in!
so-good-at-convincing-other-people guy.
For some reason people decided it would be a good idea to only listen to me when I'm scum.Ichi came from a time when it was the norm to sheep Faust. I don't think he is very scummy because of it.Whoa whoa, so what's changed since then?
How long have I been asleep?
PPE: LaLight sounds like me in the time I come from!
Yeah ok I'm basically caught up now. And...basically nothing has happened.
That said ( ͡° ͜ʖ ͡°)
I'll probably end up continuing to sheep faust in some sense or another.
I will be around for the deadline.
I'm normally much more active, but school has me really busy right now.
If people have any questions for me, now's a good time to ask them.
For some reason people decided it would be a good idea to only listen to me when I'm scum.
We should try to get some activity going, us Europeans will miss the hours leading up to the deadline.So will us Americans!
We need to concentrate our efforts!
I don't think Calamitas is a bad option. As far as I can tell his only read this far is that gkrieg is scummy for the traitor thing.
Can't say I would oppose many lynches to be honest, being one of the leading wagons. I don't really have any town reads, it feels like scum is doing well this far.
Who are the people you'd oppose?
What do you think about SA?Why are you pushing SA now? I'm confused where the tide turned on them.
What do you think about SA?Why are you pushing SA now? I'm confused where the tide turned on them.
For me, I just think they've been so helpful and active that with us having this many other viable options, I don't really think she "deserves" to be the lynch. Better to incentivize people to try and engage early for smoother games in the future, if the difference isn't big. Same concept as with avoiding lynching new players day 1.
You guys sure are trigger-happy. I would lynch gkrieg, LaLight, Eevee, maybe RR.could i maybe convince you to sway over to gkrieg without pointing out any examples of why you should do so?
Eevee seems beter than LaLight right now. Vote: Eevee
Sure. Vote: gkriegYou guys sure are trigger-happy. I would lynch gkrieg, LaLight, Eevee, maybe RR.could i maybe convince you to sway over to gkrieg without pointing out any examples of why you should do so?
Eevee seems beter than LaLight right now. Vote: Eevee
Well I did say I was good at saving myself ::)I'm never been theWay to rub it in!
so-good-at-convincing-other-people guy.
Sure. Vote: gkriegYou guys sure are trigger-happy. I would lynch gkrieg, LaLight, Eevee, maybe RR.could i maybe convince you to sway over to gkrieg without pointing out any examples of why you should do so?
Eevee seems beter than LaLight right now. Vote: Eevee
I'm getting really tired already. Some chance I'll wake up for the deadline though, or sometime during the night.Please put your vote on a relevant wagon before going to bed.
The Calamitas wagon is based on nothing but lurkiness, right? If you want to lynch a lurker, go for RR. Calamitas at least gets more useful later on.
This is pretty much strictly out of self-preservationyou haven't been caught in too long of a time
What are any of the other wagons based on?1 more read than RR has given.
Fwiw, for me it's not just having 14 posts, literally the only read calamitas has offered is gkrieg being scummy for mentioning traitor.
RR's been super super absent as well.Hi. I think we've had a good D1, even before our lynch. Even if we mislynch here, it's still been a good day. I'm really not sure what to do if I'm not answering questions. I'm pretty okay with lynching anyone.
PPE-I see my nameOh.
How is it a good da if you don't get any reads?RR's been super super absent as well.Hi. I think we've had a good D1, even before our lynch. Even if we mislynch here, it's still been a good day. I'm really not sure what to do if I'm not answering questions. I'm pretty okay with lynching anyone.
PPE-I see my name
What are any of the other wagons based on?Thing is that this is just not alignment-indicative for me. I genuinely struggle to get anything viable with little info and here has been pretty much no info at all.
Fwiw, for me it's not just having 14 posts, literally the only read calamitas has offered is gkrieg being scummy for mentioning traitor.
I am here for a couple of hours. I guess Awaclus won't happen. vote: RR looks viable enough.Why rr over gkrieg?
I am here for a couple of hours. I guess Awaclus won't happen. vote: RR looks viable enough.Why rr over gkrieg?
I am here for a couple of hours. I guess Awaclus won't happen. vote: RR looks viable enough.Why rr over gkrieg?
Is that really alignment-indicative?I am here for a couple of hours. I guess Awaclus won't happen. vote: RR looks viable enough.Why rr over gkrieg?
And RR is hard-lurker, even when he came to the thread now, he didn't say a single useful word.
Is that really alignment-indicative?I am here for a couple of hours. I guess Awaclus won't happen. vote: RR looks viable enough.Why rr over gkrieg?
And RR is hard-lurker, even when he came to the thread now, he didn't say a single useful word.
Is that really alignment-indicative?I am here for a couple of hours. I guess Awaclus won't happen. vote: RR looks viable enough.Why rr over gkrieg?
And RR is hard-lurker, even when he came to the thread now, he didn't say a single useful word.
You think that's alignment indicative for RR? You need to play more with RR bro. It's D1 as well.Is that really alignment-indicative?I am here for a couple of hours. I guess Awaclus won't happen. vote: RR looks viable enough.Why rr over gkrieg?
And RR is hard-lurker, even when he came to the thread now, he didn't say a single useful word.
For RR? I guess so.
Space is just so affable and witty that I don't want to lynch him.
I shouldn't have assumed. Sorry.Space is just so affable and witty that I don't want to lynch him.
Them.
I shouldn't have assumed. Sorry.Space is just so affable and witty that I don't want to lynch him.
Them.
Sure thing boss!
Now who are we going to lynch today?
Sure thing boss!
Now who are we going to lynch today?
This is pretty much strictly out of self-preservationyou haven't been caught in too long of a time
Vote Count 1.gkriegSneaky manipulation there, pal.
Eevee (4): Ichimaru Gin, Awaclus, Roadrunner, gkrieg13
gkrieg13 (3): Calamitas, schadd, faust
Calamitas (3): SpaceAnemone, Eevee, Robz888
RR (1): LaLight
vote: eevee
Vote Count 1.gkriegThat's super, super scummy. Vote: gkreig
Eevee (4): Ichimaru Gin, Awaclus, Roadrunner, gkrieg13
gkrieg13 (3): Calamitas, schadd, faust
Calamitas (3): SpaceAnemone, Eevee, Robz888
RR (1): LaLight
vote: eevee
Vote Count 1.gkriegSneaky manipulation there, pal.
Eevee (4): Ichimaru Gin, Awaclus, Roadrunner, gkrieg13
gkrieg13 (3): Calamitas, schadd, faust
Calamitas (3): SpaceAnemone, Eevee, Robz888
RR (1): LaLight
vote: eevee
This was L-1.
oVote Count 1.gkriegSneaky manipulation there, pal.
Eevee (4): Ichimaru Gin, Awaclus, Roadrunner, gkrieg13
gkrieg13 (3): Calamitas, schadd, faust
Calamitas (3): SpaceAnemone, Eevee, Robz888
RR (1): LaLight
vote: eevee
This was L-1.
Isn't it just L-2? 11 players therefore 6 to lunch?
Eh. Maybe?gkreig was already on the wagon ::)
Would scum really expect to get away with that? It's something I could see scum trying at endgame when it doesn't matter, but not D1.
Meh.
PPE: 2
Oh, so the order is scummy then?Wait
Or no, he voted when he was already on the wagon and then posted his vote count, huh?
Gkrieg added himself to the vote count before he voted. Which is misleading and just causes dumb confusion, like what's happening to me right nowOh right. I didn't even see his vote at the bottom of the post.
Gkrieg added himself to the vote count before he voted. Which is misleading and just causes dumb confusion, like what's happening to me right nowOh right. I didn't even see his vote at the bottom of the post.
Strange.
I... got his post and don't see it as misleading...
I... got his post and don't see it as misleading...
Weren't you going to be asleep by now? :-P Please don't die of stress and lack of sleep and overworkedness before coming to see me! :-)
Are space and light friends irl?
I... got his post and don't see it as misleading...
Weren't you going to be asleep by now? :-P Please don't die of stress and lack of sleep and overworkedness before coming to see me! :-)
No.. As I've told, I'm working now. Still.
Uh that votecount was not meant to be misleading at all. Maybe I should've put my vote at the top of the vote count?
I mean, the numbers are all correct, and no one was put to L-1.
Are space and light friends irl?
We are going to meet the first time when I will be in England on Saturday. Though we speak a lot outside the forums.
But I'm townie right?You're not townie. More like completely null.
I must admit, the ease that this wagon is progressing recently has made me question it.
scum!gkrieg doesn't make mistakes like that (sorry for the crap assumption, faust)Why does town!gkrieg?
Oh cool! Haddock is a talented one. Does he still play Mafia?Are space and light friends irl?
We are going to meet the first time when I will be in England on Saturday. Though we speak a lot outside the forums.
This!! :-)
Though I've known Haddock IRL for 6+ years -- he's the one who introduced me to f.ds, especially for the Mafia component of the site :-)
OK. That's fair I guess. I only now have a bit of time to really participate in this game.But I'm townie right?You're not townie. More like completely null.
I must admit, the ease that this wagon is progressing recently has made me question it.
Hey, smalltalk is nice and all, but you do realize it's like 6 hours to deadline?Oh cool! Haddock is a talented one. Does he still play Mafia?Are space and light friends irl?
We are going to meet the first time when I will be in England on Saturday. Though we speak a lot outside the forums.
This!! :-)
Though I've known Haddock IRL for 6+ years -- he's the one who introduced me to f.ds, especially for the Mafia component of the site :-)
Hey, smalltalk is nice and all, but you do realize it's like 6 hours to deadline?Oh cool! Haddock is a talented one. Does he still play Mafia?Are space and light friends irl?
We are going to meet the first time when I will be in England on Saturday. Though we speak a lot outside the forums.
This!! :-)
Though I've known Haddock IRL for 6+ years -- he's the one who introduced me to f.ds, especially for the Mafia component of the site :-)
scum!gkrieg doesn't make mistakes like that (sorry for the crap assumption, faust)Why does town!gkrieg?
I think gkrieg is generally a better town player than he is a scum player.
I don't think that is a mistake made more likely by town! or scum!gkrieg. I think I just did a vote count, and changed my vote after having done that votecount so didn't update the vote count in a different post, but just put my vote at the bottom of it.You're very right. LaLight was the one trying to turn this into an alignment tell.
I mean where is the town or the scum motivation there? It might be different if I had sneakily put someone at L-1, but I'm much more subtle than that.
If only I knew where I'll be living 3 months from now.... that would make organizing significantly easier.Hey, smalltalk is nice and all, but you do realize it's like 6 hours to deadline?Oh cool! Haddock is a talented one. Does he still play Mafia?Are space and light friends irl?
We are going to meet the first time when I will be in England on Saturday. Though we speak a lot outside the forums.
This!! :-)
Though I've known Haddock IRL for 6+ years -- he's the one who introduced me to f.ds, especially for the Mafia component of the site :-)
Aw, we could organise your big German f.ds EU meet-up, then you won't have to feel so left out :-)
Oh cool! Haddock is a talented one. Does he still play Mafia?
I don't think that is a mistake made more likely by town! or scum!gkrieg. I think I just did a vote count, and changed my vote after having done that votecount so didn't update the vote count in a different post, but just put my vote at the bottom of it.You're very right. LaLight was the one trying to turn this into an alignment tell.
I mean where is the town or the scum motivation there? It might be different if I had sneakily put someone at L-1, but I'm much more subtle than that.
vote: SA too helpful and fluff... That's what makes you a good scum, my friend
But I'm townie right?
I must admit, the ease that this wagon is progressing recently has made me question it.
I'm also fine with lynching Robz if Eevee isn't happening.Neither is, question is whether you prefer myself or gkrieg right now.
Space, Ichi? Do you prefer lynching me or lynching gkrieg?
@Ichi, awaclus: Do you prefer lynching me or gkrieg?Um. Maybe you?
Do I right this right as policy lynch proposal?Space, Ichi? Do you prefer lynching me or lynching gkrieg?
You, actually. You've settled into a meta that lets you off the hook far too much in D1, but this game has been a poor showing even for you. I mean, I understand that D1s are really hard when there's so little to go on, and I've struggled in most games to work out how to say things and interact with people, but I think it makes people into better players (more fun to play with, as well as more nuanced in their play) when they learn to interact and offer reads and stuff more naturally in D1. So if we stop with the tacit approval for you for clamming up so much in the early game, maybe you'll come out of your shell some more.
Of course, last time I remember gkrieg living too long in a game was because he was scum and got me mis lynched, and the time before that was because he was town and got me mis lynched. So I may yet regret this this sentiment...
I really struggle gathering reads with very little info which results usually in empty D1s on my part except something comes up I really can make opinions on (e.g. setup discussion).@Ichi, awaclus: Do you prefer lynching me or gkrieg?Um. Maybe you?
I don't remember anything about you this game.
Is lurking normally your style?
one time he spoke on d1 and i murdered himI really struggle gathering reads with very little info which results usually in empty D1s on my part except something comes up I really can make opinions on (e.g. setup discussion).@Ichi, awaclus: Do you prefer lynching me or gkrieg?Um. Maybe you?
I don't remember anything about you this game.
Is lurking normally your style?
you're not the one whose towntell that is, but thanksThis is pretty much strictly out of self-preservationyou haven't been caught in too long of a time
I don't think lynching me when I'm town D1 will really help this.
@Ichi, awaclus: Do you prefer lynching me or gkrieg?
Do I right this right as policy lynch proposal?
(No judging, just wondering)
*read this rightDo I right this right as policy lynch proposal?
(No judging, just wondering)
Um.. not quite sure what you're asking.. could you re-phrase/expand please?
one time he spoke on d1 and i murdered himI really struggle gathering reads with very little info which results usually in empty D1s on my part except something comes up I really can make opinions on (e.g. setup discussion).@Ichi, awaclus: Do you prefer lynching me or gkrieg?Um. Maybe you?
I don't remember anything about you this game.
Is lurking normally your style?
*read this rightDo I right this right as policy lynch proposal?
(No judging, just wondering)
Um.. not quite sure what you're asking.. could you re-phrase/expand please?
How long until the deadline?
Unvote
I'll check in later to place a decent vote
Claimed PR? I missed something bigUnvote
I'll check in later to place a decent vote
Huh.. I'm thinking it's too late for any other new wagons to form, really. And lynching a claimed PR seems risky... better to quiz him tomorrow if he lives. He's actually right in that there's not a lot of alignment-indicative stuff going on, and gkreig is the only one who's said anything really noteworthy. I feel bad for wanting to lynch him D1, though, because he's so rarely lived to see D2 lately :-(
Claimed PR? I missed something big
Cannot delay going to bed any longer. I am a PR, no need to give scum any more info. Don't lynch me.
Thanks!Claimed PR? I missed something big
You did:Cannot delay going to bed any longer. I am a PR, no need to give scum any more info. Don't lynch me.
we have to decide that if we let calamitas live, should he full claim first thing tomorrow.yes
Out of Calamitas and gkrieg, I prefer Calamitas actually. I think it would have been pretty important to claim what role he is so that he could get counterclaimed, but now it's just this magical shield that absolutely prevents us from lynching him with no way to verify anything, which is suspicious.i thought this as well, and initially i thought scum knew the set of PRs from the addon, but there's two options for each one. narrowing it down lets on to other interacting PRs. i think that calam as a pr would care more about that noise than holding himself accountable
we have to decide that if we let calamitas live, should he full claim first thing tomorrow. Too bad we can't ask calamitas. SA, what do you think of calamitas and how to handle his claim?
vote: schadd ?
Vote Count 1.10I think I unvoted...
Eevee (2): Ichimaru Gin, Awaclus
gkrieg13 (5): Calamitas, schadd, faust, Roadrunner7671, SpaceAnemone (L-1)
Calamitas (2): Robz888, gkrieg13
SpaceAnemone (1): LaLight
schadd (1): Eevee
Not Voting (0):
With 11 alive it takes 6 to lynch. Day 1 will last 10 days. The deadline for Day 1 will be Thursday, 19 January, at 1 AM forum time.
That is in about 3 hours
is gkrieg just better than no lynch?i should think so
Vote Count 1.10I think I unvoted...
Eevee (2): Ichimaru Gin, Awaclus
gkrieg13 (5): Calamitas, schadd, faust, Roadrunner7671, SpaceAnemone (L-1)
Calamitas (2): Robz888, gkrieg13
SpaceAnemone (1): LaLight
schadd (1): Eevee
Not Voting (0):
With 11 alive it takes 6 to lynch. Day 1 will last 10 days. The deadline for Day 1 will be Thursday, 19 January, at 1 AM forum time.
That is in about 3 hours
Unvote
I'll check in later to place a decent vote
is gkrieg just better than no lynch? anyone but me and rr here?
Also I will point out that Calamitas's claim comes at a very convenient time, right before he goes to bed so we can't question him about it.why do we want to question him about it? i think the amount of information he gave was intentional
Then what do you care about?there's a couple things that i don't want to tell you. i quite think faust is town
I'm seriously going to be lynched again D1?
can you do your confirmation bias thing plz, and on gkriegis gkrieg just better than no lynch? anyone but me and rr here?
I'm here as well.
can you do your confirmation bias thing plz, and on gkrieg
I guess I would go for anyone other than myself to ensure a lynch, but I'm not super excited about schadd.
Also I will point out that Calamitas's claim comes at a very convenient time, right before he goes to bed so we can't question him about it.why do we want to question him about it? i think the amount of information he gave was intentionalThen what do you care about?there's a couple things that i don't want to tell you. i quite think faust is town
I'm seriously going to be lynched again D1?can you do your confirmation bias thing plz, and on gkriegis gkrieg just better than no lynch? anyone but me and rr here?
I'm here as well.
And?
un momentcan you do your confirmation bias thing plz, and on gkrieg
What confirmation bias thing?
Sorry about the mistake, RR. Fixed.It's okay Mr. Mod <3
I don't recall him being able to prove that he's town.
Actually he hasn't even tried to say anything in his defense at all. Wow, he's, like, actually guaranteed to be scum now.
although, crud, you only do it on mislynches that i can find. so, disregardPPE. I need to read some of RR's games, but I would say that asking why he hasn't been lynched is a scumtell for him.
Yeah, he's definitely scum here.
The lack of townreads is tough in this situation.Who are your town reads?
I'm tempted to vote for gkrieg, but it's really a shot in the dark and if he is town, he might be very useful for a later (inverse if he is scum).
I have no idea what to do.
Uh...Schaad? It's a little late to try and get a RR wagon.no, you're town.
can you do your confirmation bias thing plz, and on gkriegnote the end part. quotes targeted you because those are the ones i could find
I'm here.Town reads? Scum reads? How long will you be around for?
None! Some predisposition to not lynch the most active movers and shakers of the game. But there is no one that has behaved in a way that I think they wouldn't as scum. I guess this game has been somewhat devoid of emotional outbursts and people strongly disagreeing with other, I guess those are where I usually make my reads. So little voting and wagons too, hard to find material for reads.The lack of townreads is tough in this situation.Who are your town reads?
I'm tempted to vote for gkrieg, but it's really a shot in the dark and if he is town, he might be very useful for a later (inverse if he is scum).
I have no idea what to do.
Schadd, do you think I'm town?nop
I guess I would go for anyone other than myself to ensure a lynch, but I'm not super excited about schadd.
What about Eevee?
Want to vote for: EeveeI'm here.Town reads? Scum reads? How long will you be around for?
eevee lynch is kinda useless and, as earlier mentioned, eezee
..No, but seriously, I think that's a good idea. 24 hours before the deadline, 1AM on Wednesday would probably make sense?l0l
i love the whoosing noise they make as they go by
I've rethought and have a gut feelingnot how that works
True it was poorly worded. It's intuition.I've rethought and have a gut feelingnot how that works
I'm a pr.ayyy
There's other stuff you can do to try and not get lynched besides claiming...just saying.claiming is fast
There's other stuff you can do to try and not get lynched besides claiming...just saying.I've tried all day, and it's 1.5 hours until the deadline.
And I know that I've claimed too easily in the past.
There's other stuff you can do to try and not get lynched besides claiming...just saying.I've tried all day, and it's 1.5 hours until the deadline.
And I know that I've claimed too easily in the past.
here, my darlings! (headache is killing me)Great! (Not the headache, hope that lets up.)
headache is killing meweren't u already dead
Ichi, what do you think of schadd and SA? (Who would you rather lynch?)Off the cuff, I'd say schadd. I don't really know either of them though...so yeah.
I will laugh as hell if gkrieg is Traitori would mostly be like dang, thought he was proper scum
Am I missing why schadd is say that he's conftown?i tunneled a red guy
Oh. I am sorry I townread gkrieg so hard. We have 2 options:
4. 1-shot Commuter, Psychologist, Detective; Mafia Knows Traitor
7. 1-shot Commuter, Jailkeeper, Detective; Traitor Knows Mafia + Serial Killer
We still may have SK, but I think it's 4, cause lynching gkrieg is hard. That proves that faust is town actually.
I will be vla this whole day. vote: SA after rereading some.
Oh. I am sorry I townread gkrieg so hard. We have 2 options:
4. 1-shot Commuter, Psychologist, Detective; Mafia Knows Traitor
7. 1-shot Commuter, Jailkeeper, Detective; Traitor Knows Mafia + Serial Killer
We still may have SK, but I think it's 4, cause lynching gkrieg is hard. That proves that faust is town actually.
I will be vla this whole day. vote: SA after rereading some.
Why don't we have these options:
1. Detective, 1-shot Commuter, Goon Cop; 1-shot Investigation Immune + Serial Killer
5. Watcher, 1-shot BP Townie, 1-shot BP Commuter; 2-shot JOAT (I assume the BP Commuter is a typo or something)
Eevee is a PR, iirc. Should he claim?
Also if we're not in setup #5, he should just claim his full role right away, because scum will basically want to kill any non-BP roles that are left regardless of what they are.True.
does strongman beat commuter?At least usually, it wouldn't work that way.
Whew!So let's look at a list of possible counterclaims. The following roles should claim now if they exist:
I'm the psychologist. Targeted Robz last night, received no result. How do I even receive no result if we are in 4. 1-shot Commuter, Psychologist, Detective; Mafia Knows Traitor?
I can't find a page for detective in mafiascum, what does the role do?
Whew!
I'm the psychologist. Targeted Robz last night, received no result. How do I even receive no result if we are in 4. 1-shot Commuter, Psychologist, Detective; Mafia Knows Traitor?
I can't find a page for detective in mafiascum, what does the role do?
Eevee: Detective investigates has killed/hasn't killed, as stated in the setup post.
Townie post. Comes 5 minutes after gkrieg's post.vote: WW for being a traitor
Only mafia can know traitor in some setups... vote: gkrieg
I did not think gkrieg was breadcrumbing traitor, and if he was, maybe he's town and wants to screw with mafia. So this is a total null thing that does not matter.This is a total scummy thing that does matter.
Yeah. gkrieg thing is weird. It doesn't feel scum-weird to me though.This is not that great.
Also this post is super townie.You guys sure are trigger-happy. I would lynch gkrieg, LaLight, Eevee, maybe RR.could i maybe convince you to sway over to gkrieg without pointing out any examples of why you should do so?
Eevee seems beter than LaLight right now. Vote: Eevee
RR votes for gkrieg. The reasoning is really bad and it could well be bussing, so I'm not sure if this is town or scum. But he does turn the major wagon from Eevee to gkrieg, so I'm ending up on light town.Vote Count 1.gkriegThat's super, super scummy. Vote: gkreig
Eevee (4): Ichimaru Gin, Awaclus, Roadrunner, gkrieg13
gkrieg13 (3): Calamitas, schadd, faust
Calamitas (3): SpaceAnemone, Eevee, Robz888
RR (1): LaLight
vote: eevee
scum!gkrieg doesn't make mistakes like that (sorry for the crap assumption, faust)LaLight continues to defend gkrieg.
Vote: schaddI don't feel too good about this.
(at least till I decide whether voting for gkrieg is a strong idea)
UnvoteOkay earlier gkrieg was "super super scummy", but now it's not a decent vote anymore? This makes RR scummier again.
I'll check in later to place a decent vote
Vote: gkriegMeanwhile Spacey moves to town territory.
Definitely bed time soon, though hopefully I'll check back in a little while, with the possibility of phone-posting when I should be sleeping...
Out of Calamitas and gkrieg, I prefer Calamitas actually. I think it would have been pretty important to claim what role he is so that he could get counterclaimed, but now it's just this magical shield that absolutely prevents us from lynching him with no way to verify anything, which is suspicious.That's pretty bad. I mean I get the sentiment. But lynching a PR is still bad. Plus, why does Awaclus even explain his reads here?
I'm less excited about gktieg than I was before and I guess I'm a bit more excited about schadd.
I have to go in a few, so I'm gonna vote: Eevee and see what happens.More scumminess from RR.
That's also not great.Want to vote for: EeveeI'm here.Town reads? Scum reads? How long will you be around for?
Maybe: schadd, space, LaLight, gkrieg
No: faust, Awaclus, Robz, Calamitas
gkrieg was right about the Eevee wagon. I've rethought and have a gut feeling about him. That's all I've got.
I will be around til deadline. But may only check in every little while.
Mafia knows Traitor is good for us; makes wagon analysis way more useful.
Plus, why does Awaclus even explain his reads here?[/qote]
That is actually a very good question. Probably shouldn't have done that.Awaclus and Robz are scummy, but I think there's only 1 scum among them.
It's Robz.
Plus, why does Awaclus even explain his reads here?
Awaclus and Robz are scummy, but I think there's only 1 scum among them.
Awaclus and Robz are scummy, but I think there's only 1 scum among them.
Well Robz pushed Awaclus a fair bit during D1, and he's not usually the type for D1 bussing.Awaclus and Robz are scummy, but I think there's only 1 scum among them.
How confident are you that there is exactly one scum between the two of them? I think it's hard to get a feeling on Robz because he's been VLA so much at the moment.
And now Awaclus is pushing for Robz, which also doesn't sound like a great idea for a scum team consisting of the two of them.
Well for their scumminess go check my reread.And now Awaclus is pushing for Robz, which also doesn't sound like a great idea for a scum team consisting of the two of them.
Okay, you're giving me arguments for "not more than one", but not for "at least one".
And now Awaclus is pushing for Robz, which also doesn't sound like a great idea for a scum team consisting of the two of them.
reason for robz?Didn't think he'd perform the kill if he was scum since he is a common target for power roles, also he is one of the strongest players so information on him would be higher utility.
does strongman beat commuter?
Order of Operations: (roles listed earlier in parenthesis will be performed simultaneously)
Modifiers (Ninja/Strongman)
Commuter
Blocking (Jailkeeper, Roleblocking)
Protective (Bodyguard, Bulletproof)
Killing
Investigative (Watcher, Psychologist, Detective, Goon Cop)
It's not really a question of "occuring before" IMO. And I am not sure how it makes sense that a modifier is "performed". But I guess that discussion does not belong here.does strongman beat commuter?
I will follow the order of operations posted in the setup when resolving night actions. So yes, strongman occurs before commuterOrder of Operations: (roles listed earlier in parenthesis will be performed simultaneously)
Modifiers (Ninja/Strongman)
Commuter
Blocking (Jailkeeper, Roleblocking)
Protective (Bodyguard, Bulletproof)
Killing
Investigative (Watcher, Psychologist, Detective, Goon Cop)
@SA
No result implies either Robz or me was jailed.
Oh or blocked! You passed the unintentional test. Or something.@SA
No result implies either Robz or me was jailed.
Eh? I think a scum goon will have inherited gkrieg's roleblocking when he died, and so RB'd you, surely? We're on row 4 of the setup, so no jailkeeper as I understand it...
Vote: RRReasons?
tell them i said hi
Vote: RRReasons?
notell them i said hi
Hi :-P
but at the same time i don't really see why theyspace, si vous plait, why vote gkrieg?i momentarily was concerned about why they needed a reason to vote me but not gkrieg, then i thought, well, gkrieg is generally a better town than me. and i made soup in the middle of making that sentence and forgot to change it.
This is really weak. The wagon on RR is blowing up because I was off wagon. Sorry for going to bed literally 5 minutes before Eevee made his announcement? Almost half the town was off wagon, why is it only me under fire?
Like I mentioned, there were 4 other people off wagon. I also don't think I interacted scummily at all with gkrieg, but no one has bothered to point that out.This is really weak. The wagon on RR is blowing up because I was off wagon. Sorry for going to bed literally 5 minutes before Eevee made his announcement? Almost half the town was off wagon, why is it only me under fire?
Why shouldn't it be you under fire?
Like I mentioned, there were 4 other people off wagon. I also don't think I interacted scummily at all with gkrieg, but no one has bothered to point that out.This is really weak. The wagon on RR is blowing up because I was off wagon. Sorry for going to bed literally 5 minutes before Eevee made his announcement? Almost half the town was off wagon, why is it only me under fire?
Why shouldn't it be you under fire?
How did you act non-scummily with gkrieg?How did I act scummily with gkrieg?
How did you act non-scummily with gkrieg?How did I act scummily with gkrieg?
If I don't interact with gkrieg at all, that's not scummy. So although innocent until proven guilty rarely applies in mafia, it applies here.How did you act non-scummily with gkrieg?How did I act scummily with gkrieg?
No, how did you act non-scummily with gkrieg?
you preferred a conftown to gkrieg, which is no goodI didn'tknow he was confirmed town at the time!!
ofc not a conftown at the time but one nowSo that argument hold no merit.
If I don't interact with gkrieg at all, that's not scummy. So although innocent until proven guilty rarely applies in mafia, it applies here.
ofc not a conftown at the time but one nowSo that argument hold no merit.
voting people that are town is a thing that scum is more likely to do than town. not voting people that are scum is something that scum is more likely to do than town. which is to say, your face holds no meritespecially if you _never give a hecking reason for the town that you voted_
I don't know which is worse, trying to reason with schadd or Awaclus ::)
I don't know which is worse, trying to reason with schadd or Awaclus ::)Well it's both probably easier than trying to reason with you.
about that wagon yesterday, hm?something that i forgot to mention, i had some level of concern that the wagon worked in part because scum were trying to get cred for the lynch; uh, after looking at all of the people on it, that doesn't really add up, maybe except for me (note my second post toDay)
I don't really like the vibe I'm getting from Schadd.Agreed. Something feels off, like a hidden desperation.
you mean like how yesterDay, when i was v desperate to get gkrieg lynched?
that was demonstrably not the goal of the post
I don't know which is worse, trying to reason with schadd or Awaclus ::)Well it's both probably easier than trying to reason with you.
Really RR?I think you're on the same team as schadd. I think schadd is scummy. Therefore...
Really?
Well I'm warming up to your lynch now. And perhaps back to my old self ;D
Still. vote: schadd for now.
But why do you think schadd and I are on the same team?Really RR?I think you're on the same team as schadd. I think schadd is scummy. Therefore...
Really?
Well I'm warming up to your lynch now. And perhaps back to my old self ;D
Still. vote: schadd for now.
But your vote is odd. If schadd is scum and you're scum I can see you finding him scummy, but I can't really see you nailing his coffin closed.
At this point I'm assuming scahdd is scum, and like I said, it looked like bussing to me.But why do you think schadd and I are on the same team?Really RR?I think you're on the same team as schadd. I think schadd is scummy. Therefore...
Really?
Well I'm warming up to your lynch now. And perhaps back to my old self ;D
Still. vote: schadd for now.
But your vote is odd. If schadd is scum and you're scum I can see you finding him scummy, but I can't really see you nailing his coffin closed.
schadd-Pretty scummy. homestly. This is mostly based on D2 stuff.Explain.
PPS - made that commitment so would lynch if forced. Otherwise IC. Confused why not obvtown to everyone.
Yeah I'm not buying schadd's bid for IC status, and I've also just found his play sort of bizarre all game.i don't see why either of these are scummy
Vote: schadd
That being said, I think a faust lynch wouldn't be the worst thing we could do.if you lost your hedge trimmers, you can just borrow one of ours. we're good neighbors.
However, if schadd is town, I don't see you being bold enough (with one of your scumbuddies already dead) to build his wagon like this.that doesn't make any sense
We pretty much do.you mean like how yesterDay, when i was v desperate to get gkrieg lynched?
stop pointing on your considerable ICness just because you tunnelled gkrieg. We still do not know if you were aware he's traitor. vote: schadd
We pretty much do.you mean like how yesterDay, when i was v desperate to get gkrieg lynched?
stop pointing on your considerable ICness just because you tunnelled gkrieg. We still do not know if you were aware he's traitor. vote: schadd
That's why I think RR looks so scummy, because he sidled off gkrieg's wagon at a really bad moment.Wouldn't that be suicide to do as scum?
When scum protects their partner, the hope is of course that they succeed and no one gets to see that they were defending a red person. It only becomes problematic when you try and fail.That's why I think RR looks so scummy, because he sidled off gkrieg's wagon at a really bad moment.Wouldn't that be suicide to do as scum?
That's why I think RR looks so scummy, because he sidled off gkrieg's wagon at a really bad moment.Wouldn't that be suicide to do as scum?
I wasn't 'protecting' gkrieg. If you reread, you'll learn that I was happy to have him lynched, but I was more happy to have Eevee lynched, and I thought Eevee's lynch would be more likely to go through.When scum protects their partner, the hope is of course that they succeed and no one gets to see that they were defending a red person. It only becomes problematic when you try and fail.That's why I think RR looks so scummy, because he sidled off gkrieg's wagon at a really bad moment.Wouldn't that be suicide to do as scum?
I wasn't 'protecting' gkrieg. If you reread, you'll learn that I was happy to have him lynched, but I was more happy to have Eevee lynched, and I thought Eevee's lynch would be more likely to go through.When scum protects their partner, the hope is of course that they succeed and no one gets to see that they were defending a red person. It only becomes problematic when you try and fail.That's why I think RR looks so scummy, because he sidled off gkrieg's wagon at a really bad moment.Wouldn't that be suicide to do as scum?
How did this become about everyone?I wasn't 'protecting' gkrieg. If you reread, you'll learn that I was happy to have him lynched, but I was more happy to have Eevee lynched, and I thought Eevee's lynch would be more likely to go through.When scum protects their partner, the hope is of course that they succeed and no one gets to see that they were defending a red person. It only becomes problematic when you try and fail.That's why I think RR looks so scummy, because he sidled off gkrieg's wagon at a really bad moment.Wouldn't that be suicide to do as scum?
So what were your overall reads/feelings of scumminess for everyone at that point in the game? (As opposed to your current D2 feelings at post #818).
How did this become about everyone?I wasn't 'protecting' gkrieg. If you reread, you'll learn that I was happy to have him lynched, but I was more happy to have Eevee lynched, and I thought Eevee's lynch would be more likely to go through.When scum protects their partner, the hope is of course that they succeed and no one gets to see that they were defending a red person. It only becomes problematic when you try and fail.That's why I think RR looks so scummy, because he sidled off gkrieg's wagon at a really bad moment.Wouldn't that be suicide to do as scum?
So what were your overall reads/feelings of scumminess for everyone at that point in the game? (As opposed to your current D2 feelings at post #818).
I wasn't worried about that at all tbh. Just catch the scum one at a time, you know?How did this become about everyone?I wasn't 'protecting' gkrieg. If you reread, you'll learn that I was happy to have him lynched, but I was more happy to have Eevee lynched, and I thought Eevee's lynch would be more likely to go through.When scum protects their partner, the hope is of course that they succeed and no one gets to see that they were defending a red person. It only becomes problematic when you try and fail.That's why I think RR looks so scummy, because he sidled off gkrieg's wagon at a really bad moment.Wouldn't that be suicide to do as scum?
So what were your overall reads/feelings of scumminess for everyone at that point in the game? (As opposed to your current D2 feelings at post #818).
It's always about everyone if you're paranoid :-P I assumed you'd formed opinions on the other people, even if you've presented it now as just a choice between gkrieg and Eevee. Like, where did you really feel like the scums were at that point?
Actually protecting the traitor is quite a bit better than protecting your normal partner, as you can try to play the "mafia might not have known who he is" card afterwards.That's why I think RR looks so scummy, because he sidled off gkrieg's wagon at a really bad moment.Wouldn't that be suicide to do as scum?
By the way, I don't think recruiting the Traitor is something scum would ever actively want to do.That's why I think RR looks so scummy, because he sidled off gkrieg's wagon at a really bad moment.Wouldn't that be suicide to do as scum?
Well, you'd have been gambling.. the chance to recruit gkrieg would have been quite tempting, no?
LaLight at least is semi VLA.But why? He is very much town.
I really need to re-read but I've been putting it off. I'm still quite happy with my schadd vote, though.
LaLight at least is semi VLA.But why? He is very much town.
I really need to re-read but I've been putting it off. I'm still quite happy with my schadd vote, though.
Huh? No, in this setup, at some point, we know everything.Actually protecting the traitor is quite a bit better than protecting your normal partner, as you can try to play the "mafia might not have known who he is" card afterwards.That's why I think RR looks so scummy, because he sidled off gkrieg's wagon at a really bad moment.Wouldn't that be suicide to do as scum?
All I see from him is a lot of empty nothingness, and it's giving me a bad feeling.speak for yourself, cowboy
so.
space, si vous plait, what were your thoughts for voting gkrieg
What up guys? It's not the weekend anymore.
Prod: Awaclus, LaLight
What up guys? It's not the weekend anymore.
Prod: Awaclus, LaLight
It's not hard to understand if you check my reread. But I can extract the case on schadd being town from it if people think it's necessary.What up guys? It's not the weekend anymore.
Prod: Awaclus, LaLight
Oh, I am really sorry. I guess, my schadd vote was not log ago? I am still fine with it. And I still think he was pointing too much to the fact he was tunneling gkrieg. And I still think faust is town. Not much happened from my pov that could make me change my thoughts. Well, I clearly can't understand why faust thinks schadd is town.
so.
space, si vous plait, what were your thoughts for voting gkrieg
All I see from him is a lot of empty nothingness, and it's giving me a bad feeling. I mean, obviously I have to re-read to see if it makes any sense.
schadd and Awaclus post without actually saying something about the incident. I rather think that scum would feel compelled to comment, so mild town points.
schadd goes on to defend gkrieg a bit. I don't like.
Awaclus also goes for Spacey rather than gkrieg, as does schadd. Okay, I think definite scum among schadd/Awaclus/Robz.
schadd votes for gkrieg. That's a town thing to do. Scum is just happy that people forgot about gkrieg.Also this post is super townie.You guys sure are trigger-happy. I would lynch gkrieg, LaLight, Eevee, maybe RR.could i maybe convince you to sway over to gkrieg without pointing out any examples of why you should do so?
Eevee seems beter than LaLight right now. Vote: EeveeVote: schaddI don't feel too good about this.
(at least till I decide whether voting for gkrieg is a strong idea)
schadd also defends Eevee. schadd is like super town.
In the end, there is movement towards schadd, but it should be clear to everybody that there's not enough people around to lynch. I think scum's only shot at that point was to try and get Eevee lynched. The fact that both LaLight and Ichi did not try that warrants some town points.
It's not hard to understand if you check my reread. But I can extract the case on schadd being town from it if people think it's necessary.
But still this doesn't make schadd supertownie if Eevee is scum, I guess.
It's not hard to understand if you check my reread. But I can extract the case on schadd being town from it if people think it's necessary.
Yeah, I agree that faust and schadd look pretty towny, but not actually IC. Eevee seems like 97% IC to me. My suspicion falls on Robz (for not having said more now he's back), Awaclus (for being generally a bit scummy) and LL for being suspicious of all the towny people. And anyone else in the game for not being memorable right now, though I'm sleepy (Aha: Ichi!). RR just keeps seeming scummy in his evasiveness with my questions this afternoon, so my vote is staying on him.
PPE 1
But still this doesn't make schadd supertownie if Eevee is scum, I guess.
Do you really think Eevee can be scum? Why wouldn't someone counterclaim and get him lynched?
But still this doesn't make schadd supertownie if Eevee is scum, I guess.
Do you really think Eevee can be scum? Why wouldn't someone counterclaim and get him lynched?
I forgot about his claim, frankly to say.
If I get the setup right, there may be no psychologist at all, but the roles may be fit. I should look at it.
But still this doesn't make schadd supertownie if Eevee is scum, I guess.
Do you really think Eevee can be scum? Why wouldn't someone counterclaim and get him lynched?
I forgot about his claim, frankly to say.
If I get the setup right, there may be no psychologist at all, but the roles may be fit. I should look at it.
7. 1-shot Commuter, Jailkeeper, Detective; Traitor Knows Mafia + Serial Killer
This might be the case for example. Every role can be possible with Psychologist, but there can be no psychologist at all.
But still this doesn't make schadd supertownie if Eevee is scum, I guess.
Do you really think Eevee can be scum? Why wouldn't someone counterclaim and get him lynched?
I forgot about his claim, frankly to say.
If I get the setup right, there may be no psychologist at all, but the roles may be fit. I should look at it.
7. 1-shot Commuter, Jailkeeper, Detective; Traitor Knows Mafia + Serial Killer
This might be the case for example. Every role can be possible with Psychologist, but there can be no psychologist at all.
But in that case, the Jailkeeper just counterclaims Eevee, since there's no way to have a JK and Calamitas's role in the same game with a Psychologist, so the JK knows Eevee is lying.
Amusing fact: LL and I are sitting about 1.5m away from each other in my kitchen, unable to see each other's laptop screens, communicating only through the forum :-Ptell him i said hi
But in that case, the Jailkeeper just counterclaims Eeveealso, i asked eevee for a reason why he chose robz and the one that he came up with made sense (as opposed to m90, which is ofc why i asked). so i'd say that scoots him up from 97% town to 97.8% town
Amusing fact: LL and I are sitting about 1.5m away from each other in my kitchen, unable to see each other's laptop screens, communicating only through the forum :-Ptell him i said hiBut in that case, the Jailkeeper just counterclaims Eeveealso, i asked eevee for a reason why he chose robz and the one that he came up with made sense (as opposed to m90, which is ofc why i asked). so i'd say that scoots him up from 97% town to 97.8% town
LaLight at least is semi VLA.
I really need to re-read but I've been putting it off. I'm still quite happy with my schadd vote, though.
I seriously don't get why people don't do rereads. Here we had a scum lynch D1, on a guy that was under fire for most of that day. We know that the other scums were aware of this. Yet instead of analyzing the plentiful interactions we got from this, people for for random inconsequential stuff. I mean seriously, do some work here guys.
Prod: Awaclus, LaLight
What up guys? It's not the weekend anymore.
Prod: Awaclus, LaLight
Vote Count 2.2rr isn't voting, i'm voting rr
Vote Count 2.2rr isn't voting, i'm voting rr
So, Eevee is, well, 95% IC i guess.To this and similar posts: No, Eevee is 100% IC.
I wonder, is doing that already forbidden communication about the game?Amusing fact: LL and I are sitting about 1.5m away from each other in my kitchen, unable to see each other's laptop screens, communicating only through the forum :-Ptell him i said hi
I wonder, is doing that already forbidden communication about the game?Amusing fact: LL and I are sitting about 1.5m away from each other in my kitchen, unable to see each other's laptop screens, communicating only through the forum :-Ptell him i said hi
vote: gkrieg13. Too hard to get his lynch. But if he's town, I'm sorry and I'm gonna blame myself to death. L-1this is just a thing that doesn't make sense to me as either alignment; why would you want the blame for that? esp. 20 minutes before deadline with like nobody there. it kinda almost makes sense as scum, like, you want to imply that you also want credit if he's scum, but that ploy would break open really fast because the PRs were gonna claim, like, immediately and mafia knows traitor would become apparent. so who knows.
Mostly, I came away even more convinced that schadd is scum. Look, here's the thing, first he defends gkrieg, and then he votes gkrieg when we are basically moving away from the discussion about gkrieg's traitor breadcrumb, and then he never moves his vote, ever. This is textbook vote-for-your-partner-when-your-partner-is-safe.i still think that wanting scum to think you're the traitor isn't alignment indicative. not moving the vote is also textbook having-a-pretty-hard-scumread
Subsequently, schadd was gone most of the day. Unfortunately for him, after the Eevee and Calamitas claims, it so happened that schadd himself was presented as the alternative to gkrieg. Which is a terrible spot for scum, and it's the reason gkrieg went down, I suspect.uh, i was pretty clearly there right around both of the claims.
So yeah, I'm comfortable voting schadd. He committed to the light bus, the bus that doesn't lynch a partner, and he got screwed. That's what it looks like to me.hey, remember that time that i got faust to join the wagon? i guess it might seem like i didn't expect him to do it, but that only makes sense under the assumption that i don't get faust
Subsequently, schadd was gone most of the day. Unfortunately for him, after the Eevee and Calamitas claims, it so happened that schadd himself was presented as the alternative to gkrieg. Which is a terrible spot for scum, and it's the reason gkrieg went down, I suspect.
but let's look at lalight.
there's something about the way he's voted & talked about other people in this game that seems wrong. i would say that he tends to have more biting and effortful criticisms as town. eg:
M88 (spoilers, he's town)
one (http://forum.dominionstrategy.com/index.php?topic=16392.msg651357#msg651357) and two (http://forum.dominionstrategy.com/index.php?topic=16392.msg651499#msg651499) and three (http://forum.dominionstrategy.com/index.php?topic=16392.msg652141#msg652141) and four (http://forum.dominionstrategy.com/index.php?topic=16392.msg652334#msg652334) and five (http://forum.dominionstrategy.com/index.php?topic=16392.msg652578#msg652578) and six (http://forum.dominionstrategy.com/index.php?topic=16392.msg653200#msg653200) (note "you should")
M86 (spoliers, not): more vague, hedgy, impersonal, agreeing with other people
one (http://forum.dominionstrategy.com/index.php?topic=16147.msg633567#msg633567) and two (http://forum.dominionstrategy.com/index.php?topic=16147.msg634199#msg634199) and three (http://forum.dominionstrategy.com/index.php?topic=16147.msg635321#msg635321) (kinda counter-example, but this is like his only scumread the whole game) and four (http://forum.dominionstrategy.com/index.php?topic=16147.msg636088#msg636088) and five (http://forum.dominionstrategy.com/index.php?topic=16147.msg636357#msg636357) and six (http://forum.dominionstrategy.com/index.php?topic=16147.msg636572#msg636572) (unexplained) and seven (http://forum.dominionstrategy.com/index.php?topic=16147.msg636775#msg636775) and eight (http://forum.dominionstrategy.com/index.php?topic=16147.msg636796#msg636796) and nine (http://forum.dominionstrategy.com/index.php?topic=16147.msg636864#msg636864)
M92 (!)
one (http://forum.dominionstrategy.com/index.php?topic=16729.msg668422#msg668422) (impersonal) and two (http://forum.dominionstrategy.com/index.php?topic=16729.msg668717#msg668717) (overexplained) and three (http://forum.dominionstrategy.com/index.php?topic=16729.msg668746#msg668746) ("don't know what to think" is much more M86 than M88) and four (http://forum.dominionstrategy.com/index.php?topic=16729.msg668847#msg668847) (maybe biting, but at least i don't think that was true) and five (http://forum.dominionstrategy.com/index.php?topic=16729.msg670186#msg670186) (similarity to rmm7 not elaborated, "looking for a mislynch" is also kinda vague) and six (http://forum.dominionstrategy.com/index.php?topic=16729.msg670251#msg670251) (see next post) and seven (http://forum.dominionstrategy.com/index.php?topic=16729.msg670807#msg670807) (eh, kinda counterexample)
another thing that's i think a lot more reminiscent of M86 than M88 that also pops up in this game is lalight talking about himself
M88
largely absent, a couple (http://forum.dominionstrategy.com/index.php?topic=16392.msg652504#msg652504) brief moments (http://forum.dominionstrategy.com/index.php?topic=16392.msg652329#msg652329) where it pointed to another thing
M86
one (http://forum.dominionstrategy.com/index.php?topic=16147.msg634553#msg634553) (largeee) + a lot (http://forum.dominionstrategy.com/index.php?topic=16147.msg633608#msg633608) of posts (http://forum.dominionstrategy.com/index.php?topic=16147.msg634513#msg634513) where he (http://forum.dominionstrategy.com/index.php?topic=16147.msg636101#msg636101) puts emphasis on his reasoning rather than stuff other people said
M92
one (http://forum.dominionstrategy.com/index.php?topic=16729.msg668742#msg668742) and two (http://forum.dominionstrategy.com/index.php?topic=16729.msg668807#msg668807) and three (http://forum.dominionstrategy.com/index.php?topic=16729.msg670424#msg670424) and four (http://forum.dominionstrategy.com/index.php?topic=16729.msg671076#msg671076)
and a other thingvote: gkrieg13. Too hard to get his lynch. But if he's town, I'm sorry and I'm gonna blame myself to death. L-1this is just a thing that doesn't make sense to me as either alignment; why would you want the blame for that? esp. 20 minutes before deadline with like nobody there. it kinda almost makes sense as scum, like, you want to imply that you also want credit if he's scum, but that ploy would break open really fast because the PRs were gonna claim, like, immediately and mafia knows traitor would become apparent. so who knows.
not gonna proofread. tell me if any links don't make sense
sheep me baby one more time.
vote: lalight
Other explanations--the scum team is RR and Awaclus, basically--strike me as way too overly simple.
i intentionally did only D1 from each game
The LaLight case is interesting, but at this point I really just want to lynch Robz.
I understand why you would want to lynch me, but you're wrong.
I feel very towny about you based on the amount of effort you're putting in to keep things going, and on making the case. Can I suggest further homework? :-) What are your reads on Awaclus, Robz and Ichi? Do you feel like we have any clear partnerships in {Awaclus, Ichi, LL, Robz, RR}?i uh have to read those people. awaclus is kinda townfully stubborn (but i dunno if that's a consistent tell), robz is doing a lot of stuff that would look bad from other people, ichi has a ton of commenting/narrating gamestate and few opinions
is bad reasoning scummy for robz?
light bus(http://i.imgur.com/45kSoE1.png)
the tip of the tongue taking a trip of three steps down the palate to tap, at three, on the teeth. vote. lah. light.
I feel very towny about you based on the amount of effort you're putting in to keep things going, and on making the case. Can I suggest further homework? :-) What are your reads on Awaclus, Robz and Ichi? Do you feel like we have any clear partnerships in {Awaclus, Ichi, LL, Robz, RR}?
I disagree. Robz defends LL only because the case comes from schadd, whom he supposedly scumreads. It wouldn't be consistent for him to agree with a case that his top scum read makes, and scum!Robz is definitely concerned with consistency.is bad reasoning scummy for robz?
I find Robz's defence of LL kind of towny, actually, given that I can't see them being a scum pairing.
Faust, have YOU re-read? Your faith in schadd didn't waver?yeah, he did, 755. did you, like, read the first time?
Faust, have YOU re-read? Your faith in schadd didn't waver?yeah, he did, 755. did you, like, read the first time?
I feel very towny about you based on the amount of effort you're putting in to keep things going, and on making the case. Can I suggest further homework? :-) What are your reads on Awaclus, Robz and Ichi? Do you feel like we have any clear partnerships in {Awaclus, Ichi, LL, Robz, RR}?
I think D2 is a bit too early for partner talk.
Other explanations--the scum team is RR and Awaclus, basically--strike me as way too overly simple.
Given how much Awaclus seems to have it in for you, in what ways is that explanation too simple?
there's another guy that i'd like to shoot some time and concentration at, if i have any of that leftI feel very towny about you based on the amount of effort you're putting in to keep things going, and on making the case. Can I suggest further homework? :-) What are your reads on Awaclus, Robz and Ichi? Do you feel like we have any clear partnerships in {Awaclus, Ichi, LL, Robz, RR}?
I think D2 is a bit too early for partner talk.
Hmm... I'd agree that second-order partner analysis makes for more work than first-order scum-hunts, but schadd has just demonstrated he's got enough time and concentration to put some quite comprehensive effort into this :-) With Eevee as an IC already, and with several others looking really townie, there are only actually 10 possible pairings between the people I suggested - fewer to consider if he's got a comfortable enough town read on any of them.
Other explanations--the scum team is RR and Awaclus, basically--strike me as way too overly simple.
Given how much Awaclus seems to have it in for you, in what ways is that explanation too simple?
@Robz?
Faust, have YOU re-read? Your faith in schadd didn't waver?My townread on schadd is largely based upon my reread.
It's also dangerous because with this, people tend to forget that the "really townie" people are actually nowhere near cleared. This is basically how we won NM9.I feel very towny about you based on the amount of effort you're putting in to keep things going, and on making the case. Can I suggest further homework? :-) What are your reads on Awaclus, Robz and Ichi? Do you feel like we have any clear partnerships in {Awaclus, Ichi, LL, Robz, RR}?
I think D2 is a bit too early for partner talk.
Hmm... I'd agree that second-order partner analysis makes for more work than first-order scum-hunts, but schadd has just demonstrated he's got enough time and concentration to put some quite comprehensive effort into this :-) With Eevee as an IC already, and with several others looking really townie, there are only actually 10 possible pairings between the people I suggested - fewer to consider if he's got a comfortable enough town read on any of them.
robz read is proving difficult. he's been town a time in recent memory, and unfortunately we killed him n2, after he had a weird d2 because he was a pr.
robz, what was your latest town game before your hiatus?
I don't think his cases are overwhelmingly compelling, but they're something.
if you lost your hedge trimmers, you can just borrow one of ours. we're good neighbors.plus, that is something that two people sort of already said
If I don't have strong opinions, I don't have strong opinions. Your cases are okay. They're certainly not bad, but they're not enough to make me want to vote for Robz or LaLight.I don't think his cases are overwhelmingly compelling, but they're something.if you lost your hedge trimmers, you can just borrow one of ours. we're good neighbors.plus, that is something that two people sort of already said
If I don't have strong opinions, I don't have strong opinions.oh muh gah. we lynched a traitor day 1, and scum knew who he was. you surely have to be able to find something to talk about. so far, you haven't even given me reason to believe that you read my case all the way
Just making sure I post enough.
Also, only faust makes a bunch of reads n' stuff as scum....
Vote: Awaclus
Just making sure I post enough.
I am okay with vote: Robz now.
What? How does it feel like scum who has given up? Why would scum!Awaclus give up when it looks like he's not going to be the lynch? That would only make sense if you think that you're his partner, which.... does not exactly seem like an argument you want to be making.Just making sure I post enough.
This sort of thing over and over does not inspire confidence. Starting to feel like scum who has given up.
Just making sure I post enough.
This sort of thing over and over does not inspire confidence. Starting to feel like scum who has given up.
People don't like my schadd case, so I'll go Vote: Awaclus, since I seem to be the alternative.
What? How does it feel like scum who has given up? Why would scum!Awaclus give up when it looks like he's not going to be the lynch? That would only make sense if you think that you're his partner, which.... does not exactly seem like an argument you want to be making.Just making sure I post enough.
This sort of thing over and over does not inspire confidence. Starting to feel like scum who has given up.
Just making sure I post enough.
This sort of thing over and over does not inspire confidence. Starting to feel like scum who has given up.
People don't like my schadd case, so I'll go Vote: Awaclus, since I seem to be the alternative.
Dude, I've gotten two prods this game even though I've been actively following what's going on several times every day. I don't want to get replaced just because there's nothing I want to say.
Okay, rereading.
First up, events surrounding gkrieg's breadcrumb:
Faust comes off the towniest. First to react, immediately spells out why it's scummy, is pretty relentless and asks great interrogative questions.
Schadd votes for calamitas apparently for voting for gkrieg, I would say that's slightly scummy.
Robz says it's not an alignment tell whatsoever, this is scummy.
But having nothing to say, over and over again, is I think explained by you being a dismayed scum.
But having nothing to say, over and over again, is I think explained by you being a dismayed scum.
I didn't say that I have nothing to say. I said that I have nothing I want to say, which means that I could comment on things if I wanted to but I don't see the point so I'd rather not.
But having nothing to say, over and over again, is I think explained by you being a dismayed scum.
I didn't say that I have nothing to say. I said that I have nothing I want to say, which means that I could comment on things if I wanted to but I don't see the point so I'd rather not.
I don't see how that undermines the point I'm making.
Awaclus has a point.But having nothing to say, over and over again, is I think explained by you being a dismayed scum.
I didn't say that I have nothing to say. I said that I have nothing I want to say, which means that I could comment on things if I wanted to but I don't see the point so I'd rather not.
I don't see how that undermines the point I'm making.
It undermines it because there is no need to explain it by me being a dismayed scum, when there's also the (much simpler) explanation that I'm just town and feeling pretty normal.
I got the gkrieg thing totally wrong, but... like, I'm still shocked he was actually the Traitor. Never in a million years would I have expected him to do that.It would be shocked too if my partner scumslipped on D1.
He's given up because he's probably lost anyway--scum don't come back from Day 1 scum lynches. That's what it looks like to me, anyway.I once intentionally drove a lynch on my partner on D1 and this made me win the game.
But having nothing to say, over and over again, is I think explained by you being a dismayed scum.
I didn't say that I have nothing to say. I said that I have nothing I want to say, which means that I could comment on things if I wanted to but I don't see the point so I'd rather not.
I don't see how that undermines the point I'm making.
It undermines it because there is no need to explain it by me being a dismayed scum, when there's also the (much simpler) explanation that I'm just town and feeling pretty normal.
Just town, feeling normal, and deliberately not saying things because you don't feel like it?
We need to concentrate our efforts!Calamitas died for our sins.
I don't think Calamitas is a bad option. As far as I can tell his only read this far is that gkrieg is scummy for the traitor thing.
Can't say I would oppose many lynches to be honest, being one of the leading wagons. I don't really have any town reads, it feels like scum is doing well this far.
Vote: gkriegThis is super towny coming after Calamitas's claim, only a couple hours before the deadline when we were scrambling for a new target.
Definitely bed time soon, though hopefully I'll check back in a little while, with the possibility of phone-posting when I should be sleeping...
I guess I would go for anyone other than myself to ensure a lynch, but I'm not super excited about schadd.This was towny from him - for scum Awaclus in that situation with gkrieg being the main alternative pushing for schadd more strongly would make sense. Alas, his day 1 voting history is terrible, tunneling me all day and staying off the scum wagon. I think it's my preferred lynch, the defense hasn't seem genuine to me, but there is the fact that I tend to think that town blames themselves more for the heat if they are getting pressured, and I don't think Awaclus would probably do that anyways, so I shouldn't put much stock to my read of his defense.
schadd - Is very interesting - I could see Robz faking that case as scum, but if he is town, I don't think it's half bad. I think he is definitely, definitely giving himself too much credit for "getting gkrieg lynched". I think SA's vote on him was significantly townier than anything he did. Schadd, do you disagree with that?if he could fake the case, then how is it good? i mean, i pointed out a few things that were factually incorrect about it, and there isn't really much i can say beyond that. does 510 (http://forum.dominionstrategy.com/index.php?topic=16729.500) look like a bus?
faust - just very towny all around. Hats off if this is a scum performance, although if anyone I guess it would be faust.
He's given up because he's probably lost anyway--scum don't come back from Day 1 scum lynches. That's what it looks like to me, anyway.I once intentionally drove a lynch on my partner on D1 and this made me win the game.
Incidentally, casting a shadow of doubt over even the towniest of our players is also what scumRobz would need to do in order to pull this out.
Awaclus's behavior totally matches someone who realizes they are in deep deep waters, and (correctly from my perspective) identifies Robz as the scummiest looking other player, but I think the hail mary against schadd is also totally what scumRobz would try.Awaclus' behaviour is totally normal and in line with Awaclus' play in every game. I don't think it say much about his alignment; if anything, it makes him a bit townier.
Awaclus's behavior totally matches someone who realizes they are in deep deep waters, and (correctly from my perspective) identifies Robz as the scummiest looking other player, but I think the hail mary against schadd is also totally what scumRobz would try.Awaclus' behaviour is totally normal and in line with Awaclus' play in every game. I don't think it say much about his alignment; if anything, it makes him a bit townier.
Awaclus's behavior totally matches someone who realizes they are in deep deep waters, and (correctly from my perspective) identifies Robz as the scummiest looking other player, but I think the hail mary against schadd is also totally what scumRobz would try.Awaclus' behaviour is totally normal and in line with Awaclus' play in every game. I don't think it say much about his alignment; if anything, it makes him a bit townier.
I don't agree. I've never seen him literally just post "bump to keep me from being modkilled" a bunch of times.
Awaclus's behavior totally matches someone who realizes they are in deep deep waters, and (correctly from my perspective) identifies Robz as the scummiest looking other player, but I think the hail mary against schadd is also totally what scumRobz would try.Awaclus' behaviour is totally normal and in line with Awaclus' play in every game. I don't think it say much about his alignment; if anything, it makes him a bit townier.
I don't agree. I've never seen him literally just post "bump to keep me from being modkilled" a bunch of times.
For me personally Robz looks like looking for a mislynch. Schadd, then Awaclus. I don't remember scum!Robz tunnelling much, but nevertheless this is quite antitown from my perspective
I don't agree. I've never seen him literally just post "bump to keep me from being modkilled" a bunch of times.
I am a little surprised that people are so null on me though.
Why can't I be an IC?
I think you're town. Also I'm probs going to sleep real soon.I am a little surprised that people are so null on me though.
Why can't I be an IC?
Becuse we aren't handing IC stati left and right.
I could get behind a robz lynch if that's the consensus.
I could get behind a robz lynch if that's the consensus.
That's the consensus.
I could in theory get behind a Robz lynch in the run-up to the deadline, but right now I'd be much more interested in seeing where the less-townie-looking people are going to put their votes.Who are your top scum- and townreads?
vote count?
I could in theory get behind a Robz lynch in the run-up to the deadline, but right now I'd be much more interested in seeing where the less-townie-looking people are going to put their votes.Who are your top scum- and townreads?
Final readshave you claimed yet?
Vote Count 2.5
Robz888 (4): Awaclus, faust, LaLight, Eevee (L-1)
Roadrunner7671 (1): SpaceAnemone
schadd (1): Robz888
Awaclus (1): Roadrunner7671
LaLight (1): schadd
Not Voting (1): Ichimaru Gin
With 9 alive it takes 5 to lynch. Day 2 will last 10 days. The deadline for Day 2 will be Tuesday, 31 January, at 1 AM forum time.
Seriously, won't even Robz sheep me onto RR?
Seriously, won't even Robz sheep me onto RR?Seems most of my townreads (everyone except for you) prefers Robz. Looking at the Robz wagon makes me like the lynch more, basically.
If I'm the lynch, fine, but it's a little irritating because I'm putting in way more work than Awaclus or RR.
Final reads: Please for all that is good in the world, find the scum among Awaclus/RR, and don't forget about Schadd and also Faust!
If I'm the lynch, fine, but it's a little irritating because I'm putting in way more work than Awaclus or RR.
Final reads: Please for all that is good in the world, find the scum among Awaclus/RR, and don't forget about Schadd and also Faust!
Reminder!
Vote Count 1.gkriegThat's super, super scummy. Vote: gkreig
Eevee (4): Ichimaru Gin, Awaclus, Roadrunner, gkrieg13
gkrieg13 (3): Calamitas, schadd, faust
Calamitas (3): SpaceAnemone, Eevee, Robz888
RR (1): LaLight
vote: eevee
what concerns me is that he definitely knows it gives that impression and that he said it before claimingI mean, that would be very impressive scum play if he managed to manipulate me like that. Not impossible, but I don't think that's the likeliest explanation. Occam's razor, yo!
SA, I'm rereading RR, don't you think this post is pretty towny, knowing Calamitas and I were town and gkrieg was scum?Vote Count 1.gkriegThat's super, super scummy. Vote: gkreig
Eevee (4): Ichimaru Gin, Awaclus, Roadrunner, gkrieg13
gkrieg13 (3): Calamitas, schadd, faust
Calamitas (3): SpaceAnemone, Eevee, Robz888
RR (1): LaLight
vote: eevee
i could have just scrolled up a little bit, but thanks
TownRobz I could totally see thinking "Damn it, I wound up in an unfortunate wagon position, and I can where they are coming from. This sucks. Oh well, town is still in good shape even if they lynch me I guess."
After finishing the reread, I do see that he walked that preference back pretty quickly. RR does look pretty scummy coming out of the reread.
I need to actually read the thread
Also, SA is on scummy side.
Also, SA is on scummy side.
Why?
After finishing the reread, I do see that he walked that preference back pretty quickly. RR does look pretty scummy coming out of the reread.
I'll do RR. Still feel like Awaclus is a better bet. But Vote: Road Runner
SA, I'm rereading RR, don't you think this post is pretty towny, knowing Calamitas and I were town and gkrieg was scum?Vote Count 1.gkriegThat's super, super scummy. Vote: gkreig
Eevee (4): Ichimaru Gin, Awaclus, Roadrunner, gkrieg13
gkrieg13 (3): Calamitas, schadd, faust
Calamitas (3): SpaceAnemone, Eevee, Robz888
RR (1): LaLight
vote: eevee
After finishing the reread, I do see that he walked that preference back pretty quickly. RR does look pretty scummy coming out of the reread.
After finishing the reread, I do see that he walked that preference back pretty quickly. RR does look pretty scummy coming out of the reread.
I'll do RR. Still feel like Awaclus is a better bet. But Vote: Road Runner
That's two words -- I hope faust counts it!
The more I read this, the more I'm souring on this lynch for today. He sure looks like his goal is trying to help town to win with or without him. Basically I would assume his behavior would be more targeted towards avoiding being the lynch if he was scum.
Yeah, that's definitely a concern. I remain undecided.The more I read this, the more I'm souring on this lynch for today. He sure looks like his goal is trying to help town to win with or without him. Basically I would assume his behavior would be more targeted towards avoiding being the lynch if he was scum.
But if he avoids being the lynch by making it look like he's trying to help town win with or without him, doesn't that achieve precisely what he's trying to do as scum?
Yeah, that's definitely a concern. I remain undecided.The more I read this, the more I'm souring on this lynch for today. He sure looks like his goal is trying to help town to win with or without him. Basically I would assume his behavior would be more targeted towards avoiding being the lynch if he was scum.
But if he avoids being the lynch by making it look like he's trying to help town win with or without him, doesn't that achieve precisely what he's trying to do as scum?
Just caught up. I completely believe ash is town, though I believed he was even before his claim.i don't like your bid for IC there
Hydrad, Silverspawn, pacovf, azadin all seem like good lynches to me.
I'm like the most IC person now, right? Mwahaha.
Just caught up. I completely believe ash is town, though I believed he was even before his claim.i don't like your bid for IC there
Hydrad, Silverspawn, pacovf, azadin all seem like good lynches to me.
I'm like the most IC person now, right? Mwahaha.
robz, do you remember your read of me from M87?
If I'm the lynch, fine, but it's a little irritating because I'm putting in way more work than Awaclus or RR.Well we don't usually lynch based on activity level. Especially if we have a good bunch of information available.
Okay, I can see that. Intent to hammer I guess.Not to push, but what exactly are you waiting for?
After finishing the reread, I do see that he walked that preference back pretty quickly. RR does look pretty scummy coming out of the reread.
I'll do RR. Still feel like Awaclus is a better bet. But Vote: Road Runner
That's two words -- I hope faust counts it!
Okay, I can see that. Intent to hammer I guess.Not to push, but what exactly are you waiting for?
That's pretty bad reasoning, because it depends on RR being scum, which may have an assigned probability of maybe 50% if you have a decently strong scumread. In the other 50% though, the statement above, even if technically true, has no relevance to the current game state.Okay, I can see that. Intent to hammer I guess.Not to push, but what exactly are you waiting for?
I feel like Robz is likely to be town, because I don't think RR leaves a bus vote there overnight. Though I guess he can see that I'm getting townread for the same thing regarding my late-night gkrieg vote.
That's pretty bad reasoning, because it depends on RR being scum, which may have an assigned probability of maybe 50% if you have a decently strong scumread. In the other 50% though, the statement above, even if technically true, has no relevance to the current game state.
wrong dude, also. wish you'd answered this sober (though you may have)robz, do you remember your read of me from M87?
It wasnt a read, it was based on night info
At this point? 45% maybe.That's pretty bad reasoning, because it depends on RR being scum, which may have an assigned probability of maybe 50% if you have a decently strong scumread. In the other 50% though, the statement above, even if technically true, has no relevance to the current game state.
Sure, I appreciate your warnings, and others should as well!
Now humour me, please :-) What likelihood would you assign to RR making that sort of a bus?
Obviously we'll lynch Space if RR is town.
wow, i was sure faust was softing. in fact, if he didn't die, i was planning to lynch within the people that didn't know he was softing
vote: rr
I can only detect people correctly if they'very actually performed the kill.
Perfect
auto-corrupt
Man, and I was ready to do all that reread work and really make today a great effort to get a flawless town win.
Nah, I didn't really look for Detective signs.wow, i was sure faust was softing. in fact, if he didn't die, i was planning to lynch within the people that didn't know he was softing
vote: rr
(That's L-1, BTW!)
I think faust may have noticed that I was detective, and was trying to advise. Or at least, he was clearly trying to advise someone, I guess! them, but that if I died then the rest of you would have RR pegged... or at least, I hope that's the case!
The LaLight case is interesting, but at this point I really just want to lynch Robz.
I think we need to lynch Robz now. Our top proirity today should be to not out the Detective. Any other lynch might do just that.
I felt like I almost evaded getting lynched, but it probably wouldn't have mattered anyway.the little thing that i said when i hammered wasn't a lie but i don't think i would have done it, at least for a while, if i didn't get the mistaken impression faust was the detective
man, faust, that really looked like a softI dunno that second post is more indicative of me not being the Detective, because I really was under no threat of being lynched? I thought it was fine to post it anyway, because scum would think I might make that post as the actual detective.The LaLight case is interesting, but at this point I really just want to lynch Robz.I think we need to lynch Robz now. Our top proirity today should be to not out the Detective. Any other lynch might do just that.
i still think the gkrieg lynch was largely my doing. faust played really well, though, and didn't get the same nigh-inexorable town inkling from robz
the second post being detective is sorta like how gkrieg's thing was traitor; wanting to get the message across isn't indicative of anything, but thinking to say it makes you seem like the thing. plus, it sorta conveyed the message of "hey, toDay is a done deal you guys, can we shut up and lynch robz real quick" which implies you had an especially strong readman, faust, that really looked like a softI dunno that second post is more indicative of me not being the Detective, because I really was under no threat of being lynched? I thought it was fine to post it anyway, because scum would think I might make that post as the actual detective.The LaLight case is interesting, but at this point I really just want to lynch Robz.I think we need to lynch Robz now. Our top proirity today should be to not out the Detective. Any other lynch might do just that.
plus, it sorta conveyed the message of "hey, toDay is a done deal you guys, can we shut up and lynch robz real quick" which implies you had an especially strong readWell I did.
I didn't think faust was the detective, I just thought he knew I was scum because I was obviously scum.
I didn't think faust was the detective, I just thought he knew I was scum because I was obviously scum.
How on earth do you fix things to get to be scum so often?
I'd play this setup again.Same setup, same people, go again immediately?
I'd play this setup again.Same setup, same people, go again immediately?
I'd play this setup again.Same setup, same people, go again immediately?
I'd play this setup again.Same setup, same people, go again immediately?
Ugh, I would rather play a different one...
Then I don't need to bring up bad memories